/lit/ - Literature

August Books Nomination
Two books this time. Two weeks each.
Post your nominations in the /sffg/ thread effective immediately. Nominate whatever you want.
Voting will be in the goodreads group.
Discussion will be in the /sffg/ thread using the usernames aug20b1 and aug20b2, for the first and second book respectively.
Please note which chapter you've read up to and spoiler your text if needed.
Posts throughout the threads can be followed here:
>>/lit/?task=search2&search_username=aug20b1
>>/lit/?task=search2&search_username=aug20b2

I'm looking for a first contact story. One where the alien's culture and biology is actually fleshed out, not like the space voodoo bullshit in "Contact". I enjoyed the Pequeninos in "Speaker for the Dead", if that's any indication of taste.

Anyone got a recommendation?

>>15942465
anyone have any thoughts on these???

>>15942516
children of time, kind of

>>15942516
Woo baby.

Uhm. I read a James Tiptree short story with some interesting aliens in it called Second Going

>>15942544
Sounds cool, I will check it out
>>15942546
Not a fan of female authors, but thanks for the tip

>>15942563
It’s 30 pages. Well worth the ending.

MORE romance subplot books

>>15942546
Well, well, well, if it isn't ButterTERF. Shouldn't you be reading Rowling?

>>15942571
Sword in the Storm

>>15942570
Funnily enough that is a perfect illustration of my problem with female writers. I prefer longer, grander, more detailed works rooted in serious world building - a genre females seem either reticent or simply incapable of participating in

>>15942546
do u like big tits butterfly lady?

>>15942575
>terf
Stop pretending like trannies are people and not monsters

>>15942638
Stop pretending commies aren't just as bad if not worse.
Now the shoe is in the other foot and the shitty wanna be commies is the far right asshole, defending patriarchal and hetero-normative capitalistic social institutions.

>>15942575
>>15942638
>>15942658
>>>/lgbt/

>>15942658
>look at all these made up faggot words
Drink bleach. You’ll never pass because you’re an abomination

>>15942535
It's good, in the same way Nova was a deconstruction of Space Opera, Neveryon is a deconstruction of Swords & Sorcery.

>>15942757
>deconstruction
Yikes

>>15942535
Guy really likes to say neveryon

> mfw I'm the greatest living author of fiction to ever walk the earth.

I'll ask earlier in the thread this time. Are there any fantasy 'novels' where female characters, preferably the protagonist, gets utterly and totally sexually destroyed by bad guys and monsters and doesn't immediately rebound from it?

It's part kink but also part annoyance of the trope that side characters can have anything happen to them, no matter how grisly, but the main females (especially if she is the protagonist) will always slip by misadventure or it will be something relatively minor (a fingering or near- rape) compared to another character being thrown into a pit of prisoners and ravaged into insanity. Terry Goodkind is a prime example. He is a degenerate after my own heart but he often seems to develop a case of protectiveness over his actual waifus.

One kind anon has recommended Crown of Stars by Kate Elliott, so I'll be reading the first book.

Need reqs for good fantasy/sci fi horror books. Bonus points for dark or twisted religious themes (a good example being the priest’s tale from hyperion). Pls respond.

>>15942799
*recs

>>15942795
Nigger the only book you need to read is the Bible cuz your ass needs Jesus. The fuck did I just read?

>>15942799
Mask of the Sorcerer

>>15942607
have sex

>>15942795
https://e-hentai.org/?f_search=mindbreak

>>15942858
I appreciate the recommendation anon, not really in line with what I was asking for though.

>>15942977
But I don't want hentai/doujin, or just porn, I'm looking for extra grim fantasy that doesn't pull it's punches in the sexual elements. It's not that strange a request. Not in a world where GRRM is a best selling fantasy author and people like Terry Goodkind have been getting away with it for decades.

>>15942799
the darkness that comes before

>>15943002
>>15943012

>>15942516
Jesus fuck. The last time you posted et, but this time you posted a thicc asian. Is that a jab at Asians being alien?

>>15943012
>the darkness that comes before
Thanks.

>>15942516

Anathem

>>15942794

Ummmm sweetie

>>15943002
>>15942795
Rules free vrmmo
Lost of rape, not female protagonist though.

>>15942516
Ffuuuuuuuuck. Need books with thicc mommies getting mating pressed.

Redpill me on the Goodwood Terry Goodkind

Where to begin with him?

>>15943147
http://sandstormreviews.blogspot.com/2006/08/goodkind-parodies.html

Jesus Christ Lads

Why is it so hard to write Good Fantasy?

>>15943143
s-s-source?

Fuck e william brown

>>15943161
>duck lips
I wonder if she would lose to black cock. It's always stiffening when a southern racist women loses to black dick, fall in love and marry the guy.

>>15943185
Never go full jew, anon.

>>15943185
>>>/pol/
>>>/lgbt/
>>>/v/
>>>/gif/

Are there any cool fantasy books that are a collection of short stories?

>>15943162
not 100% but i think its paola honma
https://xhamster.com/photos/gallery/paola-honma-10431081

>>15943143
That's alotta jaypeg

>>15943241
Tales of Dying Earth

>>15943241
clark ashton smith

>>15943241
Yes

What a mess of a thread.

>>15943354
Just like your vagina.

Serious question:

Should I use a Chinese/Asian pen name when trying to get my Chinese Fantasy story published?

>>15942465
Any eastern fantasy that's legit good?

>>15943515
No, because when you're found out you'll have destroyed all trust with the publisher and everyone else that matters. If you self-publish then do whatever.

>>15943515
Yes. Use a very traditional name too, along the lines of Sum Ting Wong or Ho Lee Fuk.

>>15943515
Just go with something generic like John Lee

>>15943515
seems racist desu

>>15943515
Are you Asian with a white name, or just a white guy?
Speaking as an Asian guy, finding out that an author I'd assumed was Asian was just pretending to be would seem duplicitous and pandery to the point where it might put me off his work altogether. If this is actually a serious question and not bait, I'd say no, don't fucking do that lol

while we're talking about asians: anyone have some ted chiang type recs? he has the tendency to get pseudy sometimes, but i think most of what he's written was pretty solid

>>15943068
The fuck you just say to me little boy?

>>15943147
You begin by getting on your knees and thanking god (me) that you live in the same timeline as I do and are able to enjoy my masterpieces.

You are welcome.

>>15943241
I liked this one- has a mix of fantasy/ sci fi.

Keeper of Dreams also good.

Any recs on Corruption of relatively "Pure" beings?
Bonus if it's more of a logical/knowledge-based downfall that leads to the corruption.
Smut or none doesn't matter.

>>15943945
At least you didn't pretend to larp as Mormon boy.

>>15942795
It's not fantasy but have you read the Gap cycle?

>>15943241
Lord Dunsany

>>15944167
Lord Dunsany is great if you like Lovecraft dreamy stories (and vice-versa).

>>15943987
cool card

>>15943987
Is there any fantasy book with such a scene as this pic? Teenage-looking angels (preferably female) in skimpyish clothes and holding/giving swords?

