/lit/ - Literature

cringe and sage

>>11711828
check out leftypol, they have a lot of charts for marxist theory

The left really can't meme, everything I see is just an awkward copy of something the right-wing adopted first. Is there some psychodynamic explanation for this?

>>11711876
We meme about history, you meme about not getting laid. In my opinion we both meme pretty badly, since all political memes are reductivist and idiotizing. The difference though is that we have brilliant theorists who analyze history intensely while you have to rely on conspiracy theories made up against your already far right government. Also we are not incels.

>>11711828
For leftwing theory I recommend Kulinski, Dore, and Uygur. There is no intelligent right wing theory.

>>11711876
I'm working on it, will explain the dismal quantity:quality SNR of their boilerplate homilies too.

>>11711913
No, you just copy.
I've been seeing lots of those "fashwave" memes, with the same retro visuals, distortion effects, and often asian characters. All you did was slap Marx on top of it - the same Marx who came up with "labor theory of value", which says that an intricately woven sock is worth more than a gold nugget fished out of a river.

This is about the level of creativity and "brilliant insight" that's to be expected of the left.

>>11711972
>implying fashwave is not just a lazy copy of vaporwave

do you sniff glue at any chance, anon

>>11711876
The left have an awareness of the ironic banality of meme culture, which rather limits it as an artform.

Right wing memes aren't stacked in layers of irony. The proof of this is Trump's political career. Two years on and it's the same jokes, the same memes, the same arguments. It's making me realise that the sentiment behind the humour is entirely genuine, and that's so much worse than it being a joke.

>>11711876
The right aggressively tries to spread their memes as much as possible, normalising their ideas and talking points. The left (or at least the theory part of it) tends to stick to closed insular communities. Just because you don't see 14-year olds on youtube repeating leftist memes to death doesn't mean they don't exist. There is something to be said about the left not embracing memes as ideology vectors, though.

>>11711828
Check this one, OP

>>11711972
>the same Marx who came up with "labor theory of value", which says that an intricately woven sock is worth more than a gold nugget fished out of a river.
>This is about the level of creativity and "brilliant insight" that's to be expected of the left.
In labour value terms, gold mining is essentially a lottery.
It's still a dumb point. You'd be better off comparing a shitload of cotton to a gold nugget, or the sock with a wedding ring, because you're comparing an unprocessed piece of raw material to a finished product.

Either way, you can buy gold in the supermarket and designer socks can be worth hundreds. So what's your point?

>>11711989
Quit the opposite, right-wing humor (especially far-right) is stacked upon layers of irony, not in the intention of subverting narratives but mostly to hide their ideology, no one would unironically support them otherwise.
Which is why you get a lot of reponses like "it's just a meme bro" coming from them when you confront them in rallies and such since there is no more irony to fall back to, they might talk about free speech but fascism is antithetical to such concepts, the current internet far-right (/pol/ type) could be used as collective for a study on cognitive dissonance

>>11711989
See, you're already babbling about some opaque theoretical construct about low art you just made up then to patina over a simple observation obvious to anyone. Do you remember your mirror stage?

>>11711828
Start with Hobbes and the liberals, for both

>>11712036
I don't get what part of my post you disagree with. You consider memes to be high art? Or you disagree regarding Trump?

>>11712027
That's not irony, it's just cowardice.

>>11711972
Some shiny piece of metal should be worth a lot. You're right.

>>11712054
Please don't try recenter this as a casual chat when you are my analysand, it's complicated enough with the indivisible transference/countertransference.

This thread has ligma.
https://youtu.be/dnxwnBKxgNg

>>11712112
Mate, this is the modern version of Parisian Cafe culture. We're not sitting an academic seminar.

>>11712130
What's ligma?

>>11711972
>Only having literal memes going for you.

>>11712158
Ésta

>>11711985
Musically, it's a lazy copy of synthwave. Visually, it does owe inspiration to vaporwave, but it's developed into something fairly unique. Most uniquely in all of popular visual art, it actually means something and coherently communicates it's intent.
https://youtu.be/eaHnzE90FC4
>>11712158
Somebody will tell you when you're older.
>>11712207
"As sparse as our present-day knowledge of Memer is, these roles seem to suggest that the Vikings thought of him as the being who helped the gods retain the wisdom of ancestral tradition, which served as an invaluable guide for their actions."
https://norse-mythology.org/gods-and-creatures/others/mimir/

>>11712207
One may likened you to the STEMfag who, after discovering he can only manage to draw pitiful stick figurines, turns around to declare all art "stupid and gay anyway".

>>11711876
Political memes are inherently terrible, you just pick the turd that you side with the most,and praise it as the "winner". As they say, politics is a team sport

>>11712237
For sure, putting shitty VHS filters over a schizophrenic collage of norse mythology deviantart comissions, nazi lolis and renaissance paintings is the apex of conteporary culture.

Let's not forget about "jbp-wave" either.

>>11711828
>race doesn’t exist but white people are evil
>gender doesn’t exist but men are evil
>everyone but me should give away all their money to the poor
there, I spared you a bunch of gay books written by jews

>>11711876
>desperately trying to claim ownership of joke images on le 4chinz
hang yourself underage redditor

>>11711828

Why are left wing memes so shit lol

>overusing the "incel" buzzword
>butt-blasted about the right wing
What autisitic fuck make two threads within half an hour?
Here's the other one:
>>11711589

>>11711876
im not old but im old enough now that ive seen 4chan evolve (i mean that in the loosest possible terms) for about a decade now.

the right wing internet memes aren't actually right wing. they don't have anything coherently right wing about them. they are anarchist sentiments wearing a spooky right wing bedsheet to scare left wingers who have become far too conservative in their idoltry of dead men, old ideologies and methods, and regulation even of manners and basic etiquette between individuals.

for example, when the left "memes" they do so because of some weird mystical belief in the power of image macros to brainwash human beings. And so, they take an image of marx, or maybe of a homeless person or something, put a marx quote underneath, and run it through a played out vaporwave filter. naively and earnestly thinking that THIS is how we fight the fascists!

when the "right" memes, there is no underlying ideology for the most part. there is no naive faith in ideology. there is only ridicule and critique of the dominant culture and ideology, usually through the most subversive and villified language of the dominant ideology.

for example, i dont usually see a meme with some milton friedman quote. or adam smith. or anything relating to property or capital accumulation. or even "freedom". the memes usually consist of violence, racism, or anti semitism. not for the sake of these things but for the sake of provoking the dominant ideology and nothing more.

when donald trump ran for president, it was obvious that 4chan would be behind him, not because of his "policies" or anything he said or did. none of that mattered. it was because he was so unusual and the prospect of him becoming president was so hilarious that there was no choice. there is no ideology. only ridicule and the desire to tear it down. a true anarchist sentiment, not any ideological anarchism. this is what 4chan and the internet right wing has been for pretty much ever. from the habbo hotel raids and project chanology, to even its involvement with the occupy wall street movement (alot of the people here by now won't realize that at the time 4chan on the whole was genuinely pro occupy unlike the mainstream media.)
the fact that the "right wing" dont even see this is perfect and pure. if you ask most of them a genuine right wing position they hold that isnt edgy violence racism or antisemitism, they probably wont even be able to tell you. and why should they? none of that matters. and its better that way it makes this a true anarchist sentiment and action, devoid of any ideological trappings of the kind bookchin followers adhere to. a sort of internet, postmodernist cultural anarchism. theres little surprise why the left hates it. the left and communists have always been statist control freaks and have always been enemies to anarchism.

