/lit/ - Literature

When will that mega be updated with resources for other classical languages?

Bonan tagon al ĉiuj!

based podium arts

>>20615851
I am the curator of that Mega and the answer is never. I made it specifically to be for Latin/Greek as those are what I have experience in. If you want a Mega for other languages feel free to create one. Due to upload limits and my lack of knowledge in other classical languages including more would be futile.
That said a fairly big update is coming relatively soon. I have a huge list of requests from prior threads. If anyone wants to request anything in particular for the Mega please do so in the replies to this post and I will try to accomodate you.

οὕτω βραδὺ τὸ τήμερον νῆμα

>>20616663
Do you have a date or an approximate date for the update. I don't want to start uploading if there will be new things coming in the next few days

>>20617308
χαῖρε, ὦ βάτραχοε ἀπόστολε

>>20615830

/clg/ Questions

- What are some classical translations for Aesop's Fables and Tao Te Ching?
- What are some important untranslated Classical Chinese texts?
- What are some important untranslated Esperanto texts?

>>20617965
> What are some important untranslated Esperanto texts?
Not a classical language.

>>20615830
was curious to know the /CLG/ opinion on Hansen & Quinn

>>20617965
>/clg/ Questions

>- What are some heckin classical translations for Sappho and Korinna?
>- What are some important untranslated Chinese Classical texts from women?
>- What are some important untranslated transexual treaties in Esperanto?

LLPSI Read Along guy here

I see several ways forward with the read along thing

>A
Continue as normal unchanged and do it differently the second time around.
>B
Slow down now, from chapter 15 onwards start going 1-2 weeks per chapter (or whatever timing we decide on).
>C
Restart from the beginning with new timing of 1-2 weeks per chapter (or whatever timing we decide on).
>D
Restart from the beginning with a radical new plan consisting of some mixture of discussion, re-reading, translation, writing exercises, grammar form memorisation tasks, etc, more of a LLPSI based latin course in the thread (would require someone more experienced in latin than me to figure out though I think).
>E
some other option, feel free to dump ideas

>>20615851
Last night, I created a Semitic Mega. I've always said, this should be handled by an Assyriologist who knows Hebrew as well, which I am not, but none have come forward. Please let me know what you want me to upload. The question is what languages should we include. Obviously, Sumerian must be included in the Semitic Mega to be included in any Mega at all for /clg/. I like the term Semitic, but Afro-Asiatic is more accurate because we ought to include Egyptian and Coptic. Should we include Hittite, if someone can suggest some resources? It is Indo-European, but it is written in cuneiform? How about Persian?
I'll reiterate, please let me know what you want uploaded. I'm not going to go to Z‐Library to download a bunch of Egyptian grammars just to upload them to the Mega without knowing what is good and what is bad, what is wanted and what is unwanted. You could do that just as well. The Semitic Mega should be somewhat well-curated. My first priority is grammars and dictionaries, but Megaman (or more aptly Megachad) of the Classics Mega has created an excellent example of what we should strive to create in the Semitic Mega.

https://mega(dot)/fm/EOFHXQAD
t. Ethiopianon

>>20618094
I'm in support of option C; extra exercises seem unnecessary and people motivated could do them anyway. I can see why starting all over after getting this far would be frustrating but if you decide to do it 1-2 days would be enough for the first few chapters. I guess you could use you own experience as a measure to how long we should spend on a given chapter.

>>20618266
good idea

egyptian isnt genetically semitic, you should call the group ANE (ancient near east)

>>20618051
>>- What are some important untranslated transexual treaties in Esperanto?
this is the only almost funny one

>>20618266
this url redirects me to the mega start page

>>20618324
Was mocking rather than trying to be funny, y'know

>>20618486
then u failed at both

>>20618537
No cap?

>>20618354
My mistake. This one should work now.
https://mega(dot)nz/folder/YfsmFRxA#pz58Q6aTDkwn9Ot6G68NRg

okay but where is daily catullus

>>20618563
it does. thanks.

>>20618597
wasn't here yesterday either. rip

>>20618266
>>20618563
> it is written in cuneiform
No particular interest in Hittite, but I wouldn't include or exclude languages based on their writing system. Some languages have more than one, and there's a perfectly serviceable classification system for languages already.

> Egyptian
I heard good things about the Assimil course, but it's in French.

> My first priority is grammars and dictionaries
BDB and HALOT are the standard dictionaries for Hebrew, right? Would be nice to have them.

>>20618683
I'll include those dictionaries. I mostly use online dictionaries, so I am not very familiar with BDB and HALOT. I should add Gesenius and Jastrow too.

bump

>>20617731
Not yet, fairly busy right now. Will update the changelog though not in great detail. You could dl everything and replace duplicates

>>20617731
>>20619930
Scratch that, tentative date is to finish before August. No promises but will do my best.
To be clear the general layout will not change. Update is almost entirely a ton of new books and files to upload as well as updating links.

>>20615851
Try these from /lang/ over on /int/
https://mega.nz/folder/INlRkAQC#CthKI9-_kmDNyrOx12Ojbw

https://mega.nz/folder/x4VG3DRL#lqecF4q2ywojGLE0O8cu4A

>>20618318
Semitic and Egyptian are both Afro-Asiatic, so that's a better name for it.

To figure out what an optimal timing is for the LLPSI Read Along I want anons in this thread to submit to this graph.

Feel free to plot either the time you actually spent on each chapter, or the time you think should be allocated to each chapter.
Since most people probably re-read earlier chapters again after having read later chapters, just sort of compile the total time together for each chapter.
Don't worry if you haven't finished the book, just plot as far as you've managed to get.

>>20620683
i thought u were doing sumerian too. is that afroasitic?

>>20620827
I'm not the Mega guy, is he doing Sumerian? Tbh all near eastern classical languages are Afro-Asiatic besides Sumerian, Hittite, & Elamite. That is, unless you count Ottoman Turkish as near eastern.

>>20620837
My bad, I am also forgetting the Iranian languages like Old Persian and Avestan. Maybe the name is better like that.

>>20620816

I'm too stupid to understand Familia Romana unless I do every exercise in the exercise book so I'm progressing through the book extremely slowly

>>20621176
I hate the exercises because it's very difficult to do them without English explanations or a teacher.

You can for the most part understand the gist of what you read, but answering in Latin is fucking hard without knowing the right word order or syntax. It's true that it can be easy to recognize syntactical ambiguity and infer meaning, but not it's not necessarily easy to reproduce it when you are not 100% certain what is going on grammatically. You can only get so far into the book using it as a sole resource before you have to ask other people online for help or use the companion book. People who say you don't need anything else are full of shit.

>>20620816
what I've done thus far - after this I went back and re-read each chapter at a rate of one per day because I forgot a bunch of vocabulary, and I saw it would bring me roughly aligned with the read along here. Personally I didn't have trouble with any chapter in particular, and the ones that took longer were mostly just because I spent less time per day.

>>20621187
Oh yeah I ignore those questions, I just do the ones with the answers in the student manual
Sometimes my word order is different but so far it's been fine and I can understand whether my answer is right or wrong

>>20621195
I'm so inconsistent, I'm embarassed to say I'm like halfway done with the book, but it's taken me probably over a year, because I don't read for a week or 2 and then forget everything and go back to the first chapter and start over. I've done that like 20 times now. This shit is just so fucking boring to read. I don't understand how anyone can say a grammar book is boring, but then prop these lame ass stories as exciting. Chapter 13 is the biggest expositional slog I've ever had to sit through in any language.

>>20621187
>People who say you don't need anything else are full of shit.
you don't need anything else if you want to learn how to read

>>20621221
LLPSI is extremely boring. One of the downsides to it.
The best thing you can do is to consistently study every day. Even 20 minutes a day will go far over time. Get another textbook and when you can't stand LLPSI look through that instead. There is no need to bore yourself to tears when there are so many options available.
I guarantee that a minimum of 20 minutes a day will see your Latin skill skyrocket.

>>20621339
no one who says this reads Latin, you, for instance, do not

>>20621339
You're right, I will just "infer" my way up to a PHD in classics level of reading.