>>15942516
Mote in God's Eye, Footfall

Sanderson began weekly release of Rhytm of War chapters. Finally, something to look forward to weekly.

I know someone asked this question in the previous thread, and I took note of the suggestions that caught my interest, but I'd appreciate any other good recs on books/series that are about samurai and/or shinobi. Like that anon, Ghost of Tsushima has rekindled that particular area of interest, so anything of that nature would more than suffice

>>15943987
Bumping this because responses weren't relevant.

>>15944989
Cool.
Be sure to tell us how robotic and lifeless it sounds each week.

>>15945637

Prologue is pretty realistic and full of emotions btw.

>>15945943
>t. turbo autist

>>15945979
>>15945637
>>15945165
Did you just talk shit about my work? Apologize now and beg for forgiveness and your family might have you home safe tonight.

poorfag here. Looking for a good website I can download pdf books to read while falling asleep, riding the bus/train, or whenever I'm bored really. Appreciate any help you guys can give me.

>>15942447
>>15942046
>>15941575
>>15941567
keep crying faggots. You genre is gay fantasy

How do you write a fantasy villain's dialogue? I have his motivation and backstory set up, but every word out of his mouth feels stilted and forced.

>>15946609
Our genre is fun, retard.

>>15946631
I agree but as a single self contained story. It should never be a genre. You should stop at Conan.

>>15946642
Why do you get to decide whether or not an entire genre should exist?

>>15946653
I am not deciding shit retard. It's just my opinion. I never said S&S should be banned. I just think it's a shitty genre.

>>15946609
>>15946642
>>15946660
>this triggers the sexually insecure fucking shit

>>15946660
Well there are a lot worse things in this industry than Sword and Sorcery.

>>15946691
naked body does not trigger me retard. I just don't like the idea of naked warriors cutting down multiple enemies without any armor.
>>15946692
I agree

>>15946704
Oh so you're autistic. You have my sympathies.

>>15946691
I wish that were me, except that there should be a sexy woman in the picture as well.

>>15946704

>>15946758

>>15946728
Call it whatever you want. I would accept naked warrior if he at least looked cool. Kratos looks cool, Darkwolf looks cool some depictions of Conan are awesome, but just putting thong on a character is lazy and goofy looking.

>>15946784
I see the autism is getting worse. You poor bastard.

>>15946798
ok faggot.

>>15946800
Okay, autismo.

>>15946808
keep being a faggot, your genre is never coming back.

>>15943002
this anon gets me

>>15946784
Lmao you are literally mad about a subgenre of fantasy literature because some artistic depictions of a character from that genre look silly?

>>15946832
because that artistic depictions influenced entire genre and every hack following Howard decided to start depicting same character over and over again.

>>15946815
>ONLY THING IS GOOD IF THING IS POPULAR
lol so not only are you autistic and insecure with your sexuality, but you're also a consoomer.

>>15946784
Thing is, Conan doesn't actually fight naked in the stories. That's entirely a flourish by Frank Frazetta, who I have to admit is a great author, but it's entirely him drawing what's COOL rather than what the text actually says.

When Conan can get his hands on armor, he fights in armor.

>>15946777
nice

So I'm tryna get into sci fi, is contemporary stuff like Scalzi trash in the way contemporary fantasy is? fan of pic related

>>15946854
no dipshit it's not about popularity. Your genre is dead period.
>>15946866
that's literally what I said in previous thread. Conan wore armor but Frazetta's depiction influenced entire genre thereafter.

>>15946866
Fuck. Frazetta is a great ARTIST, not author.

>>15946880
seeing you sperg out over art gives me life

>>15946880
>Your genre is dead period.
lol no it isn't, you retard. S&S is still being written to this day. I'm just not a CONSOOMER who cares about popularity like a fucking girl.
>Conan wore armor but Frazetta's depiction influenced entire genre thereafter.
Except there are multiple REH stories where Conan wasn't wearing armor and was in fact dressed in little more than a loincloth. Pic related has Conan in a loincloth the entire story and it's one of Howard's best Conan tales.

still waiting on a single post where a conan fan discusses a specific conan story they liked instead of all this gay ass unspecific back and forths

>>15946918
>Tower of the Elephant literally just mentioned

>>15946911
and knowing s&s is dead give me life.
>>15946914
there has not been good s&s for decades now. I know you just want to look at naked men 24/7 but there are other things in the storytelling people want to read about.
Conan fought without armor involuntarily. He either was caught by surprise or robbed.

>>15946880
>>15946880
What specific genre are we saying is dead - Sword & Sorcery?

Because...well yeah, I would have to agree. I could recommend you a ton of great S&S books but every single one would be from 1970 or thereabouts.

The closest thing to a RECENT novel would be...fuck, maybe Heroes Die by Matthew Stover, and that's from 1998. AND it's not really a S&S novel because it's actually a cyberpunk novel about a guy who PLAYS a Sword & Sorcery hero in a fantasy universe and his adventures are then recorded for the entertainment of rich people in the cyberpunk universe.

>>15946914
If you know of some S&S that was published after 9/11, please share it with the rest of the class.

>>15946918
I just read the Scarlet Citadel in the omnibus. Howard has very flowery language and I often find myself getting lost in the descriptions and just glazing over the pages, but when I got to the battle scene it started to pick up quite nicely. 3/5 stars, fun and short, but lacking in compelling characters.

>>15946937
>"conan wore a loincloth and it's good"
great discussion really merits shitting up the last 5 threads with 40 posts per thread

>>15946939
>I know you just want to look at naked men 24/7
Son, I was just joking about you being insecure with your sexuality before, but now I genuinely think you might be in the closet. You've said "faggot" about 200 times between today and last night and you keep claiming if someone likes Conan they must be gay. You are projecting.
>Conan fought without armor involuntarily.
lol he was literally wearing a loincloth in Tower of the Elephant because it was an acceptable manner of dress in that city.

>>15946691
Conan is just male power fantasy.

>>15946952
Straw man. Nice try though. And it's the faggot in the closet (you?) who's been shitting up the thread. He's not only autistic, but gay and refusing to come out of the closet. A dangerous combination.

>>15946950
If you want your swords with fewer flowery descriptions, check out the Kane novels by Karl Edward Wagner. He's very much a grim-and-hardboiled Howard.

>>15946952
that's all this faggot want from the novels. Naked men running around.
>>15946964
and you still keep being a faggot.
>>15946967
retarded term
>>15946974
that's not me. I know it is hard for you to believe that there are other people who don't like pulp trash but still try to keep up.

Reading Echopraxia at the moment and I don't like it as much as Blindsight. It feels like some kind of Alien/Aliens deal, where the original is a spooky slow-burn and the sequel is an action movie. Too much technobabble this time too; Blindsight had a lot but you were in the head of mega autismo so it fit and made the setting feel very cerebral. But this time you've got Dan, who I don't like very much. Siri was more relatable to me as well (lol?).

