My favorite programming language cant be this cute.

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Anonymous Mon Sep 16 22:47:37 2013 No.11423271 [Reply] [Original]

My favorite programming language cant be this cute.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 22:48:50 2013 No.11423275 >_m.png I don't think you know how to computer.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 22:51:52 2013 No.11423284 File: 64 KB, 421x595, 16627526_p2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11423271 Here is visual basic in comparison

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:02:53 2013 No.11423304 I wamt to put my hello into her world.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:04:53 2013 No.11423310 lel

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:06:47 2013 No.11423310,1 >>11423310 wwtd

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:07:09 2013 No.11423321 File: 27 KB, 305x400, normal_saba005.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11423271 My OS > your OS.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:09:08 2013 No.11423330 File: 137 KB, 424x600, operatan-hlj.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11423271 Can your browser be this cute?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:12:37 2013 No.11423335 I bet she's slow too.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:12:37 2013 No.11423336 File: 21 KB, 305x400, normal_saba005.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11423330 And this is for the OS.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:14:38 2013 No.11423341 File: 275 KB, 489x600, 35517962_m.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] here is debian-tan

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:15:53 2013 No.11423344 where is lisp-tan

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:16:53 2013 No.11423345 Python-tan better be a lamia

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:20:09 2013 No.11423355 File: 218 KB, 608x860, 33774326.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] She wants you to give her a system call.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:23:10 2013 No.11423361 any gentoo-tan other than the one that comes up when you google it?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:23:34 2013 No.11423362 File: 467 KB, 877x1238, antec.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:36:28 2013 No.11423394 >>11423361

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:37:00 2013 No.11423397 File: 238 KB, 450x600, 18925224_m.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11423394

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:40:14 2013 No.11423403 File: 329 KB, 501x600, 37055582_m.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11423271 here is her friend python-tan

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:44:59 2013 No.11423408 Please learn how to properly save images from pixiv.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:52:44 2013 No.11423422 what's up with all those shitty languages. what's next, php-tan? disgusting

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 16 23:56:02 2013 No.11423433 >>11423422 gscript

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 17 00:43:28 2013 No.11423512 Where is C?

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 17 00:45:29 2013 No.11423519 >>11423403 Python is fucked up, dude. Far out, fucked up.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 17 00:49:29 2013 No.11423524 >no Coq top plebeian

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 17 01:04:44 2013 No.11423544 I bet java-tan is fat and stupid and gross

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 17 01:15:29 2013 No.11423552 >>11423544 wow, this is the second result for ``java'' on pixiv: http://www.pixiv.net/member_illust.php?mode=big&illust_id=38540584

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 17 01:16:44 2013 No.11423554 File: 197 KB, 600x770, 31976235.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11423361

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 17 01:17:44 2013 No.11423558 >>11423554 oops didn't mean to quote

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 17 02:02:07 2013 No.11423639 ocaml-tan please

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 17 02:27:22 2013 No.11423673 >tfw no tcl-tan

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 11:16:53 2013 No.11432778 >>11423271 You know that Ruby was invented in Japan, right? Just checking. And I want to see Obj-C Chan. The language is so verbose, she should be a cute little twin-tail that never shuts up.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 11:17:40 2013 No.11432783 >>11432778 >You know that Ruby was invented in Japan, right? Just checking. By a Mormon. That makes it practically American. #USA

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 11:33:27 2013 No.11432835 File: 22 KB, 434x449, gordon-the-gopher.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Go-tan when?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 11:36:44 2013 No.11432848 Two words: the forced indentation of code. ^v^

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 11:40:12 2013 No.11432859 >>11423345 but Python was named after the Monty Pythons, not the snake!

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:16:05 2013 No.11433094

I hate how most of the OS-tans and programming language-tans are only designed around their product's visual theme, and not their technical characteristics or the characteristics of their userbases. It'd be like making a "/jp/-tan" and have her be a random girl wearing a burichan-colored outfit. I get that there isn't much overlap between good artists and good programmers, but is it really that hard to find a programming board and ask for their opinion?

>>11423271
Ruby-tan should be a fat, asthmatic geek that's really "popular" with foreign guys.

>>11423403
Python-tan should be a yandere with a split personality disorder.

>>11423284
VB6-tan should be an aging prostitute.

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:22:04 2013 No.11433112
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>>11433094
The problem is that then you're delving into fan fiction territory, rather than simply designing a character. There's some English-language OS-tan wiki where everyone makes shit up. "Windows 98-tan always crashes into things, unlike her sister Windows 98 SE-tan!" Okay that's great, we appreciate your input, bleachfanx96.

