/lit/ - Literature

Finally. Someone had to do it

>These judgments should lead to silence yet I write. This is not paradoxical (el mort, p89)

>>14373062
whats ur favorite bataille work

>>14372963
Laugh and Laugh
at the sun
at the nettles
at the stones
at the ducks
at the rain
at the pee pee of the pope
at mummy
at a coffin full of shit

>>14373096
what’s yours

>>14373107
accursed share

>>14372963
He looks like a pseudointellectual.

I don't know what the intimate order or the order of things are but he sounds like a fag who can't into the symbolic interpretation, just like all the rest of the profane moderns.

>>14373116
Good choice

>>14372963
Would you look at the face on that motherfucker. I wouldn't trust him to cook me a dinner, let alone give me philosophical advice.

yea mate, fuck gaynon (who was literally a semitic and ugly freak), ebola (who was literally an afro-mexican) and coomarawampshit (who was literally a poo).

>>14373291
>coomaraswampshit
kek

>>14372963
>Dude if you are a real man you accept oppositions because violence and virility

If you look at Bataille and can't immediatly tell that he's a charlatan you are an autist incapable of facial recognition. Insane that I'm sharing a planet with people who don't recognize people for who they are, such a crucial, fundamental aspect of my life and every interaction yet it seems like only about 10% of all humans are capable of this. Why?

>>14373120
8 posters and one of them picked it up. 10% might seem probably afterall.

>>14373359
read ur post and i know ur a fag lol

>>14373372
wrong, thanks for proving my point, alienated soulles droid who can't even intuit my personality from one of my post. imagine being so diminished.

>>14373389
lol shut up queer

>>14372963
>not understanding exoteric vs esoteric
always knew bataille was a brainlet

>>14373359
Because most people are basically charlatans. I don't mean all the time about everything, they usually have genuine relationships with other people, but as far as their concept of self and their concepts of other people go, it's a giant retarded charade of unexamined pride and anxiety.

>>14373399
>downplaying exoteric differences so you can keep your gay little fantasy up that all the religions are mutually assimilable if only you just ignore literally the thousands of ways they're not and call it "esoteric"
bruh

>René Guénon's theories appear to me to be stamped with simplification. Guénon is pretentious, rash; and if he knew as little about traditional thought as he knows about modern thought, which he criticizes wretchedly (everything he says about it - and he uses everything he says as a reason for outright condemnations - would fall down if he had so much as heard of Hegel or Nietzsche, let alone Heidegger), he would only merit a shrug. At all events, one would need a facile mind to read with any confidence an author whose haughtiness is so unwarranted. (Georges Bataille, The Accursed Share, Vol. 2)

>>14373433
>Bataille: well first guenon is wrong because he's not nice, he's pretentious and he hurts my feelings. I swear if he had read my favorite author and seen avengers he'd think twice before publishing. here's my latest novel about teenage sex (it's deep)

>Guénon: C'est que, en effet, tandis que le fini présuppose nécessairement l'Infini, puisque celui-ci est ce qui comprend et enveloppe toutes les possibilités, l'indéfini procède au contraire du fini, dont il n'est en réalité qu'un développement, et auquel il est, par conséquent, toujours réductible, car il est évident qu'on ne peut tirer du fini, par quelque processus que ce soit, rien de plus ni d'autre que ce qui y était déjà contenu potentiellement. Pour reprendre le même exemple de la suite des nombres, nous pouvons dire que cette suite, avec toute l'indéfinité qu'elle comporte, nous est donnée par sa loi de formation, puisque C'est de cette loi même que résulte immédiatement son indéfinité; or cette loi consiste en ce que, étant donné un nombre quelconque, on formera le nombre suivant en lui ajoutant l'unité. La suite des nombres se forme donc par des additions successives de l'unité à elle-même indéfiniment répétée, ce qui, au fond, n'est que l'extension indéfinie du procédé de formation d' une somme arithmétique quelconque; et l'on voit ici très nettement comment l'indéfini se forme à partir du fini. Cet exemple doit d'ailleurs sa netteté particulière au caractère discontinu de la quantité numérique ; mais, pour prendre les choses d'une façon plus générale et applicable à tous les cas, il suffirait, à cet égard, d'insister sur l'idée de (( devenir » qui est impliquée par le terme (( indéfini ,,, et que nous avons exprimée plus haut en parlant d'un développement de possibilités, développement qui, en lui-même et dans tout son cours, comporte toujours quelque chose d'inachevé ; l'importance de la considération des « variables », en ce qui concerne le calcul infinitésimal, donnera à ce dernier point toute sa signification.

lmao, imagine thinking Guénon was not familiar with Hegel or Nietszche when he studied mathematics and philosophy in university.

