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/jp/ - Otaku Culture


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4504188 No.4504188 [Reply] [Original]

Is ordering loli/shota now illegal?
Will I get jail time for it?

>> No.4504191

Enjoy getting raped by a man named Bubba.

>> No.4504209

What about freedom of speech?

>> No.4504210

It's not illegal. Order away.

>> No.4504214

>>4504209
I have some bad news for you.

>> No.4504218

Isn't me purchasing loli/shota material fueling the economy?

I don't see the problem.

>> No.4504221

>>4504209
Freedom to own drawn child pronography? I am sure the judge and the jury might be interested to hear your reasons.

>> No.4504222

>>4504214
yes?

>> No.4504228

>>4504209
>he still believes in freedom of speech

I wish I hadn't deleted my lauguing_girls.jpg folder.

>> No.4504253

Images depicting minors under the age of 18 = jail time

But what if the character was, let's say Rinko. Rinko is 16, so making/buying doujinshi of Rinko is bad? So that means doujins of teenagers are also illegal?

That would totally kill comiket.

>> No.4504256

>>4504253
>he actually believes fictional characters can have "ages"

>> No.4504257 [DELETED] 
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>>4504209
>>Freedom of Speech
Nice one.
Too bad it doesn't cover obsence materials.

>> No.4504268

>>4504257
I humbly request your Satori folder please.

>> No.4504273

>>4504268
I don't think he wants you to get piss all over it.

>> No.4504276
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4504276

So something like this drawing is illegal to order?

>> No.4504282

>>4504209
The U.S. at least, has always had freedom of speech, unless it is considered obscene. Which, I can understand with loli(though I disagree with it), but obscene shit has been stamped on political shit, religious shit, and information on birth control.
So pretty much, you have freedom of speech unless the inherently reactionary government doesn't like it.

>> No.4504289

>>4504276
Are those mikos under the age of 18?

>> No.4504290

Are little boys diddling eachother obscene?

>> No.4504297

>>4504257
Actually, it does. Obscenity laws are routinely overturned by courts.

>> No.4504298

>>4504290
Yes. It's very hot though.

>> No.4504315

>>4504289
yes

>> No.4504320

I think you should be more concerned about how it would affect you as an individual more than a probable punishment.

>> No.4504326

>>4504315
Really? Where does ZUN state their ages? I want to see this.

>> No.4504329

>>4504188

Illegal in Australia, Canada and the UK. Supposedly if you're in canada, they aren't enforcing it too heavily, however.

In the US of A, it's a state issue. Most states won't care, but if you're unlucky and live in say, Iowa, they can bust you for bringing "obscene" materials across state lines. Loli in and of itself is completely legal, however.

Solution: Ask someone in a sane state to receive it. Go drive and pick it up.

Solution 2: Ask someone in a sane state to receive it. Have it shipped to you through UPS(NOT usps).

Solution 3: See if you get lucky and no one bothers to check your shit.

Solution 4: Move to a new state

>> No.4504335 [DELETED] 
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>>4504297
But do you honestly believe that would apply to loli?

Its too bad the only case so far he plead guilty in.

>> No.4504343
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>>4504320
It's not like I'm going to go and take a child and do what I read.

I find 3D people disgusting.

>> No.4504358
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4504358

>>4504329
Is California a sane state?

>> No.4504359

>Nice one.
>Too bad it doesn't cover obscene materials.

"you're completely free to say whatever you want except for what the government deems as naughty"

That is not "freedom of speech". That is America's definition of freedom of speech.

>> No.4504360

>>4504320
>Philosophy Major
Yes, I would like one double grande latte! Extra sugar please!

>> No.4504361

>>4504343
It is still outlined in the shape of an immature human, however.

>> No.4504362

>>4504320
quite right philosophy major

>> No.4504363

>>4504188
>Supposedly if you're in canada, they aren't enforcing it too heavily, however.
I'm going to need a citation on this because I have heard many times that Canada is the worst for importing stuff.

Customs rip and tear shit open.

>> No.4504372

>>4504361
You'd think a philosophy major would be able to tell the difference between thought and action.

>> No.4504379

>>4504358
California resident for 20 years.
This state is a bit schizophrenic. On a great deal of issues, California is the open, reasonable society you could find. On others, particularly financial issues, they're batshit insane.
On the issue though, I'd say you're probably fine in California. I think the police are too busy dealing with the fucking Mexican gangs and the negroes to bother you.

