/lit/ - Literature

It's called a philosopher king; read the Republic

Totalitarianism isn't an ideology or a form of government in itself, but rather a way to implement other ideologies.

>>12834894
The idea that totalitarianism is incompatible with meritocracy is retarded libdem propaganda. Ironically, the only system that is actually incompatible with meritocracy is crony capitalism, the lovechild of capitalism and libdems.

>>12834894
https://anarchistwithoutcontent.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/junger-total-mobilization-doc.pdf

“Totalitarian” is a meme buzzword that means very little. It’s not a coherent ideology

>>12834926
>>12834933
I watched a video on totalitarianism and one thing i didn't like about Hitlers form of totalitarianism is that instead of being loyal to the state they were loyal to Hitler. I'm trying to be loyal to the state and have even the leader be under the authority of the land. But do go one about how totalitarianism is in fact compatible with meritocracy as opposed to what some might thing. And isn't capitalism the most meritocratic?

>>12834910
I'm planning to, thanks.

>>12835029
I see it more as a means to accomplish something. It is a tool I would like to use to push a certain ideology and lifestyle. The ideal lifystyle.

Just become a marxist-leninist, OP. Soviet cosmonauts started out as fucking factory workers and worked their way up to glory. Absolutely meritocratic

>>12835030
Because national socialism WAS Hitler, it was nothing without him.
Also, capitalism isn't meritocratic because wealth leads to more wealth in this system.

>>12835044
That's another thing. I'm also interested in absolute monarchism. Perhaps I could Make the king the head of the state. I'm also interested in marxism but from what I've read most of the industrialization that you speak of came about by stalin in the five year plan.

>>12835054
>national socialism WAS Hitler
Elaborate. I don't like the cult of personality that was in nazi germany. I do think that the leader should live up to the ideal of the nation but he himself shouldn't be worshiped like Hitler was, That's just idolatrous.

Meritocracy is the true evil.

>>12835086
y tho? And how tho?

>>12835070
The King in the old European absolute monarchies had his power through literal ownership of the land, which means he was not submitted to the "authority of the land", he ruled everything.
>>12835077
The Nazi party gained it's power mostly through Hitler's charisma and leadership, not through the ideology itself.

>>12835030
>I'm trying to be loyal to the state and have even the leader be under the authority of the land.
A state isn't anything but a group of men. Pledging total allegiance to an idea instead of just directly to a gang isn't any different in practice.

>meritocracy
No such thing. People in positions of power think they possess the most merit in any system. The more people think they have special merit the more they probably don't.

>>12835105
>Pledging total allegiance to an idea instead of just directly to a gang isn't any different in practice.
Probably but I'd prefer a idea over a man. But i'm also planning on making it theocratic.

>People in positions of power think they possess the most merit in any system
I'm sure specific policies and laws can be applied that will allow those who have achieved the most to go up in the ranks.

>>12835094
Read 'The Rise of Meritocracy' by Michael Young. Really clever dystopian novel in terms of style.

>>12834936
So sorry for ignoring you. But thanks for the recc.

>>12835086
Idiot

>>12835191
Thanks, I'm guessing he argues against meritocracy which is something I agree with heavily. But i'm open to heading opposing views.

>>12835185
Pledge allegiance to me while you're waiting bro

>>12835030
> loyal to the state

jeez what if there are two important people in the country that claim they are doing the best for the state? You know, like the USSR

>>12835210
Then they are the ones that we should all listen to.

>>12835203
no

>>12835260
What if the ideas are conflicting?

>>12835270
There will be a first among equals within the head. Also, I'm not into making a state but a federation and the leaders will come together to make decisions but will always have to have the future of the country in mind.

>>12835282
What if they don't?

>>12835282
Oh, because that historically worked in the great old USSR

Inb4 muh commies

>>12835185
>I'm sure specific policies and laws can be applied that will allow those who have achieved the most to go up in the ranks.
People really get where they are by deception and luck. You can bureaucratically try to screen, evaluate, whatever else but you're methods will probably just end up keeping out the real best. When people believe they are the best and brightest the more full of themselves they become and disconnected from reality, notice the leaders in any system whatsoever.

