/lit/ - Literature

the worst part is knowing how much of a better education I got on what matters without paying a dime. biggest fucking scam in this country's history

>>16753892
peak to be american

>>16753900
I agree. Maybe it's just autism, but independent learning has been so much more valuable than university. What a fucking naive, spendthrift loser I was to have even considered the degree as a good idea. I would have learned more working various jobs those three years while reading on the side.

>they will still let you attend their debtfarm and become a good little paypig

now step back from the situation and take a fresh look at it, with this in mind. don't bring in any assumptions whatsoever about the normal or necessary state of what a university is, or what the people running it think. now that you see it's a debt farm for paypigs and a way of vetting/hazing/thoughtcontrolling future managerial class members, just as a thought experiment, ask yourself: what if this was the plan all along?

what if any residual educational function of the university system in recent memory was merely PERMITTED to continue, so long as it didn't conflict with the paypig farm and elite-vetting process? what if the plan was, all along, to slowly slough off even the remaining educational functions? what if the people running the show are total psychopaths?

now ask: what if those people are suspiciously closely related to people who have also managed to dissolve private property ownership, normalize credit card debt and "mortgages," lower taxes on the wealthy and learn how to hide their money in tax shelters, and so on?

>>16753892
>The only people who didn't feel that way were probably the ones who knew what their career or career-focused Master's degree would be, e.g., the future teachers, journalists and academics.

Therein lies the problem you stupid motherfucker. College isn't meant to be high school: part 2 electric boogaloo. It's to get a required degree for a profession you're interested in. You should have taken a gap year after high school to figure that shit out.

The people who think college is solid are those attending it for themselves. Don't expect to be spoon fed. Get up and pursue it. Speak to professors who you want as mentors and recommenders. Apply to fellowships and internships. Prepare for grad. school or law school or med school while you're still in college.

>>16753926
don't listen to conspiracy theorist morons like this. the US is known for crony capitalism and that saturates every aspect of your life in this crummy country. it's not just universities. it's also why students coming out of universities are the ones advocating for the government to do something about the disparities between the volume of education debt and wages that have not adjusted for inflation over time, as well as exorbitant living fees. It's why people hate Boomers.

>>16753926
I don't buy a grand conspiracy, unless you can provide that 75% of university heads or education policy tsars are whatever then it's just lazy scapegoating.

However, on your wider note, I agree that this process is probably a result of the "neoliberalism" (as I understand the term) which has left everything needing to justify its existence and assign itself a relative cost for existing. The very idea that some other countries allow their young people to study for free, or that even twenty or thirty years ago university fees were quite low, is so beyond the reality I am acquainted with that I struggle to accept such things occur. The idea that your society somehow has your long-term welfare in mind, or that you can benefit from membership within it without having to become a lifelong debt slave, is truly a utopian idea.

>>16753957
>conspiracy theory
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krP6eJZehSw
https://escholarship.org/uc/item/0sg0782h

>>16753937
I agree that I should have figured that out and studied something more practical, but it doesn't change the situation. Someone who studied the same degree forty years ago in my country probably wouldn't be as fucked as I am now. Maybe it's naivety, arrogance, parental coddling, cultural / political quixotism. It remains the case that in the 1970s and still today in many European countries, university fees were either non-existent or relatively low. Did those societies fall apart because of this?

>>16754004
>I agree that I should have figured that out and studied something more practical
I'm a lit major but I'm also going to law school

>>16754004
Literally the nordic countries don't make debt slaves of their citizens like America does of its citizens. They're fine. They're not collapsing. American is objectively shit. It's not you. It's the country.

You can still become a teacher. Professor, perhaps. Go on to graduate school even.

yes, college is meant to be a slave-making machine

yes, college is no longer about learning but about paying the salaries of the professors that work there

yes, if you can learn it in college, you are replaceable

yes, you don't need college for curiosity and learning

yes, you are paying thousands of dollars just to attend college and watch youtube videos with ads

yes, college classes are consesus based, not truth based

yes, there are (albeit stupid) students who have bachelors still working at cuck minimum wage

yes, college is taught at the lowest common denominator

yes, college degrees are zero-sum status-based games

yes, your taxes are paying for retarded people and sluts to attend college, essentially wasting your money

yes, if you had spent your college tuition on the stock market, you would actually be making more money than the average cuck salaryman

yes, you don't need college to meet brilliant people because you can literally talk to them on media or email them

>>16754033
you went to a terrible college, I see

>>16754041
most likely

i live at an extremely liberal state, and the college is one of the top in that state

which is unfortunate because i do like the idea of college, not the current execution of it

>>16753892
You have to jump through bullshit hoops to get by in the world one way or another.

>>16753892
u sound like a sardonic religious isolationist

>>16754030
Teaching in my country is notoriously shit-tier. If you are studying EngLit, it's eight thousand pounds for a Master's and even after that you will be working fifty hour weeks if you are lucky. The teachers I have spoken to can't wait to retire, and many drop out either to find another career or due to stress. Academia is pozzed and you will be lucky to wake up at the age of thirty-five with anything more than a part-time contract at some obscure university.

I feel like this board is full of people who got bullied out of university

>>16754075
lmao, college has the highest concentration of twinks i have ever seen

>>16754041
>Heh you didn't even go to the good tranny training center with 85% diversity hires

You're gatekeeping something that isn't even yours. Go post in the dark academia thread, it's for you.

>>16754068
god fucking damn. condolences, brother

>>16754033
>yes, there are (albeit stupid) students who have bachelors still working at cuck minimum wage
That's less about college and more about unreasonable employment standards these days. A B.A. is worth as much as a high school degree now, whereas a high school degree is worth much less than it did decades ago. You need an M.D. or Ph.D. to get paid extra in academia. Fellowships and internships, on the other hand, get you higher pay and better chances at employment when you graduate.

