/lit/ - Literature

>>13014775
Why will it have a mass audience if it's becoming obsolete

>>13014775
How is the novel even slightly obsolete? It's a fictional book over 40k words. Novels are going to exist in some form until the collaspe of humanity.

>>13014775
take the récitpill

listen to borges and take the short stories pill

>>13000000

>>13014780
I think op just wanted to show how people can't write anymore, hence proving his point.

Media gets crowded out by other media. The novels popularity may dwindle further than it is now. And frankly that good for the trees. Mass produced garbage lit ought to stop, the sooner the better.
Is literacy going to drop off anytime soon? Only if voice activated AI (or w/e we call smartphones and computers when they completely merge into that personal assistant that follows you everywhere) becomes the norm, could I see that happening. Only when a person can live a high quality of life without needing to read a thing.
The novels, or stories, they consume will be read to them. Hopefully by professionals. Poetry, even epic poetry may become popularized again.

Book slightly related

>>13014775
until someone invents a narrative artform that can contain the length, depth and breadth of a novel where the creator (and to an extent, the editor) has total creative control, it won't become obsolete

>>13014991
It's called video games

Novels are a waste of time. Anything could be told in a grand maximum of 50 pages. If your events don't fit in that span, a lot of it is superfluous and should be cut.

Everytime I read something "long" (longer than a hundred pages), I pause and tell myself that whatever the author says in one page can be summarized in two lines.

>>13015003
disagreed. a movie is closer to what he described. video game is larping in someone else's ideas.

>>13014775
The only thing keeping the novel around is lower barrier of entry when it comes to creating. It is simply not feasible for 99% of people to turn their idea for an epic furry vampire space opera into a movie or a game, but anyone with at least one working hand can sit down and put words on a piece of paper.

Hopefully A.I. will one day allow a single person to create their own Hollywood would level films or AAA games. Then we can finally get rid of novels for good.

imagine the smell

>>13014775
Surely, but we have yet to see how the world will cope after the death of English. It's already disintegrating to smaller sects based on habits, site preferences, and the political side of it; aka. manipulation techniques utilized by the state and private companies.

>>13014775
people have been saying this for like a century

>>13015003
>>13015010
a video game could fit the bill, but certainly not something like a AAA game. beyond something with the art and gameplay quality of something like earthbound, you're starting to ask too much out of one or two people

>>13015054
typical humanities-level misunderstanding of AI

>>13014835
You can't prove a point by being dishonest.

>>13015213
my next statement is going to be dishonest

>>13015007
If something is enjoyable people want more of it. Length is only an issue with short attention span kids. This isn’t about their length. Society itself is about to change. Technological advances and ecological collapse will push this current paltry commodity we know as the publishing industry into some other mode.
>>13015186
I doubt it all go away, but it will likely be less prevalent

>>13015206
You, my friend, are a retard or this is bad bait.

>>13015241
it's not bait, and I'm willing to look like a retard if you want to chastise me about why I'm wrong

>>13015186
And they've been right.

>>13015247
AI=synthesis of information by algorithms
Art=possessing that "divine spark"

If "real" AI were to ever be achieved, we would long passed the hallmark of needing literature or whatever i.e. we would be 500 years in the future.

>>13015003
indie games? Sure, if you have the patience to learn to code and make applicable art AND the great ideas to come up with a good story without taking away from it with mindless repetitive mob encounters. As soon as the dev team becomes larger than a handful of people, you might start to question whether the story is really your telling of it. Anything other than an indie game, though? No, no, and nope.

>>13015275
I think you responded to the wrong post, I (mostly/obliquely) agree with you

>>13014775
Audio drama podcasts are the future of literature.

Define 'obsolete'.
If you mean culturally obsolete, you're completely right. I don't think novels can affect humans on the societal scale or even individually anymore. Too many new, vastly more efficient, intricate, and immediate forms of communicating ideas had been created for the longform literature to compete. Books no longer play a major, or even minor role in the dissemination of ideas.
If you mean obsolete as a recreational pasttime, obviously not. Personally I'm way bored by movies/videogames/tvs/endless barrage of youtube/etc and novels offer me an isolated respite from the relentless clangor of the modern world. Circling back to the first statement, I actually love how irrelevant and pointless literature has become. I don't want my novel-reading experience to matter, or necessarily change something, I don't want it to be widely discussed, shown in the news, referenced by politicians or any such 'important' things. It's just mine. I read the book and this small, totally insignificant, useless memory is all for me to keep and cherish.

