/lit/ - Literature

It seems to be the natural resting point for your brain activity — you tell us. What a terrible thread.

i don't know, but as Sophocles says through Oedipus mouth: 'better to never have been born at all'

If you believe in an afterlife well this life is temporary
If you don't there's a strong push towards you getting caught up into money, sex or trying to shape the world around you to replace that void.
You should resist that if you want to be happy. Don't be a slave to money, pussy or Hillery Popper.
As for dying well you'd get bored of living after about 1000 years anyways.

>>20830820

>"Life is... LE BAD!!!" Said the aristocrat thinker Who never had to work or struggle a day of his Life

Why are they Always like this?

>>20831107
Because life isn't easy for anyone, retard.

>>20831111
You missed the point.

>>20831111
You're supposed to realize that you cannot change your Life to make it easier, you can only change yourself to be wiser and tougher. Personal reality is downstream of personality

>>20831121
Your point was word for word that they didn't have to struggle a day of their lives, how is that any different than saying their life was easy? Maybe explain yourself instead of flailing your arms and acting like a faggot?

>>20831123
>You're supposed to realize that you cannot change your Life to make it easier, you can only change yourself to be wiser and tougher
Completely subjective. If I add a doggy door to my front door for example, and I no longer would have to let the dogs out every hour, how could you possibly argue that that does not make my life easier?
>Personal reality is downstream of personality
And personality is downstream of personal reality. Stop repeating shit like a parrot when you don't even understand what you're speaking about. Your new quote has little to do with your original claim.
>hurr durr you cant make life easier
And? How does that make life less difficult for anybody? In fact your quote only furthers my point when you actually think about it for more than 1 and a half second.

>>20831111
This. There is no way out of the struggle of the will. We all form our distractions, our visions and delusions. There is always the possibility of non-existence, always a new desire. How was it that Tolstoy was arguably more unhappy (or more outwardly unhappy) than Dostoyevsky when his life was much less tragic?

>>20830820
This is just the end result of stoicism.

>>20831130

I'm saying that It's always people who have an easy life and are rich Who have this cuck mentality. Between all of the four the only one I can understand is Leopardi.

>>20830820

For the average weak and delusional fool? Unironically yes.

>>20831172
Congratulations bookworm, you figured it all out. Only rich people complain about life, that's it. Fucking retarded faggot lol

>>20831172
Probably should meet more people if the only people you know of are a select-few classical authors

>>20831143
>And personality is downstream of personal reality.
Nah, it's downstream of thoughts. And you are repeatedly choosing to have negative ones.

There is literally no philosophical argument against collective suicide. Antinatalists just don't go far enough.

>>20831218
>Nah, it's downstream of thoughts
Are all your past environmental factors not what shaped your entire life? Okay now that we established that simple fact, did you not have a specific birth time and place? Because that birth time ane location would be considered "personal reality" by reasonable humans. Therefore that personal reality shaped your personality in every way, since there is nothing in your life that could be said to not have snowballed down from your specific birth time and location.

>>20831241
God's gonna laugh at you when you die if you go through your whole life using determinism as an excuse

>>20831243
God shut up faggot hahaha. You know nothing about me or my life. I don't use determinism as an "excuse", rather it is reality. Cause and effect. You simply have been outed for not using logic and now you are mad. Cry about it subhuman.

>>20831111
Stupid quarts

>>20831172
OK dip shit, why are working class songs (folk, country) full of depressing laments about the world? Or the Blues? Just because most philosophers have been from the pampered classes lately doesn't make the world great. Hell, why are most people risking an OD on drugs despite this being one of the best times to be alive? Please, set all of us pessimists straight with your higher logic

>>20831557
They're risking an od and shooting at each other for sex and money.

Solving The Life Question is the most important question of our lifetime.

>>20831562
??? Absolute fucking retard how old are you?

>>20830820
Eh ive been single for like 6 years and homeless for a bit in there too. Ive worked construction, in factories, at amazon, on a farm, and was unemployed for many months. I tooked many extra years to get my degree as well. Sure, Ive felt the pain and struggle of a hard, meaningless existence, but its not really that bad if you have friends lol

>>20832557
>just be le happy and optimistic
>oh and have friends

>>20830820
And yet arguing the worthlessness of life in published texts seems to have been more satisfying to them than killing themselves, which would have solved the "problem". Therefore self-refuted. And curious how anti-life thinkers tend to lack friends, family, basically any integration into society. Cope is all it's ever been.

