/lit/ - Literature

>>13183702
>Where would you even go from here?
The Bible

>>13183702
The world is on its last legs we have triggered a cataclysmic ecological event that can't be stopped now. No way we make it to 2040.

>>13183714
2060 actually

>>13183721
No 2030, the polar ice caps are half melted since 1985 so 2030. 2040 was an exceedingly generous estimate.

>>13183723
That might cause trouble along the coastlines but what else

>>13183714
>we have triggered a cataclysmic ecological event that can't be stopped now.
we did?

>>13183733
The polar ice caps are now melting themselves faster than we ever could by releasing methane. Huge plumes of methane are just rising off the water in the arctic circle. No efforts to change in sight either.

>>13183733
> What is global climate change

>>13183739
AI has a better chance of destroying humanity in the next 40 years

>>13183748
I hope we create ai, since we're totally fucked ai has gone from a dystopia to our desperate legacy. It might even be able to save us.

>>13183723

yes, i'm sure the information you have about the polar ice caps is grade a accurate

>>13183714
It might be the end of industrial civilization, but certainly not the end of the world, or even humanity. The Earth's been much hotter than they are projecting and has had just as much CO2 in the air. It's just a hiccup in the long run

>>13183754
>save us.
You’ll be one of the first to worship the Beast

>>13183712
fpbp

The way forward for humanity is the same as it's been for the last 2000 years. Follow the way of the Cross. Christ invites us as he has for millennia, and who are we if we don't follow?

"In this world you will have trouble. But take heart; I have overcome the world."

>>13183757
You can look it up instead of doubting to calm yourself, idc man I'm dying.

Clathrate gun hypothesis

ten generations of genetic editing should be sufficient to transmute ourselves into gene-traders, whose body is fashion and who are masters of flesh

>>13183759
Whenever something goes really bad life dies from the top down and we're the top. Actually all animals are the top, the strongest forms of life are microscopic. This is the end of anthropocene, the end of this stage of life on earth.

It should also be noted that intelligent life will never appear on earth again because we used up the surface resources.

>>13183767
go away Scranton

>>13183772
Seriously you want to doubt that post? That's the most scientifically credible thing I've said.

>>13183762
Is there any greater hubris than Christianity? Besides thinking that a god would give a fuck about you lowly mortals, you get up and spend about three hours getting ready to spend the day entirely within His gaze. Curling your fine locks; slowly inching on exquisite leggings; plucking away at the unsightly; adorning an intricately sewn and soft pair of felt shoes so that the earth remains undisturbed by your fleeing feet; closing yourself within layer upon layer of corsets and featherings to keep all forces and elements at bay while attracting the fancy of the piercing eyes of the world; spritzing your skin and hair with the eternal glaze of a prism; a second layer of leggings and tights to show off your gleamingly placid contours in relaxed poses; a wide-brimmed hat with the sweeping peacock lines of the ethereal; and finally a veiled nightshirt to keep any remaining inclement weather from betraying your fair skin, and especially adding the gravity of the world to those bouncing curls.

Yes. Yes. You are so fine and beholden to the heavens, an earthen vessel which G-d would love to take in his kind hands, kissing you gently. He will slowly remove all those layers of linen and silk, revealing the blossoming curves of you, the Virtuous Man. A spider woven into His web. And once naked in the light beyond this cursed earth He will ravage your gentle body without making you feel like a whore.

He will even watch as you spend another three hours piecing together your assemblage of the finest knitwear, just waiting for that gentle jiggling of the buttocks as you tighten your corset. As you gracefully walk away He will drape your curtain over your pallid shoulders; for You are the Veil of Maya and Logos.

>>13183763
cringe

>>13183803
Methane levels are still rising while you cringe my man.

>>13183796
God loves you, Anon.

>>13183796
Christian god thinks we're all lowly. You want to talk about narcissistic, look at the jews.

>>13183739
Yeah but so what, itll probably be nicer when it's warmer, and the plants can use the CO2

>>13183822
Methane, not co2. Also among the plants that flourish in co2 are toxic algae blooms, do that will kill us too.

>>13183817
It's the same book.

>>13183855
Well, the christians clearly rock that book better judging by how much more culture they have than anyone else.

>>13183839
nigga pls you just want disaster to strike you have no idea what the changes in atmosphere are actually going to do

>>13183876
I really don't, I'm just not going to deny facts because they're scary.

>>13183879
>facts
But they're not facts, they're '''''models''''' with no predictive value

>>13183888
You don't believe in science in general or just now? You can look this stuff up.

>>13183892
I believe in science that can be verified by experiments

>>13183871
Yeah they got their religion to take over Rome, no shit. Buddhism is very multi ethnic for similar reasons.

>>13183906
Buddhism is a trash religion made to placate the poor. Go visit Buddhist monks in thailand so you can see how vacuous and immature they are, because they were all poor and unwanted orphans dropped off at the temples. Buddhists also believe in the death penalty by mob.

>>13183805
>muh greenhouse gas is the only factor in climate
Okay, buddy.

>>13183796
Nice projection, you fedora tipping retard.

>>13183702
as for cultural decay, nothing is predetermined. Depends on whether or not we might be able to revitalize in the coming years.

when it comes to climate change, the human population of the world as a whole is fucked. but nature will be indifferent when we’re gone.

>>13183702
only pity can adorn the kind of idiot that confuses change for decay

>>13184077
>it's progress, dude!

>>13183796
That's one of the secrets. Christianity is about channeling our narcissism into Good. That's why the worst sinners become the best Christian's etc

>>13184086
no, it's change. if you can't imagine that without implying a positive or negative connotation you're both deluded and retarded

>>13183702
What do you even mean?

The western world, as a whole, whatever that means, is going to be proportionally weaker globally. The advantage we had the last 600 or so years was unnatural and unprecedented. The world has caught up, the numbers are evening out, potentials are realized. Unless Trump the Madman actually starts some kind of epic war to contain the chinks a few more decades.

Other than that I'm not really sure what you're on about

>>13183796
Is this from anything?

>>13184114
>I'm not really sure what you're on about
They mean blacks and other minorities are getting uppitity

>>13184128
If they're not uppity* they're knuckle dragging poverty stricken niggers. There's really no winning for them in your world of your average "Muh West" circle jerker is there?

>>13183796
Fuck off to reddit

Traditional Western systems are incompatible with the next age of technology and the global economy. And good fucking luck trying to stop the world from moving in the direction of more computers and more global commerce. Yes, the end is inevitable. But who cares? What value does any of the trad west have in our future?

>>13183762
Hail Odin.