>>20621221
> I don't read for a week or 2 and then forget everything and go back to the first chapter and start over.
This is the problem. Read every single day, even if it's just two pages you already read, for exactly the reason you mentioned. Of course having to start from the beginning will grind you down.

> Chapter 13 is the biggest expositional slog I've ever had to sit through in any language.
Thankfully, it will stay that way to the end of the book. Other chapters are hard, but at least they have some plot.

>>20621361
that's the spirit good luck

About to comprehend chapter 24

Just finished chapter 6, that was easier than chapter 5 imo but maybe I hadn't studied as much when I first read chapter 5

>>20620837
I am the Mega guy. It is now called ANE. I do plan on adding Sumerian when someone requests that I add some Sumerian resources or when I can figure out what some must have Sumerology texts are. That goes for every language I don't know.

>>20621532
Use these two and grab some of this material.

https://mega.nz/folder/INlRkAQC#CthKI9-_kmDNyrOx12Ojbw/folder/NB1RRCgA
https://mega.nz/folder/x4VG3DRL#lqecF4q2ywojGLE0O8cu4A/folder/dkFmHR5I

>>20621538
I will be sure to add them today. Where did you find these Megas? Who made them? They are densely packed with books.

>>20621562
They are from /lang/ threads on /int/

This one has linguistics stuff which you may or may not find useful: >https://mega.nz/folder/Ad8DkLoI#jj_mdUDX_ay-8D9l3-DbnQ
This one is latin and greek only:
>https://mega.nz/folder/9o4QEIIK#P3piz8Bfw-z7jgb7Q8NWDg

>>20621569
Thanks. I'll be sure to download some books in the writing systems folder. Any recommendations from this thread are appreciated too. I've been fascinated with Proto-Sinaitic and Aramaic for years and have asked my professors for book recommendations. Of course, Linear A and B have also interested me. I am intrigued even by Rongorongo.

>>20621593
The Historical Linguistics folder has some interesting stuff. The rest is probably irrelevant.

>>20615830
What painting is that pic

>>20621629
> File: KlimtTragedy1897.png (1.3 MB, 744x846)

bump

I want to write a poem in Latin. (something a little shorter than an average aeneid/homer book, say like 400 verses) What should I write about?

>>20622654
Caligula Did Nothing Wrong.

>>20622654
If you don't know the topic you have no business attempting to write such a lengthy poem. How about a few short odes to start? To get the feel for the language, meter, prosody and such

>>20622654
If you are going to do that, then could you do it in meter and not in rhyme?, I want to know how Greek/Latin meter works but i have failed so far since i got filtered by the Wikipedia article kek

LLPSI Read Along will be on hold for a bit while I think of what to do with it. Sorry to anyone who's following along with the current chapter.

I want to do it in a way that allows the most people to be able to follow along with it and not fall behind within 3 chapters

>Latin
>Greek
Stop being so boring and learn a rarer language.

>>20620827
I tried Sumerian a few years ago and found that there were basically no learning resources aside from out-of-print century-old philology texts and that even the linguists who specialize in Sumerian disagree considerably on aspects of its structure and grammar.
It seems maddeningly difficult but it would be cool to be able to read

best plan of action for Koine?

>>20623621
don't?
Why did the Apostles write in plain Greek? Because they wanted the message to be seen clearly. It won't help you.

>>20623607
its not a pissing contest. I just want to read plato and ficino

>>20621645
thanks my b, didn't see

>>20623607
its true that latin and greek are boring at this point and everyone should have gotten enough of it from hs and early college but...

>>20623874
next time ask him to stop sucking muhammads dick so much. imagine clg ran by fucking mudslimes

Is 90 roman coins a lot? I assume Iulius has way more coins than that

>>20623607
I'm not learning latin because I want to be unique and contrarian

>>20623607
Arabic has far more speakers, writers, and readers than Latin and Greek put together.

>>20624963
Why not be unique like me and, in addition to learning Latin, learn a bunch of ancient languages?

>>20624749
A denarius was typically a day worth of unskilled labor. It's not extravegant but it's safe to say if he's hauling that around in a purse he's wealthy.
https://coinweek.com/ancient-coins/worth-purchasing-power-ancient-coins/

>>20625143
Well the only languages I'd consider worth learning is classical chinese and classical arabic and I don't think those are 'rare'

>>20625224
Of course, you should only learn languages that interest you and will be of value to you. If Latin isn't one of those languages, don't learn it. While Classical Arabic is not rare, I would say that Classical Chinese is. You said that you didn't want to learn Latin because you want to be unique and contrarian. Now, it sounds like you just don't have an interest, which is a different matter entirely and a non-issue.

>>20625134
Latin and Greek are too much of an obvious choice for classical languages learners. While there still are many medieval-early moden beneficial latin texts that are left untranslated, much of the classical greek corpus has already been translated by the arabs and latins. Though there still exists many byzantine era greek texts that might interest some autists, I doubt you people are learning greek for that. In any case, learning latin should benefit any student of language and facilitate for them the learning of other languages.

>>20625224
Sanskrit is definitely more beneficial than classical chinese but infinitely harder if you're not a pajeet. There exists a lot of sanskrit texts written about gigabrain topics that are left untranslated. And you're forced to rely on westerners who know sanskrit like Guenon to actually access that information. Regardless, everyone should learn classical arabic, perhaps after learning latin.

>>20625480
Are there any good online resources for Sanskrit?

it's so good bros.

>>20615830
>Over coffee I open Aeschylus at random and am astonished by the scornful answer of the seventh Fury to Orestes (“In the dead put then thy confidence, thou slayer of thy mother”). I tell R. that in my memory these things always seem more emphatic, more general in tone, and I am continually amazed by their personal, Shakespearean manner. R. agrees with me and says that, particularly in view of the huge theaters and the use of masks and buskins, the effect of this liveliness of speech (“in Sophocles the chorus in fact lies throughout”) is impossible to imagine—particularly in the comedy of Aristophanes. “How could the audience follow it at that distance? I can only conclude that the Greeks saw and heard things in a quite different way from us stay-at-homes and spectacle wearers.”

>>20625764
I'm going to learn Italian after Latin and then I'll use this

>>20625795
I hope that's not the reason you are learning Italian.

>>20625814
No the reason why I want to learn Italian is that it's supposedly easy after Latin and I want to read Umberto Eco and Italo Calvino in Italian

>>20625814
learning a language to learn a language is not uncommon

How would you translate these?

>Rogat quid agant, quid egerint.
> Audiverant unde milites venirent, unde venissent.
>Scisne quot annos Romani Britanniam tenuerint?

>>20626126
Roger twenty quid, agent forty quid, eggs.
Audio variable under military rent, understand?
Sissy quotes anus Romans, Britons ten.

>>20626126
>He asks what they are doing, what they have done
>They heard where the soldiers were coming from, where they had come from
>Do you know how years the Romans have possessed Britain?

>>20626158
>They had heard
my mistake

>>20625455
One should not learn Latin or Arabic to read translated Greek texts, if that's what you are implying. Learning a language and reading the original has its benefits. Learning Greek solely for the purpose of reading Homer or the New Testament are worth learning Greek. For godsake, people learn Latin to help them with legal or medical terminology.

>>20625455
One should not learn Latin or Arabic to read translated Greek texts, if that's what you are implying. Learning a language and reading the original has its benefits. Learning Greek solely for the purpose of reading Homer or the New Testament are worth learning Greek. For God's sake, people learn Latin to help them with legal or medical terminology.

There is not a single text in either Greek nor Latin that I desire to read, I simply want to learn Greek and Latin

>>20626203
hey augustus, you dropped this

>>20626137
Thanks Anon

>>20626158
Nah, think the other guy had it.

Thanks, just realised egerint is both indicative future perfect and subjunctive perfect.

>>20626203
I feel largely the same way towards Latin, where the fact that I want to understand my culture is enough of a reason to learn it.
However with Greek, you'd have to be insane to put yourself through all that suffering for no reason and must be equally crazy not to want to read Homer and Plato.