>>20832593
Ill give you that second point, but im not happy or optimistic, ive got a degree in ecology and its hard to see the natural world get so much worse with very little effort to even slow down the degredation :(

>>20832633
>>20832593
I think lots of friends suck. Also to me optimism should not be about merely coping about how positive life could be, but about playing the part and actually living a positive life. Not settling for less etc.

>>20832633
>its hard to see the natural world get so much worse with very little effort to even slow down the degredation :(
This makes me optimistic. Perhaps we can still turn this forsaken planet back into the lifeless rock it once was, even if very slowly.

>>20832649
That will happen regardless, or perhaps even despite, human intervention
>>20832641
Friends are rad, what do you mean? I'm not optimistic that we can make the world better, but that reality wont stop me from trying my hardest. so yeah, piss on compromise.

>>20832711
Not soon enough if I can't witness it firsthand.

>>20832711
Yes, friends are "rad", but that doesn't contradict with my statement. Lots of friends suck.

>>20831172
What a retarded fucking take. And this is 4chan.

>>20830913
Every single person that i have encountered that claims to have managed to suppress his desire for pussy is the biggest pussy slave of them all.

It just comes off as major cope to me. Why would you deny yourself of great pleasures (as long as it doesnt come at the cost of your general health)?

>>20832882
I'm actually incredibly sorry that your feeble troglodyte-esque brain cannot imagine life without 6 second primordial sneezes and gushy flesh piston slamming. In all seriousness, men are supposed to develop while they're young. I understand losing your virginity for the sake of it, but the grass is certainly greener on the other side. Sometimes you get sick of women and their bullshit and you need time away from them. Not that you'd know though

>>20832882
Jokes on you, I never cared for pussy.
I'm addicted to cooming however.

>>20832882
People unable to adapt to the challenges of life cope by pretending that its most direct and visceral pleasures aren't worthwhile. That the most real experiences aren't actually real. They live in theoryspace and come to the "conclusion" that... life is le bad

>>20832762
Is your statement "having too many friends sucks" or "many of my friends suck"

>>20833502
Having many friends sucks because the vast majority of humanity is bottom of the barrel trash. Hate to break it to you

>>20833579
You got a lot of convincing to do buddy, most people ive met irl are alright

>>20831107
Leopardi (first guy) actually lived a pretty shitty life so he was completely justified in saying that.

>>20830913
>you'd get bored of living after about 1000 years anyways
Try 40

>>20832633
The world doesn’t get worse, it just changes, retards that think how it is at this exact point in time and that it must never change are the problem

>>20833734
Well you see Earth is a place where bad souls go for a sort-of spiritual rehabilitation, everyone here has a cursed personality because that is the nature of this lower realm. Even if they act alright around you, doesn't mean they are a good human.

>>20833786
I was always too old for this shit.

>>20833809
I'm not stupid enough to think the world should never change, but the way the world is changing is very destructive, anthropogenic, and doesn't have to be.
>>20833816
That seems like a strange worldview. I'm not going to ask you to justify your beliefs, but how did you come to believe them? Also, how do you define a good human?

Is nothingness even an option?

>>20833906
Non-existence is.

>>20833887
>how did you come to believe them
It just seems obvious to me. Every single human appears to be on either a path of righteousness or on a path of psychopathy. Life constantly throws curveballs what many would call "synchronicities" at me which I believe to be Godlike aliens fucking with humans and basically saying hello. It seems like the same way we look at animals, you know we as their caretakers and sort-of slave owners, is the same way that those Godlike aliens look at us. And you know we move up and down on this ladder of incarnation depending on our path
>how do you define a good human
Haha shut up. You know what a good human is. If you really want me to define it, I would say that a good human is a person that has a regard for people and things other than themselves. To me a good person is enlightened, developed, aware.

>>20833954
You mean like never bringing something into existence? Sure, I guess. But is it possible to go out of existence once brought into it?

>>20833969
Death I guess, unless you believe in a soul that will exist outside of the body, or that your remains will still hold some of you "essence".

>>20833978
>unless you believe in a soul that will exist outside of the body
Or some weird quirk of material reality we don't yet understand. I mean, just spitballing we've come up with thought experiments that posit survival after death in a strictly material realm. Who is to say something like that isn't possible?

