[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / ic / jp / lit / sci / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports ] [ become a patron ] [ status ]
2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/lit/ - Literature


View post   

File: 506 KB, 1579x1600, Heidegger.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11144136 No.11144136 [Reply] [Original]

What are /lit/'s thoughts on Heidegger? Despite him being an unrepentant Nazi he's probably one of the most important philosophers of the 20th century.

“A person is not a thing or a process but an opening through which the absolute manifests.” - Martin Heidegger

>> No.11144147

Dumb post-modernist trash. He is basically Derrida but German.

>> No.11144149
File: 407 KB, 1216x488, 1524780017207.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11144149

>>11144136
His ontology was nothing less than revolutionary. Awkward situation with the whole Nazi thing; but Aurelius wrote the Meditations out slaughtering barbarians on campaign. I separate art and artist why not philosopher and philosophy? I think it was Schopenhauer that said something like: a philosopher no more needs to be a good person than a painter need be beautiful.

>> No.11144157

>>11144136
>unrepentant
no

>> No.11144174

>>11144157
He never publicly apologized and the Black Notebooks are looking pretty damning for him. Arendt did forgive him though.

>> No.11144240

>>11144147
What? Post-modern maybe but Derrida-tier? fuggof don't insult Martin

>> No.11144301

>>11144240
He went to the same extents as Derrida claiming that all language was built on manmade axioms.

>> No.11144325

>>11144149
>a philosopher no more needs to be a good person than a painter need be beautiful.
That's a fantastic quote. Very true. I personally don't have a problem with him being a nazi though.

>> No.11144348

>>11144149
>That pic
Kek
Also where should I start with him? I've downloaded his intro to metaphysics

>> No.11144355

>>11144348
Being and Time for the Young Heidegger
Question Concerning Technology for Old Heidegger
I've never read Intro but I'm sure it's as good a place to start as any (it's all very hard)

>> No.11144368
File: 505 KB, 1034x1600, 1436140444671 - Copy.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11144368

>"Just "be" yourself

>> No.11144372

>>11144147
This is stupid. Derrida is a Heideggerean. It's not a secret.

>> No.11144375

>>11144136
>What are /lit/'s thoughts on Heidegger?

Hes a wannabe poet whose work leads no where besides the pleasure the few within his circle get from reading him

>> No.11144544

>nazism is bad because my americuck overlords say so

>> No.11144546

>>11144355
Checked thanks

>> No.11144550

>>11144174
>He never publicly apologized
he said it was a mistake
>and the Black Notebooks are looking pretty damning for him
i haven't read them but I've read in an article that he came to see nazism as another expression of jewishness

>> No.11144554

>>11144136
Every philosopher at my uni hates him. Anyone have any idea why?

>> No.11144558

>>11144355
>Question Concerning Technology

Yeah... I read that, and I wonder if he's not attributing too much will/agency to human collectives. I'm not convinced we have any real power to "enframe" our use of technology in any meaningful way, so much as biosocial impulses end up dictating such things. It's an interesting essay, but I'm not so convinced of its premises.

>> No.11144561

>>11144136
>Despite him being an unrepentant Nazi
Why was this relevant?
Their ideological beliefs should not invite a despite. It has nothing to do with the matter at hand. I can read Marx or Hitler even yet not feel disgust at one or the other.

>> No.11144565 [DELETED] 

>>11144136
A pussy theologist turned Nietzschean who was still a pussy theologist.

>> No.11144592

>>11144149

>I separate art and artist why not philosopher and philosophy?
Philosophy is concerned with how the world works and how one should live in relation to how the world works. It often has a prescribing character, mostly, and we tend to not trust people who give prescriptions they don't follow. This has been true throughout ancient philosophy (see P. Hadot - What is Ancient Philosophy?) and it is the general character of moral philosophy. Someone who wants to teach us what to do, supposedly know what is best to do. But someone if someone knows what is best to do and does not do it
(1) either is lying about what is best to do, and should not be trusted as a teacher
(2) either does not really know what is best to do, and should not be trusted as a teacher
(3) either is too weak to follow his own standards which leads to
(3.1) either the thought is somewhat flawed and does not motivate the thinker
(3.2) the thinker's mind cannot impose itself on his life, and therefore he's a weak person likely not suitable to teach

Literature, on the other hand, as well as art in general, has no prescriptive character whatsoever, nor does it have to send any moral message. Art is for pleasure - and the intellectual pleasure for which we have the impression to "learn" things from art is because art gives us the occasion of projecting our own thoughts into an aesthetic experience: this has nothing to do with a supposed "actual meaning" (i.e. "actual teaching/message") of the work of art. Art has nothing to teach, much like everyday experience: it is the projection of your thought through art that can become a life lesson. But there are no prescriptions on how to live in art, as there are in philosophy. This is why artists are not supposed to be coherent with themselves, while philosophers are.

