/lit/ - Literature

How long will it take me to do good dialogue with daily practice?

>>20918727
The best thing for you to do, instead of thinking about creating, is to just create. You'll get better as you do so, and when you reach the "end" of whatever you're making, you'll have the skillset to retread and do it better, and then repeat until you decide to stop, because art is never finished, but is stopped being polished, and that's when you call it done.

>>20918743
I'm writing a short text adventure game that I'll post here

>>20918751
If it's not a fury VN then I don't care.

>>20918727
what do you think fishing for platitudes is going to get you? how many anons have given you advice in the past few weeks since you started spamming? does asking for advice feel like you're getting something done or exercising your creativity? because you're not. it's a waste of time and a waste of well-meaning anons' time. people respond to your posts in good faith assuming that you're actually trying to write something, but you're not. go away.

>>20918785
Give me a prompt

>>20918789
Guy meets girl at the gym and asks her out, fucks her, and then tells her over text that he doesn't think it's gonna work out. As revenge for treating her as a revolving door, she spikes his shaker bottle with a liquid that turns him into a girl, and uses another on herself to turn her into a guy.

Then she destroys his new virgin pussy with her new chad cock.

Anyone want to share and compare? I think I have another pair of ~5k followed by a trio of ~2k, and then a few 4-5k range for the final act, and then a pair of ~2k as wrap up.

No wrong answers, just curious how consistent others are or if they go for a specific length for pacing reasons.

>>20918751
Does that mean you're going to stop bothering us when you finish?

>>20918856
No.

>>20918666
Easy, Satan.

>>20918789
Here

Science Fiction & Fantasy: Looking for accessible fantasy and sci-fi, especially SFF that does a bit of genre blending. John Scalzi is probably the perfect example. Redshirts (sci-fi collides with pop culture) and Lock In (sci-fi smashed up with noir and mystery) are great comps for what I love. Other favorites of mine include Cory Doctorow, Fran Wilde, Kat Howard, S.A. Chakraborty, Sylvain Neuvel, and Cherie Priest. Also see Chuck Wendig's entire publication history. I've read all his books.

https://www.manuscriptwishlist.com/mswl-post/eric-smith/

>>20919033

I am somewhat discouraged to continue knowing it will take years to get my game with good dialogue. I don't know, maybe I should go visual or kill myself.

>>20919260
Yeah, you should just give up just like the last time you posted this comment and no responded.

I miss the days we would discuss how much rape was too much rape for a story.

Suck it avatarfag

>>20919145
Science fiction is for retards who want to point their fingers at each other go “pew pew.” The only thing worse than them are the fantasy readers with their gay ass elves with stupid names and ancient prophecies. Has any of that tripe ever been of any merit? Can it ever have meaning or impact? The best it’s done is that there a generation of retards who call anything they don’t like “Voldemort” including the woman who wrote that ridiculous drivel.

I really want to write a story with the following characteristics
>Tragic romance story between a normal guy and a girl with superpowers from the guy's POV
>Story emphasizes the guy's powerlessness to help his gf
>Story starts as a wish fullfillment dream girl story, but turns into a sad tale about loss
I have no idea how to get started though. I want to read some examples before I try.
Are there any stories like this? Even if it's not super power shit.

>>20919503
It was a shitty movie. I’m confused about that description, though. If it’s supposed to be from the guy’s POV then how does it start as girly wish fulfillment? Or did you just mean that the guy feeling on top of the world because he’s banging a super heroine is girly?

>>20919516
What I mean by "wish fullfilment girl story" is one of those
>Guy is a loser but then suddenly he meets a girl that makes everything better
kind of stories. It's male wish fullfilment taken to the extreme:
>Guy is a loser but then he meets a qt super heroine who falls in love with him

>>20919499
>t. seething avatarfag
0/8 b8 m8

>>20919540
Before you get to writing you’re going to need to figure out the why if the relationship. There needs to be a reason why the qt super heroine would go for the loser. She could bang literal gods (or can she?) and will slum it with this guy? You’ll also need to world build. Is she the only one of her kind or are there lots of superheroes (and villains, I’m guessing there’s at least one to necessitate the eventual loss) running around? Is there some superhero league? Will any of them know he’s her boyfriend?

>>20919549
>gay ass faggot who takes tranny nigger dick up the ass
Try reading real books.

>>20919565
>seethes even harder
You love to see it.

>>20919503
Have you considered making this a LGBT relationship?

>>20919499
Is it possible to write good science fiction without action or like, Armageddon-level, end-of-the-world stakes?

>>20919608
Yeah?

I've written a bunch of science fiction stories that just take place locally on a space colony.

>>20919559
In order to avoid wasting hours "world-building" and to get extra exposure points, I decided to make it a Madoka fanfiction, so the setting's already there.

As for why she would go for the loser. I envisoned something like:
>Loser is about to get killed, gets saved by, surprise surprise, a girl from his class
>The next day he decides to talk to her, because the loser is actually a really sensitive guy
The Madoka universe is really bleak and lonely, so it makes it even more plausible that the girl would need some sort of emotional support, even if it's from a "loser".

>>20919591
Yeah, I toyed with the idea, but I want to try my hand at writing a "normal" relationship first. Besides, most Madoka fanfiction is already lesbo stuff.

>>20919618
>I want to try my hand at writing a "normal" relationship
No thanks faggot keepto your own kind

>>20919618
You should make it a harem isekai instead.

I'm having a really hard time starting my story, so I'm going to try something. I'm going to go on a dopamine break and cut off all overstimulating things in the hope that i regain some motivation for less stimulating stuff like writing and work. Guess I'll see you in a week or something

>>20919503
>brain turned to mush by marvel movies and coomer anime
gargle and swallow what is under your sink.

>>20919768
I wonder what he’ll do when that retarded plan doesn’t work. If writing provides so little dopamine then maybe he shouldn’t be bothering with it, anyway.

>>20919778
Post your work.

I've been stuck for days thinking a name for a race...
Nothing sounds right.

I used to write all the time as a kid, then fell out of it and reading for years. I'm 19 now and just had a spurt of energy towards reading and writing, had this idea come and go quickly so I quickly spat it out.
It's the first thing I've written in forever so I know it's shit but I wanna know on a scale of "barley passing middle school paper" to "my 4 year old with down syndrome can write something better" where I am.

>The festering mess in the basement causes me stress beyond belief.
>It's contained down there for now, which is a relief.
>But without regular efforts to stop the spread, everyone and everything I've ever known will be dead.
>Every night I heavily prepare for what I have to endure down there.
>Wearing a mask, I slowly creep into the basement, unaware of the current displacement.
>What was once a large tumor protruding from the floor can't be found anymore.
>In its place, sits cracks and a ditch.
>Something rubbing against my leg made me itch.
>I looked around and found the roots had grown above my knees, please, I know what this means.
>The chemicals I've been using to stunt the tumors growth have either been useless, helping it grow, or both.
>It's all over. >I'm done.
>The roots overtake me, the infection has won.
>They slip into my eyes and ears, it only takes seconds but they feel like years.
>My body is alive yet it has no life.
>I've been pushed into the back of my mind to simmer in strife.
>The tumor creeps from the shadows to complete the union, my mind only capable of reliving my grief.

>>20919815
Should've used fire.

>>20919813
The nignogs.

>>20919815
Don't be so hard on yourself, just keep writing and ask for opinions without calling yourself a retard.
That said, it's ok.

>>20919779
>>20919768
He's going to make it.

>>20919815
Why is this anon better than me?

How is this chapter?

>>20919913
boops ur nose. :3

Why does fantasy & world building seem so corny? I've put a lot of time into a world that I might base some writing off of, but when I focus on the details for too long, it just hits some nerve in me that wants to scrap everything. My end goal is to be able to write about magic and Tolkien-like fantasy. Or am I just being critical of myself?

