/lit/ - Literature

Here's a short text on the exoteric-esoteric distinction in Islam:
http://www.fatuma.net/text/Haqiqa_and_Sharia_in_Islam_by_Rene_Guenon.pdf

Here's an exchange of letters between an Islamic member of the Traditionalist school and a Christian critical of traditionalism, specifically debating over the idea of non-dualism
http://www.sacredweb.com/online_articles/sw17_bolton-upton.pdf

Here's an article by Nasr on the influence of Rene Guenon in the Islamic World
https://traditionalhikma.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/The_Influence_of_Rene_Guenon_in_the_Isla.pdf

A book examining the parallels between Sufism and Taoism
https://archive.org/stream/ToshihikoIzutsuSufismAndTaoism/Toshihiko%20Izutsu%20-%20Sufism%20and%20Taoism#page/n1/mode/2up

An article on the metaphysical structure of the Absolute that is elaborated in Guenon's writings
http://traditionalhikma.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/The-Logic-of-the-Absolute-the-Metaphysical-Writings-of-Rene-Guenon-by-Peter-Samsel-.pdf

Who is Rene Guenon?

>René Guénon defies classification. . . . Were he anything less than a consummate master of lucid argument and forceful expression, his work would certainly be unknown to all but a small, private circle of admirers.”
—Gai Eaton, author of The Richest Vein

>“Guénon established the language of sacred metaphysics with a rigor, a breadth, and an intrinsic certainty such that he compels recognition as a standard of comparison for the twentieth century.”
—Jean Borella, author of Guénonian Esoterism and Christian Mystery

>“To a materialistic society enthralled with the phenomenal universe exclusively, Guénon, taking the Vedanta as point of departure, revealed a metaphysical and cosmological teaching both macrocosmic and microcosmic about the hierarchized degrees of being or states of existence, starting with the Absolute . . . and terminating with our sphere of gross manifestation.”
—Whitall N. Perry, editor of A Treasury of Traditional Wisdom

>“René Guénon was the chief influence in the formation of my own intellectual outlook (quite apart from the question of Orthodox Christianity). . . . It was René Guénon who taught me to seek and love the truth above all else, and to be unsatisfied with anything else.”
—Fr. Seraphim Rose, author of The Soul After Death

>“His mixture of arcane learning, metaphysics, and scathing cultural commentary is a continent in itself, untouched by the polluted tides of modernity. . . . Guénon’s work will not save the world—it is too late for that—but it leaves no reader unchanged.”
—Jocelyn Godwin, author of Mystery Religions in the Ancient World

>“René Guénon is one of the few writers of our time whose work is really of importance. . . . He stands for the primacy of pure metaphysics over all other forms of knowledge, and presents himself as the exponent of a major tradition of thought, predominantly Eastern, but shared in the Middle Ages by the . . . West.”
—Walter Shewring, translator of Homer’s Odyssey

>“In a world increasingly rife with heresy and pseudo-religion, Guénon had to remind twentieth century man of the need for orthodoxy, which presupposes firstly a Divine Revelation and secondly a Tradition that has handed down with fidelity what Heaven has revealed. He thus restores to orthodoxy its true meaning, rectitude of opinion which compels the intelligent man not only to reject heresy but also to recognize the validity of faiths other than his own if they also are based on the same two principles, Revelation and Tradition.”
—Martin Lings, author of Ancient Beliefs and Modern Superstitions

>“If during the last century or so there has been even some slight revival of awareness in the Western world of what is meant by metaphysics and metaphysical tradition, the credit for it must go above all to Guénon. At a time when the confusion into which modern Western thought had fallen was such that it threatened to obliterate the few remaining traces of genuine spiritual knowledge from the minds and hearts of his contemporaries, Guénon, virtually single-handed, took it upon himself to reaffirm the values and principles which, he recognized, constitute the only sound basis for the living of a human life with dignity and purpose or for the formation of a civilization worthy of the name.”
—Philip Sherrard, author of Christianity: Lineaments of a Sacred Tradition

>“Apart from his amazing flair for expounding pure metaphysical doctrine and his critical acuteness when dealing with the errors of the modern world, Guénon displayed a remarkable insight into things of a cosmological order. . . . He all along stressed the need, side by side with a theoretical grasp of any given doctrine, for its concrete—one can also say its ontological—realization failing which one cannot properly speak of knowledge.”
—Marco Pallis, author of A Buddhist Spectrum

>“Guénon’s mission was two-fold: to reveal the metaphysical roots of the ‘crisis of the modern world’ and to explain the ideas behind the authentic and esoteric teachings that still [remain] alive.”
—Harry Oldmeadow, author of Traditionalism: Religion in the Light of the Perennial Philosophy

>Rene Guenon is the most correct, smartest and most important person of the twentieth century. There was no smarter, deeper, clearer, absolute Guenon and probably could not be. It is no coincidence that the French traditionalist René Allé in one collection dedicated to R. Guenon compared Guenon with Marx. It would seem that there are completely different, opposite figures. Guenon is a conservative hyper-traditionalist. Marx is a revolutionary innovator, a radical overthrower of traditions. But Rene Halle rightly guessed the revolutionary message of each of Guenon's statements, the extreme, cruel noncomformity of his position, which turns everything and everything upside down, the radical nature of his thought. The fact is that René Guenon is the only author, the only thinker of the twentieth century, and maybe many, many centuries before that, who not only identified and confronted with each other secondary language paradigms, but also put into question the very essence of language (and metalanguage).

>The language of Marxism was methodologically very interesting (especially at a certain historical stage), subtly reducing the historical existence of mankind to a clear and convincing formula for confronting labor and capital (which, in fact, was a colossal revolutionary and predictive course, because it allowed many things to be systematized and brought together into a single, more or less consistent, dynamic structure). Being a great paradigmatic success, Marxism was so popular and won the minds of the best intellectuals of the twentieth century. But R. Guenon is an even more fundamental generalization, an even more radical removal of masks, an even broader worldview contestation, putting everything into question.

- Aleksandr Dugin, author of Political Platonism and The Fourth Political Theory

>>18432049
I found a rare Guenon pic with his wife and daughter but the quality is bad

>>18432201
thank you brother, I have never seen that one before, quite rare indeed.

>>18432201
RARE!
where did you find it?

>>18432049
We need a new edition of /lit/'s René Guénon Magazine

>>18432225
Guenon's daughter has a french group on facebeook about Guenon. I have it from there.

>>18432049
>posts haram picture
>Traditionalism general
lol

>>18432201
I wonder what's become of his family since his passing and the intensification of the reign of quantity. Did he sequester them in a hidden Sufi community or something?

>>18432329
salafism =/= traditionalism
seethe harder, faggot

>>18432339
>revealed religion
>traditional
lol

>>18432335
They are like the average people this days(from Egypt), except the fact that they have a certain interest in the work of their father. Also, reminder that Guenon's wife was a normal egyptian woman who knew only arabic so Guenon's family is not Guenon. He probably just wanted them to be pious muslims, not sufi shaykhs.

>>18432318
That's pretty cool! Do you know anything about his son? Do they live in Egypt?

>>18432374
>Guenon's daughter has a french group on facebeook
>like the average people this days (from Egypt)
lolololol

>>18432335
His daughter posts in a Guenon group on Facebook

>>18432395
in french, like the average people this days (from Egypt)

>>18432339
>>18432360
https://youtu.be/mesySj71-0I

>>18432378
Yes they do. His son is also a sufi and Guenon's home holds sufi gatherings of the Order with which he himself is affiliated.

Who are the traditionalist Protestants I should read? And mystical Protestants.

Thank you.

>>18432429
>Muslim
>accepting to be filmed
Murtads will be murtads.
lol

>>18432448
>Who are the traditionalist Protestants I should read?
There are no Protestant members of the Traditionalist school, many of them derided it as a degeneration of Christian tradition
> And mystical Protestants.
Swedenborg
Jakob Böhme

>>18432318
what's his daughter's name?

>>18432448
Protestantism is anti-traditional according to Guenon.
Still, Jakob Böhme has some good parts but he would be considered heretic by 99% of protestants.

>>18432448
I know you're probably joking but Boehme is probably counts.

>>18432448
>revealed religion
>traditional(ist)
lol

>>18432460
Laila Guenon

>>18432464
>Protestantism is anti-traditional
Just like any other revealed religion

>>18432480
You are a retard. Learn about Islam and talk to me after. Abraham was neither jew nor christian but muslim. Islam is the primordial religion, the first and last religion. Islam isn't just the muhammadian revelation.

>>18432464
>Protestantism is anti-traditional according to Guenon.
Guenon said orthodox Christianity and buddhism weren't trad, but then Schuon and others corrected him and he changed his opinion iirc.
I think Schuon said Luther and some forms of Protestantism are okay traditionalism.

>>18432480
>Islam is the primordial religion
Muhammad destroyed the traditional religion of the Arabs and then forced them to worship the god of the Jews.