>>11712306

>>11712326
says the frogposter

>>11712343

>>11712237

>>11712351
>R. Luxemburg
Jewish
>E. Goldman
Jewish
>F. Engels
Best friends with Marx (a Jew)
>C. Zetkin
Had two children with a Jewish lover (Ossip Zetkin)
>M. Ackelsberg
Jewish

>>11712272
>>11712398
Meanwhile on the left...

>>11712434
>milquetoast liberal feminism = "the left"
please never stop posting

>>11711913
>In my opinion we both meme pretty badly, since all political memes are reductivist and idiotizing.
>What is humour
Thanks for proving the other guy's point faggot.

It's because the left doesn't have a sense of humor about itself anymore. This is the comes from the same trait that makes them unwilling to listen to any critiques, which is arrogance. Look at how the respond to people who disagree with them, they try to get them fired, drag their name through the mud, force them out of public life, they'll even try to tear down free speech or throw riots instead of letting someone else talk.The left's beliefs are sacred and can only be questioned by some more to the "left", which really just means someone more inane. That means they don't hear from the right, so they don't understand the right, and thus can't properly make fun of the right. Instead they produce applause comedy like you see on late night shows, which only appeals to paranoids who think there really are Russian-Nazi-Jordan-Peterson fans under their bed. "The left can't meme" is a meme made to tick off lefties, and look at this thread it produced: a bunch of twisted panties and 888 snark to justify their own humorlessness. Part of the fun of the meme is it tricks lefties into writing in their favorite genre- intellectualized, mawkish, autobiographies. And they take the bait everytime.

Memes are dumb little jokes like the left says. So what's their excuse? It's not like good jokes are hard to make. They're like the kid who pretends he doesn't care about losing class president because "it's just a popularity contest". It sure is. So what does that make you?

>>11712451
Liberal feminism certainly didn't come from the right, nor did liberal capitalism for that matter.

>>11712519
Ummm, yes it did as it's objectively a right wing ideology.

>>11712519
>capitalism
>not right-wing

>>11712559
>>11712560
the absolute state of /lit/

>>11711972
>Marx came up with the "labor theory of value"

Smith and Ricardo would like a word with you.

>>11712514
>>11712339
Good posts

>>11712514
>It's because the right doesn't have a sense of humor about itself anymore. This is the comes from the same trait that makes them unwilling to listen to any critiques, which is arrogance. Look at how the respond to people who disagree with them, they try to get them discredited, drag their name through the mud, force them out of public life, they'll even try to tear down civil protections or drive cars into crowds instead of letting someone else talk.The right's beliefs are sacred and can only be questioned by some more to the "right", which really just means someone more inane. That means they don't hear from the left, so they don't understand the left, and thus can't properly make fun of the left. Instead they produce applause comedy like you see on late night shows, which only appeals to paranoids who think there really are Jewish-Black-Slavoj-Zizek fans under their bed. "The right can't meme" is a meme made to tick off righties, and look at this thread it produced: a bunch of twisted panties and 420 snark to justify their own humorlessness. Part of the fun of the meme is it tricks righties into writing in their favorite genre- intellectualized, mawkish, autobiographies. And they take the bait everytime.

>Memes are dumb little jokes like the right says. So what's their excuse? It's not like good jokes are hard to make. They're like the kid who pretends he doesn't care about losing class president because "it's just a popularity contest". It sure is. So what does that make you?

>>11712339
>not for the sake of these things but for the sake of provoking the dominant ideology and nothing more.
absolutely in denial

>>11712339
Underrated post.
So-called "right" memes are nothing but a critique of ideology, culture and structure (often while pretending to be part of an opposite structure), while left memes are blatant attempts at propaganda.

>>11712584
>literally just copy a good, insightful post, but replace "left" with "right"

>>11712599
Prove that post wrong.

>>11712596
nobody is stupid enough to actually think this

>>11712599
It proves that the other post was a stupid generalization that will make rightwingers go "yeah" and if you switch the terms it works just as well with the opposite ideology. It shows how hollow and stupid that post was.

>>11712609
Imagine being so newfag that you don't remember pre-2009 4chan memes being directed against the right wing only because they were the reigning mainstream structure.

>>11712629
>rationalizing copying again
god it's uncanny. leftist memes come across about as spontaneous and authentic as mass produced Che shirts. even if you've decided memes are astroturf, you used to be culture jamming adbusters. what happened?

For all the talk about the left being unable to meme, I think there are some that are pretty good. Fake turning point USA posters can be pretty funny, and there are always tongue and cheek critiques of ideology or statements like this one.

>>11712657
Anon, this appears to be a crudely reconstituted right wing meme.

>>11712339
didn’t read lol

>>11712345
>being mad at the frog
S E T H I N G
no wonder the left cant meme :^)

>>11712596
Yeah bro, look at this harmless critique of ideology! It's so subversive, it makes me wanna join fascism!

>>11712351
>Beauvoir
[From Man & People by Ortega y Gasset]

>>11712673
Fashwave is a shit larper reddit meme and you know it.

>>11712678
Doesn't matter if it is, it's still explicit propaganda.

>>11712677

>>11712668
How so? It's clearly a piece that takes the classical imagery of ouroboros with the gadsden flag to symbolize the untenable nature of a system which necessarily undermines itself because of its lack of completeness. Any such ideology or system that seeks only to preserve itself exists as a material or temporal positive feedback loop, and like how capitalism exists in a similar vein, ultimately brings about its own limitation.

The universe doesn't play with infinites, so positive feedback loops can necessarily never exist forever, and I think that meme does a really good job of conveying that feeling. Its crude architecture just adds to the fact that it's poking fun at people who genuinely believe an ideology like that is workable, and edges on the absurd, which I like.

imagine being so assblasted that a leftist made a joak that you write multiple autistic rants in a desperate attempt to analyze a fucking meme

>>11711972
you fail to understand the basic principles of the LTV

>>11712685
Of course, and it's just as cringe as the average leftypol meme.
The problem is that people keep conflating "right" memes which are founded mainly on sarcasm and irony (like pepe, no step on snek, etc) with legit unfunny attempts to adapt right-wing propaganda to a younger audience (fashwave, everything created by t_d, etc).

