/lit/ - Literature

>>20389051
>A link to the ultimate colossal science fiction and fantasy collection torrent
is there a list or smth to that?
I don't want to download 20 gazillion gbs of books just to read what I want.
Also I don't have the diskspace
>t. orc

>feMC has a sex life/romance
Gaaaaaay

>>20389074
You can select which files to download after adding a torrent. (Might have to check settings to not auto download)

>>20388981
I remembered another one you might like, Monroe. It has as much if not more characters builds as azarinth, I dropped it because it eventually gets earth itself involved in the whole iskeai buisness which I find distatsteful and because MC's a loner, which doesn't appeal to me, but theoricrafting builds and not just for himself is a plot point in the novel, tho I do not know for how long it sticks around, so you might get a kick out of it.

GM from /tg/ here. I thought I'd ask you guys over /wg/ since you guys are actually discussing and not circlejerking. In short, one of my players suggested I serialize one of my long-running campaigns into some form of LitRPG. The only trouble is I don't quite grasp what's so special about that genre. Maybe it's because I already listen to folks theory craft. Inal addition, most of my TTRPG campaigns involve grandiose themes, such as the God Emperor coming back in 40k or a non-shit Dark Avatar showing up pre-Korra. Would that even work in LitRPG, where the "player" has godmode on?

>>20389124
Different guy here, I can understand the appeal of the theorycrafting stuff, but surely the point is eventually that ceases to be the driving factor because they DO lock themselves in. Unless it's some sort of "you can eventually learn everything" system.

>>20389083
If I would ever write a fantasy book about a feMC, I would make her a hard lesbian. And with hard lesbian I mean literally fully XX-chromosome pilled, where I would allow anyone with XY to even touch her. But also I would go insane coomer on every other woman the feMC would meet, where she pretty much always tries to have lesbian sex with them.

It's simply that you always have to decide who your targeted audience is. For example if you write for women, stuff like morning wood are nothing of interest for you. The same with period and men.
If you write a book for a man, you can easily just skip that a woman has a period and just pretend that women don't have periods.

Or even if you ignore the sex and just go for education. You simply can't sell a book to a scientist if the book has insanely large mistakes (for example explaining something completely wrong). While on the other hand someone without a high education has no interest if you start discussing the universe and rather prefers reading about alcohol or other very simple to understand topics.

>>20389128
With few exceptions litRPG is just pop fantasy with menus.

>>20385894
>Anons, give me recommendations for good books with Dragons
There's a series by E.E Knight called The Age of Fire. It follows multiple dragons from childhood, each with their own arc. It's pretty good.

>>20389128
I'm someone who didn't understand and even looked down on LitRPG genre in the past. Here's a post of my from previous thread >>20388835. To add to it and respond to your question the appeal is figuring out what to do alongside the characters and having a more clear understanding of what characters are capable of, similar to hard magic systems in some respects. Another angle is figuring WHY the system exists. Sylver Seeker is a novel that does that aspect well, tho it's not that appealing to me it might give you some insight in dealing with powerful MC and LitRPG elements compared to normal fiction - MC remembers world before the system and struggles to figure out how the fuck it happened.

As to epic aspect it's not that different from epic fantasy, be it plot armor or god mode it's authors job to make it work - just because something is a LitRPG doesn't mean that MC should be powerful or immortal, tho you might want to go with multiple perspective if you intend to actually threaten or kill off lead characters to reinforce that, should work decently well if translating TT campaign.

>>20389130
Just providing suggestions for what anon asked for. Azarinth has sort of class change every few levels that interacts with skills, previous choices and notable actions(achievments, basically), enabling for what's essentially new small, tho that depends, theorycrafting session every now and then. Monroe uses theory crafting to design templates for adventurers to use and abuse so it deals with more than one character. BotD is more akin to how someone who doesn't theorycraft place RPG offering skill/spell choices each level (including subclass levels) so it enables some decisions to be thought out and made aswell, tho on smaller scale. Scorched is a classless system, closest to you can learn anything as you put it, MC is in fact a spearman who crippled himself and became a mage, saying more would be spoilers, but it's progress is not level based but stat/skill based and it's relatively hard to progress, making it more about the interaction with the world to get your skills and stats where you want them to go and how it affects daily life not just of MC but of entire fictional universe.

>>20389137
So if I understand correctly, it's questing (/qst/, Akun, SV, SB, etc.) without any interaction from the readers. The author just predetermines everything and adds some nonsense about XP and spell slots.

>>20389168
> The author just predetermines everything
...That's what writing a book is, yes.

>>20389182
Thanks Captain Obvious. Whenever you're done trying to be promoted to Admiral Apparent you'll realize I was completing the questing metaphor.

>>20389168
It's closer to fantasy books than quests, quests have frequent branching points due to the way they work. LitRPG is usually just a standard fantasy railroad but with status screens.

>>20389130
>they DO lock themselves in
That's never supposed to happen. In a good RPG you don't get your "build" by level 10 and spend the next 90 levels just incrementing stats, you're supposed to keep evolving the playstyle all the way to the end of the game. This is also why MMO gear treadmills are garbage as a progress mechanic.

Who else is reading xianxia chinkshit, martial arts chinese wizards. Why do these does reverend insanity have such good world building.

>>20389280
This is an example of how to address build stagnation: just do a straight up build replacement every major arc.

Main Character Hides His Strength also addresses it: Have your STR capped unga megawarrior learn magic because enemies are cheesing him with ethereal forms.

>>20389288
True but still for the most part apart from killer moves that the author thought up a bit late the systems in the novel are clever. You gain power from gu that can die when you upgrade them or don't feed them or they just get damaged in combat.

The parables or stories about Ren Zu to flesh out the history of the world is *chef kisses* tier.

>>20389312
Gu are interesting because they're both very detailed and very temporary. As long as you rank up it doesn't matter very much what you used in the previous rank, and you're probably not going to keep using what you used in the previous rank; builds obsolete rapidly. This is very different from most xianxia where most protagonists get gifted some bullshit mary sue true sun yang cultivation art that defines what they're going to do for the entire 5000 chapter story.

Is anyone here familiar with pic related? How is it?

>>20389131
I don't know if this is pozzed or non-pozzed, but I like it.

>>20389332
So as I'm understanding this, RI basically runs on a gem slotting system, but they're... Bugs/snakes? That's what "gu" are, to my knowledge.

>>20389358
it's based, because it's effectively just writing a male protagonist in a female body, which is the only way to write a based feMC

>>20389371
>>20389288
Gu are an excellent system that all xiaxia should copy.
They're logical, intuitive, evocative, diverse, and functional both thematically and structurally.
The most important parts of the system are
>they can be found, exchanged, bought, and sold
>they require constant resources to use and maintain
>these resources are incredibly rare, valuable, and come from specific locations controlled by various factions
>in order to make more gu or upgrade one, you require large numbers of other related gu
>specific styles and types of gu are therefore monopolized by certain factions as it's ruinously expensive or difficult to acquire the necessary ingredients without being a member of the clan/sect
>which means every group is organized around a unique highly specific cultivation system, and all non-ffiliated cultivators have wild mishmashes of whatever they could get their hands on at the time and are constantly jumping around depending on what's "in season" so to speak
>cultivation level is almost WORTHLESS without matching Gu to go with it, a rank 4 gu master with rank 3 gu is on;y slightly more powerful than a rank 3 gu master, and will get his ass handed to him by other rank 4 gu masters with rank 4 gu
>lifespan is COMPLETELY UNTIED TO CULTIVATION and is a separate rare resource randomly found scattered throughout the world
This means all cultivators have an extreme need for resources at all times, there are wild swings in power depending on time, location, and political affiliation, and there's a hard time limit that makes even the most powerful cultivators ruin themselves or fight to the death competing for small chances at extending their lifespan.

No meditating in caves. No ultimate manual of the demon-god fist. No high rank magical treasures found at the start of the book.

>>20389410
It's also interesting to note that Ri is the only xiaxia I've ever heard of where cultivation actually does absolutely nothing aside from giving you more "magic fuel". No strength/durability/intelligence/lifespan, nothing.
All it lets you do is use more powerful Gu, and Gu are what give you all those kinds of abilities.

>>20389371
They're like organic materia, insect yes but their shape isn't really that important because they're usually just inside a creature/cultivator's body allowing them to cast magic. Instead of gear slots it's up to the abilities of the owner how many they can keep/maintain/combo together.

crime thriller books similar to the jigsaw movie series?

crime thriller books similar to the manhunt anthology series?

>>20389410
One contrivance that RI had was the whole self-detonation thing. Should've just said that gu are automatically killed by the shock of the cultivator dying unless very special methods are used, than the whole "everyone in the world is spite-kills their gu on reflex even if it's a perfect surprise death" thing. Would've served the exact same purpose while being more believable.

>>20389453
cover - 2

which stephen king (or other author) novels illustrates gruesome murder in vivid detail

who let the schizo out

>>20389454
It serves a purpose and can be overlooked. It's important to prevent, easy, stealing or you wind up with the loot treadmill snowball.