>> No.11144602

>>11144592
pure ideology

>> No.11144627

>>11144554
Because your "philosophers" are marxist and liberals so anyone right of center is dismissed because they're evil nazis. Also because Heidegger was an actual anti-semite and nazi (not a bad thing btw)

>> No.11144634

>>11144592
Verbose nonsense invoking the affective brain and not the rational.

>> No.11144640

>>11144627
>Because your "philosophers" are marxist and liberals so anyone right of center is dismissed because they're evil nazis.
as it should be
rightwingers can't think

>> No.11144656

>>11144627
I go to a Catholic uni lmao. None of them are Marxists or Liberals. So try again faggot

>> No.11144663

>>11144544
name one successful implementation of nazism

>> No.11144675
File: 40 KB, 720x736, 1518232176088.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11144675

>>11144544
>nazism isnt bad

>> No.11144678

daily reminder that Heidegger wants you to pay reparations for niggers

>> No.11144685

>>11144656
>They are not leftists because they are religious

lmao

>> No.11144709

>>11144663
Third Reich hitherto WWII.
Strong government not beholden to external shareholders (not "da joos"), viz. electorate, that actually was able to get shit done without grid lock. Brutal, immoral, reprehensible sure. Unsuccess? Only a retard would say that.

>> No.11144719

>>11144709
>hitherto
This is how we know you haven't read anything.

>> No.11144726

>>11144634

The point is very simple.
What is prescriptive (philosophy) should be followed by the prescriber otherwise the prescriber should not be trusted.
What is not prescriptive (art) should not.

The fact that Heidegger never engaged with moral philosophy should be a red light for you, for he probably had nothing to teach about how you should live.

>> No.11144730
File: 96 KB, 512x471, young-business-man-thinking-hard.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11144730

>>11144709

>> No.11144787

>>11144656
Ok, It’s probably because Heidegger disturbed their subject-object/God-world constellations... The Genesis is part of a productionist and Jewish worldview where the world is a collection of things molded and created by God and are always at hand for his subjects. Heideggers idea of ”the world” is different.

>> No.11144816

>>11144709
war economy that destroyed europe and couldn't sustain itself and got btfo by an horde of commies

>> No.11144838
File: 212 KB, 1218x1015, 1518136853167.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11144838

>>11144675
>>11144544

>Nazism is either good or bad because I have a Lord of the Rings Morality and if I don't believe in the existence of some "enemy"/"absolute evil" I get panic attacks from uncertainty about my moral actions instead of taking the pain of recognizing that literally no ideology/religion is absolutely good or bad and that I am required to judge good and bad bit by bit every time I am faced with an actual situation instead of using reductive generalizations and misunderstood categories such as "nazi" "commie" "bigot" "cuck" to understand the world

>> No.11144849

>>11144550
>he said it was a mistake
lol no, the only thing he admitted to was 'real nazism still hasn't been tried before' tier

>> No.11144851

>>11144838
>death camps are actually very nuanced, I swear!

>> No.11144854

>>11144709
>failed state
>successful

>> No.11144859

>>11144838
There is simply no way Nazism was bad. Try the redpill, cuck

>> No.11144870

>>11144851
"death camps" are a liberal fabrication. It's well documented that they had swimming pools, tennis courts, bowling alleys, and an arcade

>> No.11144884

>>11144854
All states inevitably fail. That does not discredit its rise and successful execution throughout the majority of the 30s.