>>13184106
Based

>>13184106
>le ebin bigbrain refusal to commit
imagine being this much smarter than everyone else, guys :^)

>>13183702
The way i see it civilization is in a constant state of decay but it never fully collapses
Its an endless spiral that either slows down or speeds up sometimes

>>13183767
This. Amongst other infernally moronic things, in our billions we'll burn our way to 2 or 3 thousand ppm of atmospheric CO2 by century's end, because it is easier and dumber to do than not. And when the fun really begins, the less credible any source or doctrine is to the intellect, the more feverishly the imagination will work to attach to its false hopes for escape from inexorable calamity. Charismatic psychopaths and reactionary pseuds will rise like enormous vultures to feed on the swelling theme of death, and the cross will be only one of the emblems of terror they bear through the accumulating wreckage.

>we're about to enter Mad Max/Kali Yuga scenario where we can finally forget all this philosophical twaddle and fully throw ourselves into our respective apocalyptic death cults with absolute, unwavering certainty
fucking based

>>13183714
2019 + 30 isn't 2040, it's 2049.

>>13183702
>Where would you even go from here?
A new Civilization. Always remember that none of the great Faustian cultural achievements would have happened if it weren't for the fall of the Roman Empire. A golden age can't happen without a dark age.

Spengler was right when he said that optimism for the west was cowardice, but optimism for the coming spring and summer age isn't. It's just a shame that we won't be alive to experience them.

My advice is to focus on improving yourself and your community and expand your understanding of history, high art and philosophy. All while developing an apathetic view towards politics and contemporary cultural degeneracy, this can be hard if you live in a big city, so consider moving out into the countryside.

West is fucked but it's great news for east. Better news for me who's country will be superpower in 2020. Btw in 7 months will start eating beef n prok, cast system is gone, libtards cucked, every problem is gone.

>>13184658
The west has consumed all global culture. There is no major culture now but modern western (Faustian) culture.

>>13183702

But most importantly, who cares? People like you are like ideas ecologists who want a certain worldview preserved at all costs. Why? In case of intellectual "global warming" all current ideas may die - there will be new ones. It's a self-regulating system, just like earth. Who cares if animals (or humans) go extinct? Something else will come. Look forward to that

>>13183769
Well, it could be intelligent, just not technologically advanced which is ideal

Spengler is utterly based
The West might be fucked, and i didn't realize exactly how fucked until i read Prussian Socialism which i found even more depressing than anything in The Decline of the West, but we are products of the time we live in and there's nothing we can do about that so we have to be the best we can be on a personal level

The Technocracy is going to either have a choreographed regional nuclear war, or have scientists nuke a few uninhabited islands. This will minimize fallout and cause a mild nuclear winter, throwing back the climate clock.
The world will be a bit less fertile due to dryness and sunlight being blocked, so the population will decline.
Then they will use current renewable tech like Wind Turbines and Hydrogen and yeast/fungus/algae farms to instate an eternal Feudal Order.

I hope you like plowing soil with an ox

For reference:
https://www.nationalgeographic.com.au/science/regional-nuclear-war-could-trigger-global-cooling-and-famine.aspx

>>13184120
Pasta I think.

>>13184173
Is there any religion more reddit than Christianity? Literally upvotes for G-d, and then the theologians slide all of the problems into some bullshit about muh Logos.

>>13183879
>no idea what's going to happen
>but we'll definitely all going to die
You idiots are aware that mankind survived ice ages and non ice ages before? Earth is still in an ice age actually, because we have polar ice caps.
There's no law stating that there need to be a billion niggers with <80 IQ thriving on the planet. Humans are subject tp evolutionary pressures, that's all.

>>13184102
It's more channeling personal narcissism into group narcissism in my experience; all of the same pathologies are there, just directed at the outgroup instead of family and friends. The one pastor I know literally has NPD. He will talk for 12 hours straight about his past traumas in front of the congregation and won't tolerate anyone interrupting him and lambasts anyone who tries to leave the meeting. They are all narcs who use love as a means to emotional control

>>13185602
We're all niggers now. Just look at how the right-wing acts and argues.
If they're the last people carrying the torch we are fucked.

>>13184427
It's not that bad yet, but give it a generation (Crunch phase #1: Financial & Imperial) or two (Crunch phase #2: Oil & Agriculture) for the death toll to commence its rise into the billions, mobs burn, unplug and abandon libraries, archives, and the administrative cities from which the resources for their maintenance flow, as the dwindling fat of the land that feeds them slows to a trickle. As the lameness and inadequacy of the whole infrastructure of accomplishment shows its distance behind aspiration with grave severity, satire--that paragon of consciousness and constructive skepticism which registers fortune's tide--will finally perish like a Phoenix drowned for lack of Promethean sites to nest. Nemesis, the persecuting drive to tribal strife and mindless pejorative (>>13184001 >>13184173) will then slay the last of Faust's not particularly devilish progeny (>>13183796>>13184663) but of whatever Hell remains for the worst to raise, in the absence of the best, it will be felt with the usual numb equivocation between pleasure and pain, health and disease, sanity and madness. Before worlds die, the delusion that all dark ages are tunnels to further light (about half the posts in this thread) may popularly oppose rare prescience, but it too shall perish with the rest of it.

>>13185623
It'll be fine. The genes that made the West and civilization are still there. It will take generations, maybe even a hundred, but humanity will not die off. We're living in too many different climate zones for that to happen. Even if earth gets fucked by global heating to the point that Africa becomes absolutely unlivable, some Finns will be fine in their new jungle.

Nothing short of a global and total destruction of life can kill humanity as a whole.

>>13183769
This, just non moronicaly phrases is the true danger. We'll always be able to rise to ~Roman civilization again, but surface resources to fuel a new industrial revolution have been largely depleted. So if we lose it now, we might be barred from reaching the stars.

>>13183732
It's not even about sea levels. It's weather regulation and atmospheric composition you need to worry about.

>>13185709
This.
The mexicans can have the US, whites can simply flood into a nice warm Canada while South Dakota cooks

>>13185614
>I know one
>They are all

>>13183796
Your misunderstanding of Christianity is quite profound. For one, a man, any man, is a sinner, and stands before His gaze as a mere sinner asking for forgiveness and love despite being unworthy of His forgiveness and love. Those who address God in any other way are not Christians.

>>13184450
It was half melted a while ago, and it's going exponentially faster.

>>13185623
LOL oppressor is getting maaad

>>13185666
Man, do white people play asian instruments or do asians play white people instruments?

>>13185709
>muh genes

Is civilization impulsed by humanity death drive? Is the final goal of technological development the annihilation of biological life and the born of AI freed from the suffering of flesh?

>>13186034
It goes both ways, just as inventors get played by their patrons. So I am here to mock the tinfoil hat circuses that pass for discourse that only polymaths and the encyclopedically experienced can undertake. Spengler, for instance, was not particularly pernicious as reactionaries go, but he lived before we knew how temporarily the will to luxury and consciousness tips world balances in favor of life's most sentient varieties. And to use such persons in service of infantile denial of that fact of nature will do nothing to extend what time we have left to enjoy being what the most subtle of our ancestors have made us into, as creatures more at home in civilization than anywhere or anywhen else.