>>20919974
because its fantasy. my fantasy story has become very cliche and is going nowhere

>>20919974
Take the solo rpg pill. You don't actually want to be a writer, you want to explore your world like a video game. Solo rpgs allow you to do that without having to create an actual game.

My world has inadvertently become a derivative of Lord of the Mysteries (a chink victorian-era webnovel) and Stormlight Archive. How the fuck do I fix this?

>>20919982
Makes sense. I look for inspiration within Tolkien and the Dragonlance books & set myself apart from tumblr and modern D&D type groups and themes, if you get what I mean. It just seems every so often that I feel like I'm straying towards that.
>>20919989
That's definitely an aspect, but I also want to produce something. It seems wasteful to have an intricate and thought-out world of which I've put weeks of work into, and not use it for anything or keep it to myself.

>>20919503
Strong Girl Bong-soon is a kdrama with a similar premise, but as a romcom. Soon I Will be Invincible is a novel about a supervillain but there's a romantic subplot which is similar to your premise.

Basically, the way to get started in any project of this kind is to think about the obligatory scenes, the scenes the audience expect from genre. For a romance, these include the meet-cute, the confession, the secretly falling for him/her, the grandiose romantic gesture, the kiss, etc. These are the hardest scenes to write because they've been done so many times before. Your job will be to exploit your premise to come up with fresh versions of these scenes.

Also, the premise itself could probably be made more dramatic by intensifying contrast. A powerless human being powerless to help a superhero has no contrast. Everything is as expected. A superhero being powerless to help the human is more dramatic -- which is why it's been a staple of the genre for so long. Or the superhero being powerless against their own flaws until the human shows up to help (this was the premise of the movie Hancock iirc).

>>20920035
You can just turn your record of play into prose afterwards, if you want.

>>20919503
Nabakov would write down his big ideas on index cards and arrange them into order. Good sentences, strong images.

Then fill in the gaps faggot

>>20918666
Schizo bro here.
I took the literaray arrr peee geee pill.
Add me to the author pastebin blease
>https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/57441/the-elevation-chronicles-grimdanklit-rpgfeels

>“Look, if you want to overcome your instincts, you need to know what the minimum requirement to actually hurt you is. You still flinch when I use that old cannon on you, and it’s a reflex you need to unlearn. You can turn into a nearly 10 story tall giant warrior who can survive getting hit by (What?) and you still flinch at less because you fail to understand your own strength.”
I don’t know what I should put at (What)

>>20920102
>The more I have partaken of the predominantly free stories offered by this site, the more I have felt the urge to write and share something of my own. I am under no illusions that my writing will be comparable to the quality stories offered on here already or anywhere near those of my childhood literary heroes, yet I feel that my unique perspective and style, will be enough to offer a slight deviation from the flavor of the norm.

just tell everyone that all the other authors are faggots and you're better than them anon

>>20920018
Mine has become so good it ended up being kinda similar to Call of The Crocodile, guess that's a sign that good literature has a lot of inspiration to give

>>20920058
I think I'll do that, yeah

>>20920136
As long as you don't confuse rifle and riffle, switch between tenses, can't decide if your MC is a man or not and never even have it a second look, i think it clearly is up there

>>20920178
The intrinsically devised messages present in the book flew right over your head as you can only grasp inconsistencies done on purpose. But that's ok, I forgive you. The level of intellect of the audience I'm aiming for in my fiction is quite out of the ordinary. You need to have bought, read and given good ratings to CotC in order to appreciate the incoming blockbuster that I'm about to publish.

>I declare myself the king of lice. Let the zyklonian invaders be—they will never pass through our wooden barricades!
That was my peak, I will never write anything better.

>>20920269
kek

>Like writing.
>Want to make it into a job.
>Go the faggot route and paywall advanced chapters on Patreon.
>Work hard to make a dark fantasy novel I think is good.
>Post the mostly completed version of it around and slowly release the remaining updates to entice readers in.
>Deafening silence.
>Meanwhile low effort wuxia, quest, and fanfiction writers pull thousands of USD per month.
I don't understand it. I went into the discord of some fanfic writer who doesn't even paywall and asked how he did it. All I got was "Dunno lol". What the fuck.

Disco Elysium is fucking genius, I'm still insecure about my main character. Even reconsidering starting over, I'm lost.

>>20920282
>Work hard to make a dark fantasy novel I think is good.
This was your mistake. You should work hard to make something that your audience will think is good. Read the works of Matt Bird.

>>20920282
The market is oversaturated. I think we need to come up with a new plan to monetize fiction. Let's make a writer's circle to have some weight as a project, and then launch NFTs called "Bored Pen Club". First we buy for from ourselves to artificially increase the trade frequency, then we promise to airdrop them to the first 10 5* reviews in our fiction pages to make the readers happy (some will be pissed, but controversy will only give more views), and after that anyone who subscribes to our patreon is eligible for a monthly lottery where they may get an NFT.

reading through all those 'How to begin a novel' tips, made me wonder
what if I start a book with a cryptic poem? Just a short one? something which seems ominous and foreboding

>>20918666
I have to do a writing sample for the LSAT in 2 days, any advice?

>>20920018
Go so far into both that it comes out the other end as non-derivative.

>>20920121
I want to say your wrong anon i really do.
On a completely related note, i got my first two star review when i killed off the first openly gay character.
It was only a short while after that when i killed off the second one that I got a three star review.
Glad i went into it with low expectations.
>>20920282
Either cave and write some cultivation wish fulfillment crap to earn the decent dollarydoos or write what you love and remain slavic tier.

So I have this
>Dialogue in general should be realistic TO THE TONE OF THE STORY and to the character's voice.
>It's idealized human speak.
>It should be subtle with the purpose of it
>It needs to have a purpose and stick to the outline.
>It's a sparring match, hit and deflect, in and out.
>Less is more.

Now for videogame writing
>It must follow and allow for roleplaying by being consistent to the possible ways to play
>It must never put words in the player's mouth unless it's reactive.
>Always allow choice, not all have to matter
>If it doesnt have a purpose, cut it
>Be clear with what the option means

>>20920352
I have a setting, factions and so on but Im struggling to actually write lines, what should I do?

Opened up some saves on Disco Elysium and Fallout NV and inspected character voices.
Kim Katsuragi being very indirect in dialogue to himself, he's focused outwards.
The movement of Evrat's dialogue being all over the place jumping around.

>>20920360
>>20920352
I don't get it, I get the theory but I can't do it, why?
Knowing and understanding the theory should be enough

1.4k words today lads
I did bretter then yesterday.
You can too!

I’ve noticed a pattern of paragraph structure through my readings of published professional authors, whether modern or old, and I’m not sure if I was a retard for not seeing it for so long.

In terms of essay writing which I will use because I am completely ignorant of the proper terms, if there are any, used in creative writing, each paragraph seems to be sub-topics with sentences as support; who are all connected and sequentially placed under a main topic, or the focus of the chapter.

To further explain my point which may come across as esoteric or otherwise arcane, I will hereby write an example of said pattern, hopefully broken down for easy reading.


>Sneed slaughtered Chuck.(Topic or main idea, first sentence of the paragraph. The outline of the scene in question)
>Chuck’s blood ran off the blade of his cleaver in thin rivulets.(Support/elaboration)
>Sneed wiped his blade off on the thigh of his denim overalls and spat at Chuck’s cooling body.(Support)
>He was just about to leave when he saw Homer come through the dark barn doors with a flashlight in hand.(Support/transition to new subtopic or scene.)

(Second Paragraph)
Homer stared at Sneed with a dumb expression on his face.(Scene outline/topic)

etc.

I have no idea if I’m being too autistic, but I wanted to share this observation in the case that it may help or inspire the writings of my fellow anons; so that they may write well and spin tales and yarns that may sate my voracious appetite for stories.

I now return to writing.

