/lit/ - Literature

no. the people on the top are often artists too, do you know how many of these faggots in galleries are living on daddy's money?

>>20680752
What the creator of this picture considers 'art' is pixel drawings and alternative pop music.

>>20680760
They only want to larp as artist

>>20680766
cope. many of them are highly skilled professionals because they actually grew up in an environment that facilitated art in the first place, poorfag parents don't do shit like send their kids to piano class or an atelier

>>20680774
Incels and commies were right

>>20680760
There is literally nothing wrong with daddy's money.

>>20680774
J.S. Bach was an orphan before he started writing music

rich people will never make good art because they will never be hungry

>>20680823
Trying to shame people for things that aren't their fault and isn't something they can change is ridiculous in either direction.

YOU DARE SAY IT? Please talk to my lawyer Big Sean. I will see you on the great pyramid of society you dirty norman

>>20680823
J.S. Bach of The prestigious Bach Family??

>>20680827
They have the privilege to live a totally comfortable NEET life and make art of highest degree and yet they only larp as artzyfags and produce dogshit work instant upcummies. Problem isn't them being rich, problem is them being rich and still making dogshit. You should experience their performative ennui and sfltruggle boasting, just accept that you're rich and move on ffs.

>>20680839
Now you're just making assumptions about someone in your head to get mad at

>>20680752
>Is this true that writers are subhuman plebs who cuck themselves for the LARP of normalfaggots and upper classes?
is that what you're getting from the image? i see it as describing how challenging making art is, and how taxing that challenge is to the people who decide to go down that road.

>>20680823
>rich people will never make good art because they will never be hungry
What an absolutely retarded take. Why do I keep coming here? I hate it here.

>>20680841
I went to an art school

>>20680848
That's cool man but I still don't know who the 'they' you're discussing is. Go hash it out with them before you start trying to establish your own musings and anecdotes as fact.

>>20680827
Not shaming them lol, but I wouldn't expect people on the literature board to have good reading comprehension (isn't 9 tenths of a humanities major inventing something in a work that isn't there?). I'm just pointing out that you are going to be better if your life depends on it.

>>20680854
The rich kids who LARP in galleries.

Is it true that writing is for people who can't do any of the better arts? It seems like the lowest form to me..anybody can write. If I could choose I would choose to be an actual artist meaning painter or that realm.

>>20680846
>shits on anon's hypothesis
>provides no counterpoint
>"I hate it here"
Good. Go back to redd*t.

>>20680861
You're a fag. Of course writing is easy but "good" writing and developing your own aesthetic style is hard as fuck, it will drive you insane.

>>20680866
People Tell me I'm a mix of holden caulfield and James joyce.

>>20680854
i think it was pretty easy to suss out who "they" were, based on the the subject of this thread and the context of discussion here.

reading comprehension is a pretty important skill for reading literature, i'd really recommend you work on it.

>>20680864
Do you know how many actors and singers are rich as fuck and or have never struggled and are making "art" right now you dopey fuck? Furthermore you don't need to experience pain to write about it, its called making shit up and every creative field is actively doing that. Fuck you, don't @ me

>>20680874
It just seems like he's judging all people born into money negatively based on the negative experiences he's had in art school and the galleries which isn't fair.

>>20680861
no, writing is deceptive in that anybody can technically do it but it is difficult to gauge an author's skill until after you have read an entire piece. ultimately, great writing is produced by a great mind, someone who is mature, intelligent, thoughtful and observant.

By contrast there are fucking 12 year old sculptors in Asia right now putting out shit that looks like it belongs in a Roman temple, art is more technical than it has anything to do with the artist's entire being the way writing is. Writing is holistic. You can't be a massive retard and write something great but you can be pretty damn ignorant and still have top tier art fundamentals. There are absolutely way more competent artists in the world than writers.

>>20680873
Then go published your shit and see how it will turn out

>>20680878
This anon is right to some extent

>>20680878
>Do you know how many actors and singers are rich as fuck and or have never struggled and are making "art"

I don't get what your argument is. In the post he said they'll never make good art. Key word being good. You agree with this, your only counter-example is people who have never struggled who are rich as fuck and make "art", as opposed to art [without punctuation]. You're implying that these people are filthy rich, but they don't make true art, which doesn't disprove at all what he originally wrote. You're actually retarded because you're arguing with people while simultaneously making their point for them.