>>15946949
>If you know of some S&S that was published after 9/11, please share it with the rest of the class.
Schuyler Hernstrom has written several high class S&S short stories. And some stellar Vancian ones as well. There's tons of random S&S out there and has been for years. Of course not all of it is good. I've recommended Rogues of Merth as well if you want something that scratches that Fafhrd and Gray Mouser itch. There's also a series by James Alderdice if you're wanting full length novels (though S&S is best in short story format).

>>15946998
Also it's keeps doing this over and over
>Oh fuck we're going to die.
>But the monks are going to fix it by doing THIS CRAZY SHIT WOOOOAHHHHH!!!
and it's getting on my nerves.

At least you're not denying you're a homo.

but I did faggot

>>15946979
I honestly don't mind it, it's just jarring to go from Sanderson's beat by beat descriptions to Howard's mile long sentences. But thanks for the recommendation, is it available in reprints anywhere or just digital?

>>15947030
Conan is based, bros. Even based Wagner wrote a solid Conan pastiche called Road of Kings. Captures Conan's characterization perfectly while also being a pretty dark story overall. Probably would have been better as a short story though, but it's still good.

>>15945360
Shogun by James Clavell, that book rocks

>>15947039
Conan and Tarzan are fine others not so much

>>15945360
Check out Gonji by TC Rypel.

>>15947031
Probably much easier to get it digitally, that's how I got 'em.

are there any good south american authors?

>>15945360
Also I don't know how you feel about litrpg, but since you brought up a video game and want to read samurai shit you might wanna check out Dungeon Samurai by Kit Sun Cheah too.

>>15942795
It's a manga but berserk is really what you're looking for

Can someone explain to me why non-Frank Dune books are shit?
I know that they are apparently a cash grap, but what exactly makes them bad?

>>15946577
just use ligben.is or zlib.org

>Ned Stark and Ashara Dayne are supposedly the true parents of Jon Snow
>Ashara's name means Tree Spirit
>Starks have a spiritual connections with the Weirwoods
>Bran is now training to become a Greenseer in his tree cave

So Ashara Dayne confirmed Jon's mother?

>>15947323
I mean, everything after dune sucks

What's the best Conan story?

>>15942607
>>15942901
BTFO

>>15946998
>Siri was more relatable to me as well (lol?)
As a social retard who learned socialization from observation, pattern recognition, and trial and error, I enjoyed Siri.

>>15942544
>>15942563
I felt the ending of children of time was meh to say the least. The human pov was all over the place, I'd find myself rushing through it because the spiders perspective was much more engrossing.

The spiders won no doubt about it.

>thought I'd finally found an epub of the best translation of romance of the three kingdoms
>they all have english names e.g. "Jeffrey Lewis" even though this isn't the case in the book version of this translation
what the fuck lol

>>15947065
gabriel garcia marquez, magical realism can be considered more or less a kind of fantasy somewhat to a degree

in any case 100 years of solitude can't disappoint

I HAVEN'T READ A BOOK IN 3 MONTHS

>>15948574
I'm on track for having read 100 books this year.

>>15948574
>>15948638
i'm on track for 100 whilst reading a bunch of long ass chinese webnovels that I can't log properly and/or at all lol

>>15948657
To each their own silliness.

>>15944016
Nope, but I'll check it out, thanks.

>>15947310
Oh I read Berserk long ago, thanks though.

>>15946952

I like the one where he feeds the duplicitous Jew to cannibal blacks

>>15947845
yeah I agree, spiders were way more interesting. kind of wish the humans had been either reworked or confined to Kern

>>15947503
Every Conanchad has their favorites, but Tower of the Elephant, Scarlet Citadel, Queen of the Black Coast, and Rogues in the House are some of the best.

>>15947473
Excuse me?

Have you not seen the show?

We know who Johnny Snow's parents are.

>>15949476
Thanks, I'll read them first when I get the collected Chad conan

Come discuss The Master and Margerita, it kind of counts as fantastical literature:
>>15949633

>>15949652
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B074CB1LWY?searchxofy=true&ref_=dbs_s_aps_series_rwt

Be sure to buy or download those books only concerning the OG Conan stories. They're the absolute best collection of Conan. The stories are in WRITTEN order and completely uncut and unaltered with tons of art and extras.

>>15942465
Anyone got a decent zombie novel recommendation, most of the ones I have read are pretty bad.

>>15950240
Not really zombies, but The Road by McCarthy has cannibals

>>15943727
Funnily enough in China your outright expected to have a Chinese 'pen name' if your a westerner, if you don't already have one the government or publisher will give you one.

james patrick Kelly's home front predicts the future. This was published in 1988.

>>15948542
Thanks anon, I know about Marquez, but do you know any other s. american authors in magical realism? I have heard that magical realism is popular genre there.

>>15949518

Not canon. Also Mance didn't sing the song about the Dornishman when Jon entered his tent could be a huge hint there I guess

>>15950415
Not him but check Julio Cortázar's short stories, José Donoso, Horacio Quiroga. Isabel Allende is the literary equivalent of an even shittier Haruki Murakami.
There's also Fuentes and Rulfo (North American though).

>>15942535
Isn't one of these novels literally about fags getting AIDS? I believe it may in fact be the first published novel about AIDS.

any books for this feel?

Why do novels so often have to shit themselves narrative-wise in the last third or so? You spend hours reading a good story, with characters you like and in interesting situations, and then they pull the rug out from under you with a subversion that just doesn't work and/or tun off on a plot thread tangent. It instantly kills my interest in the story and pisses me off because of the time invested.

This weeks contender is Fevere Dream. It's got a decent cast of interesting character, an interesting premise, an interesting antagonist, and even a compelling twist on the nature of the vampires, and then for the last third of the books is the same plot thread (Ooopsie, I nearly died but escaped) looping multiple times and everything just loses all tension.

>>15950799
The Broken Sword by Poul Anderson

>>15950891
>GRRM
What did you expect?

>>15950891
>You spend hours reading a good story, with characters you like and in interesting situations, and then they pull the rug out from under you with a subversion that just doesn't work and/or tun off on a plot thread tangent
IDK, my guess is that some writers see stories from the perspective of a writer than from the audience. So they conflate something that was fun to write about or discuss about as a writer as a good thing for a story.

>>15950991
I can see the angle, but ideally you want to at least attempt to keep the reader from feeling like they have started reading a different story, as it's killed so many books for me.

When I started I expected to be reading a part-horror story where the captain slowly realises that he is running a mobile slaughterhouse/hunting lodge for bloodsuckers, and GRRM plays into that expectation and subverts it just fine, but not long after that everything just turns to shit. In hindsight I wish that had been the plot, as what he decided on just didn't have any staying power.

>>15950971
Fair point. He does the same thing quite often in A Song of Ice and Fire, I suppose, it just feels less jarring as the books are longer and a series.

>>15951027
>man this party of adventurers we are following is great, I like the setting, and the main characters interplay with other character is great
>oh, now everyone except the MC is dead, the kingdom fell in two pages, and we'll be following his adventures in generic badguyland as a crippled and bitter asshole before his inevitable return to form in several books time
I understand completely. I think it's a failure of genuine world building. Everything is written around getting to a plot point the reader doesn't know about yet, so they can find the set up much more compelling than the plot the author actually started with.

