/lit/ - Literature

>>13099584

In the education part

>>13099584
>Where did the education system go so horribly wrong?
Everything the federal government touches, and doesn't leave to the states, goes to shit.

>>13099584
How the FUCK can someone "give up" on either the Illiad or Odyssey? And why the fuck does structure/genre matter? You're not reading it in homeric greek. I fucking guarantee it.

the answer is simple: America. Finnish schools, which start at 7 years old, produce some of the best students in the world. meanwhile, american schools are run like jails. this doesn't teach children to enjoy learning, it just teaches them to fear it

>>13099595
>but muh federal government
I'm sure your piss-poor state that is either one third black or latino and two third white trash would work perfectly without the help of the federal government.

>>13099652
It's true. Even our college/universities are jokes. I was so bored in middle and highschool. Felt like I had a holocaust class every year. I know a history class covered it, an English class, and then the trip to muh museum. Definitely more than that, but I learned nothing needless to say

>>13099584
the ETERNAL PRUSSIAN

>>13099668
Not wrong, but really /pol/ tier criticism.

>>13099595

Ah finally a teenager reader of ayn read here to explain to us why government bad. Please expand on your argument, meanwhile I'll open the window to let out the smell of puberty.

>>13099584
>why don't you like ancient Greek capeshit

>>13099701
Them not liking the Iliad isn't the only problem with their review. It's not even the biggest problem with their review.

>>13099688
>he's right but it sounds like /pol/ so it doesn't count

>>13099688
If it's not wrong, why make that post? It's objectively shit (the school system) and the Holocaust propaganda just adds insult to injury

>>13099652
wtf. you lards start school at age 7?

>>13099688
bad post. What point are you even trying to make?

>>13099694
just the US government

>>13099584
> Why does the prussian education system create obedient fools who can't think for themselves?

Because the goal of the Prussian educational system is to create soldiers who will stand and die when Napoleon and his French Cavalry charge them.

'cult'ural marxism

Still not as infuriating as people saying we need to stop reading the classics like Moby Dick because they’re written by toxic straight white men.

Can’t wait for leftists and minorities to start banning classic literature because it’s problematic and replace it with faggot-y young adult and feminist game of thrones cancer in the public schools.

>>13099652
>>13099668
america has the best universities in the world..

>>13099785
what is the last time you had a serious, 1-on-1 conversation with someone offline, in meatspace?

>>13099785
Ive never actually heard this opinion other than from some cherry picked article or tweet.

>>13099668
my experience too. i was bored in class every fucking day. such a waste of potential.
>>13099688
no, /pol/ aside. teaching one event in history, set aside whether or not a bunch of germans really turned jews into soapbars and lampshades, teaching the same fucking one singular event over and over instead of covering even a fraction of the rest of global history is torture and a waste of time and resources. i can't read any book about the fucking holocaust now, i have ptsd from our shit for brains diseducation system. the minute a book mentions wwii or nazis I drop it. i don't care what "side" it's on, it's dropped.

i hate this god damned country so much. it feels like i don't even have a chance at life, no culture no family no country, born a tax slave live in consumerism die in a hospital. this place is a total shithole. i wish i was never even born. food is shit cities are shit culture is shit lifestyle is shit everyone is an obese retarded mongrel with a giant fucking mouth that never shuts, either they're shoveling more food down their fat face or they're yapping their fucking mouth off about god damned anything and they're so loud and obnoxious it's unbelievable. no one was raised with any manners in this shithole country. an entire nation of a bunch of retards who cannot stop making the most noise they could possibly conceive of making day and night. it's instagram--the country. endless torrents of god damned fucking stupid ass morons hopped up on caffeine beer and adhd medication taking around in SUVs from fast food joint to gas station with the radio on max volume, endlessly.

i hope to god iran nukes us. please put me out of my misery. even if i move to europe i'll always bear the stigma of being a burgerclap.
>>13099790
**had.

>>13099688
Get fucked, faggot.

>>13099701
>ancient Greek capeshit
Kek well that's a way to see it. We've always liked tales about chads with superstrenght, huh?

