/lit/ - Literature

Because their life sucks

>>12144982
Do they read only "ficition", or do they only read fiction?

>>12144990
Damn, good one. You got em.

>>12144982
Why would you want to read full books about real stuff? Fucking nerds, bro

>>12144990
Women do other things, but when they read it’s only fiction. Not sure what you’re implying. My statement isn’t wrong, you tool.

>>12144982
Why do you keep making the same thread over and over again with a different image?

>>12144982
Because it's cute. Girl are supposed to be dreamy and light headed.
Imagine a girl reading Plato, off putting.

>>12145025
What kind of genre is only fiction? Never heard of it.

>>12144982
Do you have justification for the claim that women read proportionally more fiction than men?

>>12145034
I mean airheaded.

Apparently lightheaded doesn't have the meaning I thought.

>>12144982
Most women read what they read because they follow pop culture, not because they're actually interested in fiction

That's if they're not just buying the thing for shelf display. You think everyone who bought twilight actually read the books?

>>12145033
Why don’t you get a life?

>>12145040
Great method of white knighting. Keep it low effort. Why make an argument?

>>12144982
Dunno, but women have a greater interest in people. Since fictions books rely a lot more on characters than other medias, I think it's easy to see why they prefer fictions rather than, say, an history book.

Why do women prefers people? I'll have to suppose it's because they are sexually programmed to do so. Women have less trouble finding a partner for sex but face much greater costs for the act. Hence, women need to choose their partner well and so they have evolved to be interested in people. This is why 90% of people buying romance novel are women, because it deal with an heroine finding the perfect partner (handsome, alpha, find her irresistible, etc). This is also probaly why women viagra are a kind of antidepressor.

We can contrast this with the male sexuality, where 2/3 of people going on porn sites are males, and more than 90% of the people giving money to those kind of sites are men.

Anyway.

>>12144982
Not true.

>>12144982
>tfw dating a severely dyslexic girl
It's great being with someone who doesn't feel the need to feign an interest in literature just to appeal to my sensibilities.

>>12144982
Because women don't care about the truth. The truth hurts them, while the imagination sets them free. Something's wrong with a woman's sexuality if she fixates on the truth too severely and is under 60.

I read both nom fiction and fiction and I'm a girl
I do notice a lot only read YA easy stuff tho

>>12145583
What kind of nonfiction?

>>12145025
It’s grammatically incorrect you stupid nigger

>>12144982
I read mostly fiction, but thats just because I get tired of dealing with the "real" world so the idea of reading about it in my own time is off putting

>>12144982
we don't

>>12145699
It’s not fucking “grammatically incorrect” because there’s no grammar mistake. There is a fucking spelling mistake, ie a typo. You are an idiot. Please get off this board.

>>12144982

>It's "women are supid" episode again

>>12145720
>we don't
GET OF MY FUCKIGN BOARD

>>12145071

>getting this butthurt

man, you suck

Why has there not been one world-historical female genius in all of history?

Why is there no female Plato, Shakespeare, Dante, Goethe? Where are they?

Is it because whenever someone asks this question, women excuse themselves from rising to the challenge by saying "it's men's fault?"

>>12145812
discrimination

>all women do X thing that I think is bad and I'm not providing any evidence or justification beyond maybe an incel post

My gf is a hegelian whose life goal is to teach Aristotle at the greatest academy of my continent, where she studies.

>>12145812
I'd be surprised if there was a female Plato considering how Greek society was structured. I mean, historically I don't think women were encouraged to persue such lofty goals. There are a few famous female geniuses like Mary Curie. As for writers, the period you describe (from Plato to Goethe) wasn't particularly friendly to women. Statistically, you would think there would be at least one, right? To that I would pose another statistical question, why are most well known female writers from the 19th to 21st centuries? It would be one thing if there was a litany of bad female literature throughout time, but most female literature that is famous is from this period.

>>12145821
This. It’s not beyond reason to assume that at least some ancient writings whose authors remain anonymous were women.

As for in recent times, there are a number of women who have been considered influential. Writers like Woolf, Austen and De Beauvoir were all groundbreaking in their own way.