You can convey that kind of stuff visually, but I think most artists are just focused on the character's appearance. Though there are plenty of comics featuring the Windows-tans acting appropriately for the operating systems they represent.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:28:05 2013 No.11433125 Is there a c#-tan? I've been developing .NET applications recently

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:28:50 2013 No.11433124 File: 84 KB, 900x882, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Poor Perl-tan. Maybe someday, someone will make you a proper -tan.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:33:06 2013 No.11433130 I want to see Objective-C get gang raped. I hate her just for her name. I hate all C languages, but that one even more.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:34:07 2013 No.11433131 File: 24 KB, 640x360, abelson_stole_the_precious_course.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Sussman-chan is the kawaiiest!

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:36:52 2013 No.11433137 >>11433130 >I hate all C languages What?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:38:08 2013 No.11433143 >>11433137 He means "except C", Anon. Don't you listen to him.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:39:08 2013 No.11433145 >Coq >ocaml >programming thread get 40 replies in 20 minutes. What's the connection between CS and Otaku Culture.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:40:08 2013 No.11433149 File: 317 KB, 800x900, 929834.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] I want a LOGO-tan who is a turtle.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:40:08 2013 No.11433151 >>11433143 But C++ and C# is also decent.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:41:24 2013 No.11433152 >>11433145 /prog/ and /jp/ are OTP.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:41:37 2013 No.11433153 File: 324 KB, 768x960, 1378496803780.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11423361

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:42:22 2013 No.11433156 >>11433151 Now you're just yanking my chain. Being taught "object oriented programming is the best!" in schools is the biggest corporate lie since teachers told kids the Nazis gassed millions of Jews for no reason.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:43:23 2013 No.11433157 >>11433143 Every language in the C family. C is only good as a building block for other languages.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:43:23 2013 No.11433158 File: 1.80 MB, 1200x1600, 1379115308506.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11433145 Autism

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:43:36 2013 No.11433159 >>11433145 I dropped out of CS to become a NEET. I can't be the only one.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:44:21 2013 No.11433161 >>11433156 There's nothing wrong with OO languages, they're a powerful and useful tool and extremely useful in the real world. Of course it's not the best for everything but it definitely has it's place.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:44:38 2013 No.11433162 >>11433159 Me too!

>>	sage Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:45:23 2013 No.11433164 >>11433159 So did I. Well, except I re-enrolled one year after that and got my degree a few years later.

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:51:37 2013 No.11433182

>>11433161
We've been able to implement "real world objects" in data structures for years. Teachers never say that. "You want a human? Have a Human class! Want a banker? Have a Banker class that inherits from the Human class!"
Whoa so revolutionary, we were never able to do that before OO came along.

Furthermore, even OO proponents agree this shit is retarded. There are way too many narrow analogies between objects in programming and real-life objects, when it's not really about that at all.

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:53:37 2013 No.11433190

>>11433182
>We've been able to implement "real world objects" in data structures for years
Right, but that was never my argument. OO allows programmers to do things more easily and faster since it's more abstract. And that's extremely useful when developing in the real world.
Sure it can be less efficient sometimes, but often times those differences are trivial.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:54:38 2013 No.11433195 fuck manual memory management

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:57:38 2013 No.11433206

>>11433190
>OO allows programmers to do things more easily and faster since it's more abstract.

Right, enjoy having to write "getters and setters" for everything instead of just accessing member variables directly, and protecting code from yourself with encapsulation (????). Oh, and writing functions to create objects and even classes, instead of just creating objects. That's always fun.

sage Anonymous Thu Sep 19 13:59:53 2013 No.11433211

>>11433206
Enjoy accessing everything directly and then realizing one day that you want to reset another variable any time one variable is changed. I can already see your troubled face. OO and encapsulation has its place, just like other variants that make more sense in other situations.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:00:36 2013 No.11433214 PYTHON A SHIT A ASHIIIIIIIIIIT

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:03:22 2013 No.11433219

>>11433211
>then realizing one day that you want to reset another variable any time one variable is changed.

Which I can do directly? I don't get your point. C variables have local scope. I can work on a temporary copy of a variable or get a pointer directly to it if I want.