First Worlders, everyone

>>13099652
exactly this

>>13099584
when it became a day care for mediocre adults and the children of other mediocre adults instead of an institute of learning

>>13099951
I'm seriously considering taking the cynicpill and being homeless. Shit's fucked and no one cares. I have no interest in feeding the tax machine that fuels my genetic replacement. I am still an accelerationist but at the same time, it feels like everyone refuses to take their foot off the brakes even though they all say they hate society. It makes no fucking sense and I am tired of trying to make it make any.
But yeah. Wasted potential. I think I can say the only time I was challenged and actually learned something was in AP Calc. The second semester of that was the only time I got a B (it was an 88 or 89 but still) and actually had to think. I learned in geometry as well, but that wasn't difficult, just different.
And I'm not going ot blame any thing in particular. I know now I could/should have been doing hobbies/clubs/extra-curricular activities instead of playing videogames, but honestly, none of that interests me.
I have constant disagreements with my mom about this shit. She's one of the people who "hates" the way things are, yet cannot understand why I refuse to play the game. I just don't get it. I think I need to be homeless to understand *why* people work.
Sorry. Tangential rant.
/blog

>>13100006
nice blog diogenes

>>13099951
Personally hoping President Xi will drop the nukes

>>13100006
not to turn this into /pol/ because i greatly disagree with most shit said there. but there's no culture or family or community and no happy life possible. everything is unending materialism and drug fueled mania. every night i battle the cocksuckers in my apartment complex who can't shut the god damned hell up and i'm constantly calling security on their asses. constant yelling and screaming and parties and loud music all the fucking time. constant phone addiction. they're addicts, all of them and they won't admit they have a problem. the american who can sit quietly and be still for five minutes is a rare feature.

work 50 hours a week in a job you fucking despise just to get drunk every weekend and do it again... there's no point to a life like that. i'd rather die. i don't want the latest phone or a big house or a fancy car, or any car, i don't want anything they have to sell me. my laptop is all i need, some clothes i've already had for years, warm blankets, and decent food, that's all you need in modern life.

the only benefit to my lifestyle of quiet contemplation and restraint is that i can survive long unemployment bouts with minimal anxiety... you never come out ahead, they make damn sure of it. lemme tell you the average paycheck to paycheck netflix watching burgerstanian could not survive what i have.

i just want them to shut the fuck up. i want a civilization worth living in. the prize for the current game holds no appeal to me and i don't want to play.

>>13100078
cringe and doomerpilled

>>13100006
>>13100078
you and i are alike in despising the circumstances, but you have the hubris and audacity to blame others. they're just as much a victim as you are. how about doing the best you can for yourself, then for others. start by trying to get a better job so you have more free time to volunteer at your local catholic mission soup kitchen or whatever. do it faggot and cure yourself of this inane adolescent whining.

>>13099584
There are three to four things large scale happenings which deteriorate education.

1. As has been mentioned; the government's involvement. Government services always deteriorate over time, provide less and cost more. Here a main issue are the unions who constantly expand the so to speak non-skilled labour part in the administration. Also the introduction of politically motivated courses. Meaning the children have less time to learn about math or language if they have several hours a week set aside for the various grievance studies or environmental activism. This is a development accelerated by the next point.

2. The expansion of the university. There's a pyramid scheme sorta thing going on. The state guarentees student loans for the banks meaning the kids can't default and therefore will get the money irrespective of capacity or field. The university in turn expanded its student body. Meaning that I think 70% or so of kids who finish high school go to university. That's ridiculous. This pushes the average student IQ down to 105 or something like that. These people should be in trade schools and such not in a university. They're not capable of studying complex topics, so instead the university, motivated by the capture of future student earnings, creates all sorts of bogus study fields. The worst of which are the political indoctrination classes which in general teach children that government growth solves all problems in the world and really people just need to be less mean and everything will be fine, which is just useless and dangerous drivel. There are sort of non-political nonsense courses as well. Media studies would be one of those. Students will not be able to earn money with degrees here and will consequently be highly indebted and indocrinated low skill workers who carry political and social resentment. A drop from the economic class they were born into is likely, which radicalizes further.