>>20680887
I have nothing to publish. In a fit of madness I burned and deleted all my manuscripts novels and poetry. I also destroyed all my musical instruments and screamed until I slept.

>>20680883
But how do I know if I'm too stupid to write and should give up?

>>20680891
based i did the same thing but i was really drunk and instead of destroying my piano i put my first through my tv

>>20680890
>Key word being good
Look, you can be a contrarian all you want and think normies "good" is not good but if something has been seen/listened to by millions of people and or those people have given money to get a product then i dont give a fuck what you think, the people have deemed it to be good. Sit and pout all you want but being rich or being poor has fuck all to do with producing something of quality.

>>20680891
>>20680895
WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU FAGGOTS? How did it happen? Why?

>>20680894
you can't, remember the adage that stupid people don't know how stupid they are. if you truly are an idiot, then you will never actually discover how much of an idiot you are, so it doesn't matter. you might as well just do what makes you feel fulfilled.

>>20680901
Some say genius is next to madness but I think I may just be an idiot.

>>20680902
I wish I could go to a writing atelier and get mentored

>>20680823
Michelangelo was the son of a banker
Van Gogh was also born into a wealthy family
As was Tchaikovsky

>>20680899
>unironically supports democracy

The only thing good about modern music is the marketing.

>>20680910
>3 mediocre artists
yawn, next

>>20680910
Van gogh has the distinction of starting his art relatively late in life too.

>>20680913
>The only thing good about modern music is the marketing.
I can't wait for school holidays to finish

>>20680843
You expect a poltard to get anything out of an image other than his brainrotted memes?

>>20680932
Go back to twitter you richfaggot

>>20680899
Seems everyone here agrees that your argument is "bad." Sit and pout about it, I guess

>>20680752

Yes, it's true. All the greatest creative minds in history drank Monster, or Redbull at the very least.

>>20680752
Did you know that grass lawns became popular and fashionable because they used to be a very ostentatious display of extreme and excessive wealth? It was a way for land owners with massive amounts of land to spare to show just how rich they were, that they did not need to grow anything on their land.

It is much the same with literature, and especially those who pay to merely study it have been memed so hard that it has likely ruined their lives forever. Historically, the study of literature also became fashionable because it has always been such a huge waste of time that literary erudition was considered the peak of elite excess, available only to those whose subsistence was entirely secured by extreme wealth, and never had to work a day in their lives. Not much has changed in that regard, in so far as literature is an extreme waste of time unfit for anyone not already part of the upper class, despite what songs of praise you will hear about "le aesthetics", "le art is le life", or other such banal tripe by people who have skimmed a summary of 19th century german aesthetic philosophy, this tripe always coming from some upper middle class milquetoast whose only hardship is the ennui of excessive luxury, or alternatively, some poor seasonally unemployed adjunct (tenure is a lie for anyone born after 1985) who not only needs those lies to sell his work, but more severely, would surely drink himself to death immediately were he to stop believing them.

>>20681014
>Did you know that grass lawns became popular and fashionable because they used to be a very ostentatious display of extreme and excessive wealth? It was a way for land owners with massive amounts of land to spare to show just how rich they were, that they did not need to grow anything on their land.
WTF

>would surely drink himself to death immediately were he to stop believing them.
oof that huts, what is the solution then? Dare I say, "it's over"?

>>20680882
>t. artsy richfag

>>20681014
This the most retarded rant, our current way of looking at literature can't be more different from 19th century, main demographic of readers is different, our reading habits is different...
And it was never about making it to the upper classess

>>20680882
Did we strike a nerve, richfag? Or are you worse, a richfag aplogist?
>>20680797
Wrong. God I love this song. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkpLbEM06qE
>>20681014
Most if not all culture and art in any given society is created by the upper class due to them having free time to pursue such things for their own sake, while the poors typically don't have access to the same networks, tools, instruments, and schools to develop their thought. Today that's viewed as a net negative, which is why we see so many richfags using their money and connections to buy success or exercise nepotism. Look at the indie scene, rappers(especially white ones), painters, journalists, and writers(outside of the few token minorities the rich fags "platform" in an attempt to pat themselves on the back). Nothing these types create inherently challenges the system, nothing focuses on the economic issues that the common man faces, and it instead focuses on the identity of a person, the struggle of the individual in terms of coming to accept themselves within the free market. This ends up reinforcing the economy to ensure it can continue to function.

