/lit/ - Literature

>>17812353
not literature, please leave

>>17812353
Because the word of man is insufficient to translate it directly, so we run in circles with allegory and translation until the essence of the message is recognizable

>>17812353
Islam has an answer to that and many other Illogical Christian things, so just go with Islam ie., Christianity 2.0: The New and Improved Version

>>17812353
Did boogie2988 just BTFO all of Christianity? Oh my...I’m going to have to call based on this one

>>17812389
aisha

>>17812405
t. jealous

>>17812379
God's communication operates outside of the confines of human intelligence and can only be accessed in fugue states and delirious episodes of faith. translating His "Word" is an exercise of function comparable to turning a TikTok into an audiobook.

>>17812389
What is the Muslim answer?

he punished eve for being a dumb roastie and adam for listening to a roastie

>>17812424
>>17812379
>it not supposed to make sense!
is this how christniggers cope with their religion being a load of bullshit?

Why is it simply impossible for people to understand allegory
Why must everything be literal
I just don't understand it, the same thing happens with shakespeare and joyce
Why can't people understand symbolism?

>>17812424
>ancient retarded lore isn’t retarded, it’s just too deep for you maaaaaan

>>17812450
>t. Desert tribesman

>>17812450
Africa is the continent of future

>>17812456
>Why is it simply impossible for people to understand allegory
>Why must everything be literal
How do you distinguish between the literal and the allegorical parts of the Bible? Is the literal parts all the bits you benefit from?

>>17812353
God provides you everything you need, makes you ruler over his kingdom, makes you in his image. He tells you the only thing you cannot do, and then you do it anyway. Better question: why do humans think they don’t deserve to be punished? This a level of moral unaccountability you only find in faggoty zoomers and millennials.

>>17812424
>fugue states
Go rot your brain on some more podcasts, pal.

>>17812450
>>17812458
>>17812480
>seething mongs who've never had the experience of Christian ecstasy

>>17812480
>Better question: why do humans think they don’t deserve to be punished?
Who is able to resolve all this? A puny, flawed human or an omnipotent god that is perfect in every way imaginable? Why does there even need to be a tree? With a snake in it no less, all knowing in advance that this would be the outcome. Your god sounds like a fucking jackass and you sound like a cuck

>>17812353
>greentext format outside of 4chan
oh god do normalfags really?
disgusting

>>17812480
>why do humans think they don’t deserve to be punished
Because we’ve done nothing wrong objectively. At least the OT explicitly makes it clear that god is jealous and cruel.

>>17812503
The Christian ecstasy of making yourself a serf in a hopelessly corrupt and decrepit power structure? Thank goodness for that

>>17812469
>he can't think in paradoxes
Every part is both truth and allegory

>>17812520
‘Paradox’ and ‘wrong’ are not synonymous, sorry

>>17812507
>Who is able to resolve all this? A puny, flawed human or an omnipotent god that is perfect in every way imaginable?
Yeah, that’s the point of the crucifixion. Amazing you people can’t even go through the easiest maze

>>17812431
rape goats and literal children

>>17812530
Why can’t he resolve his own fuckup? Why does he need to perform a crucifixion, where I need to grovel at his feet in self-loathing, admitting to the fuckups he’s responsible for? Was this meant as some kind of knockdown argument? Because it sounds really fucking stupid

>>17812526
What? I know. It's not 'wrong' to believe that the bible is both literal and allegorical in all aspects, even where it seems like it must be one or the other

>>17812550
Let’s ask this in another way: did the story of Adam and Eve actually happen or did it not? Is it a historical event, or a piece of mythology?

>>17812569
Historical event. The earth is 6000 years old.

>>17812575
Okay, then you’re wrong, and a retard

>15 retards not understanding free will

>>17812585
Why are there even bad choices to choose from to begin with?

Dubs and boogie dies

>>17812379
Wait what language did they speak in the garden? Didn’t they have direct conversations with god all the time?

>>17812585
free will doesn't exist, christcuck

>>17812508
Boogie is on /fit/ all the time

>>17812569
>Is it a historical event, or a piece of mythology?
The answer is yes

>>17812636
>or

>>17812353

>>17812628
>LE ATOMS??? I NEED TO SUCK A BIG BLACK COCK!!!!

>>17812653
take your meds

>>17812653

>>17812642
once again,
>he can't think in paradoxes
read Kierkegaard

>>17812653
Why are righttards always obsessed with big black cock? Could they be a tiny bit homo?

>>17812389
>makes fallen angel
Opinion discarded

>>17812353
are you getting your theology from fatman2988? really?

>>17812642
Exactly, so the answer is yes. It's historical from the perspective of God, but mythical from perspective of some humans.

