/lit/ - Literature

you keep making this thread about this book but you haven't even bothered to read it.

are you mentally ill?

>>16931523
I've never made a thread before on this and I checked the catalog and there wasn't one about it.

>>16931523
Also I've ordered the book but it still hasn't shipped yet.

looks pretty based

>>16931470
Looks good. This sort of power analysis is really good at fucking with progressive "bottom-up" narratives

>>16931470
That's a great title, I'd read it but I already know too much about the subject to find anything of value therein. Spoiler alert: it's Jews.

>>16931470
I'll save you guys 20$
pic related

>>16931470
culture-wise, really nice, as most of the pinetree bros are on twitter
statistic-wise? don't be too excited, this guy probably doesn't have a degree in basic mathematics and doesn't know how to analyse basic statistics
pro tip: when entering a debate with any vaush-type trans advocates read pic related and take potshots at their studies

RENT
FREE

go read some real literature

>>16933357
only thing trannies live rent free in is the coffin they're laid in
only time they're ever laid as well lmao

>>16933372
rent free

>>16933053
>"fuck capitalism" is co opted, monetized
which leads to what?

>>16933372
sick burn

>>16933382
Are you glad someone thinks about you

>>16933053
What's wrong with woke capitalism?

>>16931470
I can't refute the philosophical and scientific arguments surrounding transgenderism, so I'm just going to make up an elaborate conspiracy theory about it being funded by pedo elites: the book

>>16931470
>exposes the actors financing the instituionalization of transgendedrism
How many -steins happen to congregate in this group merely accidentally?

>>16933889
It's like capitalism, but also woke.

>>16933909
There are no sound philosophical nor scientific arguments for transgenderism and you know it. And it being a conspiracy theory doesn't mean it's not true, genius.

>>16933935
If capitalism can be used to achieve the needs of trannies why should they reject it?

>>16933413
To more capitalism.

>>16933947
>There are no sound philosophical nor scientific arguments for transgenderism
Egoism

>>16933954
Because that's not possible, capitalism will use trannies to achieve its ends, not the other way round.

>>16933959
That's an argument but not a sound one.

>>16933963
How is that not possible? Trannies need HRT, they need healthcare, surgery a capitalist could certainly get into the business of pursuing a profit for these things
>capitalism will use trannies to achieve its ends,
Like what? Why should anyone have problems with capitalism if it can be used to achieve their ends?

>>16933909
>conspiracy theory
I fucking love science too!

>>16933969
Explain

>>16933975
>How is that not possible? Trannies need HRT, they need healthcare, surgery a capitalist could certainly get into the business of pursuing a profit for these things
No, they need mental health care. Can be done without capitalism.
>Like what? Why should anyone have problems with capitalism if it can be used to achieve their ends?
But you can't use capitalism to achieve your own ends. Capitalism always ends up using you to further capitalism.

>>16933975
They don’t need any of those things.

>>16933981
Technically it's correct, but that can explain away anything.

>>16933959
Egoism is a poor argument for transgenderism, as much as it justifies the ego's freedom to identify however it wants it also is free to behave however it wants and so fails to justify why anyone else should or would acknowledge that gender identity or the elaborate morality trannies have constructed around it.

The endgame of egoist philosophy is not trans anarchism, it's 300 boomers stomping on your head while they call you a faggot.

>>16934007
Um, no? Egoism asserts the individual is the measure of all things. Egoism is a great argument for being trans because the individual decides why they are trans, and they may do this because it brings them happiness. Being a woman often means people treat you differently, and they change in attitude towards you which may make you happy. You could also enjoy the physical features of being a woman or a boy if you so please.
>so fails to justify why anyone else should or would acknowledge that gender identity
There are plenty of people who accept that gender, sex are both phantasms that are completely subjective to what philosophical axioms one individual uses. An individual may accept that you're trans, and treat you as a woman, because you love them, and want to see you happy, you enjoy the mental stimuli of pleasure that comes from that bond. And so do they.
>The endgame of egoist philosophy is not trans anarchism,
Egoism is nominal, it is unique the individual's ends and circumstances. It does not even have to be anarchism.

I'll look at it but what does the concept 'industrial complex' really do here? The idea of a Military-Industrial Complex is that the military as a branch of the government is intimately intertwined with (commercial, private) industries, namely arms manufactures - but what analytic insight is gained by putting 'Tran_gen___' and 'Industry' into a 'complex'? Is it a 'complex' or an 'industry'? If the latter, the former term can be dropped. If the former, then the conjoining of 'tran_' and 'industry' couples two disparate objects, making the idea of a 'complex' ill-suited.

>>16934007
And more so, the "justification" of egoism stems from power; this can be emotion or physical
>. Who has not deceived the police, the law? Who has not quickly put on the appearance of respectable loyalty upon encountering the sheriff’s henchman, in order to hide an illegal act he may have committed?
>You long for freedom? You fools! If you took power, then freedom would come of itself. See, one who has power stands above the law. How does this view taste to you, you “law-abiding” people?