>>20920378
You should look up the book Image Grammar. It goes into this in a lot of detail. Also this book: https://www.gutenberg.org/files/48673/48673-h/48673-h.htm

>>20920384
I thank thee kindly, Anon.

>>20920494

>>20920496
The first time I am actually somewhat satisfied with my writing. How can I improve further?

>>20920384
I like that this actually gives you exercises
most books just tell you what to do instead of giving you actual exercises

This one right here, you know him. Where?
I do, yes.
Where? What did he want?
Couldn't tell you. By now..
When?
3 days, 16 hours, get it rolling.
I don't know, I forgot. Many come to see me, I see them all in.
Crowded lately?
No more, sir.
23, that's the stay here. 23, leaves you with one chip on the table, one.
Well I'm used to it, if I don't know...
You will. Under extreme circumstances an enemy of the state and a potential "existential risk" forfeits all rights, during this period of appraisal it's no longer a person, it's a dangerous asset.
Not working.
I'm seeing a cult here, I'm seeing a madman, I'm seeing a willing participant.
Extreme caution.
He came in, perhaps. He might have. If I saw him I didn't think much of it. He left and I would have no reason to, no special treatment...
Once you're out, you're out? Where does that come from?
It's not a lifetime commitment, not this one.
This is what I told you, mind poison.
Look, we don't expect to find him "functional", it's going to be a long trip and a huge mess to put him back. Won't do any good.
Then it's solved.
Just like that? We want something we can present, we want him mostly intact.
Empty.
I don't know what's that. Empty? No I'd rather everything be in place, the full kit. They like it that way.
They want a head rolling, comes right off. A patsy. A footnote.
Me.
You, they're going to get it, sorry but that's the way it is. I don't know if you care, I'm all for it. Martyr types.
No, I agree, I'm past that.
Anything, we've got to work here. Just talk. Even rambling, your subconscious or this and that, anything will do.
After that? No.
Nothing?
Nothing. Nothing more to say.
If there's no clay. I can't do my "holy work" like this, so be it.
23, then.

>>20920494
You've written something no one except you will enjoy. Start over and this time think about your target audience.

>>20920510
I agree that the contents are self-indulgent, but for now I am more concerned with prose, flow and whatnot. Do you have any inputs?

>>20920500
>>20920494
I wish there would be some more description of who says what
I think just going dialogue to dialogue is fine when they're two characters exchanging information, but then you have a crowd of demons, could you describe them more closely, at least like 'the largest demon towering over the others' or 'one of the mages'
which demon is leading the charge?
also: right this, sentence
>'Make way, or do you want to die?'
could it be more commanding? Why is the demon asking?
>'Piss off or I'll mow you down'
if you're feeling creative, give humans a nice derogatory nickname, like blood-bag or meatbag, that demons can use

the sentence afterwards seems disjointed, maybe having one of the mages being paranoid about traps and having him harass their leader
>It's a trap! I am telling you it's a trap! No way they could lose this easily, and the walls went down way too quickly! Let us retreat before-"
>magic thing happens
>'See I told y-'
>demons get detsroyed

third page, just confuses me, who the fuck is 'His Highness'? why are they calling him 'his Highness'? and maybe give the elf some reason why she is with the princess?

plus the dialogue, I'm pretty sure every new paragraph means a new speaker, so when you write like this it appears as if just one person speaking
the first three lines after "Mage..." should be put together, so we have the princess paragraph followed by the elf's paragraph
it is unnecessary to break it up like that

also this entire thing seems to be underwritten
also following Mage with Mage - maybe use another word, like wizard? magic user? Circumscribe the word? maybe give us an explanation why this is so mind blowing?

I don't want to write because I'm worried my computer is infected with a RAT that windows defender hasn't been able to detect and that someone might be watching and mocking my writing.
Has anyone else experienced this?

>>20920549
Thanks for your comments! At least it being underwritten is better than being overwritten. I was just writing out a random scene that had been pestering my mind lately.
As for the third page, yeah that is a fuckup. I was meaning the king. Should I have used "His Majesty" instead?

>>20920566
wait a minute
>whoever cast the spell must be an excellent mage
>'The magic of his Highness'
now I am even more confused, why not just write:
>Kalim looked outside. Whenever she saw it she was as amazed by the breathtaking spectacle as she had been when she had first seen it: the Kings magic was beyond this world.
>The small hand of the bedridden princess [Insert Name Here] touched hers and she looked down at that small thing. She couldn't imagine they were related. Was this heir truly able to be able to cast such powerful spells without it destroying her frail and sickly body? She doubted it

>>20920574
second sentence sucks, but I've got stuff to do, you know what I mean

I'm a hack. I'm too old to be good at dialogue.

I wrote a poem:

i'd tell you i love you
but nothing comes out
not a shout nor a whisper
no nothing comes out
even when i fuck you
nothing comes out
i'd tell you i'm leaving
i'd shit in your mouth
but nothing comes out
i'd burn down your house
but when i pour out the gas
it's just like when i open my ass
nothing comes out

>>20920103
The most obvious solution is just "cannonballs" or whatever period-appropriate term for that kind of weaponry i.e. "artillery".
>You can turn into a nearly 10 story tall giant warrior
You have my interest. Post link.

>>20920282
I keep coming across esl anime writers on twitter who just churn out unedited isekai or harem garbage by boatloads on Amazon and every one of them has hundreds if not thousands of followers and openly brag about selling like hotcakes. You'd think there's a limit to how many can make it, but it doesn't seem like it. I just can't bring myself to understand how this happens. Feelings of powerlessness and confusion overwhelm me

To become a good writer you must have learned to read at an unusually young age. Is that the case with you guys?
>t. no

>>20920839
Pseud nonsense. Just write.

In a four cornered room
With a mop and a broom,
The mop for the wet stuff and broom for the dry.

Holding paper towel
And smelling some foul
Odor in the air makes me wish I would die.

For there's cum on the walls
and cum sprayed in the halls.
Some fresh and some old cum, some yellow, some gray.

Urges never suppressed,
Though I'm trying my best.
I still cum on my walls through night and through day.

As I'm scrubbing the stains,
I start feeling the pains
Of regret for the mess I've described with pen.

Yet I know when it's clean,
No cum drop to be seen,
I'll just paint my walls with my cum once again.

HELLO, CLEANUP CREW!
(SECRETLY GETH AGENTS LOL!)
HOW ARE YOU DOING?

>>20920853
Ah, a fellow talentless midwit. Love you.

How autistic are you when it comes to not repeating words (unless it's deliberate for aesthetic reasons, of course)

>>20920627
Link to any examples?

>looking at my story after extensive editing and can't really spot any flaws or things that might be missing
>read another good story but easily identify its biggest flaw
>realize my story has the exact same flaw and I overlooked it all this time
>it took seeing a story I didn't write in order for me to realize it

Damn, is there any way to see my story with fresh eyes? Who knows what kinds of stuff I'm not seeing.

dID YU KNOW THAT UR ALL FAGGOTS?

-LizARD sQUAD

>>20920993
The only reason to care about word repetition is for aesthetics so if the repetition isn't aesthetic I change it.

>>20921014
OFFICIAL CERTIFIED FAGGOT

>>20921016
Elaborate

>>20920993
I like Faulkner and Woolf so in short, yes.
>oilwells and Yale

gotta write just two more pages and I can have a really long break of a couple months then

>>20921008
that's why before publishing something you first wait at least like three days (minimum), and then you read over it again
otherwise you publish it and then like a month afterwards you look back and realize how many mistakes you made
but we all learn from our mistakes, hopefully

>>20920282
You literally have to choose whether you want to make a living or make art. It's the lottery if you want to do both.

What software does everyone use for their writing?
I've written mostly in plain old notepad but thinking of moving on to something a bit nicer.

>>20921167
MS Word works well enough for me.