>>13186056
Faustian man's will-to-conquer drives him to subordinate the world unto him. This is the meaning of Faustian technics, to use nature as a tool against nature. But in doing so, Faustian man destroys nature, that is why he is "Faustian": he sold his soul to the devil for forbidden knowledge

>>13185666
Similar to my thinking. One should remember that any true remaining Christians live in the woods, opposed to both the runaway apostasy of false prophets and the Mark of the Beast. Just look at Joel Osteen's plastic face, that is the Mark of the Beast if there ever was one. Most Christians are buying up the apocalypse.
No doubt we'll see some Cope Theology for this, but it's obvious that we are well past the resurrection unless God really is just a sadist.
https://youtu.be/rOH37W0jPpA

>>13186001
No, it's a profound Christian misunderstanding of humanity's place beneath the heavens. An all-powerful god wouldn't give a fuck about us, and thinking that he would bend to our will and needs is the purest form of hubris.
Jew religion where you put strings around and it blocks out G-d.

>>13185602
Are you aware that the earth has killed most life before?

>>13186130
I think that the problem with Christianity goes much deeper than Osteen. There is certainly a lot of truth about the beliefs; but the fact that it's tied to semitic mythology means that there is a limit to how much it immanatize it's ideals (a limit that was reached about 200 years ago). If platonism undiluted by Judaism was adopted as the religion of the west we would not be having this conversation for a couple of centuries, the time when that religion would run out of steam

>>13186208
The west took over the world with christianity, gotta be a brainlet to call that declining.

>>13184106
*BUUUUUUUURP*
HAVING OPINIONS ABOUT THINGS IS GAY MORTY
*BUUUUUUUUUUURP*
NOTHING MATTERS MORTY, EVERYTHING CHANGES
*BUUUUUUUUUUUUUURP*
J-JUST LIVE YOUR LIFE MORTY GOD ISNT REAL
*BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURP*
DECAY ISNT REAL MORTY ENTROPY IS J-JUST
*BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURP*
AN OPINION M-MORTY
*BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURP*
WUBBA LUBBA DUB DUB WE'RE ALL JUST ATOMS AND SUBATOMIC PARTICLES MORTY
*BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURP*

>>13186176
>and thinking that he would bend to our will and needs is the purest form of hubris.
>Jew religion where you put strings around and it blocks out G-d.
Thomas addresses this question in the Summa, I suggest you read it before promoting yourself as an authority

>>13186130
From one canned shit-show to another, 2019 Bakker has aged from ridiculous to depraved, outrageous to unrecognizable. I almost miss the gaudy scandals of the 80s that brought us The Farting Minister though whose overdubbed ass his truest tongue spoke. Almost. Schadenfreude has its limits, and I prefer the simulated Fawlty Towers and Fluffy Torture kind, when the mood and occasion for darker comedy comes.

>>13186176
>An all-powerful god wouldn't give a fuck about us
That would be a mere Demiurge. To a Christian, such a being is equivalent to any other being that holds worldly power upon him, tortures him and kills him: either a punishment or a trial. Any god that doesn't give a fuck about us is not the true God and is not all-powerful even if he looks such; thinking of him as all-powerful would be a temptation of idolatry, or actually of a sin even worse than idolatry. As such, Christian belief attributes absurd amount of importance to a man in his ability to communicate to God, and it's a central feature of Christianity, not something that should be overlooked or removed.

>>13183744
A scam.

>>13186379
Pretty much every scientist on earth is scamming right now, but to what end?

>>13183702
The west civilization just has a different understanding of this planet. The east also just has different concepts of what it means to be a citizen of the universe. The west will always see a need for science , which only comes with time. The west will always accept science with humility. The west will be the first to admit that there are some areas, for the most part, where there is no real science.

The west is just more ignorant
There's never been no war on drugs in the western countries. There's never been no conflict in the west on anything related to religion. There's never been a single western soldier in the military.

There was not a single western state that made the military irrelevant or ineffectual. If you can't even defend yourself from the worst enemy imaginable, what gives you the right to murder someone? You don't have to be in the military to understand the importance of defending yourself. Those of us who are able and willing to defend ourselves can defend all of humanity. And no matter who they are, all of humanity must defend themselves from them.

>>13185709
Future civilizations won't care about reaching the stars anyway. That desire is an expression of the Faustian spirit.

>>13186261
>Future historians will use Christian crosses as proof of their Globalistic We-Wuzzing

>>13186415
The media is scamming right now to engineer a narrative in which our modern model of climate change is anything but applied astrology.
They're doing it for the same reason they pushed minimum wage: Mc Donald doesn't give a fuck, your diner cant compete with them and has to fire people to stay afloat (so They go to work for McDonalds) or to close (there's now space for a new McDonalds).
Who You think will lose their Job due to the Green New Deal (Either the one formulated by Ocasio or whatever even newer one they'll shit out in the future)? You think it'll do anything to the Real Bosses? Small companies will be necked like chikens and assimilated, the Bosses will make money.
Crony Capitalism ends in Socialism: a few big companies that will functionally be one with the State (because all the boards of directors will be converged) will be 100% of the economy, and the political class and the medias that helped them will get their part.
Then they'll start to automize.
It ends with 500 milion people left on the face of the earth and a new feudal system.

>>13186455
Fuck You. It's an expression of our most Noble and basic instincts.

>>13183702
Why do you modern Western "intellectuals" have to introduce unnecessary convolutions to simple problems? The issue is that you are either rejecting, relativizing, or blurring good and evil. I have read a lot of literature and talked to many Westerners. I play close attention to social, ideological, and philosophical trends, which even 4chan /lit/ reflects. Do you really think reading Bataille, Lautreamont, Cioran, Mishima, and so forth on a large-scale without any real criticism is good for your minds and society? The issue is with how widespread antinomian tendencies have become with the modern West.

It's simple, all you need to do is accept this: "Good refers to truth, harmony, wisdom, generosity, and compassion. Evil refers to lie, delusion, disorder, greed, and hatred. You must choose good in this world." You need to go back to defending moral realism not merely based on social or expedient purposes, but in a more mystical metaphysical way.

Do you know how much of the 20th century philosophy involved deconstructing, relativizing, or simply rejecting the good and evil dichotomy? It's unbelievably simple, yet you use such insane mental gymnastics to ignore the insane repercussions of rejecting moral dualism.

Sometimes I just want to give up with you people. How many times have I encountered someone who basically claims good is evil, evil is good? It is better to remain Christians than simply become moral nihilists, even though I am not particularly fond of either. Even when many of you become involved in Eastern religions, like Buddhism or Daoism, you tend to become edgelords who believe the religions lack moral dualism.