Has anyone read The Dragon’s Blade Trilogy by Michael R. Miller? I keep getting tricked by the audiobooks I listen to. They are either erotic novels, or have some bullshit that feels like it was written by a woman. Just want to know if it is worth grabbing

Alistair Reynolds and Peter Watts and Greg Egan, please fucking release more scfi books
I can't fucking stand this nu-scifi written by women.I need more tanshumanism and posthumanism. Give me the crazy shit.

>>15946879
It depends

Scalzi is sometimes good, sometimes trash
Read Peter Watts Blindsight+Echopraxia+Freeze Frame Revolution, Alistair Reynolds Revenger Series and Revelation Space books and Quantum thief

Those are really, really good contemporary scifi that shit all over boomer scifi

>>15942535
Stopped reading #1 halfway through. Kinda bored by the writing, but a lot more coherent than the mess that Dhalgren was. It was obviously about a feminist / matriarchal society, which wasn't exactly the most exciting of themes.
Might return to it some day.

>just finished Eyes of the Overworld
wew, that last chapter was good
too bad the mid chapters were such a slog

>>15942607
It’s a short story. A sci-fi trope of first contact with a really cute twist. It’s best kept short.

>>15942575
Hello trans-american. How are ya?

>>15943002
That hat is a little big for her

>>15942465
The Dispossessed - Ursula K. Le Guin, Hainish Cycle #6 (1974)
Usually I don't like novels that are so ideological, but this really worked for me. It was great almost 100% of the time. I think it's an improvement in many ways over The Left Hand of Darkness which I already gave the highest rating. This is definitely one of the best books I'll have read this year and one of the top novels I've ever read. Does that mean it's perfect and I would recommended it to anyone? Obviously not, nothing can be like that. The novel is literally almost all talking, so if you need action, this isn't for you. The novel follows the life of Shevek, a physicist, from birth to around forty years old using alternating chapters of his past and present. I wasn't immediately enthralled. The first chapter was lacking and second wasn't particularly likeable. I later understood why the first was as it is, but I remain conflicted about having the audience experience how the character felt in such a way. The second is because that's simply how youth are. There are many lengthy sections explaining various ideas in detail, which no doubt is a serious consideration for some. Much of the book compares two societies. One is basically anarcho-communist and the other is decidedly capitalist. Others exist but are only briefly mentioned. Although the cover says "ambiguous utopia", I disagree with that and it wasn't originally included. They are both realistic seeming depictions, though I don't believe there has ever been an existent society that existed for the duration and scale of the anarcho-communist one so I don't know how realistic it actually is. I see the capitalist society as an intended nightmare by the powerful and the anarchic one as a nightmare by circumstance. It's difficult to say how their society would be if their circumstances were better. I wouldn't prefer to be in either of them as they are, though the anarchic is closer to my ideal, though I have many disagreements with it. Despite saying so, this passage entirely resonated with me: "But when you said that, you did not really believe. You don't believe in Anarres. You don't believe in me, though I stand with you in this room, in this moment..." "You would rather destroy us rather than admit there is hope! We cannot come to you. We can only wait for you to come to us." Ah, I want to believe, I really do. Fiction will have to suffice, because I won't be the revolution. How disappointing. There was various times where I felt like I was reading Christian anarchism despite their lack of religion. How much of my enjoyment came from me agreeing with the novel? Probably a significant amount.

The Day Before Revolution (1974)
An amusing take on how people are made into myths.

The study guide was interesting, but reminded me I would hate doing formal discussions if I were reading this for a class. Ugh.
It included a list of 26 common attitudes of 70s feminists. I found them to be generally agreeable.

>>15951167
egan's new compilation sucked

>>15952268
>so if you need action, this isn't for you
Hey what about the helicopter scene?
> There was various times where I felt like I was reading Christian anarchism despite their lack of religion
They were anarcho-pacifists with a sort of Gandhi origin, so yeah.
>I won't be the revolution.
We can be.
You’ve seen me shill James Herod’s Getting Free?

>>15952446
>helicopter scene
That was something that happened to them and rather quickly at that. From the perspective of the characters it was a rather passive scene as it was all done to them and they couldn't do much about it aside from flee. Usually an action scene has protagonist taking an active role.

>We can be.
I'm aware, but I know my limitations.

>You’ve seen me
I mostly only use /sffg/ on /lit/ for a long time now, so no, I haven't. Yes, I know about you.

>>15952595
I know my limitations too. But yeah, I have to take a more active role if I want to see any action.
I didn’t mean just knowing me, but knowing the book.
https://www.jamesherod.info/Getting_Free.pdf
Like Stirner indicates, we’re stronger together.

>>15952719
I know what you meant. What I meant is that since you're the most prolific tripcode using poster in /lit/'s history by far, it's way too much effort to se what you've been posting. That being said, I have taken a casual interest in the past and looked at your posts on various other board with both this and your previous tripcode and otherwise.
I may read what you've linked sometime, but I wouldn't count on it.
I find you to be generally agreeable and amusing, aside from one issue you go on about. As you say, we're stronger together, so maybe don't be so exclusionary.

>>15952778
>don't be so exclusionary.
I try not to be.

>>15952805
what are your favorite lesbian sff works?

>>15942621
Oh yeah.

>>15952947
Hadn’t found any growing up. Lost interest in the genre for a time. Recently found Amonite at a little free library. Le Guin liked it, so I’m keeping it.
Actually working on a social-scifi pseudo utopia with incidental lesbianism. I say “working” but my mind is just dipping in and out of the place. I’ve never written anything before so I guess I’m nervous about it.

Halfway through Fires of Heaven and I'm struggling. Honestly didn't even like The Shadow Rising that much. Should I just drop WoT, or does it pick up at the end?

>WoT is ass and you're retarded for reading it
I know, I know. It was important to the genre though and I do kind of want to read it just for that.

>>15953044
Ammonite*

Wrapping up the last chapter or two of Ryria Revelations series. Is the prequel series any good?
I feel like I've gotten the whole story of Hadrian and Royce and the whole setting practically already.

>>15953059
I think I made it through 3 or 4 of them before I tapped out like 5 years ago. There's only so many times you can read "wool-headed lummox".

>>15950240
A rational zombie.

>>15953059
Book 5 is the part with the road trip with Elayne and Nynaeve right? That one got pretty hard to read through. If it's not doing anything for you then stop. By that point I was too invested in characters to stop reading but if they haven't grabbed you there's no point forcing yourslef.

/r/ing a Blindsight edit of this, I'm too shit to even make funny-bad quality jokes.