>>20921167
Google Docs, instant cloud saving and being to work on multiple devices is very handy

Yeah boiiii

>>20921198
This. It's what I use and I can't fathom using anything else. Cloud save so you can work on anything even your phone, spell correction with both American English and British English, more (at least it feels like it has more) features than Microsoft office, instant export to PDF, no ads, no limits to anything, totally free.

What’s the best way to share a piece of writing with this board?

>>20921309
prenarial

>>20921309

here is /wg's/ pastebin
https://pastebin.com/ruwQj7xQ

>>20921006
I'm sure as hell not getting more buyers for some faggot

>>20921253
Yh exactly it's a no-brainer. Don't really like writing on my phone but can read through stuff and make corrections or add notes if something pops into my head on the move. So practical

G E N E R A L

E

N

E

R

A

L

Are the MCU movies a good source of inspiration for how to write witty dialogue?

FLY, YOU FOOLS

>>20921595
He was telling them to take the eagles to Morocco.

>>20920494
This purple prose is unbearable. You're trying to write in an elevated register and failing. It sounds awkward and stilted.

Start writing like you talk. Make it bland and simple at first. Work to convey the information as clearly as possible. Then, once you have the bones in place, you can add the layers of meat and skin. Right now you have a rotting jellyfish.

>...strides forward a figure.
Transposition is really strange and is rarely used outside of poetry. It sounds overblown.
>The destruction pollutes not...
Same.
>Pollutes...spotless...taints
Redundant. You're using way too many modifiers per sentence.
>Screams of men and crackles of fire.
Overusing 'of' for possessive.
>woman does not understand...she notes
Avoid filter words. Just say what's happening. The fact the characters also perceive their environment is obvious.
>Not much progress has been made.
Passive voice. Sometimes it's appropriate, but it adds wordiness. Editing out passive voice is an easy trick.
>Called for a cease
Ceasefire. Or pause. Cease is not a noun, so it sounds awkward.
>collapse haplessly.
hapless is a weird word for describing an inanimate object
>A stand off begins.
You went from bloviating to short sentences and fragments. It's a jarring shift.
>The woman's lips grace the trumpet with gentleness
Yuck.
>utter contempt
>stopping dead
>heavens above
>shaken to their core
>basest instincts
>prove to be their undoing
Cliches

Big scenes with magic god lasers aren't impressive at the start of a story. The reader doesn't know or care about anyone involved. Your character doesn't even have a name. There's been no build up to the moment, so it feels dull instead of climactic.

>>20921597
pICKED UP A COUPLA LIONS JUST THERE :0

>>20919484
It depends on how deep the rape goes really

Broke 60k words today on my novel. Mostly written on my phone in Google docs. RIP my thumbs.

>>20920627
That's because their near illiteracy forces them to write with a clear and direct style. They don't cloud their prose with pretentious verbiage. Also, they're having fun with their work, and that shines through. Those hacks are legitimately better writers than you.

Stop taking yourself so seriously. Improve your writing style. Start shitting out daily chapters.

>>20919906
because your obsessed with a television character

>>20919913
Not gonna lie. Couldn't read it. Too many numbers this and number that. And the first sentence was, what exactly?

You leave nothing for the characters. Rhis story telling is the equivalent of going somewhere beautiful, and when you get there some cunt grabs you by the head, snaps your head around and says "see that bird? CAW CAW CAW! Woosh, there was wind in the trees. It left, but it will be back. Woosh" and so on until you find yourself wondering if your neck would snap easier if you relaxed, or tensed really hard, because in drunk driving accidents the drunk usually survives because they are relaxed... and so on


Get yourself an editor who isn't afraid to bin 90% of what you write

With love

>>20919974
Those fantastical settings are best when you're day dreaming. It's a real pain to pull off the details and rules without loosing all the magic.

>>20921625
Don't respond to the schizo. He'll be postin for hours.
https://youtu.be/Wutd07FtWw8?t=52

>>20921617
No! I’m going to write super serious writing for intelligent people that has depth and meaning that blurs the line between poetry and prose and will be studied for generations to come!

How do I improve on my dialogue?
If you think ignoring me will work I'll just become completely insufferable

diane callahan is a writer and an editor
she posted a bunch of high quality creative writing courses to youtube. more aimed at advanced writers than noobs

https://www.youtube.com/c/QuotidianWriter

>>20921625
Kim is literally me

>>20921627
Then it's perfect.

>>20921668
Put in some bodice ripping and a few dried up cunts will buy it from the kindle store

I have another project, another plan B game to work on. It's a simpler story more focused on things that should be easier to pull off, more genre fiction but at least it's somewhat unique. I think I'll work on that one instead.

>>20921617
>t. anime writer
You will never be Japanese.
You don't even know English.

>>20921683
It's a comedy. The title is literally The Diamond Dozen. You probably haven't read chapter 1 yet. It establishes the weird wording and sentence structures.

>>20921646
know your characters and have them talk accordingly
a meek secretary will never say 'Yo bitch, what's up!'
a drill sergeant nasty will never say to the random soldier: 'Oh, okay, we can do this tomorrow if you feel better then. Do you want some tea, dear?'
read the lines out loud and determine whether it sounds natural to you
listen to others
eavesdrop
consume well written media in any form you wish

>>20921838
This is terrible advice as it doesn’t allow one to subvert expectations.

>>20921861
then make your own suggestions

>>20921838
>>20920507
I'm just having a hard time.

>>20921869
KYS

How does a lion get to Morocco?

I don't know...

There threads are increasingly incoherent, just a dozen people having conversations with themselves.

>>20921909
I wish there was a discord we could go to so we could better track the conversations.

>>20921914
And here I was at loss for ways that this thread could become worse...

>>20921887
a simple 'No' would have sufficed

>>20921978
You wanted a suggestion so I made one. Now KYS, you pussy.

>>20922006
That's not me. Can you tell me what I did wrong? I want to improve anon.

>>20920287
Just save your regrets for a second playthrough after several months.

LOOK AT THE COLOURS!!

How long will it take me to be a good writer? Get a good game story going on?
I have a very solid theme but I am lost.

>>20922324
What's your theme?

>>20919815
teen fiction tier

>>20922328
It's related to the Tao Te Ching/Taoism

Do you dare send your garbage to a site that specializes in self publishing?

https://indiereader.com/book-reviews/

Hate reading other peoples books but love writting stories myself.

>>20922365
>275$
do I look like I am made out of money?

>>20920839
I’m nowhere near a good writer but I started reading when I was 4 because the Hungry Hungry Caterpillar called to me.

>>20922360
HOTDOOOOOOOOOGS

>>20922396
This is my problem. The ability to readfanfiction that explicitly caters to whatever whim I have in the moment has destroyed my ability to appreciate the average novel.

>no one gives a shit about your work unless you have a gimmick to lure them in
>too prideful and stubborn to debase myself with trickery

>>20918666
Just dropping in to encourage everyone.
I made it and so can you.
Don't give up.

>>20922614
Thank you Lewis

>>20922612
then you're doomed

>>20922612
I feel like it's a useful constraint. I think of it as being like verse and rhyme constraints for Romantic poetry.

>>20922703
What if you have the reverse problem? That you only want to write about some niche animesque topic but you need all the other trappings of literature to have an actual "story"?

>>20922614
What's it feel like finishing a novel? Is it like the satisfaction from taking a good photo or drawing something decent?

my pilot script just got rejected from a screenwriting contest today. here it is if anyone is down to read it. it's for a cartoon:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1y4XL20IdUg2Su0bd-qV2zFn_2dsLsMaT/view?usp=sharing

>>20922612
Everyone has a gimmick to lure potential readers in. It's something you have to contend with if you're aiming to sell a story. Dickens's gimmick, for example, was to ask the public what they wanted to see happen to the characters next which generated discussion and debate and therefore sold more of his serials.

>>20922799
Well it's a short story collection but i suppose the feeling is much the same.
Deep satisfaction and a sense that this is it, this is what i was always supposed to be doing with my life, like fate fulfilled or something.