>>20626341
The suffering itself could be the reason, I am learning Latin partly for mental exercise.

>>20626126
Now the other way.
>I shall tell you where they were and what they did: Tibi dicam ubi essent et quid egerint.
>He asked me why I had come. Me rogavit cur venerim.
>I had heard where he had been. Audiveram ubi fuisset.

I should go through a book with living authors that has actual answers after this one.

If you can read Plato fluently you still won't be able to read the New Testament or "Koine" Greek because 10% of the vocabulary, in the NT, is not found at all in Classical works.

>>20626203
Are you a linguistic or are you looking for a way to distinguish yourself? If it is the latter, you're going to have a problem, if you plan on self‐study.

>>20625480
Do you have experience with both?

>>20626203
Fuck this guy, but he's still based.

I've asked something along these lines a few times before, but I'll try again. Maybe I'll get some new answers.

Has anyone learned Hebrew, Aramaic, Syriac, & Coptic in that order? How much Hebrew did you have to do before you got to Aramaic? Can you skip Aramaic and just go right into Syriac after Hebrew? How difficult is the jump from Syriac to Coptic? Also has anyone read the Gnostic texts in original Coptic? Does knowing Greek help with Coptic?

Compliments from /t/'s language learning thread:

>Ancient Greek:
magnet:?xt=urn:btih:14CD0AC98EA62D3CA2CE66276F96AAB4B57FA7B2&dn=Ancient%20Greek%20Language%20Learning%20Pack&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.coppersurfer.tk%3A6969%2Fannounce&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.openbittorrent.com%3A6969%2Fannounce&tr=udp%3A%2F%2F9.rarbg.to%3A2710%2Fannounce&tr=udp%3A%2F%2F9.rarbg.me%3A2780%2Fannounce&tr=udp%3A%2F%2F9.rarbg.to%3A2730%2Fannounce&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.opentrackr.org%3A1337&tr=http%3A%2F%2Fp4p.arenabg.com%3A1337%2Fannounce&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.torrent.eu.org%3A451%2Fannounce&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.tiny-vps.com%3A6969%2Fannounce&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fopen.stealth.si%3A80%2Fannounce

>Latin
magnet:?xt=urn:btih:99454DE1F28C86B11BA5536C95B9D3363D840969&dn=The%20Ultimate%20Latin%20Language%20Learning%20Pack&tr=udp%3a%2f%2ftracker.openbittorrent.com%3a80%2fannounce&tr=udp%3a%2f%2ftracker.opentrackr.org%3a1337%2fannounce

>>20626865

>>20626897

>>20626897

>>20626865
BAΣΕΔ

>>20621392
Is this a LLPSI schedule?

>>20627198
his language lectures are great too bad that series he did on paganism was boring as shit. he just rattled off facts like he's going over a conjugation chart.

>>20615830
bros offer me some advice here. No one warned me how easy it is to lose Latin if you don't practice it regularly. Obviously, I should have realized this in hindsight because I speak it with nobody. The problem I have is that there are so many ways to review I'm not sure which to commit to and in consequence end up with my energies scattered. There's: vocab drilling, chart drilling, reading LLPSI, reading chapter exercises from the texts i used, writing in Latin per section of the texts I used, translating Latin texts, memorizing bits of Latin texts, and many more things I haven't thought of here. Has anyone encountered this? Because it's not a spoken language its necessarily a bookish study to review things which with almost every other language I could do by socializing and just speaking. Inform me bros.

>>20627308
>No one warned me how easy it is to lose Latin if you don't practice it regularly.
Yep.
>The problem I have is that there are so many ways to review
Yep.
>Has anyone encountered this?
Yep.
>Inform me bros.
Dude I have no idea. I lose this shit so easily. I'm going to spend more time writing stuff out by hand. It's the only thing I could think of. I'm sorry, but I wish you luck. On days I don't study, I listen to Radio Vaticana which is a weekly 5 minutes audio podcast of news in Ecclesiastical Latin from the Vatican. Either that or I listen to Satura Lanx's YouTube channel. She's the only person on YouTube that doesn't have a dogshit burger accent and she uses Classical pronunciation besides the "V". Basically I try to at least make it a daily part of my life to get some input even if I just listen to 5 minutes of something in the background.

>dis niggas doesn't learn interlinneally

>>20627308
Read Latin every day

>>20627308
> There's: vocab drilling, chart drilling, reading LLPSI, reading chapter exercises from the texts i used, writing in Latin per section of the texts I used, translating Latin texts, memorizing bits of Latin texts, and many more things I haven't thought of here.
I don't understand. Why not just read, say, two pages of Caesar a day? That should be enough to maintain the language, no?

Of course you have to have reached a certain level to be able to do that. But before you're at that level, you're not really in the maintenance phase where you're trying not to lose the language, but rather in the learning phase, where you're trying to add to it.

>>20627441
>Why not just read, say, two pages of Caesar a day?
Most of us are not at that level. It's just meaningless gibberish to us. There is no progress. He's talking about upper beginner/lower intermediate people who haven't finished Familia Romana yet.

>>20627523
Okay, at that level you'll just have to keep pushing. The good news, I guess, is that you don't have too keep up an unsustainable pace indefinitely, once you're over that bump.

I have a question about Chinese, a language I know next to nothing about.

It seems Mandarin hasn't that many different syllable sounds: https://chinese.yabla.com/chinese-pinyin-chart.php
And in Classical Chinese, words mostly consist of a single character, each a single syllable. So there's no phonetic ambiguity, like modern multi-character words maybe introduce. And the language, of course, is highly analytical.

So, it should be trivial to automatically create audiobooks out of Classical Chinese texts that sound almost as good as if done by a human speaker, right? Just map each character to its sound out of the ones on that website, add pauses corresponding to the punctuation in a modern edition, and you're done, right?

Have I cornered the market for Classical Chinese audiobooks?

What's the best way to start with Koine?

>>20627604
If that were true anyone could create Japanese audiobooks due to kana. Spoken language has more nuances than that.

>>20627232
yes

>>20627308
once you've reached a critical mass of latin inpoot and practice you won't lose it very easily anymore
if you can't make it to that point you're just boned i guess

>>20627644
Not that anon but that's not the same thing at all, Japanese as a truckload of ambiguity in terms of readings, there is no one to one mapping between characters and kana. Most characters have multiple possible readings, and no the rule of "onyomi if compound" is a rule of thumb and does not always apply - not to mention that a fuckton of characters have multiple on and kun readings

>>20627441
Perhaps it is that easy. My problem is that I finished Wheelock last year and have since lost grip of concepts that I now need to review. I can translate Virgil pretty well, and most things are so ingrained within me that I find them stored in long term memory. I just get side tracked by all the options. If I studied one chapter of Wheelock a day id be fully reviewed in a month.

>>20627940
Every Japanese word has a phonetic value regardless the character used to write it. Any Japanese text can be written in kana - it's why furigana is not uncommon even in advanced texts. Despite that, even when presented with a text with furigana clearly listed for every kanji, with no phonetic ambiguity, anyone would clearly distinguish between a text read by a native and a non-native. Again, spoken language has more nuance than just the writing system.
It is why reading a text written in IPA sounds nowhere near natural unless spoken by a native speaker or one with enough years of practice and training to approximate a native speaker. What anon wants to do with Classical Chinese will not 'sound almost as good as if done by a human speaker', not anymore than a Speak-and-Spell would.

>>20627958
>If I studied one chapter of Wheelock a day id be fully reviewed in a month.
Then do that and read Latin as well. Not sure what you're asking here, it seems you know the answer to your question but don't want to hear it.

>>20627623
Start with attic

>>20627989
>Any Japanese text can be written in kana
Obviously. That's not the point at all. You said
>If that were true anyone could create Japanese audiobooks due to kana.
Which is not true because there is lots of ambiguity in possible Japanese readings that even AI can't deal with yet. But in Chinese this ambiguity doesn't exist, because every character is mapped clearly to one reading.
>Again, spoken language has more nuance than just the writing system.
You're right about this, not that I ever claimed you are not.