>>12145821
you missed the joke

>>12145821
>>12145849
>>12145852
Women have been discouraged from genres such as sculpture that require studio training or expensive materials. But in philosophy, mathematics, and poetry, the only materials are pen and paper. Male conspiracy cannot explain all female failures. I am convinced that, even without restrictions, there still would have been no female Pascal, Milton, or Kant. Genius is not checked by social obstacles: it will overcome. Men's egotism, so disgusting in the talentless, is the source of their greatness as a sex. [...] Even now, with all vocations open, I marvel at the rarity of the woman driven by artistic or intellectual obsession, that self-mutilating derangement of social relationship which, in its alternate forms of crime and ideation, is the disgrace and glory of the human species.

Women are almost always idealists

>>12145937
>all women are X

>>12145812
Sappho?
Hildegard of Bingen?
Jane Austen?
Gertrude Stein?

Sappho was extremely popular well into the Hellenistic period, and was believed to be widely read for over a thousand years. She's still influential to a number of writers and poets today. Hildegard revolutionized both religious and medicinal practice in her abbey and her practices slowly spread to the rest of the Christian world. She was canonized two years ago I think for her wide ranging influence.

Jane Austen and Gertrude Stein, I would argue, have had a bigger influence on modern prose than any other two writers (including Shakespeare, Goethe, and Dante). Without Jane Austen there would be no free-indirect discourse, no colourful narrative. Walter Scott and his followers would have populated the bookshelves for most of the 19th century. Gertrude Stein's influence is unmistakable in modernist literature and beyond. Without her there would probably be no Hemingway, no Barthelme, no Ashberry, or at least, they would have a very different approach to the sentence.

But hey, if saying there are no female geniuses makes you feel better about being a man, who am I to take that away from you?

>>12145914
Yeah dude, just lemme write this groundbreaking philosophical treatise. I'll just overcome all of that culturally enforced illeteracy and domesticity and get right on that, chief.

>>12146033
lmao u mad roastie?

>>12146005
>Jane Austen and Gertrude Stein, I would argue, have had a bigger influence on modern prose than any other two writers (including Shakespeare, Goethe, and Dante).
Lmao. So not only do women not produce geniuses, they can't even recognize genius. No wonder all the great literary critics of the last 200 years are men as well.

>>12146033
"I suppose the stock explanation for any such difference is that women were not encouraged, or were not appreciated, or were discouraged from being creative. But I don’t think this stock explanation fits the facts very well. In the 19th century in America, middle-class girls and women played piano far more than men. Yet all that piano playing failed to result in any creative output. There were no great women composers, no new directions in style of music or how to play, or anything like that. All those female pianists entertained their families and their dinner guests but did not seem motivated to create anything new.

Meanwhile, at about the same time, black men in America created blues and then jazz, both of which changed the way the world experiences music. By any measure, those black men, mostly just emerging from slavery, were far more disadvantaged than the middle-class white women. Even getting their hands on a musical instrument must have been considerably harder. And remember, I’m saying that the creative abilities are probably about equal. But somehow the men were driven to create something new, more than the women."

The fact that your brain defaults immediately to "b-but it's not my fault! It's men's fault that I don't do anything!" is exactly why women have never done anything in all of human history and never will, except by accident or as the exception to the rule.

>>12145944
Yes roastie you can generalize about a group and mostly be correct.

>>12146062
Be careful. She's going to start implying you have trouble getting laid, now.

>>12145034
I know one who mainly read philosophy and would unironically be a good woman to marry, unlike 70% of her generation. She's hardworking and quite ascetic too by modern standard, not ugly either far from.

>>12146058
>So not only do women not produce geniuses, they can't even recognize genius.

Care to explain how that follows what I said? Jane Austen and Gertrude Stein are well recognized for their influence on prose. If you want to engage with actual statements I'd be happy to oblige, but if you just want to restate what you already said then I won't waste my time.

>>12146062
well, of course you can, since it's reasonable to generalize all cis women as having vaginas, or all women in general having skin, etc

>>12146069
>she

>>12146099
>using cis unironically

Oh man tranny spotted gross

>>12144982
Genderbaiting and racebaiting are truly the lowest forms of posting

>>12146094
Can you send me her phone number?