If you mean actually changing the source code easily, I can easily do a replace in vim. This falls into the text editor domain, not the program execution domain.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:04:51 2013 No.11433221 >>11433206 The abstraction of OO has it's pros and cons. And so does procedural languages. That doesn't some how make them pointless. You can keep circle jerking with your internet autists about how OO is retarded though.

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:05:53 2013 No.11433223

>>11433156
/pol/ in /pol/.

>>11433182
>We've been able to implement "real world objects" in data structures for years.

Yeah well, that's, you know, what objects in OO are. Data structures.

You're mixing up design paradigm with implementation. That's stupid.

>>11433206
>having to write

You do not have to do anything. You can choose to do that when you think it will be beneficial. Sometimes, it is.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:06:37 2013 No.11433226 I'd like to see Haskell-tan.

sage Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:10:23 2013 No.11433239

>>11433219
Alright, so you have a struct { int i; }. Now, your program is already finished and you change this struct into { int i; int j; } for whatever reason, j always being the time of the date i was changed. Now, you go ahead and sift through million lines of your code to find places where i was changed, and add another line that modifies j as well. And yeah, have fun doing this with your editor, you'll still edit every single line where i was changed.

Whereas I, with my object, change one line, namely in my method set_i to automatically modify j as well, and I'm done.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:12:38 2013 No.11433250 File: 18 KB, 315x350, 3620141422_consuela_answer_3_xlarge.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11423512

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:14:07 2013 No.11433254 >>11433239 I can search by regular expressions. This isn't a problem. My text editor should be the one handling this, not extra cruft in the language (and redundant functions I'm adding myself).

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:15:07 2013 No.11433260 >>11433182 >"You want a human? Have a Human class! Want a banker? Have a Banker class that inherits from the Human class!" You're missing the point of OOP. Do you even program?

>>	sage Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:16:38 2013 No.11433264 >>11433254 I'm beginning to doubt that you have experience with anything longer than 100 lines. Or maybe you're simply trying to troll me, in which case you would've almost succeeded.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:17:37 2013 No.11433270 >>11433264 I vote we abolish macros because judicious use of the text editor can replace them.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:17:52 2013 No.11433271 >>11433264 He's definitely just an internet autist that's never actually programmed before.

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:21:22 2013 No.11433282

>>11433254
>>11433239
>>11433223
>>11433219

This isn't a OOP-vs-non-OOP thing.

And if you're programming to implementations rather than interfaces you're going to have a pretty fucking fragile and brittle codebase. It's just good general software engineering. That doesn't mean that everything has to be to a interface obviously, since at the local level you're going to have to be dealing with implementation.

>but muh expensive function calls!
Most good compilers can optimize a lot of these out.

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:27:07 2013 No.11433310

>>11433137
>>11433143
A lot of people hear someone say "I hate C" and think they really mean "waaah low level programming is hard, I wanna be safe in Ruby/Python/Javascript's arms." I love low level programming. I hate C for the same reason that I hate JavaScript and the web in genreal: it's nowhere close to the ideal language for its niche (tiny, simple, very low-level programming language), yet it won its language war decades ago and now we're stuck with it and all of its warts for all eternity.

The Pascal/Modula/Oberon family of languages, for example are all roughly as powerful as C while being orders of magnitude less complex to parse. Type declarations in Pascal languages read left to right, whereas C's type declarations quite literally read in a spiral. It's almost impossible not to fuck up function pointer syntax in C without liberal use of typedef.

The worse parts of C are where the language was clearly lacking some key feature in its original design, and we have to live with a hack someone cobbled together 30+ years ago. C needed a module system so that code could call code written in other files, use binary interfaces, etc. Instead of having a proper module and scope system (like Modula-2, or much later, Go), we have an ad-hoc module system in the form of header files and a fat linker. C needed some kind of basic metaprogramming system. Instead of actually implementing a subset of the language suitable for metaprogramming (or even just jamming a Lisp interpreter somewhere), we have an ad-hoc metaprogramming system in the form of a dumb textual preprocessor with a completely different syntax from the rest of the language.

>>11433239
You can program with getters and setters in C just as easily as you can in C++. The only difference is set_thing_i(&thing, 10); vs. thing.set_i(10); It's a little ugly, but it's such a fucking asinine problem to make a language feature out of.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:27:52 2013 No.11433309 >>11433264 He doesn't even have any experience with regular expressions, otherwise he'd be aware they can't do what he wants to do with them.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:31:36 2013 No.11433321 >>11433310 >C >low level Troll post detected. C is a high-level programming language.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:34:52 2013 No.11433325 >>11433321 So is BASIC and Java...