>>20389340
haven't read it but the review seems promising especially the part about manifest mistreatment of women

>>20389531
I agree, the whole cultivator loot pinata thing should be avoided, just that it seemed there were better ways to explain it. Maybe because Gu Zhen wanted to maintain the ability to self-detonate other stuff like the soul as well he just threw gu in along with it.

>>20389410
That's really cool, I used insects (parasites mostly) as a form of "false" cultivation used by desperate terrorists from the setting's not-china to try and match up to the extermination squad sent after them by the local city-state. They had a "locust queen" (think darkspawn queen from Dragon Age but insect, an extremely ambitious imperial and 100% willing) shitting out mindless drones as mooks and loads of different parasites to help bulk up the actual sentient mutant forces with shit like armor beetles and skolopendras that attached to their backs and turned into quill-shooting tails, shit like that.

I mostly run on a more esoteric system with some parts based on medieval european mysticism through "Gnosis", a deeper understanding of some aspect of reality, or nature spirits, or just consuming the cores of cultivator-beasts in various forms to gain some of their traits (both good and bad)
Cultivation in my setting is in a disinfo-induced dark ages caused by the self-proclaimed Divine Emperor, and I only tackled it from a pretty surface-level perspective in my first two books since my MC is a total outsider and working off of her own very strong instinct, creating a fucked up mishmash cultivation path that pulls from nearly half a dozen different specializations to create a kit that far surpasses the sum of its parts

I intended to have it evoke the idea of smaller parts coming together as a greater since the MC herself is a homunculus made out of samples from hundreds of different people, but I was too caught up in the greater overarching plot to properly develop that concept so I hope to lean more into it in my third book

Might read some of RI for inspiration

>>20389555
Also need to develop this bitch to make her a more worthy rival for the MC... On one hand it's nice that I'm absolutely not lacking for content, on the other and I'm paralyzed by choice.

>>20389555
The orthodox cultivation process is one of the least interesting things about xianxia, it's also kind of dumb how people manage to be productive and have high-level responsibilities when they spend hours a day fucking meditating. Alternate systems are always nice to read about.

>>20389570
I want to include stereotypical cultivation in my story, but like... As a joke encounter. The party comes across a taoist monk who has been in seclusion for centuries, and could conceivably completely fuck up the global balance of power, but said monk only cares about preparing for their next Tribulation so they just tell the party to fuck off and give them a high-grade elixir that turns out to be useless or useful in some way that is entirely irrelevant to the plot

>Scarlet Spires have just kidnappedAcha
Devilish - they truly are the puppet masters of this Holy War

>>20389083
>male MC has a sex life/romance
Into the trash it goes.

>>20389375
>based
>a male protagonist in a female body
isn't this troon pilled? part of me think its unbased

>>20389708
it's based because it's 100% fictional
it's simultaneously a 100% male (sane) mind in a 100% female body
a troomer could never hope to be either sane or female

>>20389718
>male mind in a female body
I don't know man, sounds troon pilled to me

Is this a horror thread too? Ok, I gave John Langan a shot, read Fisherman, some short stories, Wide, Carnivorous Sky etc and I don't get the praise he gets around here. Extremely poor, convoluted writer (even worse than King) with half-baked, uninspired ideas.

>>20389857
Kept reading praise for The Fisherman, checked it out and it was just Harry Potter wizard duels that come out of nowhere. Haven't read anything else by that author but after that I don't really want to. Half-baked is the perfect description

Is Neal Stephenson able to be understood by non-nerds?

>>20389974
mostly, yes
but it would be less appealing, too
its worth giving him a shot, imo

>>20389570
Like, fuck, look at Cradle, it has a far more 'standard'-style cultivation thing going on, but it goes into the intricacies of it and makes it more interesting, not to mention the Lord-tier stuff being very different than just 'get a bigger number'.

>>20389573
You can double-subvert it. Have him built up as this 'true' cultivator, and then everything he tries to teach the party is utterly useless, but then he flies on a beam of sunlight to poke a dragon to death and it's like "oh, okay".

>protagonist has friends

>>20389051
From the pic and the edition I thought this was from a book and was interested but turns out it's from a game. Please do not bait and switch me again.

>>20389051
>Reposting from /trash/ of all places where an Anon is blogging Wings of fire for the scalies.
Re-reposting it from last thread because it was posted at the end of the thread.
Obvious spoilers ahead, so people planning on reading it or whatever: Don't read this post. I have rather enjoyed it blind.

So, I've given it a listen as I go through my work, got a little over 3 hours in to the first book.
First off, I'll say, I'm not too much a fan of the voice over they gave this. Little too "disney" for my tastes, considering the rather grim aspect to a lot of this.
I am, either way, debating just reading physical copies whenever I've got the chance as a result. It's not terrible, but it's enough that I feel like I'm missing some of the emotional impact.
It's up in the air, but I might not update this much if I do.

Going in to it at the start, I was a bit shocked, to be sure. There's a little bit of cheesiness to it, in terms of villainous monologues, which I think might've got me into a different expectation when it came down to it.
Sure, I expected gore, but damn, starting out with infanticide? That's rare as fuck.
Here I was assuming the egg'd survive, be raised alone by some unsuspecting group, and we'd have the hero's tale.
Instead, we had the BBEG chuck an egg off a cliff, killing one of the star-destined protagonists right off the gate, to which our group of legend-makers say "Shit, let's go capture a different kid then", and make do with a sudden replacement from a completely different tribe than their prophecy dictated.

That last part brings me to another observation some;
Every single adult dragon we meet, at least so far a good third the way through, is an asshole.
Your factions are murderous queens, kidnapping baby torturers, and oddly seductive murderous queens.
Might be the voice actor, but Scarlet got a rather poignant portrayal.
Still a massive asshole, but I at least enjoyed her 'screentime' so to speak.

So far, my favourite character's been Tsunami.
Definitely has a nice style to her, and I appreciate her retention of more 'dragony' character.

1/2:

jolenta's booba glistening with spray from the river as the warm sun beams down

>>20390115
On the subject of 'dragony' character, I'm somewhat disappointed that the main cast seems largely, for lack of a better word, 'human'.
Most the adults seen thus far seem to have a fair retention of that 'dragonish' vibe, albeit at a rather cranked up cruelty level, but the main lot is a little too soft by large.
Suspect that's just the nature of this kind of novel.

I will give massive props to describing draconic beauty and features in a way which impresses even my discerning taste for such features. No emphasis on perhaps the curves, though those are briefly mentioned.

Story so far's been dull. But that's to be expected, I think. It also doesn't help that Clay's boring as all fuck, for a PoV character. Still, not a ton you can do trapped in a cave for most the stretch.
I'm hopeful the next stretch'll be more engaging. Just going by what's been said so far, it sounds like an interesting matter.

Lore seems interesting enough. I can't really comment too much because what's been explored is fairly surface level. Though I will say, even touching the wiki for this thing's a pain. Spoilers galore, right off the bat.
Knowing a bit of the human aspect from here has a little bit messed with my tastes on it, honestly, but I'm a bit soft on it. Definitely would've preferred no humans.

All in all, if I had to give it a ranking so far, it's unfortunately going to be a low 6, maybe 5 out of 10.
Not bad per say. Just not very good so far. Very, very dull MC, basic-feeling secondary cast, and an extremely dull initial setting.
Still, I'm hopeful. And despite that somewhat sloggish nature, it was actually perfect for driving as a result.
Scarlet both terrifies and arouses me. I'd say I want to be in her dungeon, but I think that'd mainly mean torture and fight pits.
2/2:

Will post more updates if the guy doing it in /trash/ posts more.

>>20389447
The Cat Who...

>>20390105
>female character falls in love with the protagonist

Hey self pub autist, thoughts on mage errant?

1. Is there still a market for a high medieval fantasy inspired by 15th century England and France? Aka "the ASOIAF derivative" it will always be named.
2. Personally, I love Martin's books. He inspired me to learn about history. However, the real history of Wars of the Rose's is a far more compelling and interesting story and I think it can be done better. If you were to see a new series with similar inspiration, what would you like to see differently or improved from what Martin did with historical inspiration?

>>20389453
>protagonist kills several people hunting him to clear a path towards FREEDOM
>setting: america

books like this?

>>20390228
Mage Errant's weird. I like it well enough, the main cast is charming, and some interactions are great. The plot feels like it could be interesting but it sort of darts all over the place because the author wants to show off the world and doesn't really organically meld that into the narrative. Also it feels like a mistake to go multiversal like it has been.

>>20390253
>Is there still a market for a high medieval fantasy inspired by 15th century England and France? Aka "the ASOIAF derivative" it will always be named.
The accused kings was one of the biggest historical fiction hits ever so yeah

>>20390275
Would ASOIAF even be published today though if it was sent to an agent though? The only thing it has going for it in today's market is the fact that half the character POVs are women. Do you think the medieval era of having white european culture ever be allowed to be published again?