>>11712018
that value is subjective, just like in your own example

(by logic consequence, the labour-value theory is invalid)

>>11712718
And that's always been the problem with 4chan. It's always been impossible to discern who is being facetious and who is being sincere.

Act like fools long enough something something Voltaire something something

>>11712673
subversive critiques of ideology are by definition not harmless you fucking coward

>>11712673
>an artwork of XIX century Europe
>a visual effect reminiscent of the 80's early PC era
>a font that wouldn't look out of place at a 2018 edgy EDM festival

This meme is disjointed as fuck

>>11712718
hang yourself autist, you have an unhealthy obsession with le meemz

>>11712055
>gold is just a shiny metal
I'm guessing you didn't major in chemistry or electrical engineering? When I read ignorant shit like this, it just reinforces the belief of how retarded non-STEMfags are.

>>11712730
youre not thinking anywhere near a large scale enough. you're lost in the sauce. you're missing the forest for the trees. you're ankle deep in the trashcan. it doesnt matter who is being facetious and who is being sincere. you're still holding onto the diea that image macros dictate people's minds and are not in fact just an expression of the latter. look at what is being said as well as not being said even in these sub par "fashwave" image macros (vaporwave originally was popularized by the meme makers on 4chan btw though it didnt have any of the ideological connotations we think of today)

Why are rightards so obsessed with le funny images?

>>11712718
Very accurate. Worth adding that the left is in a similar situation, just on facebook instead of 4chan.

Here's some left meems I personaly enjoy

>>11712745
It's not an obsession.
Visiting this shithole in a daily basis for more than ten years makes you realize some things about the overall meme tendencies of the community.

>>11712762
>>11712745
>left can't meme
>yes we can
>no, you can't and here's why
>REEE WHY DO YOU CARE ABOUT MEMES SO MUCH YOU INCEL

>>11712747
>le stem master race
both gold and diamonds have moderately useful material properties but also disproportionally and artificially inflated market value

I write this knowing there's a low chance it'll even get a response, but I think it's interesting at any rate, so I'll have a go.

When you talk about memes, you're generally talking about some kind of idea or concept that has evolved in the age of the internet based beyond an idea's usefulness. Before instant communication, ideas (memes) evolved based largely on its ability to be used to further human goals, where ideas with a higher fitness also loosely (and I mean very loosely) correlated with higher biological fitness for people.

This is because the act of sharing an idea was inherently costly. To send a letter, or even to make a phone call, or before vehicles even sending a letter over long distances, ideas often had a real labor cost associated with spreading them, and so natural selection would have it that ideas that contributed to producing more of this value would be highly selected for over ideas that worked against this or were neutral.

In the age of instant communication, however, it doesn't cost anything to hit "share" or "like", basically. And as such, ideas are selected for not because they have a use-value, but because they are "share-able" to the human mind. This often means that things that make people angry, things that make people afraid, and things that make people feel good about themselves are disproportionately favored over ideas that are difficult to work through. "memes" as we know them today are the result of what can be approximated into a process of evolution wherein an image is created through thousands of people working to create thousands of variations of something that finds itself easy to share, and then progressively over time evolving to become even more-shareable based on this process of mutation and selection

The biggest meme problem of modernity is that the process by which something becomes more-shareable can actually be studied, gutted, and applied to whatever ideology you want to make it more fit, which is troublesome.

>>11712796
>NOOO THIS CANT BE HAPPENING LEFTIES ARENT ALLOWED TO MAKE LE FUNNY JOAK IMAGES UR NOT FUNNY DIS IS WHY *autistic rant continues*

>>11712804
>diamond
>moderately useful
how to spot a retard

>>11712584
>>11712602
>>11712629

Except the right doesn't try to get people fired or publicly attacked for minor grievances, unlike the left who will foam at the mouth when they sense a chance for mob justice. For example James Damore, Brendan Eich, Roseanne Barr, the Christian baker, and many many more. It isn't righty organiziations censoring political content like how lefty tech megacorps are.

There are no right wing late night talk shows. Conan, Noah, Fallon, Colbert, Oliver, and Kimmel are all generic lefties producing equally generic vituperations such as "Drumpf". Certainly there aren't any talking heads at all fearmongering about Zizek the same way you can always find red scare 2.0 calumnies about Russian bot interference hacking ARE democracy.

>tear down civil protections
This is hysterical nonsense that I would expect to see on a cool wine aunt's facebook page. Civil protections such as being able to go outside and not be run over by drunken squatamalans? Please.

>drive cars into crowds
When you pit right wing violence against left wing violence it's no comparison. The fact that the only notable case you had is a schizophrenic former bernie supporter is telling. Meanwhile ancoms and antifas have been going around beating random people, such as the bitcoin girl, for years. Or Eric Clanton assaulting at least 7 people with a deadly weapon. Or antifa attacking people on their own side such as Paul Welch. Or antifa attacking journalists (who are also on their side), and police officers.

>>11712758
>you're still holding onto the diea that image macros dictate people's minds and are not in fact just an expression of the latter
And you're being too ideological in the thought that they don't. This honestly feels like head-in-the-sand style thinking. "It's not real propaganda guys, since they were ALREADY thinking it!!"

>>11712718
>(like pepe, no step on snek, etc
Are these supposed to be positive examples?

>>11712827
>When you pit right wing violence against left wing violence it's no comparison
The majority of convicted domestic terrorists in the United States have been right-wing radicals.

>>11712820
Memes are not just "le funny images".
For example, the concept of feminists being fat and ugly is a right-wing meme. So are (((parentheses))), or simple terms like "SJW" or "cuck". We also have positive memes, like self-improvement, family values and respecting your heritage.
Our memes are highly potent - It's obvious if you just look how much more right-wing the youth has become in merely 3 years or so.
Meanwhile, your arsenal is limited to the same 60-year old tactic of autistically screeching "racist" and "sexist" at any opposing thought.

But I wouldn't expect you to understand. You're a leftie afterall.

>>11712514
Do you reckon the Left will ever become funny again? like the New left in the sixties, shitting on Drug laws and over-restrictive sexuality? Or when the progressives were opposing the dumb war in Iraq? (ironically, only to be beating the war drums themselves when Obama came along, in Libya and Syria)
I think two things are to blame for the lefts lacking ability to Meme, the first being that the values they expose are ‘’mainstream’’, I.E they aren’t transgressive or offensive. Le Drumpf xd! Resist! Academe, Hollywood, Media and finance are campaigning against right-leaning ideas and personalities. Maybe when this progressive/neo-liberal paradigm is over, and the Trump-populists are the status qou, the left’s attempts at humor will improve. Now this only covers the mainstream and ‘’acceptable’’ lefts failure to meme. Why do Commies, ancoms, and other hard-leftist of that type fail to do anything noticeable, besides copying /pol/s memes and giving them the leftist stamp? (Obvious example, merchant=porky), I think the main reason is that they are so far up in their own ass. So deep in Maoist post-colonial feminist intersectional ad infinitum theory that they cannot even self-satirize or be ironic about it, its their holy cow. The obvious result being dry, boorish that only the biggest beta nerd would chuckle at.