Be wary of richfags, they will almost always lead you astray. Hell look at most workers movements, they're lead by downwardly mobile upper middle class types who have a saviour fantasy and enjoy putting foreign objects up their ass a little too much. Bougie fucks, the lot of them.

>>20681611
>anon displays his lack of reading comprehension

>>20680827
Trust fund loser is absolutely seething at the realization of his own mediocrity because he’s noticing that despite daddy buying him every credential, he’ll always be inadequate

>>20680797
This, poor and middle class people love the "giving a better life to muh kids" larp, but when rich people do it they get mad. Bunch of hypocrites.

>>20680763
spbp

>>20680752
normal people can't write (good) novels. when they try it comes out as soulless MFA core, "it's x crossed with y" style copying like a teenager tracing anime, or formulaic shit like cozies where it's all plug and play.

>>20680846
t. asspained richfag. Art comes from suffering crossed with overeducation. privileged rich kids do not suffer. third worlders do not have enough education. art can only be created by socially isolated sufferchads with an above average IQ.

>>20682210
No doubt that he is an assblasted richfag but rich people in the past have made good shit. Schopenhauer, Baudelaire, Beckett, Proust etc. were richfags but they made kino works. Contemporary richfags are gay as fuck with their performative ennui, moralfagging and empathic larp.

20680823
>J.S. Bach was an orphan before he started writing music
So? Did you just not bother learning any other piece of trivia about him and just assumed that him being an orphan means he grew up poor, starving and uneducated? He was from a wealthy family of professional musicians, was taught music by his relatives since he was born and studied in prestigious schools. He is the complete opposite of a self-taught starving artist. He was set up for success from the start.

>>20680823
>J.S. Bach was an orphan before he started writing music
So? Did you just not bother learning any other piece of trivia about him and just assumed that him being an orphan means he grew up poor, starving and uneducated? He was from a wealthy family of professional musicians, was taught music by his relatives since he was born and studied in prestigious schools. He is the complete opposite of a self-taught starving artist. He was set up for success from the start.

>>20680903
You 'think' you might be an idiot?

>>20681968
Difference is that the poor do it because they know of the enormous obstacle poverty has been in their own life. Middle-class people are typically thankful to have avoided that obstacle, and strive to give their children the same. Rich people with this mentality don't understand that they are not saving their children from one of the biggest disadvantages it is possible to be shackled with, they are afraid to stumble but don't know what it is to fall. In truth, rich parents with real concern for the character and well-being of their children should strive not to further insulate them from the harshness and difficulties of life, but to acclimate them so that they don't have to go through life never knowing that there's a bottom to the pool.

>>20680752
people who are into "art" look just like the bottom ones

>>20683010
>Noooo everyone has to be a wagecuck like me!!!!!

>>20680827
>oh, poor me, shamed for being disgustingly rich
lmao listen to yourself faggot

>>20683089
No, the point is that no one should be. To work and toil is good, good for the soul and for your character. But when that comes at the cost of any leisure, any chance to experience some of the most beautiful parts of life and truly explore yourself, then it's just a fucking economic trap to keep people in an awful existence.

At the same time, those desperate, rock-bottom experiences allow us to get much more out of the beauty that is there in the world. To be insulated from the world is not a blessing, it is its own curse.

>>20680827
is right, it makes no sense to blame people for their circumstances that they had no control over. And when you're born and raised in daddy's pocket, it can destroy an individual just as badly as abject poverty. Reminder that both the poor and the rich escape to drugs.

>>20680752
No, most artists were born and raised upper class. The "lower class outsider weirdo that makes a masterpiece" is a deprecated archetype from an anomalous economic era. You shouldn't expect to see it happen anymore.

>>20680752
This image is backwards. Art students are people who make poor life decisions out of passion, artists are rich people with a trust fund to fall back on if it doesn't work out.