>>20620281
ok cool, thanks for this thread and the mega. I'm working on latin right now, I hope to write a book on the holy roman empire in the next few years.

You have just been teleported to Ancient Rome circa 300 AD, how well do you fare with your current latin skills and knowledge of the ancient world/culture/literature of the time?

>>20626203
I feel the same way, but didn't realize it until after learning Latin.

Drills and exercises are fun. Reading Roman authors is a dull slog.

>>20628203
Teach them the wonders of arabic numerals, double entry bookkeeping, and distillation. Live like a king.

>>20628203
very badly at first but i've learned enough to pick it up once i'm there

>>20628203
I would go up to Brutus and KICK SOME ASS

>>20628203
I could confidently speak broken latin, and use Spanish and sign language to get by like if i came from an uncontacted tribe, although it would be interesting to know how they would react to Spanish, they would most likely call me a barbarian, but then again it's the 4th century so who knows.

I would be dying to speak with Diocletian though (fav emperor), i would shit on the tetrarchy.

>>20628203
Satis Latine scio ut supervivere possem. Cives Romani me retardatum esse aestimarent, at idem cives nostri temporis agent.

>>20627997
>>20628066
I'm the guy who asked the original question. One reason why I think in Chinese there's a better chance to do what I proposed is because its a tonal language.

In other languages you'd sound like a robot if you pronounced a word the same way every time, but in Chinese... is there even any other way?

LLPSI chapter 24 was really easy. Comfy chapter.

>>20626137
I haven’t laughed this hard in months

>>20624540
>imagine clg ran by fucking mudslimes
they wouldn't allow troons

>>20618537
he didn't

>>20628203
male. scientia mea de historia romana satis esse puto, sed morum romanorum paucus scio. Quoque sine dictionarium lente dicabo, itaque tardus vocabor

>>20628203
bene: emerem BitNummos et homo dives firem

>>20628203
In terms of communication, I'd fare poorly. I know no Latin, yet I could still try to communicate using both my Spanish and Portuguese knowledge.
I also know nothing of the Roman Empire and what happened to it between the 3rd and 5th centuries.
Yet overall I think I could still adapt to my surroundings and learn the language; with enough time.

latin is so easy compared to japanese

>>20628879
and here's the troon

>>20628879
it's the other way around. japanese is the easiest language in the world.

should we have /lang/-like challenges?
easy, medium, hard phrases to translate?

>>20629038
We're too retarded for that; who would check the translation? I've read so much bullshit here (related to Latin) that I even believe that people here mislead others on purpose.
It would be better to just post in and simply use your TL. It would be a nice way of practicing, but we're too retarded for that too.

why do people mislead others
is it crab mentality from personal failure
do competent latinists want to ruin spoonfeedees
do some people just want to ruin latin culture

on a positive note it reinforces citations and making people actually use textbooks. cant filter the bullshit without a proper grounding

>>20629073
I should have added that I would love to do any of those. It's just I think it won't gain any traction or even be feasible.

>>20629099
>why do people mislead others
probably mere ignorance, but who knows

>>20629073
>It would be better to just post in and simply use your TL
biggest problem seems that people don't really know what to chat about, chit chatter gets boring fast, challenges at least give you a specific input
they can also be in the form of
>Easy
>Talk about X
>Describe Y
etc....
in any case I find them useful on /lang/ even if nobody corrects it, makes you look up vocabulary and review grammar

>>20629149
>biggest problem seems that people don't really know what to chat about
Half of the post on this general are offtopic or weakly related (lipsi, best method to learn languages in general etc). Just talk about that.
The problem is that we don't have the level to keep a fluent conversation, don't fool yourself... for example, you could just have written your last post in Latin.
I wouldn't be able to write this one.

>>20629180
I will try to answer in Latin tomorrow if someone (you)s me in Latin, btw.

>>20628948
japanese is the final boss of languages, not even natives know it well

*craaaaack*
Morty we need to read texts in
*burp*
Their original languages otherwise we can't understand their meaning well.
No Morty just because the Romans read all Greek literature in Latin and translated the Bible into Latin doesn't mean anything.
*crack burp*

>>20627249
great teacher but his pronunciation is awful.

>>20629149
good idea
describe this anime picture in latin

>>20629259
Ania tristis est.

>>20629229
*craaaaaaac*
Morti, necesse est legere scripta
*būrp*
linguis originalibus, aliter intellegere rectam significationem eorum non possumus.
Non, Morti, Romani legisse totam litteraturam graecam latine et Bibliam transtulisse in latinum, nullam significat.

>>20629259
videtur sicuti quaedam puella(nonne? aut puerculus effeminatus?) ex pellicula quadam iaponica modo fletura, crebrum visu hoc in situ

>>20629320
>Romani
romanos
mementote inspicere casos si verbum mutatis

>>20629320
desiste an legam liber graecus tui

>>20629360
neca te, evirate illiterate

>>20629330
>crebrum visu hoc in situ
quid hoc significat?

>>20629381
>crebrum visu
>The second supine, which comes with adjectives, is rarely used; only a few verbs have been seen to commonly adopt the form. It is derived from the dative of purpose, which expresses the purpose of a thing or action, or the ablative of respect, which can translate as "with regard/respect to" and is used to indicate to what extent or in what way the main clause is true. It is the same as the first supine but replacing final -um by -ū, with a lengthened u. Mirabile dictū, for example, translates as "amazing to say", where dictū is the supine form. The sense is generally passive, even if usually not explicitly marked as such in idiomatic English translation; for example, difficile creditū, "hard to believe", is more literally "hard to be believed", or "hardly believable".
>hoc in situ
on this site

>>20629406
putabam supinum passivum tantum cum adiectivis ire

>>20629439
ita, sicuti "creber, -bra, -brum", nonne?

>>20629439
>>20629457
et non tantum cum adiectivis sed tantum cum adiectivis finientibus in "-illis"
>>20629457
"crebrum", estne adverbium ibi?

>>20629481
>-illis
quid? falsum, quod exempli gratia "optimum factu" saepe invenitur
>>20629481
>"crebrum", estne adverbium ibi?
minime, sed neutrum adiectivum

>>20629510
>quid? falsum, quod exempli gratia "optimum factu" saepe invenitur
tamen non cum omnis adiectivis ire potest
https://dcc.dickinson.edu/grammar/latin/supine
>minime, sed neutrum adiectivum
quid est crebrum / quae res crebra est? adhuc non intellego sententiam tuam

>>20629229
> just because the Romans read all Greek literature in Latin
I know I'm responding to a shitpost, but man, I hope you don't seriously believe this.

>>20629590
potest nihilominus quoque qualibuscumque adiectivis adhiberi non modo -is, -e habentibus exitus, etsi fortasse "crebrum" antiquis in scriptoribus non frequenter inveniri potest, ipsi medii aevi scriptores saepe novos adhibent adiectivos
"crebrum" sive frequens est id factum, quod genus imaginum istud saepe videri potest hoc in situ

>>20629638
>potest nihilominus quoque qualibuscumque adiectivis adhiberi
dubito
>The supine in -ū is used with a few adjectives and with the nouns fās, nefās, and opus
et cur "crebrum" neutrum est? ad quem substantivus pertinet?
si volebas dicere verbigratia "videre has imagenes crebrum est", "videre" est subiectum sententiae

>>20629710
>dubito
libenter hoc fac, sed recte dico
>"inhonestum factu" - Horatius

>ad quem substantivus pertinet?
"factum", implicite, sicut locutio illa frequens "mirabile dictu"
cur mirabile ac non mirabilis? intellege hoc ipse

>>20629439
>tantum cum adiectivis ire
pure pidgin

>>20630773
how do you say it it in proper Latin?