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:35:36 2013 No.11433329 >>11433310 I really like how people make opaque objects use getters and setters along with them.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:36:22 2013 No.11433332 >>11433321 Nobody codes in assembly anymore besides people in embedded systems or who really, really need that 3% efficiency boost. C is as low-level as most programmers will substantially work with.

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:41:06 2013 No.11433341

>>11433321
wow ebin u troled me
I've written programs in 6502 assembly language. C is pretty well abstracted from that, but it's a lot closer to it than it is to JavaShit or Python. You have complete control of memory layout, you can deal directly with addresses, you can stick tags in your pointers if you want, you have compiler intrinsics that map directly to machine opcodes, you can link against assembly language you wrote yourself, etc.

If you're going to argue that that does not constitute low-level programming, you might as say that the only low level programming languages are primitive non-macro assemblers.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:54:26 2013 No.11433356 Why do people study CS when EE is much better for programming?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:54:56 2013 No.11433359 >>11433356 because now that your computer is ten million times faster than it was four years ago nobody cares about efficiency anymore

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 14:57:10 2013 No.11433366 >>11433359 This is true. Better hardware == slower programs.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 15:01:11 2013 No.11433382 >>11433359 but at least it isn't useless

>>	sage Anonymous Thu Sep 19 15:03:25 2013 No.11433385 >>11433310 >You can program with getters and setters in C I know. But the poster above insisted on manipulating everything "directly".

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 15:15:12 2013 No.11433413 >>11433359 >>11433366 This is upsetting.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 15:31:13 2013 No.11433429 >>11433413 The best part is you can get away with it too.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 15:33:59 2013 No.11433431 >>11433429 I've seen many people not only count it as acceptable but defend it as well. >we don't live in the 80's anymore, get a real computer

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 15:37:44 2013 No.11433438

>>11433359
>>11433366
People will only put the effort in if by making a faster program, you can make a fundamentally different program.

Going back to the dawn of home computers, you needed to optimize the shit out of a word processor just to make it usable. Nowadays, your first attempts would probably be fast enough anyway, so why bother? Better to focus on eliminating bugs and adding features.

Modern video games are all just prettier versions of games made decades ago, so it's safe to say that if the simulation can run on a Pentium 4, it's fast enough. Why bother optimizing when you can use a slower but more malleable language like Lua and significantly increase your team's productivity? Only complex simulations like Dwarf Fortress really benefit from increased CPU performance, and those are a small niche anyway.

Meanwhile, the state of the art is constantly being pushed in computer graphics. It makes sense to spend a lot of time optimizing your shaders and tweaking your scenes, because you can make fundamentally different looking graphics by doing so.

All other things considered I'd like more optimized programs, but I'd rather the optimization geniuses spend their time on graphics or tools that everyone can benefit from, than have them waste their time greasing a text editor.

>>	sage Anonymous Thu Sep 19 15:57:45 2013 No.11433484 /jp/ programming threads are the best~

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 16:50:19 2013 No.11433620

Does anyone here actually program for a living? (EET scum filthy normal etc.)

It seems like a lot of these arguments don't really matter when you're dealing with production level systems. Just learn the shit that's there and the most you might be able to do is minor tweaks where these language arguments don't even matter.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 16:54:50 2013 No.11433631 >>11433620 I'm a developer for Apple.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:00:04 2013 No.11433646 >>11433359 i bought 50 acres of land, better fill them with horse shit!

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:03:19 2013 No.11433651 File: 292 KB, 800x506, mimi.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] who /frog/ here

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:04:19 2013 No.11433653 >>11433651 Who /toad/?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:07:34 2013 No.11433665 >>11433653 By the snakes, I assume he means /prog/

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:12:05 2013 No.11433689 >tfw you're too stupid to program

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:14:34 2013 No.11433694 >>11433689 You're also too stupid to use the quote feature properly.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:15:18 2013 No.11433696 >>11433694 I'm quoting my thoughts.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:15:49 2013 No.11433699 >>11433696 Where was that posted?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:16:50 2013 No.11433700 >>11433699 Nowhere

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:16:50 2013 No.11433701 >>11433646 A better analogy is that since you have 50 acres of land you shouldn't care if a pack of wild horses comes through and shit all over everything

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:18:04 2013 No.11433705 >>11433700 Then who were you quoting?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 17:19:49 2013 No.11433709 >>11433705 My thoughts. I apologize if I upset you.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 18:28:23 2013 No.11433853 >>11433631 Then defend Obj-C, you bastard!