>>12835288
I'm sure they will sooner or later. Or it could be that a single person is the leader and all decisions are made by him kinda like a absolute monarchy and people can only advise the ruler about what decisions they think will be most appropriate but ultimately the decision lies on the ruler.

>>12835306
Yeah, there will have to be a way to stop these from happening. But I'm also toying with the idea of a absolute monarchy. Perhaps promote deception and trickery and have the royal family be brought up in education so that they don't fall to the trickery and if they do fall the ones that will take their place will be greater than them and so on. But ultimately if the people are not happy with their government they will most likely revolt.

>>12835325
It only works in theory because people die, or are just born dumb so the whole thing falls apart when the monarchs only child is useless or retarded or if the monarch is sterile

>>12835339
I remember hearing about this story that a rothchild had like 5 kids and trained them up to become expert banksters or something and sent them out to lead the major banks in europe and that's how they controlled the world and stuff. But if you have a retarded child then have another one but don't let the retarded child breed.

>>12834894
>totalitarianism is incompatible with meritocracy
Meritocracy implies a contractual theory : the State expresses its need for worthy people by enabling them to conquer higher socio-economic positions.
On the other hand, totalitarianism (as in fascist or national-socialist -i.e. aristotelo-thomisto-hegelian- theory) is organicist and postulates that the elite is generated by the State (just as an organism generates its organs), even if the State is not -temporally speaking- first in execution (it is first in intention though).
The totalitarian, organistic theory of the State therefore imply that the elite comes from the State itself and choses to subordinate to it by accepting this origin. The elite choses to be what they are and to follow their rules, while in a meritocracy, the elite is just people willing to take high ranks usually just for the sake of having higher ranks.
This absence of subordination to a higher good in a meritocratic system usually leads to opportunism, fixism (those who are in higher positions want to keep them for themselves and their offspring even if they are not worthy of these.
Which leads to bad stuff since meritocracy ends up degenerating into nepotism.

>>12835351
>if you have a retarded child then have another one but don't let the retarded child breed.

Do you not realise how human reproduction works? Also, its not all about being retarded, but some people just dont want to be rulers. You can't actually train a child like a dog

>>12835362
>Do you not realise how human reproduction works?
Yes, but what does it have to do with this?

>but some people just dont want to be rulers.
I disagree but even so like I said earlier it's not an issue since the one that takes his place will be superior.

>>12835352
>Which leads to bad stuff since meritocracy ends up degenerating into nepotism.
Interesting. I mentioned it earlier in this thread but is it possible to perhaps enforece specific polcies that will not enable people to do nepotism? And is it possible to allow the members of the nation to rise up in the ranks if they show themselves to be worthy and show feats worthy of being a leader of the state.

>>12835030
True capitalism is. But nobody actually practices true capitalism, because once some corporation becomes powerful, they seek to acquire a monopoly, which is strongly anti-capitalistic. Therefore, true capitalism is more or less impossible, and monopoly or crony capitalism is, obviously, anti-meritocratic. There is however no reason to assume a just state or ruler, regardless of totalitarianism, wouldn’t be meritocratic, and many authoritarian states have been fiercely meritocratic in the past (Such as Imperial China).

>>12835376
>Yes, but what does it have to do with this?
That you can't just decide to 'not have retarded children' or to not be sterile. Are you 12?

>>12834894
>totalitarianism is incompatible with meritocracy
>

Political Theology by Schidmt

>>12834894
Read Leviathan, just lots of basic political philosophers pre-1800’s.
Might want to look into Salazar’s Portugal too

>>12834894
From reading your other posts seems like you just want a classical republic, the way Machiavelli envisioned it.
I think Discourses on Livy goes into it

>>12835444
Well, that would only be an issue if all your kids for some reason came out retarded.

>>12835510
Nice, thanks for the recc.

>>12835077
>Elaborate

"The Party is Hitler! But Hitler is Germany, as Germany is Hitler!

Hitler, Sieg Heil! Sieg Heil! Sieg Heil!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VD31NVUWUUs