>> No.4504384

>>4504358

I have no idea. Look up your state laws yourself or see if anyone here is a member of your tiny gay republic.

I can't see why they wouldn't allow loli though, with all the faggots and trannies and other disturbing deviants you have running around.

>> No.4504388 [DELETED] 
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4504388

This is illegal?

>> No.4504396

>>4504372
Philosophy majors think their brain is in a vat being controlled by an evil scientist.

It's quite an amazing and pathetic thing that the modern academic community actually offers philosophy as a major or even recognizes it at all.
Sure it's enlightening to hear ideas and give it a little thought, but only as a passing interest.

>> No.4504398

>>4504388
More and yes.

>> No.4504399

I can see why CP is a federal offense, but why are drawings?

>> No.4504403

>>4504372
I can also tell you their correlation.

>> No.4504409 [DELETED] 
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>>4504398

>> No.4504410

>>4504399

Loli isn't a federal offense.
It's simply classified as "Obscene" like any porn, and thus not protected by free speech.

This means states may decide if they wish to ban it or not.

>> No.4504417

>>4504403
Regardless of the thought, it is a large step between it and action. Law should only punish based on action. Victimless crimes should not exist. Thought crimes especially.

>> No.4504430

>>4504409
good until i scrolled down and saw the dick

>> No.4504432

>>4504320
Philosophy =/= Psychology

>> No.4504441

So in short, UPS your shit and hope nobody find out.

>> No.4504447

>>4504417
I agree, I never said the law should punish you for obtaining this material even if it is obscene. However, it may lead you down the road to break a bigger law. It is your own hesitation that blocks you from ripping apart an innocent child, be careful when meddling with it.

>> No.4504452

Why are you faggots honoring our newest triptroll?
Why all the posts of the Satori tripfag disappeared?
The world may never know.

>> No.4504458

>>4504452
Athens is hardly new.

>> No.4504470

>>4504447
>However, it may lead you down the road to break a bigger law.

The "gateway effect" is a legal and logical black hole. You should be ashamed of yourself for even considering it.

>> No.4504477 [DELETED] 
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>> No.4504479

>>4504477
More shota please.

>> No.4504481

Remember, we're all homosexuals anyway so we don't have to be ashamed of liking loli.

>> No.4504486

>>4504379

Checking here. The law you want is section 311.
>Every person who knowingly sends or causes to be sent,
or brings or causes to be brought, into this state for sale or
distribution, or in this state possesses, prepares, publishes,
produces, or prints, with intent to distribute or to exhibit to
others, or who offers to distribute, distributes, or exhibits to
others, any obscene matter is for a first offense, guilty of a
misdemeanor.

tl;dr. You're good to order loli but may not distribute.

>> No.4504488 [DELETED] 
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4504488

As I was saying...

Until we get a case in the US that goes all the way to the supreme court, the status of Loli in the US is both unknown federally and may vary state to state.

>> No.4504495

>>4504470
Perhaps in terms of some things, but when sexual desires are taken into account, the argument becomes more relevant. Notice how the argument for criminalizing possession of child porn is based off it.

>> No.4504499

>>4504488
>Until we get a case in the US that goes all the way to the supreme court
I'm almost positive we've already had one and SCoTUS ruled that it did not constitute child pornography.

>> No.4504503
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>>4504495
>Notice how the argument for criminalizing possession of child porn is based off it.

Notice how that's completely baseless.

>> No.4504504

>>4504503
Explain to me, then, the true reason it is criminalized.

>> No.4504506
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4504506

such a complicated subject.

>> No.4504509

>>4504504
Paranoia, F.U.D. campaigns, Public opinion based on misinformation.

Take your pick.

>> No.4504510

>>4504504

You're welcome to troll him, but stop spreading disinformation about my beloved country. Loli is not criminalized, at least on a federal level.

>> No.4504513

>>4504504
Because anyone who disagrees with the idea is labeled a filthy pedophile, which means that no one will ever oppose such measures.

>> No.4504518

>>4504510

The subject is about real child porn, not its artistic representation.

>> No.4504522

>>4504518
>The subject is about real child porn, not its artistic representation.

>OP post
>Is ordering loli/shota now illegal?
Get out.

>> No.4504523
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>> No.4504525

>>4504518

Oh, I see.
Carry on.