>> No.11144892
File: 392 KB, 540x546, 1524185260110.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11144892

>>11144838
>mfw a Jewish historian BTFO neo-nazi posterboy David Irving, reducing him to a pathetic stuttering mess as shown in this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtofVFOWKyU

>> No.11144954

>>11144851

>nazism=death camps

Death camps sure were bad, but there were also good social policies we still use today (ecological policies, policies to create less disparity between women and men working) and moreover none of the people who criticize nazism actually look at how everyday life was in those days. Being german under nazi germany meant to have social support, work, and a sense of community: people were happy. Same thing with fascism in Italy, which lasted 20 years and did not develop on a racist base. It lasted not because it was held by force, but because it worked economically and people were living well under it. It was overthrown and met with actual, violent resistance ONLY when, because of the war (last 5 years of a 20 years regime), it failed to provide the well-being of people living under it.
Now when you start to engage with the fact that dictatorships (both leftwing and rightwing) also realized positive things and maybe learn from this, you may come out of your childhood and stop thinking that the world is whatever faction of avengers you are fighting for versus thanos wearing the opposite political symbol you don't like.

>> No.11144958

>>11144149
>I separate art and artist why not philosopher and philosophy?
Because his thinking was infected with nazi-terminology like the whole "freedom toward death"

>> No.11146684

>>11144544
Checked.

>> No.11146719

>>11144149
>His ontology was nothing less than revolutionary
Are you trying to troll Heidegger readers? Because I feel like I should tell you nobody reads him so the fact nobody uncovers that you're an idiot is because you're surrounded by them.

>> No.11147575

>>11144851
>>death camps are actually very nuanced, I swear!
Of course they are.
Death camps for the Slavic people certainly were an atrocious thing.
When it comes to the Jews it gets a bit harder, many Jews demonstrated in WW1 that they were willing to fight for the German Empire, so obviously one can not condone the genocide of these Jews who are loyal to Germany.
On the other hand as seen in the Socialist Revolution some Jews definitely were harboring communist and anti-German thoughts and thus them being put into camps, not because of their Jewishness but because of their communism and subversion, was certainly a good thing.
Then we get to the gays, where again a nuanced position has to be taken, obviously nobody should be killed because of his sexual attraction alone, but if you are a fag about it and won't stop, other methods have to be taken.
Lastly there are the NEETS and I think we can all agree on that they deserved the camps.
(Did I miss any major group?)

See? You can be nuanced on death camps.

>> No.11147643

>>11147575
>if you are a fag about it and won't stop, other methods have to be taken
>death camps
>nuanced
kek'd

>> No.11147651

>>11146719
Do you really think the distinction between ontic and ontological wasn't one of the most important contributions to modern philosophy?

>> No.11147779

>>11144136
who should i read before him?

>> No.11148798

>>11147779
Greeks

>> No.11148833

>>11147779
I found it fine to just jump right into him.

>> No.11148877

>>11144958
Epic bait

>> No.11148892

>>11147779
Husserl.

>> No.11148924

>>11144149
>Aurelius wrote the Meditations out slaughtering barbarians on campaign
are you implying theres something wrong with culling snowniggers

>> No.11149008

>Heidegger is a Nazi
Oh you mean he joined the Nazi party in 1933 with everyone else that didnt want to be murdered or forced into poverty? Fucking idiots. Never expressed a single anti-semitic thought though it would have enormously helped his position in Germany.

>> No.11149022

>>11149008
You didn't hear about the Black Notebooks?
http://www.critical-theory.com/7-new-translated-excerpts-on-heideggers-anti-semitism/

>> No.11149028

>>11149022
>tfw you don't give a fuck about anti-semitism

feels good not having to walk on ideological eggshells

>> No.11149038

>>11149008
>the people that didn’t join the Nazi party were murdered or forced into property
Is this bait or are you actually retarded?

>> No.11149056

Literally nothing wrong with being a nazi

>> No.11149061

>>11147575
good post, gas the neets

>> No.11149063

>>11149038
Are you fucking retarded? Do you anything about history? Everyone had to join the Nazi party, everyone had to support the Nazi party or anything could happen to them. To just assume everyone who stayed in Germany when the Nazi's took power loved them is stupid.

>> No.11149066

>>11149008
nah, he joined the Nazis to save the world from ((()))s

>> No.11149098

From the perspective of some country bum the nazi party might very well have been a good thing. Especially if negative things were censored

>> No.11149125

>>11149063
>Everyone had to join the Nazi party
Okay, now I know you’re retarded

>> No.11149131

>>11149125
Okay retard great argument.

>> No.11149337

>>11144634
Look at you. Using words but saying nothing