>>16931470
>rich shitlibs put their money towards progressive causes
Shocker. There's no grand conspiracy, it's literally just redditors with weak minds believing tranny memes explain why they're depressed and nihilistic. Go on reddit, go to r GaySoundsShitposts, sort by top and see for yourself. There's frequent themes in the memes that even the most heterosexual of normies can have a light giggle at/find mildly relatable. Eg: anime, playing female characters in video games makes you trans, the idea that you don't have to feel trans to be trans (they call people that oppose this notion truscum), identification of various popular media characters as actually trans, "wholesome" posts about teens discovering that they're not actually depressed - just gender dysphoric. With being a tranny established as normal and positive, it's incredibly easy to get grasping depressives to attribute their problems to being the wrong sex. Not to mention that the depressive soon to be transvestite enjoys being part of a small, eccentric group. This is basic group dynamics, people will bond over the most trivial of similarities (eg: playing female characters in vidya), and from there they can convince themselves of more and more signs of faggotry in their youth so they fit into the cool club more

>>16934038
Yeah and my ego's telling me trannies are disgusting perverts that in any just society would be stoned to death, that would bring me great happiness. This is a major problem I see with twitter egoists, they are always some kind of deviant that expects a 100% individualist and amoral society would be completely flexible and accommodating to their specific neuroses, rather than violently intolerant of them.

>>16934084
>Yeah and my ego's telling me trannies are disgusting perverts that in any just society would be stoned to death, that would bring me great happiness.
Yeah, and you feel that way. The trannie can ignore you because obviously some angsty 4chan nerd isn't going to ever do that , I can use what power I have to eliminate you if you a threat to my well-being
>This is a major problem I see with twitter egoists, they are always some kind of deviant that expects a 100% individualist and amoral society
Egoism may reject if they have the courage to do so, or if it is in their interests.
>In my humble opinion, those who come to engage in debates of consequence and who challenge accepted wisdom should expect to be treated badly. Nonetheless, they must stand undaunted. That is required. And that should be expected. For it is bravery that is required to secure freedom.
Also, I don't understand why you're complaining about twitter egoists being deviant - you do realize Stirner explicitly defends murder if it is the interest of the egoist? Anything goes, it is a war of all against all.

>>16934106
>The trannie can ignore you because obviously some angsty 4chan nerd isn't going to ever do that , I can use what power I have to eliminate you if you a threat to my well-being
Not that anon but you realize in an anarchic society most mentally ill, psychotic people like transsexuals would be clearly marked as (easy) targets, right? It's not about '4chan nerds', most normal people, and those with the most virility to assert their dominance would stomp all kinds of deviants out of existence.

>>16933352
>, this guy probably doesn't have a degree in basic mathematics and doesn't know how to analyse basic statistics
Statistics isn't maths.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1cpA4M0Hgo

>>16934118
An egoist does not need care about society though. It can, as Stirner did, rejects it. More so, it doesn't even have to waste its time with hypotheticals because these are speculative endeavors. A trannie will do whatever they need to secure their interests be in manipulation (which works very well) or force. Again, bellum omnium contra omnes

>>16933909
>Are you a man or a woman? A man. Then adorn yourself as a man, and not as a woman. A woman is by nature smooth-skinned and delicate, and if she is covered with hair, she is a prodigy, and is exhibited at Rome among the prodigies. But the same applies to a man if he is not hairy, and if by nature he is devoid of hair, he is a prodigy; but if he cuts it off and pulls it out, what are we to make of him? Where shall we exhibit him, and what announcement shall we post up? "I'll show you a man who would rather be a woman than a man." What a shocking spectacle!
TROONS BTFO

>>16934106
So you see then why egoism is a poor argument for transgenderism, it doesn't justify the ideology itself only the liberty to believe in it and fight for it, while also in equal measure justifying the ability to oppose it and fight against it. This isn't a successful resolution of the problem, it just concedes to remove it from the realm of philosophy and into the realm of brute violence. Thus proving anon's point
>There are no sound philosophical nor scientific arguments for transgenderism

But anyway, I hope you get your egoist society and a troop of actual women drown you in a toilet the first time you try to use a public bathroom.

>>16934133
Anon, trannies are less than 1% of the population. By many estimates real trannies might be less than 0.5% of the population. In an anarchic state you're talking about a group of 1.5 million trannies across the entire contiguous US vs. potentially 10s of millions liable to view it as so disgusting that they should be forced out, and killed if they bring it up with kids.
>An egoist does not need care about society though.
That's not the fucking point anon and you know it. In anarchic societies this is negotiated by force. Trannies don't have the necessary force to prevent those who don't like them, who are in the majority, from stopping them.

>>16934133
Stirner didn’t live in an anarchic society genius. If he he had, you probably would’ve never heard about his writing in the first place.

>>16934145
>Im, it doesn't justify the ideology itself only the liberty to believe in it and fight for it,
Ideology is often justified through force. Christianity, liberalism, pretty much any wide spread ideology was justified through conquest, state violence, family violence, some authority imposing it unto you.
>This isn't a successful resolution
It certainly is; the rights that transgender people have now, especially in the United States, can from violent struggles. It works well.
>hope you get your egoist society
Well, I don't need an "egoist society" to get what I want - just need to use whatever skills I have to secure what I desire.

>>16934161
This is retarded because Sitrner was not interested in an "anarchist society" ; he was interested enjoying his life into death dissolved him. The Unique And Its Property in fact rejects society; its nilhistic egoism concerns itself in the antinomian; it does not argue for the creation of a society, but for the egoist, the individual, do whatever it needs to do to survive in whatever social context it lives in.