>>20683143
It happened in my country tho. A big brained mason mogg'd every university educated writer/poet.

shakespeare was middle class

>>20680797
>>20681968
This and this. Nothing but literal slave morality

>>20681696
>t. works at McDonalds and has never seen art.
Fucking lol. Why do poorfags even try? I've been to more theatres, more concerts, more shows, seen more paintings, read more and older books, had a WAY BETTER EDUCATION, and have just experienced more shit period than you probably ever have? So where the FUCK do you get off calling ME the mediocre one? Poorfags are legit dumb as shit. I have zero sympathy for you. NONE. I worked hard as shit to get where I am. Just because your definition of """work""" involves saying "do you want fries with that?" doesn't mean I haven't done any work, faggot. Fuck you. Guaranteed my life is a 1000% more stressful than yours but I still fucking manage somehow and don't bitch about it (I know, fucking crazy!).

>>20681680
>nothing focuses on the economic issues that the common man faces
This statement contradicts the one before it. You're right the influential artists never challenge the established Liberal democratic propaganda, but the class struggle is a major theme in anti white propaganda. Taxing the middle and upper classes to raise poor blacks to the middle class is a huge agenda they are pushing, and there's a ton of sob stories of MCs growing up poor. Articles and books about this are not uncommon
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/05/08/growing-up-poor-and-queer-in-a-french-village

Yeah nobody is writing how tough it is for the "common man" because we do live in the most richest times ever. Owning an iPhone and a laptop are like basic human rights now. It's cringe af to complain about middle class life materialistically, its like "boohoo why can't I have nice fast car like my local politician? The elites are in a conspiracy to keep us poor!" and you write this from your 2 room apartment with aircon and a fridge full of food.

Marxists faggots totally blinded by his ideological programming, always seething because of your resentment to the more successful and beautiful that rightly inherited it. And because you're lazy and don't want to work

>>20681680
Btw your taste in music is shit

>>20682210
>art can only be created by socially isolated sufferchads with an above average IQ
Nice self insert anon, but no good art has ever come from 4chan, except memes, if you consider that art.

A recent example of a great sheltered middle class artist is David Lynch. The man grew up pretty wealthy with a normal happy family. He happened to have artistic talent and his family supported it. He creates hellish but dreamlike movies that may seem to come from someone who's suffered a lot, but Eraserhead just came from him having fears of becoming a father and having talent and education enough to pull it off

Thinking of a decent contemporary writer there's Knausgard, a normie in every sense but with talent and passion to write.

>>20683092
Alright so what's your solution? People who happen to be born to people who happen to have money should kill themselves out of shame? If you were born into money you would never use any of your resources right?
If a rich person feels guilty and gets rid of all their money you call them an idiot
If a rich person just makes use of what they have you call them spoiled

>>20682265
You're just making assumptions and pretending all rich people act a single way as if nobody said the exact same things you were saying in the days of Proust and Beckett

>>20680752
The opposite of your statement seems true to me in the modern day. Artists are generally from well off families and they make art to gain the admiration of the masses.

>>20684209
>If a rich person feels guilty and gets rid of all their money you call them an idiot
Personally I'd call this person a man of God, pure in heart and soul, and based. Only soulless bugs will call that person an idiot

>>20680823
I'm rich and I'm hungry right now.

>>20684231
And yet if you see some rich kid who is now poor you'd make fun of him and call him an idiot who can't manage money's nd romanticizes the poor. You'd be constantly making 'got on daddy's bad side' jokes. He would have to tackle each and every single argument you made personally before you'd ever come around to believing this is a life he chose

>>20684245
Why would he need others to externally validate his life? Why is the fear of being misjudged so powerful in your example? What is so wrong about being misunderstood by others, do you believe that we are all properly understood by everybody else?

Ultimately this is the robbery of being born to too much money and not being grounded enough in reality, you become stunted. If you are never allowed to touch the floor, how can you ever grow strong roots?

>>20684138
Anti white propaganda is created by the power structures/capitalist system that exists in the world and use it to distract people from the truly inclusive issue which is class. They then use this attack on "whiteness" to appeal to lower class whites, many of whom own guns, and tell them the minority is trying to kill them all. The classic capitalist move, creating narratives that reinforce capitalism and take criticism and attention off of it.