>>12145937
what? It's the opposite. Men are attracted to abstractions - ideal forms - while women like interpersonal understanding and feeling more.

>>12146108
oh, I'm sorry, I didn't know this was /pol/. save your ammo in any case, my dick has been attached to me since birth

>>12146118
This is why men create philosophies that last for ten thousand years, and women create drama and make workplaces unpleasant.

>>12146114
Are you French ? :^)
She's already taken tho, sorry, but if you search you'll eventually find someone like her.

>>12146131
Yikes you definitely type like a fag though. Sorry I'm generalizing again

>>12146140
And she's french? Fuck. Does she have that fetal alcohol syndrome eye thing that french qts have? If so, she sounds perfect

Fiction is all I read and in as huge of a misogynisti as the next chamber. This always seemed like a meme to me.

>>12146146
Do you have any examples ? She's low-key redhead too

>>12146155

>>12146094
>hardworking
>mainly reads philosophy
So she's a man? That's what you're into?

>>12146141
no, you're fine for generalizing, I'm thirsty for dick and I mildly deserve the term fag

>>12146182
It might still be a woman, women sometimes read a lot of meme philosophy related to social activism shit and confuse it for real philosophy

>>12146168
Nope sorry
>>12146182
Definitely a woman, stop believing memes. They're rare but such girls exist.
>>12146187
She likes poetry too, mainly french ones : Verlaine, Baudelaire, Victor Hugo, as well as more obscur ones.
As for philosophy she read : Schopenhauer, Hegel, The Greeks (don't know everything about her taste tho, so it must miss plenty of them since she read a lot)
In fiction: Kafka, Céline, Zola, Camus

>>12146005
Jane Austen did not invent free-indirect discourse. And she was not even consciously aware of it as a device.

Sappho is not an influential poet. How can she be? We only have a few scraps of poetry. No none of this is even remotely true.

>>12145745
>it’s not grammatically incorrect
>>why do women read only fiction
>what is sentence structure?
Sub 80IQ detected

women like emotional romance trash, so it's easier to write books aimed towards them

where are you from?
almost all the women i know that read go thru more non-fiction and are always wanting to talk about it.
I feel like talking about Victorian era lit goddammit, why haven't you read Bronte?

>>12145812
There were plenty but many of their work was lost to time and more obviously due to the fact that women were pigeonholed to their dedicated roles then any modern Western woman will ever be shackled too. How can it be a woman's fault if man dismisses her based off something as arbitrary as her sex. This is a stupid discussion and there will always be a useless NPC trying to bait on a sensitive person who wants to defend a woman's right to her own intellectual pursuits in the great odds it'd ever be seen in history as significant. Perhaps in the next 500 years the tables will be more balanced.

>>12146892
where are YOU from bitch ass nigga

>>12145745
Spelling is part of grammar, you dumb cunt. And that's not what they were referring to.

>>12146218
He meant those are male interests and characteristics, undesirable in a woman.

>>12146260
>sappho is not an influential poet
>how can she be?
>we only have a few scraps of poetry
>we
>influence only exists to the extent the historical text is available to the contemporary marketplace
i can't tell if you're legitimately or just ironically pic related

>>12145937
It’s true. That’s why so many of them are liberal.

lmao as if any of you losers know anything about women. how can all of you incels make such ludicrous claims on women when you only have a faint concept of what a woman is?

>>12148390

>>12145681
Reading History of corruption in Peru at the moment and already read 1421: the year china discovered the world
In my non-fiction list are Colapse, The righteous mind and other history books

>>12144982
They want to be seen as cutesy, they want to attract a mate whether they realize it or not.
They might not act attractively, but they still want to attract a mate. So they'll dither about in the houses of readers, gamers, and other intellectuals, hoping to be that qt gf the smart rich 10/10 imaginary chad will have fun explaining Plato and Positivism to between sex sessions.
Women are treated better than men, so they see themselves as better than men of their level and social standing. That's why 6/10 and 3/10 women still feel entitled to 10/10 chadcock and will resent you for not being Christian Grey's richer older brother.

