/lit/ - Literature

a war is only beautiful if its cause is righteous.

>>14160620
someone just read the 1929 translation of storm of steel

>>14160620
yeah I really found horizon to horizon conexes interspersed with the occasional explosion to be the most beautiful and /lit/ state of existence possible

not.

>I would even go so far as to say that war is the closest humanity comes to the essence of beauty. The figure emerging out of the rubble approaches perfect inhumanity, divine peace, a memory of the moment of creation - of Aphrodite, or Mary who offered her half-devoured child back to the rebels. To think that a man should be free of emotion and spirit in such circumstances is inhuman in an altogether different way. There is a deep humility amongst men who survived within ruins, and for others to live they had to lift the veil of death from the earth and sleep along the banks of the underworld. War is simply the form of devastation entering the world, and men having to survive within the rift. To accept this is not inhuman, it is humility before Fate - and so perfectly human. Those on the homefront who live in a mobilised form of peace while lamenting their own ruin drape veils over life wherever it appears; they are the citizens who offer to eat the half-devoured child, just as the rebels flee. Against Fate they offer their own homes to an unknown and unseen enemy, devouring even the memory of creation - something far worse than war.

No it's horrible, it's only from the detachment afforded you by information technology and long periods of domestic peace that you make these absurd claims. If you were dropped into any of your "beautiful" war zones you would be mewling with terror and probably evacuate your bowels.

>>14160635

"The vanquished know war. They see through the empty jingoism of those who use the abstract words of glory, honor, and patriotism to mask the cries of the wounded, the senseless killing, war profiteering, and chest-pounding grief. They know the lies the victors often do not acknowledge, the lies covered up in stately war memorials and mythic war narratives, filled with stories of courage and comradeship. They know the lies that permeate the thick, self-important memoirs by amoral statesmen who make wars but do not know war. The vanquished know the essence of war—death. They grasp that war is necrophilia. They see that war is a state of almost pure sin with its goals of hatred and destruction. They know how war fosters alienation, leads inevitably to nihilism, and is a turning away from the sanctity and preservation of life. All other narratives about war too easily fall prey to the allure and seductiveness of violence, as well as the attraction of the godlike power that comes with the license to kill with impunity."

Chris Hedges

>>14160677
chris hedges is based

>>14160644
>not.
ooooh snap you really showed him huh!

>>14160667
>t. soiboi that never played a sport as a kid
Mussolini, Hitler, Julius Evola, Churchill, the ancient kings of europe, etc, all of them fought in the very darkest parts of war and became absolutely smitten in her. The actual fact of war is that there's nothing as enticing then her in all of existence. Even the amerimutt soldiers that fight in these pansy ass modern day wars admit they miss fighting.

You'll never experience human passions to their fullest extent then like in the heat of battle, to know ultimate purpose, to know you could die at any moment, serving with comrades who would (and some will) die for you.

There's nothing this soulless neo-liberal can do to erase this ultimate testament to humanity's connection to divinity.

>>14160737
*pulls bag of cheetos closer*

>>14160667
https://youtu.be/tMNI25Tg4iY

I hate everyday in my life since the war. I don't feel anything when someone dies anymore. My uncle, grandma and one of my oldest friends died and I never shed a tear and I hated myself for that. I hate myself for living where I do and I hate how I look how people in other countries are living and bitching about stuff we'll never see in our lifetime and some of them even romanticize it which is understandable. Just know that you''re blessed for living in peace. Imagine getting out of your house to do whatever and thinking that you might come back, how passionately would do this (meaningless) work. Now imagine someone you love hot out and then you hear a bomb and your heart beats fast hoping they're ok. Imagine calling them and they don't pick up. Imagine not being able to call them because there's no network. Imagine having no electricity or running water. Imagine having to eat some obviously spoilt food to not starve, or feeding it to your children. Imagine forcing your 8 yearold son to leave school and work again to not die of hunger. I didn't intened to make this a rant but here you go. Stay safe bro and don't go to military or something too. It's absurd.

>>14160737
Why do a lot of Americans think it's inappropriate to ask people about their time in war? Like some vets get offended if you ask them about the war. My father fought in Yugoslavia in the 90s. He always talks about it, even jokingly at times. Stories of him and friends running through woods getting shot at by a .50 cal on a modified crop duster, chucking grenades within 20m of enemies, being ambushed, setting up ambushes, friends getting shot, having to leave supplies behind on the run, some guy that got split by a misfired tank shell, etc. Too much shit to list. Anyway, despite it being a very unique and interesting experience, I don't think anyone who has been in combat wants to go back. Think of it as if you fought a bear and barely survived. It's a good story, but would you go out trying to fight a bear again?

>>14160737

point is, that you are not any of those people, and the dire conditions of war in itself is not something to be admired with a raging hard on and a bag of chips oops gotta go

>>14160761
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUxkFCBPgx4

>>14160737
>Mussolini, Hitler, Julius Evola, Churchill
>Postman, artilery officer and commander
I'll give you Benito, though.

>>14160742
So you admit you've never evoked the hint of any aggression in your life.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwA2VByUxAY

>>14160792
Hitler had one of the most dangerous jobs he had to run between the trenches.

Julius Evola was in one of the most dangerous fronts in the war.

Churchill before the war was a cavalry officer that led charges in colonial wars. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Omdurman

>>14160777
>I don't think anyone who has been in combat wants to go back
I have a friend that was a total loser outside of war. Inside a war zone he is a top tier professional.

>>14160784
You aren't any of those people either and have as much right to say whether it should be admired or not as me.

>>14160635
War is no more righteous than a lion eating lesser beasts. It's a crude act of self-preservation, nothing more.

>>14160820
Only a very small percentage of American soldiers actually experience brutal war. Most are just glorified base babbies. The closest the average American soldier today gets to combat is being 200 yards away and spraying behind sandbags. I'm not even hating, it just is what it is. I don't know his personal situation, so I'm not going to comment on that.