>>20390295
Stop taking shit

Someone recommended Heaven's Law prodigies a couple threads ago and it sounded interesting enough to give it a go. Just finished it and I'd say it's pretty decent within it's genre, it fumbles a few things, namely suspense, combat and some plot points by not being emotionally evocative or interesting enough. Sadly one of those plot points is practically central to the entire plot as it changes the nature of the story half way through, but at least everything around it is handled well enough, it's just the event itself is a bit abrupt and feels like everyone taking leave of their sense, tho it at least makes sense in character due to personalities and information asymmetry of people involved, just could have been set up better with more suspense, pressure and foreshadowing, tho it's not like there wasn't any, just not enough for such a central event. Still given event's nature and how rarely writers are willing to tackle it I think it was well done for what it is, assuming one doesn't regard including it to be retarded in the first place. Combat-wise it's well written enough but because most fights have no emotional weight my eyes just glaze over reading them, those that do work well enough however, assuming you don't hate Xuanhuan. Cultivation is largely treated like magic with levels and aptitudes rather than anything to do with Dao, but unlike combat it's actually quite well connected emotionally to the characters involved so it's very well done for the genre, it also has pretty solid ruleset, tho the whole inner world goes a bit overboard for my taste it's more a genre problem. The work has a bit of an obsession with monogamy, for better or worse, tho it is minor at least it makes of it for story. It also seems influenced a bit by some (probably christian) religious thought, but it's minor. It is worth noting that for a cultivation novel, outside of that one singular event, it has a good, reasonable portrayal of cultivators who are not directly aligned with MC, being more reasonable than most, and even that event is something that's not entirely irrational either just could use more set up and better execution, tho consequence are very well done. Another point is that novel focuses a lot on relationship between our two MCs, leaving a lot of what you expect from cultivation novel less time, resulting in final confrontation, common in cultivation novels, to be setup behind the scenes without much participation or build up on the MCs side, tho they are the cause for it and they are involved in resolving it.


Caveats: Rape, NTR (single instance)

Would recommenced it and read more of it, if anyone has anything similar that actually deals with human connections rather than turning the genre into grind fest. Is cradle actually any good? First book synopsis seems rather nebulous and generic but I've heard good things about it in the general.

>>20390365
I should also mention that the book got YA vibes, which makes sense given it's primarily about two YA, but it's not teenager angst, just something that might not be to everyone's liking.

>>20390327
Well is there any fantasy being published these days with medieval western European settings? Sandershit soilight archives characters are non white and inspired by Asia. I don't pay attention to much modern fantasy... can someone even depict a historically accurate western European culture and demographic anymore? Just curious.

>>20389371
that and you basically have a farm inside your soul where you can grow things. But your own knowledge, and ability to grow shit, typical of cultivation and tribulation affect what and how you can grow things. Usually, a normal person grows shit that either makes money or can feed his own gu.

>>20389555
RI also has some great world-building, there is a lot that novel gets right. Be warned though it was so good the ccp banned the author from finishing it.

>>20390365
Glad you liked it. I did enjoy how it did things other traditional xianxia doesn't do like no arbitrary opening schedules or length of time duration for the special training area, and MCs dad being strong and actually training him, among other things. Were you referring to the ruthlessness subplot?

>>20390767
>Were you referring to the ruthlessness subplot?
Yes, basically to the even that sets up it's resolution, the resolution itself is fine, but the lack of set up for the event that triggers it lessens it's emotional impact. Against the gods for example for all it's cheap plots, (ab)use of prophesies and other problems had great ability to play with readers emotions, large part of which was building up suspense and expectation before traumatic/dangerous event, prodigies fails at this somewhat, as well as makes me question decision making of everyone involved on both sides, especially it, and the event later on near finale, makes one think that Ice Phoenix Sect master is far too naive/trusting, which doesn't really match her role at all and I doubt that characterisation is deliberate, rather I believe it's a consequence of author being careless with it. All the other characters, especially the ones responsible for it are not characterised well enough before hand either to make one expect something so radical to happen, in terms of cultivation novels it feels like going from alliance to completely tearing face in one step with full knowledge how dangerous it would be if it backfires, which just paints everyone involved as stupid to the point of retardation. But as I said before it makes some sense in context of their personalities, but that's almost exclusively in retrospect, and complete underestimation of forces opposed to them. But even with that it just doesn't make sense to me that they'd be willing to essentially cripple Ice Phoenix prodigy given that Divine ice phoenix sect is likely to be watching it in some way shape or form, and probably will not take it lightly. Story tries to justify it by saying that victim wasn't scouted, but that's paper thin justification to me, and it's full of holes that would need filling if it is to make sense.

But I understand what author was trying to do, even if he didn't do a terribly good job of it, it could have been much better with some tweaking but the story as a whole works well enough despite this issue.

Curious if you can recommend anything else like it, as it left me wanting for more, i.e. cultivation or even just relevant self published/less known books with focus on personal relations. I find sorting through self published stuff prohibitively difficult so it was a pleasant surprise when I followed your recommendation and enjoyed it. Meantime I picked up Ze Tian Jie because someone on reddit, yeah I know, mentioned it in relation, even tho I was hesitant to touch it before. It's a bit wooden but got a decent enough start to it.

I shall seal the heavens book 6 just too good bros i just wish the MF author would reunite the family faster im too curious about that

Alright bros post your favorite

1. Comfy story
2. Strings you along, page turner
3. Boring just people standing and talking
4. In the heat of the battle pov
5. Series you have grown to hate but keep reading

For me it's
1. Fellowship of the ring
2. A game of thrones
3. God emperor of dune
4. The heros (J.A.)
5. Stormlight archives

Soulship would be the other one off the top of my head. Involves MC protecting a living ship that has various avatars across the galaxy but we are 4 books in and MC has not received even a kiss yet although the feelings are acknowledged. The cultivation system is a bit wonky and books 3 and 4 are basically one book.

>>20390911
Thanks, I'll check it out.

>>20390916
Sorry, I am on my phone. I will look through my previous books and try to find some more relevant stuff for you tonight.

>>20390919
Np at all at first glance and given the spoiler soul ship is probably not something I'm gonna pick up but you don't have any reason to apologise, I'm grateful for your recommendation as it is - probably wouldn't have ever stumbled upon prodigies otherwise and I am looking forward to see how that series continues.

>>20390932
It is the only cultivation I know of with temp advancement which is one reason I like it. The reason for the spoiler is mostly practicality as shipgirl is still weakened and they don't have time for anything like that.

Stannis just wants to drain the swamp.
>Just two more books.

>girlfriend drama in DotF
Fuck this shit I'm out. The setting is cool and all but this is getting so fucking stupid. What a shame.

>>20390982
He already started with the karstarks

>>20390984
>Fuck this shit I'm out. The setting is cool and all but this is getting so fucking stupid. What a shame.
IIRC the girlfriends drama gets over pretty fast, and the author said outright that Zac's only love his axe. No relationship bullshit, and I am caught up. Actually, that drama kickstarts and important developement that gives Zac a second class, which breaths a new life into the story. I recommend to continue reading, don't let one low point take you out of the story. IIRC that was before the glorious Treasure Hunting arc, that was cool as fuck. Seriously, it's worth it.

>>20390984
>Girlfriend drama
Doesn't that only last all of like two chapters?

>>20391010
DotF is such a mixed bag for me, on the one hand it's got neat world-building and the Dao shit is cool, on the other hand there's barely any semblance of plot beyond just surviving and Zac is a complete nothing protagonist. I can't say a single character trait he has.

>>20391010
I'll take your word for it and try to push through for now. The town-building arc has been atrocious in general though, and the ability stagnation very tiresome. A messy breakup being a plot point in the fucking apocalypse is in such bad taste that it's close to being the straw that broke the camel's back.

>>20391013
I bet the author got backlash and realized it was a really dumb idea.

>>20390977
>temp advancement
You mean relationship advancement or something else? Not sure what temp means in this context, could recommend a few myself if you are interested in this sort of thing, tho it will mostly be WN of either Chinese and Anglosphere make. Japanese ones tend to be either dense protagonist or outright sexsless shounen, or tentacle hentai and nothing in between.

>shipgirl is still weakened
Eh, you could justify anything if you want to avoid something, it's fiction after all but the choice to do so for four books shows that author has some sort of reservation in developing the relationship, which is a problem for me. Did you read cradle? It seems somewhat similar in this regard but more appealing to me otherwise, I'm curious to hear your thoughts on how they compare, if at all.

Besides going by synopsys soulship got couple other issues. I try to avoid sci fi these days because I think scifi, space scifi at least, is best at large scale story telling. For a long time most of what I read was mil sf focused on space and I think sci fi lands itself better to that sort of thing than to relationships, complexity of even modern society means that trying to tell a good story in it would require explaining and developing it as well as your actual plot and characters, which is rather more difficult than working with something simpler like tolkien/litrpg/cultivation fantasy that mostly follows rather well known and simple, by comparison, rule set, leaving more time to work on other stuff or personalise the setting, rather than explain/develop it from scratch. At least unless you make you decide to go full romance. Another issue is I always found one guy must do this one thing or the world is doomed set ups rather dubious, it can work but it pushes me away from it.