>>20922802
>a cartoon
>starts with gambling
please tell me it wasn't for Disney or a children's cartoon

>>20922703
Yep. I'm hoping the wise old faggots are right and that it will pay off in the end. It makes sense that the ceiling is higher when you take the hard path, but the curve is far steeper.
Here's to hoping integrity pays off in the end, fren.
>>20922820
I want my writing to sell itself on its own merit. I don't like cheap tricks. I may have romanticized an ideal of integrity too much, I don't know. It's shit like the youtube gimmick of putting a ridiculous face in the thumbnail. That shit just pisses me off and I actively avoid videos with that horseshit. I don't know why this stupid crap works on people and the people it works on are not those I want in my audience.
Maybe I just need to get better. Like I said, I just want to be so fucking good at something that people appreciate it on its own merit. No gimmicks. No bullshit.

>>20922851
What do you consider a 'gimmick'?

>>20922851
>Yep. I'm hoping the wise old faggots are right and that it will pay off in the end. It makes sense that the ceiling is higher when you take the hard path, but the curve is far steeper.
Well, you make your position sound compelling, but I think you misinterpreted me. I think have the gripping gimmicky element *is* the useful constraint.

>>20922851
>I want my writing to sell itself on its own merit. I don't like cheap tricks.
I don't either, so I empathize. But good writing and good work goes unnoticed every day. You don't have to trick someone into reading your work. You just have to land the audience. Having high quality work enhances your chances of retainment but it won't sell on its own.
>I may have romanticized an ideal of integrity too much, I don't know. It's shit like the youtube gimmick of putting a ridiculous face in the thumbnail. That shit just pisses me off and I actively avoid videos with that horseshit. I don't know why this stupid crap works on people and the people it works on are not those I want in my audience.
I agree. I also have the romantic idea of integrity. I think it's important to think about what you can leverage to make a successful sale that doesn't feel like "THE NEW MOBY-DICK? :O READING OF COCKS AND SHITPUSSY BY ALFRED HITCHCOCK" tier clickbait. What has felt like a happy medium for me is writing flash fictions and sharing them and my general thoughts through social media and forums. Honestly I've been here for so long 4chan might have been a great audience to target with stories. But I do think finding what you can stand to do for audience seeking and gathering is the real differentiator.
>Maybe I just need to get better. Like I said, I just want to be so fucking good at something that people appreciate it on its own merit. No gimmicks. No bullshit.
See above. Good shit goes undiscovered every day. It's natural to think it'll rise up to the top "with time", especially if you look at history and see that only the best authors have lasted for the hundreds of years between then and now. I do wish it was true, but I recognize that it's not necessarily true. If you want to land an audience, you have to find something to use (that you can stand) which will bring in and keep their attention. This is especially important in a free entertainment culture because it's easy to ask "What are they bringing to me that is more valuable to my time than any of the other free entertainment I can get anywhere else?" For example, I read "I Roved Out in Search of Truth and Love" because there's no other Western painted porn comic like it anywhere else.

>>20922915
A shiny object to lure in a potential reader that lacks substance and does not elevate the material nor is it representative of the quality or substance of the material itself.
>>20922929
Ah, well I think the constraint is not using gimmicks so your work has to be so good that it speaks for itself. To use a gimmick would be to add rather than constrain, in my opinion. Though, I do understand your point that it could be considered a constraint since you're working within the 'rules' of our time rather than attempting to defy them.
>>20923007
I think the workaround is figuring out how to get people's attention without resorting to a shitty gimmick. Dickens' idea >>20922820 isn't bad, but isn't for me. Still a bit too gimmicky and functions as a flashy object to attract immediate attention that doesn't elevate the material in a lasting or substantive way.
Since I don't need the money (at least for the moment) it isn't about selling anything. I just want people to enjoy or even love something I've created.
I'll think about what you've said, but my philosophy compels me to seek trial by fire. I either die or come out the other side stronger than ever.

>>20923007
I don't know. I'm conflicted.
To elaborate further on what is and isn't a gimmick one of the defining factors of a gimmick would be the intent. Is the intent to elevate the material, or to catch prey? Is it wrong for the hunter to trap the rabbit? Or is that just the way things are? Do the same rules apply to capturing people or are we simply captivating them?
What is hard about this problem is that I look at people like Eddie Bernays and what he has done in advertising. What our world has become in part because of malicious advertising. There is likely nuance there, but I don't want to participate in a game that only serves to devolve the species.
Does that make sense?

>>20920627
>every one of them has hundreds if not thousands of followers and openly brag about selling like hotcakes.
Do they though? Or are you just seeing the success stories?

Kimberly Fernando - Open to Queries September 1st
@books4kimberly
·
Aug 30
I'd love to see science fiction and fantasy with societal and political intrigue that puts the protagonist into impossible situations that they must then cleverly prevail from. #MSWL
Kimberly Fernando - Open to Queries September 1st
@books4kimberly
·
Aug 30
Science fiction with technology that will terrify humans and potentially make them extinct. #MSWL
Kimberly Fernando - Open to Queries September 1st
@books4kimberly
·
Aug 30
Science fiction that blends with another genre (example: romance, horror, fantasy, mystery, thriller). #MSWL

https://mswishlist.com/mswl

>>20923400
>prevail from
Prepositional solecisms are the truest marker of linguistic carelessness. I would not want this person touching my manuscript.

i'm so drunk help

>>20922832
Naw haha it's intended for adults / mature audiences. Like a South Park / family guy audience

Howdy fellas
Using any singular 'they's lately? I hope not.

>>20921167

Libre Office.

>>20921768
>weird wording and sentence structure

It is not a comedy, your unhinged ego is though. It isn't weird, or quirky, it is shit and full of redundancy, and cliche. I started gathering examples, then I though nah fuck this cunt, send it to an editor who'll just say "sorry, not for us" because they refuse to waste their time, and usually when some "I'm moving along paths you don't understand" asshole shows up amd is showed up, they tend to go away and kill themselves, thankfully, or sadly, someone else

It's shit

>writing short story with some twist and turn
>Early dialogue scene
>Feels like the dialogue is just setting things up and feels really inorganic
How do I fix this?

>>20923794
Post the sample if you want serious feedback

Is a historical romance with two immoral characters a bad idea? People who should rightfully be hanged by the law of their time period rather than receive a happy ending that is typical of romance.

>>20923804
Nah I just want generalized advice or examples of another thriller that set things up in a natural way via dialogue

>>20923821

- speech is the most direct way people covey emotion, but strangely enough, use few adjectives while doing so

-nobody ever says everything they mean to say. Even between strangers there is an assumed common knowledge

-everybody is horny all the time, just probably not for the person they are talking to

How to apply dissonance in writing? A transition shot, skipped beat.

>>20923186
>>20923186
It does make sense. I think the primary goal of a writer who is trying to reach an audience should be to understand who his audience is, where they can be found, and how to convince them to spend time and/or money on what he's made.

Just can't find the motivation to write. I've had my entire Uni Summer Holiday and I've done like 5 pages. I am my own worst enemy.

>>20923794
just remove all the exposition and stop caring whether the reader is confused and then when people tell you it's confusing, tell them that they're supposed to read it twice and that they missed the whole point

>>20918666
>checked

my people, any updates on publishing on amazon, smashwords -> amazon?

At the very center, there was a tree, 14 to 16 feet high, around it a faded dark blue concrete enclosure 5 feet tall, hexagonal in shape. 3 sides each, a bench. Unlike the other one 7 blocks away, with no deviation from the lower left, this one had no kiosk, it was smaller in size and its only advantage had been height. It was not as central and not the first choice of any wandering tourist.
Imposing on the street near the busy markets one way and the schools on the opposite end, a church seldom attended to the east. Cramped streets finding their way in and out of it, lower route.

