/lit/ - Literature

>>10208730
>Dusty

kill you are selve

I don't think he went wrong. I believe he intentionally put archetypal characters in his stories in order to speak not only on a narrative level, but also a deeper philosophical level.

Tolstoy's 'real' characters give us an opposite effect. They make us feel like what is being read is actually happening, bringing the reader into the story.

Both are great.

>>10208740
But how does it work? I know they have weight and depth and I feel it but I just don't get how

>>10208762
That's a horribly difficult question to answer. Any explanation of HOW Tolstoy wrote like he wrote will come up short. It's something deep, and possibly, only those like Tolstoy understand it. Hence not all of us can be a Tolstoy.

>>10208730
It’s the exact opposite, but you’re a Bloom / Nabokov drone so you wouldn’t realize that. Have fun with your Disney channel characters.

>>10208923
holy.. is this the power of christ?

>>10208941
Fucking funny kekage, ann in

>>10208730
>Why do Tolstoy's characters seem like real people and Dusty's like embodiments of philosophies
Have you even read any Dostoevskij or just the Wikipedia page of the Brother Karamazov?

>>10208965
He’s directly referencing the self-unaware pedophile Nabokov because he can’t think for himself.

>>10208965
>>10208971
>>10208923
>Being this butthurt.
Wew, /lit/ sure is full of fanboys. Anyway, thinking that Dostoevskij's characters feel like cardboard cutout is a very common thing. Nabokov wasn't the first to say this. Proust, Tolstoy himself and a lot of important Russian critics such as Mikhaylovsky thought the same thing.

>>10208994
Tolstoy was a manchild aristocrat who romanticized poverty. His characters are wonky nosed caricatures of actual people. And no one uses the term “embodiment of philosophies” that isn’t referring to Nabokov’s “landscapes of philosophy” as both are retarded, vague descriptions which can be applied to any writer.

Most people also love Nietzsche over Schopenhauer because the root of the problem is much less appealing than a juvenile fantasy.

>>10208730
If any of us knew we'd be successful novelists.

Am I the only one thinks that every character is a cutout? All I can hear is the author's voice when I read.

>>10209006
>Tolstoy was a manchild aristocrat who romanticized poverty. His characters are wonky nosed caricatures of actual people.
Sperg-tastic post.

>>10209006
wew lad. I've never attacked your beloved Dostoevskij, calm down. All I was saying is that the view expressed in the OP isn't that uncommon.

>>10209030
this means we desperately need you to come in and revolutionize the field. please write a book where you can't hear the author's voice. if the problem is the medium itself well i guess this board doesn't have much more life in it.

>>10209032
About as sperg as dressing up as a peasant for pictures while being extremely wealthy isn’t it?

Worth noting that as time has gone on, Dostoevsky, who wasn’t very popular during his life, has become increasingly relevant while Tolstoy has shrunk in comparison.

>>10209056
Indeed, Dostoevsky has become more popular as the tastes of the plebs have come to shape the literary marketplace.

>>10209006
Wew lad
Calm down

>>10209066
Yeah, I’m sure the barely literate, yet literal peasants of 19th century Russia had a closer grip on the abortive hand of modern life than people on here do. Consider rethinking your worldview.

>hating on Tolstoyevsky

>>10208730
Read Alice Munro.

>>10209085
What? You don't seem to have comprehended my post.

>>10209085
>peasants of 19th century Russia had a closer grip on the abortive hand of modern life than people on here do
This but unironically

>>10209103
You don’t seem to comprehend the purpose of art.

>>10209106
>the purpose of art

Yikes. I should hope not.

>>10209105
Nuclear holocausts, global warming, scientific materialism, quadrupled mental illness rates, global corporate control, inescapable nihilism.

>>10209112
You appear to be living in a fantasy world friend.

>>10209130
You appear to be an insufferable, yuppie faggot, “friend”.

>>10209131
Sure thing. Have fun with your apocalyptic fantasies, I guess.

>>10209144
You’re so fucking brain dead you just repurposed my comment >>10208923 as an insult.

>it's another thread comparing tolstoy to dosto

I know you guys don't know any other russian writers, but come on.