>>14373503
you won't post that in english because you know it's fucking garbage and you don't want anyone to read it lmao "look a french man said a long paragraph! he smart!" shut up twat

>>14373433
What the fuck? How does Hegel, Nietzsche and Heidegger refute him in any way?

>>14373512
I won't post in english because I know anglos are intellectualy bankrupt and wouldn't contribute to the discussion whatsoever.
I mean, a quick look at anglo philosophy vs continental provides ample proof.

>>14373531
then why post at all, you literally just grabbed a random paragraph of guenon that you liked and used it in order to BTFO a strawman faux-paragraph of bataille, that's cringe bro

>>14373543
Stop ignoring me just because guenonfag is an easier target. Answer my fucking question >>14373513
Literally nothing that these thinkers say refutes him in any way. It sounds like Bataille just doesn't understand him

>>14373433
>an author whose haughtiness is so unwarranted
Guénon spoke and wrote; French, German, Latin, Greek, Farsi, Chinese, Hebrew, Sanskrit (and more) He was a mathematician, had extensive knowledge of western philosophy AND eastern traditions. Bataille is a sentimentalist who writes about anal sex. He resents Guénon because he was everything Bataille dreamed to be; actually subversive. Whereas the extent of Bataille subversion is writing about adolescent sexual escapades, Guénon shakes the very foundation of a 2000 year old civilization. Pathetic, really.

>>14373563
idk bro i've never read bataille

>>14373512
>can't read French
>larps as an """intellectual""" on /lit/
lmfao. pathetic...

>gets cucked by Lacan

>he hasn't synthesized the two
kek

>>14373359
>I havent read them but something tells me they aint up to no good
Brainlet tier

Bataille and Guenon are two sides of the same coin but niether wants to admit it

>The spirit farthest removed from the virility necessary for joining violence and consciousness is the spirit of "synthesis."
>guenon should have read hegel

>>14373714
You're just diminished, an empty vessel. You couldn't even infer from my post that with it comes the empiricism of validated experience. On top of being a soulless autist, you are dumb. I worded my post naively to bait you into replying, but truth is I know damn well why people are like this; it is in fact their own anguish and fears which causes this diffidence, like >>14373410 said, which inhibits their potential, because if they were capable to see one's true face, then it would mean that their own being would come to be uncovered, stripped of all its ramparts; light would be shed onto themselves, unveiling the secrets for all to see.

>UTTERLY AND IRREFUTABLY
Ok but was it retroactive as well?

>>14373727
yeah. bataille wants to (like a fascist) whole-hog create a 'tradition.' guenon wants to pretend like one that's at hand could still work. both see the theoretic possibility of creating (or joining, for guenon) a new world—and both fail.

>>14373852
This is why prophets are prophets, not secret society meme-larpers.

>>14373503
In which book does Guenon talk most about the ancient world, the traditional world of the earlier Yugas or whatever?

>teenagers still attached to the first (and probably only) "esoteric", "eastern" interpreter they heard of think he has the most impressive critique of a monolithic, at most half-understood "modernity"

>>14373433
He looks like the singer from Rammstein here

>>14373658
i can read french, that's why that stupid trick doesn't work on me, you can't just go around posting long paragraphs in french and expecting ppl to think ur smart

>>14374014
Feel free to actually name an alternative anytime, fag

Guenonfags on absolute suicide watch itt

>>14372963
I'm not a Guenonian, but pick someone other than a creepy french boomer who LITERALLY jerked off on his mom's dead corpse.