>>11712837
I think it's a little bit of both, but also neither.

Something can be essentially randomly created and still gain a 'life of its own' by the fact that it encourages its own reproduction by being easy to share, and easy to mutate. Image macros have that dastardly trait of easy mutation, which allows them to easily have thousands and thousands of renditions, where the ones that just so happen to be the best at being shared are selected for in places where people share these things.

But then, someone can take that process, and they can see which ones are most popular at a given time, and ask the question of how, from a meme's beginning to its most popular rendition it became more popular. Was it based on environment and the websites where it grew? Is there some design element of where text is aligned that gets a viewer to think more highly of it? Does it inspire another emotion than its prior form did, and how does it achieve this? People can study the evolution of these memes and then be able to craft ones that use the mechanisms that were otherwise essentially randomly evolved, and then engineer images, concepts, etc. that will start out with a moderate level of success but then be easily modified so that it spreads itself.

It's really hard to explain all of it, since it relies on a prior understanding of evolution to make sense of. Kind of like how machine learning algorithms work, or how biological systems evolve based on random changes in a replicating code in individual instances within a population, and how the 'population' evolves based on the shifts in frequency of variant-types.

>>11712876
>We also have positive memes, like self-improvement, family values and respecting your heritage.
>Our memes are highly potent

>>11712876
didn’t read lol

>>11712887
You can laugh, but just look at the 2016-2018 election results in the US, Britain, Poland, Italy, Austria...

>>11712876
>the concept of feminists being fat and ugly is a right-wing meme
That “meme” has existed since the sufferage movement, you atrociously underaged retard.
>So are (((parentheses))), or simple terms like "SJW" or "cuck"
Is this supposed to be good?
>We also have positive memes, like self-improvement, family values and respecting your heritage
Those aren’t memes, those are just things you say you like on /pol/.

>>11712841
No, they are examples of memes often considered "right-wing" whose core memetic qualities aren't derived from such movement.
Pepe has more depth than being a dumb le ebin nazi frog. The snake flag has liberal patriot connotations, but its memetic potential relies more on the fact that it's a fucking talking snake being used as a personification of a sociopolitical ideology and the comedic variations of that concept.
On the other hand, shit like fashwave is always based on propaganda. Even "comedic" rebuttals from leftist communities are about the mocking of such propaganda style.

>>11712876
>the concept of feminists being fat and ugly is a right-wing meme

it really isn't

>>11712903
>Britain
You mean the one where the conservatives lost their majority, UKIP and the BNP were utterly dead and Labour made massive gains despite their leader being slightly to the right of Pol Pot?

Is this the power of le epic memes?

>>11712907
>A meme is an idea, behavior, or style that spreads from person to person within a culture—often with the aim of conveying a particular phenomenon, theme, or meaning represented by the meme.
>an idea, behavior, or style
So yes, "things we say we like" are memes.

>the meme of fat feminist has existed for a hundred years
So what?

>>11712916
The Brexit referendum was largely the traditional media VS internet memers.

>>11712867
You mean that guy from 2001? Yeah. He as a lot to do with the current political situation. What if we go back further and I include communist mass killings? Right now left wing violence is far more prevalent than right wing. Having to go back decades for your cut off point only proves how dishonest you are.

>>11712922
Anon, I'm the one autistically shouting into the void about memes as a necessarily amoral phenomenon whose selective pressures have only to do with their ability to be repeated, and not necessarily about any intrinsic value.

To say "X is a meme" is meaningless, since every concept imaginable that is created by humans is a meme. When people like that anon are talking about 'memes', they talk about modern phenomena wherein ideas spread based on their ability to be shared quickly and explosively, and while there's little fundamental difference between that and any other idea, there's a pretty clear understanding of the distinction on a colloquial level. Please do not ever try to engage in such a fallacious purposeful misuse of concept again. I don't think you meant bad, but it's just obvious at that point that you guys are talking about two different things, and a productive argument can never follow from that kind of setup.

honestly i think the difference is that right wing people tend to genuinely believe in transcendent aesthetics whereas left wingers tend to believe that aesthetics can be reduced to politics

hence left wing art is often banal uninspired garbage

>>11712879
>>11712837

there is no inherent deign element or beauty to any of the popular image macros. they spread because the people spreading them relate to it.

over in /gd/ we regularly get people asking how to nget a vhs effect or how to make fashwave stuff and they regularly get shitted on because fashwave looks like shit as does vaporwave. there is no objective interesting aesthetic sensibility there. its just that people relate to the message that is being said. it doesn't matter what it looks like. trying control people via image macros betrays an ignorance of how the internet works and how it interacts with culture. its essentially a democratized megaphone. not a tool of control. if it was like that, then hillary clinton and corporate powers would have much more narrative control than they do via their paid propagandists and astro turfers. but it doesnt work that way.

instead of reactionarily fighting this rising tide of culture disruption via the internet, anyone who claims to be any kind of radical of any kind should embrace and welcome them. instead, the left due to its latent hyperconservatism plays the game of the easily spooked mainstream for them.

>>11712938
I am literally a communist and I voted to leave the EU, you dumbass.

The Brexit referendum was largely a result of the EU being fucking shite, contrary to Guardian whinging about le evil Russian internet Nazis being behind it. Even if you look at the age statistics for votes placed it was carried by older people with younger people (i.e people who would actually be exposed to memes in a significant way) overwhelmingly voting to stay.

>>11712977
lmao

>>11712943

>>11712977
right wing memes are like 3 different forms of unoriginal nostalgia. there's more transcendence to be found in a literal garbage dump

>>11713001

>>11713007
in what way is this meme an example of unoriginal nostalgia?

>>11711876
right wingers, as in fascists, have a higher iq and and skew cognitively masculine and creative (cs, bio, eng, maths) while leftists tend to be midwit cog effeminate social science majors who are also homosexuals. Thus, the culcha emanates from the gifted and brave, there is no risk to leftists at all so they don’t have any pressure to become powerful. Its just a temporal advantage. If this were the 1910’s we’d see the Left domming reactionaries in the culcha wars too

>>11713017

>>11713020
first of all there isnt even anythin artistic or aesthetic about that. its just crude propagada.

second of all that meme predates the anti communist message. its been used for anti libertarianism, anti americanism, anti environmentalism, anti semitism, etc.

>>11713035
Stop spreading bullshit.
STEM is mainly apolitical because people with high IQ don't fall into the dumb anglocentric right-left dichotomy.