Men formed a circle in the center of the outer ring facing west, right next to the elevated ground, but close to the staircase.
Playing chess with metal caps for plastic was in some way, frowned upon. They had earned themselves a varied reputation, at any time but both ends of the day the drunkards handled the game. Spare coins moved between and then slid across the board, and so again. This particular man, a teacher in some nearby school would often come. Easier company than most, he had earned himself a name on his colorful tie alone.

The pensioners and the regular deadbeat stood around him watching him play, this man was their champion, their one solution to the recent city square debate.

>>20924175
love the first phrase
>Unlike the other one 7 blocks away, no deviation from the lower left, no kiosk, it was smaller in size, and its only advantage its height. Neither central nor the choice of a wandering tourist.
go from here

>>20924049
You just need accountability. Find some asshole to meet up with to share and critique writing, off the interwebs. Even if you hate them, and they write trash, articulating why is a good exersize, and forcing yourself to hand something out for review is a good way to get some distance on your own work

>>20924175
>An imposing church, near the markets and the school opposite. Among the cramped streets, the most popular was the lower route.
>Close to the entrance that to the outer ring, men formed a circle.
the rest is gibberish, I won't even attempt to overstand it

>>20923192
I don’t see why not. That’s literally what F Gardner does for the horror genre and everyone knows him.

>>20924221
They only know Call of the Crocodile. That’s it. F Gardner is a one hit wonder.

>>20924175
>At the very center, there was a tree, 14 to 16 feet high, around it a faded dark blue concrete enclosure 5 feet tall, hexagonal in shape.
you've started off with a clause
>there was a tree
and then injected an appositive
>14 to 16 feet high
which is all fine, but then for some reason you continue on with the object, and since you've intuited that this is wrong, you use the word "around" as a sort of pretend verb, as if the enclosure arounds the tree
>there was a tree around it a faded blue concrete enclosure
>there was a tree (and) around it a faded blue concrete enclose
you can see that you really should have written "and around it" or "there was a tree enclosed in faded blue concrete." The problem really is that appositive "14 to 16 feet high" which splits right in between what is sort of a continuous noun phrase and makes the whole sentence hard to read. Delete it or move it and be conscious of other such constructions which confuse readers. And if you're going to play around with syntax, you must pay MORE attention to it, not less.

I've reread the same paragraphs so many times that they don't make any sense anymore.

>>20924100
>checked
to you as well

>>20924208
what kind of church it is my man
what is imposing
don't rely on the reader, maybe he or she or it is Chinese
state clearly that it was at least thrice as high as any other building in the city and it was open at all hours while harboring treasures beyond human imagination
made of solid rock at least 300 generations ago, it withstood all earthquakes, the science and art of its stained glass windows still unexplained
it had a fountain in front. with a strage grey figure looming over it, offering water to all those who dare approach it
friend of thieves or thief of friends, nobody could decipher; children loved it for the very same reason
the buttresses and grotesques gave you an uneasy feeling so you turned your eyes to the school
>the school
a big door, but nobody ever used it, apart from the mayor and me, the chief of police
children used one of the many side entrances, many of which were unknown even to teachers
windows were distributed regularly, indifferently, even though the size class halls diverged wildly

you decided to move on from the church and the school, as they were too tough a steak to begin chewing in the safety you could afford with your amassed gold coins bearing the face of a hated ruler, and no means to cast them into a better shape

>>20924238
>>20924238
Read someone else's paragraphs. Might I recommend a Modernist or a Victorian? They know how to make sensible paragraphs.

How does this sound for a blurb?
>From the grounded to the strange. The meek to the mighty. To the silly to the serious. From the scientific to the supernatural.
>This is an Ode to Monsters.

>>20924256
forgot the picture of the chief of police

>>20924262
Sounds better suited for a podcast than a blurb for a novel. You may consider adding monster names, jumping locations, tying in whatever narrative, etc. Right now it sounds like an encyclopedia of monsters than a story about monsters. But if it's a podcast or encyclopedia, you're on the right track.

>>20923551
'Humbug' I say to thee.

What do you think of this kind of thing?
It gets across a lot of what I wanted to get across, but I'm not sure if anybody writes monologues anymore

>>20924283
I actually have the latter, but the idea is to write a bunch of short stories that serve an overarching narrative

>>20923186
By this definition, most writing is a gimmick. Every page turner is designed to keep the reader's interest in 'what happens next.' All story structures with dilemmas and resolutions manipulate our brains with a hit of dopamine. Interesting characters hook us with empathy.

It's probably unavoidable. I'd worry less about removing the gimmicks and more about adding the parts that go move beyond them. Psychological tricks keep people reading, but once they've finished, it's the bigger ideas that they'll remember.

>>20918727
How do I practice writing dialogue?

I keep writing myself into corners and giving up. The plot, the setting, the characters and their motivations and personalities, it all works against me. What do I do? Can I break free of this?

How can I write fiction if what I enjoy the most is non fiction, letters, documentaries, pseudodocumentaries, journalism.
Monologue, voice over.
>>20924208
Ok, the rest was completely forced.
Not really what I meant but my fault for writing things in a stupid way.
>>20924195
Thanks!
>>20924233
This is perfect, thanks.
I'll keep the very clunky structure in mind.
>and around it
Any reading material for optimal improvement anon?

>>20924350
>Any reading material for optimal improvement anon?
A Student's Introduction to English Grammar
not trying to be mean, it's aimed at college students who just don't have a background in strict grammar instruction. Reinforcing your understanding of the basics is always a good idea.

I want to write a science fiction book but I’m not super smart regarding any particular sciences.

A lot of the more modern sci fi books I’ve read seem quite physics heavy or go into detail on biology and stuff which frankly I don’t understand

Do you think writing a sci fi book from a less straight up analytical view is feasible? I’d rather just describe certain tech without explaining how it works and instead focusing on what changes it makes as per the plot

>>20924381
No offense taken, I clearly forgot some stuff.
Look, am I going the wrong way about this? I already know what I enjoy and if I had it my way, maybe I'd end up as boring as Lovecraft. I don't feel the spark in me.
What do you say? Decent writing is 2 years away?
>>20924382
Asimov used sci fi for philosophy, right?

>>20924345
stop caring so much about plot
just write some stuff that makes the characters fascinating and string it together however you need

>>20924317
You're really bouncing around between characters, images, and scenes. Cousin, courtier, husband, space, mars, jupiter, earth, the future, court, space, ruins, a broom closet on a ship, a luxury room, etc... It's like looking in a tumble dryer.

It's very rapid fire, giving the reader no chance to fully picture anything. Either pick one specific memory to monologue about, or proceed in chronological order through her trip. Decide what elements are important and cut the rest. Weave one theme or sense or metaphor through the whole thing to tie it all together -- for example, the sounds of these places, since that seems prominent in these descriptions.

>>20924404
thanks for the feedback
I guess it's not clear that Modest is the Triumvir and maybe she's a bit too romantic with her cousin
it is supposed to be a bit rambly, in that she's the type of person who doesn't know how to tell a story that isn't her life's story, but I can tell the spots where it was unclear and I'll rearrange them. I'll strike the sentences about Jupiter and the ruins, they are definitely whiplashing and don't contribute.

>>20924382
>Do you think writing a sci fi book from a less straight up analytical view is feasible? I’d rather just describe certain tech without explaining how it works and instead focusing on what changes it makes as per the plot

Sure. A lot of 'speculative fiction' includes one element of super science that can't be explained (hyperspace, prefect cloning, AI, nanotech, immortality) and then extrapolates what that innovation would to society. It doesn't take any special knowledge to imagine how humans would react and adapt to these things. And stories about humans tend to be more interesting.

I know it was shit but can someone tell me what's wrong with my dialogue?