>>15953080
are they lovers? didn't want to read in case they were

>>15953059
stopped reading when the girls kept getting waylaid, it got comical how they never saw it coming

Sort of a lukewarm take after reading 200 Chapters of Wu Dong Qian Kun;
Eastern/Asian Fantasy is particularly unpopular given the different expectations of the writer. Wuxia and Xianxia would be far more accessible and enjoyable for the majority, if 'Western' Translator(s) not necessarily re-wrote but reformatted the story to follow Western story schemas and models.
This also might be due to the type of story being told; After watching a video by Deathblade (popular translator) he spoke about the majority of the translators focusing on the more YA equivalent (Xianxia) stories, hence why it doesn't feel serious, while being too cartoony. While the more serious Wuxia stories are honestly comparable to traditional/low fantasy; the general interest is far lower making it less accessible due to less translations and overall exposure.
Aside, seeing the untranslated vs the translated made me realise how much information is lost or simply not translated correctly which is another issue as well.

>>15953059
Not really related to your question, but I quit Eye of the World when the 'party was split'. Does it improve in terms of pacing after or does it continue to be a WoT travel guide?

>>15953914
Xianxia's based and people hate on it because nonwhites wrote it. Sure some of the stuff you mentioned would help, not try to say it wouldn't.
Literally the only reason why that sperg freaks out. /pol/ lurks more than usual and flip the fuck out when they see anything other than english.

>>15954243
>>>/lgbt/

>>15953914
>Does it improve in terms of pacing after or does it continue to be a WoT travel guide?
Different anon, but yeah they travel to almost every major city on the map plus a few places actually not on the map. There's so much walking and riding, even after they rediscover Traveling, essentially teleportation using portals. I will say though that it's pretty hard to guess how the rest of the series will go just by reading Eye of the World, because a major plot development is dropped at the very end of the first book that sets up the rest of the series. Book 1 feels like a lot of other Tolkien-derived fantasy, heroes form a party and journey across a fantasy world to reach the place of power to vanquish evil, the end. But the rest of the series is political intrigue and world conquest.

>>15954263
Makes no sense but okay.

>>15947323
Dune through to GEoD is a pretty clear line of thought for the ecology of a planet subject to exploitation, and how the influence of religion to varying degrees (see practical genocide in one instance, and the ethics of planned breeding in another) allows for exploitation of the people. Heretics and Chapterhouse (still reading Heretics) were part of a new trilogy that was meant to explore beyond the original 4 books themes. But Papu died and the true end was meant to just remain ambiguously unfinished. You probably know this, but you need to have this in mind.

This is mostly second hand information, but being friends with a vocal group of anti post-Herbert Dune, I can add what I've gathered;
Flashforward 14 years later, his hackfraud son and some guy release a book that's 'The events of dune, before dune' which were 'based off of Frank's notes' - spoiler, the legitimacy of that statement is often called into question. They add ultimately nothing other than Sanderson's WoK Interludes level lazy worldbuilding; Thanks Tor, batting 2 for 2 on shit Authors.
Flash forward another 5 years after the last of that 'trilogy' comes out, and we get the 2 books that 'end Dune' - poorly. They are written with no charm, no real meaning behind ending the thing, and have so much 'This just happens, trust us' going on that it's as if KJA and BH treat it as a chore to write. But it sells well because 'hey Dune is on the cover, dune is popular, I'll get it' and this is where it started to become clear that Dune is like Star Wars and people will buy it off of name alone.
Then, because apparently notes - they wrote things that happen between the first two books; A lot of which is WILDLY out of character and doesn't show a sensible sense of growth at all. And guess what, shit gets deservedly cancelled. Fucking hooray.
Apparently their only saving grace is that the Sisterhood and Mentats books are decent.

tl;dr KJA and Herbert Jr can't write Dune, that's why their stuff is bad.

I'd like some recommendations for space operas.

>>15954381
Well fuck. Would it be worth it to just read the breakdown of the book then carry on to the next?

>>15954428
KJA can't write well, full stop.
The Mendoza line of writing quality by author is just above KJA.
It's like SFW AI Dungeon level stories.

>>15942516
5th Head of Cerberus

>>15953059
You're just entering the Dead Zone. Fans say it picks up when Sanderson took over, but I haven't gone back to it. I keep imagining I'll do so on some long ocean voyage.

>>15953080
Just read the original series. The author is trying to milk it with the prequel short stories.
Also don't read "The Age of" series, it's utter shit. The author went from based bros against the world to some pandering shit that isn't logical.

>>15954243
>/pol/ lurks more than usual and flip the fuck out when they see anything other than english.
While it's true that pol lurks more, pol wants chink women more than the chinks. White women are a lost cause for the traditional wife apparently, because they are all "coal burners".

>Xianxia's based and people hate on it because nonwhites wrote it.
No. People hate it because a lot of them are shit and chinks can't write. A lot of the chink power fantasy market is like amazon kindle market. Anybody can publish and you only see the popular ones at the top, be they quality or not. Look at the big names in the kindle market, a lot of them are shit (Harmon Cooper, Logan Jacobs, Eric Vall, Dante King, etc), yet they are getting sales. I'm sure the translator plays a big part in this, as how they translate a chink novel might make or break it. The only people I see mindlessly defending chink novels are chinks themselves(because bugmen are hivemind and defend anything chink), and low read IQ brainlets. If you read a lot you would see that a lot of chink novels are shit, yet a lot of readers are reading literally machine translated books and praising how "good" it is.

>Proving their point

From next week Tuesday there will finally be new releases again.

>>15954435
Vorkosigan is absolutely essential reading

>>15947503
Beyond the Black River is spectactular.

>>15955317
>finally new releases
>committed to catching up and reading classics
I have such shit scheduling of my reading

>>15951508
Now you can read the sequel

Some thoughts on pic related

It's everything I would want from an indirect sequel. Bujold is a very competent story teller which makes it all the more baffling how the plot sags in the middle. The romance was a little overbearing and seems geared primarily towards older women. Worth the read if you liked Chalion

>>15949363
Have you read the next book in the series Children of Ruin? I'd like to read about a civilization of octopi but the first one ended on a sour note.

>>15955499
How do the 2 compare with Vorkosigan in terms of style?

>>15955531
Not that anon, but I liked the Chalion series a lot better (granted I haven't read the later half of Vorkosigan). Vorkosigan had a lot of.. well, banal 80's feminism honestly. Not the obnoxious screachy modern feminism, but the kind of shallow, socially progressive shit you'd expect out of a stereotypical upper middle class woman in the 80's or 90's.
Chalion on the other hand is still very much pro-woman, but it also came across as pro-man as well. Overtly masculine acts are portrayed just as positively as anything a woman might do, as opposed to Vorkosigan where the literal patriarchy planet is portrayed as something desperately in need of a woman's touch

On the whole I think Bujold simply grew up a lot by 2001, and it conveys itself in the books.

>>15955600
Nothing shallow about Vorkosigan except Ivan's relations with women.