>>11713041
>first of all there isnt even anythin artistic or aesthetic about that
all youre doing here is making it clear how laughably underdeveloped your aesthetic thought is

>t-t-there's nothing aesthetic or artistic about this piece of visual art

>second of all that meme predates the anti communist message. its been used for anti libertarianism, anti americanism, anti environmentalism, anti semitism, etc.
it was largely other vaguely right wing groups mocking ancaps initially, i think trying to pretend that the meme, if we are going to view it as a political construct, is more right wing than it is left wing in origins and current usage

>>11713082
mangled that last sentence but what im saying is if youre going to view the meme as a political construct it is clearly a construct that the right has more of a claim to

>>11712867
mcveigh was a true nomadic war machine
there is literally nothing right-wing about killing fascistic feds

>>11712339
The essential chart for a critique of the Left:
https://www.marxists.org/archive/camatte/capcom/on-org.htm

(yeah, he's on a marxist for some reason, but they all hate him)
I'd also be interested in knowing how many people here are aware of Aufhebengate.

>>11713082
no, not all thoughts are equal.
you're going to have to explain what makes that aesthetic or a work of art.

i'll tell you why its just crude propaganda. it doesn't transcend. it doesn't say anything other than "hurr socialistssts are retarded" and even then it doesnt even say it in any interesting manner. its literally just one common talking point of right wingers about socialism overlayed on top of a meme representing the soviet union. there's nothing about it that explains why socialism as a thought constantly fails, or makes any greater references to say another art movement or parodies or makes a comment on the world today and connects to the past or anything like that. it doesnt make the viewer question anything. there was no thought put into the layout, font choices, color, or any part of the composition. no thought put into nhow the viewer would interact with this other than they would see it on the internet. there was no deeper thought put into this than some edgy kid in his bedroom mocking what he thinks socialists are from based on his public school education and arguments in youtube comments. its trash. i could draw that exact meme say by hand, and have the words cut out of say different threads from here on 4chan(perserving the context) and it would have more artistic sensibility and value that this shit, and i just thought of that in 10 seconds.

>>11712351
Look at all those Jews lol

>>11713036

>>11713149
how do people like you even make it here? how the fuck are you on 4chan.org/lit/ espousing 300 year old aesthetic theories (probably without even being aware that you are doing it) as if they still hold any major degree of relevance??

it doesn't say anything other than socialists are retarded? there is no other idea you can draw from that image? the sunglasses, posture, composition, overlaying, repetition, white space, familiarity of the font, familiarity of the template, divergences from the common usage of said template hold no meaning for you?? its just a communist symbol with the descriptor "retarded system" captioned onto it?? jesus fucking christ.

"there was no deeper thought put into this than some edgy kid in his bedroom mocking what he thinks socialists are from based on his public school education and arguments in youtube comments"
do you know that for certain? are you able to read people's minds by looking at pictures they drew? that's very impressive! i'm glad that we have you as a human, i guess post-structuralism is over now, thanks anon! we solved it!

>i could draw that exact meme say by hand
you didn't though did you!! and if you were working from it as a template and drawing it by hand it wouldn't be the same would it??? are you aware that this argument is used by traditional conservatives all the time to "own the postmodern art establishment"

>>11713020

>>11712938
retard
>>11712943
not an argument

>>11713216
lmao, as i thought, you're full of shit and can't actually form an argument to save your life. Embarrassing. Go back to /pol/ you're way out of your range here.

>>11713217
and unsurprisingly the leftist meme is an overproduced inauthentic shadow of the right wing meme, i have a hangover and that meme makes me feel a bit sick when i look at it. some sort of terrible inarticulate mashup of the aesthetics of fakeyeezyboosts and the most banal school of cartooning (tired watered down caricature that identifies more with "looking like a cartoon" than expressing anything)

>>11713205
That guy is
a) A Tunisian terrorist who committed an attack in France. Not American, not a domestic terrorist, not even a terrorist against America.
b) a militant Islamic fundamentalist, which is by no means left wing.

Are you this braindead?

>>11713244
You do realize the supposedly good right-wing meme posted beforehand was a rip-off of a leftypol meme designed to take the piss out of ancaps?

>>11713240
if you dont understand why a character proudly adjusting his glasses (a symbol of out of touch imitative "coolness") while thumbs upping whilst text portraying him as a disconnected retard repeats over him in a white void is doing something a little bit more than affixing the word "retard" to the symbol of "communism" then you really should be embarrassed. you clearly haven't read a single work on aesthetics in your life, start with clive bell or, better yet, with the greeks

>>11713253
leftypol had not even been created when that meme began to be circulated, it was other right wingers (a vague spectrum of liberatarians, proto-"alt right", neo-nazis and perhaps some classical libs) making fun of ancaps.

>>11713262
/leftypol/ was founded in 2014
That meme appeared in 2016

> it was other right wingers (a vague spectrum of liberatarians, proto-"alt right", neo-nazis and perhaps some classical libs) making fun of ancaps.
Do you have a single fact to back that up?

Why is autism so prevalent amongst the right wing?

>>11713253
shhh
>>11713256
>the greeks
>the fucking glasses
lmao keep going what else? is the white space in between the text indicative of the emptiness of the human soul under socialism? the grinning smile indicative of the totalitarian state's ecstatic willingness to crush under its boot the freedom of the people? seriously what else am i missing with this super original wholly right wing strikethroughmemestrikethrough art work?

>>11713272
your dates are not correct and i can back it up because i have been on /pol/ and there are not many people on there who espouse left wing views so unless you think the left wing people all psychically communicated and decided to make fun of ancaps together that is not what happened

>>11713279
why don’t you kill yourself you unimaginable autist

>>11713067
No STEM skews centrist and rw especially ENG. And again i didn’t even make a comment on STEM, i was saying that rw’s tend to be higher iq (true; not conservatards but actual fascists) and that they also tend to work in STEM, typically ENG, Math and CS; and because the Left is heavily involved in diploma mill majors like Social Sciences and Humanities, there is a huge gap in creativity and iq. Ofc most STEM people are apolitical insects, and most Bio people and low level Soft Eng are left leaning, as you go up the ladder of cog capacity the beliefs become more and more ambiguously technocratic and/or fascist in nature. This is not a coincidence. Memes are just a collectivized form of street art/rhetorical warfare, ergo creative and visually oriented people will dominate; rw’s are visually oriented and moreover they tend to be capable of critiquing more viciously since basically nothing in our culture represents their interests. When the world really was a WASP-Germanic industrial hellscape ruled by monopoly capital you cud confidently expect the Left to outperform the right. However, the uh Jewish nature of capital as it is now and the incredibly obvious pandering to minorities predicated on anti-white propaganda and of course demographic displacement and destruction of safety nets for the white working class is what fuels the resurgence in fascist thought and since the dialectic turned out to be vaguely substantial, the Left will continue to sperg and cooperate with Libs while RW’s terrorize the mainstream discourse and push cons into bifurcating. Everything at the moment is in favor of fascist revival including the state of the Life sciences and economics which is totally opposed to rawlsian and marxian conceptions of humanity. This is so significant because, returning to memetics, if you have nature on your side, the most organic forms of communication become yours, the ownership they feel is unassailable in this light. Everything Leftist relies on nostrums which cannot, will not, withstand the onslought of nihilistic zoomers who are obsesses with sociality and being in agon with their parents culture. Gen X’ers are like Boomers but without any of the pretentions to wisdom cribbed from the acid revolution. You can’t convince some 6’ tall ectomorph lax player that mexicans are good when, he bullies them in school because they smell and are weak, his parents are obviously better than their parents and have higher cog function, the president actively appeals to his family’s interests and the memes produced by those who support this view are backed both by a scientific truth of human inequality and vicious kynical spite towards the very slave moralists who shame him for his natural instincts to cruelty. All the while rw’s are generally also good looking people, the kekistanis and hardcore stormnigger subhumans aside, ive seen more symmetrical faces on the right than the left. You won’t escape discrimination