>>10209157
Kill yourself, mongrel.

>>10208730
Well, Tolstoy stole from his wife's diary on a regular basis, and was frankly busy raping his own underaged slaves.
so, if you want to have more genuine characters, just steal them from women, while raping them while they're young.

>>10209179
Love this part of the Tolstoy bed night stories.

>>10209184
>Well, Tolstoy stole from his wife's diary on a regular basis, and was frankly busy raping his own underaged slaves.
Epic meme. I can never not upvote this meme!

>>10209191
>meme
>is incapable of doing simple research
look, this discussion has been had thousands of times. His wife was a dairy cow, and it is clear that her diaries were pillaged by him. he raped slaves, my man, check out the truth of droit de seigneur sometime when you want a reality check.>>10209191

>>10209197
You're trying too hard to meme the newfags. Are you losing your touch or did you get touched somewhere funny recently.

>>10209211
Nothing like preaching communism while owning literal slaves.

>>10209215
You should know all about slaves, mongrel. Get on your knees and pray.

>>10209219
I don’t even know what the fuck this dumbass post is trying to say.

>>10209211
it's not a meme, you moron.
the man was a deranged slave rapist. his father in law literally had to intervene because his daughter complained of having constant mastitis from breastfeeding nonstop, as tolstoy kept her pregnant day in day out. Just imagine for a moment that idea in modern terms. The father of the bride coming to confront his son in law for forcing his daughter to breastfeed so much that her tits are getting pus filled and infected like an overworked dairy cow. You think it's a joke? go fuck yourself.

>>10208730
Tolstoy and Dostoevesky were both cuck socialists. They are only popular today because (((globalists))) like to push their SJW agendas. Throw them to the side and read The Gulag Archipelago instead.

>>10208971
>>10208965
>>10209006
I've never read Nabokov. The only Dostoyevsky I've read is Brothers, The Idiot, and Notes from the Underground so I may be lacking. I never said they were cardboard cutouts, but to deny that they serve as vehicles for different outlooks is pretty retarded.

Hot opinion: Tolstoy being an aristocrat isn't an excuse to just blow off his works. Try reading.

>>10208730
How fucking autistic (or submissive) do you have to be to stutter when making a fucking 4chan post? I don't get it, where you trying to make us feel sorry for you or something? Also
>Dusty
Fucking retard.

>>10210113
>not reffering to the great Ruskies as Toy, Dusty and Nob

>>10210125
>Not Toy, Dusty and Turgy

>>10210113

>>10210135
>I unironically own this book and enjoy it

>>10210135
Try making a sincere post for once in your life, you piece of shit.

>>10210153
Oh, it's an ironic parody of a sincere idiot. Carry on

>>10208730

Tolstoy was into realism. Dosto didn't go wrong, he conscioulsy went for a different style of art. Both have different means and ends.

>>10209006

This. I've probably read dozens of Russian novels, from Gogol to Solzhinystyn and honestly Tolstoy might be the most overrated author of all time. Your assessment is completely accurate. Mind you Dostoevsky isn't that great, although Brothers Karamazov is a masterpiece, most of his other work is flawed.

>>10209247
Slit your wrists.

>>10210191
Kek, you sure are a smart guy. A real literary critic

>>10210113
Aww, is someone new and trying to impress the scawy 4channews? Don't worry sweetie you'll get it eventually

>>10209377
>Dostoevsky
>socialist
Are you retarded?

>>10208730
>H-how do you make characters more real?
Contradictions.

>>10209006
Freddy is simply much more fun to read. Both have juvenile ideas.

>>10210905

>Implying I need to be a literary critic to assess literary quality.

You do realise that "literary critics" are just failed writers who make a living sponging off those with talent.

>>10208730
Polyphony

Read Bakhtin

>>10210191
>novels, from Gogol to Solzhinystyn
The latter wrote a bombastic "nonfiction," not novels, and Gore Vidal was completely right about him.

>>10211384
Yeah and philosophers are just failed scientists lmao

>>10208762
Putting a lot of attention to sensory detail.
Dostoevsky focuses more on the internal experience of the characters, so while they can be complex psychologically they don't seem like real persons that have physical existence.