>>14160777
Its a well document fact that often time American combat veterans miss war when they return home.

>>14160846
lmao see >>14160830

>>14160620
>things people say whove never been close to a battlefield

>>14160859
>>14160737

>>14160859
>>14160830
read a book by someone who fought in a brutal war then

>>14160859
>Things simpletons say whose minds are infected by the effeminate modern Zeitgeist
If war gives men opportunity to be at their vilest, that means it gives them a chance to be their best too. Warfare is not worth demonizing any more than it is worth lionizing. It just is. Like the rest of the world it is grim and beautiful.

>>14160830
He gave a briefing and all of the grunts were laughing at him in his brand new 5.11s and brand new boots. Their sergeant stepped in for a moment to explain that the autist standing in front of them was not an REMF.
>Panama - had to ditch a third floor roof because they got over run
>Iraq 1 got forgotten at an outpost that resumed being in enemy territory after the main element continued forward
Then he told them that my friend was not a talking head - that he would be the first one out the door on the mission (Afghanistan). In Somalia he was strictly a theoretical advisor for the withdrawal. He's a poster boy and he got a special training slot in Florida now. There are a lot of non-average individuals and experiences.

>>14160877
Modern wars are mostly just planting minefields, airstrikes, artillery strikes, shooting from a distance, camping around armored vehicles, etc. Then you accidentally step on a mine and get btfo, or you get hit by an airstrike you never saw coming, or a random shell lands near you. It's very far from a noble struggle. You were unironically born in the wrong era. I would agree with you if we were in the Middle Ages.

>>14160737
>Mussolini, Hitler, Julius Evola, Churchill, the ancient kings of europe,
>basing your opinion on things people wrote to glorify war so people would fight for them

this whole thread is b8

>>14160903
>NO ONE THAT FOUGHT IN A WAR WOULD LIKE IT
>N-NO WAR CAN'T BE GOOD! MY SINGLE MOM TOLD ME IT WASN'T! THIS IS JUST PROPAGANDA!
this is what we call cope

>>14160872
why didnt he fight in ww2 then

>>14160901
Just wait till you serious the glorious light of a nuclear blast anon.

>>14160928
I dunno if braindead soiboi or b8, but generals hadn't led at the front of the battlefield for hundreds of years. It would put the entire war at risk to put the figurehead of the German people in such grave danger.

>>14160935
convenient excuse
if he's a great leader and war is so great imagine what him being with his troops would do to the nation's morale

>>14160936
He did visit his troops.

The antiwar movement is liberalism's own Death of God moment, a horrific madness of nihilism in keeping with the theology of its birth: a void between continents revealing God's weakness before brutality, a cruelty hidden within an incapacity for decisive ruthlessness. Where the humanist can no longer contemplate his own destructive capacities he begins to employ instruments of war against all of the laws which create its possibility. Foolishness for nihilism creates clownish machines, until even war heroes begin to doubt their lives.

One can only imagine Hesiod's pastoralism and forces demanding a return to war from those who had renounced it completely. Where fiddles are set aside for containment chambers of war's echoes forgotten angels begin to sing to the wretched. Siege guns set to the tune of jongleurs and the burlesque. The Religious Wars were nothing more than an instance of rearmament for what is to come, the World Wars a brief clearing of peace.

Only a soldier may lament his crimes. A world tribunal searches for these men as it recognises them as heralds of the unspoken war, the return of unknown soldiers.

https://youtu.be/aSNJ00iAZ7I
https://youtu.be/_kzjyuQA8ao

>>14160946
>the unknown soldier

>>14160667
Simplicius as the object of study for those beyond the perimeter of war. The beauty of enduring as the ruins tear into forests is little more than an instrument of study within the temples of reclusive authorities, where a theology of man may only endure as a medicalised etiquette. War is the Christian fool returned to a cave state. Peace an eternal sterilisation before the necessity of amputation. The beard of the heathen grows as his science of crypsis takes on a natural appearance, his patched coat draped like some shadow of an animal. This is war, and all but man and the primordial gods flee from it.

>>14160818
>Hitler had one of the most dangerous jobs he had to run between the trenches.
Wrong kind of runner, he was stationed in the rear and was running behind the lines. He was most likely a pog t for the whole war, unfortunately there are no sources that could confirm or deny wherever he briefly was a combatant before he become a runner.

>Julius Evola was in one of the most dangerous fronts in the war.
So was my great grandfather, but unlike Evola he served with dragoons that actually saw combat firsthand. Dude that calculates artillery fire has more experience with the physics of war, rather than the metaphysics.

>Churchill before the war was a cavalry officer that led charges in colonial wars.
That´s a single one, he didn´t lead. But yea, I was wrong on him, I forgot about his career in the colonies.

>>14160777
Because the theological aspect of war has been outlawed, dividing the nation from its soldiers and the soldiers from themselves. A Pyrrhic victory at the level of the spirit once war becomes too destructive to contemplate.

>14160620
I had a very chill Iranian prof in my uni who fought in the Iran-Iraq war, he lost a lot of friends there and it really looks like it had it's toll on his mental health.
Personally I think the American veteran (and American culture in general) glorifies war because they've never been through a proper one, not even WW2 was that brutal for Americans compared to what Europe went through.

>>14160968
A proper warrior doesn't die. The world is filled with rank amateurs, the darwinian dunning krugers. Americans have been far better at war than many others, the exception being for that teenage bipolar period. You should read historical accounts for D-day, get as close to the after action accounts as you can. Absolute clusterfuck. This attack would have been actual suicide. Hitler must have felt like god turned on him with the level of intelligence the Allies, and the US, had on their troop movements. It really is just Sun Tzu.

>>14161030
>Americans have been far better at war
>haven't won a single war

Literally counting troops like the bygone era Napoleon fucking derailed, how woefully misinformed. Almost as bad as sourcing a fucking tweet.