>>15944886
Mote in God's Eye, Footfall
Yes. And speaking of Larry Niven, his first contact story about the Kzinti, The Warriors:
"Circa 2366 the Angel's Pencil, a Human colony ship propelled at sublight speed by a light-pressure drive, had traveled 11 years toward We Made It from Sol System. It was overtaken by a starship (unnamed in this story, later called Tracker) of the aggressive, militaristic Kzinti, whom Humans had never before encountered."
http://news.larryniven.net/concordance/summary.asp?title=%22The%20Warriors%22

>>15955390
You can't read everything, anon. Just focus on the classics that touch on topics you enjoy. Me personally, I read all the degenerate stuff.

Are there any books that are similar to these two.
I'm searching for fantasy books with focus on the main character and not some epic grand fantasy quest with half a dozen of different plot drivers.

>>15943987

terra ignota

>>15954435

>>15950660
Thanks anon

>>15942465
Tell me about Red shirts by Scalzi.
Is it good?

>>15956004
*tips fedora*

>>15956026

*tips*

>>15956016

scalzi is a fucking joke. I can't believe his shit even gets printed.

>>15955840
succ me mami

>>15955840
This, there are thousands of shitty book for every few good ones. Instead of slugging trough the shit being released in order to find the one diamond hiding just get the diamonds who have already have been found and determined to be such long ago.

>>15956414
Writing styles and concepts get dated easily so it's usually more rewarding to find something new.

>>15956414
This, but also read new shit.

>>15956587
They only get "dated" if you keep up with the constant releases. Having never read sci-fi before Asimov seems completely fresh and original in every way. That would not be the case if I had read several of his inferior copy-cats before, that would have soured the experience.
>>15956592
Meh, I will wait until a more or less "objective" hierarchy of quality has been established between the released work before I try them.
Little changes if I read the fictional story now or in 5 years, but in 5 years I won't have to try and guess what has, at least, good prose and a coherent story.

is le Guin's fantasy stuff just as based? I just finished The Dispossessed and really enjoyed it. she's very heavy on the themes.

>>15956671
But in 5 years you dead.

>>15956683
Earthsea is heroic fantasy but YA/for children. Orsinia is not fantasy but pretty good. I think she did SF better than fantasy

>>15956683
>>15956866
>Earthsea

https://thecharlieborchardblog.wordpress.com/2020/07/25/off-world/

Here's a link to my blog where you can download a free copy of my sci-fi novelette. I fixed some issues anons picked up on last time in regards to formatting. You can let me know on the comments to the linked blog page what you think if/when this thread dies.

>What is the spark of life? How many years can pass before it's too late to fix our mistakes? Off World begins with a young man named Jasper South waking from a ten year stay in cryostasis. He's woken forty years early by his former employee, Phillip Swan, who has lived those ten long years entangled in a world of illegal, state-of-the-art science and the criminal underworld. Jasper finds that a dark conspiracy has put not only his life in danger, but the lives of those he loves.

>>15956866
Earthsea is only yaish for one book

>>15956914
No one cares what triggers snowflakes like you

>>15957398
Is there some problem with what I posted? I don't understand your response.

>nothing to read for like a month
>velocity weapon and salvagers sequels out in same week
why the fuck does scifi publishing always group notable releases together

What should I read next?
The Black Company, Elric of Meniboné, or Perdido Street Station?

Malazan was good but lacking in good characterization
The First Law was good but lacking in world building
Stormlight was good but the fights were too anime for my taste

>>15957547
Both Black Company and Elric are pretty damn comfy. Haven't read Perdido but I really enjoyed The City & the City. How can one man be both based and cringe at the same time??

>>15956914
>keeps posting the same screenshot from Amazon's Look inside
Lmao
At least download the epub and fish for juicier bits
>>15957439
There isn't, unless you start twisting that to make the series into "It's too political" or "Good fantasy should be 100% escapism".

Am I supposed to take notes while reading Malazan or something? I just finished book four and I'm really enjoying it, but the author is just constantly reintroducing characters that made an appearance in like one chapter of the first book.

>>15957439
>I don't understand your response.
Because we didn't respond how you wanted. No one cares. If a story is fun you enjoy it. I don't see people making noise over classics with ledo authors.

>>15957115
>What is the spark of life?
>to regenerate your limbs
>to see the nutrients flow into you
>to hear the lamentation of death as you live past your due date

>>15953781
I like WoT but have to agree with this statement. If TGS and TSR haven't done it for you, it's probably not going to get better (unless you really like the female bickering that comprises most of 7-10).

>tfw your favorite modern short story writer has a new story out, but it's in a paperback that apparently will never get a digital release and you don't want to buy anymore paperbacks

>>15954466
The first book is chock full of foreshadowing of events and developments later on, but you probably wouldn't even realize it on your first read-through anyway. You can skim until they get to the Blight.

>>15957794
>Am I supposed to take notes while reading Malazan or something?
I unironically did keep notes. I drew character maps to keep track of who was in which group and how they were related. I did the same thing for figuring out the Houses of the deck of dragons and other Ascendants. Only other series I did that with was Tad Williams' Shadowmarch, when I was trying to piece together the mythology and figure out which names for the gods corresponded with each other in the three different holy books.

>>15957794
You haven't even finished meeting new characters yet. Just wait til book 5 when you go to a completely new continent with completely new characters, and the whole thing is set before the events of book 1.

>>15957898
Heh

>>15958145
Who is it, anon?

What are you reading at the moment fellas? Is it any good? Pic related is okay, I'm about halfway through now. It's a bit straightforward though, and I feel it's not taking full advantage of the world/setting it finds itself in, but that might be something addressed in the next one

Can someone give me a recommendation on where to start with Conan? Or even better some kind of order in which to read them? Wikipedia is not very helpful.

>>15958815
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B074CB1LWY?searchxofy=true&ref_=dbs_s_aps_series_rwt

Buy or download those collections and read them in the order presented.

Tell me about this site, anons. https://shelf.li/shelf

>>15958901
Looks like an even shittier Goodreads with a practically empty database. All the authors listed on the Demo are /sffg/ tier.

Are you shilling your own website, anon?

>>15958853
Nice, thanks.

>>15959055
No. Wanted to know if I should use it.

>>15959063
Just pay it forward.

>>15959086
You should ignore retards that think you're shilling your own thing because they've never seen it mentioned here before. I brought up a book I was looking forward to reading months ago and I was unironically accused of being the writer of said book because the morons here never heard of that writer before.

>>15959103
The app/website was developed by a redditor who's into Sanderson and SF/fantasy. I'd say chances are pretty high.
Nothing wrong with a bit of light shilling, but what's the point in this particular case?

>"Dune is a literary masterpiece"
>the protagonist and his mother are a couple of annoying Mary Sues
>there's no conflict at all since both of them know everything about everyone
Man, books really suck

>>15959223
It does

>>15954435
Alastair Reynolds
>>15958738
Finishing up Malazan botf 10. Subjectively, yes.

>>15959139
>a redditor who's into Sanderson and SF/fantasy.
Definitely fits in here then.

>>15959343
And objectively?

>>15959223
Dune is undoubtedly the biggest overrated steaming pile of dogshit that gets recommended here.