>>16754062
Jumping through hoops or struggling is fine, but what I realise in retrospect is that I essentially set up more hoops for myself to jump through, and the kind of hoops that required me to change my perspective and ideologies (which were still at an early stage) to jump through them. The only reason I saw university as this important thing is because somehow I was told that getting *any* degree was a good way of finding a decent entry-level white collar job, but what is hilarious now is that many entry level jobs in my region, especially government jobs, specifically advertise to people without degrees in an effort to boost diversity or whatever.

>>16754081
imagine being bullied by twinks

>>16754088
what're you getting mad about?

>>16754107
Not surprised to find that anons are bullied by twinks

especially this one:
>>16754088

>>16754110
I'm not mad, I am letting you know that your instinct to defend the abstract idea of "college" anonymously because you went to a second-rate liberal arts college your dad pays for is pathetic. Columbia here btw. Notice how your instinct was to go "LMAO NUH UH NUH UH I BET YOU DIDN'T GO TO COLUMBIA" and not "who cares if you went to Columbia?" That's why you're a bitch.

I dropped out after one year. At least I'm only 7 grand in debt.

i write college papers for money so I've been keeping tabs on academia almost despite myself after graduating.

it's a business drone programming center, and where humanities are concerned, 80% of my assignments are checking off the boxes professors think qualifies as a vigorous education when it's just training people how to reproduce a style. you're not learning anything about the world, you're just learning how to talk in a managerial capitalist system. biggest waste of time and money in my life.

>>16754150
You might find the book Academic Discourse by Bourdieu interesting, it's short

>>16754150
How do you set yourself up doing that lucratively? Writing academic papers is my only skill in life.

>>16754126
i like how you assume that university is the exclusive province of rich children who could literally get a better lot in life through nepotism.

stop being a little bitch. his experience reasonably indicates an objectively bad college. op agreed. but go on - keep seething, snowflake

>>16754183
I see, so it was a third-rate liberal arts college. A second-rate would have at least taught you to read.

>>16754103
What annoys me about all of this is how meaningless and low-skilled many jobs are in general, specifically office jobs. I worked with people who all had degrees but whose jobs I could realistically do (as well as many who were far more skilled than I could hope to be). With these former jobs, which were quite well-paid but only required a sense of confidence, good humour, politeness, a decent grasp of grammar and a good work ethic, I imagine that maybe forty years ago they were the kind of jobs that guys found regardless of degree, because the company were willing to give a young guy a shot and train him up. Now you are competing with dozens if not hundreds of people for that same job, including many people who have spent a decade learning hyper-focused specific skills relevant to it. It's a nightmare.

What's more, many relatively low-paid but secure enough white-collar jobs, e.g., office clerk, have now disappeared thanks to software improvements and internet fuckery. You read about some poet, writer or screenwriter and how they worked a menial office job at a newspaper or something and were even able to support a family while doing so, but today that job doesn't even exist and even if it does it exists overseas or doesn't allow you to support a family of any size. It's like slowly the population is becoming drowned by technological advancement, with the unskilled the first to go under (e.g., suicide epidemic among white middle-aged blue collar men), while more and more people are nervously looking down and praying the water won't keep rising and drown them also. Not to mention the price of houses, the depressing state of love and romance, the inter-ethnic hostility, and whatever. It is all so depressing.

>>16753892
>being emasculated by a lecture on literature
You probably didn't have much masculinity to begin with desu

>>16754165
go trolling through craigslist and you might find a posting. it's easy money and it's even easier shitting on faggot profs and their faggot baby minds while sipping a beer in bed. americans, their thought, their minds, their language, are so ephebic

>>16754199
Nigga have you ever sat through an hour-long lecture about the female gaze, or decolonialism, or homosexual themes in the work of [conspicuously heterosexual author]?

>>16754195
Having a cushy job is a middle class luxury and you're expected to pay the expect tolls to earn your spot there.

>>16754183
it's astounding to me there are shitwits like you who still believe in college as a bastion of higher learning. probably the same type of faggot to grow up into a professor who still assigns prompts on the American Dream.

>>16754219
*Sorry, the male gaze.

>>16754193
seethe and cope

>>16754195
for sure. not to romanticize the past, but things have gotten worse for the common person and better for the rich. it's depressing. i honestly don't think life's worth living, but i keep on keeping on because i want to do something to change it for children. pick your poison, man.

>>16754230
another one. when did i say college is a bastion of higher learning? everytime another gremlin's blood pressure rises, i am graced by a moment of unrivalled ecstasy. maybe you should have college'd right or not college'd at all according to your career aspirations and then you'd be less pissed off everytime you look at the mirror. don't blame others for your mistakes. grow a spine, pussy.

This thread is really bringing out the tourists.

Remember, one in five people you are talking to on /lit/ is pic related. They come here to harvest "memes" for facebook groups. Some of them are literal trannies.

>>16754219
What do you find threatening about these topics?

>>16753892
i empathize with you greatly. wish somebody sat me down and said "college is what you make it. hit the books, major in the right thing, and network with positive people"

i majored in finance at a state school with no internships and im scrambling after realizing i suck at sales. all my peers who majored in engineering, accounting, nursing, etc. and who hustled their ass off doing internships and making connections are leagues ahead of me and ive accepted ill never catch up. the bright side is i went to community college first and graduated from uni with no debt.

the silver lining: we can tell young people about this racket and help them make the right decisions.

>>16754230
also, correction: an attorney, not a professor. nibble on my nutsack

>>16754300
you're a broad

I attended a 2 year college program for a trade ticket. It cost me $15,000 and I landed a job making 95k out of school.

And I still feel like I got ripped off. I don't know how some of you 150k+ indebted fuckers who got degrees in useless shit can wake up in the mornings

>>16754299
college is a huge milestone for sure. kids aren't properly informed on it or prepped for it. it's just ingrained into our culture that we should mindlessly attend it.