>>14161056
Imagine being a burger crying for intellectualism.

>>14161056
Americans almost singlehandedly fucked up D-Day because of their incompetence. This could be discussed but you know what they say about arguing with Americans.

>>14161084
Even now the stigma of fighting against the great American is fully entrenched. It has found a way through all cultural sieves and even you necessarily regurgitate a fear of conflict. Not really surprising, not so many countries effortlessly and efficiently train their children with live fire exercises.

>>14160737
>>14160620
holy fucking cringe

>>14160620
Its pretty aesthetic, anyone that disagrees is a tranny getting their hrt deposits from the cia.

>>14161269
What aesthetic about having all your children killed by a drone strike then watching a bunch of US marines rape your wife with a broken bottle?

>>14160655
>Aphrodite, or Mary who offered her half-devoured child back to the rebels.
What is this in reference to, exactly?

>>14160773
Joining the military was the best choice I ever made in my life. No drug has ever gotten close to the feeling of absolute agency and weight in those moments where you might die. You're never more there then when you are confronted with the oblivion of eternity before you.

Fun fact, the soldiers who get PTSD are disproportionately effected. The guy driving or shooting is significantly less likely to have PTSD after the fact compared to the passengers, it is precisely the loss of control that is traumatizing. To that I can only say, the best thing then is to bring war, rather than let it come to you.

>>14161278
The fire and chaos anon. Can't you feel it?

>>14161278
Thank you for continuing to demoralize the American populace.

From,
Cia Nigger

+1 estrogen pill has been deposited in your rectum

>>14160737
>Right is your larp post
>Left is actually you
Guaranteed you redditnigger

>>14161038
There were no limeys at Omaha, what a crock of shit.

>>14161278
Nothing is aesthetic about it at all, since this never happened. It's weird how victim fantasies are so prevalent nowadays, people fucking fantasize about being cucked or raped, it's some real perverse shit.

>>14160677
>killing bad
This is what's wrong with society today.

>>14161030
You may be right but when I speak of war I mean cities turning into battlefield in your own country, the sight of destroyed monuments and places you've lived in turned into complete wastelands ny the war.
Americans have never experienced that, they have never been invaded by a foreign country nor does the average civilian know what was is like. In a general sense America is currently at war, yet you as an American (I assume) don't feel any disturbance in your daily life because that was is not fought on your soil, the US could wage three simultaneous wars across the globe without their average citizen being affected by it,, which is why America as a nation is so aggressive in it's foreign policy. It doesn't know what it's like to be completely devastated by a conflict, at least not to the extent of what we experienced in Europe

>>14161331
That has happened thousands of times though. Drone strike have killed many children, and US troops have committed all kinds of atrocities. Are they not aesthetic?

>>14160620
This was posted on /k/ in the War is Fun thread:
>It's all fun and games until someone puts their eye out... or gets torn in half by an IED. Everyone handles the adrenaline dump differently. For me, it was this incredible sharpening of everything, and the complete absence of my constant, ragging internal voice which wants me to be miserable. It's just me and my environment -- there's none of the normal mental noise. I fucking lived for that feeling. It's really just not describable the feeling of having already been through a bunch of gnarly firefights and sitting there as gunfire drifts over the breeze -- close, but not close enough, a sister platoon in contact -- and being fucking READY to do violence. Your mindstate, which will come and bite you so fucking hard that it takes you a decade to recover, is so perfectly compartmentalized that you're past even considering your mortality. There's just the thunderous inner silence and the eagerness to go back into that modality where all the petty garbage of your mangled life floats away and you get to hone in on the one thing you know you're good at.

Trying to have a normal life is really fucking hard afterwards.

Fuck no. War is what happens when people don't read. War is what happens when the nigger gets the best of people. War is the opposite of /lit/

>>14160920
you probably wouldn't like it

>>14160620
>t. has never had to hide in his basement because his home town was being shelled by grenades
yeah war is so based, going to school without having to dodge landmines is so cringe.

>>14161601
Look at this girl's epic hair and sweet polo neck . Aesthetic as fuck

>>14160936
>cites Evola on how beautiful war is
>refuses to recognise that Evola himself argued that leaders should head the lines in battle

>>14161607
>tfw have a overweight friend who constantly shares 'war aesthetics' pictures (soldiers in fog/sunset tinted with yellow,blue or purple)

war fetishists are usually the last one to join the fight

>>14161612
I replied to the wrong guy sorry

>>14160737

Exquisitly based.

>>14160791
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rs3kKHhG4m0

>>14160620
20th century wars are the most vile and disgusting creations of mankind.

>>14160737
Maximum cringe

>>14161307
I'm in my twenties and hope to join up soon. This resonates with me. I know it is possible that it is at least in part romantic fancy, but I hope to experience the same.

>>14161615
There are people who do this with everything though. How many /lit/ aesthetic fetishists are there who don't even read? That doesn't diminish reading.

>>14160961

Ive been to the front where hitler was stationed it was one of the worst fronts near ieper. The trenches were shallow and simple and the bunkers ceilings built uncomfortably low on purpose because the german high command thought they could manage a breakthrough there and wanted to keep the men on offensive.
Hitler was wounded during service so it was indeed a dangerous job, and he received the iron cross for it.

There is one instance where the call comes for a runner in the night, and hitler says "let the others sleep, ill take care of it".
Extremely dedicated man to the point of autism

>>14161758
Try again.

>>14160777
This is just my opinion, but Americans love the dark tortured soul as well as the unsung hero narrative. People who have never saw combat will gladly avoid the topic either out of shame for having not fought or to imply that they have and it scarred them. It's equivalent to the girlfriend when she says "It's fine." Really, they want you to know it's not fine. I've read that most American troops who experience PTSD don't receive it from combat. I also think America in general is comprised of people and intentionally sends people to war who have no business going to war. We proudly send what are essentially kids who really lack the inner character to be effective on the battlefield to battle. Obviously, there's others for whom that doesn't apply, but on the whole, it does. America is mostly made up of strivers and brutes, neither of which implicitly share characteristics which belong to a warrior. Hence, why America relies so heavily on techno-industrial warfare.