>>11713279
https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/picardia
fucking retard.

>>11713248
a) I never talked about America in specific, that's something the other guy arbitrarily brought in, much like how he was willing to go back 17 years to try and make a point about right wing violence.

b) He is absolutely a leftist. He's the exact person that the left has been writing encomiums for. He represents all the ideals that the left now stands for.

>>11713278
yeah haha because the glasses aren't actually in the image i just made them up!! or they are somehow in the image but make NO contribution to what the image is as a whole somehow because its not a direct textual political statement or an explicit symbol that directly represents a political ideology? ? ? and that is all i am capable of understanding art as ?? ? ?

>fags don't know about based picardia
the meme is older than 90% of /pol/

>>11713286
How many times do I have to tell you to put your neck in a noose and jump before you actually do it, /pol/tard?

>>11713279
>your dates are not correct and i can back it up because i have been on /pol/ and there are not many people on there who espouse left wing views so unless you think the left wing people all psychically communicated and decided to make fun of ancaps together that is not what happened
You are an idiot. You seem to assume /pol/ is the source of all memes until proven otherwise and if left-wingers don't use /pol/ then they couldn't have come up with a meme because /pol/ is the source of all originality and humor. Do you see the problem with this logic?

/pol/ is not the only place on the internet where people have memes about politics. As I said it came from /leftypol/, to the best of my knowledge anyway. In any case I noticed left-wingers using it long before /pol/ caught onto it and I had been using both for a long time, /pol/ for significantly longer.

I'm not even going to bother trying to pull rank and call you a newfag because that's gay but this is hilarious.

>>11713295
go for a walk or something, this is not good for your blood pressure and mental health you know

>>11713278
and the white space is a compositional element that gives the image a feeling of roughness/amateurishness (especially since we recognize white as a default background, or "lack of background", but also because we can easily imagine that the image was made using software we are familiar with and do not associate with more "professional" / "artistic" creations) that lends to its authenticity, you said you felt as if the image might have been made by a child - doesn't that make it feel more "real" and "authentic" to you as a piece of expression than this mess >>11713217 of overly produced attempts at sleekness mixed with ugly incompetence? to me one of those images is a funny, effective work that contains an old message ("communism always fails") but puts it across in an original, interesting way. the other image is a fucking inauthentic mess that is barely coherent to me.

>>11713319
its pretty epic how you accuse me of not putting forward arguments while chucking in posts like this. as i already said its clear your aesthetics are embarassingly underdeveloped and you need to do some reading before you every try to engage in a serious discussion about art ever again.

>>11713294
a) that guy was me, and the original posts before I came in were exclusively revolving around American politics. To quote you
>When you pit right wing violence against left wing violence it's no comparison. The fact that the only notable case you had is a schizophrenic former bernie supporter is telling. Meanwhile ancoms and antifas have been going around beating random people, such as the bitcoin girl, for years. Or Eric Clanton assaulting at least 7 people with a deadly weapon. Or antifa attacking people on their own side such as Paul Welch. Or antifa attacking journalists (who are also on their side), and police officers.
Literally every single one of these instances happened in the United States. If you want to move the goal-posts and make it about global politics you'd only be shooting yourself in the foot because right-wingers are violent niggers in Europe as well.

Not to mention switching the goal-posts like that is tacitly admitting that my point, that the majority of American domestic terrorists are right wing, is correct. And having to cite examples of Jihadists in Europe as your examples of "left wing violence" is utterly pathetic. Seriously, is it that hard to find a communist domestic terrorist? Or even a liberal domestic terrorist?
>b) He is absolutely a leftist. He's the exact person that the left has been writing
encomiums for. He represents all the ideals that the left now stands for.
Ah, I see. I thought the left was all about social justice, economic equality and secularism. Clearly the left-wing are actually all about reactionary religious fundamentalism. Yup, those lefties sure hate feminism, atheism, Jews, gay people and degeneracy.

>>11713316
>>11713279
i mean the fact that you immediately assume any consideration of the white space (which is PART OF THE IMAGE) would be retarded symbolist interpretation pulled out of nowhere says it all really, you can't even imagine what actual current aesthetic thought looks like

Absolute Monarchy is as Left as it gets.

>>11712878
There is a similar humorlessness you can find on the right, but the difference is that they haven't taken over right wing culture the same way deranged lefty cranks have.

I don't think these attitudes are a result of their political ideology. They are caused by the social environment which makes them aggressive and paranoid due to impoverished relationships. Horseshoe theory is bunk, but what people are picking up on is that tankies and wignats have the same embattled temperament, which is what pushed them to these bizarre totalizing ideologies in the first place.


>>11713365
> Seriously, is it that hard to find a communist domestic terrorist?
Antifa you tard
>Ah, I see. I thought the left was all about social justice, economic equality and secularism.
Hey, not my fault you're gullible and lap up buzzwords

>>11713344
>>11713295

you people dont understand

these memes in my opinion can probably be considere3d a kind of "art" but a new kind of art more exciting than the ones past. art as it is now if fairly commercial and memes defy that to an extent.

but they are NOT political. their very beauty comes from the fact that they are mallebable and can be used in any number of contexts. a product of their postmodern age. the right wing meme shared above is an appropriation of a much earlier meme called picardia which had nothing to do with any political or ideological leanings. its smile, glasses, and font (mostly impact) are humorous and can be used as a punchline for any number of different messages or meanings. that doesnt mean that the meme itself inherently has any meaning or ideology. the opposite.

as to the childlike nature of the meme, sure yes this is an aesthetic that has been done countless times before, basquiat is an obvious example. in my opinion on pure visual qualities its done much more interesting in a different manner but memes dont realy on visual categories for their artistic value, they rely on the viral impact. so trying to claim that any meme has any inherent aesthetic value or artistic value is stupid and missing the point. memes are not aesthetic or "artistic" in the sense we normally think of. thats not the point.