>>17812682
It don’t care what Kierkegaard thinks, I care what you think. Explain it, in your own words

With Trump nearly forgotten are we circling back around to 2007-2011 atheism debates again?

>>17812692
So the bible is basically just schizo ramblings?

Boogie is as physically obese as he is mentally obese

>>17812686
>makes fallen angel
???

>>17812431
Some people seem to be answering the OP

>>17812353
>fat fuck who eats every single edible thing around him doesn't get the concept of self-control
I'm not surprised.

>>17812660
>>17812671
>>17812683
>you WILL take your meds sweetie
YOU WILL NEVER BE A FUCKING WOMAN!!!!

>>17812716
>>17812431
>Some people seem to be answering the OP
Lel, didn't let me finish. Some people are answering OP text, some are answering OP pics so I am unsure which one are you asking about.

>>17812710
Fallen angels were created as angels and chose to rebel. They were not created as fallen angels.

for the life of me I can't find it anymore I've tried several times over the years but my favorite interpretation of the Adam and Eve story is that God wanted to be truly loved by us and he knew that keeping us ignorant meant we could never really love him because we wouldn't know what it means to love him so giving us the knowledge of evil and kicking us out of the garden to suffer was a necessary step to making it so we could actually love him

>>17812364
I don't know if you know this but the Bible is literally a book

>>17812757
He could have just made us to understand how to love him naturally

>>17812775
>fuck my parents for kicking me out and making me learn to live on my own
>they could have just made me understand what it's like to do that while I continue living with them

>>17812768
so is my diary desu. Still not literature.

>>17812793
My parents are people, not god. That’s the point rofl

>>17812398
cringe, please stop saying based to anything you are devaluing the word.
I can't remember the last time this useless fat fuck has said anything of substance, much less something that was truly worthy of being called based.

>>17812827
based

>>17812728
Again, why are you so obsessed with cocks and trannies? Are you a homosexual?

>>17812353
>If the Bible is literally the word of God then why has it changed over the years?
Correct, it has been corrupted over the years, and thus it is no longer the true word of God.
>Why did God (in the Christian tradition) set up Adam and Eve for failure and thus eternal punishment?
Who knows? Christians love to hate themselves, and drive themselves to self-pity.
>Why did God set up Adam and Eve for failure and for eternal damnation?
The answer is that he didn't. The Quran teaches that humankind is greater than God's angels, because they have freedom of choice. It was never meant as a punishment to put humans on earth, but it is meant as a test. With great power comes great responsibility, etc. This is a much sounder doctrine than instilling the idea that humans are hollow, cursed husks of beings, destined from the get-go for their deserved damnation. In fact, Satan was punished for refusing to bow down to the superiority of Adam. In response, Satan deceived Adam and Eve. True, they disobeyed God, but they had the power to do so. The tree, by the way, wasn't the 'tree of good and evil' to give us the myth that seeking knowledge is impious. So God, the most gracious and merciful, immediately forgave Adam and Eve, and promised that they can return to Paradise (i.e. heaven = the garden) as long as try harder to keep God's commandments, in a more difficult life that will only make the reward that much sweeter. They will till the earth for a time under God's commandments, and return completely rehabilitated for union with God. And God promises that he will send messengers occasionally to remind them to listen to his commandments, (until one day, when the message is actually memorized by the faithful and exactly delivered to subsequent generations, which was fulfilled in the Quran) so that Adam and Eve's descendants can also return to Paradise. Finally, God promises that if someone hasn't been exposed to the truth, he will be judged only on his character (by a totally merciful God, no less) and will attain Jannah on this basis alone. There is no weight of 'original sin' weighing down humans for which they are destined to damnation. God just wants to make sure you're fit to join him in Jannah. Plus, imagine how much sweeter the fruits and flowing streams of Paradise are after one has lived through the trials and tribulations of earth.

>>17812692
>Exactly, so the answer is yes.
Makes no sense whatsoever. The answer to an or-question is picking one option, or explaining why another option is possible, not ‘yes’. You just can’t reconcile the claim of absolute truth that the Bible makes with the massive deviations we see between the claims from the Bible and what we observe in reality. This is basically just cope on your part

Imagine writing parts of the Bible and retards dissect every word of it to find meaning. The ability to scam the general populace is far too easy and acceptable. If it weren't for my own personal morals, I would have done this a long time ago. This is the major issue with every successful intelligent person. They all learn to justify their reason for swindling people.

>>17812867
>Correct, it has been corrupted over the years, and thus it is no longer the true word of God.
What parts, how exactly was is corrupted and by what ‘perfect’ version of the word of God do you assess all of this?

>>17812450
Africa has a faster growing poulation than Europe and Americas. Why not give a percentage of Christians in general population for each continent?

>>17812628
Then we would not be able to observe the double slit experiment... We do.