>>14160667
fag

>>14161818
have sex

>>14160620
War doesn't even exist you imbecile.
War, insofar as it DOES exist, exists as an explosion without warning sent from a drone so small and far as to be invisible piloted by an overweight burger-eater several thousand miles away.
War is an unavoidable failing of reality.
>>14160667
Untrue. Many who fight in wars are not turned away from war.

Only in the minds of those who have never experienced it.

>>14160737
>modern day wars
>comrades who will die for you
implying they don't die for oil these days

>>14161818
You're right, a hundred twerking white women is surely worse than mass vivisection.

>>14161854
>hurrr wars in the past were so much more noble
Read Thucydides you naive retard

>>14161853
>>14161545

read a book you fucking niggers

>>14161810
>Hitler was wounded during service
He went blind as a result of extreme PTSD. Not a stellar review of the war.

>>14161856
unironically yes

>>14161866
You're right, I'll convince a friend of mine never to twerk again (not even when drunk) and in return I'll vivisect you
What's your discord?

>>14161856
What did the wars have to do with vivisection? And what if this is just another form of experimentation?

>>14160635
found the cuck realist

>>14161870
They performed vivisections during the war on prisoners of war in order to advance war knowledge. Do you not understand what that has to do with war?
I'd take doing some twerking over being sliced open and rummaged around in without anaesthetic, even assuming the worst case scenario of some lizard man caballist twerkspiracy.

>>14161873
Proof? Terrible if true, but doesn't amount to mass vivisection. And you seem really upset by memes.

>>14161869
Thats not how war works. If you can track me down and knock me out from the post you can vivisect me. Might makes right.

Other then that yes I agree.
>>14161873
Complete cringe. Beat your whore to make her stop, and then prove your worth through heroic deeds in combat.

>blocks your fascistic desire to destroy other humans

>>14161877
>proof?
I miss when you had to be a weeb to find 4chan. Unit 731, li'l zoom.
>>14161879
>that's not how war works
War doesn't care how you think it works. We're talking about whether the twentieth century wars were worse than white girls twerking. The only heroic deeds done were those you can find in the history books, right alongside the far worse atrocities. It's not anything you're imagining right now.

Relevant crossthread
>>14158912

>>14161888
Anon those "atrocities" were heroics.

>>14161888
>obvious wikipedia reference
What do bug people torturing their own have to do with Westerners or the rest of humanity in the wars? What kind of liberal autism are you on?

>>14161888
Why are you whiteknighting some random whores? You're a virgin aren't you anon.

>>14160667
>let me tell you about yourself
Plenty of men of all horizons have liked fighting.

>>14161888
Anon you're an actual faggot if you dont beat that whore until her face is black and blue the next time she twerks. I don't know if its because your single mom brainwashed you or something that this is hard to realize, but yes young white girls whoring themselves out is infinitely worse then whatever the worst war atrocities your boring mind could think up.

>>14160737
Holy... I want more

>happy Ernst Jünger noises

I was watching a documentary on some mighty empire that spanned across Asia in the 400s. I saw its neighbors chew on its borders like rust and build their empires atop its ashes, only to be replaced by another. I suddenly realized that this is all just ashes; empires, centuries, claims, intrigue, millennia -- just ashes. It's like fast-forwarding a movie about a man from his birth to his death. It was a pretty /lit/ moment.

>>14161898
I knew you were new. How did you find this website, zoomer-kun?

>>14161428
This is your brain on facebook.

>>14161607
>literally posts a staged photo op

>>14161545
>Fuck no. War is what happens when people don't read. War is what happens when the nigger gets the best of people. War is the opposite of /lit/
Anon, I...

>>14161883

>>14161898
>>14161900
>>14161905
>>14161909
>>14161914
>>14161923
>>14161951

Is this samefaggotry from some one who simply can't stop jerking it to destruction and mayhem? or is it a collective of degenerates?

>>14160737

>>14162017
How come every single "identitarian/fascist/faggot" uses these statues as some sort of profile picture, when they probably are ridden with grease, infected with fleas and carry weight to feed an entire platoon. Sad idealization. Sad!

>>14162051
they themselves*

>>14162051
Even an iMAX can't project so hard. Sad. Many such cases!

>>14162051
>>14162055
>everyone I don't like is a fascist
>I don't actually know anything about history
I suspect you're projecting with your descriptions

>>14162017
>if I ignore it it will go away

>>14162041
fuck off you nigger

Not really, it's just something ingrain in our animistic instinct as an escapism from the routine life of the stale peaceful world. It's no fucking different than falling for a radical ideology in hopes of changing the status quo for the promise of change alone, rather than making the world a peaceful place.

not gonna lie. a very selfish and irrational part of me wishes there would be another major war.
>sign up for a war that can largely be characterized with "good" and "bad" sides
>go through the traumas and brutalities of war, realizing that both sides commit atrocities, but the scale of "good" nonetheless still tips to one side's favor
>this conflict, this struggle will give me meaning. i may even die and my legacy will no longer be tainted with the overwhelming failings and uselessness of my life.
>live
>fail to contemplate what to do after the war ends
>revert back to useless NEET
>still irrationally, but genuinely, wishes for war

>>14162521
Why not just pay a guy to shoot at you for a few hours then blow your own legs off. You'll have had the same experience

>>14162201
degenerate detected

>>14162521
anyone who signs up for war believes themselves to be on the "good" side. otherwise they would not war.

Cowards have much to say on the evils of war they will never know.