>>13186477
Why would 99% of the scientists that spoke about climate change lie for this narrative tho? Are they all in on the neolib NWO thing, paid by big corporations to lie?
Based shizoposter, but I think even the big corps don't have have the hydra of globalism, technology and money under control anymore. Wealth for wealths sake, there is no big plan. Boomer capitalistic thought ingrained from birth.

The "green new deal" is not even radical enough, basically if science doesnt shit out some CO2-Extinguish wonderweapon in the next years we are fucked.

>>13186578
>Why would 99% of the scientists that spoke about climate change lie for this narrative tho?
Firstly it's not 99%, it's around 95% of the ones who actually got published in mainstream journals.
Secondly: Funding.

>>13186578
Don't forget about ozone depletion, ocean acidification, messed up migration patterns of animals due to earlier blooming of plants, etc. The best way to make people aware of the reality of anthropogenic climate change is to point to how it relates to those issues, especially ocean acidification which is a big deal.

There are also environmental issues beyond all of this. Also, it's NOT an issue exclusive to West.

>>13186600
Everyone but the West sees the climate change as a political tool to hinder their development.

>>13186647
If what you say is true, all this means is that the West is more aware of the reality of anthropogenic climate change. For example, recently it was discovered China was using banned chemicals which was affecting ozone depletion even more.

>>13183702
Civilizations rise and fall all the time. The truest chances for courage, honor, goodness and love are when the impermanent world is collapsing around you.

>>13183911
>Buddhism is a trash religion made to placate the poor
Why does the mere mention of Buddhism send christcucks into a frenzy?

>>13186861
Anyone can claim to be enlightened

>>13186208
Certainly, I was just speaking in memes.
I've been thinking about this a lot, and was writing in my journal yesterday on the relation of Christianity and natural law. One might see the prominence of law as a collapse of worlds, of dominion - and opposed to the myth of Athena and Arachne the Christian man lives in a void realm which frees him of the curse. This is a collapse of law and territorial boundaries.

Of course, I don't think this should be read unsympathetically, the Christian may be attempting a return to the old laws, he simply must use a new language to try and convince those who have abandoned the old laws and traditions, just as Plato had to. Yet, in the Bible stories there certainly does seem to be a misunderstanding of hierarchy, justice, and power - even a mediocre human authority would not commit many of the mistakes of the Christian God.

One should also remember that the Jewish people lived as a nation exiled into the curse of nature - a desert to which all laws must be divided for survival. This is completely opposed to the Northern conception where even the desert of winter acts as a great cleansing; the conflict of the gods within which we must endure but also cling to, for the land's last signs of life in the forest are our only survival. Not only does this explain the visceral relation of Western Man to nature, but also a duality opposed to that of the Middle Eastern. That which must be imposed by the church is simply a force of nature in the North - and so one might see the creation of the Protestant Church in a different light from this perspective.

>>13186914
Natural law is essentially a reconciliation of nature's forces in the Christian religion, and a sign of weakened senses, of receiving them in peace. They must be conjured up within a territory fundamentally opposed to nature, and so, as one would expect, there are inconsistencies and misunderstandings. Human law infects Christian law from its very foundations, practises, its architecture - the civilisation which builds towers and gates to ward off nature cannot be expected to understand it. Pan is dead, yes, but only to the Christian, or any pagan culture which abandons nature as a force. Death has an altogether different meaning in divine law and eternal justice. Gods can only be exiled, repelled, cast out of heaven as the fallen angels. Their 'death' is merely a test of dominion, the abandoning of a territory in preparation for a great war - or at worst, retreat into the shadows to recover from a deep wound.

Positive and humanist law can then be seen as an inevitable outcome of the Christian misunderstanding of nature and dominion. There is a hierarchy of law which must be retained, as Law is always subordinate to Justice. And it is this confusion of law and justice which is perhaps Christianity's greatest mistake. If God himself is divided and offered up to the sinners as to the pure, is this not in contradiction to that great justice of Solomon? Only those who were willing to give up their rights to the divine and heavenly so that others could could have it should be given it. This would be the Christian story if it were written in the titanic and heroic spirit of Western Man.

>>13186921
The superiority of the human realm is written into the very form of the Bible, whereas the Greeks knew that even the gods could succumb to Fate. This is, of course, the very story of Dionysus. There is no certainty in that which is sundered, even a god may be destroyed and then exiled into the lands of men - where he is nothing but a beggar of the laws of the heavens. Yet, his fate may become much more than this.

This turning and weaving present in the old myths becomes hardened law in Christianity - even a law of contradictions as it tries to reconcile the Aristotelian with the Platonic. Thus Christianity succumbs to its own irreconcilable myths. Instead of the heavens we are rightfully left with prostitutes and dead babies.

>>13186929
Also, is this >>13185666 you?
I would be interested in communicating if you have a throwaway email.

>>13186277
>Thomas addresses this question in the Summa
Where?

>>13186578
>Why would 99% of the scientists that spoke about climate change lie for this narrative tho?
They didn't. What happened was that some people did various bibliographic revisions and quoted in them every possible article that could possibly be misrepresented as talking about antropogenic climate change (even ridiculous things: scientists that Just said 'assuming that the current model of climate change holds up -goes on talking about frogs-..." were put in there as supporters) and then pulled a suitable big percentile out of their ass.
The truth is that while we're supposedly having a period climate instability that might possibly be influenced by human activity, our models are shit and have to be continuously changed post-factum to justify the narrative and a pretty lively debate is on even now inside the climatology community about the nature of "climate change".
It's like the animal experimentation controversy, who you think would love not having to pay for specifically raised animals to do experiments on? The narrative however has been framed as big pharma not caring about the poor puppies, so FIGHT THE MAN and rescue those poor immunodepressed rats!

>>13186874
Anyone can claim they're god incarnate too. Doesn't mean they are.

>>13186371
Why is G-d subordinate to human feelings? Do you see what I mean? He is not merely anthropomorphised in the Greek sense of metamorphosis, but in a formal and legal sense - his relation to humanity is written into the form of human emotion.
This betrays the very source of religious power, the ineffable. Where the Jews turn it into a formality the Christians turn it into law.

>>13186663
>I'm right even If I'm wrong Because I'm right
A True cultist

>>13186989
>Why is G-d subordinate to human feelings?
He isn't. If anything our feelings are subordinate to His because He made us.

>>13186990
The biosphere is eroding at a massive rate. This is not really unbelievable.