>>18432502
>Islam is the primordial religion
Muhammad destroyed the traditional religion of the Arabs and then forced them to worship the god of the Jews.

>>18432465
>>18432464
I can't understand Boehme unfortunately, he sounds as confusing as Hegel imo

>>18432502
Allah will crush you, murtad.

>>18432502
>religion revealed at some point in time
>primordial
lol

>>18432518
>traditional religions of the arabs
The arabs are semites, they come from Ishmael which is in the Old Testament. Arabs are as semitic as the jews.
The "traditional religions of the arabs" was based on idols which were less older than the God of Abraham.
Seethe harder pagan larper.

>>18432510
>Guenon said orthodox Christianity and buddhism weren't trad
Source on him saying orthodox Christianity wasn't trad? I thought that in "insights into Christian esoterism" he says positive things about hesychasm

On Buddhism it's more complicated, his later view was that original Buddhism was trad, but then the Indian Buddhist schools lost the correct understanding of it and became garbage, but then that later Buddhism was made trad again when it became blended with Taoism and Tantric Shaivism. He never reversed his original view to the point of accepting all Buddhism as trad, or to the extent of considering medieval Indian Buddhists schools like Yogachara and Madhyamaka as such.

>>18432529
revealed religion is perennial truth, primordial truth is obscured by the Fall, unless you're literally a prophet you need a true religion.

Are you a prophet?

holy shit /lit/ is done now isn't it
tradfagg retards have taken over
is this what insecurity and bbc al jazeera headlines does to a whiny sissy white dude
laughable bunch

>>18432545
>The traditional religions of the arabs was based on idols
lol you hate the Arab Tradition so fucking much...

>>18432554
You are a murtad.
Allah will crush you.

>>18432550
>Source on him saying orthodox Christianity
>In 1935 Lovinescu visited the celebrated Greek Orthodox monastery on Mount Athos in search of initiation. He reported his experiences to Guénon, who concluded that either there had never been anything there or it was no longer there, and he introduced Lovinescu to Schuon. In 1936 Lovinescu traveled to Basel and, after “preparation” by Burckhardt, went to Amiens and entered Schuon’s Alawiyya.

>>18432584
ok so you're trolling, or you think you're a prophet who doesn't need revealed religion, good luck

>>18432519
That's where Hegel got it from lol

>>18432554
>Are you a prophet?
This the guénonian version of "only Allah can judge me".
Guénonians say this all the time when they are caught promoting their degenerate haram stuff.

>>18432600
>ok so you're trolling
Nope, murtad.
You'll go to hell.
Allah will crush you.

>>18432563
>atheist buck wants to be broken
not today boy

>>18432590
Not having initiation doesn't mean non trad bruh. Is just incomplete.

>>18432609
What is your religion and holy book, and who do you say God is?

>>18432613
>initiating something
>tradition
lol you are so dumb...

>>18432613
fair point

>>18432612
go back to your lifetime of a cope cuck

>>18432619
You are afraid, murtad.

>>18432626
>initiation and tradition are not the exact opposite
>fair point
lolololol

>>18432628
>>18432630
>>18432639

>>18432502
DAS RIIIITE

Bros, how do I get a guenonian gf?

>>18432643
>accepting to be filmed
>pious
Why are you postig this haram picture of a degenerate?
you murtads are so disgusting
lol

>>18432653
stop looking for a gf who mirrors you and your interests, if that's what you want you need to find a man, a man with aspergers .

Guenon's wife was a mostly illiterate housewife

>>18432653
>Bros, how do I get a gf?
Orientalism in a nutshell.

>>18432049
>seething hylics edition
how did OP know his thread would make the hylics seethe ?

>>18432658
How do I get an illiterate housewife?

>>18432653
Just go to some third world country and marry the dumbest girl you can find.

>>18432666
move to a poor country, get a simple job (teaching english) become religiously orthodox, make friends with the locals and ask them for help finding a wife, or go to a village outside the capital and find one once you learn the language.
(this is what I did)

>>18432679
>ask them for help finding a wife
Imagine "asking for help finding a wife"...
lololol

>>18432448
Unironically, listen to Hank Williams's recorded hymns

>>18432679
Holy based. May I ask you, in what part of the world you did this? There are many poor countries.

do you frens read indian writers

>>18432685
>dividing the IQ of your future children by two
>Holy based.
lol

>>18432683
yep, asking within your social circle just works, and it's normal, people start calling their cousins and sisters and friends and you'll have a bunch of options lined up

>>18432687
Coomaraswamy, he was half indian

>>18432685
I'll just say somewhere in South East Asia, it's very hot here :)

>>18432700
Nice, probably gonna move to north Africa.

>>18432691
>asking
lol you're so pathetic

>>18432687
not modern ones, but I enjoy reading the works of Sri Shankaracharya and other medieval Hindu philosophers and writers

>>18432695
Anf Indians hated him.

>>18432721
no they didn't

>>18432710
Based, you'll find high levels of consanguinity.

>>18432730
seething hylic

>>18432725
Of course they did.

>>18432742
Allah will crush you, murtad.

>Allah will crush you, murtad.

>>18432805
Keep posting your degenerate drawings you dumb retard.
lol

>Keep posting your degenerate drawings you dumb retard.

>>18432809
>ctrl+f : murtad
>9
seething

how realistic is it to start your own powerful cult lads

>>18432979
How tall, handsome and charismatic are you?

What is a mustard?

>>18432049
/trad/ chads
I finally came to realize how America is counter-traditional to its core. How do I cope?
Soft nationalism + loyalty to the Pope??

>>18433101
> loyalty to the Pope??
Yes, do that retardanon

>>18432991
6 foot 2.5
I could get myself to an 8.5/10 if I lose some weight
Charismatic, yes

>>18433116
Yes, the one on the right

>>18432939
>ctrl+f
>lol

>>18433127
Based

>>18433101
move to north africa and become muslim

I remember when the fad among trade was to larp as orthodox. What happened to all the orthobros on 4chan? Did they convert to Islam or Hinduism?

>>18433170
hell no
i'm /trad/ but i'm also racist

What are the best editions of the Corpus Hermeticum and the Enneads that are neither too expensive nor shitty abridged editions?

>>18433187
Still here, but more ecumenical with other Christian bros, less need to argue

>>18433255
>not wanting this to belly dance in front of you as practice semen retention in lotus position

>>18433324
sorry bro, I don't want sandnigger kids
it's really that simple

>>18433333
checked. blessed digits
the future is purely huwhite confirmed

So are most of you Muslim like Guenon or something else?

>>18433351
/lit/ is an Evola board
we believe in the Roman Tradition

>>18432563
>noooo I miss the shitposting and memes

>>18433333
>sorry
Imagine apologizing to an orientalist retard...

>>18433364
>orientalism
>roman
Pick one, retard.
Evola was just a stinky orientalist.

>>18432590
There was Saint Silouan who passed in 1937. I've known his disciple Elder Sophrony who was an obvious saint too.

>>18433421
no, he thinks hindu/buddhism is Aryan so we are allowed to steal some esoteric knowledge from them

>>18433415
>>18433421
Heyyyyyyy Chaim don't leave on on read!!! Go respond to me here >>18431070.

>>18433438
Evola was an stinky orientalist. Here is his phylosophy summed up:

1. All oriental things are superior and must be seeked (symbolism of the bow)
2. All western things are inferior and must be crushed (symbolism of the club)

Plus he used to drink camel piss.
Pretty disgusting if you ask me.

>>18433452
you've never read him

What happened to ... posting?

>>18433442
Go drink camel piss elsewhere you dumb retard.

>>18433455
seems like you aren't able to read between the lines

>>18433462
drink bleach and poop your intestines out you illiterate dumb piece of shit. Why are you even on this board. Fuck Off.

>>18433456
one Muslim? (It's not clear) person who probably has aspergers or another form of autism is ranting at anything he perceives to be connected with Guenon

>>18433472
You're losing your temper.
So pathetic.
And so funny!
lol

>>18433481
Yeah people like to mock guenon fanboys...
Internet is so much fun!

>>18433333
checked. based.

>>18433472
>>18433482
how about you both fuck off since neither of you are contributing any worthy discussion.

>>18433524
>orientalism
>worthy
lol

>>18433481
>kike number #666
Yeah it must be a muslim who keeps spamming lol, murtad and haram. It must be a muslim autist!!!11
>>18433503
>kike number #66
I agree, of course we mock guenon fanboys and oga boga *nasal voices*
This is my first time on the job
Oh holly molly internet is fun
I didn't know that it would feel so nice to have a wooden pole in my ass.

>>18433552
You're still losing your temper.
So pathetic.
But so funny!
lolol

>>18433566
>66
you are losing your butthole kike nubmer #66
you need to dilate asap before it's too late

>>18433603
Go back to /pol/, nobody cares about your camel butthole rambling.