>>15959433
Objectively, while the series is overflowing with neat characters, fantasy concepts and story arcs, funny and sad moments; it might be too full of all of it. For many readers the series will lack focus, with a superfluous number of characters and places, the remembering of which turning out too tedious. Some readers have also expressed that they found a lot of characters being too similar to one another, or following a limited set of archetypes, though I don't think it's that bad.

But I have enjoyed the series overall, even though it has taken me more than three (3) years and will take me a couple more days to finish. It is a competent heap of epic fantasy. The author having a archaeology/anthropology background really shows.

>>15953080
they're pretty meh imo. Doesn't really add anything interesting. Maybe the firsr one you could give a go

>>15955145
I liked the first 3 books of legends of first empire, the latter 3 were very meh

>>15959488
The silent majority speaks out.

>>15958815
Conan is like a dozen short stories.... that has no real order

>>15953914
Yea but translators are generally not traditional writers nor are they making much money
So what can you expect...
obviously going from Chinese to English you are going to lose the wordplay or subtle sentence structure too

>>15956414
But the people who selected those diamonds and singled em out are a buncha liberals... so how could I enjoy it?

>>15959765
Then pick out the diamonds selected by your preferred sorts?

Do you guys ever feel like fantasy is the least evolving genre out of the big handful? We're not any further than Tolkien, I mean, we've been repeating the same tropes for decades, the same stories, it's not that the tropes are bad, but it feels like the fantasy genre hasn't changed since the original popularized fantasy book, which is still regarded as the best. Is this just the normal timeline of genres?

>>15959815
Obligatory

>>15959835
Wow, nail in the head. Why do you think no one has ever tried to venture out of Tolkien?

>>15955864
Maybe check the Tower of Babel series (Senlin Ascends). Either now or next year when the final book is supposed to drop.
It's funny and whimsical like your pic related. Except for the 3rd book, it's mostly centered on one character and all the action is focused on one particular quest, I guess, but it's inevitable that writers run out of condensed plot lines and have to branch out with side characters and side quests. It's all too tiresome but wel...

Also, maybe, The Black Company. And since you don't seem to mind Reddit YA tier trash, (no offense intended): Prince of Thorns, Tigana, The Rage of Dragons.

>>15959815
Fantasy was more varied and creative before the publishers decided ALL fantasy should be derived from LOTR to some degree. Why? Because there's more money to be made selling multiple books to a series. The reason why Wheel of Time lasted 200 books wasn't because that's what the story demanded; it's because retarded readers were willing to keep buying these books thus making more money for the publisher.

>>15959843
The author of that quote probably attempts to put his money where his mouth is. Check out China Mieville if you wanna see post-Tolkien fantasy.

>>15959843
>>15959850

Some help PLEASE. I'm in the middle of Ship of Destiny, and the author is really pissing me off, because she keeps describing the dragon's eye movement as a "spin". Like
>The dragon's eyes spun
or
>The spinning of the dragon's eyes
She's described the dragon's eyes spinning ON HUNDRED FUCKING TIMES now, and I don't know what the FUCK she's talking about. Like, how do eyes SPIN?!
Someone please explain what that's supposed to look like.

>>15959914
>she
There's your problem.

>>15959914
You can spin your own eyes you know.

>>15959914
Fuck off. I told you not to read hobb, yet you wanted to be contrary, so deal with the consequences.

>>15959914

>>15959914
https://youtu.be/i3wqTUwImFY

(vid is kind of loud)

>>15959914
If you're reading something called "Ship of Destiny" you know absolutely what you're reading and what quality it is. You want to read witcher sphere phantasy, and you're getting it.

>>15959914
Oof. I think I might never read Robin Hobb thanks to this post.

It's hard to tell with so little context, but it's probably a metaphorical spinning. The eyes are so stunning they observer loses himself looking at them, like if they had a hypnotic effect or some aura.

>>15959948
Maybe you shouldn't be anonymous if you want to post stuff like this.

>>15943566
Classic

>>15955864
That Chinese thing should be right down your alley.

>>15959958
You saved the jpg, not the gif, newfag.

>>15959997
I'm a boomer and I've been here since before you could wipe butterfly arsehole

>>15954435
The Gap Cycle
The Sten Chronicles
Deathstalker
Lensman
Vorkosigan Saga
Berserker
Nova
The Centauri Device
The Star Kings
The Paradox Men
the first 5-6 books of Honor Harrington

>>15960010
So you were here before 1993

>>15957794
just use the wiki

>>15959914
>>15959965
Fuck off, Bingtown was great. Nautical fantasy too.
Her other series were trash though

>>15959948
I'm starting to regret it. The Live Ship Traders isn't bad, really. But boy is it slow. The plotlines aren't complex enough to justify the pages she's burning. I'm still going to finish the book though, because I've already invested so much time, that I have to finish it.

>>15959937
I don't believe she's talking about rolling.

>>15959959
I mean... I don't think that's what she has in mind. I can't imagine a dragon constantly doing that with its eyes. That looks silly, but the dragon is supposed to be beautify and enrapturing.

>>15959971
That gif is what I was thinking, but I still doubt. Because why would she describe something so cartoonish? None of the book describes anything likes this. The way she describes the eyes spinning, seems to be for everything. Like it's gesture as common as blinking. The dragon's eyes spins before she laughs. Her eyes spin when she gets angry. Her eyes spin when she's concentrating. And they spin whether or not someone is there to witness them. It's just super fucking confusing.
The dragon does have a hypnotic type effect, but again, eyes are always spinning for everything anyway. So like... what?

>>15959815
It's just convenient worldbuilding to start off of. It's hard to evolve into different world building. I doubt any currently working writers were reading pre-Tolkien. Our brains are just wired to think of elves and dwarves when we think of fantasy.

When someone is bold enough to step outside of those high fantasy cliches, they get convoluted real fast. Steven Erickson is a great writer, but between his world and everything else he has going on, it's just a lot of work to read his story. Even then, the tiste just feel like reskinned elves at times.
And although I'm a big fan of Marlin James, I couldn't finish his fantasy book. It's based off of African folklore instead of European folklore, and the writing wasn't strong enough to keep me engaged in that strange world I have no prior concept of.

I feel like most fantasy enthusiasts read to relax. Why struggle through Malazan for a month when I can read 3 Robin Hobbe books in a fraction of the time? I'm guessing publishers generally agree.

>>15956016
Scalzi wrote one good book called old mans war. And by good, I mean it reminded me of a modern take of starship troopers. Everything else since was just so horrid.

>>15959847
Thanks for the input.
Never heard of Senlin Ascends, but it looks quite interesting.

> And since you don't seem to mind Reddit YA tier trash
Yeah, I also read a lot of YA tier trash. But most of them are only interesting in the beginning and then either get littered with side characters and side quests or just repeat the same formula over and over again. Which makes it quite an unsatisfying experience.

>The Black Company
Is The Black Company any good? I read the first chapter ages ago and found it rather boring.


Now that I think about it, I read the first five books of The Chronicles of Amber ages ago.
They also went in that direction.
Can anyone recommend the sequel with Merlin?


>>15959994
What Chinese thing.