>>13100100
I'm not blaming anyone else. I don't want more; I want less. Jobs only perpetuate the exploitation. Encouraging it through volunteering is just as bad. If people really cared, theyd make jobs for the homeless. They'd find something the homeless are capable of. Give the poor guns to kill bankers, politicians, or whatever. But no. I'm not contributing to something evil. If everyone did something, it wouldn't be like this.
But I will give you that I shouldn't be whining. I just saw a chance to connect with someone and caved. I'll do better next time
>>13100078
I'll probably get banned again for not posting literature but that's probably for the best. What you say about noise is so true. There are just simply too many distractions. I live in a city (unfortunately) and there is just so much noise. Between the blacks hooting and hollering outside, or the endless traffic and car sounds, to dogs barking nonstop, it just gets to me. Not saying I'd survive in the country, but I can't understand why people subject themselves to this.
Furthermore, why people get jobs to pay for any of these lifestlyes. It's one thing if you have a kid young and want to be a good parent. Fine. I get that, and appreciate you for being a decent person. But everyone else? Is it really just shallow consumerism that keeps people happy?
Idk man. I won't last long if I keep this up. And I don't want to hurt my family. But working wouldn't undoubtedly make me kill myself, but no working makes them sad. There's no simple solution

>>13099584
>>13100121

3. That's the worst point. We're going through dysgenics. High IQ people do not reproduce, low IQ people are encouraged by the state to do so. It's difficult to measure because of something called the Flynn effect but there's good indication that we're losing IQ points fast (or more accurate; general cognitive ability). The introduction of low IQ migrants into western society does not help. With these economic and political incentives in place the education system has an enormous interest in capturing the largest possible part of the population If the IQ is constantly dropping that means that the curriculum has to be utterly devastated, and that's of course what's happening.

So we're doomed basically.

>>13099951
>i hate this god damned country so much. it feels like i don't even have a chance at life, no culture no family no country, born a tax slave live in consumerism die in a hospital.

>>13099785
>Moby Dick because they’re written by toxic straight white men.
Nobody thinks Melville was straight.

>>13099688
You have to go back, tourist.

>>13099951
is this the zoomgeist? how do we break these hellish chains? we live in a world of luxury, but one that wasn't designed with humans in mind. it's like we broke into an alien's house, and while everything is very nice and impressive and futuristic, we end up having to sleep on the hard floor because there are no beds anywhere. I want to run away, or else set everything on fire. I feel like a fucking meme every time I voice these kinds of thoughts to myself, but it's getting harder for me to ignore. we unironically live in a society and I don't know what to do about it.

>>13100197
I'm so disconnected from everyone. I've never really had friends but I don't hate people. My family is close to me yet I don't understand why they put up with what they do.
>I want to run away, or else set everything on fire
Exactly this. I lean towards setting it all ablaze, but I am one dude. I'll just make a fool of myself. Might as well run away and let people enjoy their lives

>>13100210
hey, we are two dudes together. count in the fbi agents lurking itt and we've probably got 30 or 40 dudes

>>13100215
True that. Alright, let's exchange numbers and addresses. Burn this bitch DOWN

>>13099584
Most people are average.

find an outlet for your anger so that people can be unified under your vision and you can profit from their agreement.

>>13099851
A girl I know said this to me.

>>13099688
Saturday night, all the normal people are either drunk or having sex, or most likely both, so we can talk between adults:
1. There was no intention by the Nazis to genocide the Jews.
2. There was no plan of systematic massacre of Jews that was carried out by the Nazis. No orders, no budget, nothing. Even the greatest historian of the Holocaust of the world was reduced to admitting that according to him, it all happened by "an incredible meeting of minds, a genocide by telepathy."
3. There were no gas chambers.
4. There were no 6 million Jews dead. If anything there was between 80 000 to 300 000 dead due to various circumstances (all under the umbrella of there is a fucking war going on), which is still a huge fucking number but clearly not enough for the master whiners to do their guilt-tripping of the rest of the world to push their political agenda.

There you go. Thanks, have yourself a good night.

>>13099652
Details?
I thought this was very nice
https://youtu.be/j_2NIhXrjIQ
Although kids separated by gender would be better.

>>13100006
Based. Homelessness may be the only way to live with some dignity now.
Although it's also becoming more dangerous, so be careful if you do it.