>>16754312
oh epic bro you found work with your hands like even literal egyptian slave niggers did 10,000 years ago lol

College allowed me to extend not having real responsibilities or have my soul crush by wagie jobs for four years so that makes it pretty good to me.

>>16754305
my bad i'll correct it:

you can nibble on my surgically installed nutsack

>>16754312
im on a full-ride scholarship, fortunately

>>16754327
>denigrating the noble laborer
Soft, effeminate hands wrote this post

>>16754345
lmaooooooo

>>16754345
yes the noble construction worker destroying his body to put up jewish condos

>>16754345
>implying being a laborer is noble
propaganda to keep the poor content with their meager lot in life

>>16754271
I'm hesitant to romanticise the past either, but in some ways the quite recent past was obviously a better place to live providing you didn't suffer from now-cured illness or whatever.

>>16754327

Not really. I operate power plants, 95% of my job is sitting in a control room monitoring the plant. The other 5% is knowing how to keep it from blowing up when shit goes wrong.

>>16754345
Look at them trying to justify their sneeding condescension for the working man by saying his labour is alienated from him. Tomorrow they will turn around and claim to be Marxists.

>>16754373
i agree. also, assuming you were white lmao.

this is why people hate boomers

>>16754376
Homer Simpson?

Careerism is for empty, vapid faggots.

>>16754369

>laborer
>poor

I've cleared 10k a week as a labourer with only a highschool education putting pipelines in the ground in northern Canada

I studied CS in Germany for free.

>>16754286
In abstract, nothing. But in the context of living in a highly pozzed country whose native ethnic population is being rapidly replaced (also mocked, undermined, branded as ignorant, evil, etc) the idea of studying decolonisation is just a demoralising ritual in which you are expected to either shut up or shit all over your ancestors.

The male gaze is again fine but you learn that kind of thing in the knowledge that raising an objection to it or offering the idea of a female gaze will get you doxxed and publicly shamed on the uni quad by a collective of mentally unhinged women, emasculated male allies, and otherwise normal girls who have been lured into playing along. This at a time when young women out-earn men, when females have a far superior position in the dating market, in corporate quotas, etc.

>>16754315
>it's just ingrained into our culture that we should mindlessly attend it

such a ticking time bomb. i remember telling my mom that i was thinking of dropping out of CC to do a trade. she freaked out and called all my relatives and i cant even describe it. it was like an intervention. like i was a fucking heroin addict. a total, visceral "i see though the matrix" moment for me.

my family was so proud when i graduated from uni but i couldn't erase what happened a couple years back. my mom saying "im disappointed in you. i expected more" to me just for considering becoming an HVAC or electrician. think about it: they would have been more "proud" of me if i majored in political science and ended up bartending than if i became a union plumber just so they can get middle class brownie points and don't have to people their son is blue collar or some shit. unbelievable. /rant over

they NEED to tell kids that there's only certain majors that are worth the investment. that if you can't handle engineering or comp sci, you need to switch to accounting, CIS, or supply chain.

>>16754299
What's wrong with finance? Can't you find a job with that?

It seems like the kind of degree that involves actually knowing something which is beneficial to a company.

>>16754385

Essentially, yes. When people ask what I do I tell them I do what Homer does. My actual job title is Process Operator and I'm ticketed as a Power Engineer (sometimes called a standing engineer)

>>16754411
My college was pretty pozzed but it wasn't nearly this bad. RIP anon.

>>16754219
this sounds like a fucking nightmare

>>16754420
Thank you for powering my computer where I watch anime and making the power plant not explode

>>16754326
This is what makes me regret that period of my life so much though. In those four years I remained the same beta, withdrawn, lazy retard I had been in my teens. I even clung on to the aesthetic of a teenager with my messy hair and shitty sleeping habits. It was like being allowed to live with your mommy for three / four years with only meagre encouragement to actually turn up to lectures etc. In theory, that is an enjoyable idea, but when you come out the other side and find yourself old, unskilled, naive about the world etc it can be crushing and humiliating.

>>16754387
>imagine wanting to support your family

>>16754402
i take it back

>>16754411
>native ethnic population
white people are not native to America you fucking baboon

>>16754414
your mum is just shite for doing that "i'm disappointed in you because you could have done better." congratulations on your hard work, man.

>>16754411
if your ancestors do something wrong, you should definitely shit all over them. it's called community policing. police your own people. be better; do better.

you just sound like a ponce who never wants to be criticized, even when the criticism is valid and constructive

>>16754440
You're very welcome anon
I actually take a bit of pride in providing power to millions of people, even if it is a vastly automated process
It's a cool job, I like it.

>>16754454
Whites are just as native to America as the constantly migrating Indians who killed and colonized eachother every five seconds. White Europeans also built America and have a right to it. Having touched foot on some land at some point doesn't magically make it yours.

>>16754419
nothing wrong with finance or even econ actually. it's just that there are better, more in-demand majors.

there are job opportunities but it just bugs me that there's this narrative that a bachelor's degree on its own is your golden ticket. it's more like a prerequisite. a good GPA and internships under your belt create the ideal situation.

>>16754454
thanks bro. best of luck

>>16754447
I feel that. I just have zero desire to participate in the "real world" in the first place so I don't really care if I'm not what I'm supposed to be compared to peers or whatever. I figure if I run out of options to support myself in a way that doesn't kill me inside I'll just off myself.

>>16754402
How did you find this job? Do they accept international applicants?

>>16754454
Not American mate.

>>16754464
I accept that, and Edward Said's work and the work of others was quite interesting. What I'm saying is that having that kind of lecture today, in the context of "fuck whitey" culture, it's demoralising and will inevitably result in a discussion period wherein people bring up George Floyd et al.