>>20629749
>libenter hoc fac, sed recte dico
magis fido grammaticae libris
et illa sententia non est horatii

>>20629749
>cur mirabile ac non mirabilis? intellege hoc ipse
*hoc quod dixit* mirabile dictu

>>20630950
>tantum
solum or modo is better here. 'tantum' means only in the sense of 'only so much/little'. But this is the least of the issues
>cum
completely unnecessary, use ablative alone
>ire
this is the main problem. 'ire' means go as in motion. There is no motion in this context. On top of that you are transposing English idiom onto Latin resulting in nonsensical and frankly ugly sentences.
Quintilian tends to use 'invenire', 'dicere', even 'facere/fieri' when describing word usage. A better sentence, with a couple more tweaks, would be
>supinum autem passivum solum adiectivis inveniri putabam
This is the problem with trying to compose in Latin before actually knowing it. You have to acquire an instinctive feel for the language through lots of reading before anything you write starts to feel realistic. Without a grasp of how native Latin speakers actually thought and wrote you end up making horrible butchered pidgin sentences like a mumble rap nigger.
There are lots of resources for Latin composition. A composition book or two, a grammar, a dictionary and lots of reading are the key ingredients to quality composition. Posting on 4chan is not.

>>20631147
whats the minimum amount of reading to get a feel? 3 reading books?

>>20631179
>quantifying abstractions
A lot
Keep reading. Many authors, many works, many passages
And bear in mind that 90% of the Latin you see in /clg/ is bad. Ungrammatical, boorish, lacking in any style, ugly.

>>20628278
Really, Diocletian? What was so good about him?

>>20631193
okay but whats the rule of thumb minimum? you too dumb for stem? is that why you settled for classics? someone smarter than this faggot please answer

>>20631289
https://youtu.be/61Kk7VkoWbc?t=499

>>20631193
>>quantifying abstractions
if u seriously think this way latin the language of civilization isnt for u. swahili is more up to speed with an intellectual hard capped nigger like u

>>20628471
Oh yeah, rub it in douchebag. I'm on 17 still.

I just got Latin: An Intensive Course, anybody else use this? How did it go?
>tfw also got An introduction to Ancient Greek Scholarship and A Philological introduction to Greek and Latin
The latter went from explaining what a word was to shorthand explaining how vowles changed over time by giving exclusively examples in Doric-Attic and Attic-Ionic Greek. Has anyone ever came across this book?

>>20631617
I have it, it teaches the subjunctive like immediately. I have only looked through it and worked through the first chapter because I'm still finished Orberg and Wheelock, but it looks like it teaches way more grammar a lot faster.

>>20622654
I second Caligula >>20622772

>>20631628
That's helpful, I think getting grammar sorted first is probably a good ground to have.

>>20631675
Well the idea is that a lot of textbooks teach stuff like the subjunctive quite late in the final chapters, so students graduate with a shaky understanding when they jump into reading. The other problem is that they have to severely modify the annotated texts to be less natural by removing grammatical things like the subjunctive or passive voice when they are actually prevalent. By showing them early, the exercise sentences you work on in the early chapters are already closer to real Latin than other books.

>At the arrival of two legions the enemy departed from the left flank.

What case should 'legions' be in here?

qustion: "Marcus credit Sextum tam validum quam bovem esse." is it correct for me here to decline validus and bos in the accusative?

Does anyone know if there's a good way of writing "funded by x/paid for by x" in Latin?
Like if you had a big statue and you wanted to write "this statue was funded by Marcus"

The closest I've managed to find is the pantheon inscription, but that says "x made this" rather than "x funded this"

>>20631766
in Greek I would solve it with an absolutus (so absolute ablative in Latin), but my latin is not good enough to know if you need to cram for a participle of an equivalent deponens or if you can solve it like this: venientibus duobus legionibus

>>20631147
thanks for the input
>Posting on 4chan is not
i a 4chink midwit who finished familia romana 2 month ago, what did you expect

>>20631617
It is definitely intensive but a good textbook. Don't rush through it.
The downside is the lack of readings and sample sentences. Supplement with a reader.

>>20631796
yes

>>20631796
some nigger here corrected a sentence of mine saying that the verb esse never takes the accusative, not even in the infinitive... and I believed him

nigra sum, sed formosa, filiae Ierusalem, sicut tabernacula Cedar, sicut pelles Salomonis.
Nolite me conisderare quod fusca sim, quia decoloravit me sol.

>>20632592
dealbare te possum, si intellegis quod intendo

>>20632938
I heard the translation was bad. How is it?

>>20632938
>Yon Hobbit
I don geddit. Why wasn't it just called Hobbitus?

>>20632948
>bad translation

>>20631766
>>20631962
I think the other response has the right idea. The exercise probably doesn't intend for you to translate word for word ("what's the Latin word for 'at'?"). You probably want to translate with an ablative absolute (though in perfect tense), cum clause (e.g.g, cum ... advenisset) or something like that. Hopefully your textbook has examples in the chapter so you can see what they're going for. In short, the answer as to what case is it depends on what construction you use.

>latin doesn't have an active past participle or a passive present participle, but still has two future participles
I can't endure this shit

This this game do well with their voice lines in greek and egyptian?
https://youtu.be/OzlkRPuMMHs

>>20633406
Too modern for the time period. There is not much consistency with the pronunciation. One actor sounds native Greek, one Spanish, other American.

>>20632938
Bros... imagine if Tolkien had taken the time to make a translation himself

>>20633811
He would have made one in OE or Gothic or one of his conlangs.

>>20633823
Now I'm cooming even harder. You know I forgot for a second that this isn't the Latin general.

>>20633852
There are recent Alice in Wonderland translations in OE and Latin that seem to have been done really well. There's one in Gothic as well, but that one has problems, according to an Amazon review.

>>20631962
>>20633106
Not got to the ablative absolute yet

>at

Apud which is an accusative preposition so it would be 'apud adventum'. Sometimes it throws out tricky ones not explicitly covered yet designed to make pre WWI schoolboys think hard until teacher helps. I hacked together:

>Apud adventum duas legiones hostes ex latere sinistro discesserunt.

One to come back to I think.

>>20633966
I don't think you can use "apud" in a temporal/causal sense like "at" in English. Also, the two legions have to be in the genitive, it's their arrival.

>>20615830
Hey all. I asked about derivatives in another thread. Found this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Latin_words_with_English_derivatives

where is daily catullus bro...

>>20634069
he didnt really add anything desu, and if anything its harmful. it produced alot of 90% good translations that are ultimately more damaging to latin than obviously bad ones

>>20634223
>damaging to latin
mental illness

The only way to "damage" a language for yourself is by not engaging with it.

Any memorychads here can share techniques and tips for memorizing Homer and other hexameters/texts?

>>20634235
I think anon means to say that, because they are better than a really bad translation, a Latin novice might put great trust in his translations and get some incorrect ideas about Latin.

>>20634278
Memorizing Homer in the modern day has to be done differently than when early bards were doing it. Before the Athenian and Alexandrian master versions, bards had their own versions of Homer, and who knows how codified their own recitations were. My point here is that, today, you are expected to be quite accurate, so the techniques that Homer, his contemporaries, and early successors used won't all work for you. You're just going to have to recite lines again and again and again. Take your cues from Anglos instead. I have two suggestions, though. Sing or chant the lines; that's what the meter is for. I found this helped out a lot when memorizing some Latin poetry. Second, in addition to trying to remember line after line, keep a plot summary in mind too. I haven't tried memorizing anything close to the Iliad or Odyssey, but if you plan on reciting in Greek, a plot summary in Greek might be better than English.

>>20634293
yes. almost-good translations lead to bad habits and yes its damaging to latin >>20634235 you idiot

>>20634467
bad habits are not as bad as you think.
There's enough fear mongering about bad habits from Mr Baldhead and Dowels, we don't need any more.

The more information you take in, even if some of it is bad, will ultimately benefit you. If you are scared and try to avoid all bad information, you'll end up not taking in any information at all and won't learn latin

>>20634492
well duh but attempting translation should be the last step tried after basic composition. and youre wrong bad habits are often undetected and never unrooted. see foreign politicians speaking english with weird grammar despite using it for decades.

>>20634293
>>20634467
i understood what you meant and no it's not damaging that's bogus
>>20634492
took the words out of my mouth
in the long run all the "wrong" information will be corrected as you take in more of the language
the only way to play yourself is by stopping to do so in which case yeah you might end up crippled good riddance

>>20634566
>in the long run all the "wrong" information will be corrected as you take in more of the language
lmao no. why do u think butt latin trash like hobbitus ille happens. ur the same kind of retard ruining latin.