>>16934174
>the rights that transgender people have now, especially in the United States, can from violent struggles.
They literally didn't. There has been essentially no widescale violent struggles in the US in favor of trans rights of any kinds. The "rights", really privileges, that trannies enjoy are a result of prominent ideologues being moved from the top-down into positions of authority in psych and social orgs and forcing through regulatory allowances.

>>16933909

>>16933975
They need a bullet

>>16934192
Not even remotely true; Black Lives Matter for example backs transgender lives, and their rallies are mix of violent, non violent direct action.
>that trannies enjoy are a result of prominent ideologues being moved from the top-down into positions of authority in psych and social orgs and forcing through regulatory allowances.
And that's perfectly fine. Whatever works, works. The egoistic trannie doesn't care how its done; as long as its done.

I accept transgenderism on the condition that transracialism, transagism, transheightism, transspeciesism, transintellect, etc are also all accepted. Transgenderism is the stratification of sex into a physical, measurable component (biological sex) and an almost spiritual, subjective, identity-based one (gender). There is nothing logically wrong with this on the condition that all other objective measures of one's individuality undergo the same stratification. Ethnic makeup/racial identity, age/mental age, species/identified species, height/mental height, IQ/intellectual identity, and so on. There's no argument I've ever heard for the sex/gender divide that doesn't also apply to those.

If those stratifications aren't accepted (there are some pretty good practical reasons they shouldn't be), none of them can be. This is simple. It's time for progressives to prove they mean what they say by going balls-to-the-wall, or else the time to retract the claim has come.

There any fucking proof youre born the opposite gender? Seems like its almost entirely socially constructed ironically enough

>>16934244
I’m surprised you’re asking seriously. You know the answer.

>>16934174
Tranny

>>16934039
The observation is that "Trannyism" is a problem that is actively created entirely by a combination of government and corporate forces. In short, by making people have certain sexual desires, and creating a religious-ideological drive to self-mutilate, they create people who will consume certain products. They're creating a demographic. It's an intertwining of corporate, government, and academic power.

Yes, the title is totally just playing off of "Military-Industrial Complex", where "the military starts wars because corporations want to sell them shit", we can describe a "Medical-Industrial Complex" that "makes people sick so that corporations can treat them".

The book goes into how this works, names names, and details the movements of large sums of money to make this happen.

>>16934158
Never said anything about an "anarchist state" which is an ironic play on words, and egoism does not have anarchistic and Stirner never called himself an anarchist; he was only called one after his death.

>>16934235
>BLM's stance on trannies is anything more than an equivalent 0.5% of their position
>Blacks support you drilling a hole in your abdomen and calling it a vagina
huhuhuhuhahahahahahHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
BLACKS WOULD FUCKING CURBSTOMP YOU IF YOU TRICKED THEM INTO FUCKING SOME FAKE VAGINA
HAHAHAHAH
BLACKS FUCKING HATE TRANNIES AND GAYS DUMBASS, THEY'RE RESPONSIBLE FOR LIKE 99% OF ANTI-LGBT HATE CRIMES
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
BLM IS A CORPORATE INITIATIVE RUN BY A FUCKING JEW YOU FUCKING IDIOT
AAAAAHAHAHAHAHA
BLM IS NOTHING MORE THAN A SCREEN FOR THE CURRENT ANTI-GOVERNMENT SENTIMENT
AAAHUEHUEHUEHUE
YOU'RE A FUCKING IDIOT!

>>16934191
Then why are you using him as an example in regard to the question of living in an anarchist society? If your implication is that Stirner, and thus the tranny, wouldn’t exist in an anarchist society but would rather just reject society altogether, that seems to me a complete and total fantasy not grounded in any reality at all. Stirner existed in society and inherently had a relationship with it, whether he liked it or not and to the other poster’s point so would a tranny, whether they like it or not.

Transgenderism is a vile spiritual sickness. Keep them away from children and normal people. They exploit people's natural altruism so they can larp as their sick fetish in public.

>>16934274
You do realize Stirner attacked anarchism in his book right... he was explicitly an opponent of Proudhon and mocks him through out the book. I use stirner as an example because he is the fundamental author of egoism. You keep calling Stirner an "anarchist" when he never was... his rejection of humanism would run into conflict with many forms of anarchism which actually does call for some sort atheistic providence - which Stirner had no interest in.
>>16934272
You okay bro, you seem triggered

>>16934286
>Laughing
>Triggered
Your retardation is extremely funny and you've done a poor job hiding it.

>>16934174
Ideology is impressed through force, this is true. But that's not necessarily justice is it? If you're going to claim that something is just then that's a normative claim that it's good, or at least that it's a true and valid argument (i.e the conclusion follows the premises, not the nonsense twitter usage of "valid"). It's entirely possible that something that is de facto law could be unjust, as trannies believe many laws are, or it's even possible that justice is a spook, but it's not possible that we could derive an ought from an is - what "might makes right" claims amount to.

Violence can achieve many things, even if it's not possible that might could make right it is true that might makes reality. And this is why it's foolish to believe radical individualism and amorality is a path to the society trannies desire. The only reason them, gay people, women and the like have the rights they do in the west is because we live in a liberal society that affords the weak and the few rights and protections from the strong and the numerous. And violence can end a liberal society also, all the majority must do is realise their chains to end it in an instant.