>>16754466
clearly you do not know the definition of native. also, no, migration or not they remained in the same continent and typically the same areas. if you ever studied migration patterns of nomads, you remain in the same localized area and move as the food moves.

europeans built shit with the help of the natives, who they pretty quickly massacred and enslaved. then when those died, they brought in the enslaved african people. without slave labor and the knowledge of natives, the colonies would have failed.

like you said, having touched foot on some land doesn't magically make it yours. it doesn't belong to europeans.

>>16754490
>Not American mate.
Where you at

>>16754491
Something belongs to you if you take it by force. If the Indians want America back so bad they should just take it back - oh wait they can't lmao

>>16754491
I just wanted to bait you into revealing you're a woke revisionist retard so nobody will listen to you lmao

I don't want to be a wageslave I think I rather kill myself

>>16754490
>"fuck whitey" culture, it's demoralising
I can see that. Not white but I'd wish people would stop making blanket statements about white people as well. No need to shame people for the ethnic circumstances they were born into. That, by definition, is racism. The intent itself is fine tho, which you've expressed that you agree with. The form is just faulty.

>>16754476
>I'll just off myself

But chances are you won't. I guarantee that a lot of idealistic, rather poorly socialised young men have this exact same attitude towards adulthood, i.e., I'll just do what I want and if I'm not in a good place by thirty then sayonara motherfuckers. And then they reach twenty-nine, thirty, thirty-five, and they are deeply depressed, still quite socially peripheral both due to their past indolence and ongoing begrudging attitude towards making an effort in life, and eventually many of them resort to trying to turn things around at the age of forty, which is fine but requires a lot of energy that is no longer natural to them, or distract themselves from life except to complain about "the system" or to ponder on how their life could have been different. There are so many men alone in a rented room somewhere right at this moment on their hands and knees with their hands gripping their face cursing themselves for fucking things up so badly. You get used to living and even the most basic curiosity will keep you wading through your miserable existence.

>>16754517
youre on an anonymous board, retard. for all anyone knows, you and i are the same person speaking to one another

>>16754490
I found the job through a company I was already working for, they just asked if anyone wanted to work out of town and I volunteered. 2 days later I was like 600km away
There might not be much for international work right now as COVID has really affected the energy sector and not many people are building pipelines, but when it kicks back up I'm sure there will be work again. I've met many, many foreign dudes working on the pipelines.
Just google for pipelining jobs in North America, they all pay pretty well. You might need some misc tickets (First Aid, Ground Disturbance, H2S, skidsteer/loader/rocktruck tickets, etc) but they can be had for a few hundred bucks a pop and a one day course.

>>16754517
>woke revisionist
imagine calling actual history "woke revisionist"

>>16754530
Don't you ever fucking call me a tranny like that again.

>>16754527
I don't have an age where I'm planning to off myself I'm just mentally unstable, so it is a distinct possibility, as is what you typed. I haven't given up hope on making a decent life for myself yet though, so I'll enjoy that while I can.

>>16754411
What would the female gaze be? I mean, obviously such a perspective exists but it seems kinda non-threatening

>>16754539
you dad's a tranny too. he a screamer

>>16754536
Thanks bro, appreciate it.

>>16754544
Fair enough, I wish you well.

>>16754559
Earthworks or welding would be the best way to get into it, but seeing as you're probably not a welder I'd look into earthworks.
It's a pretty well paying branch of construction that not many people know about that specializes in dirt, and you've gotta dig holes when pitting pipe in the ground.
Pic related is what I spent 4 years doing

>>16754546
I haven't really thought about it, to be honest. But there are books like Benatar's The Second Sexism, etc. And there are tons of prominent female authors who write about romance today, in a literary sense (i.e., not smut), which surely deserve analysis in a similar way?

>>16754527
sounds like you're speaking from experience

>>16754592
In a couple of years I will be.

>>16754576
You attended an hour long lecture on the male gaze and still don't understand it

>>16754504
>effete dweeb preaching might is right

Who said americans are godless? They love worshipping the cock that fucks them

>>16754664
I actually didn't, but could you suggest some reading on the issue?

As I understand it, it is a study of how women are portrayed in literature from a male authorial perspective, and how this often results in a woman being objectified, reduced to a sexual being or existential "other", and how they are denied autonomy and such.

>>16754667
you tell that chud!

>>16754504
Come on, unless you are saying that to be edgy it isn't a nice thing to say. The treatment of native Americans by whites was often very brutal and unfair, even if you don't buy the idea that pre-white America was some kind of edenic paradise.

>>16753892
>Admittedly, I studied EngLit which isn't a good idea career-wise
Should be wasn't.
>doesn't even know what tense he is writing in

>>16754744
Isn't it okay to write "isn't" if the assertion remains true, or if you are speaking universally rather than specifically?

>>16753892
Nigga, your fault for not doing a STEM.

>>16754527
Nah I’m killing myself this March. I already have everything planned out.

>>16754930
What do you mean planned out?

>>16754930
For me, it's April

As someone who did study something practical, I can tell you that the thing a regret the most in life was spending the one chance I’ll ever get at an education is learning a glorified trade. There’s so much knowledge out there to engage with under the guidance of people who are purportedly experts, and I wasted it all learning how to put numbers in boxes.

>>16754968
Do you at least have a secure job?

Unless you are attending a top college, chances are you won't get too much guidance that isn't available in secondary reading. The discovery of secondary literature, i.e., books exploring themes and applying wider referential context to a piece of work is a great way of experiencing mentorship.

>>16754957
I have everything needed ready and I’ve been planning on doing it around then for about a year now. At the moment I’m just living day to day until then. I still want to see some things through.

>>16754527
I'm 25 and after sleeping through a BS and MEng in engineering find myself with a shitty job that pays shit. I was thinking of going back to school for computer science online, working part-time, and this time making better connections with professors (if that can be done online) and getting better internships. Is this a stupid idea? I feel so lost and have no idea what to do

>>16755030
I don't know what to say Anon. I wish the best for you brother.