>>14160620
I don't see how it can be on an individual level unless you're really lucky. There's no guarantee you wouldn't get a bullet through your head the second you climb out of your trench. Intelligent people usually avoid risks like that.

>Men love war because it allows them to look serious. Because they imagine it is the one thing that stops women laughing at them. In it they can reduce women to the status of objects. That is the great distinction between the sexes. Men see objects, women see relationship between objects. Whether the objects love each other, need each other, match each other. It is an extra dimension of feeling we men are without and one that makes war abhorrent to all real women - and absurd. I will tell you what war is. War is a psychosis caused by an inability to see relationships. Our relationship with our fellow-men. Our relationship with our economic and historical situation. And above all our relationship to nothingness. To death.

>>14162530
but then i dont get to justify my sacrifices in the context of a greater struggle
but then i dont get to hit the highs and lows of war
>mfw even trench warfare in WW1 was a dramatic contrast between long hours of "nothing to do" and "shells falling on your head one per minute as the overture of an impending attack"
but then i dont get to experience the bond and brotherhood of a life and death struggle shared between fellow human beings

>>14162545
true, which is why i didnt sign up for the Iraq War

>>14162560
>dont get to justify my sacrifices in the context of a greater struggle
You could pretend? Does something only acquire meaning because the government produced propaganda about it?

>>14160620
Who let this edgy kid out of his basement?

>>14162567
at this point i cant tell if shitpost or pure retardation
>why bother enduring the strict regiment and schedules of a dedicated sports athlete? any lessons in determination, dedication, and grit can be grasped by pretending!

>"does something only acquire meaning because the government produced propaganda about it?"
>implying my position of "meaning" can only be derived from government "propaganda"
youre gonna have to try a little harder faggot
>"SO YOU'RE SAYING <insert random cunty strawman">
>SO YOU AGREE WITH <insert "evil" label that everyone reacts with disgust to, such as Nazi, Fascist>

>>14160737
>>14160620
You are right. As a matter a fact, I already have a one-way ticket for a flight to France next week so that I can join the Foreign Legion. Can't wait to shoot and be shot.

>>14160667

>>14160620
war is literally anti-lit

>>14162639
Literally all the best authors are former soldiers faggot.

>>14160935

Washington personally commanded troops from the field during the Whiskey Rebellion you ahistorical ponce

>>14162593
Still can't grasp your thinking. So if you just randomly get your legs blown off, that doesn't have meaning, but if you believe it was part of something larger, it does have meaning? Is that right? But if that is the case, the only variable is your beliefs, so if you just believe your random leg blowing off was meaningful you have the same effect, without anyone else having to get hurt.

>>14161864

Adolf got wounded by bullet in 1916 and temporarily blinded by gas in 1918. He served in combat as volunteer from 1914.

>>14162834
i dont quite know how else to break it down for you
>all experiences are subjective. but they are still affected through external forces.
>random strike of lightning lobs off your leg
>why did this happen to me? what is the purpose?
>lose leg while pulling out someone trapped in a collapsed house
>it is unfortunate, but at least i was able to save someone

you truly are, an unprecedented level of autism and retardation

>>14162834
let me go by your line of reasoning
>outcome is the same, only difference is your beliefs

>im too poor to afford food. i am currently starving.
>oh wait, Gandhi starved himself in protest. i am currently starving.
>yes, if i just mend my belief i can make the reasonable leap from: NEET fag who cannot buy food to Peaceful protester struggling for the independence of his nation
>im not starving because im a useless member of society, i am starving because i am Gandhi

>yes doctor, this guy right here needs a refill on his meds

War. War never changes.

>>14160620
Wars for the homeland are kino. I'm talking American Revolution, Vietnamese during Vietnam War, Syrians now, etc. Being a fighter going to another country and killing people for corporations or any other interest is cringe. You're the worst type of slave in that case, a de facto bad guy. God bless all of the people throughout history who fought for the local side, defending their homes, farms, villages, etc. from foreign vampires.

>>14162832
I'm not sure how comparable a few hicks rising up over a whiskey tax is to the eastern front in WW2.

>>14162834
Interestingly enough, the latter is the main theme of Omon Ra, one of my favorite novellas

>>14160667
You're correct, anon. These people are psychopaths. Zero empathy for people outside of their in-group, a thirst for brutality lying dormant within them, itching for the opportunity to express itself within a legally-permitted context. And they use words like Divinity or God, which they know nothing about, merely as badges on their character, solely to glorify themselves even further. We should keep such concepts away from people like them, who inevitably pervert such entities around their own corrupt nature.

>>14163078
You can have empathy but still understand the need to kill someone.

>>14163089
>nothin personnel kid

>>14163078
Such weak and effeminate insects like yourself should be kept away from concepts like empathy to prevent you from perverting it into a glorification of victimhood and helplessness.

>>14160620
>war
>beautiful
War can only be beautiful to someone who hasn't experienced it.

>>14163165
psychopaths must have a really good time during war though

>>14163166
Maybe if you're also a masochist.

>>14160620
t. thinks he will finally have sex if he's wearing a uniform
Have sex, incel freak.

>YEAH KILLEM
have sex, incel.

>>14160737
ohhh lord fucking kill yourself

>>14160620
no

the right answer is of course

gardening

https://youtu.be/j5arZGgyGSc

Neocolonialism must be abolished.

Class war is the only war. The last war.

https://youtu.be/I5YZ7FELtCI

anti-war people are cringe

>>14163407
Two sides of a single cringe coin.
https://youtu.be/e9Q0Um4RMYk

Anyone have the hilarious video of burgerboomers screeching for war in Iraq/Afghanistan? It's one of the best neocon videos.

>>14163497
Americans are the Boomers of political theology.

