/lit/ - Literature

>>15902933
What would a fascist reading of Tolkien look like

>>15902933
What would a fascist reading of Dr. Seuss look like?

>>15902940
It wouldn’t be different, at all.

>>15902933
What does any reading of Deleuze look like? It's total word salad meaningless hackery and everyone knows it.

This is the table of contents of A Thousand Plateaus

>>15902953
It’s not, A Thousand Plateaus is pretty intelligible. If you don’t get it, you’re likely not working hard enough, or you’re just not very bright.

>>15902961
I know you're not serious, but I would not be surprised if Deleuze/Guattari intentionally wrote total BS just spat out on the page as a performative revolt against academia,and now people who have never read it pretend to understand it/twist it for their purposes to seem esoteric and well-read

you really do have to be schizophrenic to understand this garbage lol

>>15902989
There’s literally nothing complex about what’s being described there. Arborescence inhibits free-thought by imposing strict hierarchical order, where rhizomes allow for thought to expand in all directions and from anywhere.

>>15902933
>I'm a right wing postmodernist
Who do you imagine?

Deleuze is a phenomenological techne for breaking out of (and ultimately breaking down) existing conceptual orders, what Marx and Engels called ideology, but not much more. If you appropriated him to break out of a stagnant neoliberal order and make room for a fascist one, that would be a fascist reading of Deleuze.

Keep in mind that neoliberals love him and other thinkers similar to him because his praxis is so shallow, and he can only ever be a techne. Freeing up subjectivity is meaningless if you don't have any further exposition of what subjectivity is, what it's situated in, what happens when you free it up. Deleuze's existentialist phenomenology was already implicit in Stirner, which Marx critiqued for being a meaningless (and dangerous) retreat from true self-consciousness.

You can situate Deleuze in a critique of ideology in the marxist sense, and then substitute whatever post-ideological position you want.

>>15903026

me, i am unironically this

>>15903030
good response, thanks dude

>>15902949
this

>>15902940

>>15902933
Pro-Oedipus

What the body without organs thingy

>>15902989

The language is overwrought and tiring, but it's not impossible to understand with a lot of thought.

>>15902953
Why not admit there's stuff to read before it. What is it with anglos and wanting everything served up on a plate.

>>15903515
anglos are the niggers of the culture

>>15903026

>>15903411
This but unironically

>read Foucault
>dry methodology leaves significant room for reinterpretation
>use his elucidation of punishment systems to argue in the favor of modern penalty as a sublimation of taboo and refinement of despotic social contracts by emphasizing terror in chaos instead of in evolving scope of authority
>simultaneously pit this arrangement against the panopticon boogeyman recontextualized as a self-censuring penalty system where fanatical civilians serve as vigilantes for an uncontrollable, capricious mob
>suddenly authoritarianism becomes a reprieve from madness, all it took was assuming the panopticon a regressive step that instead falls back in line with the more realistic 'human justice network' models he delineates earlier in his book
The biggest mistake Frenchies make is assuming you agree with them.

>>15902933
jack ruselel

>>15902933
It would look like a tranny but with Primo de Rivera themed socks

>>15902933
A reading with an emphasis on Georges Dumezil and indo-european "war-machine" culture against degenerate state philosophy

>>15902953
God I'm so glad I'm actually intelligent and can do math so I don't feel any need to pretend that this bullshit is profound.

>>15903026
Literally any XXIth century fascist

>>15903154
I instantly thought of him too

>>15903001
LMAO when pressed to defend the quackery all they can spit out is absolute trivialities. God deleuze faggots are completely pathetic, ridiculous human beings.

b

>>15902933
>>15904697
This is the correct answer to your question, OP: a reading of 1000 Plateaus that recognizes that Dumezil, rather than Marx or anyone else, is the thinker D&G are most profoundly engaged with in that book

>>15906016
>>15904697
Elaborate. This sounds interesting.

>>15906572
There's an enlightening part in chapter 9 in A Thousand Plateaus regarding war machines and fascism:

>This brings us back to the paradox of fascism, and the way in which fascism differs from totalitarianism. For totalitarianism is a State affair: it essentially concerns the relation between the State as a localized assemblage and the abstract machine of overcoding it effectuates. Even in the case of a military dictatorship, it is a State army, not a war machine, that takes power and elevates the State to the totalitarian stage. Totalitarianism is quintessentially conservative. Fascism, on the other hand, involves a war machine. When fascism builds itself a totalitarian State, it is not in the sense of a State army taking power, but of a war machine taking over the State. A bizarre remark by Virilio puts us on the trail: in fascism, the State is far less totalitarian than it is suicidal. There is in fascism a realized nihilism. Unlike the totalitarian State, which does its utmost to seal all possible lines of flight, fascism is constructed on an intense line of flight, which it transforms into a line of pure destruction and abolition.