>>14372963
>I love limit experiences such as having the bull breed my wife
Why should I take Bataille or any other French (crypto-cuckold) theorist seriously? It's all a sissification psyop. Wake up, lit

>>14373359
Post face

>>14373585
based

>>14373433
Damn, I guessed fake quote.

>>14374278
>crypto-cuckold
I don't think it's even crypto in Bataille's case. An Algerian bull quite literally cuckolded him, not to mention Lacan. See this quote from a correspondence he had with some other French faggotue right after his first divorce.
>It pains me to say this, but concerning the rumors about my wife, yes. They indeed posses some veracity to them, or to be exact, all of them are true. I found out that she was seeing an Algerian man who wooed her with the piquant exoticism so common to his people. After the fight I had with him in my imagination, no other man would dare touch her, but after all that I paid a visit to the baccarat casino, and after being, you know, heavily paraded I was afraid to even look at my wife's pretty neck again. When she realized that I knew, she went into town in the middle of the night and I was so terribly dejected that I insisted on a divorce.

accursed share any good? seems bogus desu

>>14373585
Maybe, but I'd have to agree with him not understanding tradition or modernity. Another neo-kantian retroactively refuted by time.

>>14374367
>retroactively refuted by their own theories of time

>>14374367
Pseud with a bad reading in Guénon detected. Guénon's understanding of tradition and modernity is so lucid and on-point, that one could define these terms based on how Guénon understands them.

>>14373503
top kek

>>14374347
is that a Kantian apparition on the right? creepy...

>>14374347
yikes. legit changing my mind about this chap

>>14374382
Sure, but what is that based on? Maybe I'm just a pseud who doesn't understand laws of duration and why I should change my name and larp as an Neomystical Vedic Islamist. Yet, I can see very clearly how Guenon falls in line with Kantianism, and you can't.

>>14373585
>Guénon shakes the very foundation of a 2000 year old civilization
kek must be his estate shilling this shit so hard

>>14374478
explain how hes a neo-kantian

>>14374392
could be...

>>14374478
You fags always pretend like you have some superior knowledge that ruins everyone else's argument but for some reason you never actually explain what that knowledge is. I wonder why that is? Perhaps it could be because you don't know shit and are just trying to impress a bunch of mentally ill NEETs by making shit up?

>>14374392
>>14374540

>>14374810
the narrowing of empirical synthesis haunts

>>14373503
>>14373531
This doesn't have anything to do with Hegel or Nietzsche. Literally:

>the indefinite follows from the finite
>let's use the analogy of the natural numbers to explain this

That's it.

https://youtu.be/A2WbFH-lY3M

>>14374382
Define them then. Show me the way, Glaucon.

>>14372963
What if I hate traditionalism and dialectics too?

>>14375683
Tradition is (by definition) whatever the entity known as Guénon understands it to be. Same for modernity.

>>14372963
This is what I keep saying to my friend who's gone balls deep into Jung ever since I introduced him to Peterson--that comparative religion fixates on the similarities and ignores the differences.

>>14375723
>Peterson
This is supposed to be an intellectual thread.

>>14373794
lol

>>14374810
saved

>>14374347
The power of reading theory

>>14374347
That woman should have been beaten. Fucking slag.

>>14373359
He just looks like a weirdo, which he was. Definitely not a pseud though, brilliant actually (don't agree with him).

>>14373939
can a Guenonanon please answer this. I read Traditional Forms and Cosmic Cycles but it said practically nothing about the past

>>14373939
>>14376823
Guénon doesn't talk about the past for the sake of it. One misconception is that traditionalism is reactionary. It's not, tradition has nothing to do with the linear progression of history (although Guénon does not negate the existence of historiography and historical materialism, he thinks it has its place - much like modern science - but only if understood and studied in accordance to principles) His writings "about the past" are scattered across his works but you will not find what you are looking for, since Guénon focuses on principles and intellectuality, not forms.

>>14373585
>Bataille is a sentimentalist who writes about anal sex

Based. That's why he is better than René "the Horsefaced Muslim" Guénon.