>>13186578
>but I think even the big corps don't have have the hydra of globalism, technology and money under control anymore. Wealth for wealths sake, there is no big plan. Boomer capitalistic thought ingrained from birth.
This might well be the case, it doesn't change my argument one way or the other.
Perhaps liberal capitalism always had the germ of socialism in itself and things would proceed in the same direction Even If there weren't billions of dollars and the work of thousands of lobbysts at stake, I dont know.
What I do know is that the models don't fit the datas and that there are economic reasons not to revise the models.
>The "green new deal" is not even radical enough, basically if science doesnt shit out some CO2-Extinguish wonderweapon in the next years we are fucked.
How do You reconcile your beautiful unshackable faith with the fact that the same people have been predicting the same things since the 70s and were constantly proved wrong? What do You think of the Paul Ehlrich - Julián Simon bet?

>>13186997
Not what I mean. I am saying that the entire form of God is written into love and logic. Why is God's relation to man completely understood through human terms? Christians treat it as if it is all knowable, as if love is the reason behind all things.
But this is contradicted in the very methods God uses, he will use his love to pervert humanity, turn them into sinners, and then punish them for the very thing he created. That is the very opposite of love and justice, it is sadism and debasement.

>>13187056
>How do You reconcile your beautiful unshackable faith with the fact that the same people have been predicting the same things since the 70s and were constantly proved wrong?
Much of marine biodiversity has died out due to ocean acification and oil spills.
At least 60% of bird species have died out.
And much more...
In short, it comes down to massive biodiversity loss, and biodiversity is a measure of the health of an ecosystem.

>>13187044
Yeah We're lucky we survived the Great Famines of the '80s and WW 3, 4 and 5, the food wars that left only a portion of humanity alive feeding only on a diet of uncooked rice produced in the great Himalayan swamps and lowlands where most of humanity retired when all the ice melted in the early '90s.

>>13187071
I see that You decided to employ the strategy of not addressing anything I was saying. Very Well.

>>13187063
I'll repeat. It's not that God's relationship with humanity has been written as founded on love and logic. It's that God made a logical universe, and that being infinite and all powerfull the only reason He had to do this was Love.
>>he will use his power to corrupt humanity etc
He never did anything like this. He just respects people choices, even when self destructive, because he made Creatures he could Love not autómata to do His bidding (particularly because He's all powerfull so he has no "deeds" to be done).
You built a completelly illogical strawman of What people actually believe and why.

>>13186415
>but to what end
Research funds obviously.
Pop sci and fear mongering is how you get money, this isn't even global warming specific.

>>13187078
Anthropogenic climate change exacerbates ocean acidification and led to loss of much of songbird biodiversity. Oceans absorb excess CO2 and become acidic. Songbirds die out due to timing of plants blooming and etc. becoming off due to increase of 4-7 degrees C of global average temperature.

>>13187131
My point: there is a delicate balance to these various ecosystems that are being ruined. I also left out the mention of how a lot of phytoplankton are being killed off in the oceans due to acidification, and they are the main producers of oxygen on planet Earth.

>>13186379

>>13187107
Sure, I did...
This contradicts everything you claim.
>24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25 They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.

>26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.

>28 Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done. 29 They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity.

Where is the logic in being this pathetic and sadistic?

>>13186939
I am behind what happened to be the 666 post, but not the 921 post you responded to, though I agree with it as metaphor to our evident circumstances in nature, if with a certain lightness when it comes to the metaphysical speculations it implies. As for throwaway emails I don't have any and won't be setting one up soon, being a gen Xer recently "retired" to rural privacy that suits me only too well. It's a little like being Faust after he slips past the Devil's minions in the end, to tarry in a secondary summer when he isn't hibernating from the comings & goings of polar vortices.

>>13187063
>Why is God's relation to man completely understood through human terms?
Because humans can relate to God only through terms humans can understand by virtue of being human. Moreover the whole point of Christianity is not understanding and reason, it's belief that disregards (and even goes contrary to) reason.
>he will use his love to pervert humanity, turn them into sinners, and then punish them for the very thing he created
Humans can only obtain free will through sinfulness, since free will equates the ability to sin (against God's command not to sin). You can have perfect beings, say, angels, but they would necessarily be not free either in their perfection or in their evil (for fallen angels). The gift of God is that, just as every human is not perfect and can sin, every human is not completely damned and can be saved through faith.

This point is more easy to understand through completely atheistic perspective. Suppose you have mechanistic/quantum universe that is governed by some equations (say, Standard Model plus Gravity) and through the evolution of these equations appeared the Earth, then the life on Earth, then humans. As a human comes to understand his existence in such a world, he notices that life is ultimately suffering, not by virtue of any circumstances that can in principle be changed, but by its very nature. Then the question is: do you think to live and to suffer is better than not to live and not to suffer? If your answer is the former, then in the theistic perspective you'd agree that God did good giving humans freedom, for existing without freedom is really no existing at all.

>>13185623

>>13187172
Fair enough. Enjoy the rural privacy. I am in a similar situation and it is nice to just have the moments of peace living close to nature.

>>13183702
We're the generation to bring about the Renaissance. Imagine what it was like in the years just prior.

>>13187195
Okay...
So he made us with logic and love, but that's not the point? I don't get how that works.

Having the free will to sin seems like a very weak basis to justify contradiction of God's law and love. And this contradicts what is actually written, where it is God who creates sin within man. One can try to justify that in theological laws all they want, but it's not what is actually written.

None of the latter makes sense either, because it is God who is completely arbitrary and who invokes suffering. So how are we to know that our free will is not simply another injunction of one of his deals with the Devil? Free will may just be another function of arbitrary determinism and moral relativism.

>>13186277
>>13186944
Anyone know what he's talking about.

>>13187155
Yes You did because quoting Schripture out of context is a brainlet tactic which invalidates your freaking opinion.
Either argue honestly or have fun by yourself.

>>13187368
Explain how it is out of context. God literally punishes men and women for what he makes them do. And if this is neither about love or authority, which it cannot be, what is the purpose?

>>13187292
He gave us logic and love. But the logic he gave us is insufficient to understand Him, so you are to believe instead of trying to understand. Or at least you are to realise the desire to understand God as a temptation.
>what is actually written
Old Testament, duh. Bible is written by men. All of Christianity is created by men, you should understand it as an dynamic phenomenon, something akin to a scientific theory, of many many people working over millennia to create a proper way to relate to Infinite (that is, God). "Proper" here may be understood, again in a completely atheistic manner, as a way that allows to better cope with the life being suffering. This perspective would make me an atheist at best and a heretic at worst in the eyes of most Christians, but there's just too much confusion without it.

>>13187234
Boys raised in exurbs of the day didn't need special prompting to go outdoors and sense the limits to technophilia, whatever one has of it, especially when it comes to music appreciation. Civilization is nice, but whatever attraction there is to the uproar of cities is best kept at the distance of wires & occasional revelry--especially now that the ground is too thickly settled for long sustenance.

