/lit/ - Literature

>>17676155
pretencious, self help, scam: and every possible combination of these

>>17676155
stoicism = christianity = faggotry and cuckold

>>17676173
>>17676179
This is you brain on coom.

>>17676155
>criticisms of stoicism
I'm just tired of every MBA student pushing stoicism into meme land.

>>17676173
>pretencious

there's a story in attic nights that i can't dig up rn about some dude traveling on a ship with some hot shot stoic guy and they end up in a storm and the stoic was scared to death, so the author concluded it was a self-help scam even back then

>>17676184
>posting ugly cumdumpsters
>iphone filname
Wow... so this is stoicism....

all the "in tune with nature" shit is kinda weird, especially when a lot of stoicism involved strictly defying natural impulses to rise above nature. its possible i didn't read enough to know what exactly they were getting at. all in all i feel like pretty much everything positive stoicism had to offer seems to have been distilled into christian philosophy

>>17676155
It's ancient boomerism, pick yourself up by the bootstraps spoken by bearded men in togas so it seems deeper than it really is. It's really quite shallow. Epicureanism mogs.

>>17676226
From what I've been reading, Christianity seems to have taken a lot from Stoicism. I'm not a religious person, but I can appreciate the underlying morals of Christianity. That's part of the reason I have been reading about Stoicism, because I wanted some kind of moral guidance in life and it seemed appealing.

>>17676229
What makes Epicureanism better?

Crazy how stoicism makes you losers seethe so much. They aren't hurting anybody.
New age broStoics on the other hand are very lame.

>>17676229
Nietzsche mogs both.

>>17676244
>They aren't hurting anybody.
You say that like it's a good thing, that's not very life-affirming of you, dud.

>>17676226

I too, enjoy paraphrasing Nietzsche and pretending I came up with the idea independently.

>>17676242
It's more fun. Stoicism is too stodgy for my taste. Maybe when you're a dried up cynical old man it would be of more benefit to you. Young people shouldn't read Stoic philosophy.

>>17676233
im certainly no expert on stoicism but yea, from what Ive read so far, Christianity kind of encapsulates all the really important and tangible aspects of stoicism with its moral philosophy and presents it in a really elegant way, like mans intellectual advancement causing us to break off from nature and leaving us with our inherent sinfulness in the form of our leftover animal impulses that often conflict with living in a more civilized and advanced society and cause us problems

>>17676260
you severely overestimate how well read I am

>"You won't turn to drink, will you? You stoic types often do, when disappointed in life."

>>17676272
And then bundles it with absolute faggotry in the form of theism

>>17676251
go home freshman.

>remember that you are an actor in a play, of such a kind as the director may chose; if short, of a short one; if long, of a long one: if he wishes you to act the part of a poor man, see that you act the part naturally: if the part of a lame man, of a magistrate, of a private person. For this is your duty, to act well the part that is given to you: but to select the part, belongs to another
Give me a break desu. Only freedom being that one is aware they are playing a role in an already written script.

>>17676293
Stoicism is already faggotry, theism is just a cherry on top. Marcus Aurelius was a literal cuckold and his son was a useless faggot.

>>17676155
non really,m. its a decent system of action that is widely applicable across many different philosophical and theological systems.

>>17676295
NAA.

>>17676297
>if you're born poor, remain poor just because
what a dull, fatalistic view

>>17676297
... is it wrong? or are you saying determinism isnt a thing?

>>17676297
I have no other criticism of stoicism because the rest is just platonism.

>>17676155
Seneca is the only stoic worth reading because of his comfy stories and his entertaining style. All the other ones are dull as fuck.