>>13099652
Compare apples to apples. Nigger and spics are what bring down American education. White Americans are actually on par with the Finns, and surpass other Europeans. If you wish to understand any disparity between the US and Europe, you must first start with the nigger and the spic.

>>13100273
Girls aren't people

>>13100502
i have the same idea as to what happened to the jews as you do but have you felt like your a little crazy sometimes when you meet people who believe 6 million and gas chambers i mean how many other incredible lies are in history like the holocaust but with no evidence to base their truth or not are out there.

>>13099951
move to europe

>>13099584
>Where did the education system go so horribly wrong?
American schools are cesspools in every possible way.
>>13099661
>>13099694
t. parasitic federal employees
we're on to you

>>13099584
Literacy is not for everyone.

>>13100580
history is propaganda, read moldbug

>>13099584
There is no public anymore, let alone a reading public. Welcome to 2019.

>>13099652
Most finns i’ve mer have been retards, really doubt any of them have read homer.

>>13099652
>Finnish schools, which start at 7 years old, produce some of the best students in the world
thats because finns are asian

Do they really have Holocaust class every year in public schools? I went to a Catholic school and we hardly even learned about it.

>>13099785
Good job forming your world view based on the dumbest examples of the other side of the political spectrum.
Way easier than reading those long complicated books or actually talking to sb from the other side

>>13099584
The moment it became a system.
The best and most efficacious "school system" in the Western World was the schoolhouse in the american midwest and rural town.
The village hires a teacher and puts an house at her disposal and she reaches the kids in one big room-class.
Since kids of various ages are all together the older ones are encouraged to help educating the younger ones, building friendships.
They are taught to read by memorizing the KJV and Iliad and Odissey: they've produced the most literarily advanced generation in human history.
All that was left was to impose a final exam to standardize level of attainment so that You were sure that everyone who was interested in going to college knew at least THIS much.
Instead This model of education was abandoned in favour of Bismark's School-Barracks which takes up 100% of the kids time and is focused on producing workers and soldiers for the 19th Century Nation-State.
It won't change any time soon.

>>13099584
The Iliad is trash. Based amazon reviewer.

>>13101565
Yes. I posted above and have no reason to lie. I didn't actually notice it until after highschool. I was obviously bored on the second or third class, but not angry or concerned. That I was taking multiple holocaust courses didn't set in until I found 4chan. After that, it all started making sense

Most normies barely read anything beyond Harry Potter and Garfield/Peanuts newspaper """"funny"""" strips.

>>13101620
Any books on American schooling before it got Prussianized?

>>13101654
>after i found 4chan i turned into a schizo retard
adds up

>>13101654
Dang, I think they mentioned it one day in world history for me but we hardly harper on it. No wonder people are so brainwashed if they teach as if the only things to have happened in the US are the Revolution (which didn't abolish slavery!!!), the Civil War (over slavery!!!), the Holocaust, Civil rights, and Obama's election.

>>13101565
Yes. Holocaust and MLK/Civil Rights movement are taught almost every single year since elementary.

>>13101668
>tfw we probably spend more time on the Holocaust than the Krauts
Hold me burgerbros

>>13101672
I don't know, I'm pretty sure the Germans are taught to feel a collective sense of guilt about it.

>>13101685
They do the same here with slavery, also, the Jews partially blame the US for the Holocaust for not letting them all move here.

>>13101685
This phenomenon is hardly restricted to Germany. Guilt-tripping is a very effective tool to keep people under control.

>>13100161
>Give the poor guns to kill bankers, politicians, or whatever. But no. I'm not contributing to something evil.
kek_wheeze.gif

You're a brainlet.

>>13101660
>Jonathan Zimmerman (2009). Small Wonder: The Little Red Schoolhouse in History and Memory. Yale University Press.
Biased But good starting point

>>13101700
>killing bankers
>evil
lol

>>13101704
That's very anti-semitic of you, bigot.

>>13101704
Killing is immoral, even in retribution. Bankers and politicians should certainly pay for their crimes, but according to ethical standards set by the Geneva Convention.

