/lit/ - Literature

The bump that bumped the thread

>>18451339
Thanks for your detailed review of the book.

>Here is what this book will tell you, in a nutshell:

>You should major in a STEM field, preferably in some type of engineering other than environmental. Clarey discusses and ranks the various engineering fields, but basically, any type of engineering except for environmental is OK. Also OK: degrees leading to jobs in the medical profession (although Biology and especially Kinesiology are discouraged); accounting, statistics, econometrics, and actuarial degrees (though Economics and Finance are discouraged); and computer-oriented degrees. Clarey says little about majors in theoretical sciences such as "pure" math or physics, but it is safe to assume he would discourage them for being not practical enough.

>Also OK is any training that will produce a precise and valued skill. Trade school and military routes are encouraged. The author is vehement that "the lowly plumber has more in common with the bio-engineer than does a doctorate in philosophy because the plumber, like the bio-engineer, produces something of value." Trade school is considered "a superior option to the humanities or liberal arts" because it leads to the acquisition of a skill that is in demand.

>The economics of supply and demand should exclusively dictate what one chooses to study. This is a major point of the book. The author gives the model of a medieval European village in which everyone is expected to pull his weight by providing a genuinely useful service to the community. In such a village, there is no room for "the professional activist, the social worker, the starving artist, the trophy wife, the socialite or the welfare bum." Everyone must contribute something that is in demand by the other villagers. By contrast, in modern American society, people increasingly choose educational paths that bear no resemblance to the products and services they actually want and need--everyone demands cars, gas, and gadgets, but fewer and fewer people are willing to study the fields needed to produce them. Instead of electrical and petroleum engineering, people major in "soft" subjects that do not enable them to create sought-after commodities. In the author's pithy words, "I have yet to see a student ask Santa for 'a lecture about women's studies.'"

>>18452824
>Education, particularly higher education, is something of a conspiracy. Its de facto role is to supply teaching and administrative jobs to the thousands of people with worthless degrees. The author points out that in America, the government spends much more on education than on Big Oil or the military, and argues that many self-serving people are after a piece of that money. Mostly, he thinks schoolteachers are disingenuous. He also asserts that "soft" degree programs are pushed because they turn a higher profit for universities than sciences programs. General education and core requirements--"prerequisites," as he calls them--are viewed as a massive waste of time and tuition money, because students can become well-rounded just from having friends and interests. In his view, liberal arts departments pass on useless knowledge at a high cost to students; their goal is to supply salaries to professors with degrees from the same departments. He calls this "The Circle of Why Bother."

>You should not major in Architecture, Political Science, Communications/Journalism, Marketing, Business, HR, or anything in the liberal arts or humanities for economic reasons, moral reasons, and because of the author's distaste for them. This distaste gets plenty of attention in the book. Just a sampling: "When you major in Finance, you must understand that you are majoring in something barely more moral or ethical than being a lawyer." "[Politicians] don't really care about the people, they just couldn't find real jobs." "[Minority-studies degrees] are particularly dirty and low degrees in that not only are they worthless, but they target minority groups as their victims. [...] There is no employable skill in merely having a trait you were born with." And finally, "Declaring a worthless major is simply shouting out to the world, 'I'm a parasite and have no intentions of working for a living. I want to do what I want to do and I want the rest of you to pay for it. I ultimately want to produce nothing society wants [...] I also want society to create some make-work job for me so my ego isn't bruised and I can make believe I'm a real-word-live [sic] adult too. And if you dare point out what I'm doing in the real world is nothing more than parasiting off of others, I'll cowardly hide myself behind some altruistic crusade and excuse of you of being a racist, a misogynist, or a hater of children."

>>18452828
>Among his arguments are that everyone who achieved success in the arts or business did so without studying them formally, and that any subject that can be learned by reading books should be studied in a library for free. He actually includes this chart:

>Degree: / Replacement: / Savings:
>Foreign Languages / Language Software / $29,721
>Philosophy / Read Socrates / $29,980
>Women's Studies / Watch Daytime TV / $30,000
>Journalism / Start a blog / $30,000
>Radio/Broadcasting / Apply / $30,000
>Political Science / Listen to talk radio / $30,000
>Theater / Audition for a play / $30,000
>Literature / Go to the library / $30,000
>English / Speak English / $30,000

>Your life will be hell if you don't take the author's advice. Choosing a soft major will lead to poverty, health problems, and even divorce. Four years of studying something "rigorous" is a small price to pay to avoid a lifetime of misery.

Lol I’m not reading that nonsense, get fucked idiot

>>18452839
WORK UNTIL YOU DIE WORK UNTIL YOU DIE WORK UNTIL YOU DIE

Normally I'd call this based and tradwife material. But after reading the summary posted here my impression is that the author is full of misdirected hate. I'm not going to try to explain why the author says what he says but I genuinely believe that making 100k a year in the sciences is cucked as hell. The world NEEDS scientists, it needs musicians, it needs philosophers as much as it needs plumbers, physicians and engineers. I only really have opinions but I guess it's better to out them than keep the pain to myself so this is my opinion ok bye

>>18452839
...For every Telemann or every David Bowie who were self taught there is a myriad of people trying to sing and failing with or without lessons. Picasso was taught by his father, so was Charles Ives. There being outliers like Bill Gates doesn't mean there aren't many financiers in Wall St. or bankers in Goldman Sachs or JP Morgan Chase who are thankful for the university they went to and the connections they made there, the skills they practiced...nah this author's an A-grade midwit.

inb4 me starving to death

>Make me a burger

Yeah no, you make it yourself if you're so damn smart

>>18451339
>Just be a STEMbug lmao
>Reason: money
Pass.