>>18433617
You are losing your temper Chaim.
It's bad for your soul.

>>18433633
AAAAAAAAAAAAA I CAN'T TAKE IT ANYMORE.
FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU
I HATE YOU WITH EVERY FIBER OF MY BEING.
FUCK YOUUUUUUUUU

>>18433641
Just go away. This battle is above you league. No repent and don't do it again.

>>18433633
>>18433641
okay guenonposter

>>18433641
>>18433649
Allah will crush you, murtad.

>>18433641
>>18433649
guénonposter answering to himself
how pathetic
lol

>>18433709
>guénonposter
you called?

How do you get a femboy who reads guenon bf?

>>18432049
what is the Traditional way to live life according to Guenon or Evola? I see them posted about so oftenzm, what course of action do they think someone should take after accepting all their crazy ideas?

>>18434150
>what course of action do they think someone should take after accepting all their crazy ideas?
That's for people to decide for themselves, it's implied that one would seek membership in an existing religious tradition, and then devote oneself to the acquiring of spiritual knowledge through participation in whatever form of traditional esoterism is preserved in the respective religious tradition one is participating in

>>18434260
what Traditions are alive today in say, America that have esoteric paths?

>>18434282
>what Traditions are alive today in say, America that have esoteric paths?

Islam and Hinduism

>>18434322
Hinduism is a living Tradition in America? Don't you have to be born into a caste?

>>18434325
>Hinduism is a living Tradition in America?
Yes, there are Hindu monastic centers and temples located throughout North America.

>Don't you have to be born into a caste?
Only to participate in Vedic ceremonies such as the bestowing of the sacred-thread. In some instances in India if you sought to be admitted as an ascetic monk (sannyasin) into an order of monks, you might be rejected for not having the requisite caste as some only accept Brahmins; although the different sub-orders follow their own rules and sometimes differ from each other.

The different sects of Hinduism have their own procedures for initiation, as a rule most are generally open to westerners. The Sri Vaishnavism tradition established by Ramanuja and other Vaishnavite traditions of Hinduism initiate people with a rite called Samasrayana that has no caste-, birth- or nationality- connected requirement with it. The Shaktist and Shaivite traditions of Hinduism are also willing to admit and initiate westerners as they draw their initiations from the Tantric agama literature and there are no caste-requirements connected with these initiations, unlike Vedic ceremonies.

>>18434538
literally who

>>18434906
I am sure outside of this shithole Guenon is the literally who.

>Highly decorated, fully initiated (Drain Gang)
What did Bladee mean by this? What Tradition is he initiated in?

>>18434960
That's where you're wrong though, Guenon is read by intellectuals all over the Islamic world and he is influential within certain Christian circles as well.

If the pyramid scheme of modern academia was deprived of its funds, there would be nobody left with any real interest in Bataille. He is only represented as having importance by people looking to justify their tenured positions and research grants.

>>18433306
>more ecumenical with other Christian bros

Your orthodox beard is pic related. It's the ecumenism curse you can't escape, far more effective than onions.

>>18433187
The orthodox convert stop becoming trad and actually become orthodox.
We are just on the waiting line for a tradition here waiting to get adopted or adopt a path, and then we will leave to a complete dedication to it.

>>18434999
What intellectuals in the Islamic world, Islamic intellectuals would classify him a kafir/heretic. unless you mean cringe western audience speakers.

>>18435001
*onions

>>18435027
>What intellectuals in the Islamic world
there is a whole article about it here by Seyyed Nasr titled "The Influence of Rene Guenon in the Islamic World"

https://traditionalhikma.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/The_Influence_of_Rene_Guenon_in_the_Isla.pdf

>>18435036
fuck I mean S o y

>>18434999
>Guenon is read by intellectuals all over the Islamic world and he is influential within certain Christian circles as well
Cope. They exile intellectuals in those countries and devout Christians aren't reading French Islamists.
>muh academia
More cope. Nobody reads Guenon except identity-shopping maladjusted zoomers.

>>18435037
>Upon his return to the west, Nasr took up positions at University of Edinburgh, Temple University, and since 1984 has been at The George Washington University where he is now a full-time University Professor of Islamic Studies
Lol being a guenon expert is only allowed outside of Islamic countries

>>18435044
>>18435055
>>18435066
Those successive dubs

Traditionalism leads to traditions, and not to traditionalism itself. But the fact it directs to a more particular accomplishment of it's ideal doesn't make it wrong.

>>18432049
Is perennialism life affirming and masculine? I am spiritually minded but I refuse to sign up for a cuck religion. I'm not going to turn the other cheek; I'm not going to stop being racist because we're all "made in God's image"; and I'm not going to stop banging tight pussy just because it makes God mad. I want a warrior religion for MEN-- does perennialism offer this or is it just life denying cope like most other religious systems?

>>18435055
>They exile intellectuals in those countries
No they don't, there are both Muslim and secular intellectuals in these countries, in Turkey just to take one example there is a fairly large secular community of academics, whom you would consider intellectuals.

>and devout Christians aren't reading French Islamists.
Guenon wasn't an Islamist and yes they do, Seraphim Rose is just one example

>>18435207
Isn't Turkey re-islamicizing for electioneering purposes? And Seraphim Rose is another name I only ever see in tradzoomer threads.

>>18432070
The nasr essay is interesting, ty anon

>>18435200
Evola remained a racialist throughout his life, disapproved of moralism, did not disapprove of banging tight pussy (even leftist pussy), was in favor of Tantric sexual practices with the purposes of initiation. The only thing he did not approve of was marriage for the perpetuation of the bourgeois nuclear family.

>>18435217
>Isn't Turkey re-islamicizing for electioneering purposes?
That is an agenda being pushed by one political party, but which is opposed by large swathes of the country and the other parties. So opposed in fact that just a few years ago they attempted a military coup which failed.

> Seraphim Rose is another name I only ever see in tradzoomer threads.
Because you don't read Russian forums, he is widely known in Orthodox countries.

>>18435252
Ok so... Russians and Turks are reading Guenon... that doesn't make him any less of a literally who compared to Bataille.

>>18435243
>bourgeois nuclear family
To be sure, he was not anti-natalist, as some think. He clearly states in the Sufi of Rome that in the egalitarian and feminist West the conditions for matrimony were longer there. He was in favor of the model of the Roman Pater familias (read Coulanges’ Ancient City).

>>18435037
Nasr is a Shia and even Guenon was not fond of Shiite devils. Also is that all? You low life.

>>18435275
>i'm not saying not to have kids, but unless we return to the morēs of aristocratic Rome it would be unwise to marry and reproduce.

>>18432448
Harry Oldmeadow is an Anglican who also wrote books on the Sophia Perennis and the age of modernity. Check him out.

>>18435270
>that doesn't make him any less of a literally who compared to Bataille.
yes it does because their interest is organic instead of it being artificially sustained by self-justifying academia and the tax dollars that fund them
>>18435290
>Nasr is a Shia
So? Not everyone he cites in the article as readers of Guenon in the Islamic world are Shia
>and even Guenon was not fond of Shiite devils.
Guenon had no ill-will towards Shiites and didn't disparage them, the most he said was that their doctrine in some respects gets closer to mysticism than metaphysics

>>18435311
>someone is only more widely known if he is known for the right—i.e. my arbitrary—reasons
Amazing, Guenonians can't even parse basic facts

>>18433101
Join ISIS.

>>18433116
>Pope holding a Commie icon with the crucifix
The fuck? Can someone please, explain this story to me?

>>18435353
he received it from commie president but admonished him for it saying it is not right

>>18435325
Okay, you got me, what I should have said was that many more people actually deeply care about Guenon and his writings than the amount of people who deeply care about Bataille and his writings

>>18433452
>1. All oriental things are superior and must be seeked (symbolism of the bow)
>2. All western things are inferior and must be crushed (symbolism of the club)
Patently false. Evola had a lot of respect for western esoterism, particularly Hermeticism, Pythagoreanism, Greco-Roman mystery schools, and alchemy.

>>18435363
That may actually be true. There are a lot of tradzoomers and Russians

>>18434282
If you won the genetic lottery and can reliably trace your lineage to it, you can be initiated in a Native American tribe.

>>18435200
Assuming you aren't trolling, which I seriously doubt, Traditionalism is not "Racism, Yes!" but is does acknowledge a doctrine of castes to the extent that some people are more geared towards certain vocations than others, and Traditionalism is by definition patriarchal (even Harry Oldmeadow says this in the documentary in the OP). As for religions that have a warrior ethos, there is paganism, but every western pagan tradition is dead, and the modern manifestations you find today are all larps. Besides that, Islam seems to be the only one that has a warrior ethos, and it's easily accessible to westerns, unlike orthodox Hinduism. As for being allowed to crush tight puss puss, sorry, you're not going to find that in any living orthodox tradition.