>>13015327
>Books no longer play a major, or even minor role in the dissemination of ideas
you can't possibly believe that. A longform written text is still the best way to record and convey a complex idea or narrative, whether it's fiction or nonfiction

>>13015299
Just checked. Yep, You are right. I am the retard. I apologize.

>>13015347
Being the best doesn't mean much when nobody cares.

>>13015372
when I say "best" it's not a qualitative judgment, I mean a book is the most effective and efficient vehicle for conveying a long, organized set of thoughts. They aren't obsolete because there's no replacing them, and someone who spends all their time on digital media is not "replacing" their literature diet, they were never going to be a reader in any era of information technology

>>13015415
>there's no replacing them
just to clarify, this is a typo and I don't mean to say there's nothing in our future capable of replacing a book, although it might be a few iterations before it becomes unrecognizable as a "book"

>>13014775
>>13015327
>>13015347
Literature is where a single person is allowed to present his ideas without any intruder telling him to compromise. The author is the sound man, the cinematographer, the story-teller, the actor and the director. Literature also helps keep the imagination alive. It forces you to exercise your imagination and therefore strengthen it, as opposed to movies and videogames that dumb it down. Is it at all surprising that the best movies are based on literature?

>>13015415
>a book is the most effective and efficient vehicle for conveying a long, organized set of thoughts
The thread is about novels. Nobody disputed the fact that scientific papers and similar scholarly idea-containers will remain written in longform text. Although one may argue that as technology continutes to exist, dynamic, interactive environment will replace the efficiency or reading a wall of text.

>>13015454
I don't buy the idea that literature is particularly good for your mind or soul as opposed to a film or a video game or whatever. I think there are stories that are best (or only) tellable through film or a game, but like you said, the biggest advantage of lit over both of those is intimacy and total creative control

>>13015459
I still stand by what I said. Besides the issues of production, a novel is really the only way to tell a complex, intricate, long story. There's a reason why there are "unadaptable" novels, or that complex novels that do get adapted have to elide and omit so much

>>13015535
>novel is really the only way to tell a complex, intricate, long story.
Ofcourse not. There's more written text in the dialogues of an average videogame, visual novel, manga, or some weird shit like Homestuck. Text volume aside, their inteacting, often procedurally-generated nature makes them unimaginable more complex, at least in theory. You can argue about the quality, but all these mediums are still in their infancy and will inevitably get better and better, while the novel form obviously had it's peak.

>>13015578
I'm saying that a video game's complexity (which isn't really the kind of plot or stylistic complexity I'm talking about) comes at great expense precisely due to the amount of considerations that come with the territory of art and gameplay. I'm sympathetic to video games and I think they have as much artistic potential as any form of media, but they're ultimately constrained by budget and too many layers of indirection, just like a film is. A novel can be a singular, complete vision, no matter how convoluted or strange, delivered from a single creator directly to the consumer

>>13015279
>>13015206
>>13015003

Nips have had the answer for decades: VNs. They’re literally non-linear screenplays produced by indie circles for a hyper-niche audience, which allows them to produce shit that would never make it to market in any other medium. Pic related is better than almost every book I’ve ever read

>>13015454
>literature is written by a single person

>>13016008
>that tasteless art style
That only adds another piece to my point right here >>13015454 in the advantage there is of leaving the visual style up to the reader's imagination and not the author, so long as the description the author gives is vague enough.
Seriously, that weeb shit looks awful. For what its story may be worth, I'd rather read it in great prose on grainy paper than being presented in that teenager-catering trash.

>>13016196
>leaving the visual style up to the reader's imagination
>he watches movies in his head when he reads
never gonna make it

>>13016209
>he watches movies in his head when he reads
If movies looked like animated Kris Verwimp illustrations, then yeah, sure, movies.

>>13016209
>he watches movies in his head when he reads
If movies looked like animated Kris Verwimp or Luis Royo illustrations, then yeah, sure, movies.

>>13016432
>I'm not imagining a chair because there's no real life chair that looks like this chair I'm imagining

>>13015007
>every second of my day must be squeezed of its productivity potential
Who gives a fuck if they're a waste of time? People who read for knowledge alone are philistines

>>13016504
>/mu/ triptard
now THERE'S were to get advice on how to live your life from

>>13016519
as opposed to the enlightened scholars who post anonymously

>>13016531
nice bump!

>>13016504
This

Personal utalitarians are such miserable people, you're not a robot for fucks sake