>>18452839
>Philosophy / Read Socrates
>The texts of Socrates
>Authored by Socrates
>Read the Socrates
For fucks sake, literally a manbug

>>18451339
what if you are too stupid for math. I've tried math so many times and failed every single time

>>18452824
>>18452828
>>18452839
>just aim to be a mediocre wagie, bro
I'm a uni dropout but damn, this guy is a proper brainlet.

>>18452824
Pleb take. Also stupid take per his own parameters. I know a lot of engineers and they say the entire field is fucked.

>>18452937
>The world NEEDS scientists, it needs musicians, it needs philosophers as much as it needs plumbers, physicians and engineers
well, probably not AS much, but all of these things have their place. it's good that people have the option to go into these fields.

>>18451339
he is right about philosophy and humanities though you won't learn shit in college and you won't make any money when you get out. If you are too dumb for math you shouldn't go to college.

>>18453522
nice dubs
you don't go to college to learn stuff. it's all about credentials. you get to call yourself an """"authority"""" after having majored in english or something.

>>18452839
>>Degree: / Replacement: / Savings:
>>Foreign Languages / Language Software / $29,721
>>Philosophy / Read Socrates / $29,980
>>Women's Studies / Watch Daytime TV / $30,000
>>Journalism / Start a blog / $30,000
>>Radio/Broadcasting / Apply / $30,000
>>Political Science / Listen to talk radio / $30,000
>>Theater / Audition for a play / $30,000
>>Literature / Go to the library / $30,000
>>English / Speak English / $30,000
This might be the most smallbrained thing I have ever read.

>>18451339
Seems like it's still here, to me. Were you thinking of something else?

>>18452839
>>Women's Studies / Watch Daytime TV

>>18452839
>Read Socrates

>>18452839
> Read Socrates

The author of this book is a MGTOW who got a vasectomy and now regrets it.
https://verisoeconomica.wordpress.com/2019/06/16/aaron-clarey-is-a-loser/

>>18453731
Much worse than that: He seems to be an e*gineer

>>18451339
>>18452824
>>18452828
>>18452839

You know, this guy might sound bold but after getting my BA in philosophy out of love of exact reasoning and MSc in political science with intent of both studying something interesting that might land me a data/RStudio-related job I feel this guy. I love humanities and social science will all my heart but our society and educational system are so vastly disorganized and distorted from its Platonic ideal that at the end of the day the only actually realized goal of education from a majority of educational systems is economic signalling, not personal fulfillment and sharpening of your mind. Don't get me wrong, some memories and discussions from my BA and MSc studies are some of the best I had, but, it simply makes no sense to willingly take a high-risk gamble of taking a degree that doesn't hold a high likelihood of granting you a well-paying job in an extremely competitive economic environment - your chances of becoming tenure-track academic in philosophy or a bureaucrat for European Commission are just so much fainter than a junior software developer at mid-size fintech company. Were I sixteen again, I would immediately find a summer job so I could afford to treat my ADHD before after my studies, study up so i could be accepted to an exact "hard skill" discipline like computer science in a prestigious university and treat it as a signalling tool while reading the living shit out of Wittgenstein, public choice theorists and like in my spare time. At the end of the day a degree is just a paper, and a truly educated, erudite man will refuse to specialize in one single domain of knowledge. Granted that, it simply makes more sense to be a well-paid erudite person with a hard skill degree than to be merely an erudite person with a soft/human science degree.

>>18453821
Didn't he major in economy?

>>18454009
So he's a liberal arts student larping as a stem one? What a cuck.

>>18452877
>>18453453
>>18453503
These.
What a pathetic bootlicker. I'll agree on one thing only: Given the online ressources available today, as a burger you shouldn't go into debt to acquire a piece of paper. But that doesn't entail you should become a STEMlet or tradecuck either. Even this Clarey fellow quite apparently agrees as evidenced by the fact that he'd much rather make a living as a writer of corporate propaganda than to actually work for corporate as an ordinary drone. His actions speak louder than any of his words.

>>18452848
based

He's mostly right desu, if you don't have an elite pedigree you're absolutely not getting a job in academia with your humanities degree, nor will you get hired to work in Finance like people with said pedigree will regardless of what their degree was.

>>18454217
The point of attending college is not receiving a fancy job training for a fancy job. It's the pursuit of knowledge.

>>18452137
dangerously based

>>18454117
>But that doesn't entail you should become a STEMlet or tradecuck either
This, im just going run a business personally. Its the only way I can give a fuck about what Im doing and I dont give a fuck about money that much either. If I was interested in something worth it I’d go to college but since all I like it English I’ll just run a store. Dont be a STEMfag unless you really do have autism and trades arent for long term unless you’re really retarded

>>18454249
I'm assuming you're American here because the "college tuition" thing is only really an issue here. First of all, you can pursue knowledge on your own time. Secondly, you aren't going to acquire any knowledge at an American university humanities program if it isn't an Ivy, and honestly probably not even then. it's not like you need a huge lab or are doing some super-abstract and obscure branch of research in algebraic topology or something - you're just reading books and learning what other people thought about things at an undergrad level. Third, you aren't actually getting training for a job, you're acquiring a credential to prove that you aren't an idiot because IQ tests are illegal for hiring purposes in the US.

>>18452839
>Read Socrates

>>18453731
Holy fuck that's hilarious. I just turned 24 and make nearly double what this weirdo in his forties does, but he would've told me my degree was a waste of time.

>>18454335
What's your degree and a job?

dude seems hopelessly stuck in the Maddox era

>>18454370
Studied physics and went into the military as an officer, but I guess that's not very "practical."