>>15960061
Merlin's Chronicles aren't quite as good as Corwin's, mainly because Merlin seems way overpowered compared to his Dad. That said, I still enjoyed them.

But if you want to read some other Zelazny I'd highly recommend Jack of Shadows or Dilvish the Damned. Both are short but great books.

>>15960011
Could someone please weed the bad books out of this list if I didn't like Dune, Sanderson, Malazan, The Expanse and don't want something barely "comfy" or "entertaining" like Black Company? I like Wolfe and Vance.

>>15960053
It's supposed to sound poetical. It's literally something akin to "losing myself on your eyes".
It's only cartoonish if you just think of the cartoon. I'm pretty sure I've seem a similar device used in old movies or shows in relation to vampires and stuff. Problem here is the motif seems to be overused. Maybe all those instances of eyes spinning all imply it like a Jedi power, some "hypnotic" magical effect not exclusive to dragons (or implying the person has some supernatural dragon like power). The narrator or the victim notices the effect from the way the eyes look.

>>15959914
From google I guess it was referenced as "pinwheel-like". So I'm guessing a hypnosis type visual

>>15960132
There's nothing worth reading aside from Wolfe and Vance anyway, so don't bother.

>>15960061
>What Chinese thing.
Xianxia, Wuxia

>>15960041
The book started off promising, but it's taking on water and slowly sinking.
I remember about a week back when I was done with the first book, I posted saying that I hoped Amber, Brashen, Paragon and Althea just sailed and opposed Kennit, Wintrow and Vivacia. That was the clear and obvious progression of events. And somehow, Hobb spent the whole second book having characters fart around. Only to then FINALLY get the team together in the third book. And while I'm still only in the middle of the third book, and the two teams haven't clashed yet, I still expect it to happen by the end. Perhaps they won't fight directly, but their opposing wills, will be a problem. And knowing that they're meant to come to a head for so long, makes the waiting unbearable. Like, you showed your cards already, Hobb, just GET TO THE POINT.

It really feels like the first book should have ended with Althea and Brashen manning Paragon, and then the second book would be the first confrontation with Kennit and Vivacia, and they would have an ongoing struggle throughout the second book, until something huge blows apart everyone's plans at the end. And then the third book should have been the "everything's changed" arc, where Althea and Wintrow and Kennit have pick themselves up, and reprioritize their motivations and find the resolve to fix everything.

>>15960132
>I like Wolfe and Vance.
For Vancian short fiction check out a nigga I'm never gonna stop pimping: Schuyler Hernstrom.

>>15960132
A Cancticle for Leibowitz

One should experience how something is and not how one wants it to be. That leads only to disappointment and frustration.

>>15960153
>>15960166
>>15960168
Nah bros, please. I was referring specifically to Space Opera which is why I quoted the space opera list.
I have Lyonesse on my backlog and the only Wolfe left on my backlog, the one I'm pressed to keep reading, are his short stories, which I'm sparsely and carefully administering like some antidote.

>>15960132
I just can't buy into that. It doesn't make sense to the context of the book, it has to be a visual of some kind. The best I can imagine is when reptiles blink their double eyelids. But even that seems wrong. But sometimes the spinning is sustained. Or sometimes it's fast.
It has to be some kind of physical gesture.

>>15960139
The other parts of the book aren't so cartoonish.

>>15960132
>>15960166
And for longer Vancian fiction check out Michael Shea.

>>15960184
List a space opera that you like then.

>>15960205
How would I know? I'm very cautious with SF and I'm not that good with subgenres. Hyperion was pretty good (Fall of Hyperion was terrible).
I'm just looking for an engaging plot, some non tropey characters, little to none hard SF autism and decent writing that's not cheesy.

>>15960187
None of those descriptions contradict the fact it's the obvious representation of a visual effect in prose form of a probable supernatural power. Why would a physical manifestation be required? It's kinda 'tism-like.

>>15960283
You aren't going to find what you are looking for.

>>15960187
Maybe they're literally spinning?

>>15960283
1. The situations eye spinning is described, is in conjunction with other actions the dragons takes. It's a description used more in line with "the flick of an ear" or "a wag of a tail" or "sucked his teeth". The manner its used doesn't necessarily equate to the influence it has over others. Like I said before, the eyes spin even when no one is around to witness. So does that mean they eyespinning is just a reflexive glamour, on the off chance that someone or something might be in the vicinity?

2. A clear physical description of the eye's action would make it less frustrating to hear described 100 times. Because every time it's described, my brain reaches for a visual, so I can imagine it, but it can't grasp what is happening. The idea is too slippery to hold, so I just slip around it, not able to understand.

Why do wizards wave wands? It's a gesture to help the reader understand that magic is manifesting. It's a solid idea. It's graspable.

I expect no less autism from /sffg/ than to have many people argue at length about eye spinning.

new thread
>>15960236
>>15960236

>>15960160
>you expect me to read all that shit for a shit book.png

>>15960397
>ever reading anything anyone ever posts about anything
Not even zeroth.

>>15954435
>>15960132
Try Neal Asher's agent cormac series and Bv Larson Undying Mercenaries series.

>>15960426
If you never read any post, how did you know what my post was talking about?

>>15960345
Well, there are hundreds of literary expressions regarding eyes, maybe she tried to coin a new one. You know, the "show not tell" thing and how eyes are the windows of the soul or some shit like that. Some writers try visual prose but suck at it. You can say someone is deep in concentration, or make some poetic description of their eyes. "Her eyes gleamed with life", or "A cloud passed over his eyes", as if any of that shit made any sense in real life. But the "spinning" does sound pretty bad.

In the examples here https://www.goodreads.cc/429/26701.html
I interpret it as some flowery expression to indicate the dragon's state of mind more than the manifestation of some power, but idk.

You fucking autists. A dragon is a large creature. If it wants to look around and focus on something without moving it's head, then it will roll it's fucking eyes.

>>15960479
Then describe it as rolling.

>>15960479
Reading comprehension requires varying degrees of autism and not being a brainlet to get it right.
>The dragon still looked down on him, considering each name carefully. His eyes spun faster and faster. ‘No. I think not,’ he said, and amusement shimmered in the rumbling voice. ‘I think I will name you “Meat”. ’
Take this example. The dragon is looking at a stationary object, while remaining almost perfectly still. Why would he need to "roll" his eyes anywhere if the thing he's looking at is not moving, genius?

>>15960538
He is running down a list considering names. Have you ever took a video of yourself reading a book? Do you see how your eyes move? You fucking autists.

>>15960690
Ah yes, running down a list of names inside his head (because they're not printed anywhere). My eyes do move when I add 3 and 3 or when I do a mental list of the things I had for breakfast... not to mention when I recount my primary school classmates. Sure. My eyes move a lot when doing that...

You're a fucking brainlet.

Any tips how to outline a fantasy story?

>>15960722
Look. Are you gonna give me the pucci or not? Because you seem like you want me to fuck your backpussy. I bet you're female.

John Conroe is a shitty author. Fuck everyone who recommended any of his trash