>>20391010
Since you seem informed, am I correct in understanding that DotF is mostly combat/progress fiction with cultivation as background? Considered picking it up, but decided against it, want to make sure I'm not misunderstanding it.

>>20389340
Fuck Adare

>>20391068
I doubt it. Author seems to have a lot of chapters lined up beforehand and the intent was just "Zac realises how little Hannah means to him now".

As someone who is new-ish to fantasy, would you suggest reading the "classics" first or just reading whatever I feel like. I'm reading Eye of the World right now and really enjoying it despite it seeming a little derivative/cliche.

>>20391110
It's always good to read the older stuff. I'm mostly reading modern stuff right now with a bit of stuff released like 10 years ago, but there's a lot of good stuff from back then. Some has arguably been surpassed, in that it set a foundation but that foundation was later done better in almost every respect, and then there's some that set a foundation and still haven't really been surpassed, or do their own thing so uniquely well you won't ever see anything like it again.

>>20391069
>Another issue is I always found one guy must do this one thing or the world is doomed set ups rather dubious
After posting this I realised just how many works it applies to including some of my favourites, so perhaps this isn't a valid criticism. Maybe it's just the presentation of it and logic behind it rather than the structure itself. Curious thought that, at least for me.

>>20391110
Depends what you are reading for and what you ultimately want out of it. Besides I think some people might consider wheel of time classic, and it wouldn't be entirely unwarranted. I personally prefer more current stuff because I find it more appealing and it's more likely to avoid issue that plagued the genre before as it's often written by people familiar with them. On the flip side a lot of modern literature is hyper commercialised drivel and the cultural issues going on in anglosphere isn't helping matters, so going to old books is entirely valid if they appeal to you. Ultimately I think it's subjective, almost completely, unless you intend to make a profession of it or are looking to expand your boundaries and literary erudition for whatever reason, classics are probably better for that.

>>20391021
Pretty much my evaluation so far too.
>character building: UNGA BUNGA AXE
>character development: UNGA BUNGA SAFETY
>setting: fun carnage fiesta
>spiritualism: kinda shallow but flavorful, too many cultivation don't even try here
>characters: Only Ogras, Billy, and 'Nam Vet are remotely likeable
If only the progression was a little better, or Zac had a little more charisma, it'd tip things from "cool but taxing" to just "cool". Really unfortunate.

>>20391086
Hanna wouldn't even need to be alive to make that clear. Someone could have just told him she died in the tutorial and he'd be like "damn, I really don't even care" internally. The character is utterly pointless, but I'll forgive her if she kills Alea because that character is both pointless AND a page hog.

>>20391158
There's two other LitRPG stories I compare it to a lot after reading all three. He Who Fights With Monsters and Dungeon Crawler Carl. I have some issues with both, moreso the former, but both do not suffer from boring protagonists. HWFWM does have a bit of an issue of almost nobody else being all that endearing, but it at least has a plot, a goal for Jason to achieve. The combat is bland after a while because Jason just does the same thing over and over (Zac has an excuse in that department because that's his gameplan is unga bunga, whereas Jason feels like he SHOULD be more creative), but I found myself liking it more for the sheer fact that it feels like it's going somewhere. Jason also... Develops. It's a bit awkwardly done, but he does sort of fall partially down the slippery slope the title would suggest.
Dungeon Crawler Carl, meanwhile, has a great cast. The plot is basically just "keep going down the dungeon while the grand plot happens around it", but each floor has its own thing going on, there's always at least one or two clear problems to handle, and Carl's motivations shift from just surviving to "burn this shit to the ground". It's got a great cast, some inventive scenarios, etc. I feel like I may have spoiled myself on most LitRPGs by reading DCC honestly. I can tolerate medium quality as long as it has some interesting stuff, and honestly my bar is pretty low, but I just don't feel too enthused to continue DotF.
I've also read Randidly Ghosthound, which... I guess has a better protagonist but mostly feels like a weaker DotF.

>>20391069
>Since you seem informed, am I correct in understanding that DotF is mostly combat/progress fiction with cultivation as background? Considered picking it up, but decided against it, want to make sure I'm not misunderstanding it.

DotF is mainly combat/progress fic (with some elements of base building at times, although it seems to me the author just dropped that plotline and shoved it into the background at some point, which serves the story well), however cultivation is an important part of the story. I personally consider DotF to be one of the best cultivation novels mainly due to rich and creative descriptions of Dao and mystical visions, those are always a treat, I'd even call it as good as Cradle, even better in some regards, but with caveat that it's a webnovel, so it's written around being read once per day six times a week, so it's obviously different experience than polished, published series. While the story is LitRPG, the System (also called Ruthless Heavens) has serious plot explanation, so it's not just random litrpg slapped onto an otherwise normal setting, so it has way more sense than random other trash stories. I think litrpg elements are the strongest in the beginning, with the story becoming more and more focused on cultivation as it goes on. The worldbuilding is rich and creative, which is also one of DotF's strongest points, having scope and diversity that other cultivation novels wish they had. The author delved way deeper into mysticism and weird asian stuff than one would expect, I've never before seen Buddhist or Indian stuff in a cultivation novel, least of all actual monks. Now I am suprised other authors didn't try to incorporate things like that.

Of course, it must be remember DotF is mainly 'popcorn' story, HOWEVER, it is self-aware, funny, doesn't take itself too seriously, and the story arcs are great most of the time. Definitely top 5 Cultivation stories I've ever read. Just read to skim the stuff you find boring, sometimes fights do get too long.

I want to read a fantasy book about a hulking strongman who solves problems by being strong as fuark. Anyone have any recommendations?

>>20391208
I just don't think the cultivation stuff carries it enough to call it as good as Cradle.

>>20391208
Thanks for your response, surprising to hear about mysticism aspect but otherwise about what I expected, not my cup of tea but I'm glad to have more clarity on it if I ever decide to pick something like that. Honestly biggest problem I have with combat focused fictions is that I get much more of a kick out of playing games with similar themes/mechanics than reading about them, but it's good to hear someone actually putting some effort into making work interesting within it's genre. I tried reading Randidly and honestly I couldn't bother with it, I might check DotF someday tho, the mysticism might make it stand out if I'm ever in the mood for something revolving around combat.

>>20391245
If you couldn't get into Randidly, DotF is Randidly with a weaker protagonist but a better setting and more deep-dive spiritualism stuff.

>>20391184
I'd actually prefer dotf to have less plot. Not just because the plot itself is bad, but because I think too much plot focus is really beside the point of reading a litRPG. I don't pick up a murderhobo playground setting like Ruthless Heavens for the relationship interactions or the grand overarching plotline, I pick it up to see a dude be the best murderhobo he can be. I was actually disappointed about the technocrats reveal because it makes Earth a "special planet" and not just a particularly nasty battle royale setup with Asia zombified and insectoids who are even worse than the invaders.

>>20391216
>I just don't think the cultivation stuff carries it enough to call it as good as Cradle.
I judge it as Cultivation+Power Progression. If it way solely by Cultivation then...Well, I honestly think it has better Cultivation system than Cradle, which Cultivation progression seems rather shallow and straighforward compared to DotF's. Honestly, it might be just due to the fact DotF is a webnovel, so obviously it has more time and effort spent on enriching the setting and the story, compared to Cradle being a published series with tight storyline. Still, if I was to judge both series as how good they do in their categories, I'd say Defiance of the Fall is just better at being a Power Progression Cultivation webnovel than Cradle being a self-published Power Progression Cultivation story.

>>20391208
So review fag, you said you approve of Prodigies by Apollos Thorne?
Because I read another book by him that started okay, then turned into some YA shitshow. Where the protag was simping for a girl, and putting his life on the line to feed others who were shitting on him, all because she wanted it so. When I saw him turn into a doormat I dropped the series (it was that hell one where the protag had blue mage abilities).

I assume this new book is the same? Is there some girl in the background that smile and gives him glances?

>>20391296
>So review fag, you said you approve of Prodigies by Apollos Thorne?
Not me Anon, that must have been someguy. He will probably reply to you, though.

>>20391184
I don't know how people can comapre Randidly to DotF. DotF has its problems and weaker moments, but Randidly is all over the place, in the worst way possible. It's not great at the start, has weird System that's a boring 'Numbers go up' with little substance, dumb plot, and then it randomly changes it fucking tournament xianxia without any warning, just to go into dumb shit again. I am not saying it's horrible shit, but it has no right being as popular as it is. DotF has always been consistent, meanwhile Randidly just gets worse the longer you read.

>>20391309
So >>20390365 isn't you?

The Subcreation Theory of J.R.R. Tolkien
https://www.gwern.net/docs/fiction/2015-mirante-thesubcreationtheoryofjrrtolkien.html

>>20391349
>So >>20390365 isn't you?
Nope, it's the first time I've even heard of Prodigies series, no opinion on that.