>>13099652
We don't read books at school. Well okay, maybe one fiction book per year and usually you can pick it yourself so it's either Harry Potter or some subpar detective story and that's it, even in high school. No Homer, no Tolstoijevski, no Shakespeare. Highest form of literature that we have to read is some Väinö Linna novel. It's pathetic. Finnish education is a meme.

t. Finn

>>13099790
*as declared by american university professors

>>13101726
>killing is immoral
Proof?

>>13101565
Yes. every single fucking year.
>>13100589
not into being raped by pakis, friend. anyway i can never wash off the stain of being a burger, even if i do move away. i have concerns about being able to get a job in europe, too.
>>13100197
iktf. Take the /n/pill. Our cities have not been designed for humans to live in--they're built to shuffle wagepigs from box to box draining every cent out of their pockets along the way. the /n/pill has made me far more bitter and resentful than anything on /pol/.
>>13100161
it's not even the blacks here, it's white people. these fucking white yuppies who think life is a 24/7 party and jump from one drug to another to keep their energy to manic levels. i'd rather live around asians. i've never met a noisy asian except chinese. anyway.
yes, their lives are 100% consumerism. npc meme is not a meme, that's our reality. i don't think these creatures are capable of independent thought. you speak to any of them and they all say the exact same things, same exact hobbies and interests, they watch the same movies and listen to the same music. they even look the same, i can't tell them apart.
>>13100100
christcucks need to die. churches are old time NPC-factories.

>>13101662
I'd rather be a schiz than a psychopath like most NPCs and normies

>>13101703
thanks anon

>>13099584
mass schooling is not designed to educate, it's just priming for propaganda

>>13101620
My great grandmother was taught in a one room schoolhouse and would talk about how much she wanted to go to school and learn. She would get up early with her sisters to walk several miles to get there. They respected the children's autonomy and time, but now school has turned into a miserable 9 to 5 office job where students are just punching in hours. Nobody really wants it anymore, and if they do they don't want the k12 education, just the hope that they will get into college.
This is bleeding into college though and it makes me very angry to see so many students fucking around on their laptops while the professor they paid for lectures. They roll their eyes like children when asked to do anything and beg for shitty multiple choice tests. My great grandmother and her classmates were more mature at ten than these people are at twenty. I had a wonderful history professor who was young but had essay exams. Most of the class hated him for this because it was hard. Of course it's hard retards, but if you can write a full essay on something in an hour then you know it and it feels satisfying. These other classes with multiple choice and curves feel so cheap.
The noise thing is hitting home. I am exhausted because my roommate was up all night playing video games and never stops talking when she is awake. I don't know what she has left to talk about, all of the conversations I hear through the wall follow the same pattern like an overplayed song.

>>13102200
Thank you for your contribution, absolutely precious.

>>13102200
>They roll their eyes like children when asked to do anything and beg for shitty multiple choice tests.
>I had a wonderful history professor who was young but had essay exams. Most of the class hated him for this because it was hard.
That's because it's all a rat race. You don't go to college to learn, you go in order to get a degree so that you can maybe get a decent middle-class job and scamper up the ladder as fast as you can before it falls away during the next financial crisis. If you get a shitty mark then you're fucked, no decent company will want to take you on as an intern, and without decent internships you'll never get a decent job lined up after graduation, etc. I've seen it in engineering classes; a thermodynamics professor I worked for asked me how he could improve his teaching evaluations. I talked to some of the students he taught, and the conclusion I reached was that they disliked his course because he was trying to instill an interest in thermodynamics in his students, instead of just teaching exactly what was required for the exam (his exams were quite reasonable, and were directly related to material that he had taught in class or tutorials).

>>13102458
>That's because it's all a rat race. You don't go to college to learn, you go in order to get a degree so that you can maybe get a decent middle-class job and scamper up the ladder as fast as you can before it falls away during the next financial crisis
Isn't that a fundamental and constitution al problem of our economy? The fact that we have to have an university degree to do litteraly anything nowadays despite the fact that most people just aren't interested or predisposed to pass so many years studying?
What did We do to ourselves?
1/5 of the population of the US is under antipsycotics.
What did We do to ourselves?