>>17676310
>pointless determinism vs. free will argument #734,745,646,121

>>17676293
eeh im not religious myself but I dont think its all that bad. give people good healthy advice for living their best lives, then light a fire under their dumb asses so they have a reason to defy temptation and stick to it even if they are a lowly uneducated dirt farmer who doesn't understand why its good for them and their mind is screaming at them to do something wrong, and you have the added bonus of a strong cultural bond that helps hold people together

>>17676306
>talks about greeco-roman self help philo
>rando baby’s first philo pips up with Neitzche for some unknown reason even though anyone from Spinoza to Deleuze would be equally as applicable in their temporal distance
a tale as old as time

>>17676155
How dare you create a philosophy that is practical and made by high achievers who are qualified to give advice on life and not some mentally ill person locked in his room or a private teacher that lived a mediocre life. Oh and it has some ties to christianity? Haha deboonked.

>>17676310
A beggar can become a land owner. An unlearned man an adept of the mysteries.
Do you resign yourself to being a poor, unlearned man because that is your given role? Or if you decide to no longer be a poor, unlearned man was that not also a progression of your role? If the first you cant achieve the second.
Its not an argument against determinism but becoming a victim to the idea.

>>17676325
>qualified to give advice on life

>An unlearned man an adept of the mysteries.

>>17676322
Deleuze's whole career is build on misinterpreting Nietzsche, without him he's nothing.
And Nietzsche's critique of stoicism is crucial to his philosophy, have you even read him at all?

>>17676315
of course it would get into shitflinging, but the only objection to this way of seeing things >>17676297 is in a non determinist world veiw.
is a

>>17676308
I really dont think thats what its saying mate, im pretty sure hes saying you shouldn't sperg out about it and make your situation worse if youre born poor and have no way to better yourself, not that you should just give up and never try to better yourself

kinda crazy how the anti-stoic posters here are so bizarrely stupid with comments like this and "dude just dont care about anything" tier stuff

>>17676325
>made by high achievers who are qualified to give advice on life
How come Marcus Aurelius's son was a fucking faggot and a useless caesar then?

>>17676339
>born poor and have no way to better yourself
that situation does not exist

>>17676325
>bro stoicism is based because um strong greek smart men and oh yeah christianity
>imma just ignore all the other schools of greek philosophy that had a greater influence on christian theology
>its totally not just because smart gym bro on twitter posts quotes from stoics

>>17676344
hang yourself

>>17676335

>>17676359
you being a NEET doesn't count, sorry

>>17676344
I highly doubt real class mobility exists for literally every human being on earth but that isn't even the point of my post, the point is that the quote is not telling you to just give up and never try to do better, its just saying that needlessly lashing out in self destructive ways about your station in life wont help you, and you will be a lot better off if you keep a cool head and work towards your goals instead of wallowing in self pity and bitterness

"Philosophical discussion can go on either /lit/ or /his/, but those discussions of philosophy that take place on /lit/ should be based around specific philosophical works to which posters can refer."

>>17676337
> And Nietzsche's critique of stoicism is crucial to his philosophy
cool maybe that would be applicable in a Nietzche thread. guess what retard? a personal struggle with stoicism was also a crucial part of plotinus and a dozen other notable philosophers philosophies too. But noone is talking about fucking Spinoza.
>Deleuze's whole career is build on misinterpreting Nietzsche, without him he's nothing.
and Nietzsche has roots in Schopenhauer, and Schopenhauer in kant, etc etc. what is your point here?
> have you even read him at all?
what gave you the implication that i didnt? all im saying is that its funny how many newfags drop N boy at the drop of a hat at the mear mention of greaco-roman stuff.

newflash, EVERYONE IN WESTERN PHILOSOPHY was influenced by the greco-romans.

>>17676380
>critique of stoicism is irrelevant in a thread where OP asks for critiques of stoicism
This is your brain on DUDE BOOTSTRAPS LMAO.

>>17676373
you can specifically suck my dick

brutish

>>17676184
She is so ugly. Can't believe she has so many simps.

It's adherents are dumbfucks.

>>17676155
It's very anatema to juvenile political larping. It has also been adopted by a bunch of money hungry sociopaths at SV and WS.
Understandibly young people, and especially those who are not doing well and want to chage things - often in a retatded way- don't like it.