>>16934298
Dude, you're literally alogging like a sperg because someone told you BLMs is an effective conduit for transgender rights. Like, and they overwhelmingly vote for Democrats who do support these rights. Like, you just don't live in reality, and this is what happens when you circlejerk on 4chan all day. You probably still think Trump won the 2020 election

>>16934301
>Ideology is impressed through force, this is true. But that's not necessarily justice is it?
One does not have to care about "justice" in abstract. Justice is a nominal value that is unique to the individual. I decide what my "justice" is, and I decide what I may do to pursue it.
>Foolish
This just misses the point; this isn't about "society" this is about securing your interest regardless of what stands in your way. If it takes manipulation, theft, murder, etc - so be it. One does not have to care about anything else but themselves.

Allahu Akbar

>>16934306
You know so much less than you think you do. BLM is run by a fucking Jew, it's not a black civil rights movement. It is a corporate initiative. It's not a conduit for anything because its fundamental purpose is to act as a mediator between Capital and poor Blacks. It will never achieve anything for trannies (or blacks either) because it is a money-making and power-generating initiative that targets anti-government protestors, not an actual anti-government initiative.
>B-but they vote for dems
Ah yes, the Democratic Party
Cracker, nigger, cunt, or jew
With Dems you can all kill arabs too!
The Dems don't give a fuck about trannies, both parties only care about cementing a central power apparatus and expanding American dominion
>Trump
I don't give a fuck.

>>16934306
>BLMs is an effective conduit for transgender rights
But it's not. That anon was right, blacks hate trannies more than any other group does. It's almost as retarded an "alliance" as the white SJW feminists and muslims.

>>16934339
I don't if its ran by Jews; I have no problems with Jews. I'm not an autistic anti-Semitic; I love people like Soros because they do, pursue things that are within my self interest.
Instead of sperging, look at the data:
https://www.prri.org/press-release/survey-americans-increasingly-support-transgender-rights/
Stop being emotional and think critically. This isn't /pol/, nigger.

>>16934341
It is effective, see the actual data, and actually look at the expansion of transgender rights in the recent decade
https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/very-lgbtq-decade-gay-marriage-trans-rights-rainbow-wave-n1107901
Like, again, you don't really live in reality.
>>16934350

>>16934339
>>16934350
>>16934354
Tranny lol

>>16934354
>see the ((data))
Sure buddy. Trannies may think they're making inroads, but when they get too powerful the blacks will turn on them without a thought. You're the one who doesn't live in reality.

>>16934362
Sounds like cope

>>16934350
God you're retarded anon. Blacks make up 13% of the population. Even if they all vote democrat and everyone else votes 50/50 D/R, then you're still looking at a max of ~26% of D voters who are black, which are significantly less than the "no" reporting on the study you cited. It's provably true that blacks are way more hostile to gays than trans, it's fucking common knowledge. You cannot establish with a simple D comparison
1. That voting democrat actually means trans rights are expanded
2. That this means blacks support trannies.
You're clearly the emotional one, and not thinking critically at all. The fact that you cited this study as evidence when it clearly isn't relevant is clear indication.

>>16934286
I’m not saying Stirner was an anarchist or advocated for anarchism even though we could have a debate about it. What I’m saying is that you specifically picked Egoism and then cited Stirner’s rejection of a society to give an example of how a tranny could use Stirner’s philosophy but you did it in response to a challenge about a specifically anarchist society. Moreover, you really failed to explain how it at all supports your idea that Stirner’s egoism and Stirner’s “rejection of society” is at all adaptable for a transgender, anarchist society or otherwise. What I want from you is to explain 1) how Stirner rejected society and 2) how a tranny could co-opt egoism to do the same. I don’t care about anarchism.

>>16934306
Okay, this was all just bait. Now it’s obvious.

>>16934373
Nothing you said refuted what I provided. I showed how transgender individuals have gained rights in the last decade, and this was largely due to Democrats who have a large voting block among blacks. What you're saying is clear non-sense, and this is largely due to the fact you are a /pol/tard, and you do not know how to argue. The fact of the matter is blacks are a significant portion of the Democratic coalition, and their personal feelings about transgender individuals has little impact on what actual material gains trannies have gained in the last decade.

>>16934354
>Expansion of trans rights
Literally no expansion of trans rights is listed in that article you illiterate retard.
The only thing that could possibly qualify is the repeal of the ban on trannies in the military, which was also instated DURING THE PERIOD IN QUESTION.

>>16934324
You see if you read and addressed my argument as a whole rather than digesting select ADHD-sized micro-fragments like a redditer you'd see how I've already addressed this. That's the point of a paragraph, it can include more info than individual sentences and words.

Here we can see where you were already refuted. The central claim you're making is every man for himself, I simply take that to its conclusion - tranny holocaust.
>It's entirely possible that something that is de facto law could be unjust, as trannies believe many laws are, or it's even possible that justice is a spook, but it's not possible that we could derive an ought from an is - what "might makes right" claims amount to.
>The only reason them, gay people, women and the like have the rights they do in the west is because we live in a liberal society that affords the weak and the few rights and protections from the strong and the numerous. And violence can end a liberal society also, all the majority must do is realise their chains to end it in an instant.
I dislike this kind of hand-holding, and I find this very reddit style of fragmented argument very boring, so I won't reply further. But fundamentally your position is already incoherent by insisting that one can opt-out of society, while still being completely reliant on society.

