/lit/ - Literature

>thinking anyone here has read all 4

Tocqueville, which I'm sure most Americans have read

>>20365639
Replace Paine with Burke rn

>>20366586
You may choose de Tocqueville or Ferguson if you please, but Burke is a different category than these four

>>20366628
fair enough

>>20366628
>Burke is a different category than these four
How so?

>>20366628
How so?

>If the our revolution has proven anything, it is human sacrifices and plebeians turning against one another once their explicit political enemies have been executed.

Tocquevillefag made the ultimate sacrifice

>>20366965
And his death rattle is still heard to this day

>>20366578
>which I'm sure most Americans have read
You’d be wrong then (and retarded)

>>20367409
It's a meme

>>20367409
It's a meme you dip.

>>20366659
>>20366840
Burke an essential thinker regarding the Revolution, but rarely is his focus on civic society.
Four authors proposed all deal with conceptions of natural and historical law, how it is seen with a formation of the civic society and how the French Revolution affected it.

>>20365639
I don't know who they are.

>>20365639
None of there were correct.

I don't recall what Ferguson said about the French Revolution.

If you are interested in some counter-revolutionary and counter-enlightenment thinkers read
>Justus Moser (read Jerry Muller's articles on him on scihub)
>Louis de Bonald (articles by F Roger Devlin at https://counter-currents.com/2021/10/remembering-louis-de-bonald-9/))
>Joseph de Maistre
>Juan Donoso Cortes (https://counter-currents.com/2010/12/juan-donoso-cortes/))

>>20365639
Marx. Robespierre and St Just were deluded classical republicans who thought they could recreate the Roman Republic in modern economic conditions, they were replaced by the true holders of power in modernity, the bourgeoise, who dispensed entirely with the Roman LARPing post-Napoleon and have managed France ever since, dispensing with kings and parliaments as they saw fit to maintain their hegomony and quite enjoyment over France.

>>20367627
>>20367939
epic meme dude!!! kill yourself

>>20371270
The bourgeoisie in the ancien régime had already bought venalities and tax exemptions 100 years ago, and enjoyed more often monopoly rights as well. They didn't take part in the revolution.

>>20366576
FPBP. If anything, these people read abridged works or interpretations. Knowing an author's oeuvre to really understand understand his lifestyle, influences, etc.. is a complete different level of research
I only read & understood(every word and expression) .. what 10%-15% of these guys? especially hegel

/lit/ doesnt read, good larp though

bump

>>20371682
It's a citation of former President of Iran Mohammad Khatami in a CNN interview.

>>20372081
The French Revolution was a bourgeois revolution from top to bottom. It was fought, at least in its first stages, by the emerge French urban middle class, who were envious of the privileged nobility, who were themselves the descendents of ennobled burghers and bureaucrats, the orginal nobility of the sword having lost political power to an absolutist monarchy in the Fronde and being replaced by the nobility of the robe 10:1.

>>20372378
urban petite-bourgeoisie =/= bourgeoisie. It was a coalition of the above, the elite defectors in the professions+lower gentry, and the rural peasantry that undertook the revolution i.e. the classes formed from bearing the tax burden of the ancien régime's fiscal incompetence. The substantial bourgeoisie already won their dominance gradually through the balancing coalition of burgher and monarch against feudal title, leading to the rise of absolutism. The only thing the bourgeoisie care about is who can guarantee them their profits and property, and will as soon ally with the upper gentry (as in Prussia) as the petite-bourgeoisie and their professional minders. The french revolution was a petite-bourgeois tax-revolt, not a bourgeois revolution.

>>20365639
Carlyle.

>>20365639
Tocqueville.

>>20365639
Tocqueville

>>20366965
>>20367169
Why did Tocqueville make /lit/ seethe so hard anyway? Many German Idealists are also just reposted and spammed in threads to make points, but I never saw the backlash I saw with Tocqueville

>>20372776
I never minded Tocqueville/Junger poster (same guy right? cant tell anymore) but its pretty simple, comes down to two things
>1. slow board, so anyone with a gimmick is going to be noticed and trolled
>2. reacting badly to being trolled makes people sympathize with the troll

From what I could tell there was one guy who would post "Spamming again huh Tocqueville fag?" type things, I still see him posting it sometimes. He was in category 1 above, he just noticed the spam and for whatever reason didn't like it, I don't think it was an opposition to tocqueville in particular, 4chan always just has a knee-jerk reaction to anything inorganic or forced since it feels like being marketed to.

Tocquevillefag/jungerfag seemed like an outsider which can go either way, but outsiders trying to present themselves as a "big deal" often provoke hostile trolling reactions. I don't think t/jfag himself did this too much, it was more his fanboys overreacting that caused it. The fanboys would get preemptively angry that their leader was being trolled, which fueled the he must think he's a big deal problem, which made people troll.

The French Revolution was a monstrous aberrational phenomenon, which could no longer be explained in terms of the development of the idea, the practical spirit, the moral order, or any other kind of development. In its own eyes, however, it was only logical. For it had been thinking for a long time without any material base, and its time had finally come. It had found thought on which to act and had then given it concrete form. In its eyes, it was a new world whose laws and constitution it was now setting out to prove. Yet its laws and constitution were the same as in other times and countries. Rousseau had given his own time the law of its own destruction, the law that “in order that each man may know who are his superiors and who are not, each man must become a subject of the universal sovereignty.”

>>20373333
les quads ont parlé

>>20365639
None of them

hegel

>>20366586
Yeah Burke had the best explanation, he btfod natural law in his reflections

>>20372776
>>20372791
That wasn't it. It was the sperg who hated jungerposter because of ideological differences. The guy was trying to promote junger as a nazi so he didn't like any other discussion of Junger. jungerposter showed he wasn't a nazi so antijungerposter sperged out in every thread to stop discussion and used every tactic to muddy the waters. had nothing to do with popularity since junger wasn't popular at all. He would sperg out without jungerposter even in the thread. and he is reportedly a janne

>>20373333
Zzz

>>20365639

>>20374753
Oh no

>>20374753
real butters? since when r u back???

>>20372081
Yes, but the bourgeoisie retook control from the Roman restorionalist LARPers with the Thermidorian reaction, lost it again in part with Napoleon the Roman Empire LARPer, then became increasingly ascendant under the restoration Bourban king LARPer before taking complete power in the July revolution of 1830. The bourgeoisie were not the great agents of the revolution but the revolution accomplished, through "the cunning of reason", their rise to dominance. Others made the kills, but the feed of the carcass was theirs.