>>11713355
that was the first post I've made in this thread. I don't care at all for this dragged out discourse but your intense investment into partisan ownership and interpretation of a shitty meme is concerning.

>>11713355
dude are you even an artist of any kind or do you just read books on aesthetics? be honest

>>11713392
>Antifa you tard
Ah, yes. The infamous domestic terrorist known as Antifa. Truly this man is a danger to us all and has got to be stopped.

How many Americans has Mr. Antifa killed again?

>Hey, not my fault you're gullible and lap up buzzwords
Yes, how stupid of me to believe that the entire history of left-wing politics hasn't just been an elaborate trojan horse for reactionary Islamic fundamentalism. Clearly all those feminists actually HATE women and think they should wear burqas and men should be allowed to beat their wives. And clearly when Karl Marx said "religion is the opiate of the masses" this was really coded language for "There is no god but god and Muhammad is his prophet".

Who the fuck is coming up with this shite?

>>11713392
>antifa are terrorists cus some based MAGApede got hit on the head with a bucket once

>>11713403
i think you have misunderstood what i am arguing, my position is that the meme is NOT solely a political statement (but rather an aesthetic expression that contains political messaging) and I personally do not think art can EVER be reduced to political ideas. On the other hand, if we were to try and claim that there are "right wing memes" (as the person i was originally responded to did claim) then certainly the right wing could be said to have more of a claim to ancap memes than the left. I also think that the memes that might be identified as "right wing memes" seem to me to be generally better pieces than what are generally identified as "left wing memes" (though i don't personally see the point in viewing memes through left/right dichotomies)

>>11713310
i don’t post on /pol/
>>11713386
no
>>11713424
they’re terrorists because they throw acid in people’s faces and beat pedestrians with sticks and steel toed boots while rw’s do not do this.

>>11713419
why would my answer be at all relevant to my arguments? why do you spend your time on 4chan if you have this desire to link communications to an identity??

>>11713441
>they’re terrorists because they throw acid in people’s faces and beat pedestrians with sticks and steel toed boots while rw’s do not do this.
True, right wingers shoot people and set off bombs.

>>11713445
you're making all these arguments about art and aesthetics and have a very snobbish attitude towards it. How can you claim to know about art when you dont even make it yourself? One thing is to read books about art. Its an entirely different thing to make it. Frankly i really cant take your arguments as anything other than a book nerd talking about things he's read about if you're not actually familiar with the artistic process yourself. Its like someone who reads about fighting telling someone else he could totally knock them out with his monkey fist technique he's read about but never done.

>>11713475
asking you to read some of the books about the thing you are trying to debate is snobbish?
>How can you claim to know about art when you dont even make it yourself
"art" is not just the process of creating things but also the process of receiving things and interpreting and understanding things
>Frankly i really cant take your arguments as anything other than a book nerd talking about things he's read about if you're not actually familiar with the artistic process yourself. Its like someone who reads about fighting telling someone else he could totally knock them out with his monkey fist technique he's read about but never done.
firstly you've assumed i don't make art (when i have chosen not to comment because i think its completely irrelevant to the discussion and just a transparent attempt to launch ad hominems), secondly you do realize that the people who train mike tyson don't go in the ring and do the fight? and you do realize i was not saying anything about how i think people should create art but rather talking about how i have received art?

i am going to assume you identify with the left (since you've made assumptions about me) and it makes sense, the left has generally had no fucking understanding of art whatsoever throughout history, imagine mandating art at a state level in the fucking 20th century!! incredible!!

>art is a vehicle for an artist to deliver their intent because they had an idea they wanted to share but they forgot how to write essays or something

its just white bro!!

>>11713523
>"art" is not just the process of creating things but also the process of receiving things and interpreting and understanding things

sure

>firstly you've assumed i don't make art (when i have chosen not to comment because i think its completely irrelevant to the discussion and just a transparent attempt to launch ad hominems),

i think you're being sensitive. i asked you if you made art, and then said what i would think of you and your arguments if you didn't.

i think its important for any art critic to be involved in making art. of some kind, even as a hobby. you cant truly understand art if you never make it.

>secondly you do realize that the people who train mike tyson don't go in the ring and do the fight?

sort of a weird thing to say. all of mike tysons coaches were very involved in boxing themselves as youths, and then went on to coach. i dont even think you can be a boxing coach if you've never boxed. no one would take you seriously.

>you do realize i was not saying anything about how i think people should create art but rather talking about how i have received art?

now you're being slimy and dishonest. i said that you were being snobbish and you were, since you were calling people's aesthetic sensibilities trash and saying your own were much better. you weren't talking about how people receive art at all until recently. you were mostly just shitting on other people.


>
i am going to assume you identify with the left (since you've made assumptions about me) and it makes sense, the left has generally had no fucking understanding of art whatsoever throughout history, imagine mandating art at a state level in the fucking 20th century!

no, i don't and if anything this reveals your own aesthetic disabilities. say what you want about constructivism but it was and still is hugely influential in nearly all areas of art. the idea of art as something ultimately separate from the political/ideological is also a false notion at the end of the day.

so you sound like a total phillistine larping hard about art. i'll ask you again, do you make art at all or not? ill take a refusal to answer as a no.

>>11713604
>you cant truly understand art if you never make it.
how does a person truly understand a piece of art? an art critic is someone who interprets and criticizes art, knowledge of the artistic process can help you interpret or criticize art, you can also interpret or criticize art from other perspectives that do not consider the processes that went in to the piece (would a piece of anonymous art that didnt allow you to discern how it was made from examining it be uninterpretable?) is it impossible to make statements about the object or do you think that the aim of art criticism is to try and read artists minds through observing objects they made? (if so, on what basis do you argue that such a thing is realistically possible)?

>you were calling people's aesthetic sensibilities trash and saying your own were much better
it wasn't about their sensibilities it was about the broadness of their aesthetic thought, it is immediately obvious when someone who hasn't done much thinking or reading about art starts trying to talk about art (the same as with literally any subject), i pointed people towards books they could read so they could broaden their understanding and countered their bad assertions and if you think that is snobbish i guess you can feel free to think that.