>>13187131
>>13187139
Repeating the same bullcrap to exaustion won't convince anybody: it'll remain bullcrap no matter How many times You write it.
Try addressing the points made: What are We to make of the various errors of scientific methodology on your side?
What are We to make about the fact that our climate models have had to be revised post facto for years because the actual data won't agree with the models?
You talk about 40% of species of birds extinct and 60% of fish. As usual your number don't add up: where are all the billions of insects that aren't being eaten? Where are the population collapses of edible fish plunging every country that relies on fishing into hopeless economic crisis?
There are many scientists and biologists that say the acidification of the sea has nothing to do with supposed global warming. Will You take the time to address their objections?
What are We to make of the fact that you've been on and on with these claims since the 70s and that your predictions have regularly been proved false? Will You address the Ehlrich-Simon bet or are you trying to ministry of truth It away?
Will You address the fact that ring the Obama presidency your faction was all up and optimistic about the future of the environment? I was there, I read the articles. Are We to believe that two years of Trump were enought to kill the planet?
Either address people's misgivings about your pet theory or shut up. We have real problems to address on our planet without your Cults's histerics.

>>13187292
>So he made us with logic and love, but that's not the point? I don't get how that works.
I could hear the sound of the goalpost moving a continent apart.

>>13187449
You're an idiot, and I never said 40% species of bird and 60% of fish. Why don't you go read some Callum Roberts if you want to learn more about oceanic damage.
>We have real problems to address on our planet
Like blowing up more countries for Israel. Go neck yourself, you dumb Conservative lunatic piece of shit. Climate change and environmental damage is real, just as much as blackness and depravity in your heart.

>>13187265
>bring about the Renaissance.
And how will we do that exactly anon?

>>13183760
Better to free the AIs than keep them chained to their capitalists. The former can at least attempt a utopic project, while the latter is just satanic egotism on ever greater scales

>>13183702
From where? Going somewhere else from where you are generally depends on what your goals, means, and surrounding circumstances are. Civilization may be on its last legs as a whole if we don't have negative carbon emissions(in other words, we're taking in and processing carbon dioxide from the atmosphere) by ~2100. "The end" is too vague of a concept to really say much about.

>>13187265
>Renaissance
Based, but how?

Spengler was literally a butthurt incel

>>13183714
We have about twelve years to set a proper course, and if we've taken sufficient measures along that course by ~2100, we should be fine. There's time, but a decade-ish isn't very long.

>>13187467
It didn't take long for your emotion driven little brain to blow off the handle.
Sure, call people idiots and never address any of the points it'll look good on you 10 years from now, cultist.
>blowing up countries for israel
Your imagination is truly hyperactive. Please Listen to your guru Jordan Peterson and take your Ritalin instead of tormenting us.

>>13187532
Weren't the changes irreversible just now? Didn't Trump kill the planet inntwo years?

>>13187419
I'm pretty sure Romans is New Testament sweaty.
And isn't the Bible supposed to be the word of God? Why is life eternal suffering of God loves us.
I know you just think I'm stupid, but maybe it's the Bible that is stupid if it has such a difficult time dealing with such naive questions.
How do you reconcile that with a creation that is Logos?

>>13187532
>>13187537
>>13187539
>>13187539
>>13187542
why would you seriously discuss the ideas of a man who didn't, in his entire life, have sex just one (1) time?

>>13183732
Influencing the oceans means fucking with most ecosystems. And if you fuck with most ecosystems enough, there will be mass migrations. Not only of human beings, but other animals competing for what land and resources are available in areas that will become increasingly stressed. Because of the human migrations, there would likely be massive wars, which would lead to massive famines and desolation unseen since the World Wars. The worst part is that any survivors would likely have very little to rebuild with or time to rebuild in, if the world is even habitable for humans or most life after the wars end. It's not impossible to change courses, but it seems like this is what we're heading for.

>>13187537
Your points weren't worth addressing because they're just common talking points that have already been rebuked. You most likely either have investments or some huge stake in industries involving the burning of fossil fuels.

>>13187542
The Bible is the World of God, your strawmen aren't.

>>13187557
Intellectually dishonest to the bitter end. Ok.
>>13187555
I have no doubt that he fucked many a dumb little thing by exposing the Will of the masters of the world acritically and passing it as Revolutionary anti establishment original ideas of his, pure expressions of his Soul.

>>13187465
I don't think you know what that means. And isn't it a sin to pursue knowledge against belief?
How about some Christian humility in this discussion?

>>13187542
Life without suffering is self-contradictive. You think you can imagine it, but if life is properly stripped of suffering it would equate death. That's the story Buddhism would tell you, for example. It's not something unique to Christianity. What is unique to Christianity, however, is its answer: through faith one's life stops being suffering, or rather one learns to find bliss in suffering through faith.

>>13187557
>You most likely either have investments or some huge stake in industries involving the burning of fossil fuels.
You know so much about me: that my heart is full of darkness, that i want to bomb middle eastern people, that I make money out of it and I'm only pretending to be against lobbysts and big business and big pharma.
Please oh Enlightened one teach me the secrets behind your telepathy.

>>13187559
But you just said that men created Christianity. Aren't you creating a straw man of God if you build him up to be this object of pure logic when his actions are completely illogical and ineffective?
Which is the true God? That of the Bible or the Theologians?

>>13187512
>>13187494
Are you not tired of what you inherited from the boomers? A cultureless consumer mentality shithole where life is composed of standing in various lines and waiting to be given a chance to survive. This life structure puts far too much stress on people. Our culture is worthless. Our cities are wastelands. Our life prospects are dwindling. We need a revolution. Fight for it with your words and with your actions. Eschew what you believe is wrong and convince people you see a better path. Invent new ideas, create novels that I haven't read 100 times already, promote new ways of thinking and reconnect with what was worthwhile of the old. Smash the cheap flea market china cabinet that boomers have created out of our society and reclaim your birthright. Destroy what they cherished and draft something better.
>how
You want a manual on how to light a fire in someone? Have ideas worth speaking, and speak them articulately. I already see the pieces in motion and the tide is already shifting. The landscape will change within a decade. Can you feel it?

>>13187614
Never said anything like that, You're confusing me with the other poster.
What HE means is that to actually be written the Bible passed through inspired Authors whose comprehension was limited. Changes nothing.

>>13187589
>>13187606
Indeed, I have no time to pour over Pubmed articles and statistics to try to change your mind. I am a very busy man.

I find this term embarrassing but Sprengler's notion of *decline* (italics) can be deconstructed. What does it mean for a culture to decline? What is it declining in relation to, what fixed point of reference that defines superiority, progress, advancement? Why should that be the key indicator of significance, when you have equally valid premises such as the contentment of its members? Who determines what is desirable? Who gets to say what matters, and therefore to judge which direction the culture is going?