>>16754369
Propaganda to convince you we must import millions of third world slaves to do jobs that are "below us"

>>16755047
First thing to note is that twenty-five isn't old, so don't panic over that. At twenty-five I turned down opportunities to improve my life because I was scared I was already past it.

Where do your priorities lay? What are you hoping to achieve long term? Have you talked about this with anyone IRL, e.g., your parents, someone at a college who deals with computer science, your employer even?

>>16755080
I only talk about it with my parents and some friends. They are supportive but express concern that I'm using school as a break from work, which I'm afraid I might be doing, but I don't think I am. My dad thinks I'm just lazy and won't like to do anything, which is possible, and I'm so afraid if I follow through with my computer science plan I'll be in the exact same position.

I don't know what I want out if life except peace. I dream all the time of living in a small village or having a cabin in the woods and just farming for myself or some simple outdated trade. The only practical way I know how to move forward with my goal for peace is to earn a lot of money. Computer science seems like a good way to earn money. I did mechanical engineering and that wasn't too bad so I think I'd succeed academically. I liked programming in school

Thanks for just taking the time to even reply to me. I'm really panicking right now. I'm so afraid for my future. I agree with the earlier post that people who plan to commit suicide won't actually do it and that mentality drives you to failure, but its such a tempting idea. Luckily I have my mom alive still to rule it out as an option.

I'm freaking out

>>16755103
You could learn to code without going to school

>>16753892
>so much money
>all heavily in debt
>debtfarm
>paypig
OP unironically paid for uni kek
>my slightly-above-average university
I know that you were young and probably didn't think through this properly, but your uni being "slightly-above-average" should've been a massive red flag. Universities like these, if we can even call them universities to begin with, are High School: Second Season for young adults with Peter Pan syndrome and slightly-above-average intellect.

>>16754373
Just wait for the housing dip after 2020.

>>16755103
Calm down, seriously. I don't mean that to sound as if I would be calmer in your situation, but seriously any decision you make as a result of panic is likely to be one you will find a reason to regret, as panic will become your primary motivating emotion. This isn't healthy because it turns the world into a frightening place full of doors which close at a certain age, etc. This isn't the case.

Would you consider the idea of gaining further skills in your current career, and progressing that way to earn money if that is your decided means to find more peace?

Do you live in a major city? This for me was the source of my desperation and unhappiness, as I was not suited to it.

Suicide should not be something you are thinking of. It just makes the entire decision-making process so much more dramatic than it ought to be. Plenty of guys throughout history, and today, are in a job they loathe, earning less than they would have hoped, regretting decisions and so on. That isn't to say you should suck it up, as there as always people worse off that you can use to justify paralysis, but still.

>>16754491
Its yours, if you win it.

>>16755145
I agree. When I look back and realise how arrogant, delusional etc I was it is so repulsive and I feel a great shame. Any university is fine if you are learning something useful, and even if you don't but have relatively low expectations (or realistic expectations, perhaps) for your future.

That said, the fact that the economy is the way it is, especially in regard to house prices and job insecurity, makes this much worse in the current context. Earning a humanities degree in a mediocre university fifty years ago probably wouldn't have been such a cause for anxiety and shame as it is today.

>>16755103
Pull yourself together lad. You're acting like a little bitch.

>>16754930
The fact that you don't have any interest in suicide NOW means there's hope for the future. Once you're dead, none of your earthly priorities matter. I'm sure there'll be great things awaiting you later in life.

>>16754447
Yep that about describes my experience. Third year student here. Thought this year I'd make a tiny bit of effort to do interns or get out but then COVID happened....

Either way I hate college. 99% of the content you can learn on your own online or through books. College today is completely useless, it's just an adult cool kids club.

>>16755117
But to get a job in it I think I'd need a degree

>>16755155

I feel like I already hit a dead end with this job. Itd be nice to think it was due to the virus but I've applied to dozens and dozens of other jobs and gotten nothing back. I see cs another fresh start

I hate where I live right now, and if I did go back to school, I'd move to this small country town where I have a part time job possibility

Thank you, you calmed me down

>>16755024
I got a job in my field, and it's relatively secure. The pay is shit, and with the debt I'm in, I can't afford to move out of my parents' house.
When it comes down to it learning under the guidance of even a mediocre professor is still far more efficient and effective than the kind of self-study most people (myself included) are capable of doing. My life has been a total waste.

>>16755352
On the bright side, not to demoralise you and others, you are gaining a degree which at least shows some dedication and competence. Not sure if you are studying humanities, but you are young and life can and *will* be very strange, lead you places you don't expect to go. So don't worry too much, just plan ahead, determine what your needs are (in retrospect, my own needs were minimal and I should have appreciated this and not been so determined to overcompensate for my inadequacy by whoring myself out for any full-time job I could get) and just trying to secure a small patch of security, comfort and above all LOVE which is bearable to you. Don't allow yourself, please, for your own sake, to become demoralised, fearful of life, fearful of the future, fearful of your own potential or perceived lack thereof, and close yourself off. Try to find the right people who you can be vulnerable around, caring towards, protective of, and keep your conscience as clean as you can. Good luck friend.

>>16753892
The only thing I hated was pendling to classes for literally nothing. I could've learned the things they asked in exams by myself through a fucking book and saved myself travel money. Also, most of the time I forgot what the class was about and had to catch up all alone anyway. The whole week left me tired with demaged motivation.

On top of that I had no driver's licence, was poor and had to listen to the stories how my friends were having "crazy nights out" being "drunk" or whatever. I wish I went there at least once to see with my own eyes how they're piling complex after complex after complexs on their general relationship with girls. I laugh at them for it now. At least I got this satisfaction.

>>16755367
No problem, and you calmed yourself down. It's all in your power. I was such a manic retard at your age, it pains me so much so look back and to see what a melodramatic scaredycat I was. I made decisions (or failed to make them) which will haunt me for the rest of my life.