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 18:55:26 2013 No.11433888 Python seems to be a great programming language. Anything wrong with it?

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 18:56:56 2013 No.11433889

The most powerful programming language is Lisp. If you don't know Lisp (or its variant, Scheme), you don't know what it means for a programming language to be powerful and elegant. Once you learn Lisp, you will understand what is lacking in most other languages.

When you start a Lisp system, it enters a read-eval-print loop. Most other languages have nothing comparable to read, nothing comparable to eval, and nothing comparable to print. What gaping deficiencies!

Lisp is no harder to understand than other languages. So if you have never learned to program, and you want to start, start with Lisp. If you learn to edit with Emacs, you can learn Lisp by writing editing commands for Emacs. You can use the Introduction to Programming in Emacs Lisp to learn with: it is free as in freedom, and you can order printed copies from the FSF.

To study Scheme, and a deep understanding of program structures using Scheme as a vehicle, I recommend Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs, by Abelson and Sussman. This too is now free as in freedom.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:09:15 2013 No.11433915 >>11433889 I see a lot of posts about Lisp and assume they're joking. Is it actually worth learning something like Scheme or even something different like Haskell? What are some good reasons to.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:10:28 2013 No.11433916 vomitchan.jpg

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:12:44 2013 No.11433919 File: 211 KB, 640x640, sachi.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] if she aint the best ill eat my hat

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:22:44 2013 No.11433949 >not learning assembler

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:23:44 2013 No.11433950 >>11433949 Not using the quote function properly.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:24:45 2013 No.11433951 >>11433915 Please use a question mark when asking a question. Thanks.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:24:58 2013 No.11433952 >>11433888 Its not as good as Ruby, but I would learn Python first.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:26:27 2013 No.11433953 >>11433951 I made a mistake, sorry?

>>	Serkit !eSpvUDpflw Thu Sep 19 19:27:57 2013 No.11433956 I had an exam on MIPS assembly today

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:28:29 2013 No.11433958 >>11433956 Nice blog, normie.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:29:14 2013 No.11433960 >>11433153 sweeness thank you

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:30:59 2013 No.11433967 >>11433310 >>11433332 >>11433341 >language where you can write int x=2; >low-level

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:32:14 2013 No.11433972
File: 211 KB, 783x643, 1374884522831.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>11433915
Learning about lamdda functions, purity, homoiconicy and algebraic datatypes will change how you program forever. I will wonder how you even managed to write programs without that.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:33:31 2013 No.11433978 >>11433967 C is low level. It's like saying JavaScript or HTML are high level.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:34:58 2013 No.11433979 >>11433972 Could you point me towards some reading material? Is SICP actually something to read or just mostly a joke? I only know C and python currently and have been interested in looking into functional programming.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:36:31 2013 No.11433984 >>11433979 Why would I be joking

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:36:45 2013 No.11433986 >>11433979 SICP is used by Carnegie Mellon and MIT. What do you think?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:37:14 2013 No.11433993 >>11433984 >>11433986 I'm not sure, that's why I'm asking.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:39:15 2013 No.11433997 >>11433986 I don't think CMU uses SICP anymore.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:40:45 2013 No.11434005 >>11433978 C is high level.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:42:59 2013 No.11434012 >>11434005 So is basic.

Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:42:59 2013 No.11434013
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>>11433979
SICP is not a programming book. It's about CS and information theory. Exactly the stuff you do in the 1st and 2nd semesters CS. You will learn Scheme and C along the way but alway use them to implement the concepts and algorithms the book taught you before. So, if you aren't interested in that (and don't have the 1 year Calculus requirement) I recommend against it. Try Little Schemer, Learn You A Haskell or Land of LISP.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:43:14 2013 No.11434016 >>11433997 They did like five years ago.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:44:00 2013 No.11434019 >>11434016 They rebuilt the entire CS curriculum a few years ago. The end of an era.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:45:28 2013 No.11434020 >>11434013 Thank you for the recommendations. I will certainly look into reading them all. I really appreciate it.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:51:28 2013 No.11434040 File: 33 KB, 512x512, 1374438494161.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11434019 Also MIT teaches Python in 6.001 now.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 19:53:44 2013 No.11434050 >>11434040 IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 20:22:47 2013 No.11434141 HtDP

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 20:55:48 2013 No.11434237 >>11434141 The creator of the fucking language uses a Mac and complains about SICP.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:09:02 2013 No.11434282 >>11434237 And?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:11:47 2013 No.11434290 >>11434282 Why do you hate freedom?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:15:19 2013 No.11434300 >>11434005 No, it's not. It's relatively low level.