>>17812450
No wonder modern European and North American literature is so awful. Who are the best post 2010 Sub Saharan African authors?

>>17812901
Wait, I thought scientific knowledge was yucky materialist thinking, now when it confirms your worldview you suddenly like it?

>>17812905
Have you ever read any religious literature? By your logic that should amazing, yet pretty much all of it is God’s not Dead tier garbage

Because some sand people made it up 2000 years ago. Religious morals are just ape conventions to increase our group survival strategy. They change as our survival strategies change in relation to the changing ecosystem. Do people seriously not see this? It is so obvious I don't know how people even consider religious gibberish in modern times.

>>17812967
Natural serf tendencies that are presented as ‘rebellious’ and ‘edgy’

>>17812881
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_consistency_of_the_Bible
The Quran gives a few meaningful corrections, but Muslims generally accept that God didn't send the Bible down again for a reason. It could be that it's so utterly reconstructed that there's no use rehabilitating it. The stories and prophetic sayings in the Bible are based on true revelations, but Muslims believe that Moses, Isaiah, Jesus etc. were mostly delivering the same key points as Muhammed, and the Quran (plus Muhammed's sayings and actions) are sufficient to build faith on.
>by what ‘perfect’ version of the word of God do you assess all of this?
The Quran

>>17812353
Be fat
Try to lose weight
Keep eating
Gain weight

bottom text

>>17812988
You’re not an ubermensch just because you believe we wuz monkeys.

ignorance is bliss

>>17813005
??? We ARE apes. What else are we?

>>17812991
>the Quran
>a book on monotheism that never mentions Akhenaton, the very first monotheist
>where Allat, Manat and al-Uzza are occasionally legit when it’s expedient
>that foretells of Mecca becoming the eight instance of punishment by God, which didn’t happen, so his prophet had to do all the work for him, almost as if he doesn’t exist to begin with and the whole revelation ship is just a cheap ploy for power
>and which includes a final judgement that totally didn’t originate in the heathen mind of Zoroaster and that can happen any moment now, just trust the plan akhi

>he doesn't understand the hermeneutic circle

Whatever happened with him shooting the gun? He should be in jail.

>>17812967
genetic fallacy. philosophy 101, kid. get a grip for fucks sake

>>17813033
Adam was the first (human) monotheist
They aren’t
Incoherent nonsense
There are portents of the final judgement that have almost all appeared recently

>>17813054
I thought yelling fallacy was muh reddit, is reddit suddenly cool amongst trad larpers?

>>17813065
I could fuck your mom for fucks sake!

>>17813058
>Adam was the first (human) monotheist
Adam was a completely mythical figure that is demonstrably impossible to have existed, and was literally derived from the version of Canaanite polytheism called Adammu. Besides, who were Adam’s offspring, and how did they have kids?

God didn't "make a fallen angel". He made an angel who, by his own choice, fell. Likewise, Adam and Eve, by their own choice, ate the fruit. Why are you taking the theology of a man whose livelihood is based on playing video games and eating mayonnaise out of a tub?

>>17813086
>the first human is impossible to have existed
LOL

>>17813058
>They aren’t
That’s not what old Mo believed. Occasionally they were exalted cranes, whose intercession is hoped for. Of course, only when the polytheists outnumbered him, he was a lying huckster after all

>>17813100
bro like of course there was a first human and maybe he did live in a garden or whatever but his name was probably oogabooga or something so that means the whole story is completely false, like how could his name have been adam?

>>17813086
>mentioning the inconvenient fact that all abrahamic religion was rooted in canaanite polytheism
This kills the christfag.

>>17813033
I'm not here to proselytize, just offer a different viewpoint than Chrisianity.
>>a book on monotheism that never mentions Akhenaton, the very first monotheist
Islam holds that Adam was the first monotheist, because he knew God. If Akhenaton received a revelation from God (which he might've), it simply may not have been recorded, and God simply did not feel the need to tell his story to Muhammed.
>>where Allat, Manat and al-Uzza are occasionally legit when it’s expedient
This is universally accepted to be a temptation from Satan, and not binding. Muhammed is a human just like Adam was, he's not divine in any sense, and even he said that his salvation was not guaranteed
>>and which includes a final judgement that totally didn’t originate in the heathen mind of Zoroaster and that can happen any moment now, just trust the plan akhi
Again, messengers were sent to all people, so Zoroaster may have been rightly guided. However, the corrupted priestly structure of Persia turned Mazdeism into an engine of the state and of hierarchy.
>>that foretells of Mecca becoming the eight instance of punishment by God, which didn’t happen, so his prophet had to do all the work for him, almost as if he doesn’t exist to begin with and the whole revelation ship is just a cheap ploy for power
I'm not aware of what this is referring to, sorry

>>17813100
One that didn’t develop out of an earlier species? Yes, that would’ve been pretty much impossible, and would’ve given up the mother of all genetic bottlenecks

>>17813054
Genetic fallacy? What?! We have very good evidence to believe that morals are just survival tactics. We also found that other mammals have their own "morals". And that would mean that our own are nothing special, I.e, not from God.