>foreign politicians speaking english with weird grammar despite using it for decades.
how much serious reading of native english texts do you think these people have done in their lives?
talking among other esls isn't going to produce native-like grammar skills who would have guessed

>>20634604
Yikes. It's giving linguistic imperialism for me.

>>20634604
This reminds me of how many ESL's there are who completely disregard English literature, calling it trash. How many of them could even understand it if they read it?

the only way to truly master latin is to study it so much your native language decays as a result.

theres no documented proof any multilingual has been ever truly fluent in at least 2 languages.

focus on 1 results in decay of the other. when you go on youtube even celebrated multilinguals and polyglots will show their weaknesses in their best non main language(s) when their speech goes into advanced and technical discussion.

thats why bad habits are inescapable in language, which is a grueling learning process.

>>20635076
holy fuck. when did this thread get filled with people this based?

>>20635076
>theres no documented proof any multilingual has been ever truly fluent in at least 2 languages
I have long suspected this. When people supposedly fluent in two languages are put on the spot they become suspiciously reserved

which is why the faggot saying bad habits in latin arent a real problem is simply wrong.

>non sequitor

>>20635135
then prove me wrong you faggoty nigger.

if even erasmus couldnt help but slip up on some grammatical aspects, why should we expect a bunch of nobodies on a filipino knitting forum, clinging to textbook knowledge, to master the language

>>20635182
who in the world do you think you're replying to, and why are you so angry?

>>20626756
>Also has anyone read the Gnostic texts in original Coptic?
Working on it. I've been practicing with the random bullshit on here so I can actually appreciate the Nag Hammadi texts and Manichaean fragments that I want to read:
http://data.copticscriptorium.org/index/corpus/
Be warned that this site, while its interlinears are very helpful, contains errors (as a random example of what I mean, John 1:24 uses the verb ⲧⲛⲛⲉⲩ - 'send' and it misparses it as ⲧⲛ+ⲛⲉⲩ which produces nonsense)

>Does knowing Greek help with Coptic?
It definitely helps, about 40% of the recorded Coptic lexicon consists of Greek loanwords, and this extends even to basic function words. That said, it's sort of like Greek and Latin loans in English where the native Coptic words are much more common

>>20635182
Aren't Erasmus' shortcomings an example of why textbook study IS important compared to trying to just 'figure everything out' from reading alone?
I agree with your overall point though that developing bad habits from non-fluent writing is a serious issue

>>20635697
im not sure what your criticism is specifically but i consider that bilingual textbooks, readings, and latin language textbooks are all necessary for a clearer picture

Mere textual reading and overconfidence in language abilities is autism. Most of the Latin in these threads is pretty error prone in style and grammar. He's right, it's the kind of bad habit forming that harms Latin.

>>20635965
okay now write your post in latin

>>20635207
Did you learn any Afro-Asiatic languages prior, or just Greek?

>>20635076
american cope

>>20635076
Nabokov wrote 9 novels in Russian before writing Lolita in English, which he then proceeded to translate into Russian himself. There you go, all the "documented proof" you could want. I guess if you wanted to go check for yourself you'd have to learn a little Rus- oh wait. You're disabled.

>>20636667
you see, he switched from being a fluent Russian speaker to a fluent English speaker, then back to Russian again.

bump

I'm too lazy to study

Valete amici! Sexto anno sine linguam Latinam studendo, estne bona idea Cesaris de bello Gallico commentarium legere experiri? Grammaticae fundationes memini, fortasse melius est prius grammaticae librum legere, deinde Cesaris? Veniam peto si Latina compositio mea bona non est.

What the FUCK is all this??

>>20638490
Definitions and precise examples taken from classical literature. If your dictionary doesn't look like this then it is no good.
Great app by the way, free and handy to have on the go.

What app is it?

>>20638581
Lewis and Short A new Latin Dictionary. Just the first two names will get you there. Great resource, not the absolute best but near the top and free.

bought this
fuck daily catullus guy

>>20638555
Okay but what does
1. In gen.: auferere, non abibis, si ego fustem

sumpsero, Plaut. Am. 1, 1, 202: *laciniam, id. Merc. 1, 2, 16

And

Bacch, 4, 4, 24

"si mutuas non potero, certum'st sumam foenore,"

id. As. 1, 3, 95

"postremo a me argentum quanti est sumito," Ter.

Ad. 5, 9, 20

"locum ( = capere)," Plaut. Aul. 4, 6, 9 "legem in manus," Cic. Agr. 2, 6, 15

"unum quodque vas in manus," Cic. Verr. 2, 4, 27, §

63

Mean?

>>20638698
In general, as in general usage
Right after the head word they list alternate spellings, conjugations and declensions Following that examples of that word being used in classical works.
For example, Plaut. is Plautus, the various abbreviations after are the titles of individual works by Plautus. The numbers are the exact location of that particular example. Am is Amphitruo, Act 1, Scene 1, line 202.
> auferere, non abibis, si ego fustem sumpsero
is found in that line.
id. means idem, that is the same author, so also Plautus. Next example is from Plautus' Mercator, Act 1, Scene 2, line 16
For Cicero the numbers mean 2nd Oration, Chapter 6, Section 15. Each authors' works are divided differently but you should get the general idea.
They are giving precise locations of words so you can see examples in real Latin and get a better understanding of how words were used.
Below is a list of abbreviations in L&S. First authors, then grammatical terms.
https://latinlexicon.org/LNS_abbreviations.php

>>20615830
Can I as a black man learn Latin and partake in this general?

>>20639083
niger homo

>>20639083
ye

Bros, I've become obsessed with Aeschylean choruses.
These lines in particular are stuck in my mind:

αἴλινον αἴλινον εἰπέ, τὸ δ᾽ εὖ νικάτω.
Ζεύς, ὅστις ποτ᾽ ἐστίν, εἰ τόδ᾽ αὐ-
τῷ φίλον κεκλημένῳ,
τοῦτό νιν προσεννέπω.
οὐκ ἔχω προσεικάσαι
πάντ᾽ ἐπισταθμώμενος
πλὴν Διός, εἰ τὸ μάταν ἀπὸ φροντίδος ἄχθος
χρὴ βαλεῖν ἐτητύμως.

οὐδ᾽ ὅστις πάροιθεν ἦν μέγας,
παμμάχῳ θράσει βρύων,
οὐδὲ λέξεται πρὶν ὤν:
ὃς δ᾽ ἔπειτ᾽ ἔφυ, τρια-
κτῆρος οἴχεται τυχών.
Ζῆνα δέ τις προφρόνως ἐπινίκια κλάζων
τεύξεται φρενῶν τὸ πᾶν:
τὸν φρονεῖν βροτοὺς ὁδώ-
σαντα, τὸν πάθει μάθος
θέντα κυρίως ἔχειν.
στάζει δ᾽ ἔν θ᾽ ὕπνῳ πρὸ καρδίας
μνησιπήμων πόνος: καὶ παρ᾽ ἄ-
κοντας ἦλθε σωφρονεῖν.
δαιμόνων δέ που χάρις βίαιος
σέλμα σεμνὸν ἡμένων.

It's so profound, feels like a true sacred text. I see why Wagner and Goethe called it "the best thing ever".
Anyone here share my passion?

>>20638832
Thank

>>20639294
φεῦ, καὶ εἰ δύναμαι σὺν λεξικῷ καὶ ὑπομνήματι ἱκανῶς μανθάνειν αὐτόν, οὐχ οἷός τ' εἰμί μιν τιμᾶν(οὔπω, παιδευθήσομαι)

>>20639083
Nigri toti sumus

>>20627308
I've encountered the same problem in learning living languages too. Regardless of whether it's Latin or Japanese, I've noticed I'll forget the meaning of words and how to "interpret" sentences if I stay too long without practicing reading in that language. I don't live in countries where languages I've learned are spoken, however, so maybe my experience is not the same as the one an immigrant living in the country that they are learning or learned the language from could get.
I hate reviewing flashcards on Anki but I guess it might be necessary to remember all these declensions, conjugations, and words with at least 7 different meanings.