>>20391296
I'm >>20390365. I haven't read any other books by Thorne, they don't seem appealing to me. Prodigies got YA vibes but I wouldn't call it shitshow, I don't think book ever crosses the line into simping like what you seem to describe but that's somewhat subjective. I'm gonna put a spoiler tag and elaborate in detail on the dynamics of relationship from the guy's perspective, but to get it out of the way, while relationship is central to the story it's not the sole exclusive focus of it. The main conflict in the story is about different approaches to cultivation and life of a cultivatior, romance aspects are a reflection and a platform for it but it's ultimately secondary to it. Without spoilers I can say that the way sexuality(virginity mostly, not transgender stuff), cultivation (laws, levels, inner worlds) and setting works in the novel creates a number of conflicts and they get addressed and reviewed from different points.

The book is largely about meeting between a guy who is fascinated by an aspect of local cultivation system called Laws, and a girl who is a prominent young cultivator. They meet and start developing relationship but the book isn't exclusively about that. The guy has a fascination with Laws but his actual cultivation level is garbage and he doesn't really go out of his way to increase it prior to the meeting, because he is mostly fascinated by laws but not an ambitious/dedicated cultivator. The girl is by the book cultivator and part of the "book" in setting is that laws are something to be left largely alone until way higher levels, but she too is fascinated/focused on cultivation in her own way, namely pursuit of the apex of power and ascension to higher realm and beyond, her talents ensure that path is clear for her. Conflict/Relationship ensues. On simping, I've seen some criticism of the guy's motivation as simping, but I'd not agree. His motivation later on in the story can be broken into 3 aspects, first is cultivation, his pursuit of laws starts to develop to more broadly encompass cultivation as a whole and becomes more driven because of exposure to her approach and the gap of power between them. Second is friendship, other than his father she is the first person who has the same passion for cultivation he does, so he wants to stay with her to continue pursuing it, but that requires almost desperate rush of his own cultivation. Lastly is romance, because of the setting they can't have sex according to tradition of her sect and the perceived mechanics of the world, which adds tension. These motivations overlap but aren't realyt simping as he is clearly aware of his own goals as well as interest and doesn't disregard them. The biggest example of him "simping" happens early on when he is treated very poorly and has to chose whether persevere or turn around and leave, but it's even more so a test to see if he is got what it takes to be a cultivator, rather than a test of relationship.

>>20391110
Read whatever, you'll have a much more interesting time if you branch away from purely epic fantasy about destiny and quests sooner rather than later just because all of that stuff echoes previous works in the same subgenre.
Reading WoT now is probably the best possible time to read it because it won't be weakened by you having read loads of other authors who were inspired by it.

There's classics absolutely worth going back for but even with them it depends on personal taste how much you'll appreciate them.

>>20391340
That's fair enough. Randidly sort of keeps having this thing where it keeps threatening to be interesting, and then Randidly does the least interesting thing, or a new thing which is less interesting than the telegraphed thing. I do like Randidly more as a character than most LitRPG protagonists, I like that his social awkwardness is a major factor, but the rest of the series is just kind of a mess.

>>20391340
>it has no right being as popular as it is
Think large part of the popularity of Randidly comes down to the fact that it's old and was one of the more prominent series at the time, so it got grandfathered in because it was available when the genre/culture was still new and only getting of the ground. Might be wrong but that's my impression.

>>20391504
Randidly mostly feels directionless, and it almost seems like a lot of stuff that COULD be interesting keeps happening off-screen. It also feels weird how... Little is explained, still. Most System apocalypse things tend to at least explain the System in SOME way. It's just... There in Randidly. I'll give DotF credit there, I really like that one's explanation for it.

>>20391513
>>20391504
>>20391483
This topic reminds of that one time someone on Royalroad's forum made a thread about litrpg stories going on forever without prupose, some stupid whining, yada yada. For some reason the thread got popular and many authors started responding, those really popular ones. Basically, they were mostly just dunking on the whiners and having fun, and then TheFirstDefier, the author of Defiance of the Fall, even made a meme about the post of a guy who was whining about DotF meandering on purpose to make more chapters (picrel)

>>20391540
I don't mind meandering if it at least feels like there's an eventual goal in mind. Hell, I loved Cradle and that series is like 60% Lindon and co meandering into the plot.

>>20390115
I like dragons...How does Wings of fire compare to Temeraire?

>>20391540
I make like 80USD/mo off of my Patreon and I feel that meme lumao

>>20391540
At least he's self-aware.

>>20389410
>Gu are an excellent system that all xiaxia should copy.
I agree, but I think RI is a tough act to follow precisely because everyone immediately knows exactly which story you read due to all the restrictions you mentioned. It's also got the dubious honor of getting canned by the CCP in the finale. Who would want to willingly associate themselves with that? In contrast, the "standard" cultivation systems have a very long history behind them and don't run the same risk.

Those are only the big meta problems. Another problem is that the gu system is a truly gear based system with maintenance and upgrade concerns, which is anathema to the ideal of being a strong, independent cultivator who don't need no one besides himself, where his understanding of the universe alone enables him to never need to sleep or take a bath or do anything besides sit in a dark room alone.

>>20390491
It's more like a fellow author got pissed that RI kept blowing his novel out in the rankings and he reported him because he couldn't compete. This predictably provoked a backlash from the CCP.

>>20391729
>Who would want to willingly associate themselves with that?
Who WOULDN'T? Being banned in china is one of the few ways one can secure one's work against being just outright stolen by those subhuman bugmen.

>>20391738
>Who WOULDN'T?
Chinese people like Gu Zhen Ren, the author of Daoist Gu, more popularly known in the west as Reverend Insanity? The people who actually pump out those huge long webnovels?

>>20391729
>strong, independent cultivator who don't need no one
That's what Gu immortals are, and they're even more interesting because instead of just meditating in caves they ARE resource points and the tribulations are so horrible everyone goes from trying as hard as they can to cultivate to spending all their efforts to STALL and STOP cultivation before they explode.

>>20391751
Besides chinamen, who WOULDN'T?*
There, fixed

>>20391758
They'll steal what they can from you anyway, might as well try to make some money off of them before they do it.

>>20391729
Yeah I've read that before who was the shit tier author that got buttmad about RI?

Also, you can become a strong independent cultivator if you do it slowly and build up your starvalley farm properly.

>>20391852
>Also, you can become a strong independent cultivator if you do it slowly and build up your starvalley farm properly.
Yeah, but you don't get any freebies like the aforementioned perks that enable you to cultivate mindlessly.

>>20391852
>who was the shit tier author that got buttmad about RI?
The guy that wrote Douluo Dalu, AKA Soul Land, it's kinda funny considering how much nicer it is than RI which proves the point about righteous cultivators only appearing to be friendly.

>>20389340
I read the first book and didn't have much interest in continuing.

>>20391899
>it's kinda funny considering how much nicer it is than RI which proves the point about righteous cultivators only appearing to be friendly.
I can tell you mostly cultivate the art of sophistry.

>>20391899
Really I though Doulou Dala was semi-decent, what a scumtier bootlicker.

>>20392051
That's what's so funny about it. He even got a chinese cartoon but it still couldn't beat RI.

>>20392077
I mean anyone with a brain can see RI is just leagues ahead in everything but romance and self insert with fulfillment. Such a shame that he didn't get to finish it, is his new novel any good? I looked and it and it seemed pretty normie and uncreative.

What the fuck is DotF and why have retards started spamming it

>>20392180
>What the fuck is DotF and why have retards started spamming it
Defiance of the Fall, one of the most popular and successful webnovels. A good mix of LitRPG System Apocalypse and Xianxia. Also one of the most financialy well-doing patreon webnovels.

When was the last time this general wasn't such a fucking dumpster fire?

>>20392226
So it’s going to replace reverend insanity as the most shilled novel I take it?

>>20392096
No. I gave it a shot and read the first volume but it's honestly shit.
Apparently the author agrees since he's re-written it over a dozen times.
This has also driven all translators insane and they all refuse to continue until he finishes it so even if you wanted to read part said first volume you'd have to use MTL or learn chinese.
And even if you did that you;d have to constantly keep track of things as he'll add and remove entire characters and story arcs retroactively and suddenly the next chapter doesn't make any sense.

Basically he got totally mindbroken and went nuts when RI was banned.

>>20392262
No, probably not. RI is just one guy with brainrot and a few people who go "yeah it's fine". DotF is... Just fine. It's decent for what it is, but it's not much more than that.

>>20392262
They are just discussing it fagget.
It started being discussed in here because of the chart.

>>20392260
Start talking about David Gemmell and the thread quality improves drastically

>>20392277
>le ebin solo lebeling
I read a significant chunk of the manwha and the "system" is fucking nothing
it's just the MC getting handed shit for free

>>20389051
Has anyone read pic related? It seems quite interesting and I’m getting Malazan vibes from it

>>20392286
Solo Leveling's basically only popular because that adaptation has good art and good action scenes. It's a complete nothing otherwise.

>>20392277
>Mother of Learning
I still don't know why that's on the list, considering it's neither isekai nor gamelit.