>>18434384
>westernized hinduism
Effeminate beta boys, yoga moms, rave thots, DMT navel gazers, vegan incels, no thanks

>>18435200
>masculinity is being enslaved by sex and petty emotions
Zoom zoom

>>18435496
> and it's easily accessible to westerns, unlike orthodox Hinduism.
orthodox Hinduism is accessible as well, unless you are defining everything aside from joining an Advaita Vedanta ascetic order as unorthodox, you’ll just stand out more compared to if you became Muslim

>>18435608
The Romans and Greeks (most masculine civilizations ever) were all giga-coomers. Pretending like celibacy is masculine is cope. Have sex.

>>18435595
None of those people actually participate in real Hindu traditions like you would if you were initiated into one, none of them go to services at a Hindu temple or converse with their guru, if you did this you would find other Indians who take it seriously

lol

>>18435630
You mean to tell me all of those anons who got their first gf after doing nofap for many weeks and months were wrong? There is something to semen retention. Hell, even a life affirming tradition like Taoism says you should be celibate.

>>18435678
>>18435689
>>18435698
rent free

>>18435630
>The Romans and Greeks (most masculine civilizations ever) were all giga-coomers
cooming on little boys isn't very masculine, despite what Gay Pride month is telling you, retard.
repent

>>18435736
>NNooo I'm not a crypto buddhist!! NOooO Ahblobloobloo.

>>18435761
I am not guenonchad

>>18435767

>>18435788
checked
sounds based ngl

>>18435756
This homosexuality wasn't as accepted in Greece as fags want you to believe. There was a double standard where being the bottom as an adult was humiliating.

>>18435794
>being a Top was straight in ancient greece
>religion bad, sodomy good

>>18435794
in ancient aryan societies, raping and dominating betas was not gay. however, if you got raped you were basically fem-tier and an outcast.
Western Liberal Tradition by Kevin B MacDonald

>>18435948
so glad the greeks&romans decided to convert to Christianity

>>18435761
Dude, no, that image is actual mental illness. I don't care about this conversation at all. I've just started reading The Crisis of the Modern World, I am like 4 pages in. So, I have no horse in this race. But this is actually obsessive. Take care of yourself. Please. I'm not saying take meds or whatever the meme is. I'm just saying be mindful and be safe.

>>18435794
>>18436326

It seems I am out of screenshots for now.

>>18436137
>even sharma, the one book guenonfag ever read, admits advaita had to be "developed" from the upanishads by buddhism, and revived by gaudapada the buddhist admirer

he is the gift that keeps on giving

Any new guenon facts are appreciated. Thanks brothers.

>>18436326
>I'm not saying take meds or whatever
I am

>>18436478
this is a schizopost

>>18436461
are you guenonfag loremaster? did you know he was a buddhist

>>18436326
>I've just started reading The Crisis of the Modern World, I am like 4 pages in.
Sure thing… Guenonfag!

>>18436488
Guenon would never be so popular on /lit/ if it weren't for the fact that one schizo developed a burning obsession with Guenonfag and would bump every Guenon-related thread with his schizo pics purportedly about Guenonfag, thereby ensuring that even more people saw the threads and giving Guenon even more exposure. In a way I'm grateful to him.

>>18436511
and to think in all that time guenonfag never actually read guenon, ironic isn't it

>>18436515
source?

Anyone else bothered how historically illiterate most Guénon readers in these threads are and how 99,9% of them are unable to apply theories/thoughts/observations of Guénon to the current times?

Most of the time I see wall of text Jargon from white western people arguing about some irrelevant metaphysical sanskrit terms. Things that have little to none relevance in this age, the times we live in. Some sort of a history club or a nostalgia-buffs' coffee shop type of speculation of some religious drop-outs or some people seeking for something (probably transcendence).

What I really miss is accurate observation, insight to the current times we live in, especially as expounded by Guénon in his reign of quantity. The fact that counter-initiation started brewing up California (as speculated by Guénon in his letters) and how we are closer to seeing the total dissolution of our domain through infra-psychic domain (alien disclosure) or be it through digital money as Guénon speculates (CBDCs are being implemented this year)

I'm pretty sure none of the people have even read the book René Guénon et les sept tours du diable (“René Guénon and the Seven Towers of the Devil”).

The problem with these traditionalism generals and Guénon readers itself that little to none people here can apply the knowledge to real world or even understand what is being said. You only argue about irrelevant sanskrit metaphysical concepts of Far East or some other irrelevancy. That is why I hate single one of you.

>>18437108
> people arguing about some irrelevant metaphysical sanskrit terms.
>that little to none people here can apply the knowledge to real world or even understand what is being said. You only argue about irrelevant sanskrit metaphysical concepts of Far East or some other irrelevancy
You are being overwhelmed by the reign of quantity and the pragmatism it requires; free yourself from horizontal arguments with pure, vertical Metaphysics then you will be moving towards what is really essential.

>>18437108
>Things that have little to none relevance in this age, the times we live in
Filtered.

>>18437108
I used to post about Guenon and act like I had read his work and did the whole PBUH memeing for a time telling everyone to read Guenon when in reality I had just read 'The Crisis of the Modern World' and half of 'Introduction to the Study of the Hindu doctrines'
Was really retarded of me

>>18435630
Only in their final stage of collapse, anon. I recommend reading early Roman literature and studies and comparing it to the late (but pre-Christian).

>>18434538
This is an obvious cope by Bataille because Guenon so clearly called out modern philosophy (particularly post-Hegel) for what it is. A goalpost shifting nothingness which has eradicated Truth.

I like Guenon but I have to admit Philip Sherrard BTFO him

>>18437108
I bet exactly zero people who post on /lit/ about Guénon have ever been initiated.

>>18433452
Ride the Camel

>>18435678
>>18435689
>>18435698
you really put this much effort into identifying and analyzing some random nerd online you don't like?

>>18437218
>not liking guenonfag

Identifying him was the most fun on this board in a long time. Remember when he kept posting his own naked pictures trying to forced meme them?

>>18437198
I bet exactly zero people who post on /lit/ about Guénon are practicing a religion.

>>18437198
Initiaited in a what sense? From what I've gathered from reading Guénon, and especially the controversial et les sept tours du diable, it seems to me that the Kalachakra initiations now popular in the west (from which the myth of Shambhala derives) and which many popular tv shows like Twin Peaks make a reference are active counter-initiatic attempts to produce those very same centers.

Also the Melchizedek speculation in Guénon's King of the World was confirmed to me after reading Jacques Vallée's "Messengers of Deception" and his contact with the ufo cult regarding the Order of Melchizedek (also related to California, as Guénon speculated regarding the centers of counter-initiation)

The fact that one could be initiaited into some Tibetan or Tantric lineage in this day and age is worrysome to me, for I do not believe these are actual lineages of benevolent spiritual transmission, but rather, they are actual counter-initiation masquerading as such.

>>18437230
There used to be one or two devout muslim ones but guenonfag drove them away.

>>18437231
give me pdf of et les sept tours du diable

>>18437237
https://www.scribd.com/document/371473591/Jean-Marc-Allemand-RG-Et-Les-Sept-Tours-Du-Diable

>>18437231
I originally typed "into a tradition older than 100 years" but expected someone to come up with something masonic that is 101 years old.

>>18437108
Hey, fuck you. I actually do see the signs all around and reminded of symbols and inversions of them. Take the events surrounding George Floyd for instance. He was objectively a thug nigger criminal who got deified to sainthood and got buried in a gold casket. This significance obviously ties to what Rene Guenon said the essay 'The Significance of Carnivals' in Symbols of Sacred Science, where we are living in a perpetual Saturnine carnival, where the virtuous are brought low, and the cretinous cthonic devils are brought high.

>>18437241
Well according to Italian writer Marco Baistrocchi: (Marco Baistrocchi, ‘Agarttha: A Guénonian Manipulation?’

Baistrocchi quote:
>“By draining the spiritual energies from Europe, the crisis [of the modern world] has been indirectly accelerated and regeneration has been hindered. At the same time, Islam has been reinforced, in which there grows from day to day an ever more rigid, anti-spiritual, and counter-traditional fundamentalism.”

I personally don't agree with Baistrocchi, but is interesting to see this sort of deprivation of certain initiatic centers. Vatican is already (after the second council) in a total counter-initiatic perversion of the original religion. I personally would not be surprised if same is true of Islam ( at least in the West )

>>18437249
>Rene Guenon said the essay 'The Significance of Carnivals' in Symbols of Sacred Science, where we are living in a perpetual Saturnine carnival, where the virtuous are brought low, and the cretinous cthonic devils are brought high.

Well, we certainly agree.

If you do want a Traditional observation of this Carnival aspect, apart from Les Sept Tours Du Diable, there exists and excellent article written by Nigel Jackson called "Hexentanz: The Sinister Masquerade of the Kali-Yuga" released in Oriens Winter Journal 2012.