If you hate where you live, then that is a good place to start from. Talk to your parents about this, perhaps even consider finding a part-time job back home or someplace you like being and you will gain perspective. In a large city (not sure if this applies to you) I was constantly on a treadmill, under pressure, alienated, rootless, angry and so on. It was unhealthy. No amount of money can compensate for that kind of emotional burden.

Not sure how you are doing in terms of savings, but again if you have anything at all saved up or don't feel you will have to stress out about debt if you can go back to college, then consider it. Only when / if you do find a CS-related job, you will likely find yourself in a similar situation whereby you become tempted to think the grass is greener, etc. It's a rather boring inevitabiity, but at least you are familiar with that already.

There is no correct answer. There is no objectively correct route to take. There is no promised land. Your best hope is to reduce and afterwards limit the amount of unhealthy stress placed on you, and above all to find a little routine you can tolerate, which in turn will give you the peace of mind to form connections with others IRL, which I argue is very important for any sane person.

>>16755182
>when I look back and realise how arrogant, delusional etc I was it is so repulsive and I feel a great shame
That's a good thing. It means you've grown, you've matured. I myself feel much shame of who I was in the past, although most people who know me since those times think positively of who I was; but you have to take this shame as a good thing, for it means that now you're better, in some way, than then. Just think how terrible it must be for those who peaked in HS or uni to never grow up and spend the rest of their lives thinking nostalgically of these times. And this behaviour is more common than you think.
>>16755182
>economy
Let me tell you, vocational school is the best way to ensure a decent living for yourself. As long as you put the necessary effort into it, you'll be able to find jobs good enough to ensure for yourself in a middle class standard of living. Although going into engineering, business, law or so might be more "promising" regarding how much money you can make from it, only a select few can actually make it into good engineering, banking or management positions, to name a few. Vocational school, however, allows "average" people to succeed, and without all the money and time you'd invest into uni. I'd recommend you to consider this possibility, and keep a /lit/ lifestyle outside of your profession.

>>16755445
Why the fuck did I >> you twice?

>>16755385
>My life has been a total waste

I think this is called doomnaughting or something, essentially allowing a perceived negative situation to spiral into the conviction that nothing good has ever or will ever happen to you. For one thing, living with your parents (provided you get along with them) is a lucky option to have, and a steady base from which to grow.

Consider how much more debt you'd be in had you studied a humanities subject, for example. If you are truly interested in a topic, you can find a way of dedicating yourself to it. My own interest in the humanities subject I studied was probably actually reduced by the fact I had to study it, as it essentially became an exercise in speed-reading and professor-pleasing rather than an experience conducive to personal growth, and so on, which it ought to be.

Do you lack something tangible in your life that you think would improve it, such as friends, a girlfriend, etc?

Please don't succumb to doomthinking and paranoid convictions of utter defeat. As an unemployed near-thirty-year-old virgin with no friends or romantic experience, in quite serious trouble which may hinder my chances of ever being able to find gainful employment, paralysed by depression, I encourage you to at least be on your own side. As long as you try to keep your conscience clean by being honest and kind, you will have the tacit support of everything good and worthy in this world. No amount of financial humiliation or personal regret is capable of destroying you, provided you have a good heart.

>>16755451
Dunno but it felt like unwrapping two presents, so thank you for the advice and support.

>>16753892
>I didn't even have sex, which is probably another reason for my bitterness.
Stopped reading here, incel
>>>>>>/pol/
>>>>>>/r9k/

>>16755546
Do you really want to create more chuds? They got Hitler elected.

>>16755553
I'm not Murica so I don't give two fucks who you guys elect, lmao

>>16753892
Unironically one of the worst life choices someone can make is to go straight from HS to university, I took a year off and worked somne blue collar jobs. Many of my peers are delusional about the world, and the university is enabling that at every step, they are screwed when they hit the real world. Even some of my TAs and profs are out of touch. Ironically my best prof is an ex military dude who got into academia later in his life.

>>16754744

No, you retard. He's saying that in general, it isn't a good idea to study EngLit.

>>16755553
Jew spotted

>>16755477
>Consider how much more debt you'd be in had you studied a humanities subject, for example. If you are truly interested in a topic, you can find a way of dedicating yourself to it. My own interest in the humanities subject I studied was probably actually reduced by the fact I had to study it, as it essentially became an exercise in speed-reading and professor-pleasing rather than an experience conducive to personal growth, and so on, which it ought to be.
My debt comes from how I mishandled my education. If I had studied humanities or went to a different school, I would probably have been in less debt. I ultimately just feel like I've hit a dead end, and that all of my aspirations are outside of my grasp.

>>16753892
Don't bitch on /lit/ of all places because you were too stupid to make good use of your degree. I have several friends who were in arts programs and still ended up with decent jobs and fucking applied themselves during their uni years to get good co-op jobs and build experience.

Reject modernity, come back to the fields.

>>16754411
>It's another /pol/yp rants about what he thinks university is like post

>>16756062
It's true you fucking pencil neck fagarinooooooo

>>16756048
Fucking idiot. There is NO value in hard work. I worked in a warehouse and drove a truck just to come home and try to get as much Don Quixote in before I pass out for the night. If you were before my eyes I would run you through with a lance.

>>16756264
He isn't talking about working as a warehouse monkey dipshit

>>16756062
He’s not wrong though. At least in burgerland.

>>16754414
>they NEED to tell kids that there's only certain majors that are worth the investment. that if you can't handle engineering or comp sci, you need to switch to accounting, CIS, or supply chain.
i don't want to do any of that.

>>16757586
Then you should be working a lower class peasant job

>>16753976
Its not free

>>16758630
I would rather pay higher taxes than be 50,000 dollars in debt.

>>16758639
That's just you having a high time preference.