>>14163497
>We're gonna have a war eh. Right on, America's just gonna SEND IT!
https://youtu.be/qo9IQUXdpXs

>>14162560
>but then i dont get to justify my sacrifices in the context of a greater struggle
yea but wars between nations and some random guy shooting at you are just as stupid and meaningless

>>14163356
literally fedora & neckbeard tier

https://youtu.be/RY5vTcLBnNk

>>14163407

>>14163497
Why is everything so shit nowadays? These people are the same as their predecessors but of inferior quality. We had some pretty good protest songs in the past. Now it's garbage like what you put. On the other side there are the neo-nazi types. The originals would listen to Lohengrin or whatever every week but our guys are a bunch of dweebs who listen to anime opening themes and meme shit from YouTube like moonman.

>>14161810
>Hitler was wounded during service so it was indeed a dangerous job
Cooks were wounded during services too, doesn´t make being cook a "dangerous job". The standard was an infrantry man, which was way more dangerous than either cook or rear-runner.

>>14163550
Shut up incel.

>>14163389
>Class war is the only war.
https://youtu.be/yy-SiZSlmhI

>>14163552
pic is who listens to this

>>14163593
Based. More of an ubermensch than some fash larper hiding in its basement.

>>14160737
Holy cringe

>>14163547
maybe its my autistic bias shining through, but i can somehow see the extension of "going to battle" for the family to "serving in the military" for the nation

there were plenty of atrocities on both sides during WWII, and there's validity in pointing out that most of the Allies entered the war well before the Holocaust was well known. but once the Holocaust came to light, i dont see why fighting to stop that would be stupid and meaningless.

>>14163596
dilate

https://youtu.be/qvRGq9hn6lY

>>14163619
>words words words
cringe

>>14163186
>doctored image
>AGAIN

>>14160635
You have no idea about aesthetics.

>>14163608
How did he know then?

>>14161030
The eternal Americuck.

>>14163662

>>14163608
None of the allies gave a fuck about the holocaust, it wasn't even the worst genocide of the war you fucking retard.

>>14163718
Let me stop you there anon.

>>14162560
>true, which is why i didnt sign up for the Iraq War
mega pussy

>>14163666
Americanism is coming to a city near you.

>>14160667
>>14160620
War is simply a state of hightened emotional investment and exploit, with greater, more immediate stacks, than the protracted stacks of most states of man.

This is why it enamored us so. Its not necessarily good, obviously, but the people who say war is just plain out bad are deluding themselves, or want to be holyier than thou.

Beautiful may be an apt word, but anything that expresses magnitude, not positivity and negativity exclussively (terrific, terrible, great, grandure, etc) are applicable. Its a great canvas for the expression of indiviguality.

And likewise im expressing everything here in terms of magnitude, because I think we are equilly captivated by a hero saving his compatriotes as well as a criminal mowing down innocents.

So Yes, I agree.

I know not everyone likes lindybeige, but I think He has a nice way of expressing it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBI1Hplnghs

>>14163608
>there were plenty of atrocities on both sides during WWII, and there's validity in pointing out that most of the Allies entered the war well before the Holocaust was well known. but once the Holocaust came to light, i dont see why fighting to stop that would be stupid and meaningless.
This is fair. Fighting to stop atrocities is valid. The type of war I meant as meaningless is simply war for the sake of expansion of borders or the wealth of the state.

>>14163771
Unfortunately this happened long ago. But at least the rebellion against Rome is impossible.

>>14163726
What would he make of the vast majority of the youth today not giving a single fuck about the holocaust except for memes perhaps?

All music is preparation for war. Even your fake punk antiwar trash.
https://youtu.be/_Ra9ibe3lB0

>>14161294
A story related by Josephus, from Wars of the Jews I think.

>>14160667
>t.Letzter Mensch

>>14160620
Absolutely!

>>14160620
It's only beautiful to young and gullible men. The older, smarter men convince the youngsters it's beautiful so that they volunteer to be cannon fodder.

>>14163858
t. galloped gallantly with his sabre raised high - just long enough to be seen, before promptly returning to safety as his men engage in the actual fighting

For aristocrats, war exists so justify their miserable existence, but it's actually pretty bad for those doing the fighting.

>>14160620
Yeah man, can't wait to get both my legs shot off for 3 square miles of dirt.

This was ugliness. Vengeance will be beautiful.

>>14163879
Men are born for games. Nothing else. Every child knows that play is nobler than work. He knows too that the worth or merit of a game is not inherent in the game itself but rather in the value of that which is put at hazard. Games of chance require a wager to have meaning at all. Games of sport involve the skill and strength of the opponents and the humiliation of defeat and the pride of victory are in themselves sufficient stake because they inhere in the worth of the principals and define them. But trial of chance or trial of worth all games aspire to the condition of war for here that which is wagered swallows up game, player, all.

Suppose two men at cards with nothing to wager save their lives. Who has not heard such a tale? A turn of the card. The whole universe for such a player has labored clanking to this moment which will tell if he is to die at that man’s hand or that man at his. What more certain validation of a man’s worth could there be? This enhancement of the game to its ultimate state admits no argument concerning the notion of fate. The selection of one man over another is a preference absolute and irrevocable and it is a dull man indeed who could reckon so profound a decision without agency or significance either one. In such games as have for their stake the annihilation of the defeated the decisions are quite clear. This man holding this particular arrangement of cards in his hand is thereby removed from existence. This is the nature of war, whose stake is at once the game and the authority and the justification. Seen so, war is the truest form of divination. It is the testing of one’s will and the will of another within that larger will which because it binds them is therefore forced to select. War is the ultimate game because war is at last a forcing of the unity of existence. War is god.

>>14163902
Is that what freedom and spreading human rights looks like?

>>14163915
Just have sex.

It's no coincidence romantic ideas of war and homosexuality go side by side

>>14164031
Imagine if your comrades found out about this.

life is perpetual war, its just either physical or psychological

>>14160620
imagine dying for a configuration of civilisation

>>14160620
Absolutely not. War is a greater horror than you can possibly imagine. Pray that you never have to experience first-hand, that you may continue to believe in the lies that glorify it. We are fortunate enough now that the people in power don't cover up the psychological issues that arise when veterans return home from war.