>> No.4504527

>>4504458
Oh so this is athens new moniker? Absolutely hilarious.

>> No.4504531
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4504531

As I was saying...again

Until we get a case in the US that goes all the way to the supreme court, the status of Loli in the US is both unknown federally and may vary state to state.

>>4504499
I believe that new and changed laws have gone into effect since then.

>> No.4504529 [DELETED] 
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>> No.4504534

>>4504504

That is AN argument for criminalizing it, but it is illegal is because it exploits real, living, breathing children.

>> No.4504537
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>> No.4504564
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>> No.4504568

>>4504534
True enough, there are many arguments for anything.

>>4504522
Topic of conversation.

>> No.4504569
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>> No.4504571

>>4504531

Scotus will never get rid of loli's gray area, bro. It'll always be "obscene" material, just like all porn. Scotus invented the definition of obscene as an exemption from free speech, if you don't remember. They'd need to overturn their own ruling.

That said, they have constantly destroyed any case where loli would end up the same as CP.

Loli will always remain "obscene", just like any other porn, and as such, it will always remain a state issue.

>> No.4504574
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>> No.4504592
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>> No.4504595

>>4504188
We already had this thread, many many times now.
The conclusion's almost always the same:
1. It depends on where you live and how you squint at it.
2. No, not likely, unless you live somewhere where they spy on your internet usage.
2.5. In any event, not being into actual 3d pedoporn (which is illegal everywhere that's civilized) helps you a great deal.

>> No.4504597
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>> No.4504605
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4504605

FUCK YOU GUYS

THE POLICE ARE AT MY DOOR NOW

>> No.4504608

>>4504531
>Until we get a case in the US that goes all the way to the supreme court
Ashcroft vs Free Speech Coalition. Not involving actual loli, but rather the broader category of virtual CP. They basically said it must be obscene to be illegal - thus loli is legal unless a court renders it obscene (and given that obscenity violates the vagueness protocol, this means loli is legal except in unknown circumstances).

>>4504504
Because the production of it requires a crime to be commited (violation of a minor, obviously). They don't ban it due to gateway effect but due to the concept of the market - if people don't buy it/download it, less will produce it.

>> No.4504611

P.S.
>>4504588
Reported, http://www.4chan.org/rules
go use some other site, there are many to choose from.

>> No.4504620

>>4504571
>It'll always be "obscene" material
No, it'll be obscene if the jury says so. Just don't get tried in hick states and you'll probably get off if it's not something way over the top.

>Loli will always remain "obscene", just like any other porn
Not all porn is obscene. It's case-by-case.

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>> No.4504621
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>> No.4504624
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>> No.4504626

Thread needs some shota.

>> No.4504630
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>> No.4504631

>>4504620
>all porn is obscene

Yes it is, by the miller test. All porn is obscene.

That is why one should instead defer to state obscenity laws to decide loli's legality.

>> No.4504633
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>> No.4504635

>>4504620
The everyman (read:normalfag) will no doubt call it obscene. This isn't an issue of whether or not it is. The problem is that "obscene" stuff isn't protected in the first place. That is a capital bullshit. Freedom of speech is all or none. It's not freedom if it's somewhere in the middle.

>> No.4504637
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>> No.4504638

>>4504631
lol no

If you want me to believe this, give me a court case that shows this.

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>> No.4504652
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>> No.4504660
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So, the mods have time to delete my posts, but can't get rid of this spam which is against the rules, not to mention the content of said images.

I am not impressed.

>> No.4504661
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>> No.4504675

>>4504638

What do you want me to prove? It's the supreme court's ruling itself. They created the miller test.

If you run any porn by the miller test, it's "obscene", and thus it's status is forfeit as free speech on federal level.

This means that it falls on state obscenity laws to define the legality of what porn is legal and what isn't.

For reference:
* Whether the average person, applying contemporary community standards, would find that the work, taken as a whole, appeals to the prurient interest,
* Whether the work depicts/describes, in a patently offensive way, sexual conduct or excretory functions[2] specifically defined by applicable state law,
* Whether the work, taken as a whole, lacks serious literary, artistic, political or scientific value. (This is also known as the (S)LAPS test- [Serious] Literary, Artistic, Political, Scientific.)

That encompasses pretty much all pornography right there.