>>20639294
No, I've never felt that way about anything.

>>20627893
That's absolute bullshit. Even after you reach the 10k hours of input that le based black language learning blog man wrote about, you can still read old books full of obscure vocabulary and extremely complex sentences spanning an entire paragraph unto themselves that will be hard to understand, and, even if a word is unique and hard to mistake for anything else, you might forget them if you never see them again.
>inb4 but I can just make a flashcard for it
Then it wouldn't be remembered exclusively by the means of natural exposure in context, would it?

>>20639756
you didn't understand the point at all sure you may forgot the odd uncommon word here and there but you will not lose your general ability to understand latin once you're past that point it's the same as with your native language

>>20639807
>Don't worry about the details bro komakai koto kinisunna as Nips say. Just rely on the feel even if it means you'll have to look up fuckloads of obscure words and be perplexed at the meaning of many sentences if you read ancient poetry and pre-modern scientific writings. Trust me, the lowercaseposting tranny who has never shown any evidence of knowing any Latin at all.

>>20639829
keep shouting at windmills bro

So Esperantotranny, have you ever read any Buddhist sutras in Chinese?

monoglots are pathetic lmao

>>20616550
>make money worthless
It's a "I'm from /pol/ and don't understand monetary economics" post, again, for the 80 trillionth fucking time, and it will always be fucking wrong.

>>20639999
the digits have spoken
monoglots on suicide watch

>>20618266
This post is not exhaustive but perhaps it may help. My only claim of authority, is that I have seen and known some shiiiit when it comes to the history and modernity of Semites and thier adjacents.

If you take the semitic claim of "Hebrew is the language of Creation" at face value, that tells you what you should start with:
Classical, non-vowel Hebrew, as well as modern stuff
Yiddish, as the Israeli common tongue and a degeneration of the same.
Add to this the historic Bible and Bible adjacent languages which are not already covered elsewhere: Aramaic, Coptic, Egyptian both hieroglyph and modern. Whatever is available on "Enochian", although it borders on occultism, should be included here.

One thing that I saw recently that came to mind seeing this thread: Cepher Publishing Group has come out with some guide to heiroglyphics that walks it through Welsh iirc of all things. And it just werks. See if you can add that, or its source material, to the pile.

>>20636426
Just Greek. I was putting off Afro-Asiatic languages for years because of the dread of their consonant root system and abjad writing, but it turns out the root system (at least as it exists in Coptic) isn't bad at all and Coptic mercifully uses a full alphabet (though you would think otherwise when you see words like ⲙⲙⲛⲧⲕⲣⲙⲣⲙ)
I want to go on to Hebrew and Syriac in the future

>>20639083
we don't care as long as you aren't an angl0

>>20640130
What do you mean by 'both hieroglyph and modern'? Middle Egyptian and Demotic, or written in hieroglyphics vs other scripts or what?

>>20639999
>learn more languages and spend 10 bajillion hours getting input in each one bro. That way, we'll all be able to get theology PhDs by writing theses on the works of obscure mystics that have never gotten translated so we'll all get ordained as Roman Catholic priests and be appointed as parish priests in churches at stops on the supersonic railway to Mars as soon as Elon Musk announces it. All of us will have 72 altar boys each. Just trust the plan and donate to the RNC. Also, take HRT for at least 300 months and learn how to program in Haskell because...just do it. It's all gonna work according to keikaku.
TL note: keikaku means plan.

>inb4 that's not an LLPSI, Wheelock, Athenaze, or Reading Greek post so reported
Do it.

>>20640221
rope

>>20638018
incipe legere caesar, et si nimis difficile sit, lege aliud facilius
novum testamentum satis facile est

>>20640363
>caesar
caesarem

>>20640185
Yeah, that is sort of what I mean. For languages that have a very long recorded history, the study of that history and its changes is worthwhile in itself, even just as an academic exercise. I dont know enough about Egyptian in particular to indicate anything exact. Historically hieroglyphics were a problem with multiple proposed solutions, some modern takes have identified the forms consistently, like the Welsh take I mentioned. If the goal is to assemble a "resource pack," then it would be good to include everything under the umbrella. A potential student might not know or care about the details of classification or linguistics enough to know where to look, you just have to put things in the most obvious place. If I wanted to download resources for "the Egyptian language," that better include anything i need to parse through ancient tombstones as well as yesterdays newpapers. If its considered a dead language then that narrows the scope just a bit. I warned you my own authority and knowledge was limited, but I wanted to contribute anyway and offer you support and encouragement.

>>20640221
I unironically have an MTS and am about to start a PhD on Manichaeism and I could barely read a sentence in any classical language, though I've rectified it now in preparation for the PhD

/clg/ Questions

- What are some classical translations for Aesop's Fables and Tao Te Ching?
- How many books are required to master Latin style?
- What are some important untranslated Classical Chinese texts?
- What are some important untranslated Esperanto texts?

Idk why they're so open about calling each other's noses ugly
Bit mean of Iulia

>>20641570
Sed verum est.

>>20639294
>Anyone here share my passion?
Absolutely.

>>20631938
What you found is correct-public works like the Pantheon were regarded as personal undertakings and achievements of the funder. You will see FĒCIT on most inscriptions after the person's name and their titles or ancestors. RESTITVIT (restored) also appears in a few inscriptions. I haven't found any uses of the passive voice like you used in your example, and I find it unlikely that the Romans would use it.

>>20617965
>Esperanto
GB2R

>>20623607
Islam is a joke and biblical Arabic is even more pointless than biblical Hebrew. (Aramaic has actually ground, however.)

>>20623607
Islam is a joke and biblical Arabic is even more pointless than biblical Hebrew. (Aramaic has actual ground, however.)

>>20626203
>Doesn't desire to relearn your native language since you technically didn't learn it.

>>20627350
Why haven't you guys come up with "writing a journal in your target language" and shilling that endlessly yet? Literally just do that.

>>20640130
I am not compromising an Ancient Near Eastern Mega with a bunch of Enochian shit. Kelley was a charlatan, and Enochian isn't ANE. If you want to gather a bunch of books on Enochian in a Mega, that's your business. I'm not saying your a moron for being interested in Enochian or that it shouldn't be investigated; I just don't think it has any place in an ANE Mega.
t. Ethiopianon

>>20640854
Cool. I know the leading expert on Coptic Manichean manuscripts. I did hear that he is taking a new student who might study Coptic with him this year, but since that probably isn't you, I bet you study Syriac. That's a language I have been trying to find time to teach myself. It seems mighty interesting. Good luck with PhD. I hope to hear more from you in these threads.

>>20640854
Any plans of learning Coptic? If so, we might get to know each other personally in the near future.

>>20641771
> (Aramaic has actual ground, however.)
Please elaborate. What is there to read except for endless elaborations on Biblical texts?

>>20641570
I got a bit sad when Syrus looked in the mirror and closed her eyes

>>20641823
>we might get to know each other personally in the near future.

>>20641907
>Aramaic
>What is there to read except for endless elaborations on Biblical texts?
It was the lingua franca of
>The Assyrian Empire
>The Neo-Babylonian Empire
>The Achaemenid Empire
>Seleucid Empire
>Parthian Empire
>The entire Levant under Imperial Rome

>>20642044
I know, but that's not what I asked.
Classical Quechua was also the language of a great empire, but what use is that without literature?

>>20642157
The Incans didn't have a writing system. Dogshit analogy.

>>20641394
>- How many books are required to master Latin style?
bout tree fiddy
>- What are some important untranslated Esperanto texts?
kek

>>20642168
What difference does the reason for the dearth of literature make? The only thing that counts is the fact that there's nothing to read.

> It was the lingua franca of whatever
Show, don't tell.
There's the Story of Ahiqar, but even mudhut Britain has Beowulf. Anything else?

>>20642253
Most Aramaic is from inscriptions not papyrus books of adventure stories. But you are only asking because you think Aramaic is useless, not because you are genuinely curious, so what's the point of this conversation anyways? I love how you pretend like 17% of the Dead Sea Scrolls aren't written in Aramaic or like Syriac and Mandaic aren't dialects of Aramaic.