>i'll ask you again, do you make art at all or not? ill take a refusal to answer as a no.
how many people on 4chan do you think have never made internet memes? i am not going any further into this line of inquiry because its absolutely retarded. you are on the wrong website if you feel a desire to know things about the people you are talking to, if thats how you like to discuss things then there are other websites available that cater to you.

imagine being fucking thick enough to engage with a body of literature where hundreds of people disagree about what karl marx was saying and then somehow hold the belief that art criticism is about a singular intent being imbued magically into an object and then excavated back out by the professional critic

>>11712559
>>11712560
There's a reason the transition into capitalism from guilds and feudalism was called "economic liberalization". It was a granting of liberty to all in a free-ish market in accord with the liberalism of the day and industrialization. A right wing economic approach would at the very least include protectionism and at the far end the reinstitution of serfdom, lordship, and monarchy. Fascist corporatism was an application of a guild-like mentality to national industry, except that there was basically 1 guild (corporation) per industry and they were not allowed to conflict with each other or the national interest. Part of blood and soil was an idealization of the farmer as the backbone of the nation, and therefore a kind of elevated and equitable serfdom where the serf is respected to a much greater degree than in classical feudalism. Hitler was basically king of Germany, except he didn't dress as cool as kings. This was the only thing he did wrong. The perception of capitalism as right wing just shows how far left the overton window has shifted and how small it is. In America, the acceptable range of economic opinions is basically classical liberalism on the far right and a mixed economy on the far left. The range of acceptable social opinions however is far more skewed to the left though. You can't even REALLY rant publicly about the elementary school "trans girl" that was featured in an advertisement for BDSM gear without getting weird looks and libertarian bullshit from people.

A video about corporatism and a video about national socialist economics:
https://youtu.be/FsAIuAMjzsc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FUZFy9Nd9s&t=4534s&bpctr=1535745520

>>11712282
no one says race doesnt exist -- you dense fucking child. they're saying it's a social construct not a natural kind

>>11714007
We wuz starz n shieet

>>11712413
because goyische women is cucked into submission by their balding wife-beating husbands

>>11712339
i tend to agree with this, although i think this kind of faux-right memeing has given rise to a new earnest and intellectual right wing movement

>>11713889
>How is law and order kept and the issue of scarcity dealt with
Read Kropotkin

>>11713441
>>they’re terrorists because they throw acid in people’s faces and beat pedestrians with sticks and steel toed boots while rw’s do not do this.
True, and the right based MAGApedes gives out hugs and kisses to all

>>11712339
this so much
anarchistic contrarianism is the only consistent ideology in this site

>>11711972
LMAOing at these crying responses.
>>11712339
>the fact that the "right wing" dont even see this is perfect and pure
Everyone knows that 4chan is counterculture you blundering newfag. Refrain from being encouraged by the other newfags lying about the quality of your abhorrent post.

>The left cant meme.
>The right is subversive and self aware
>Lets look at the main meme page of the right on Instagram. (Pic related)
>Oh shit

>>11714575
Why are you on social media you self-absorbed queer

>>11714575
Meanwhile at the main meme page of the left.

>The left doesnt do subversive memes
>The left has no selfawareness
>Leftist memes are cheesy propaganda

>>11714588
Your mom got tired of faxing nudes

>>11714514
>muh secret club
lol

>>11714596
>he thinks the right can meme post 2016
gold: the post

>>11713035

>>11712639
Exactly. 4chan's main ideology is contrarianism.

>>11711828
Where my Anarchist niggas

>>11712980
>they spread because the people spreading them relate to it.
And you can't see the problem with this?

Instead of being exposed to more nuanced ideas such as "our demographic issues are complex, but with enough goodwill and a bit of creative thinking we can find a solution that suits both locals and new arrivals", young people are being exposed to ideas like "Jews are responsible for the destruction of the white race, it's time to take them down" in a way thats palatable to them. It's "relatable" because it's *designed* to be relatable, by insidious right-wing ideologues looking to recruit vulnerable people into their ranks.

Face it, you're just deflecting responsibility for spreading literal propaganda to kids. There's nothing "natural" about any of this.

>>11714243
>I type all that shit up
>The meme I attached as an afterthought is what gets the response
"lole"

>>11715591
the left's been targeting kids, especially uni students, and the most vulnerable people in society, by explicit design, for decades and now using literal fucking cult techniques which I should not have to itemize to anyone who's not comatose level unobservant. Meanwhile shilling all manner of hyper obscene literature while claiming any examination of its pernicious effects - nihilism, self-loathing and all that - is mccarthyism/moral panic/blah blah fucking blah, which is because many of you outright believe in some nebulous formula about transformation through transgression under a variety of guises.
you're now claiming civil society is going to flip full fash because of a few teen edgelords, which is more dishonest pearl clutching, exactly of the variety that you shamed Christians about for decades. You don't have the character to understand why it's become so hard to take anything you say seriously. All you'll do is screech "nuh uh not me personally, I'm an X" like you think you're a Marxist Leninist or some other line of BULLSHIT, so your dig about irresponsibility is just yet another example of your profound hypocrisy. not to mention you flat out refuse to discuss any of the real critiques with a shred of intellectual honesty.

>>11715680
>not to mention you flat out refuse to discuss any of the real critiques with a shred of intellectual honesty.
What critiques? "The Jews did it?" I am not ideologically opposed to listening to right-wing talking points, it's that right-wing talking points are almost unanimously false, or if they're not, they're taken deeply out of context.

There's absolutely nothing to threatened ideologically by right-wing extremism. I don't care about ideology. I care about the human lives that could be lost if resurgent hypernationalism has its way.

>>11711828
GOOD FUCKING JOB ANON.

You see fuckers, this is how you do a good bait. 2 lines of text, marx thumbnail and a bunch of faggots.
Good job.

>>11715706
exactly, your entire response is merely to yell "it's wrong!" at a strawman and try exude smarmy confidence. There are psychos and morons out there to be sure, the difference is the leftie establishment gives their radicals tenure track while the right are considered no more than the scum of society. There is going to be no resurgence of ultranationalism from fucking 4chan memes, any rumblings of this from the likes of China, Israel, India, and Eastern Europe have fucking nothing to do with cartoons, you're the paranoid one. And likely a professed """materialist""" too, quite dialectically simultaneously insisting that the ideology isn't a threat and is nonsense, while fearing the spread of dangerous ideas through obscene cartoons. It's not that Marxists are just wrong, they're often times wrong and right at the same time.

>>11712822
how do you like your non-diamond-tipped drillbits

>>11712017
But you do see 14 year olds screaming "this is why we need communism" and other than that all the tumblrinas fuck nazis comic memes.

>>11711989
>Two years on and it's the same jokes, the same memes, the same arguments. It's making me realise that the sentiment behind the humour is entirely genuine, and that's so much worse than it being a joke.
This, I can't believe they still haven't come up with anything better than "le cheeto man" and "wtf impeach". I mean every day MSM flips the fuck out about Trump. He has absolutely taken over their minds.

>>11712687
Holy fuck now that is a burn

>>11711876
>The left really can't meme
There's a book by Franco Bifo Berardi in which he claims exactly this, that the Left is unable to produce memes and hence is gonna die (or rather, it is already dead). The guy comes from a marxist background but he constantly criticise the Left in a way similar to that of thinkers like Fisher or the early Land.

>>11714007
>no one says race doesnt exist
lol

>>11712413
Your point?

>memes are spread based on their popularity and appeal to the viewer
>leftists want democracy, the purest popularity contest possible
>but they don't use memes
How are they going to square this circle?