>> No.4504676
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>> No.4504677

These threads are just two bots arguing and a lolispammer with foxyproxy?
Somebody shitcan the thread or lock it. People can use the "NEET/General" archive or whatever and review the other 12999 endless useless circular threads JUST LIKE THIS ONE.

>> No.4504682
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>> No.4504686

>>4504670

Tasers are scary.

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>> No.4504692

>>4504660
They also deleted the shota. Shit sucks.

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>> No.4504700

If God wanted loli to be illegal he wouldn't have made it so hot.

>> No.4504702
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>> No.4504704

>>4504700
Oh you.

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>> No.4504715

>>4504660
See, the problem is that you're a tripfag and as such your posts are worthless. The mods love loli, this is awesome and it is also very old news.

Official.

>> No.4504719
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>> No.4504721

Take a moment to look at what loli pics are in essence: Young girls, almost toddlers, in obscene situations. Why would any judge, local law enforcement officers and sane people in general, allow people who own this pornography to go free?

Worse of all, why take the chance of him/her finally becoming a child molester/rapist?

>> No.4504727
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>> No.4504733

>>4504721
Why take the chance of every video gamer turning into a crazed school shooter?

Why take the chance of every driver becoming a speeder?

Why take the chance of every alcoholic becoming a heroin addict?

>> No.4504740
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>> No.4504741

>>4504733
Sexuality is a different matter than those issues. Using something as masturbation fodder is expressing a sexual interest in it.

It's not the same for video games, or dirving, or drinking.

>> No.4504747

>>4504733
Why take the chance of stepping outside of your house every day and possibly getti-

>/jp/
Oh wait, nevermind.

>> No.4504749

>>4504733
Why take the chance of every citizen revolting against an unjust government and upsetting the corrupt fatcats in charge?

Better to enslave them all now.

>> No.4504750

>>4504660
>>4504715
Same faggot.

>> No.4504751

>>4504741
So then if I say I just looked at the pictures out of curiosity and did not fap to them, I would be ok right?

>> No.4504752
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4504752

>>4504733
We should make fun illegal. Fun can lead towards laziness, and cause people to stop working completely and becoming unable to pay taxes.

>> No.4504754

>>4504741
>Using something as masturbation fodder is expressing a sexual interest in it.
OH REALLY.

No, it would only be a different issue if I was claiming violent video games led to deriving sexual pleasure from killing.

Rather, I say it leads to pleasure. Just not sexual. If they have fun going on killing rampages in this virtual worlds, they are no doubt a ticking time bomb who will do the same in the real world.

>> No.4504756

>>4504741
Well, you're the one saying they're different. I suggest you provide proof and quick before you're (probably justly) ignored.

Violent video games and violent movies obviously expresses an interest in violent action.
Driving obviously expresses an interest in going fast (otherwise you'd walk or take public transportation)
Drinking alcohol obviously expresses an interest in mind altering substances

>> No.4504761
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>> No.4504767

>>4504751

I refer you to:
>>4504486
and:
>>4504329
For California's state laws.

Please review your state laws, but it is highly likely loli is completely legal in your area.

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>> No.4504786
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>> No.4504805

>>4504774
I hope my body can handle it.

>> No.4504806
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4504806

why you bother? if you are not fucking retard, you can get all the lolis on the internets. is there even a point in ordering hentai manga?

>> No.4504809
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>> No.4504811

/jp/ is supreme

>> No.4504819
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>> No.4504866

>Shota removed
>Loli still here

Meido is fapping right now, please watch warmly.

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>> No.4504875

>>4504794

This thread should be deleted for going on this long, but before that, can I get a source for this please?

>> No.4504877
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>> No.4504894

Oh boy a religion thread!

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>> No.4504914
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>> No.4504915

>>4504894
loli bible.jpg

>> No.4504917
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>> No.4504922

>>4504909
I'd her taco, if you know what I mean...

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>> No.4504960

>>4504937
Is that fucking dora the explorer?

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>> No.4504996
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>> No.4504997

yup. that poor bastard in the US got nabbed for having like 6 volumes of loli shit mailed to him.

i don't really get it but whatever...

>> No.4504999

I'm going to be moving to Nevada soon. Can someone point me to any sections of Nevada law relevant to this topic?

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>> No.4505013

>>4504991
Guess I'll have to add loli glowy vagoo to my list of fetishes.