>>17813109
The satanic verses aren’t canon

>>17813124
>we wuz monkeys n shit
here we go again

the nag hammadi is

>>17813096
bugmen can't understand free will and consequence of choice

>>17813145
>just survival tactics
Survival is pointless you dumb ape.

>>17812480
>This a level of moral unaccountability you only find in faggoty zoomers and millennials.

You should try reading your own holy book.

>>17813109
The only mention of the three goddesses in the Quran is to tell the listener to beware of idols. Far from being an accepted or "expedient" intercession, they can only misguide the believer.
>Now, have you considered ˹the idols of˺ Lât and ’Uzza, and the third one, Manât, as well? Do you ˹prefer to˺ have sons while ˹you attribute˺ to Him daughters? Then this is ˹truly˺ a biased distribution! These ˹idols˺ are mere names that you and your forefathers have made up—a practice Allah has never authorized. They follow nothing but ˹inherited˺ assumptions and whatever ˹their˺ souls desire, although ˹true˺ guidance has already come to them from their Lord.
>Or should every person ˹simply˺ have whatever ˹intercessors˺ they desire? In fact, to Allah ˹alone˺ belongs this world and the next. ˹Imagine˺ how many ˹noble˺ angels are in the heavens! ˹Even˺ their intercession would be of no benefit whatsoever, until Allah gives permission to whoever He wills and ˹only for the people He˺ approves.

>>17813115
>it simply may not have been recorded, and God simply did not feel the need to tell his story to Muhammed.
How very fucking convenient
>This is universally accepted to be a temptation from Satan, and not binding.
Again, how very convenient
>Again, messengers were sent to all people, so Zoroaster may have been rightly guided.
He believed in two gods, so probably not
>I'm not aware of what this is referring to, sorry
The seven stories of punishment, none of which involved the prophets going to war with the polytheists without any indication of Gods assistance. Only in Islam does God never bother with anything that can’t be explained by natural means, almost as if there hadn’t been enough time to create miraculous events as there had been in the previous installments of Abrahamism. By the way, I didn’t even mention that Abraham building the Kaaba isn’t mentioned anywhere except in the Islamic tradition, and that it’s pretty well established that the Sabeans built the Kaaba for their moon goddes Almaka, which is probably where the name Mecca comes from

>>17812389
islam has a cope that bibel has been corrupted which is contradicted in quran itself.

>>17813195
>By the way, I didn’t even mention that Abraham building the Kaaba isn’t mentioned anywhere except in the Islamic tradition
That’s because only the Islamic tradition is true :^)

>>17813153
>here we go again
With what, established biology so robust even the most ardent fundie doesn’t bother with trying to replace it with creationist retardation?

>>17813145
how dumb you have to be to not understand that's not an argument?

>>17813207
Christcucks aren’t really “ardent fundies” (at least the whites) because they understand christcuckery is bullshit

>>17813191
Again, this was ‘revealed’ after the polytheists had ceased to be the powerful majority, not before. Even your prophet knew that shitting on the faith of the Quraysh and the memory of their ancestors was a bit dumb.

By the way, the justification for starting the jihad is also pretty damn hilarious, and is rooted in the sentiment of justified revenge of Surah 22:39, but non-believers are magically not allowed to do the same thing back to you? This is why Abrahamists are hated so much, because you’re such a bunch of power obsessed hucksters, just like the prophets you idolize

>>17813195
>How very convenient
Yes, in fact, it was convenient to leave him out. The Quran contains exactly what it needs to contain, so that it can be memorized and recited by believers for all time. This guards against textual corruption.
>Again, how very convenient
I mean, Muhammed was just a vehicle for God's word, and for the creation of a religious community. Here we see Muhammed attempting to slacken his message to include the nonbelievers (he is human, after all), after a false revelation. He immediately realizes what has happened after hearing Gabriel correct him. Then he makes things MORE DIFFICULT for himself and his community by offering no compromises. This only strengthens his message. I don't see what's so "convenient" for him.
>He believed in two gods, so probably not
Zoroaster? No he didn't. There's a reason we call him a monotheist.

>This is why Abrahamists are hated so much
Ah yes the commie shows his true color

>>17812353
Imagine Shigeru Miyamoto bringing his son a copy of super Mario brothers. He explains how to play and gives his son the controller, and the son immediately just runs into the first goomba.

Suddenly The son loses all faith in his father completely and pretends he doesn't exist.