>>16934386
See: >>16934387
Everything you listed as an expansion of trans rights is either directed at gays, not trannies, or was a return to status quo in response to a change made during the period in question.

>>16934379
No, this is peak illiteracy. I was clarifying the argument of Stirner's "anarchism" which is irrelevant to the point at hand. Egoism is adaptable because egoism is belief that the individual is the measure of all value. A transgender individual, like all individuals, are egotistical and pursue self interests. A transgender individual has self interests in keeping themselves alive, happy, and sheltered. Using egoism, rejecting societal norms on gender rights, they will value things that achieve these goals, and use their power to do so.

>>16934396
Kinda falls flat when half of all trannys commit suicide LMAO

>>16934396
Yes anon, no one is disagreeing that trannies have a self-interest in staying alive. But you cannot derive ought from is or visa versa. In an egoist society trannies out to act in their self interests, survival. That doesn't mean they will survive, because enough others find their actions reprehensible to pose a problem to their survival.
No one is arguing that egoism actually means trannies can't be trannies. They are saying that under egoism, everyone who hates trannies also gets to act in accordance with their self-drive, which is to stop trannies from living.

>>16934411
Based
BTFO

>>16934395
>>16934387
Are you stupid? Do you not realize that transgender rights are directly tied to acceptance of gays and bisexual people?
https://www.govdocs.com/supreme-court-1964-civil-rights-act-protects-lgbt-employees-from-workplace-discrimination/
When gays get rights, these rights are also applied to transgender people. Civil Rights broad applications of legal rights; they don't specifically apply to one group. Maybe you're retarded don't understand how legal precedent works? More so, Biden won the presidency, and has explicitly talked about expanding transgender rights and undoing Trump's anti-LGTBQ policies.

>>16934424
Lots of gay people fucking hate trannys

>>16934424
See this anon:>>16934425
You're so fucking naive. "B-but biden said he'd expand our r-rights!" Yeah, and Obama said he'd enact single payer healthcare. Biden flip-flopped so frequently during the primary alone, not even the election, that you're a fucking idiot to take him at face value.
You cannot apply arguments granted to gay people as arguments granted to trans people because you are arguing that acceptance of trannies is driving an expansion of rights. Therefore those things granted to trannies that are driven by acceptance of gays alone are not applicable to the argument you are making.

>>16934387
A retard like you would say that the Civil Rights Movement did not result in the gain of rights for black people because the Civil Rights and Fair Housing Acts didn't not specifically mention black people... even though the statute is broadly defined to cover them. You actually made this argument in a smug way and are doubling down on this retardation unironically.

Trannies are just weapons of Globohomo in their war against the straight white male and his family.
But this will backfire eventually because muslims and other non-white will not be purged as easily as the white beta cuck males.

>>16934437
Um, this is a real cope though because Obama administration allowed them to serve in the military and had executive orders on the books that were against the discrimination of transgender people in housing.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/01/politics/transgender-homeless-shelters-rule-change-ben-carson/index.html
You're just not saying things that are tangibly true; you are making emotional arguments, not factual ones.

>>16934439
See:>>16934437
You can't argue that act A which aims to benefit group X and also benefits Y by happenstance is an indication that acceptance for group Y drove the enactment of act A. There is no indication that, for example, acceptance of trannies was what drove the enactment of marriage equality, which benefitted trannies by happenstance. Most people were presented with it as a gay-rights issue focused on gays and lesbians. There is a clear argument that acceptance of gays and lesbians is what has driven the advancement of gay rights in the last two decades. Similarly, there's a clear argument that acceptance of blacks has factored into legislation that supports them, even when that legislation hasn't mentioned them by name. But it would be a hard sell to say that rising acceptance of the Japanese was what drove the existence of the Civil Rights and Fair Housing Acts.

>>16934449
>"The evidence you cited isn't applicable"
>That's not true
>"It's provably not true based on the evidence you cited"
>N-no, look at this new evidence I just added! You're emotional!
Faggot, I don't track US gay rights laws, it's not my fucking hobby. This is /lit/, not /lgbt/. If you have evidence fucking cite it if you want me to analyze it.

>>16934388
This argument is autistic... you're just sperging out about how trannies are gaining their rights, and the conditions that allow it; when I'm saying I'm okay with that; I don't have any moral standards on how its done.
> insisting that one can opt-out of society, while still being completely reliant on society.
Yeah, what are NEETS? What are criminals? When I talk about "society" I'm talking about the generally accepted norms; I'm making the argument that being sociopathic is certainly a valid way of living in society, but rejecting its sacred obligations. See, one can simply use society to their own ends, and don't necessarily have to accept the common interests, or beliefs, of society.

>>16934480
>Yeah, what are NEETS? What are criminals?
Completely reliant on society?