>"‘When Ya’juj and Ma’juj are let loose (from their Barrier) and they swiftly swarm from every mound.’ The Holy Qur’an (Surah Al-Anbiya)"

>>18437251
Thar is true for Salafism

>>18437249
>Take the events surrounding George Floyd for instance. He was objectively a thug nigger criminal who got deified to sainthood and got buried in a gold casket.

Contrary to the Hyperboreans that derive from a masculine, Olympian and Uranian-solar nature, symbolized by the light of the black sun and the green ray of vril and other virile solar qualities, the southern races of Africa and Amazon are symbolized by the chaotic and Dionysian natures of mankind, earth-based pantheism (Mother Nature), predisposition to karmic law, darkness, femininity, and the moon. There is a sacred dualism between these two poles, a spiritual conflict between the Northern Light and the Southern Light, the former relating to the transcendent-solar Hyperborean-Aryan nature and the latter corresponding to the terrestrial-lunar Southern races.

The Negroid element now dominates the United States and even the Vatican (through their Pache Mama idol worship etc.)

Julius Evola viewed the Southern races as being from the dark side that possessed a “demonic” nature, describing them as being “archaic and matter-obsessed” who were predisposed to “sacerdotal and naturalistic-pantheist religions of promiscuous vegetal and animal fertility”. Evola relies on an ancient Aryo-Zoroastrian scripture that describes the origins of the Southern races, particularly the Negroid and Capoid races, through coition between a demon and a witch with mankind:
“Zohak, during his reign, let loose a dev (demon) on a young woman, and let loose a young man on a parik (witch). They performed coition with [the sight] of the apparition; the negro came into being through that [novel] kind of coition” (Bundahishn, XIVB).

It is also apparent from their use of Spiral symbols, the spiral triangle symbol and other negroid fetishistic imagery

Catastrophe struck the Atlantic continent and through a natural disaster, the land of the south was covered in ice and their civilization destroyed. The Southern races migrated northward and established early societies in modern-day South America, Central and Southern Africa, Australia, India, and various areas of Asia that were once interconnected. It is unknown if the Asiatics, particularly the modern-day Japanese, Koreans, and Chinese I believe this theory is quite plausible, since these Asiatic ethnicities are significantly dissimilar both genetically and spiritually to the Australoid, Negroid, and Capoid races.

But in America we find the most two most hostile currents united to the most loathsome degree - The Southern-South Pole Nature Worship combined with the dark sorcery of negroid black magicians of Atlantis (Voodoo, Obeah).

>>18437269
I hate Evola'a dualistic way of looking at history

>>18437249
>>18437269

The relationship with America the mythological Atlantis (that was also said to be destroyed by a Flood) is also speculated by René Guénon in his Symbols of Sacred Science:

>From this last point, we want to draw at least one conclusion: at the decline of a civilisation, it is the most inferior side of its tradition which persists the longest, in particular the ‘magical’ side, which, moreover, contributes to the complete ruin of the tradition by the deviations it gives rise to. This is said to be what happened with Atlantis. Magic is also the only immaterial thing of which the debris still survive from civilisations which have entirely ceased to function-witness the cases of Egypt, of Chaldea, even of Druidism; and no doubt the ‘fetishism’ of the negro peoples has a similar origin. Sorcery could be said to be made of the vestiges of dead civilisations. Is this why the serpent, in the most recent times, has hardly kept anything but its malefic character.

Guénon using such terms above as “negro fetishism” may sound a bit pompous and even racist at first consideration, but the point he is making, that such traditions are to be considered of vestiges of some higher religious systems and cultures that degraded over time when the “true knowledge” of the "true rites" was lost through some sort of Catasthrope.

Similar fate is awaiting for America, it may take few thousand or hundred years, but the continent itself will degrade similarily to those negroid cultures to extreme primitive fetishism, obea and voodoo etc. only time will tell. What we can be sure that the Maso-Judeo-Atlantis will end up in a catasthrope.

While the Obelisk of Washington is white, we must understand the axiom of the mystery schools "Osiri IS a black god" and what does the concept of "BBC" represent to the American subconsciousness and psyche.

Negro fetishism in this context does not mean some magical charms of African medicine men, but rather, the inner longings and lusting of (white) American women

All prejudice, all superstition, dead tradition - and ancestral loathing and slavery, all combined in the subconscious of white American women under the figure of "BBC", like a forbidden fruit, but which is now through Kanye West and other chocolate-Jesus idols such as George Floyd accepted to eat.

White woman kneeling on the mural of George Floyd, the Golden-Osirian-Black-Counter-Initiation-Kanye-West-Chocolate-Jesus-BBC obelisk

>>18437255
>>18437231
Were you or either of you the person posting about Upton and Vallee a year ago? If so I got into Upton thanks to you so thanks

>>18437277
I am one of the other people who used to 'document' Guenonfag and it's nice to see that guy, I always found his infographs funny as fuck.

Letter from René Guénon to Arturo Reghini, Cairo, April 25, 1935 .
“As far as the attacks on me are concerned, you have understood very well that there is something quite different there than outward appearances; the curious thing is that it seems to come from all sides at the same time, even the most opposite; but behind it all is what is truly "evil", and it goes even further than anything you can imagine. To get an idea, you can read carefully the answers contained in my reports, and also what concerns the "counter-initiation "., the "seven towers of the devil", etc. All these things, basically, hold together very closely; the rest are only more or less unconscious instruments, but sometimes all the more dangerous by their very unconsciousness ... - Certainly, I am much quieter here; moreover, the last year that I was in Paris, life had already become almost impossible there, and it would doubtless be quite something else now. Impossible to tell you all that I have since discovered and how many so-called friends have gradually unmasked themselves… ”

>>18437284
I'm not sure, might have been /lit/

I personally got into Upton through reading The Demonic Theory of UFOs by nickname "John Of the Gentiles" (ISBN 9781475070545)

Even though I do not agree with that book 100% (it is a bit religious fanaticism), I would recommend reading the theories expounded in that book.

But understand the full implications of such Ufo-theory of Upton, Guénon (Forces of Gog and Magog, Cracks in the Great Wall of Infra-Psychic domain) and how it regards that some claim that governments are working with these aliens/demons/forces, I would then recommend to read Sinister Forces trilogy by Peter Levenda (even though Levenda himself might be part of disinformation and counter-initiation)

It gets into a very conspirational territory, but if Upton correctly observes that aliens/ufos are the very same forces, like this Upton quote:
>The UFO “aliens” are beings from another “dimension”—the world called in some systems the etheric plane, situated on the “isthmus” between the material world and the world of dreams and mental imagery. The etheric plane is home to the Jinn, the elemental spirits, the fairies, the Powers of the Air mentioned in Ephesians 2:2—the “air” in this sense denoting the subtle-material dimension. (The “border” between the etheric plane and the world defined by the five senses apparently has something to do with the electro-magnetic spectrum

It is interesting to note that the Roswell incident happened chiefly at the same time when Jack Parsons was summoning the Enochian Air Elementals from the Tablet of Air with L. Ron Hubbard

And this is not even some conspirational nonsense, we have the diaries of Jack Parsons, Hubbard and their Babalon working, and they were the Elemental Tablets of Air they were using of Dr. John Dee's system in their ritual through 1946-1947.

>>18437306
Letter from René Guénon to Marcel Clavelle of March 25, 1937
“It seems that the atmosphere of Antwerp is something dreadful, which even gives rise to inexplicable physical discomforts; but, there and even for Lyon, like perhaps also the Balearics and some other places of Europe, and for California as far as America is concerned (because it is doubtless not for nothing that so many strange things gather there), I think that they are basically only secondary centers, which should not be counted in number of "turns" properly so called. These seem rather arranged in a sort of arc of a circle surrounding Europe at a certain distance: one in the region of Niger, from where it was already said, in the time of ancient Egypt, that the most formidable wizards; one in Sudan, in a mountainous region inhabited by a “lycanthrope” population of around 20. 000 individuals (I know eyewitnesses to this here); two in Asia Minor, one in Syria and the other in Mesopotamia; then one on the side of Turkestan where there are things as "mixed" as in Syria, good and bad; so there should be two more to the north, towards the Urals or the western part of Siberia, but I have to say that, so far, I cannot locate them exactly. "

>>18437269
>“Zohak, during his reign, let loose a dev (demon) on a young woman, and let loose a young man on a parik (witch). They performed coition with [the sight] of the apparition; the negro came into being through that [novel] kind of coition” (Bundahishn, XIVB).
>It is also apparent from their use of Spiral symbols, the spiral triangle symbol and other negroid fetishistic imagery
I watched The Last Fiction recently which told the story of Zohak and had this blood letting ritual that released the demon inside of him. Some /pol/tard also connect this to pedophilia and satanism, and they might be right.

Also, what are your thoughts on the Chinese favoring the South? Even Guenon pointed out that the south pole is where the sun is at it's zenith, which is why they drew their maps south-side up and had their palaces facing south.

Anyway, watch The Last Fiction. There's a whole lot of symbolism in that movie.