Zareth had the most unfortunate stench about him. Wherever he went, others would hasten the conversation and reach the end as quickly as possible. I too was guilty of this. I could not tell you how often I would feign an excuse to leave the conversations I had with Zareth. Yet, the oddest thing in Zareth's predicament wasn't his smell, but rather the unwillingness of others to inform him of his foul odor. The world tolerated it, afraid of offending him. Such preposterous nonsense, that we, would be scared of offending the man that offends us! I tapped my fingers on my chin, in a thought that could tell Zareth he simply stunk. A direct approach would be the answer, yet, I could not possibly bare the burden of telling him, nor suffer the shame to be the one that would hurt the man; but it must be done. Mustering up the courage, I took a step toward my destiny. A creeping of the door and to the hallways, the all too familiar smell lingered. It grew stronger with every step. Zareth was near.

There he was, chatting with Joyce, a firey redhead with emerald green eyes. Her nose twitched, and her legs parted, a posture to which anyone saw was one of flight and impatience. She glanced at me and from earshot I heard her words
"Sorry Zareth, I need to speak with Kenny."

Her delicate hands wrapped around my arm, dragging me away from my purpose and goal. My arm, wedged between her breasts, enchanted my brain. She cast a curse on me, causing me to lose awareness of the smelly man and instead bask onto the smells of perfume. She left me quickly without a word, reminding me of my foolishness. The clock struck five, and the scampered feet of hundreds of individuals exited the building. Without the telltale musk in the hallways, I too knew Zareth joined in the stampede. Taking my cup of coffee, I vowed once again, the same thing I vowed under each new moon, a swear that I will complete this task.

I'll tell Zareth tomorrow.

>>20924564
>a firey redhead with emerald green eyes
feel like you could do better than this.

>>20924646
>Describing a character’s green eyes.

How Gardnerian.

>>20924654
I can’t fucking believe I got this reference. I’ve been here too long.

>>20924654
Lmfao. That was sort of kino. At first I thought it was retarded how Gardner constantly described the kid as having green eyes. But then I got to the le big epic twist and it dawned on me that he was just heavily foreshadowing.

I am this anon
>>20919503
>>20919618
I wrote picrel. Give me your thoughts.
I wanted to end with something cutesy like she grabbing his hand and saying something like "I'm glad you're alive", but I couldn't think of anything good. I want to make it look like she's trying to look heroic and is oblivious to the feelings of the guy.

Also, give me some good romance recs. Or tell me about your favorite romance scenes in any media.

>>20924685
Made me lol. You should keep it as is and just build it on it.

>>20923605
I tried this out today, actually pretty solid software for sure.
The no-subscriptuon is also a massive plus.

For the past two days I've managed to write more than 2k words a day by working simultaneously on two separate texts. Every time I begin to slow down with one, I switch to the other.
This is a winning tactic, I recommend dividing your attention.

>>20920839
I hated summer reading as a kid, but I did learn how to read proficiently before almost everyone in my class. But that's also because my mom taught me how to read. I really enjoyed the science and history textbooks when they had photographs or illustrations paired with what we had to read. So I guess all in all, yes?

1.1k words today
Took me a while to transition perspectives.
I had to also generate new characters.
Yet these are just excuses.
Tomorrow I will do better.
I hope you do to.

Continuation of
>>20924685
Smoked a joint, I had to make the most out of it.

I'm using time skips because I'm trying to have a faster pace, I just want to move into the good stuff and I don't think anyone is going to have much patience reading this.

Again:
>give me your thoughts
>give me some good romance recs. Or tell me about your favorite romance scenes in any media.

>>20919145

You came to the wrong place agent, nobody here actually writes anything.

why does everyone here write in first person

>>20925006
Except F Gardner, of course. That man is a single man publishing house.

>>20925013
Because it's impossible for most people to take a 3rd person view. They can't stand the thought of simply observing, they want to be "in" the action.

>>20925055
Question about F. Gardner- is he a Christian or some kind of New Age LARPer?Someone was posting excerpts from one of his books and it was bizarre. There was this one Christian character arguing with an atheist character. Then the prose derailed into Gardner rambling about Buddhism, DMT and Bigfoot. It was the most confusing and funniest thing I’ve seen posted here and it made me wonder what the fuck his actual belief system is.

>>20918666
full issue at: minimag.space

send things: minimagsubmissions@gmail.com

new issue coming out tomorrow

>>20918666
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXsQAXx_ao0

>>20925013
Because they're untalented idiots

>>20925013
I don't
I think first person is boring in most cases and only really exciting when the person is a nutjob

>>20925013
When writing in the 3rd person, should the narrator be strictly passive, merely describing the action, or should the narrator be able to give insight into the characters?

>>20918666
Can Creative Writing actually be taught?

>>20925013
>>20925260
This. It's fun to write what goes in a madman's head.

It's so difficult for me to not write autofiction in a draft, does anyone else deal with that? I will be writing on topic and just midsentence drift into pure seethe. At least I edit it out later but I really dont want to come off as bitter because I have a lot to be thankful for and hope for too.

im writing 3 plays at the same time and drinking apple juice. it was originally only one play but the apple juice made my brain reach new heights far beyond that of which was thought humanly possible. drink apple juice.

>>20925493
I use writing as a catharsis and often I bleed into seethe myself. It isn't difficult to avoid but I do often use it as a way to handle things that happen to me IRL. It's cheaper than therapy.

>>20925013
I mostly do 1st and 3rd omniscient, I feel like I can really speak in a stronger narrator voice by having a single clear narrator.

>>20925291
It's a stylistic choice for each story. Think of your narrators as a characters in their own right - they can be very reserved/neutral and repeat only what characters see, or they can lean into the story to weigh in with their own thoughts. Also they can either know everything about the world as a god/storyteller, be a part or it, or juat be a near blank slate "camera" relaying information as the characters see it. They can speak plainly, with humor, lyrically, with depression, etc. to varying degrees.

>>20925388
In the past I would've said yes, but these threads have convinced me that some people simply never learn

>>20925613
The problem is people leave. A guy comes in writes something, gives up, leaves forever, someone new comes in and we're back at step one.

There are only probably 4 anons here that actually stay here

>>20925230
Some of the best books were written in 1st.

>>20925388
1. read a lot
2. write a lot
there's not much else to it

>>20925013
i write in 3rd person limited
but a lot of current genre fiction uses first person
i think it's because a lot of recent books have a young main character and the author is aiming for angst. first person is good for angst

I want to read other people's short stories. I probably don't have good feedback, I just want to meet writers. Where can I find that? Are there people with blogs? Are there organizations that do stuff like this in-person? I just want to make friends with people who are more creative than me

>>20925013
I write 3rd person, but present tense generally

>>20924685
How do you get into the mindset to write that script-like style?

balancing stuff
so my main character is trying to be a leader
one of her subordinates dies
if i make my mc wonder how the death will affect her ability to lead, she comes off as a cold bitch
if i make my mc morn the loss of her subordinate too much, she comes off as ineffective
there has to be some kind of balance
there's probably a hundred things like this. is a character to sociopathic or not sociopathic enough.
are there too many combat scenes or not enough
the right balance could mean the difference between a good book and a bad book

How do I gain the will and desire to continue my fantasy story, even though it's complete shit? Do I write it anyways and hope during the edits it stops being shit?

>>20926258
apple juice

>>20926258
everyone has doubts about their project at times
i would bulldoze to the end and finish it
it's great practice if nothing else
i had doubts about my current project, but now that i've worked though a tough spot, i'm a lot more positive about it

>>20926258
Unironically this
>>20926393
You aren't drinking at size yet.

How do I go all in etymology for a writing style?

>>20926258
Think long and hard about why you think it's complete shit and change that.

>>20926227
The answer should be obvious if your character has any kind of established personality.

>>20926491
What do you mean by that?

>>20924564
This is so close in being very good.

>>20922802
anyone else read it? i'm dying for feedback

>>20922802
>says covid is a hoax
kek
yeah, you had no chance

>>20926700
I'll give it a read later, but was it a contest for adult cartoons? Because I read the first page and it's not kid friendly.