>>16934463
>You can't argue that act A which aims to benefit group X and also benefits Y by happenstance is an indication that acceptance for group Y drove the enactment of act A.
This is irrelevant because that isn't my argument. My argument is that inter sectional groups, like BLMs, have actively acted as conduit for the expansion of transgender rights. Their activism has led to the broad expansion of particular civil rights statues to apply to transgender individuals. This is true, especially if you are familiar with the statues under the Obama Administration in which Civil Rights Act, as provided by the CNN article, shows how it was used to protect transgender people from discrimination in schooling and housing. What you're saying is irrelevant because the statues are real, and they provide a real, measurable benefit to transgender individuals. The ACA, for example, explicitly prevents the discrimination against transgender people in healthcare. These are examples of how movements, which are eclectic, can have broad strokes across many different groups.

>>16931470
Any PDF in sight?

>>16934488
Yeah, in a way that benefits them; and not society... that's the point. NEETS manipulate the system to get what they want off the backs of others. They certainly benefit more than wage cuck who goes to work every day to pay for his check.

>>16934509
Hmm, how could a philosophy like that backfire on weak and mentally ill people that are totally reliant on society to survive?

>>16934498
You're confusing the systems response to brought opposition to the effects of individual oppositional agencies.
1. Black CR groups demand rights
2. Gay CR groups demand rights
3. Government gives both rights
The conclusion from this is not intersectionality. Black CR groups are not responsible for gay civil rights. The combined pressure may have been enough to force the government to make a change and it chose to address both issues, but while the combined effect was enough to move the government to action, the individual effects are not the efficient cause of either outcome. Had an equally strong lobby existed for Asian civil rights at the same time, the impact would have been blacks and asians getting rights. That doesn't establish intersectionality. That establishes that sufficient power is required to force the government's hand, and it can therefore be beneficial to move for civil rights at the same time. But it doesn't generate an interest for blacks in particular to support gay rights. Just for blacks to support other oppositional groups to increase their proportional strength.

>>16934533
I mean, do you really think society is going to just disappear one day in an instance, or if it was disappearing slowly, people would not learn how to adapt? Like, this is just a really one-dimensional, retarded way of looking at things. Think Rhizomatically

>>16934551
>Magically these problems will resolve themselves, don't worry about it!

>>16933372
Kek

>>16934537
No, you're making a strange insistent on what group supports what morally and that's irrelevant. I don't care what blacks support in abstract, I'm interested in what they do, and if they vote in a way that is meaningful for transgender individuals. All of what you're saying is speculative and not a basis of what has actually happened to transgender individuals in the United States.
For example, women getting the right to vote was also a mixture of different racial groups; black and white women hated each other, yet, when the 19th amendment passed; they both got the right to vote. What you're doing is making a moral argument; as opposed to me who is making an empirical one that shows how these moves did intersect, and how the broad application of these movements had externalities that did have an impact on people. Lincoln may have hated black people, but his actions certainly did change their lives.

>>16934537
>Black CR groups are not responsible for gay civil rights
Correct, government and corporate power are. The entire modus operandi of "democratic" power is that those with power justify doing whatever they please by some group's incredibly minor problems and using them as the "will of the people" in order to do solely what benefits themselves.

>>16934558
You have to be retarded if you think there is a such thing an ideology can predict every thing that happens to an individual. There are too many environmental, genetic variables to consider. Life is all about experimentation, trial and error. You may not like the answer; but that's really your problem.

>>16934581
>and then, for no reason at all, the state will just wither away!
lol

>>16934447
Not at all, Whites are the only people with any degree of resistance to this garbage by virtue of being one of the only three groups with any coherence. You're either a Jew (and as such are pure and holy), White (and as such are wicked and sinful), or a BIPOC (and as such are a seething morass with no identity other than what Globohomo tells you). By percentage, there's far more BIPOC pyrsouns of faggotry than there are Whites. This shit gets pushed on them HARD, and they crumple to it.

>>16934551
I don't think you even know yourself what you think "society" is. As long as the human population is greater than 1 there will always be some kind of society. The only reality in which it's conceivable society doesn't exist is one where humans are extinct.
I frequently think about how in medieval times Jews were hated in part because they represented the power of the king, were it not for the king's laws and soldiers then Christian peasants would have already lynched them all. Anar-trannies would do well to think about that too.

trans poster is right. trans are manipulating people at their will. and they are doing it very good.
but i doubt the transgender movement have this egoist mindset. in fact they are making new spooks with a enormous smile in their face. a trans egoist knows he is not trans in the end. that´s the point.

>>16931470
good thread op, many mad trannies in replies

>>16934615
>and then, for no reason at all, the state will just wither away!
Not a Marxist, in fact,
>Communism rightly rebels against the pressure that I experience from individual property owners; but still more horrifying is the power that it puts in the hands of the collectivity.

Egoism takes a different route for eradicating the propertyless rabble. It doesn’t say: Wait and see what the board of equity will—give you in the name of the collectivity (because such a gift has always taken place in “states,” each receiving “according to desert,” and so according to the measure to which each was able to deserve it, to earn it by service), but rather: Seize and take what you need! Thus, the war of all against all is declared. I alone decide what I will have.
>>16934615
I could not care less about "society"; I will exhibit sociopathic behavior to pursue my self interests until death dissolves me and every day around me. I will work with Jews, assassins, rapists, thiefs, anyone I wish who will mutually work with me to pursue the things I want in society.
>there will always be some kind of society.
And there will always be people like me who have the courage to struggle against it.
>Freedom is no fairy gift to fall into a man's lap. What is freedom? To have the will to be responsible for one's self.