>>18437323
>Also, what are your thoughts on the Chinese favoring the South? Even Guenon pointed out that the south pole is where the sun is at it's zenith, which is why they drew their maps south-side up and had their palaces facing south.

>Anyway, watch The Last Fiction. There's a whole lot of symbolism in that movie.

I must say I am too afraid of this subject and maybe I have developed a bit paranoia when it comes to these symbols and forces they represent.

I finished watching the "Mouthy Buddha" documents recently and also seen these same symbols in tv shows like "True Detective" etc.

Even though I live in Northern Europe, I've noticed some sort of:
>"If you stare into the abyss, the abyss stares back at you"
-phenomenon

What do I mean by this? Well, I was trodding through my town recently as part of my morning walk and noticed that next to a kindergarten in my city there was an abandoned electric power station that has very old graffitis drawn on the wall. Closer look to that station and I noticed it was full of those pedo spirals and pedo spiral triangle symbols, and keep in mind: these graffitis were older than the kindergarten in question

I am honestly terrified/scared of this subject and I refuse to go too deep into this/that rabbit hole, as I am not sure what I might be getting into and if they are some metaphysical evil forces I am dealing with: I am more paranoid than Guénon when it comes to some attacks of sorcery.

I am too afraid to go too deep into this subject as it could be disastrous for my sanity.

>>18437311
>It is interesting to note that the Roswell incident happened chiefly at the same time when Jack Parsons was summoning the Enochian Air Elementals from the Tablet of Air with L. Ron Hubbard
Did not know this. Scary stuff.

Because we have no strong traditions of our own to rely on, and so much of what we do on a board like /lit/ is theoretical, the mundane conceptual intellect straining to restart the old "intellectus" (higher metaphysical understanding) and recapture higher forms of knowledge, it's easy to fall into reading conspiracy theory-like materials without balancing it with positive, healthy things. Basically, it's so much easier to "see" the evil aspects in the world today, that spending 8 hours falling down a rabbit hole of reading about spooks is easier, comes more naturally, than going to a religious service, praying, meditating etc. All things that would have come naturally in another age. Maybe even in an age much more open to "spirits" and permeated by them, but and yet even then, people were by and large safe from these evils because they had living faith.

If we don't have this, ironically we today can end up closer to Parsons than to the old believer. More interested in the demonic than in the sacred. Even if it's initially out of a desire to avoid it or resist it. If we and Parsons both spend hours obsessively cataloging and learning about demons and not being active participants in our faith, what's the difference? It's also fun to be "in the know" about the Kali Yuga, demonic aliens, etc. That's the one-two punch of modernity, first it drowns you in disenchanted secular materialism, then it entices you with paganism and "magic."

Just have to be careful. Remember, you're literally on the side of the Good, of the metaphysical order of reality and God itself. Something the greatest mystics experience and can't even remember, it's so blissful and pure good, beyond our comprehension.

>The glory of Him who moveth everything
>Doth penetrate the universe, and shine
>In one part more and in another less.

>Within that heaven which most his light receives
>Was I, and things beheld which to repeat
>Nor knows, nor can, who from above descends;

>Because in drawing near to its desire
>Our intellect ingulphs itself so far,
>That after it the memory cannot go.
(Dante, Paradiso)

We obsess so much over how to gain knowledge of this, in theory and philosophy, that we forget it's also real and in a big way, it has our back.

>>18437340
I just wrote all the above and then refreshed and saw your post. I even wrote something about Guenon being attacked by sorcery and deleted that part because I didn't want to make it more "fun" to talk about these demonic attacks, secret sorcerers and curses, etc., because that goes against my point of how dangerous that can become for your sanity. Weird synchronicity, and if you believe these things like me, then perhaps for a reason. Stay strong friend.

>>18437320
>one in Sudan, in a mountainous region inhabited by a “lycanthrope” population of around 20. 000 individuals (I know eyewitnesses to this here)

>>18437359
>I just wrote all the above and then refreshed and saw your post. I even wrote something about Guenon being attacked by sorcery and deleted that part because I didn't want to make it more "fun" to talk about these demonic attacks, secret sorcerers and curses, etc., because that goes against my point of how dangerous that can become for your sanity. Weird synchronicity, and if you believe these things like me, then perhaps for a reason. Stay strong friend.

Well, the thing is, that even Evola speculated that through occult (or other practices) one might make himself/herself vunerable to this in a sense of "Knowledge increaseth Sorrow" or similar.

http://www.juliusevola.net/excerpts/On_Pre-Birth_Superconsciousness_%26_the_Power_of_Occult_Forces_over_Backward,_Primitive_People_or_Going_Beyond_Rene_Guenon.html

Evola quote:
>It is interesting to note that when I questioned Guénon concerning his accident (his case of pseudo-arthritis), and asked him whether an individual who has attained a certain spiritual level might not be safe from all attacks of 'magic' and wizardry, Guénon replied by reminding me that, according to tradition, the Prophet Mohammed himself was not invulnerable in this regard. Apparently, the reason for this is that 'subtle', 'psychic' processes operate in a deterministic fashion, not unlike physical processes (a knife stab, for instance, causes damage regardless of the kind of person it hits). (Actually, I have some further reservations on the matter: for I believe that the process of materialization of the individual - what contributes to distance him from the subtle forces of nature - can actually act as a protection against occult attacks of the kind I have just been discussing. Such attacks, therefore, would have little power over modern man, an intellectual type and city-dweller, whereas they would prove effective against more 'backward' and 'primitive' human groups.)

>>18437227
kek no, sorry I'm a newfag

>>18432518
Yeah, he did force them to stop worshipping their traditional God, Yahweh. Instead he forced them to worship Allah.

This board is counter-initiatory and satanic, we should move to another place, anyone can see our posts and join the discussion.

>>18437376
Yes I think this too. Imagine how dangerous it was seen as to think or talk about "demons" in a different age, and now imagine one of the well-read teachers of that age being told that people in a future age will have an "internet" filled with well edited editions of most occult books and entertainment media glorifying demons and the occult. Oh and they wouldn't have any religious traditions, everyone is basically an atheist, but an atheist pagan who wants to be cool and get special powers by talking to a demon. Convinced that the world is a meaningless void, but open to talking to "aliens" from other dimensions to see if they have any good weed brownie recipes. He'd shit his fucking robes.

But I highly suspect that even the most vulnerable humans are not that vulnerable all things considered. For the most part we're safe, not some Lovecraft story about us being ants, the playthings of monsters from the 9th dimension. The most that happens to us is we go nuts. Unless you go out actively seeking evil, then maybe you can get possessed or something.

If there are evil forces fucking with us, they are probably just etheric assholes. They're probably more frustrated by their inability to get "in" here than excited about messing with us. Again, if you have faith, you also feel triumphant in it in a way. It's the pagan, who thinks the world is nothing BUT a meaningless material dimension filled with meaningless vulnerable humans, overlaid by a meaningless etheric dimension filled with spooks, that has a problem.

>>18437403
I very rarely participate in these discussions anymore for that reason, I usually chime in (like now) to discuss secondary issues if they're somewhat interesting.

>>18437376
When you read a lot of occult works and integrate it into your mind, you dont become more vulnerable to magic attacks, you just become mentally ill.

People living in huts in the jungle who belief ghosts are everywhere are just the mentally ill.

>>18437306
He suffered from a burn-out......

>>18437430
They're "mentally ill" according to the mentally ill, where what is mentally healthy has been entirely inverted from its true state.

I have a very satanic mood rn. Yesterday night I was reading some weird stuff, I woke up after a nightmare where the text "olhobos are alhillein" was shown in the air(does that mean anything?) And now in the morning, we talk about this things on /lit/ and I just feel weird.

>>18437359
>Basically, it's so much easier to "see" the evil aspects in the world today, that spending 8 hours falling down a rabbit hole of reading about spooks is easier, comes more naturally, than going to a religious service, praying, meditating etc. All things that would have come naturally in another age. Maybe even in an age much more open to "spirits" and permeated by them, but and yet even then, people were by and large safe from these evils because they had living faith.

>If we don't have this, ironically we today can end up closer to Parsons than to the old believer. More interested in the demonic than in the sacred. Even if it's initially out of a desire to avoid it or resist it. If we and Parsons both spend hours obsessively cataloging and learning about demons and not being active participants in our faith, what's the difference? It's also fun to be "in the know" about the Kali Yuga, demonic aliens, etc. That's the one-two punch of modernity, first it drowns you in disenchanted secular materialism, then it entices you with paganism and "magic."
These are wise words. If all we see and focus on is darkness, then we forget the Light and succumb to the darkness. We must always believe and worship the Good, no matter what. Anyway, it's a shame I have to go to bed just when this thread started getting good, even if it's only 2 or 3 people effortposting. Good night!

>>18437320

>>18437495
Counter-initiatic arrogance. Muh exoteric masses bad.