I would rather it not be, but I have no clue. I've never been subject to death and nobody who has seems to be able to report anything, but out of honesty I have to say I just don't know what happens.

>>20833955
Almost everybody has regard for people and things other than themselves. I would rather define a good person by their actions rather than their inner thoughts.
How do you move up and down the ladder of reincarnation?

>liberation=annihilation
this is so fucking stupid, there is no reason to believe liberation would be absence of experience since in fact true liberation would mean absolute fulfillment and absence of desire i.e it would be whole, complete, fulfilled the opposite of void

>>20830820
"Nothingness" doesn't exist so the question is pointless.

>>20831232
Yeah, I mean if you think nothing matters. If that's the case go rape a black infant

>>20830820
Anybody who would use that Schop pic in an image immediately declares, "I am retarded."
The bottom line when it comes to nihilism, and the ironic humiliation of all anti-natalists, is that their beliefs use the exact same foundation as every single one of the "delusions" they condemn.
It's one thing to ignore roll your eyes at the optimist's counter of "why don't you just kill yourself?" but it's less excusable to behave in a manner NO WAY DISTINGUISHABLE from that of "normal" people while convincing yourself you're in touch with a more enlightened moral dogma.
Every single sentence spoken by nihilists as propaganda is the same as political or religious rhetoric.
A Christian monk or Hindu brahmin will actually neglect worldly things, and seclude himself. This demonstrates that his beliefs are actually meaningful, as they inform his actions.
Furthermore, in order for the nihilist's "philosophy" to be meaningful, he needs to make the idealistic assumption that
A) his logic is in any way valid
B) it is worth communicating his philosophy to others
But these assumptions can be undermined easily without reference to nihilism, so they absolutely have no place in the nihilist repertoire.
I'm only touching on the flaws unique to nihilism. You could tear it apart with more traditional logic but that exercise would be redundant considering the fundamental issues.
The natural nihilist response to this post would be:
>Why do you say I have to care about these things? Ugh, I just don't, try to get over it.
And he'd be right to say so, because I'm treating nihilism as a respectable intellectual position when it in all honesty isn't one.
Nihilism is a POSE, and nihilist philosophy is angsty prose-poetry. A nihilist defends nihilism in the same way a man might defend his alleged belief in the flying spaghetti monster. The only true fool is whoever takes him seriously.
The nihilist abstracts and generalizes contempt he ought to reserve for himself.

>>20836276
I'm not sure if I was clear in regards to nihilism being hypocritical.
The nihilist takes a negative stance, ( >>20831232 for example) but there is no real reason to do so. The natural position, upon denying all value and purpose, would be to refrain from all judgment and action. To condemn something is no less a spasm of the animal mind's drunken derangement than is an endorsement of that same thing. Why should you lend your will to negative derangement and spurn positive derangement? The reasonable course, as I see it, is to suppress your ego. Social thinking should be the first thing to go. A proper and convinced nihilist shouldn't ever mention "collective" anything, and he should blush at declaring an objective compulsion to suicide without having first acted on it himself (I'm not saying that he *should* commit suicide, I'm saying that he'd need a darn good reason for verbalizing it).

>>20830820
Fully internalizing the idea that existence is not inherently good and that all positive feelings about it are some form of cope might be the closest real-life equivalent to forbidden knowledge

I'm saying don't have sex, make money or talk about politics.
I'm saying don't make it the thing that replaces the place where God used to be.

>>20834334
Inner thoughts are what lead to actions, no? Accidents happen, doesn't mean the human is bad. How do you move? I believe you have to pass a series of tests personally designed for your soul. I don't think anybody can tell you how exactly you can ascend, but I think you already have somewhat of an idea. Go through the trials and be prepared for death

>>20836319
>The natural position, upon denying all value and purpose, would be to refrain from all judgment and action.
That would be the logical conclusion of stoicism.
>I'm saying that he'd need a darn good reason for verbalizing it
The right deeds need no justification.

>>20833741
Leopardi (first guy) actually lived a pretty shitty life so he was completely justified in saying that.
>>20831172
>Between all of the four the only one I can understand is Leopardi.
I'm quite sure he explicitly refused the concept of "He was sad because he had a shitty life". Can't find the quote atm though

>>20836276
>Schopenhauer
>nihilism
There's a reason nobody read beyond that.

>>20831107
You think work is the only bad thing about life? How low is your IQ?