>Taxing the middle and upper classes to raise poor blacks to the middle class is a huge agenda they are pushing, and there's a ton of sob stories of MCs growing up poor. Articles and books about this are not uncommon

Implying the tax dollars actually even go to social programs in the US. It'll be used to pay off contractors and grease the gears of the MIC while taking away resources from the middle class as well. What we're seeing is the start of a new industrial revolution, one where a new form of feudalism becomes the norm. And of course there are poor gay people, but they're rarely the ones who get the screentime and cultural influence. A few are plucked out and brought into the regime to say HEY LOOK WE HAVE REPRESENTATION.

>Yeah nobody is writing how tough it is for the "common man" because we do live in the most richest times ever. Owning an iPhone and a laptop are like basic human rights now. It's cringe af to complain about middle class life materialistically, its like "boohoo why can't I have nice fast car like my local politician? The elites are in a conspiracy to keep us poor!" and you write this from your 2 room apartment with aircon and a fridge full of food.

Disingenuous argument, you're saying NUMBER GO UP SO EVERYTHING GOOD. Meanwhile people are struggling to make payments for food(most of which is absolute trash), rent, cars because God forbid the US set up good public transport lest the auto lobby flip its shit. And let's not forget the complete stagnation of wages, the loss of actual working class jobs where we as a nation actually made tangible goods and instead focus on creating fake numbers for fake products in a fake economy. Oh, and housing is next to unaffordable in parts of the country where there are jobs while places that have affordable housing have no industry nor infrastructure.

Neolib faggots like you are the worst, you worship mammon and completely neglect the needs for others while finding new ways to justify the developing caste system here in the west. And assuming I don't work a trade when because I actually want people to be able to support themselves, have a family, and build a community of people where there's support for everyone. Stay atomized you bug, not like you can take whatever you own with you to Heaven.

And hating that track by Pulp either means you have shit taste or it struck a chord with you. Probably both.

In short, lick my taint and suck my nuts.

>>20684245
Weird projection. If someone tells me he gave away his money willingly to the poor and stood behind that decision with firm conviction without sounding like an attention whore I would respect and esteem him highly

>>20684053
>>20680797
What's it like having everything in life handed to you?

>>20684320
>mug capitalism being the problem behind everything
People are better off economically than ever because of capitalism. Society works effectively with hierarchies which have always existed for good reasons. Importing nignogs in your society and raising them to the same class as everyone will destroy it. I agree capitalism is spiritually corrupt, but socialism will only ever work in a high trust homogeneous society with strong patriotic fervor. Your commie solution is based on a total delusion of human nature. What we need is the next Hitler to passionately flush out commie retards like you and the unpatriotic who dislike their country and muddy their culture with filth. Calling me a neolib shows your low iq. Communism is just a much more terrible solution that the current one we have now.

>>20684320
>muh middle class are actually poor
Oh I see, you're just a spooked zoomer witnessing his first inflation. You probably read the communist manifesto and think it sounds like paradise on earth, or you just listened to your favorite breadtuber talk about how based a classless society would be.

The fake economy is a real problem. All that is needed there is Hitler to eradicate all fake jobs, and instill a proper caste system so low iq proles can keep being proles cleaning toilets, where they belong, but if they serve the country willingly and honorably they will rightfully be taken care of with free health care and fair pay.

>>20684386
It's great. Aside from all the obvious benefits, you also make the less powerful seethe endlessly just by virtue of existing. There are very few greater feelings in the world.

>>20680910
Van Gogh was not rich

>>20684121
Take your meds

>>20684323
>To the poor
Nice caveat

>>20684273
You wrongfully seem to think I'm born into money

>>20684465
Not him but no, it’s just that no one gives a fuck

>>20684468
Yes you do. This entire thread is about obsessing over and shaming someone for the circumstances of their birth

>>20684476
What? You have a microdick or something? Really appalling looking?

>>20684465
I did think that, but it doesn't really matter to what I said. I'm not basing it on a projection of you, it's just what I think about the circumstances of being born rich... clearly very advantageous, but not guarantee of a happy or meaningful life, and with its own challenges.