>>18437495
This is Tomberg right? Where do you recommend starting with him?

>>18437495
Metaphysics should lead an honest seeker to humble and 'simple' religious practice because man is not just an abstract intellect playing in the Platonic realm; man has body, mind, and soul that need to be oriented in a certain way, daily, and man has sins in need of continual purification. The fact that Guenon entered an orthodox religion and prayed at mosques isn't at odds with pure metaphysics, it's an expression of it. A seeker of truth, even a high IQ metaphysician needs a religion and practice; without an orthodox practice the metaphysician who thinks he has 'found truth' is deceiving himself.

>>18437524
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPkDVILsIwo

>>18437518

>>18437572

>>18437628

Bros is Mishima trad?

>>18437646
No, he was too westernized

>>18437646

More like a homo aesthete who fantasized a lot about trad things.

>>18437658
Mishima was a right wing femboy before it was even cool

>>18437666

>>18437666

You bet. The creep really knew how to write engaging books though.

>>18437655
>westernized

>>18437536

>>18437695
I want a guenon pet

>>18435027
How did guenon not get stoned in Egypt? Are sufis okay with all that Kali Yuga crap?

>>18437702
He just didn't talked with them about hinduism and all of that.

>>18437702
>>18437712
Also, he could speak about this type of concepts in a muslim language.

>>18437698

You will never be a real woman . You have no womb , you have no ovaries , you have no eggs . You are a homosexual man twisted by drugs and surgery into a crude mockery of nature’s perfection .

All the “validation” you get is two-faced and half-hearted . Behind your back people mock you . Your parents are disgusted and ashamed of you , your “friends” laugh at your ghoulish appearance behind closed doors .

Men are utterly repulsed by you . Thousands of years of evolution have allowed men to sniff out frauds with incredible efficiency . Even trannies who “pass” look uncanny and unnatural to a man . Your bone structure is a dead giveaway . And even if you manage to get a drunk guy home with you , he’ll turn tail and bolt the second he gets a whiff of your diseased , infected axe wound .

You will never be happy . You wrench out a fake smile every single morning and tell yourself it’s going to be ok , but deep inside you feel the depression creeping up like a weed , ready to crush you under the unbearable weight .

Eventually it’ll be too much to bear - you’ll buy a rope , tie a noose , put it around your neck , and plunge into the cold abyss . Your parents will find you , heartbroken but relieved that they no longer have to live with the unbearable shame and disappointment . They’ll bury you with a headstone marked with your birth name , and every passerby for the rest of eternity will know a man is buried there. Your body will decay and go back to the dust , and all that will remain of your legacy is a skeleton that is unmistakably male .

This is your fate . This is what you chose . There is no turning back .

>>18437536
I think the criticism against Guénon's conversion comes of his earlier association with certain hermetic, masonic framework he spent his youth in.

In terms of arts, it would be like a some technical artist or classical composioner abandonding his earlier pursuits and "succumbing" into some infantilism

Of course it would be underestimation when it comes to rich symbolism inherent in Sufism, but I think some people are trying to make his conversion look like he chose the most backwards beduin herder religion because he got "burn out" from all the hermetic/occult prior knowledge.

But honestly, can man be "tainted" to a degree that it is impossible for him come back to some simple monotheistic religion?

I mean if we take example of some young fellow who spends his youth studuying Gnostic texts and regards this whole realm as some sort of Demiurgic phantasm where he is a prisoner and the organized religion is actually a heresy of some anti-Gnostian defilement of the Bible and Book of Enoch/apocrypha was right etc.?

I mean how could one even "convert" to a simple faith of some God the Fater or does he consider it some Demiurgic Restriction? And even then, if it would be out of fear, it would be like succumbing to Satan

>>18437702
>How did guenon not get stoned in Egypt?
Egypt was already westernized to the max at that time.
That's why René Guénon was accepted and nobody cared about him or about stoning anyone.

>>18437306
>>18437320

In these same letters, and in the book ( les sept tours du diable (“René Guénon and the Seven Towers of the Devil”).

Guénon also described the Leopard Society of these Sorcerers and their association with Uranium mines of Africa.

It is interesting to note the recent mainstream news how Ufos are associated with Nuclear Weapons (enabling, disabling, them) interest in them. Guénon also speculated some underground existence connected to Uranium with these infra-psychic forces, especially with the Leopard Society

>>18432448
The ones that turn into traditionalists unironically end into either Catholicism or eastern Orthodoxy.

>>18438125
How good is that book? Should I buy it?

>>18438263
There are no English translations

>>18438275
I know, I will read it in french

>>18437152
>Sherrard BTFO him
wrong

>>18438277
It is worth the read

>>18438277
>René Guénon and the Seven Towers of the Devil
>>18438275

The author does not speculate it, but:
> The seven Towers of Devil also form the constellation of Ursa Major, but they would be much further one from the other, and according to the texts each tower is guarded by some priests that belong to, let’s say, a secret society that in this case would be a center of anti-Initiation (which goes against tradition, the Initiation, opposing forces). Guenon spoke of these centers a few years ago. This is a very interesting but sparse subject. These 7 towers would be located at the following locations: 1. Mount Nuba (Sudan), 2. Niger, 3. Syria, 4. Iraq, 5. the Turkestan zone 6. Meadow of the River Ob (Siberia, Russia) 7. Belvy Island (Kara Sea, Russia

It is interesting to note that the largest Atomic Bomb ever detonated on Earth (Tsar Bomba) was detonated extremely close the center that Guénon speculates and the center counter-initiation (or the main center) being somewhere historically in Siberia

This is because of the ancient Hyperborea. Shamanism itself are degraded traditions of primordial tradition and it is perhaps for this reason Guénon believes it being the main center of counter-initiation spiritually

But I would advice not to take this novel as some sort of historical truth... it is in my opinion a Suggestive work

>>18438291
Why are such centers in Russia? Also, from the time of Guenon, many things changed in that country, at least at the political level. How relevant is this map today?

>>18438309
Historically it does make sense, considering the Bolshevik tradition and the revolutions that occured there and the Marxism gaining foot there etc.

I would suggest you to read the Les sept têtes du dragon vert - la guerre des cerveaux ("The seven heads of the Green Dragon - the War of the Brains") also

It is related to especially Siberia, Mongolia and Russia in certain initiatic sense

Especially this man comes to mind:
https://www.newdawnmagazine.com/articles/the-mysteries-of-trebitsch-lincoln-con-man-spy-counter-initiate

>In contrast, writers such as French esotericist Rene Guenon and Jean Robin, see a more secretive and sinister side to Trebitsch. To Guenon, Trebitsch was an obvious “agent of the Counter-Initiation,” a tool of hidden forces which sought to thwart and misdirect human enlightenment. Robin puts him in the service of the dreaded “72 Unknown Superiors” whose manifestations included the mysterious Green Dragon Society.1 Robin, among others, even makes him an influence on the up-and-coming Adolf Hitler.2 Historian Guido Preparata dubs Trebitsch a “midwife to Nazism.”3 Preparata also insists that Trebitsch was “neither a spy nor an imposter, [but] in all likelihood was, like [Alexander Helphand] Parvus one of those ‘specialists’ fluent in the art of subversion, who were part of a wider network of mercenaries fascinated in one form or another by the ways of power.”4 It’s an intriguing possibility, to say the least, but not one easy to prove.

These people were heavily connected to Russia

>>18438320
Ok, maybe you are right. But where are this people now? Also, if you look at pseudo-religions like Theosophy or Spiritism, they are less popular this days, than they were 100 years ago. I agree that things must be worse now than a century ago but I really don't see an increase in the signs when it comes to pseudo-spirituality.

>>18438352
>I agree that things must be worse now than a century ago but I really don't see an increase in the signs when it comes to pseudo-spirituality.

Do you live under a rock?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qAXMctpVeJE

>>18438360
What has this to do with psychic powers and so on? Is more like a mockery of religion. As I said, there is no increase in counter-initiatic groups, and the old ones are weaker. This seems similar to the situation of war, people expected more world wars after WW1 and WW2 but nothing like that happened. Is this the peace before the final storm?

>>18438379
You/we have a very different understanding how these things evolve.

It is for example easy to see how the Ascended Masters of Theosophy and Alice Bailey in Modern times have evolved to the Galactic Federation and UFO masters of recent decades

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanat_Kumara
>Later authors who draw from Theosophical teachings such as Alice Bailey and Elizabeth Clare Prophet have added to the story with further details. He is usually depicted as having the appearance of a 16-year-old boy, said to be the incarnation of the Will of the Logos, and purportedly possesses an unaging body not born of mortal woman

But these days they are found in groups like these:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanat_Kumara#Ashtar_Galactic_Command_Flying_Saucer_Fleet

These news came about 6 months ago:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/weird-news/former-israeli-space-security-chief-says-extraterrestrials-exist-trump-knows-n1250333
>A "galactic federation" has been waiting for humans to "reach a stage where we will understand... what space and spaceships are," Haim Eshed said.