>>13100537
Yeah yeah keep blaming anyone but yourself you pathetic whitoid. Try a different method of coping with your extinction

>>13102851
You think your turn won't come eventually?
Poor moron. The élites want a earth with 500 milion people. You honestly think that as soon as They're done with us they won't round You people up and make soap with the lot of you?
You want to be their slaves in exchange for life? They don't need slaves. They'll just automize industry.
They don't need anything from us anymore, What makes you think that they would need anything from you?
Think carefully before choosing your allies.

>>13099595
>Everything the federal government touches, and doesn't leave to the states, goes to shit.
Alabama anon reporting in.
Alabama has rigid control of it's school system, mostly dictated through local school boards. The boards rule with an iron hand, with the intent of destroying public education, so they can prove gub-mint bad. The problem lies with the lack of oversight of private, religious based schools and charter, for-profit, schools.
Alabama has been creating generations of mental midgets. No classics, no greeks, no science/stem, nothing is taught that would promote critical thinking or intellectual thought.. No computers, except for toys and "educational games". All the conservative political system wants is work drones that don't know enough to question authority, AKA "The Redneck".
It's the Dumbing Down of America", thoroughly implemented.

>>13103018
Based, the idea that the dumbing down of the population is an accident is liberal bullshit.
The system is designed to create workers first and foremost, critical and creative thinking is not a boon unless it's harnessed in a way that creates revenue.

>>13102851
found the kike

>>13102200
Don’t hate the students who roll their eyes, hate every insufferable faggot teacher/professor they’ve had who has systematically robbed them of the ability to enjoy learning. When you’re paying over $1,000 to take a course taught by someone who fails to teach one single fact the entire course then gives you a C because he gives everyone C’s because he knows he can’t teach and doesn’t care, it’s hard to get enthused the one time you have a professor who can actually teach.

>>13101962
You never read Kalevala?
t. Swede-finn

>>13099652
True and false
American schools have the problem of being way too lax, it's extremely easy to cheat the system. I did homework probably like twice and still got decent grades. At the same time, the books they force you to read are gay faggot shit. Barely any classics, just shit that the hippie English teachers like and if you're not into it too bad faggot keep reading the fucking Bean Trees lmao

>>13099584
>Where did the education system go so horribly wrong?
In america, the "one size fits all" aproach to education is super cancerous. Here the goal is to have students pass standardized tests as opposed to reach their full potential, and as a result, most elementary/middle school classrooms are taught so that people with 90 IQs can do good. This shit us super damaging to people who are even remotely above average and in the end encourages mediocrity. Here it's usually not until highschool (year 9 for euros) where people are segregated by abillity, so the result is that the first 8 years of public education are glorified daycare for many. The end result is that even promising American students are often behind their European counterparts by the time they reach university; in Europe its rare for someone going into university not to take at least a year of calculus in highschool, where as many Americans don't even have precalculus finished by the time they're done.

Or you can listen to /pol/ and believe the problem is "lol brown people" (even though pol also says that Sweden is being over run by brown people and yet they have one of the best public education systems in the world).

>>13103018
And here we have another classical example of the old switcharoo.
We made mess. But it was always the evil republican's fault.
Grow the fuck up.

>>13099584
But both the Iliad and odyssey are poems, what the duck is that reviewer doing

>>13101620
I went to one of these private schools as a kid (between being homeschooled by the paranoid, self absorbed bitch that shat me out.) It was a rural area. Kids didn't take well to newcomers, my brother and I were bullied all the time. It caused me to withdraw more socially and my grades were terrible. I wasn't the only retard: one 4th grader literally did not know how to read in her head. She would have to go to a separate room for reading assignments to read the book out loud to herself. One boy had a bad home life and was often forced to call his mother, the shithole had no e.g. principal's office, so he did it in front of everyone in the classroom who burst into hysterical laughter at him while his mother screamed at him over the phone.
At any given time 3/4 of the entire class would gang up on whoever was the most appealing target of that moment, while the remaining 1/4 was being taught their lesson by the teacher. In the highly unlikely chance you have a kid, don't put them through this horseshit.

I eventually did make it into public school, and it was atrocious, sure, but not in comparison to that garbage.