>>14160620
yeah only so i could rape
otherwise i cant get a girl

>>14160737
yes
YES
the tiger is based

>>14162017
Evola was a POG. Hitler was dishonest and used divide and conquer tactics. There was no one remotely smart who can justify war as a way of life except maybe Jünger but even he later discards or doesnt take those views seriously

>>14163650
Everyone knew the Nazis were anti-semetic though, retard. Also by D-Day the united states had been involved in the war for 2 and a half years already, stupid fuck.

>>14164464
Ok but how?

>>14164472
the OP you originally responded to
hmm let's see...
>mein kampf
>countless speeches by Hitler addressing the Juden problem
>anti-semitism runs as far back as to the days of Prussia

>>14164492
So the average Jewish soldier had an in-depth understanding of the holocaust in the middle of the war?

>>14164496
>chain of comment speaks about "everyone knew the Nazis were anti-semetic"
>this dumb cunt retard thinking he's a clever little faggot replies: "SO THE JUDEN HAD AN IN-DEPTH UNDERSTANDING OF THE HOLOCAUST?"

you remind of those cheeky little fags who keeps saying "source? evidence?" not cause he actually gives a shit about the source, but because he can pat himself on the back while he declares his little intellectual victory when people are too lazy to link him sources or find it entirely retarded to source something obvious

>"CAN YOU GIVE ME A SOURCE THAT SAID THE JUDEN IN THE UNITED STATES NOT ONLY KNEW ABOUT THE EXISTENCE OF MEIN KAMF, BUT ALSO READ IT?"
sure bro, let me hop in my time machine and conduct all these little social studies and other polls for you. what else do you wish to know?

>>14164560
2016 will never return.

>>14164574
>anyone who refers to the linking of comments and replies as chain of comments must be from leddit
>hehehe guys, leddit amiright

>>14160737
>I played sports as a child
>therefore I know for a fact that not only am I mentally and physically prepared to fight in a war but that war itself is the ideal state of man
>after so many noble, morally righteous men like Adolf Hitler and Benito Mussolini said it was awesome and all those faggot libkeks insist that it's soooo bad, isn't it obvious who to believe?

>>14163921
Kind of. You know that's Gaddafi right?

>>14160737
*does the fortnite dance*

>>14163879
Helmuth von Moltke the elder was a military genius you absolute fucking brainlet, he turned the art of war into science. The greatest officer corps and military bureaucracy in human history, that of the kaiserreich, was partially constructed by him.

>>14165485
gotta agree with this anon. so many of the "duh" stuff we take for granted nowadays regarding the military were stuff that were pioneered or effectively implemented by Moltke.
also his record in of itself demonstrates that.

almost every single successful person will slowly have their ideas eroded with the progress of time. doesnt mean the stuff they said wasnt valid, or deserve its due credit given the times they were in
>von Clausewitz and the idea of a center of gravity
>capture the capital = gg
>well yes and no
>center of gravity is no longer as clear cut as back in Clausewitz's days
>see Nazis captured Paris but war with the French still didnt end
>Napoleon set fire to Moscow, still lost
>see the issues of fighting decentralized terrorist groups
but theres still credence to his ideas, even though they have been eroded with the progress and changes of time

>This is the nature of war, whose stake is at once the game and the authority and the justification. Seen so, war is the truest form of divination. It is the testing of one's will and the will of another within that larger will which because it binds them is therefore forced to select. War is the ultimate game because war is at last a forcing of the unity of existence.War is god.

Fools, the lot of you

>>14161824
Everyone with the money and resources necessary relies heavily on technology. Despite what your government tells you Ivan, they don't make heavy use of WWII/cold war technology because they're just too badass to bother upgrading, they do it because they're broke and incompetent.

>>14161898
>>14161870
The Japanese vivisected at least two captured American bombers partially out of revenge for Tokyo and other cities. You cannot separate war crimes and atrocities committed as a direct result of it, although you shouldn't even fucking need too because war, according to 99% of people that participated in or were directly affected by it, is absolute hell.

>>14160620
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbNG2rqctAI

If you're the conquering soldier then sure

>>14165793
>according to 99% of people
Source?

>>14165558
But it's wrong. Interesting but wrong.

>>14160620
>>14160635

>>14162841
>and temporarily blinded by gas in 1918
main theory is that it was ptsd anon

>>14164472
>>14164496
Not the details at all, but overall yes, actually. The Holocaust was reported on as it was going down, but it was kinda seen as an extention of the general atrocities everyone knew the Nazis were doing.
>>14163718
p much this, they didn't focus on it until they had the leisure to. I'd like to pretend that they only focused on it as a way to justify their destruction of the Nazis, but honestly, they probably were genuinely horrified. After all, this was a genocide of white Europeans in civilised Germany, not random bugmen.

Are there any works that take this perspective that war is beautiful?

>>14166278
Most of them, because most are written by the elite and the idea that war is beautiful greatly benefits the elite.

>>14166301
Not at all, and you shouldn't assume everyone you speak with is a fool. This is a similarity you share with the 'elites' you supposedly despise.

>>14160620
I'm not going to lie I find the Second World War, and especially the Eastern Front, to be really awe inspiring. There's something almost majestic about the sheer scale of the destruction.

It's sublime, that's for sure, at least in literature. Those passages that go on and on in the Iliad and Aeneid where heroes just go on killing and you learn a bit about each guy they kill and get a gory description, it's great.
It's also ugly though. It's one thing for a main character to lose their best friend and take revenge because he's the strongest guy and the reality where your friend gets shot and there's not much you can do about it, you're not necessarily the best fighter, you have to be prudent or you'll die. So while I haven't been to war I don't doubt that it's much less interesting than the idealized version. There's a lot of waiting around in real life, a lot of boredom. They usually skip that in history and fiction.