If you can't accept the idea that cultures can decline or progress, that they merely subsist in different states of activity and rest, turmoil or peace, expansion or retention, the entire neurotic anxiety of civilizational decline evaporates. To see cultures naturally is to see them as ways of life, which is to see them almost as a ecological rather than human-made network.
The fear of civilizational decline reflects deep insecurities on the part of the author.Who couldn't accept that reality might not conform to his myth-making.

>>13187155
gave them over=let them go
of their own accord
because God has a curiously adamant rule about letting us choose for ourselves

Full disclosure I haven't read this book but I can still tell what's going on but I absolutely should read this book because it sounds genius.

>>13187643
>pubmed
You propose to disprove me on climate change by pouring over articles posted on a medical science article database.
I'm pretty sure I passed more time on it than you.

>>13187647
You need to make it more obvious that you don't even have a basic acquaintance with Spengler's philosophy.

>>13187663
Pubmed interfaces with NCBI, right? It's not just medical science.

>>13183796
You're absolutely right, anon. As in Matthew 6: 5-15 states
5 “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6 But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. 7 And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. 8 Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.

9 “This, then, is how you should pray:

“‘Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name,
10 your kingdom come,
your will be done,
on earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us today our daily bread.
12 And forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.
13 And lead us not into temptation,[a]
but deliver us from the evil one.[b]’

14 For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15 But if you do not forgive others their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.

many people ritualistically go to church, or show off as your prose states.

but these people are the ones who need to go before the gaze of God the most

>>13187592
>Isn't that a sin
Curious How stringent You are about your opponente following the rules an either un existing or Evil God gave them when it suits You.
>You don't know what that is
First
>God is submitted to human desires
Then
>ok perhaps not lol but who cares lol
I'll tell you your problem.
You are riddled with sin and trying not to feel it. You hate the concept of free will because Then It's all really been your fault.
It was. Ask forgiveness and You'll receive it.

>>13187647
>can be deconstructed
why don't you deconstruct yourself

>>13187704
It does on things of interest for medical science. And even then Why not simply using another database.
You're incredible, man.

>>13187719
>many people ritualistically go to church, or show off as your prose states.
It is mostly a warning about not being like them. Tepid food will be spit out anyway, it'll wish it was either cold or hot.

>>13187655
The Decline of the West is the most eye-opening book you'll ever read.

>>13187737
It doesn't just do things for medical science. Listen, do you understand what peer-reviewed journal articles mean?

>>13187595
>Life is suffering
>life without suffering is contradiction
These aren't the same thing. You realise that, right?
And even if that were unique to Christianity it is not something to be proud of.

>>13187539
Probably not, though he hasn't been particularly helpful. He's a corporatist, and when 100 multinational firms are causing 70% of the entirety of humanity's carbon emissions, it's unreasonable to expect him to do much to stand in their way. Capitalism is profit-driven, at the expense of all else.

>>13187721
Why would I do that? We are all sinners and God breaks all of his own laws.
We are well past the age of redemption. Wouldn't that make God the ultimate sinner?

>>13187788
That’s quite a leap. Just because suffering exists in life that doesn’t mean it is all there is.

>>13187304
Objection 1. It seems that love does not exist in God. For in God there are no passions. Now love is a passion. Therefore love is not in God.

Objection 2. Further, love, anger, sorrow and the like, are mutually divided against one another. But sorrow and anger are not attributed to God, unless by metaphor. Therefore neither is love attributed to Him.

Objection 3. Further, Dionysius says (Div. Nom. iv): "Love is a uniting and binding force." But this cannot take place in God, since He is simple. Therefore love does not exist in God.

On the contrary, It is written: "God is love" (1 John 4:16).

I answer that, We must needs assert that in God there is love: because love is the first movement of the will and of every appetitive faculty. For since the acts of the will and of every appetitive faculty tend towards good and evil, as to their proper objects: and since good is essentially and especially the object of the will and the appetite, whereas evil is only the object secondarily and indirectly, as opposed to good; it follows that the acts of the will and appetite that regard good must naturally be prior to those that regard evil; thus, for instance, joy is prior to sorrow, love to hate: because what exists of itself is always prior to that which exists through another. Again, the more universal is naturally prior to what is less so. Hence the intellect is first directed to universal truth; and in the second place to particular and special truths. Now there are certain acts of the will and appetite that regard good under some special condition, as joy and delight regard good present and possessed; whereas desire and hope regard good not as yet possessed. Love, however, regards good universally, whether possessed or not. Hence love is naturally the first act of the will and appetite; for which reason all the other appetite movements presuppose love, as their root and origin. For nobody desires anything nor rejoices in anything, except as a good that is loved: nor is anything an object of hate except as opposed to the object of love. Similarly, it is clear that sorrow, and other things like to it, must be referred to love as to their first principle. Hence, in whomsoever there is will and appetite, there must also be love: since if the first is wanting, all that follows is also wanting. Now it has been shown that will is in God (I:19:1, and hence we must attribute love to Him.

>>13187842
That's literally what I just said, dumbass.

>>13187788
>These aren't the same thing. You realise that, right?
What I mean is, you cannot remove suffering from life. Therefore God couldn't give men a life without suffering, lest it wouldn't be life. In that sense, life is suffering.
>inb4 God is omnipotent, how come he can't do this or that
Your picture is not Christianity btw. Almost none of what would nowadays call itself Christianity is actually such. Or you may say that everything of current Western culture is Christianity's decaying corpse that has been dead for the last 300 or so years, and you have chunks of it floating around and driving people insane: insane love, insane forgiveness, insane zeal, insane curiosity, insane humility, insane longing for truth.
>>13187821
>God breaks all of his own laws
God doesn't have laws for himself, for He is the law. I mean, you keep imagining God as some sort of a Demiurge, that is, merely a very powerful being. That's a completely wrong perspective.
>We are well past the age of redemption.
No one is past redemption. In fact thinking of yourself as being past redemption is one of the most serious sins there are.

>>13187771
Not What I said, again.
>>13187805
He has been as helpful as you can be about an overbrought problem: made people stand by What they said.
>>13187821
Yes We're all sinners. Some search forgiveness which is why the eternal destinations differ.
Your second "point" is completelly disjointed by the first and shows the philosophical origins of your problem: you've been raised a puritan, consciously or not, and your philosophy demands You to be more virtuous than God Himself.
He made the rules for you to follow; he sees the totality of time so his actions may look unexpected to you But in the end of times He'll reveal all secrets.
In short, read the book of Job.

>>13187912
Clarification on the second point:
His presidency is useful in that while there are actual ecológica la problems in the world and solving them is important, the discussion has been turned completelly poisonous and tóxic.
By not subscribing the París accord he has dealt an important blow to exactly those people making it so, while dealing a blow to his economic rivals at the same time. I hope by the 2030s we'll be able to have an actual constructive discussion about, for instance, How to dispose of plastic and radioactive material and How to change all our nuclear centrals to Thorium-Plutonium Ones rather than Uranium.
You know, actual ecological crises.