>> No.4505014
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>> No.4505019
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>> No.4505024

>>4504999

http://leg.state.nv.us/NRS/NRS-201.html

Look that over real carefully, I think you may be boned, but I'd need to take a closer look and I've got a hardon right now

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>> No.4505056

>>4505024
Thank you good sir

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>> No.4505074

>>4504765
what is this from?

>> No.4505080
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>> No.4505118

>NRS 201.241 Action to declare item or material obscene and obtain injunction.
> 1. The district attorney or city attorney of any county or city [...] may file a complaint in the district court seeking to have the item or material declared obscene and to enjoin the possessor and the owner from selling, renting, exhibiting, reproducing, manufacturing or distributing it and from possessing it for any purpose other than personal use.
I'm not sure how accurate my Legal Jargon is, but does this mean Nevada allows ownership of obscene material for personal use?

>> No.4505123

>>4505118
pretty much every state does.

The last few legal cases were about transporting them across state lines, not possessing them.

>> No.4505138
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>>4505123
Well then, there's no problem here until they open up a customs agency for internet traffic and start randomly searching that. Excellent.

>> No.4505154

>>4505118

Having finished my business, the line you're looking for in this case is:

>NRS 201.249 Production, sale, distribution, exhibition and possession of obscene items or materials; penalty. Except as otherwise provided in NRS 201.237 and except under the circumstances described in NRS 200.720 or 200.725, a person is guilty of a misdemeanor who knowingly:
>Publishes, sells, rents, transports in intrastate commerce, or commercially distributes or exhibits any obscene item or material, or offers to do any such things.
>transports in intrastate commerce

No loli for vegas bro

>> No.4505176

>>4505154
There should be a city that's to loli what vegas is to prostitution.

>> No.4505188

>>4505138
>Well then, there's no problem here until they open up a customs agency for internet traffic and start randomly searching that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A

>> No.4505234

>>4505176

There probably is a state that has lax enough obscenity laws. There's all kinds of obscenity laws across the US.

For example, I live in New York. Our obscenity laws ban "promotion" of obscene materials as defined by the community.

How is promotion determined? If one has six or more copies of material or likewise similar pieces, then they have the intent to promote.

So basically, Loli is fine in new york as long as you don't buy more than five doujins at a time.

>> No.4505255

>>4505234
That's.. weird. Wouldn't the seller naturally have more than 5 copies?

>> No.4505261

Other threads are going 404 and this one is still up?

Great

>> No.4505268

>>4505255

The seller in this case is out of NY state jurisdiction. Selling and promotion of obscene materials as defined by community law is prohibited. Transfer is now.

However, one has to intent to promote if they have more than five copies or pieces of similar nature.

Get it?

>> No.4505269

>>4504958
sauce

>> No.4505317

>>4505234

After a quick looking, it appears that Vermont has no laws pertaining to distribution of obscene material outside of "Do not allow minors to buy or distribute".

So I guess now you know where to go if you need to open up your loli shop.

Amusingly, apparently if you do let kids sell your porn and the police need to take it for evidence and you only have one copy left, you're required to make a copy for them.

>> No.4505677

I think it is just the human need of having someone to oppress at work here. If you can't have blacks, jews or homosexuals to bother, why not pick on pedophiles?

It isn't like any of these by default will commit crimes, and anyone with half a brain knows this. Too bad people with half a brain are about as rare as pedophiles.

>> No.4506016

>>4504188
Is it illegal if she's 495 years old?

>> No.4506752

>>4506016
It doesn't matter if she is 500. If she looks like a 10 year old then yes, she is illegal.

>> No.4506759

fappan

>> No.4506780

Back in the good old medieval times to was alright to shag 11 year olds.

>> No.4506788

>>4506780
Not for 30-year olds.

>> No.4506811

>>4506752
Just like in Australia!

>> No.4506823

The Protect Act is an abomination.
I don't understand how that thing got passed, but basically based on the wording almost anything can be potentially child porn.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PROTECT_Act_of_2003

All it has to do is give the impression or 'lead the viewer to believe' that the work contains child porn and it becomes criminal.

Whoever gets nailed by the Protect Act like Hadley did really ought to fight it next time. I think his lawyer was a pussy.

>> No.4508094

I'm glad I left this thread open when I went to bed, a single image and a few posts turns into a loli dump. I love you, /jp/.

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