>>20392286
It's power fantasy, anon.
Remember being young and having fun pretending to be strong and flying like superman? Then stop bitching.
It's aliens anyways

>>20392304
Did you read the entire series to the end? It's an isekai.
>it doesn't fully match the arbitrary description of the described effect
Stop being a pedantic fagget.

>>20392319
I'm not mad about the power fantasy, I'm mad about the fact the system is just wallpaper

>>20392340
>operator, put all points into agility
>operator, activate the Judgement cloak
>operator, wanna SS?

Answer me faggots >>20392296

>>20392304
>>20392325
I mean, to be technical about it, Mother of Learning is a VR Game Simulation story

>>20392370
Doesn't that make it more litrpg than anything then?

>>20389280
Let me know when the audio book is released.

>>20389453
atomic lobster

>>20392370
>literally just "it was all a dream"
that's unbelievably fucking lame

>>20392395
No, because you can't have fucking LitRPG without System or anything resembling computer video game. People who assocciate MoL with LitRPGs are retarded beyond belief, and I don't get where they aren't ridiculed into oblivion. The fact that MoL and LitRPGs are both Power Progressions doesn't mean they are the same genre ffs. Why are people dumb. It's like calling Lord of the Ring YA because it has young protagonists.

>>20392397
There is already on for coiling dragon. But the chinks don't want to take it off there website (which you have to use webnovel bux to buy). They promised to take it to amazon years ago, never did.

>>20392411
>It's like calling Lord of the Ring YA because it has young protagonists.
Frodo is 50 years old

>>20392411
Gamelit and litrpg are the same shit.
The fucking system is the timeloop.
Getting to play a world simulator for years and receive no consequences, doesn't that make it game like, pedantic fag?

>>20392304
>>20392411
I already know it’s too late, since you replied to the bait, but just ignore the retard who post that chart. As I said, he’s a retard and doesn’t give two shits, so arguing with him is pointless.

>>20392433
No explicit game elements means it's not gamelit.

Ban all litrpg posters

>>20392446
You must be fun at parties.
>things must specifically show it's that thing
>it's a SUV not a car

>>20392462
>reductio ad absurdum
I accept your defeat

>>20392451
>you cunts are actually reading, discussing and defending your books
>in my sffg?
>Ban all litrpg posters

>>20392472
Gonna cry some more?

>>20392451
Mormon jannies will only ban Bakker while the litrpg posters run amok.

>>20392405
>that's unbelievably fucking lame
No, because it makes sense within the story and is an amazing rational twist that makes total sense within the story.

If you want to know what actually happens:
It turns out that no, just like Protagonists believed you CANNOT turn back time, nor loop it. Nothing could do that, Time Travel is just impossible. But you know what's possible? Gods creating an incredibly advanced divine artifact and using imprisoned immortal Dragon Cthullu as a hardware platform to create a copy of the planet and then run it again and again in a loop under incredibly extreme time dillatation. And then using special planar occurence to power it up and shove in a soul of a chosen individual who checks all the 'goody two shoes and talented enough to be hero' to train and learn in the simulation for decades or centuries if needed to fulfill one task OUTSIDE of the simulation once it's over.

And you know what's the best part?

Gods weren't the ones that did this THIS time, because they are fucking gone who knows where, and Angels panicked when facing an incredibly dangerous situation that would destroy the continent, so they debated and chosen one average good guy with position to learn as much as he could and then tricked him into agreeing to enter the simulation in a sub-optimal time for looping. And then inside the simulation an unlikely situation happened, which made an edgy, resentful teenager loop as well. Which should be a big no-no as someone like the protagonist would never pass the psychological checks to be allowed to become powerful. And this more or less is what happens in the story. The proatgonist is the ultimate underdog trying to not only discover all of this, but also avoiding permanently dying, as he is actively hunted.

It's of course simplified a bit, but that's pretty much the plot of Mother of Learning. Pretty cool, in my opinion. Liked it so much I read it three times already. It's called one of the best webnovels for a reason.

>>20392472
i accept your surrender

>>20392476
Like the elder race in middle earth, I feel the time of Bakkerchads is coming to an end here and we must move on to greener pastures

>>20392468
>oh boy
>it's time to list the logical fallacy names on this anon

>>20392451
Ban all censor faggots. They should not be allowed to speak.

>>20389051
Has anyone read pic related? The premise seems interesting and I’m getting Malazan vibes from it

>>20392501
Read it and find out instead of deleting your previous post about expecting a handout.

>>20392510
>t. litrpg spammer
Oh the irony

>>20392501
Moth cunts cuck ant-bros out of beetle pussi
The Novel.

>>20392495
Censorship is based and Supreme, only morm*ns and litrpg dweebs disagree

>>20392501
Why'd you deleted it before?

>>20392516
It's only me and another anon in the thread
>the other anon is the litrpg anon
neck yourself fagget. An hero.

I say let the litrpg fags read what they like and everyone hold their anger for the Sanderson fags.

>>20392528
So it’s been only two losers shitting up the entire thread? That’s even more pathetic

>>20392492
The old that is strong does not wither
Bakkerchads not affected by the mods
The power of Bakker soon will be bigger
He will reign supreme against the odds

>>20392523
janny is deleting my posts again because he got assmad
many such cases!

>>20392541
As posters can delete their own posts after two minutes up to 15 minutes after posting it so within this window it can sometimes be hard to tell who actually deleted it.

>>20392480
Okay, that does make it cool. I'm still not gonna read MoL because I barely have time to watch the two weekly shows I follow between writing my own shit

>>20392567
>/tv/ fag is shitting up sffg with crap and he doesn't even read

>>20392578
anon you are aware that someone can consume media other than the specific media type they themselves produce, right?

Can’t believe it’s been 3 days.

Dune
>oddly exciting political intrigue with some hints of mysticism that get explored and expanded upon towards the end of the book
>managed to finish the whole 1000 page anniversary edition in just a few sittings
Dune Messiah
>extremely boring nothingness but with magic added in (shapeshifters, reincarnation or whatever a ghola is, etc), all while Irulan seethes at Paul for pages at a time
>can barely bring myself to get through 20 pages at a time

Am I getting filtered or did the quality completely nosedive?

>>20392602
The quality is about the same, what are you talking about?

>>20392480
Yeah, I knew I was better off not reading that story.

>>20392602
IIRC 2 and 3 books have to be read together, so if you started the second you must finish all three. Probably shouldn't continue past that, because the story gets even weirder, Sex Wizards, jacking off kids to reincarnate them, stuff like that.

ok, red rising is bretty good

>>20392613
I'm only about a third of the way through so maybe it changes. But all that has happened is Irulan whining nonstop about wanting a kid, Paul refusing to even touch her, Irulan whining the Reverend Mother about Chani/Paul/Jessica, and Scytale talking about their epic plan that hopefully Paul doesn't know about. That's it. Give me the spice trade deals and Harkonnen's schemes within schemes.

>>20392620
I'll power through since it's so short I guess. I'll finish the core trilogy at least. Won't touch Brian's books at all.

NO GOD SERIES WHEN?

>>20392595
Guy really has no life if the first thing he does is come here to shit up the thread.

>>20392278
For me it's the Jerusalem Man trilogy.

>>20392267
Well fuck but that's a big rip, any other authors or novels? I've read warlock of cultivation (good army building) and avalon of the five elements along with 40k years of cultivation and lord of mysteries. I pretty much stopped reading this shit after wuxiaworld started shilling garbage and webnovels shit website appeared so I am out of touch.

>>20392397
Probably never it's not finished either and haram in the governments eyes.

>>20392660
I've been trying to find something myself.
So far after I read RI and LotM I haven't found anything worthwhile. Everything from China to Korea to Japan to the West, there's just nothing new or interesting of decent quality. I mean it's possible there's something out there, after all both of those stories didn't emerge fully formed from the ether, but I can find neither hide no hair of anything.
It's especially mysterious because the next books written by BOTH authors I find to be much lower in quality.
I'd say currently your bets best is to wait for LotM part 2 or for RI to be continued and finished. But both won't even start for several years.

>>20392663
Manhua died too unfortunately before even finishing the first arc, which also kills any momentum for an RI anime, which would be ludicrously based.

>>20392660
There was an anon reviewing Chinese webnovels or something and he came upon a few that were better than Reverend insanity, which isn’t saying much considering it’s shit to begin with, but just check Warosu.

>>20392623
Not really, but Golden Son is a standout novel in that mediocre series.

>>20392682
>But both won't even start for several years.
about that, just today it was revealed that lotm book 2 is coming out march 4th next year.

>>20392623
it's kinda okay YA shite.

>>20392717
by coming out i assume it means its starting then, since its still a webnovel afaik

>>20392660
>>20392689
Here's the warosu link, along with his reviews, hopes it helps you.
>>/lit/?task=search2&ghost=&search_text=&search_subject=&search_username=8%2C9+of+20+%28Current%3A+Mother+of+%28...%29+&search_tripcode=&search_email=&search_filename=&search_datefrom=&search_dateto=&search_op=all&search_del=dontcare&search_int=dontcare&search_ord=new&search_capcode=all&search_res=post

>>20392718
I do get a YA feel from it. The guy who recommended it to me...exclusively reads YA shit from sandermeme and the like.