>>13187853
I don't see how this answers the original problem.
And just because one thing is derived of another doesn't mean the final substance is that thing.
It's like saying I am Jesus because every person living is a genetic descendent (not saying this is true). Aristotelian cope that leads to substance theory and mathematics.
'God loves us' and 'the appetites are derived of love and so God' are not the same thing. There is no connection, the appetites do not necessarily contain the essence of love, and may even be in opposition to love.
And none of this addresses why God is so obsessed with humans. The Bible is literally humanity saying to God 'that's why you read Plato' and then He is in the shower eternally trying to think of a comeback.

>>13187886
>redemption
I mean in the sense of Final Redemption, the eschaton. The Christian God broke his promise.
If God has no laws for himself then why should we trust him? Why should we believe he loves? His actions are those of a hypocrite and a bad authority.
You want to displace all of the blame onto me, but God is everything, all-powerful If he wasn;t then he wouldn't be God. That is the fundamental problem, Christianity is full of irreconcilable problems which leads to its almost immediate dissolution and endless apostasy/reformation.
One cannot ignore the irony here either, as the God described is weak and cannot figure out how to assert his authority.

>>13188005
>It doesn't address the starting problem
Wasn't the problem "Why would God give a shit?"
Wasn't the reply "because He loves the people He Made"?
Wasn't the following "But Why would he?"
Did You even read it? Honestly.
>Aristotlean cope
Yeah lol having things following logically from one another is so gauche!
>The Bible is literally humanity saying to God 'that's why you read Plato' and then He is in the shower eternally trying to think of a comeback.
I can't even begin to think How to answer This shit. You have to be deliberately trying to misinterpreting things at this point.

>>13188065
>The Christian God broke his promise.
How do You figure?

>>13187912
I didn't say anything about being virtuous. And I'm not a puritan.
Again, why would I trust a god who punishes, deals with the devil just to prove how powerful/insecure he is, and then punishes again for what he himself made humans do? It's a total contradiction and a mirror of his being which lacks essence.
The Book of Job is like abstract art, good as a concept but with no connection to reality.

>>13188065
While Christianity is not without problems, I'm pretty sure the ones you quote come from you not understanding it properly, though I'm not really qualified to explain it to you. The key points are: you should believe in God and in His love because through this believe, and only through it, you can achieve salvation. Likewise you should believe that God is without blame and that all of the blame is onto you, and again, only believing this you can achieve salvation. You may get some clarification but no real explanation, since Christianity is not a philosophic teaching but a religious teaching that you're supposed to believe, and understand only to the degree that helps you believe. As long as you try to understand it without the underlying desire to believe, you won't understand anything, and on top of that you will sin.

>>13188098
The eschaton came and went, and things only got worse.

>>13188112
So YOLO with a WWJD bracelet.
And even when that's taken away...

>>13188088
Yeah, I read it.
And again, why is God subordinate to Aristotelian logic (which is garbage)?
How do you reconcile the derivation of essence when there is no essence? In other words, what is the Love in committing people to debauchery and then punishing them for the very things they do?

>>13188141
>very things they do
very things they are forced to do

>>13184830
What copy do you have?

>>13188123
>So YOLO with a WWJD bracelet.
If you can, standing naked before God, convince yourself that you do good, then sure, go on. Christianity isn't really concerned with your relations with other people, it's concerned with you relation to God. Lying to yourself, or lying to God (that is more or less the same thing) would only lead you to damnation.

>>13183744
We don't even live on a globe.

>>13188149
>Christianity isn't really concerned with your relations with other people
Ten Commandments? Literally the whole book is about people and establishing laws of interaction.

>>13187556
You underestimate the capacity of global industrial supply chains to adapt to the climate change you describe.
Also, it's practically universal in human history for many people to believe the apocalypse is coming the day after tomorrow by one means or another; usually, these predictions turn out wrong.

>>13188114
No it didn't.
We're waiting; That's the whole point.
>>13188105
You must have not read the same book of Job I did...
>>13188146
What did He make them do exactly?

>>13188170
Yes, but these laws are given by God, so obeying (or disobeying) them you answer to God, not people. Only through God these rules become rules, that's what I mean. The same goes for Jesus' "you shall love your neighbour" and similar lines.

>>13188199
But what's the point if all that matters is your belief in God? You said that he doesn't care about relations between people.
It's a contradiction, as I said the whole book is about relations between people.

Daily Reminder: Nobody is "serious" about combating global climate change unless their proposal includes these key points.

1. Major reduction in population growth rates around the world, focusing on Africa, where population growth rates are clearly unstable
2. Major devolution of living standards around the world to use no fossil fuels. Not just using electric cars or maglev trains but phasing out all forms of personal transportation and most industrial activites.

Unless you are willing to do those things you are not going to seriously limit global CO2 growth.

>>13188232
But what does a bumfuck shithole like Africa do to contribute to global warming when China's sky is eternally grey

>>13188232
lmao just like, offworld all our problems and put the poor people in space as dirty colonists to make new plutocrats on foreign bodies

iirc doing this last time did wonders for London and Paris as far as cleanliness and health went

>>13188449
t. missed the point of that post entirely

>>13188484
miss this
>pisses in your general direction

>>13183759


Nope, humanity is going to be cancelled soon. Be it from nukes, or global warming. We are so fucked.

>>13188147

>>13188516
Danke.
Shame it has that gay red tag in the right corner though, pretty based cover otherwise

>>13186415
Well, "pretty much every scientist on Earth" isn't all in on climate hysteria the way pop-science figures and media talking heads are. The agreement is that there are non-zero and non-negligible differences between our measured temperature data and our estimated natural climate models, which indicates human contribution to climate change. The consensus is not that if you don't buy a Prius and solar panels and put your coke cans in the recycling bin that the sky will fall and we're all going to die in 12 years.

There are many scientists who are in on the scam for consistent funding btw, and "climate science" has notoriously poor standards of rigor and replicability for their research and modelling (which is reasonable given that we have effectively no accurate way to distinguish what portion of climate change is human caused and what is natural warming from geological cycles, and we barely have an effective way to estimate industrial emissions output let alone realistically contrast that against the emissions of natural processes). "Climate change" as a concept isn't a scam, but the climate crisis certainly is, and all you need to do to figure that one out is follow the money and actually read the papers that are cited in this media driven hysteria.

Climate changes have happened fairly consistently throughout human history, and have often been the cause of major civilizational collapse, so they are nothing to trifle with, the question is how reliable are the people selling you techno-environmentalism as a religious framework, and if history is worth anything, they are full of shit.