>>16754464
>constructive criticism
fucking lmao

I've only looked into half of the thread so maybe I'm missing something so far but what I've read can be summed up in two points:

1) >peers are way ahead of me/ learned no important skills/ wrong major
2) >burger debt

>2)
can be avoided if you're not a retard. If you are unfortunate enough to live in that shithole then just don't fucking go to college unless you have to for your dream career.
It's especially embarrassing if you're marxist in burgerland because you're essentially opening your asshole to capitalist elites who want nothing more than drain the money out of your pockets. Have some self-respect and choose a different path.

>1)
If you went for humanities or any other field with less promising career prospects then you should've learned practical skills on the side, e.g. programming, drawing, learning finance etc.
>inb4 code monkey meme
yes yes I fucking get it, we all hate stemfags and the like but just take a fucking look at the job market. I'm sorry to admit this but the neolib technocrats are right about this whole thing. It might be a soul-sucking job (although that kinda depends on the exact position) but it's still better than nothing, isn't it? If you've managed to acquire a position in that field you'll have decent income and from there you can decide if you want to pursue your passion instead.
Tbh this is only helpful to those who have some free time. If you're unfortunate enough that you have to work 20+ hours a week while still catching up with your major and minor I can see why this is no option.
But the point still stands. You guys can still learn practical things on your own. Better than shitposting and complaining about not getting the promised /lit/ pussy.

Also the career thing in general should be very skeptical to look at. Many people who studied hard, went to 4 different internships and sucked 10 different corporate cocks just to get that managerial position are usually unhappy with their lives and full of regret ("oh why didn't I study what REALLY interests me?" etc.)

All in all, if you're sure you want to go to college, choose a major that goes in line with your interest or passion. If that passion happens to be very profitable, then consider yourself very lucky. If not, then do something on the side as a plan B.

I myself have just started my first semester majoring in philosophy, which is what I'm VERY interested in. I used to study cs but quit after one semester because I realized it wasn't for me. I know that the career prospects for philosophy are pretty shitty in comparison, so I'm doing stuff on the side like writing screenplays, drawing, learning to code etc. Anything that might help in the future. That way I'm studying what I really want AND helping myself to be more marketable in the future.

>>16758782
who asked lol

>>16758782
The people positing in this thread are mostly not 18 year old high school students who still have a choice to make, they are people who already fucked up and know they fucked up. You can't un-fuck up.

>>16758782
Dude study law or some shit.
Don't go into coding. I can code and its NOT fun. Its not worth it. I dislike it.
I'm looking to go into a regular humanities based job.

is it just me, or do they now teach shit in college things that were taught in high school 150 years ago? those motherfuckers were studying the classics in greek and latin at 14. my faggot ass peers at a 'premier' liberal arts school could barely read or write. are we stupider now?

>>16758837
No

>>16758837
University is becoming the new high school, graduating is barely even an achievement and one day we'll spend our entire lives within these kinds of walled garden institutions.
>>16758840
yea nothing really changes xD

Humanities fags don’t know how good they have it. I took classics electives whenever possible, it was based as fuck and the staff were very passionate and easy to get along with. If you take a critical theory class you deserve what you get

>>16758804
that's why I said that they can still learn practical skills. People act like they go to college and then it's over in terms of education and training. It's not. We're lucky to be blessed with online resources. Use them.
I'm also writing this for faggots like OP who complain that their mickey mouse degree didn't lead to anything and blame it on academia. Oh boo fucking hoo. Should've known that before signing up. Not saying that academia is perfect but you have to realize that you should always put in effort from yourself if you wanna get far. I mean wtf did OP expect?
>>16758826
no thank you. I'd rather eat my nuts than study law. According to what I've heard from law students that might actually be less painful than law school.

>>16758869
Yeah I study biomedical sciences in a top lab but I don't have fun doing it.
Humantities faggots have fun whatever they're doing.

>>16758871
You're kind of cute. Will you be my gf

>>16758871
I'm not going to say learning practical skills is useless, but getting good at them takes time and energy. You can have that time and energy if mommy lets you live rent free or you get lucky with a job that pays your bills and doesn't completely wreck your time and energy, but not everybody gets in that position. Aside from that, practical skills are in no way going to guarantee you a job. The fields where it can are usually highly competitive, otherwise you're going to have to bust your ass being an entrepreneur and selling and shilling constantly for no guaranteed payoff. For everyone who succeeds with this a lot of people will fail. It's not a reason to not try, people turn around shitty situations all the time, but if you wasted four years on gaining student debt for no return and you have to fend for yourself you're already in a pretty disadvantaged position.

Damn lads I’m a senior at college already. One year to get my shit sorted before the eternal grind begins

>>16758869
>If you take a critical theory class you deserve what you get
It was required to get my degree. The pure literary classes were always great, but the college stuffed the degree requirements with some bullshit classes.

>>16758896
completely agree. I also mentioned in my other comment that learning skills on the side is only recommended insofar as you have some leisure time.

>>16754033
>yes, you are paying thousands of dollars just to attend college and watch youtube videos with ads
>being an amerifat

>tfw studying ancient languages and deal with very little of the shit mentioned itt

>>16754345
>being a servant to the rich and powerful is noble, goy!

>>16754033
>yes, America is just the richest third world country

>>16759022
Based and same, anon. What are you studying at the moment? I'd like to get back into Greek. I tried to learn it before learning Latin but got filtered like a bitch. Now that I have a solid grasp of Latin, I imagine it would be at least a little easier.

>>16755367
>But to get a job in it I think I'd need a degree
From what I've heard, software engineering just teaches you best practices. It doesn't make you a good coder, it just shows you were able to complete a course. It's true that some places will weed out applicants who don't have a degree, but if they have to do that, it means there's so many people applying there that chances are you wouldn't have gotten the job anyway.

Programming is essentially pure problem-solving. What you should do is demonstrate that you can solve problems. Build up a portfolio by finding open-source projects to contribute to, or make one of your own. Look into which frameworks and technologies are popular and employable right now. Focus on those, and show your work to prospective employers.