>>12148633
My friend saw a 4/10 woman in the airport yesterday on Tinder swiping left on guys way, way out of her league

Pretty funny

>>12146033
>I'll just overcome all of that culturally enforced illeteracy and domesticity and get right on that, chief.
Dumb roastie, you live in a pro-woman anti-male society where you'll get a "Good job!" and a "You're so smart and funny!" no matter how badly you half-ass your product.
Women fail at being men and competing with men, even when men inconvenience themselves in an attempt to lift them up.

>>12144982
They also read true crime.

>>12146095
Care to explain why you feel like saying "Me no wastey time" instead of reading his point about the more-oppressed blacks who invented jazz, roastie?
He already debunked your point, stop pretending he didn't even touch it.
Stop only hearing what you want to hear, you fucking girl.

>>12145034
>platonism
>not fiction

>>12145050
There was a time when people in /lit/ only made that kind of conjectures about heavy books like Phenomenology of Spirit. Now we're supposed to believe people can't even read Twilight. Sad times.

Also OP should go outside demonstrate for gay adoption instead of shitposting here.

>>12145543
> the truth hurts them
>imagination sets them free
>implying it's not the same for all of us

Why so dishonest anon ?

>>12145914
>But in philosophy, mathematics, and poetry, the only materials are pen and paper.

You forget teaching, training and most importantly free time. You think Gauss would have had time to make discoveries in every area of mathematics if he had been the daughter of an illiterate peasant busy with raising 5 children ?

Case in point: the aforementioned Gauss, the son of a woman so undeducated she didn"t know his date of birth, got a better mathematical training that Sophie Germain, daughter of well-off civil servants who thought mathématics wasn't for girls.

Lrn2 history fag.

>>12144982
I read about human behavior and evolutionary psychology

>>12146005
I think you're overstating Austen and Klein influence particularly outside of the Anglo world, but otherwise fair point.

>>12146058
Nice try dodging Sappho and Hildegard (ie the two most legit examples of the post you quoted).

But one thing you guys haven't considered is you don't know any female geniuses simply because you're ignorant. OP's question, bait as it is, is very telling in this respect: OP apparently hasn't heard of female philosphers, from the female companions of the Father of the Desert to Hildegard and Therese of Avila to Beauvoir and Simone Weil, not to mention lesser known but just as refined figures such as Rachel Bespaloff, Marcelle Sauvageot or Cristina Campo.

tl;dr: you're still way too young to be talking about the history of thought, do your homework and read more

>>12148682
i don't usually get embarrassed for someone over the internet but wow

>>12148655
Yeah Socrates was a leprechaun, you human mulligan.

>>12148702
No one said female philosophers, they said female geniuses of the first rank, on par with Shakespeare and Plato. None has ever existed. Some other retard tried to move the goalposts by writing walls of text about how Jane Austen invented nigger peanut butter and was rightly ignored for doing so.

>>12145829
Triggered?

>>12148682
>raising 5 children is so hawwwd waaaaaah
You've spent HOW LONG lowering the socially acceptable number of kids for a woman to raise, again?
And you still can't do anything during those years you spend in the workforce getting fast-tracked for promotions for being a queer female plantkin who's just so stunning and brave uwu, failing to have kids.
And you can't do anything after you hit any of the walls at the 25-30 or 31-40 or 40-80 mark
God, you're a disgrace. Feminism was a lie from the start meant to dupe the weakest minds of western civilization and turn them away from the one important societal role they can be trusted with.

>>12146058
>exception to the rule

Retarded saying and retarded argument. And how are creative geniuses not "exceptions to the rule" (to the extent that such a thing can make sense) ? I never had any expectations for the average reasoning capabilities of people on this board yet you guys still manage to disappoint. It's an amazement in itself.

>exception to the rule

Female geniuses aside, raising children is actually quite important to human history. Disregarding the basics like that doesn't make for a good argument anon. Apply yourself ffs.

> In the 19th century in America, middle-class girls and women played piano far more than men. Yet all that piano playing failed to result in any creative output.

At last an argument. Now consider the facts more carefully: what does "playing piano more'" means ? Playing more piano hours a day on average ? Playing more piano is not making you more of a composer, you have to learn and compose for that. Even for high level performing you need to accept the idea and effort of making piano performance you only job. In a society and class where women having jobs is considered an oddity female professional player would simply sound outrageous. Remember women worked at the time, but mostly among the lower classes and those weren't jobs likely to lead to any kind of musical endeavor.