>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Ezra
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Daniel
>>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Book_of_Giants
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Jerusalem_Dead_Sea_Scroll
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4Q246
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genesis_Apocryphon
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cairo_Geniza
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testaments_of_the_Twelve_Patriarchs#Levi
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Story_of_Ahikar
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalili_Collection_of_Aramaic_Documents
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talmud
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syriac_language
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandaic_language

If you don't give a fuck about Canaanite religion, then don't whine about a language having nothing to read when most of it's texts are about Canaanite religion.

>>20642253
>Britain has Beowulf
England

>>20642362
> But you are only asking because you think Aramaic is useless, not because you are genuinely curious, so what's the point of this conversation anyways?
Wrong. I'm planning on learning some Aramaic once I'm proficient enough in Hebrew.
What I'm taking issue with is >>20641771
where Classical Arabic and Hebrew were described as useless in comparison with Aramaic, of all things, which is absolute madness. I don't care about Islam either, but there's a huge amount of writings in Classical Arabic that have fuck all to do with religion, in stark contrast with the situation in Aramaic.

> I love how you pretend like 17% of the Dead Sea Scrolls aren't written in Aramaic or like Syriac and Mandaic aren't dialects of Aramaic.
I clearly stated
> except for endless elaborations on Biblical texts
and your response is to post two dialects with... nearly nothing written in except for Biblical elaborations (in the case of Mandaic, it's their own spin on the religion, but still). And also the Talmud and various Apocrypha. You know, you could just have said from the beginning
> If you don't give a fuck about Canaanite religion, then don't whine about a language having nothing to read when most of it's texts are about Canaanite religion.
instead of pulling the WE WUZ shit of the all these empires, that have almost nothing to do with the actual Jewish/Christian/Mandaic texts that came down to us.

>>20642449
>Wrong. I'm planning on learning some Aramaic once I'm proficient enough in Hebrew.
You have a funny way of disparaging a language that you supposedly want to learn.
>Classical Arabic and Hebrew were described as useless in comparison with Aramaic, of all things, which is absolute madness.
Idk what he was getting at there, but that's not me.

>instead of pulling the WE WUZ shit of the all these empires, that have almost nothing to do with the actual Jewish/Christian/Mandaic texts that came down to us.
Most Aramaic that isn't Biblical is Babylonian and Persian inscriptions as I stated earlier. How the fuck is that "we wuz"?

You sound like one of these people who wants to watch a show, but before you do so, you go around the workplace or online in a forum asking people with a condescending tone "is that show even worth watching". It's a creepy need for validation from others when you could just do the thing you want to do and not scrape around for justification from others. You should more like a needy utilitarian than a curious reader of ancient literature.

>>20642468
> Most Aramaic that isn't Biblical is Babylonian and Persian inscriptions as I stated earlier. How the fuck is that "we wuz"?
My question was about literature; random-ass inscriptions don't belong to that category (unless there exists something like the Res gestae), and posting a list of fallen empires won't change that. The real surviving literature only has strenuous links to those states.

>>Classical Arabic and Hebrew were described as useless in comparison with Aramaic, of all things, which is absolute madness.
>Idk what he was getting at there, but that's not me.
Okay, but then don't say
> you go around the workplace or online in a forum asking people with a condescending tone "is that show even worth watching"
To use your analogy: someone claimed that the reboot was much better than the pointless original show, and I asked him to elaborate on this, because I can't imagine someone enjoying the reboot without appreciating the original. You latched onto this question, misconstruing my position as hating the reboot.

What I'm saying: if you care about Canaanite religion, both Hebrew and Aramaic make sense. If you don't, then Aramaic isn't worth the effort. Can we agree on that?

>Can we agree on that?
Not really since you sound like an annoying teenager accusing me of "we wuzing" because I had the audacity to mention inscriptions. We have Akkadian, Hittite, Ugaritic, & Sumerian literature. Do you think those are on papyrus? They are from cunieform inscriptions you fucking monkey. Do you even know anything about classical languages. Not all inscriptions are epitaphs and tax codes you moron.

>adhuc nemo mittit merdaenuntios
Iam lipsi librum consumandum erat
etiam, estne satis legere ut discam recte scribere? num sunt libri proprie ad hunc finem? suntne utiles an melius simpliciter legere est?

>>20642701
The answer is already in this thread, you just didn't like it.
>read more Latin
>read books on Latin composition
>stop using English word order
>get some style
A good book for particulars of composition is A New Latin Syntax by Woodcock. It is in the Mega.

>>20642700
> We have Akkadian, Hittite, Ugaritic, & Sumerian literature. Do you think those are on papyrus? They are from cunieform inscriptions you fucking monkey. Do you even know anything about classical languages. Not all inscriptions are epitaphs and tax codes you moron.
That's why I qualified them with "random-ass" and mentioned the Res gestae as a counterexample in Latin. This would have been your cue to name the Gilgamesh of Aramaic literature, if such a thing exists, in which case I would have conceded that there is worthwhile non-Biblical literature.
Instead you conveniently ignored selected words in my post and proceeded to get incredibly mad about something I never said. For the second time in this thread.

>>20641907
>Bardaisan: Book of Laws

>Syriac Sentences of Menander

>Aprahats Demonstrations (Some of these are writings about historical events)

>Euphemia and the Goth

>Julian romance

>The Life of Rabbula

>Isaac of Antioch: Memra against the Jews

>Joshua the Stylite: Anonymous Chronicle (Historical events)

>Sergius of Reishana: 2 introductions to Aristotle’s Logic

>Chronicle of Edessa

>Ahudemmeh: Philosophical Texts

>Barhadbeshabba of Halwan: Cause of the Foundation of Schools

>Anonymous Literature: Syriac Verse on Alexander the Great

>Severus Sebokht: Treatise on Syllogisms

>Severus Sebokht: Treatise on the Astrolabe and Constellations

>Chronicle of Khuzestan

>Life of Rabban Hormizd

>Bar Hebraeus: The Laughable Stories

>Qarabashi: Shed Blood

>Syriac Book of Medicine

Here is a very very short list I made of Non-Biblical Syriac literature. You might find traces or mentions of Christianity in the literature/documents, but this is because Christianity was basically ingrained into Syriac literature and culture. This (very) short list of literature and documents is specifically non biblical.

I’ll post more if you want. But I wanted to post this fast in case the thread got archived

>>20642865
Great post, thanks! I knew about Bar Habraeus, but that's it.
Also Kelileh va demneh, which isn't in your list, but you probably know about already.

I haven't mentioned it before, but I'm also not too interested in things that have been translated into Aramaic and survive in the original language. But your list seems to be original works.

>>20642787
you just repeated what I said without answering anything plus
>stop using English word order
doesn't even apply because I'm an ESL

>>20642932
Ingrate

New Thread: >>20643001
New Thread: >>20643001
New Thread: >>20643001

>>20642989
what should I be grateful for? You didn't provide any answer
at least answer in latin so I can get some inpoot about mundane stuff not commonly discussed in literary works

>>20643021
>A good book for particulars of composition is A New Latin Syntax by Woodcock

>>20643031
did it work for you?

>>20643042
No, it is a terrible book, that is why I recommended it. Good luck with your 'merdaenuntios' you retarded ape.
Protip: that word is wrong and so is the line immediately following it, 'Iam lipsi librum consumandum erat'. No more replies from me, try to figure it out on your own coon babbler.

>>20643068
Not that anon but why don't you make a post in Latin to show that it actually worked for you instead of seething like mad

>>20643068
then why don't correct them in the first place? what kind of autism affects you?

>>20643079
he probably didn't even read it

>>20643068
I'm trans btw

>>20642903
replied to you on the new thread
>>20643001

>>20642026
I will be taking a class with a prominent Manichaean specialist. I'd prefer not to say which one because that could lead to me being doxxed. He's taking a new student, and if Manichaeanon is just starting his PhD with a focus of Manichaeism, it's possible that he is the new student I've heard about.