>>20392634
Never trust a grown man who wears shorts.

>>20392717
Yeah, in chinese. We'll be considerably behind and getting dripfed like 1k words a day at best.
Nothing like watching a 20 hour movie in 5 minute segments.

>>20392721
AHAHA
>>feed a 16 year old girl's tender breast meat to an actual bear just to make your cool ass beetle bigger

Forgot about this, ah man.

Thanks for the link though I do be skeptical of anyone shilling cradle after le reddit mods on r/noveltranslation starting banning people for not exposing it's virtues.

>>20392750
Only reason why I even recommend him to begin with is because he's actually reading them and giving fair reviews, he's also willing to discuss them if you're willing talk to him about it. Other than that, he makes the reverend insanity shill seethe, so there's that.

>>20392775
>Other than that, he makes the reverend insanity shill seethe, so there's that.
Best part in my opinion.

>>20392660
>>20392750
Actually, here's a more complete list. He only started using a name around the seventh book, because people had mistaken him for someone else.

>>/lit/?task=search2&ghost=yes&search_text=&search_subject=&search_username=+of+20&search_tripcode=&search_email=&search_filename=&search_datefrom=&search_dateto=&search_op=all&search_del=dontcare&search_int=dontcare&search_ord=new&search_capcode=all&search_res=post

>>20392775
I will give his reccs a crack then though I still think 4/10 for RI is intellectually dishonest or I'm just uncultured and unread after a decade in the scene. Maybe the new shit is just built different? Whites just dominating a new foreign medium better than the creators?

>>20392808
>Whites just dominating a new foreign medium better than the creators?
Yeah, it's mostly this. Western xianxia tends to be better than chinese xianxia.

>>20392682
I think the issue is that most of them have nothing to say. RI, love it or hate it, is OBVIOUSLY intensely political/philosophical. The author has a very clear anti-authoritarian stance and is trying his hardest to demonstrate and explain his ideas through demonstration. There's definitely a moral/message to RI, and thus a reason for it to be written.
Compared to most other xiaxia, and they're completely hollow power fantasies with nothing particularly important to say that the author obviously has little interest in beyond making number go bigger.

Actually I have read two other xiaxias that had some interesting ideas, but they bungled the writing by copying too much from generic cultivation and petered off into blandness after a the beginning of the story.
I forget the name of the first, but it's the one where the talking Bull teaches a guy demon magic. Really solid opening, gradually falls apart as you realize the entire setting is just layers upon layers of bullshit disguising a chosen one "fate of the world" predestination stinker.
The second is "The Path Toward Heaven" which has decent writing and some legitimate philosophy, but diluted to the point you can barely even see it in an absolute OCEAN of bland filler. The deathknell was when the main character, who spent the entire story up to this point subtly manipulating people from the background finally took center stage and acted, and became a totally boring generic overpowered cultivator MC.

In both cases it's the cultivation itself that ruined the story. The first was at it's peak when the MC was a normal mortal whose "demonic art" was threatening people with a knife. The second was at it's peak when the MC was asleep in a chair for six years while all his enemies mysteriously killed each other.

>>20392808
>I still think 4/10 for RI is intellectually dishonest or I'm just uncultured and unread after a decade in the scene.
Trust me, he's giving it a higher rating than I would ever give it, and as I said, he's willing to talk about it honestly, unlike the shills.

>>20392829
Filtered. Cradle is the 4/10, the Sanderson Cosmere of xiaxia, literally.

>>20392825
>very clear anti-authoritarian stance
The more I hear about it from people who shill it, the more I think that it and it's shills have anti-social worldview. Which makes it far worse than usual authority bad cretins and puts into the category of lets gender transition kids for shits and giggles

>>20392856
But that's literally authoritarianism...
"Trannies bad, government good" is peak cognitive dissonance given that the former is a direct consequence of the latter, which in addition is largely composed of the former.

>>20390115
>>20390130
>Reposted from /trash/

Alright, newfuck WoF guy back again; I've gone to 7 hours in, now. Nearly through it seems the first book.
Just hit the heartfelt goodbyes with Peril and Kestrel. Mostly Peril. Kestrel missed the memo that this is the apology section, and continued being a raging bitch.

Peril has pretty swiftly taken over the 'favorite character' slot for me. Albeit, some nervousness she's going to lose some interesting aspects of her character now, given her expressed desire for some 'redemption' type deal.
Her interactions with Clay are especially cute. My dumbfuck rockboy is popular with the ladies, it seems.
I'm glad she got a hug at the end there. This way, I don't have to do it, major burns and all.
10/10, would wife anyway, if my dick turns to ash so be it.

On the subject, Clay's immunity to fire did feel a touch like an asspull. I'm not necessarily opposed to it, as I'm a sucker for such destined love types of deals, but they really ought to've built it up earlier. There's no real reason it shouldn't've been mentioned that he was at least resistant to fire before. Seems like a last-minute decision, or worse, like character powers just pop up as needed for plot devices.
Still, it made for some real wholesome scenes.

Osprey was the only good adult dragon. He dies immediately. This is a shame. Based lad, talked smack to the queen and gets shanked for it.

The prisoners singing brought a tear to my eye. I'm a sucker for that kind of thing. Melancholic songs especially.

This might've been some misunderstanding on my part, but it sounds like Burn didn't smash just one egg, but possibly every Skywing egg born that year.
Might've just been sloppy wordplay, but that was the implication I got from what Scarlet said to her.

All in all, though, it got a quite large stretch more interesting.
There were a few 'deus ex' moments, so it's not going too highly, but the story definitely picked up and got more interesting, with much better character interactions to boot.

Funny how we were at over 100 posters when litrpg schlock was never discussed, but now we’re under 60 posters

>>20392867
I'm not even gonna entertain your nonsense, anon, I value my brain cells too highly and you clearly pissed most of yours away.

>>20392868
>>20392868
Wish I cared about/read the series, I love those "chapter by chapter shit on the author" blogs like the ones for Eragon, Harry Potter, and Methods of Rationality.
I wish there were more of them desu, they're usually better than the actual books.

>>20392875
"Watch as he recoils, he's been found out!"

Authoritarianism is based and Supreme

This is funny because Fang Yuan things authoritarians AND anti-authoritarians are idiots because they care about spooks like "ideology" instead of focussing 100% of their time on acquiring personal power.

>>20392890
>spooks
Stirner isekai when?

>>20392872
amazing what a group of dedicated losers can do to drive out all dissenting opinions

>>20392893
It's called Youjo Senki. I'd give it a 6.5/10, 8/10 if you're obsessed with early 20th century military history and logistics though.

>>20392884
Yeah but its unbased when the authority figure is a Mormon. you see, we need a good ruler to rule the thread, someone who is based and Supreme, someone dignified and majestic.

>>20391110
Read Eyes of the Overworld instead.

>>20392924
I would unironically welcome sanderson posting over the flood of litrpg redditors in these last two threads, at least the morm*ns first book is somewhat decent

>>20392936
Be careful what you wish for, ones sanderson rules supreme, there is no going back, the thread will be unsalvageable.

Miss me yet?

>>20392982
based king

>>20392982
>*Bows down*

>>20391899
Thinking liking RI contradicts being nice and friendly is like thinking liking Stirner contradicts being nice and friendly. There's edge but RI is not at its core a mean-spirited work, well except toward Maoists perhaps.

>>20392267
I understand why he'd cut entire portions, the island arc is way too fucking long. I think I see where Gu Zhen was going with it thoughL He wants protagonist to become the leader of an emerging righteous force, but the leader himself has an inherently demonic cultivation method and probably will also be forced to use less than honorable means to protect his new force (hence the ruthless old man as a mentor/advisor figure), thus with the internal conflict of the idealistic leader who has an inescapable dependence on demonic means. The problem is his last work was a 2000 chapter solofest and he's probably realizing he doesn't know how to write a faction-oriented story, making his usual tendency for slow pacing even more of a problem.

>>20393019
gay

>>20393019
I meant that RI has a pretty depressing world and, ironically, it's the evil MC that offers the best hope of saving it.

>>20393022
18+ website

>>20393029
I couldn’t think of anything more cliche

>>20393030
i accept your defeat

>>20393033
It's all about execution, baby.

>>20392267
>Apparently the author agrees since he's re-written it over a dozen times.
Holy shit, even veteran authors with millions of words under their belt can fall into endless rewrites of the intro? I feel better already.

>>20393019
I dislike RI but the fact it spits on Maoists is enough to bump it up several points in my mind

>>20392267
>He fell for the infinite rewrite loop
Lumao

>>20393029
Fang Yuan is amoral, not evil. He has the sole purpose of survival which is the most basic and morally neutral goal a protagonist can ever have. RI is about facing the fact the world and by extension ourselves are inescapably cruel, anyone that reads it for murder porn would probably get filtered by zombie arc if not way before that, like the Shang clan arc.