Do you follow the news at all? The Seven Ah-I of Blavatsky were nothing more than the Seven Counters or Sages of Counter-Initiation and the same Seven Rays of Ascended Masters of Alice Bailey

And these days they are associated with more modern "galactic federation of light" with UFO/Alien implications.

>>18438379
>>18438394

And keep in mind how much Alice Bailey has influenced United Nations, even the United Nations Prayer Room is designed by her Trust (Lucis Trust)

They are also heavily associated with the World Health Organization

>>18438394
>Do you follow the news at all?
no
Hmm, this is interesting.

>>18435496
>>18435200
In islam you could have an unlimited number of female slave provided you win them in a war or buy them with money.
But if she gave you kids they will be yours too and she and her children will not be your slaves anymore.

>>18437311
>>18437284
have you guys noticed how these groups advocate for anti-natalism? this is one of the most intriguing aspects i find. it cannot be only due to environmental concerns, it has to do with some evil reason about de-humanization/break of natural law. if i see a group of people or a person advocating for anti-natalism i know right away they have been co-opted by counter initiation.

>>18438567
Agreed, my other big thing is the dissolution and blurring of distinct forms. I feel like I was noticing that all "leftists" and liberals do it for years before I had a concept and words to describe it. No matter what it is, leftists and progressives want to break down everything that exists, knock down everything that's standing, blur everything's lines of distinction with its neighbours, unite opposites just for the sake of uniting them, overturn or invert things just for the sake of it.

Trannies are a fascinating sign of the times. Not even the most basic essentialisms are respected or allowed to be felt naturally. Every stable aspect of existence has to be literally flayed into shape, to suit the petty desires of the most retarded degenerate proudly anti-intellectual lowlifes, a clear inversion of all hierarchy.

>>18438610
>Trannies are a fascinating sign of the times

yes. in upton's book about comparative eschatology he writes
>Interestingly, St Nilus of Mount Athos, in the 19th century, also mentioned cross-dressing as an apocalyptic sign; and I would add that since polarity is the principle of all cosmic manifestation, the erosion of sexual differences is a clear sign of the dissolution of earthly humanity

upton's source is the orthodox book 'Ultimate Things: An Orthodox Christian Perspective on the End Times'. another passage in pic

>>18438610
True but you must not fall into the modernist dialectic trap. Don't become a "reactionary", don't react to what leftists do or say. For example, leftists hate colonialism. Should we like colonialism? No. Leftists hate national-socialism. Should we like national-socialism? No.
Leftism is bad and so is rightism. Just keep your religious traditional views, don't engage in political debates. This is what I do. I am not assuming that you are a "right-winger" but I felt that this is a good opportunity to say what I just said.

>>18438394
This is interesting. Do you have any recommendations for further reading?

>>18438641
yes. not that anon but to fall from the spiritual to a political sphere is precisely the intention of counter initiation, it is the inversion. counter initiation is defined by the desire to actively transform the world. all of the counter initiatic groups revolve arond this. i believe anon above is well aware. one just has to look at /pol/ to notice degeneration proposed as tradition, and evola is being instrumentalized to this end --- one of the reasons i believe evola was a counter initiation agent, perhaps unintentionally.

"Everything begins in mysticism and ends in politics"

>>18438653
Read the book False Dawn by Lee Penn

A great study, but perhaps a bit superficial

>>18438671
Available from Sopia Perennis

>>18438671
Thanks, anon. Much appreciated.

>>18438665
Seems kindve odd if the movement into politics is trying to organize society in a way that is pro-initiation?

>>18432679
is this incel very pathetic or impressive for how far he goes to get pussy? idk anymore

>>18438610
They're trying to force non-dualism. Unable to see unity in all, they try to bring about a sensible, ersatz, unity.

>>18432700
>SEA
of course
congratulations to this new based trad couple

>>18432683
Yeah, not doing that is some gringo or cosmopolitan nonsense. As a random example, Laszlo Polgar's mother was the one who hooked him up with a wife willing to go along with his crazy experiment.

>>18438843
I don't think he did all that just to get pussy. A bigger drive was likely to get away from modernity.

>>18438737
Which movement into politics?

>>18438873
he wanted to get away from modernity because modernity meant no pussy for him. that’s what all tradfags are motivated by even if they refuse to admit it. pussy. even they become ascetic and try to root out their desire for pussy or take advantage of some 70 IQ third world girl who is disgusted by you but a passport is a passport

it’s all about PUSSY also ywnbaw

>>18438942
t. hylic

>>18438883
Evolas

>>18439002
have sex

>>18438567
>have you guys noticed how these groups advocate for anti-natalism? this is one of the most intriguing aspects i find. it cannot be only due to environmental concerns, it has to do with some evil reason about de-humanization/break of natural law.

I honestly think it is just absolute demonic hatred of the hurman form itself. Be it true transhumanism or some other disintegration like tranny mutilation of the human genitals: the end game is to destroy human form itself and all human life itself

>>18437108
you make a good point anon
the advaitist vs buddhist debates in every guenon thread are such a fucking snoozefest
the quality ITT significantly improved after your post.
I just recently bought a book by Jennifer Upton (somehow related to Charles Upton - I think wife) called Dark Way to Paradise: Dante's Inferno in Light of the Spiritual Path. I'll report back next week with interesting findings and compare it to Guenon's Dante book

>>18439143
Even though I own several books Upton (Vectors of Counter-Initiation, Cracks in the Great Wall, System of Antichrist) and recommend those books, he seems like some sort of Guénon for dummies or some extremely Americanized version of traditionalism and does not seem too educated man himself. Not saying "non-academic" approach of his writing is bad, he just comes off as a bit simpleton, but that being said, I do enjoy his books and the point he is trying to put across.

There is also lots of some boomer jargon in his books. I for example don't want to read some poetry of Rumi in a middle of some book as a metaphor, Frithjof Schuon had this same type of writing style which I really dislike when contrasted to Guénon who is in my opinion no-nonsense type of writer and does not type anything irrelevant.

That being said Upton and his wife are a weird couple. Charles himself was a hippie type in the 60s or 70s who went through some Tibetan initiations and used lots of psychedelics and was heavy in the hippie scene/whatever holistic medicine and converted to Sufism/Islam and his wife is Orthodox Christian.

I really don't want to diss the man, but some of his videos convey me this image of some boomer who is not quite there in terms lucidity, especially if you watch his video rants on Youtube. I mean certainly a relevant fellow, but somehow too mellow and boomerish to be considered one of the 'greats'

>>18439197
I actually didn't realize it was his wife when I first purchased it. i've been interested in Dante lately and the book was in my recommended section on amazon.
>Charles Upton's YouTube videos
Agree, he's a total boomer. I don't like how he writes out his speeches and reads off the screen. It's a snoozefest

>>18439197
what do you think about Tibetan initiations?

>>18439226
I am not a fan. Especially those related to Kalachakra.

The Shadow of the Dalai Lama is a good book on this matter. It is extremely politicized and they may have sinister intentions for their presence in the West.

>>18439365
>The Shadow of the Dalai Lama
i've read that book - the translated English version is all online.
The Japanese doomsday shit was the most interesting part IMO desu. now THAT is countertradition to its core:
http://www.trimondi.de/SDLE/Part-2-13.htm

>>18439377
>http://www.trimondi.de/SDLE/Part-2-13.htm

It is interesting to note tha Kundalini aspect that many counter-initiative organizations have common with. Especially the Tibetan empowerments and others that are concerned with the Serpentine Force.

This is more than often, a common theme, and usually they promise some sort of "short cut of initiation" by activating it by physical means through either tummo practices or some other psycho-physical regime.

>>18439426
I live in bumfuck USA but there is a legit Tibetan Buddhist monastery and cultural center which the Dalai Lama visited
should I go investigate bro?

>>18439430
If I was you, I would not let them touch you. They are concerned with what is known as the electric current of man and many of these empowermenets are conferred by touch etc.

Don't let them touch you, it might be disastrous for your aura.

>>18439440
>>18439430

Animal magnetists control people through touch and it is one of the oldest methods of mind control

Felix Kersten was personal massager of Himmler
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felix_Kersten

He had extreme power over Himmler because of his magnetic hands (I've read several biographies of him) and he was taught this method by the Chinese

It is a manipulation of certain energetic regions of man.

>>18439440
>>18439447
we shall continue this discussion in the next /trad/ thread.
idk if it was you or another anon, but the whole materialism could be used as a natural defense against psychic/magical attacks was an interesting bit and had me thinking about communist china.

>>18439426
what is wrong with snakes ?
africans are afraid of them

>>18439463
We will.

And we will destroy the counter-initiation.

>>18439688
The thought counter initiation can be destroyed is counter initiatic desu

>>18439802
I was just joking.

NEW
>NEW
NEW
>>18440045
>>18440045
>>18440045