>>14373503
alors ça c'est épique

>>14376878
well that's disappointing. Do you know any authors who do talk about earlier parts of the Yuga cycle?

>>14375695
Then you're a Deleuzian

>>14373585
cope

>in human affairs [such as philosophy] the argument from authority is the weakest
Saint Thomas Aquinas

>>14372963
I’ve been saying this will be a Nietzsche board for years. We’re just waking up from the camel stage.

>>14374347
Source on that or never happened

>>14373410
Projection

>>14377204
>doesn’t even understand the words he writes
Dumbest post I’ve read in a while

>>14377337
Still better than
>b-but he talked sanskrit how dare you criticize him :'(((((

>>14373120
he isn't one, unlike guenon

>>14373503
someone's mad

>>14374344
yeah i was surprised bataille would even spend time on a charlatan like guenon. turns out he didn't, i guess

>>14373585
he's a nobody anon. meanwhile bataille is a world-renowned philosopher

>>14377506
Can you actually say anything intelligent or is philosophy a fashion contest to you

>>14373658
>can't read one language of philosophy out of dozens
>"lmao pseud"
why didn't you post bataille in french anyway? could it be that your non-philosopher would look like shit in comparison?

>>14374014
based

>>14377523
post one(1) Bataille quote that says something of value

>>14377513
he's a nobody because he had nothing philosophically worthwhile to say. bataille is world-renowned because he had lots of it to say
cope harder

>>14377540
That would be a 'no' then

>>14377556
cope. your earlier post has a false premise

>>14374014
BASED

>>14375683
Come on guenonfags

>>14377530
>En dehors des choses sacrées proprement dites, qui constituent le domaine commun de la religion ou de la magie, le monde hétérogène comprend l’ensemble des resultats de la dépense improductive (les choses sacrées forment elles-mêmes une partie de cet ensemble). Ceci revient à dire : tout ce que la société homogène rejette soit comme déchet, soit comme valeur supérieure transcendante. Ce sont les produits d’excretion du corps humain et certaines matières analogues (ordures, vermine, etc.) ; les parties du corps, les personnes, les mots ou les actes ayant une valeur érotique suggestive ; les divers processus inconscients tels que les rêves et les névroses ; les nombreux éléments ou formes sociaux que la partie homogène est impuissante à assimiler : les foules, les classes guerrières, aristocratiques et miserables, les différentes sortes d’individus violents ou tout au mains refusant la règle (fous, meneurs, poètes, etc.). Les éléments hétérogènes provoquent des réactions affectives d’intensité variable suivant les personnes et il est possible de supposer que l’objet de toute réaction affective est nécessai|rement hétérogène (sinon généralemcnt, du moins, par rapport au sujet). Il y a tantôt attraction, tantôt répulsion, et tout objet de répulsion peut devenir dans certaines circonstances objet d’attraction ou réciproquement. La violence, la démesure, le délire, la folie, caractérisent à des degrés divers les éléments hétérogènes : actifs, en tant que personnes ou en tant que foules, ils se produisent en brisant les lois de l’homogénéité sociale.

>>14378255
How the fuck do you consider this insightful?
>people disrupt society by being disruptive. also waste material lol
fucking brilliant Bataille, thank you

>>14374347
Actually good for him that he ditched her. A real cuck would love this.

>>14378287
It's programmatic: Bataille develops a critique of modern (homogeneous) society, akin to the reign of quantity, typified by a loss of the sacred. Bataille wants to bring back heterogeneous forces - which are found in fascism (but this is not the way to go for him), in erotic transgression, and in luxurious religion...

>>14378287
dumbass. you need to read stuff that matters more

>>14372963
Outside of fiction, sometimes, I am not interested in this decadent and vulgar man's opinions. Might as well go listen to a serial killer's social commentary or metaphysical thoughts.

>>14374347
Why would he care about being cucked when he probably had countless orgies with his wife? I'm pretty sure many other men had their way with his wife too.

>>14374347
Source?

Guenon and Bataille would have gotten along well if they understood each other more. They both were on he same strain of thought

>>14375683
>>14374382
Anyone?

>>14378412
faggot

>>14378489
Well, they were both French retards so maybe.