>>20393083
>Fang Yuan is amoral, not evil.
Keep being in denial about it, he's evil.

>>20393087
Explain how.

>>20393087
Don’t even bother. Last time someone argued with him, he threw a tantrum.

>>20393100
Holy cope

>>20393087
>Umm... He just is okay????

>>20393048
>>20393072
It also shows that even someone trapped in endless rewrites can write a million word story just by consistently banging out 1k words a day by the seat of your pants and never looking back.

>>20393184
>the secret to successful writing is being a chinese nickleslave paid by the letter who'll starve to death if he doesn't write enough each day to buy a bowl of rice

>>20393184
>consistently banging out 1k words a day by the seat of your pants and never looking back
picrel

>>20393184
RI was probably a passion book while Bloodcore is an attempt at disciplined writing. I have a feeling that most of these emerging web authors will be one hit wonders due to this. Writing for the sake of production is just a different beast entirely.

>>20393196
>most of these emerging web authors will be one hit wonders due to this
Most authors PERIOD will be one-hit wonders
Hell, Rowling hasn't had any meaningful success since H.P., same for Paolini with the Eragon books. There aren't many people who write just for the sake of writing like, say, Goodkind.

>>20391588
I wouldn't in good conscience be able to recommend it to a grown man going in blind unless you are into super into dragons. You have better things you can read before cracking open warrior cats 2.0 turned game of thrones. It's for kids first and foremost, they are very high calibre children's books that have clawed(heh) their way into bestsellers lists for years. But it's still entirely designed and refined for that age bracket. Boys like the dragons because they are dragons and they make the red stuff come out, Girls like the dragons because they are pastel-colored princesses. Scaly's like the dragons because they are scalies.


Shit, a well made Temeraire/Wings of fire crossover story would be lit though.

>>20391588
Just read Dragonriders of Pern

>>20392721
>>20392805
Whatever happened to this guy? I know he got into an argument with that shill, then he dropped off from this general.

>>20393259
Maybe he's reading

>>20393259
He's been gone for three days, guy is probably reading or taking a break.

The weirdest thing about Zac being so fucking boring is the same story has an actual unga retard character and he's actually fun.

Got any book recommendations? I recently got back into reading novels and have recently completed the black company series and have read through the metro books. I really enjoyed the black company books, any recommendations for long form fantasy/adventure that is a bit more grounded in reality? I don't care if it is classical or modern.

>>20393324
A song of ice and fire.

>>20393324
Malazan was inspired by BC.

>>20393324
>Got any book recommendations? I recently got back into reading novels and have recently completed the black company series and have read through the metro books. I really enjoyed the black company books, any recommendations for long form fantasy/adventure that is a bit more grounded in reality? I don't care if it is classical or modern.
The Princess of Nutting

>>20393324
A song of ice and fire, or it’s prequel Tales of Dunk and Egg.

Janny keeps deleting my posts but let’s the endless litrpg spam go unfettered, no doubt he’s the one doing most of the spamming

>>20393324
Either Malazan or A song of ice and fire

>>20389051
I’m looking for a trilogy of fantasy novels that takes place both 2,000 years in the future and 2,000 years in the past, is there anything on earth that could fit my needs?

>>20393333
I'll definitely give that a read I think a friend may have in passing mentioned that series.

>>20393377
No

>>20393377
The Way of Kings by Brandon Sanderson

>>20393324
Pale,

very long
very grounded
very fantasy
Best magic system I've ever seen bar none. Sanderson eat your heart out.
Free to read and also coming up to its climax. Anyone else here keeping up with it?

>>20393410
>Anyone else here keeping up with it?
There is no way a mere white man like me could keep up with that strong woman of color I spot on your image.

>>20393377
How about one book that's set 500 years in the past an 50 million years in the future? It's called The Night Land. There's two versions, the original 1912 one written as a meandering travelogue full of extremely weird contemporary dialogue and a modern one written as a standard 3rd person narrative safely edited to remove any and all controversial language.

For reference, my favorite line of the original is when the main character affectionately called his love interest "Mine own baby-slave" as a supposedly endearing pet name.
I honestly can't tell if that was just normal at some point or if the author would always be considered a deranged weirdo.

It also contains literal dried water "just add water!", lightsaber frisbies, and soul eating boomerangs, all of which are treated with complete seriousness and gravity.

>>20393422
>How about one book that's set 500 years in the past an 50 million years in the future?
Anon, can you not read? I said 2000 years in either direction.

>>20393410
Ward scared me off of ever reading anything else that guy writes for the rest of his life.

>>20393324
Check out first law by Joe abercrombie. I haven't read black company but I hear it's similar. Very little magic. It's probably my favorite series. 3 trilogies.
Also asoiaf is great.

>>20393429
Time is relative.

>>20393410
>trans shit
No thanks.

>>20393429
Stop impersonating me

>>20389051
What’s the name of the book that David Gemmell wrote a gay character into just to spite one of his fans?

>>20393441
It was too tempting to pretend you are autistic enough to insist on exact time frames.

>>20393444
>What’s the name of the book that David Gemmell wrote a gay character into just to spite one of his fans?
My Diary

>>20393348
>>20393333
>>20393393
>>20393432
Thank you all for recommendations, this gives me quite a bit on my reading backlog. Have a good night.

>>20393410
>trannyshit
haha, no

>>20393446
That’s pretty funny actually

What are some good space opera books?

>>20393492
Hyperion

Any good art of the vessen from in the shadows of the gods?

>>20393324
Malazan books, the author of BC loved them.

> The series has received widespread critical acclaim, with reviewers praising the epic scope, plot complexity and characterizations, and fellow authors such as Glen Cook (The Black Company) and Stephen R. Donaldson (The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant) hailing it as a masterwork of the imagination, and comparing Erikson to the likes of Joseph Conrad, Henry James, William Faulkner, and Fyodor Dostoevsky.[7][8][9]

>>20393492

>>20393623
>book called Space Opera
>it's about an opera in space
Brilliant.

>>20390856
I'm liking Malazan. I think the subtitle for the series is "book of the fallen." 10 books.

>>20387545
asking again just in case
I'll fuck off after this I promise

>>20393681
Go away coomer.

>>20393688
ok fine, I'll go back to spending countless hours in ao3 and literotica only to find absolutely nothing worth reading

>>20393717
best I can do is a dubiously attractive himecut mantis mutant manipulating an 80IQ inbred baron with the mere implication of cultivator pussy

>>20393551
This
I thought tessun looked like mini dragons but I'm not sure

>>20393671
Malazan books are great. Love everything about them except the Icarium chapters.

>>20393083
He is evil but competent and intelligent, and people like to read about competent people regardless if they are evil or not.

>>20393895
>He is evil but competent and intelligent, and people like to read about competent people regardless if they are evil or not.
Speak for yourself and your fellow bugs please

You know those isekai animes where the main character just travels around the whole world while getting more and more op. What is a novel with that concept that isn’t shit?

>>20393895
Nobody likes bug philosophy, it literally denies a component that is atleast half of human interaction, something you bugs have never experienced, emotion. No one enjoys reading about an emotionless character that has to logically prove every goal or purpose in his life.

>>20393935
Actually, logically speaking, people like RI protag need to be put down as they are a clear and present threat to everyone else. They pursue their own selfish interests and bend over backwards to justify how moral their self serving pursuits are. The problem is, of course, is that they do it the expense of everyone else, and functioning society as a whole, which leads to even more damage than just their pursuits alone.

>>20393962
The only one bending over backwards here is you.

>>20393968
>no u

Bugs rule supreme
Humans rage and scream

>>20393935
What? Fang Yuan may not be overly emotional but he does not lack them. Many other, in fact almost all chinese novels approved by CCP have even more emotions, especially romance.

Music you listen to while reading?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kEvPRQsyxrk

Just ordered Journey to the West (volume 1). W-w-w-what am I in for, lads?

>>20394002
Just read it when it arrives, Jesus Christ.

>>20394031
Jks. I've read parts before I bought it, but disliked the Penguin translation that I downloaded. I heard Yu's translation is the best of the best, with extensive notes. I'm excited :D

Percentage of /lit/ users who come to this thread who read isekai and coincidentally, as it's not a popular genre, have literally been transported into a fantasy world, as in a real life isekai, not metaphorically, versus an ant or a blade of grass getting transported instead of a conscious person and comprehending their situation as being in an isekai situation?

>>20394044
/wg/ is that way >>20391186

>>20393968
Don't even bother, anon, it's pointless.

>>20393717
As you should.

>>20393259
>Whatever happened to this guy?
He's taking a small break, not that I blame him, he was going to burn himself out with his reading pace.

>>20393492
The Star Wars original trilogy novels.

Just found Ligotti wasn't a misanthrope when I read some of the notes to "The Conspiracy Against the Human Race." Is there any misanthropic horror literature?

>>20394106
>Is there any misanthropic horror literature?
Ligotti

What can I read that still respectable to women? Are folklore/fairy tales seen as manly considering how they're represented in media (Brothers Grimm are usually depicted as chads)?