And if the idea of a female composer r piano performer is not part of the general culture you can bet most middle-class women will stick to piano as simply a hobby.

On a statistical note, you should know that when talking about significant creative output outliers matters as much as average if not more. So a statement like "women played piano more than men [in average] "isn't going to be enough to describe the situation.

The funny thing is you actually have the retort to your own argument in your post

>All those female pianists entertained their families and their dinner guests but did not seem motivated to create anything new.

Just ask youtself why the assertion above is true, and if it truly has nothing to do with women not being encouraged to pursue higher creative pursuit (and not merely house entertainment).

>Meanwhile, at about the same time, black men in America created blues and then jazz

They did it as a means of survival and self-expression, both of which were a necessity of their situation. And remember those jazzmen were only recognized after decades of being ripped off by more popular white musicians. Few musical commentators at the time would have acknowleged the value of black jazz. So none of that applied to middle class white women. And meanwhile the wives of those poor talented jazzmen were mostly busy with the children.

>It's men's fault

Not exclusively, it is everybody's (or nobody's depending on how you look at it) fault in that it is a consequence of the division of labor at the time.

>>12146118
Those labels are ultimately so insignificant you can make them go both way within the course of the same argument without explicitly breaking logical form.

Idealist has a precise sens in philosophy which is almost the opposite of what it means most of the time in common speech.

>>12146146
Are you implying all french qt look like Sartre ?

>>12146218
Tell me about the obscure ones. Villon ? Laforgue ? Valéry ? Reverdy ?

>>12147359
>shitting on women for not being /lit/
>stating /lit/ women are undesirable

Sometimes I wonder if /lit/ is not just a clever use to make all its user into woman-hating homosexuals.

>>12146344
There’s literally nothing wrong with the sentence, you fucking dipshit.

>>12148725
>You've spent HOW LONG lowering the socially acceptable number of kids for a woman to raise, again?

I haven't spent anytime lowering anything except my dick into your mom's mouth anon (forgive that easy joke, I have a soft spoke for the classics). I don't know where your assumptions come from but they're idiotic.

>And you still can't do anything during those years you spend in the workforce getting fast-tracked for promotions for being a queer female plantkin who's just so stunning and brave uwu, failing to have kids.

It seems you didn't understand my argument at all. I wasn't talking about women now. The "raising five children" argument was obviously meant to be applied to earlier times when it was a common occurrence.

Perhaps you actually deserve that "fucked your mom" joke after all.

>And you can't do anything after you hit any of the walls at the 25-30 or 31-40 or 40-80 mark

I'm not a woman. Is it inconceivable for you that one can argue on behalf of women without being a woman ? You can do it even when you're a misogynist anon, look up rhetorics, it's an actual thing.

>God, you're a disgrace.

The irony of anyone in this shithole earnestly typing that sentence is staggering.

>Feminism was a lie from the start meant to dupe the weakest minds of western civilization and turn them away from the one important societal role they can be trusted with.

Judging by the quality of your argumentation you should have been the first weak mind to be corrupted by such an ideology, so I'll have to conclude that feminism doesn't appeal to all idiots, sorry.

Last time I saw her before coming to the office my wife was reading math and physics textbooks for University.

>>12148750
>JANE AUSTEN BACK FROM THE GRAVE, WRITING 7000-PAGE NOVEL ABOUT HOW SHE'S RIGHT IN AN INTERNET ARGUMENT

Ms. Austen, your autograph please! You're at least a third, maybe a second-rate genius!

>>12148641
what's your fuckin problem? are people not allowed to dislike people who are more physically attractive than them? are you attracted to all staceys who have a higher rating than you? is this the standard of the modern nu-male? jesus fucking christ, you judgmental little bitch

why do mods allow this place to become /pol/
honestly how hard is it to police all /pol/shitting

>>12146005

How do you think Sappho comes?

>>12146005
>>12149072
please respond

>>12144982
self-help isn't fiction

>>12144982
Because non-fiction is for people who are the personification of a glass of water

>>12144982
real life sucks

>>12144982
The same reason men play video games and watch marvel moobies, escapism.