>>16934569
>Moral argument
It's not a moral argument you stupid faggot, it IS an empirical argument. In making the statement that event X is contingent on event Y, not simply that event X caused event Y, but that event Y is CONTINGENT on event X, you have to establish that event X and only event X can lead to event Y.
In assuming that black votership for democrats is beneficial for trannies, you are stating that the outcome of black votership and increasing black rights agitation is necessarily beneficial for trans groups. This simply isn't true. You're pointing at trees and making them the forest. Being allowed to serve in the armed forces won't matter. The vast majority of trans people don't serve. It is a symbolic gesture. The vast majority of trans persons need protections at home from people who will enact violence on them. How do you think that's going to work when inner city police forces are defunded and replaced with unarmed social workers? There is a necessary conflict between greater home rule for blacks and greater protections for trannies. Therefore literally the only way you can defend black agitation as beneficial for trans is by stating that it's necessary for trans rights, and then you have to establish that in some way trans rights are contingent. They simply aren't. "Dems benefit trannies" doesn't mean blacks are good for trans because they vote democrat. The interests of blacks in voting democrat contradict the interests of trannies. Frankly, if blacks didn't vote democrat period, the Democrats probably would support trans rights even more.

>>16934644
>In assuming that black votership for democrats is beneficial for trannies, you are stating that the outcome of black votership and increasing black rights agitation is necessarily beneficial for trans groups. This simply isn't true
Yeah, I already refuted this argument by showing how Democrats favor LGBTQ+ individuals. The law, because of these voting patterns, apply to them. You seem to have never taken a civics class, and you don't understand how statues apply.
>How do you think that's going to work when inner city police forces are defunded and replaced with unarmed social workers?
What does this have do with trannies? Like, it just seems you're trying to impose your autistic moral philosophy unto the conversation when it has little to do with the topic at hand. LIke I said, there have been results that benefit trannies from their actions, and I have no problem in benefiting from these externalities, unintentional consequences.

>>16934644
>Being allowed to serve in the armed forces won't matter.
Why? Trannies get benefits from working in the military; you get retirement benefits, a wage, social security benefits... a retard like you want to tell me this doesn't matter? Like, having money to do things with my life doesn't matter to me when I use it to pursue my self interests? like you, do you realize how stupid you sound

>>16934661
>Logical induction is autistic moral philosophy
Anon, how fucking old are you?

>>16934667
>NOOOOOOOO YOU CAN'T TAKE MY COOKIE AWAY
>I DON'T CARE IF YOU'LL GIVE ME A HUNDRED COOKIES IN FIVE MINUTES I WANT MY COOKIE NOW
>I WANT COOKIES NOW REEEEEEEEEEEE

>>16934667
>ACA's transgender protections don't matter even though they allow transgender people to have access to healthcare to live longer
>Housing discrimination protections for transgender people don't matter even though they allow them to less likely be homeless
>Job discrimination protections for transgender people don't matter even though it makes it less likely they will be fired for their gender identity
Like, this is a really fucking argument you're making; and its just even coherent. These are real, tangible impacts that do effect peoples' lives. Incredibly retarded of you to say otherwise; and all of this is possible because black people put Democrats into power to pursue these things. So, you really need to get a better argument.

>>16934669
You're not using logic though, autist. See my continued points in
>>16934684

>>16934675
what are you even trying to say bro

>>16934669
The fuck does social workers and police have to do with transgender rights, retard, what is the logical induction from this red herring? I'm not really interested in your autistic conservative philosophy about the police; this discussion has nothing do with it.

>>16934684
It's not the argument you utter retard. The argument is that these things would be equally possible no matter whether blacks were voting Dems into power or not, so long as blacks voted Dems into power. In essence, that Democrat victory is contingent on the black vote. It simply isn't. The Dems could pursue entirely different strategies and appeal to different populations and still win. Instead they stick with Blacks, who in fact are opposed to trannies and want increasing home rule to act freely in their own districts, which likely will lead to increasing attacks on trannies by blacks since the police presence will be greatly reduced.

You're too retarded and short sighted to see this because you're focused on scraps and not on the fact that if the police are defunded any trannie walking in suburban Detroit will probably be beaten to death by roving gangs of hoodlums.

>>16934720
>so long as blacks voted Dems into power
So long as anyone voted Dems into power

>>16934720
>>16934720
This does not reflect reality, retard, I just gave you multiple examples >>16934684 how intersectional movements, by Democrats & BLM, has led to the activism that has secured, and benefited transgender interests. You are making a moral argument stipulating that the Democrats could do something else, but currently they are not. The Democratic platform is clearly invested in the transgender voting black as per the actions and the DNCC's actual platform that explicitly pushes for the rights.
Instead, you want to be an idiot, and autistically make this special pleading about how "OH ITS NOT REAL SUPPORT, IT DOESN'T MATTER" when just isn't the case because it does matter and it does impact the lives of people in ways that measurable. You're complaining essentially how its done, and not realizing it doesn't matter, you functional retard. This isn't a battle of sacred principles; this is a battle of interests and securing them. And, unfortunately for you, the outcome you are pleading isn't what lines up with reality.

>>16934720
The other point about police, which is really a retarded tangent, is not even relevant because one police are not legally required to defend your life. The individual, ultimately, is responsible for what they do with their body. LIke, you keep drawing up autistic hypothetical scenarios that are not necessarily reality based. Just being a sperglord randomly using conservative tropes like a wannabe ben shapiro about open carry Detroit Michigan doesn't really help you when you make your points as if you have room temperature IQ.