Of course, for extra street cred, set up the website yourself. Look into static website generators, such as Jekyll. The easy way is with Github Pages (you will have to learn Git for software development, get started now!). The slightly less easy way is with a VPS, but this allows you to host your own web server, and any other self-hosted service you want. https://youtu.be/OWAqilIVNgE

>t. retard in the humanities

>>16753892

>>16753892
It's just as bad in the UK. I studied art and the course was such utter pretentious dogshit it ultimately put me off pursuing an art career altogether. I later retrained and now work in graphics/ print production, which I love.
Uni is fun, don't get me wrong, but unless you're in STEM you're probably wasting four years of your life.

>>16759521
Assyriology, so Akkadian and Sumerian - it's such an obscure field that there really isn't the same treadmill mentality as many other fields of the humanities

>>16755367
Your story is uncannily similar to mine. Except I'm about 4 years older. Dead-end, safe, easy, mechanical engineering job out of college. At 25 I was so lost. I thought about killing myself every night for 9 months. But life goes on. 5 years ago someone asked me where I wanted to be in 5 years and I said "anywhere but here." And here I am. Same job. Same place. The depression has certainly lifted. I think philosophy got me through it. Schopenhauer and Alan Watts lectures helped. Exploring the idea that suffering comes from desire was cathartic. At 25 you have so much desire, so much potential, and you've been sold a bill of goods. The life you thought you would have isnt real. But you should realize that even if it was, it wouldn't satisfy your desire. So take a deep breath, recognize that you're going to die someday and don't worry so much. It's not all that serious. Get another job. Or don't. Neither will make you happy. Go back to school. Or don't. Neither will make you happy. Exercise being grateful. You could have been born in the Kibera slums. You are in a position where you don't have to fight rival gang members in prison to survive. The suffering we all face is real and eternal, but you can understand it, and every once in a while you can find peace.

>>16762076
>5 years ago someone asked me where I wanted to be in 5 years and I said "anywhere but here." And here I am. Same job. Same place.

I had the exact same experience.

can someone explain how the FUCK you get a job? or get any skill at all? i can't drive because i am afraid of cars, i can't keep eye contact and i am lazy and stupid as fuck. tested 135+ on an official mensa test yet i tried taking an online course on home cleaning the other day and i almost started crying when i saw all the types of floors, soaps, spots and types of mops you have to master and select to even begin washing properly. at this point i am seriously considering prostitution

I went to a military college. It was a spartan lifestyle. I needed it.

>it's yet another /pol/kiddie that has his basic Bitch opinion and comes to /lit/ not to discuss books, but to lecture us on why white people are Le victims, demand we should share all of his views, and cry about how he's a loser
Le sigh

>>16753892
>I didn't even have sex, which is probably another reason for my bitterness.
There it is.

>>16761252
Good resources for learning Sumerian? Should I even bother trying outside of a university setting? Should I learn Akkadian first?

>>16766829
>Good resources for learning Sumerian?
As a possible start, read Rubio's ''Sumerian Morphology'' while working through Volk's ''Sumerian Chrestomathy''.
>Should I even bother trying outside of a university setting?
Akkadian is possible. Sumerian, probably not, as the language is difficult enough within an academic context. You'd probably end up constructing some mish-mash, left field understanding of the language by learning it without guidance.
>Should I learn Akkadian first?
All Assyriologists know Akkadian, only few are proficient in Sumerian. Learning Akkadian gets you acquainted with cuneiform in general, but it isn't strictly necessary to learn Akkadian before Sumerian (again, you will if you study Assyriology).

>>16766920
thanks anon

York?

>>16753892
Lol americuck losers.
I did my bachelors and masters for free, here in Greece. Of course there was unemployment at first with my country being extremely socialist, but after a while I got a good gig and above average pay in public administration.

>>16758826
Coding is fun wtf. I enjoy Numerical Analysis, Design of Experiments And Optimization, and robotics. Combining them all let's you make great lil robots

>>16767036
Thats Hes Hall so yeah it seems to be

I just recently dropped out to fish lobster then read and write in my spare time. Sure, I will never make a whole boatload monetarily, but I'm happier where I'm at now than I ever was in college. I've got a nice girlfriend, a comfy bed, and I'm steadily conquering the classics that sat unread on my to-do list for years, mouldering while I wasted my time at what basically amounted to an indoctrination camp. Life's good.

>>16767460
How did you meet your girlfriend?

>>16767484
Literally just bumped into her at the convenience store she works at. I go there every morning with my cousin before work (smokes for me, breakfast for him). The people here are pretty friendly so it was easy to chat with her while she rung my shit up every morning. Weeks went by and we got friendlier and friendlier with each other. So, I eventually took the chance and handed her my number on a receipt- which I thought couldn't possibly work anywhere other than in a movie -but somehow it did and I took her out.

>>16767536
Wow, I am pleased for you. Thank you for sharing.

>>16767299
It probably depends on your brain wiring whether or not you find it fun.

>>16766926
No problem - good luck, if you decide to go through with it.

>>16767536
>>16767460
this nigga is living the /lit/ dream. godspeed anon!

>>16762076
Are we the same person? I cope at work by listening to Alan Watts, Schopenhauer, some more self- help stuff like Eckhart Tolle and Sam Harris, buddhism podcasts, etc.

You're right, the only thing I truly believe is that it'll all be okay eventually. I think I'll go for the new school plan, just to minimize regrets later in life, but thanks for the reminder of all things being temporary. I hope I reach a point of wisdom you seem to have

If you have a diploma you're pathetic lol.

>>16763572
If I were you, I'd try to find resources for reviving help based on disability. That sounds hard too but easier than prostitution. If your problems are as bad as you describe I think you're the kind of person it was made to help. Maybe if you get just a little support you can find a skill path that interests you and your interest will motivate