>>20684400
Who said I'm in favor of mass importing people from the global periphery? I'm in favor of not sowing discord in their nations and letting them rule themselves as opposed to subjecting them to the petrodollar, cheap mineral extraction, and shit working conditions in factories just because those working conditions wouldn't fly here. And communism is only a terrible solution now because we have downwardly mobile anal enthusiasts who are more anarchist than communist. They're to the left as libertarian dudes with Asian wives are to the right. And dude, this inflation is nerve-wracking when cost of living hasn't kept up with the rise in prices for rent, food that isn't complete trash, and the complete lack of medical care in the US. And stop labeling me as some failed artist covered in too many tattoos adjacent type, I hate them too. Now go watch Ben Shapiro and post in the groyper chat talking about how you owned a commie today.

>unironic nazi

You're literally playing into the hands of idpol. Now go strut around like a retarded pigeon in front of oncoming traffic because you think you won the argument.

>>20684490
So you think all rich kids should kill themselves?

>>20684505
No, just you

>>20684513
Fuck you I bet you think robert kurvits is a good writer

>>20684505
I'm not sure how you understood that from what I was saying. I'm saying that those born rich are not given the guarantee of a happy life, which is true of everyone regardless of their circumstances at birth. But we all owe it to ourselves to try, and the rich are no exception.

Why did you defensively jump to that extreme?

>>20684522
so you're saying rich people don't try and they are shitheels for it.

>>20684526
No, I'm not saying anything near to that. Why is that what you understood?

>>20684544
Because rich people piss me off. People like robert kurvits

>>20684320
>And hating that track by Pulp either means you have shit taste or it struck a chord with you. Probably both.

Bro, it's a shitty song, I didn't even get to the singing part because it already sounded gay, I had to go and read the lyrics to see what you meant with it. It SOUNDS bad that's all.

>>20684549
I don't even know who Robert Kurvits is

>>20684553
Don't fucking lie

>>20684552
at least listen to a single song. surely you are not that busy. even if it is just in the background

>>20684121
I am an attorney, you dullard

>>20684402
>>20684053
Slave morality is most common among the wealthy and powerful overcompensating though. They invented it and festered it in order to reconcile their conclusions about the world with what they actually are. Perhaps a little motivated by trying to delude the lowerclasses and cut out competition. They created the victim hierarchy and its exaltation. While, of course, doing whatever they can to sideline class and remove the real determining factor that defines them.

I'm from a poor family and I absolutely despise the poor and rich alike. Disgusting, inhuman creatures both. There's only a few kinds of people in this modern world who are respectable.

>>20685486
Dude, what the fuck are you talking about? Read Genealogy of Morals, at least the first essay (it's not long). This is a complete, complete misunderstanding of what nietzsche was saying when he explained slave morality (actually i don't even think you can call it a "misunderstanding" if it has nothing to do with that).

I swear you guys will do anything to avoid actually writing. Instead of trying to quantify suffering in relation to artistic output, you should probably concern yourselves with getting your work out there.

>>20680846
You're here because you know you're wrong. You can leave. Nobody will miss you. But that's why you don't go. You need these people way more than they need you.

>>20685508
Writing in no way makes you a better writer. It makes you Stephen King.

>>20685492
I'm obviously not talking about Nietzsche but the sentiments and all the rest attached to the term which is what is meant when someone says slave morality including in this case (the post I replied to). It is saying that the lower exhibits certain characteristics when he doesn't. Those characteristics are fully the domain of the upper for his games and hangups because they don't have master morality but still don't want to be poor and powerless.

>>20685536
>It is saying that the lower exhibits certain characteristics when he doesn't
He doesn't? This is just blatantly incorrect, even posts in this very thread can prove it ("muh daddy's money", "muh you have everything handed"). A large portion of the poor not ony here but MUCH more in the irl world are devout followers of slave morality. Just look at how many communists there are out there, and those don't make even a third of the total number of slave moralists.

And how do the powerful follow slave morality at all (as you seem to imply in the last part of your post)?

>>20685531
Unbelievable amounts of cope with this one. Stay unpublished and bitter.

>>20680882
protect POC (people of coinage)!!!