>>16934761
I'm not arguing morality you fucking retard. I'm not saying the Democrats "should" do anything. I'm saying that the present situation is a result of many groups with many different agendas and you're just assuming that magically all of these groups will continue to support your troon ass because you're confusing the political equivalent of a cat chasing a laser pointer with legitimate support.

I've tried to be as clear as possible with explaining that this is about your inability to establish a trail of facts that shows that black civil rights in any way has an interest in furthering your own rights, and you keep deflecting it into
>So, uh, you're saying ACA was bad?
>So, uh, you think CRA had nothing to do with blacks?
Instead of actually contesting the points
You are an autistic teenager. I am not going to keep wasting my fucking time here.
Dilate, kill yourself, you will never be a real woman, etc.

pic related, is me for even having this fucking argument with you.

>>16934796
You absolute fucking monkey; it has nothing do with magic; its is literally out convenience; nothing lasts forever, and currently the support structure is working as of now. It may change in the future depending on the peculiar circumstances ahead, and one may adapt. That is fine; that's what politics is about, retard, making deals and changing tactics depending on the context.
>You are an autistic teenager. I am not going to keep wasting my fucking time here.
Yeah, because you've demonstrated you can't argue with a clearly more intelligent and more educated opponent. Good to see you taking the L, and your absolute failure to actually contest or counter any of my arguments. At least you were smart enough to run away before I made you look even more stupid; which wasn't even that difficult to me because I destroy faggots like you all the time. Don't ever, in your life, think you can step toe to toe with me because you clearly can't and you never will.

>>16931470
>Transgender industrial complex
.......
>drag queen story hour
>sex education
>big gay
going to go ahead and not read this.

>>16933889
Nothing. The trots are just raging because they can't use black/gay/trans rights as a lightning rod to draw people to unwittingly support socialist policies in the background any more.

>>16933988
>No, they need mental health care. Can be done without capitalism.
This was attempted before HRt and SRS became standard and it done nothing.
>But you can't use capitalism to achieve your own ends. Capitalism always ends up using you to further capitalism.
stfu and get a job.

>>16934219
>/pol/ colours
have sex

>>16931470
It's a worse rehash of Adornos The Culture Industry that specifically focuses on the transgender movement being absorbed by Neoliberal Capitalism because the movement has wide support and ad culture and corporations want to form an enotional connection with the movement and their products. For profit.

>>16934828
All egoism and trannys will die off in a generation
You exist only because of the mercy of the common man.

I guarantee you this thread is almost entirely Americans. If the book isn't American then i'll give you all a fiver.
What the fuck is the correlation between Empires in decline and trannies?

>>16935015
>What the fuck is the correlation between Empires in decline and trannies?
You really don’t see how a stable state would impress stable values onto its people and if unstable would result in instability among its people? It would extend not just to economics but obviously the tendencies and affinities of people also. Transgenderism is inherently material since it relies entirely on the means to chop your dick off, which may or may not even be available depending on the state you exist in relation with. Also, is it not obvious that there’s a moral and ethical component to empires in decline? Whether it’s causal or incidental doesn’t matter because it obviously exists. Maybe it’s not the case but it’s not so absurd to say that it can lend itself to transgenderism in the 21st century.

>>16935015
Bro, trannies are everywhere in England too.

>>16935120
Is this more of an angloid phenomenon?

>>16935124
Probably, which means in 10 years it will be an everywhere problem.

>>16935124
Yes, the Anglo-American conception of liberalism is the most severe prerequisite and thus lends itself to the phenomenon the most.

Also, to be clear, this belief that "anarchism" is intrinsically tied to egoism is complete fucking stupidity. Aristippus, Nietzsche, Spinoza, Ayn Rand were all proponents of ethical egoism, and their egoism certainly had little do with anarchism. Stirner's egoism no different, it does not necessarily imply anarchism, certainly some anarchists could use his theories for that,especially when he was called one after his death, he never explicitly called himself one; his understanding of egoism can be used in a way that compatible in a with an ethical theory that sounds the foundations for nihilism, existentialism, hedonism, perspectivism, individualism, psycho-analysis; this was never a discussion about the arguments for or against anarchistic humanism, I really do not care about your autistic obsession anarchist politics, it is not relevant to my interests.

>>16933372
Holy based double burn

>>16933889
>What's wrong with [adjective that denotes celebration of shittiness and degeneracy] [ideology/societal structure most conducive to shittiness and degeneracy]?

>>16931470
>Marx predicted Capitalism would require and eventually run out of new markets in order to sustain itself
>Capitalism turns out to be completely unstoppable, invents entirely new dimensions for markets
>Capitalism now involves convincing functional human beings they are deformed and getting them to buy replacement hormones and surgeries to mutilate themselves, all of which require lifelong commitment and consumption to maintain
>Capitalism concomitantly involves the counter narrative to these people and the counter narrative to that and so forth down an endless rabbit hole lined with souvenirs for the apocalypse and dissolution of society
>reaching the bottom you just pop out the other end of the Earth and find yourself in China as gravity reverses and it all starts over
You have to admire it. What a fucking leviathan.