>>14163007

It's a head of state leading more than 13,000 troops into armed conflict.

>>14162521
This is a temptation that modern, soulless world tries to snare the more intellectual with. Realize it as such, and entertain it no longer.

>>14166406
He was the head of the US military during the revolutionary war so he was in a special position where he was the head of state and best man for the job.

Plus c'mon there really wasn't that much danger involved. Literally more people died in the Boston Massacre (5).

War is the failure of words, therefore, it is the antithesis of /lit/.

>>14160620
I made this thread a couple of days ago. It answers most of your questions regarding War and those it does not it intuitively shapes: >>14148574

This thread also, which I made a little while ago but is generally more about the act itself of War rather than the philosophical nature/implications of it: >>/lit/thread/S14023092

>>14160960
Can I get a link on the video, can't remember the name.

>>14161321
>pissed his pants and everything
Fuck man, really quite embarrassing but it's war so he gets a pass.

>>14166184
Occultic Cope

>>14161890
Ey you referenced my thread.

>>14160667
Watch Ken Burn's Civil War documentary on netflix, your mind will be changed completely I guarantee it

Never before have I felt so romantic from the accounts of soldiers and generals

>civil war general Johnston attended the funeral of an opposing confederate against all his doctor's advice, died from the cold weather the next day
>Stonewall Jackson's death ending with hypnotic last words
>General Grant's memoirs
>Lincoln being a slimy fuck
It's horrifyingly beautiful, you'll never see humans the same way again

>>14160667
Also try watching Apocalypse Now if you're that much of a leftie. That one is very Left, while still beating at the heart of all warfare. AWay more intense

>>14166603
Care to elaborate on what was 'leftist' about it?

>>14166313
>not at all
Explain yourself, fool
>and you shouldn't assume everyone you speak with is a fool
I didn't

>>14166603
How removed from the world of literature do you have to be to think that disliking war = lefty and liking war = righty?

>>14166599
The American Civil War was a non-war by most standards. It's the kind of thing people were thinking the First World War was gonna be.

>>14160620
yes

>>14160620
Oh boy, it’s a jolly old time here down in the no man’s land. I love the feeling of being shell shocked and having my family being raped and killed by invaders!

>>14167208
I've always heard the exact opposite, that tech like Minié balls and telegraphs and the industrialization of the north made it the first and only brutal total war that the US ever saw. I mean statistically, far more Americans died in the Civil War than in any other war we've fought, and no other war ever managed to fuck up the infrastructure of any significant chunk of the mainland. Large portions of the South still haven't recovered from Sherman's march to the sea, I live in one of them.

>>14167208
the American Civil War was a bloodbath of unprecedented extremity and foreshadowed the first world war

>>14168654
No one is making the argument that war is painless, life never triumphs over sacrifice. It was the worst time of their lives for some and the best for others, this is clear to anyone who has ever listened to the soldiers. I find it interesting that leftists take the position of the government and the cruel family members who refused to hear the stories of the war, even insisted that what they went through never happened. Their position should instead be one of empathy and helping soldiers recover, which highlights the false spirit of leftism (not that the right are without perversions).
But in the end none of this is about individualism or political positioning. War has a deeper necessity.

>>14166184
>Listening to Ebola

You can realize all of that from the prospect of war, so you don't need the war and the philosophy self-defeats.

Even if you think something like "awareness of one's mortality" is stronger in war time, and alternatives like that I've suggested are some kind of "diet awareness" that's a poor substitute for the real thing, existential threats are more important to think about: the world never ended from too much "diet awareness", but nuclear war, the most likely outcome resulting from any truly serious modern war between major powers, has a non-zero existential risk that it completely RUINS awareness (after all, if you and everyone else is dead, there was no fucking point in you being made "aware", because "being aware" ruined every other physical and spiritual value).

Point being don't get your /phil/ from diseases.

>>14169607
You're right, I was being hyperbolic. It was definitely a war, it just wasn't a particularly noteworthy one. It definitely doesn't deserve to be romanticised like that anon was doing.
>that the US ever saw
Well sure, but as far as everyone else was concerned, the Crimean War had already shown that. The ACW was not the first war minie balls, smokeless gunpowder and trench warfare was used in.
The English Civil War killed more people proportionally than the American one, and people rightly treat that like a non-war.
>>14169639
Is this what they teach you guys in school or something?
>>14170330
You have a huge chip on your shoulder about leftists, don't you?

>>14170330
>War has a deeper necessity.
Huh like what
just ending your post like that screams *reads storm of steel and blood meridian once*

>>14161278
Odd that you imagine you'll be on the losing side.

>>14160784
He's not, but I was in Iraq. War is baller. The dude is right.

>>14161347
Based. I would kill for you.

To someone who says so, I would call him either a devil or a fool.

>>14172113
>I'm a fool who needs an introduction
>REEEEEE DON'T YOU DARE REITERATE THE INTRODUCTION!

Oh how the weapons clung, how their horses sprung, the bear roared and opened its fangs to reveal two rows of teeth, and in its belly was the gate to Hell, swallowing all soldiers that were cut down to it

Oh gorgeous storm of iron and blood, oh delightful hurricane of limbs and rage, you flay me until I am made pure, you refine me like a diamond, I live for the thrill, I live to hear the excited moans of valkyries and the pleasured screams of Venus Armatha, behind my smile are razors and behind my eyes, nothing

>>14172113
>t. hasn't read either

>>14171484
You somehow managed to both neither disprove Evola or make a coherent argument that is even tangentially related to the picture I posted.

>>14171704
I don't see how mentioning the problem with the leftist relation to war is 'a huge chip' when leftists are constantly shitting up these threads.
>>14172113
Nice attempt at bait, but perhaps you should explain why it's wrong and how the new leftist understanding of war is the correct one.