Basically, the organisation of power in war machine is not a matter of the State (which concerns itself with philosophy/logos/nomos/polis and transcendental thought), but is its exteriority and takes the form of "nomadism" intent on territorialization and deterritorialization through warfare (horizontal movement)

Indo-europeans ("Aryans"), Huns, Mongols are all examples of "peoples" who have mobilized themselves as war machines - often toppling "State" societies like islamic ones in eurasia, european kingdoms and indian

The fascist war machine is basically Dumezil's "warrior caste" taking over the whole State, and not submitting to "magician-emperor" nor "jurist-kings"

More in chapter 13

You can also see a resonance here with Ernst Jünger's warrior-writer-scholar society in Der Arbeiter

>>15903026
Someone who hasn't thought about it, or that doesn't understand what human value is and how the traditional and the conservative are attached to that, and merely thinks returning a stolen bad for non-moral reasons makes one moral. Much of postmodernism you cannot draw a moral or political belief out of, but I can see left-wing doing it far easier for obvious reasons, but of those that a "left-wing morality" does directly stem from, and representing, there is much also which makes it even the more difficult to be a "right wing postmodernist". You can borrow ideas from them, but why even call yourself a "postmodernist" if you're truly right wing, and if you're borrowing ideas from the right wing, but you're a postmodernist, then why call yourself "right wing"?

I like the idea but it just seems a little unthought out to me.

>>15903515
They are so stupid that they even had the need to create some low-tier philosophy that they actually could understand (analytic).

Also this >>15903554

>>15903026
>believes in tradition and hierarchies
>wants to dismantle narratives and metanarratives
I don't see how these are compatible

>>15907533
Mythic narratives aren't necessary grand narratives

I reckon you can have a pagan-like society with hierarchy based off of small, local narratives

Modernity is very grand narrative-oriented, pre-modernity though? Fables, fairy tales and mythical thinking prevail

Generative Anthropology and neoabsolutism/postliberalism.
They are a sociopathic bunch.

>>15907232
absolutely kino, based anon

>>15904873
I love how Russell never actually gives the single ‘obvious’ absurdity of Hegel, much like you cannot give an explicit reason for why Deleuze is quackery.

>>15902933
There’s a fascist Hegelian that has interesting thought in Deleuze I was talking to a few months back on here, maybe he’ll pop his head in.

On a “””serious note”””, is some kind of neo-fascism the only way out of the neoliberal mess we find ourselves in? I certainly envisage a large chunk of fascists revealing themselves in the wake of 2024, in a Lewis/Pound grasping for an alternative in a society that seems broadly reflective of the apathy of Georgian/Edwardian monarchy of the 1910s. We already see the roots in QAnon and the wider right resurgence in Europe and America. Fisher says that we cannot envisage an alternative to capitalism, but is that only because he was too scared to look at fascism - an obvious (when we remove totalitarianism/Nazism from the equation) alternative that would have broadly similar class-conscious aims to Marxism, but without the anti-history ontology that so many normal people loathe?

>>15902933
>fascism
>reading
Fascists don't read. They don't write. They don't pursue any kind of artistic or scientific advancement. The goal of Fascism is - just like Soviet communism, its brother from another mother - to create a 'new man' that blindly obeys the supreme authority. An animal that does not dare express his individuality, but just follows a simple input-output program like a factory appliance or an animal.

>>15907878
You’ve said your piece, go and post on another thread now please, imbecile.

>>15907859
The wrong side won ww2 for sure

>>15907892
Care to point out how I am an imbecile for posting that?
The true fascist, presented with Deleuze's book (or any book) would not read it.

>>15907859
Yes. Once Liberalism starts literally imploding in on itself (which is an American election or two away) and as Marxism remains an impotent farce, and as Trumpian populism is dead in the water, Third Positionist ethos will naturally manifest.

>>15907859
A kind of neo-nationalism is the answer, based around the genetic competition between ethnicities that inherently degraded pluralistic societies over time, fascism is a little too occult obsessed for modernity. So similar in some ways to fascism but not quite

>>15902933
have fun opie

http://www.4pt.su/en/content/deleuze-guattari-new-right

>>15907618
>implying the premise of traditonalism isn't that the metanarratives of the past were authentic and more realistic to the constipated metanarrative of the modern causing the postmodern which has helped the traditionalist in some ways get over the modern
Still, the traditionalist isn't a postmodernist.

>>15902940
hobbit camps