Anyone else not actually hate women but just find shitposting about them fun?

>>12144982
My mother reads holocaust records constantly because she's dating some Jewish guy.

>>12148787
Feminism was a mistake
Women are inferior to men
You are a disgrace to women everywhere
Change my view.

>>12149753
men play video games for exploration and/or mastery you dumb woman.

>>12145034
This, stop applying male traits to females, that shit is gay.

>>12146218
Sounds exactly like my ex girlfriend.

If her name starts with S kms

>>12144982
what a sweeping generalization
Am I then more feminine for only reading fiction? Is a woman a dyke for reading nonfiction?

>>12145025
A lot of women read biographies and history.

>>12152332
Biographies of actors and stars.
History of female emancipation

Male here. Anything which I have not personally experienced has a certain degree of likelihood of being fiction, regardless of how "realistic" it might seem.
I consider philosophy to be comparable to poetry and fiction in terms of the creativity and artfulness needed to make something unique that is not immediately derivative of something else.
The only "pure" forms of non-fiction writing would be history books made entirely up of quotes or paraphrases/unimaginative summaries of historical documents, or works from the natural sciences.

>>12146033
Never stopped other people. Didn't stop slaves, prisoners, the persecuted.

>>12144982

>>12144982
Because women are more literate than men these days.

>>12144982
I only read fiction and I'm a guy. Philosophy laid out in boring ass clinically sterile words, is boring as fuck.
Even so I am pretty certain that a ton of women read philosophy also. Your thread is shit and you're an incel faggot pol x poster

>>12153659
>reee get out /pol/

/lit/ has been my home board since 2014, friend

>>12152154
Yes.

>>12144990
op B T F O

>>12146005
A fifth or sixth tier writer is better than the best women. Someone like Thomas Hardy or even Arthur Conan Doyle represents a standard women can't reach, despite being above average at best when compared to male authors.

>>12145849
>>12145849
>implying there were no matriarchies in ancient greece
start with the greeks nigger

>>12154810
Well that's the end of argument with you. Everything else will be ignoring your retorts.

>>12144982
*ahem*

>>12145044
Google.com male/female reading habbits

>>12145044
women only read romance novels.

>>12145812
IQ distribution, women are far less likely to be a genius (not that a man is likely but hopefully you get my point)

>>12154995
>but hopefully you get my point)

>tfw you feel your own despair mirrored in this statement
>tfw trying to explain something as simple as "It's rare for men to be x; but it's especially rare for women to be x. Look at this graph" to a normie
>tfw they always go UHHHHHHHHHH IT'S RARE FOR BOTH????
>tfw you try to go "Y-yes, but see, it's MORE rare... There are differences in the rarity, even if it is rare for both.."

Women tend to have fanciful and childlike hearts, and I mean that in a nice way. So they can appreciate a bit of imagination. Only my mom ever cared to put out holiday decorations as a kid if it was just me and my dad and brothers the house would have looked like a barracks. Women enjoy the pleasanter side of life and don't have shame in it. Men feel a need to be hard and hard-headed (and hard-dicked) and so tend to favor more objective real-world nonfiction. But sign me up for either, especially narrative nonfiction.

Here's the kicker, most great fiction is written by men! Also this has been a recent thing, in the past both sexes enjoyed literature in equal measure and novels were the go-to form of in-the-home entertainment. People read a fuck ton until the radio and tv became the bit thing.

>>12146094
lol mylene or something right

>>12155039
> People read a fuck ton
And we have Napoleon to thank for that. Universal literacy anyone?

>>12149736
Actually, it is.

>>12144990
Nerd.

>>12145839
>My gf is a hegelian

>>12145944
>most women are X
>SO YOU'RE SAYING ALL WOMEN ARE X?

>>12155039
>Women tend to have fanciful and childlike hearts

Have you ever encountered women that aren't your mother outside of fiction?

>>12147356
>referring to

>>12144982
>why <false statement>

>>12155086
Jeanne

>>12148812
ad hominem bc you have lost

>>12145583
You know the rules, bitch.

>>12145812
>forgetting about Hipparchia

>>12153659
yeah i love reading history