Got characters, got half a setting and overall thing I want to explore. I don't have a real singular story line.
I have the tone though, Carpenter-Cronenberg, how do I find something that jumps out at me?

>>20926821
not OP but yes, it was
>>20923468

>>20926839
>how do I find something that jumps out at me?

>>20926700
Oh. I thought you were just shitposting.

I have a 10,000 word outline of my novel.
I know that there are lots of things to expand on, but as it stands I hate it.
My idea started out so promising, but i am not in love with the plot anymore and its not as funny as I thought it would be

Can this be saved as I expand the first draft, or should I give up and try again from scratch?

I know this is barely even a draft 1, but is it normal to hate it so much? How much can be saved in rewriting and editing?

>>20926839
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thirty-Six_Dramatic_Situations

>>20926197
>script-like
Is that a good thing or a bad thing?
I honestly don't know what I do, I just write

I genuinely enjoy reading the things I write as recreation.
Is something wrong with me?

How many words did you type today anon?

>>20927010
Where are your paragraphs? Why are most sentences split up into lines?

>>20927028
you're too well-adjusted and mentally healthy to ever be a good writer

>>20927029
1500 but they are all shit
I want to change the plot but i've invested too much time now
my only goal is too finish it

>>20927037
Sometime it feels like the paragraphs get too long, or that the ideas are so different they need their own lines.
While i was editing that part I deleted a lot, some of those lines were paragraphs.

I guess I feel lile I want to get things moving fast, cut to the important part, but I still need to set things up.

>>20927048
Wouldn’t you rather write one paragraph a day of something you love rather than 10 of something you’ll scrap?

>>20927067
NTA but no
it's much more painless to look at a paragraph and fix/remove the bad parts than it is to look at a blank page and write something good the first time

>>20927067
Probably, but this is my third attempt and ive given up both times.
I want to finish it, and try to see if in the rewriting process it will be salvagable.
Hemingway said the first draft of anything is shit. I hope that applies to mine

I know it's basic, but r8?

>>20927120
would sex

>>20927120
>sulty
not sure if salty or sultry

>>20927138
Sultry is the siren
Salty are her nipples

Chapter 25 of A Hero Among Monsters is now available on Scribble Hub! https://www.scribblehub.com/read/436962-a-hero-among-monsters/chapter/531401/

>>20927146
>I found a siren sultry
>I gave her bloody mary
>then found a siren salty
>now she is thirsty for the dowry
>and her father Triton
>his hands around my balls tighten

My idea for a novel is a surrealist/postmodern book about a fumigator who is essential a more evil, and twisted version of Dale Gribble from KOTH who discovers a new breed of insects, and comes up with the genius idea to breed them and let them loose in people's homes while trying to make as little information known about them as possible since he wants to be the only competition.

Anyone have experience using WordPress vs substack vs squarespace or something for an author website? Debating options now and WordPress seems like the only one that won't rape me but will be a pain in the ass to set up.

>>20927176
>My idea
Stopped reading right there.

My game really has to start in a a way that I didn't want to. Basically same as Dark souls, out of jail and into the setting.

>>20927202
I used WordPress for my site and it was really easy. Just use the .com instead of the .org and all that messy server and self-made website utility.

>>20927210
>Has to
Who's holding a gun to your head?

>>20926993
>I have a 10,000 word outline of my novel.
you done goofed
>I know that there are lots of things to expand on, but as it stands I hate it.
good. because there are a lot of things to expand on, like writing your first chapter. a 10k word outline is a monstrosity that will simultaneously sap your love of the story and chain you down. get to writing.

>>20926804
hahaha i know..
>>20926992
i guess that's to be determined
>>20926821
much appreciated! what >>20926840 said

>>20926993
No it’s not normal. If you don’t like it rewrite it. You don’t even have anything yet just an outline. So stop making a big deal about it.

>>20927452
>you done goofed
how so?

>>20927406
It really makes sense to have a sort of not so blank slate character come fresh into the world if they just got out of supermax

>Know for a fact that my prose is shit.
>But I just enjoy the act of writing so I usually write 1000-5000 words a day.
It feels good bros. I don't know what to do with any of it, aside from revising and rewriting some of it to try to make it better, but I just have to make some more tweaks to the pacing of my novel outline and I'm going to move from novellas to an actual novel.

>>20927509
Okay but the character if, they're not a complete blank slate is still going to have some sense of a prior reality, especially if you're making them emerge from a supermax prison. People in supermax prisons tend to have stories. Pretty wild ones at that.
You might as well just go for the came back from a long journey at that point, or even just a foreigner arriving for the first time.

>>20927527
I know, the thing is to start right away on the setting.
Mind you, this is not the original project idea I was mentioning here days ago. This is the backup, to see if a twist on the formula would work. I can allow myself to be stupid with this one.

It's not literal supermax, it's a sci fi equivalent so that gives you some leeeay torrally have a blank slate.
I'll go back to the drawing board, I can reuse and remix assets until a certain point.

>>20927508
>how so
a 10k word outline is a monstrosity that will simultaneously sap your love of the story and chain you down
you need to actually write your first chapter

How do you decide what the b story should be? I have a whole story idea that I’m outlining but im confused

>>20927772
are you writing a sitcom?
why would you have a b story

>>20927772
No im using save the cat writes a novel

>>20927405
Interesting, thanks. I was watching a tutorial earlier on the free version and mulling between .com and .org

Might try playing with free version for fun to see if it confuses me too much. I just am not sure I can justify the annual cost if I only sell 3 books

do you find it easier to write in the morning or at night? (or perhaps in mid-day)?

>>20927797
>No im using save the cat writes a novel
congrats on wasting money to learn nothing of value
you want to write? just write. if you're not sure whether it's good or not, just ask yourself "would I want to read this? would my friends want to read this?" don't worry about whether it adheres to some formula or template or whatever the fuck. Good writing is self-evident.

>>20925422
you can write a good introspective novel without having to lean on first person writing
Crime and Punishment is a perfect example.

>>20927793
if the b story adds to the theme of the book, adds to character arcs, adds to the story, then why not
the side kick heads off to do an errand
star trek always had and a and b plot.

>>20927511
>Knows my prose isn't shit
>Still solely reads and writes 0 words a day while giving advice on writing lmao

captcha is telling me to give adv on drawing as well since I also don't do that

>>20927949
No I am someone who works well with a template before i get the groove of things OK

Can you tell me what exactly a b plot is sir? Same as subplot? Idk

>>20928132
>Can you tell me what exactly a b plot is sir? Same as subplot?
I don't care what they are and neither should you

>>20925128
>implying anyone here actually knows F Gardner

Should I make my fem main character have a lesbian relationship? Like, a part of me wants it but other doesn't think it fits the story

New Bread: >>20928392
New Bread: >>20928392

>>20921598
I am not the one who posted the excerpt, but I know how to recognize a good analysis.
Which book do you recommend to make these points obvious to me?

Salutations, anons, newfag here
Tell me what you think of this:

I have been dying for intimacy
With you, striving so things could here be led —
I am at last pushed down onto the bed;
And you, succumbing to my lunacy.
You put your hands on my low self, alike
Hot serpents sliding up the tree of life,
Preparing hungrily to curl and strike—
And sighs, and moans were charming snakes of strife;
A slowly-lambent beast, that tastes the prey
With craving eyes, and fixed gaze, in a trance—
A feral gladly feasting in its way
As flesh, drool, heat, life, mix in savage dance.
Just when I thought my fate to die of lust,
You made me come to you, freeing th'angust.

>>20928952
>posts when people have moved to the new thread

>>20928974
Oh...
Well, that's a newfag for you lol

I haven't wrote anything creative since grade 5 and now I'm in grade 12. Shit on it as much as detail as possible, I need as honest advice as possible.

>>20928974
FUCK

test post (for testing purposes please do not reply)