>>	sah-gay Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:21:18 2013 No.11434320 >>11434300 your mom is pretty low level

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:35:07 2013 No.11434363 File: 31 KB, 530x564, sheeeeeeeeeeeit.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11434320

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:40:22 2013 No.11434376 >>11434300 It's the second result when you google "low level programming".

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:43:24 2013 No.11434381 >>11434300 It's a high level programming language. Idiot programming languages for children don't change that fact.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:44:24 2013 No.11434383 >>11434381 It's a skeleton language.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:45:07 2013 No.11434388 >>11434383 Well maybe some people could say the same about you.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:46:39 2013 No.11434394 >>11434388 That doesn't make sense. I'm a physical being, not a written language.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:47:22 2013 No.11434395 >>11434388 >>11434320 /jp/ at its finest

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 21:59:10 2013 No.11434431 >>11434394 Is that what you're mom told you?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 22:03:27 2013 No.11434436 SICP is not a joke. I'm deeply offended by that.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 22:07:25 2013 No.11434451 >>11434019 >>11434040 Really sad. Python isn't even an especially elegant or insightful language.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 22:08:40 2013 No.11434456 >>11434451 Python is a Getting Shit Done(TM) language.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 22:10:24 2013 No.11434460 >>11434456 Not any more. It's still a good language, but its spawn a lot more, more useful languages.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 22:11:55 2013 No.11434462 >>11434460 Like what? The strength of Python is its fuckton of modules. Perl used to fill this role but CPAN is horribly outdated.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 22:41:55 2013 No.11434536 >>11423554 Who is this tall and refined young lady?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 22:48:13 2013 No.11434550 I had a professor that described C as a high level assembly language.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 23:00:12 2013 No.11434571 >>11434550 Something wrong with that nerd?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 23:01:59 2013 No.11434576 >>11434571 no what do you guys think about that statement?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 23:05:44 2013 No.11434583 >>11434576 It's accurate.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 23:10:43 2013 No.11434592 >>11433359 But CS is more relevant to that. Improvements in algorithms are much more important than raw constant multiple improvements when working with non-trivial input sizes.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 19 23:15:13 2013 No.11434603 >>11434592 The only consumer-grade products that push computational limits is graphics. Sure, if we were working for Google and had to process ten billion whatevers, then it'd be important, but none of our pet projects need that kind of shit.

Anonymous Fri Sep 20 01:33:48 2013 No.11434916
File: 600 KB, 621x395, please teach your daughter about the dangers of traffic.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>11434603

I make games that simulate large cities full of little girls. Using naive algorithms and data structures for things such as collision detection is prohibitively slow. Graphics isn't the only slow thing in games. There's also physics and other things, too. It depends on the kind of game.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 20 04:22:34 2013 No.11435173 File: 235 KB, 1280x1280, 1370651373456.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Should I start learning with SICP or Learning Pythong the Hard Way?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 20 04:36:19 2013 No.11435185 >>11435173 SICP.

>>	sage Anonymous Fri Sep 20 04:53:35 2013 No.11435197 >>11435173 You will never go anywhere with Python. SICP and Lisp are the way of the future.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 20 04:54:04 2013 No.11435199 >>11435173 SICP is a meme.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 20 04:58:21 2013 No.11435203 >>11435173 SICP.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 20 08:49:48 2013 No.11435440 >>11423554 The joke is that Sepples tries to jam in every fucking feature in her loose stinky slimy pussy. And all other languages try to compete against or follow her. What a fucking slut.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 21 00:47:30 2013 No.11438498 >>11435173 I learned using this. It's free and has deadlines which will give you an incentive to actually do things instead of just putting it off. https://www.edx.org/course/mit/6-00-1x/introduction-computer-science/1122

Anonymous Sat Sep 21 01:06:15 2013 No.11438555

>>11433853
Sure. It's a functional language that does what it was meant to do. Abstract C into an object oriented design and determine all typing at run time while being a strict super set so you can switch back to C when performance is needed (OpenGL code really)

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 21 01:16:29 2013 No.11438587 >>11433620 Does it count if I'm getting paid for getting a CS PhD? No, it doesn't, I should have gotten a real job. Oh well.

Anonymous Sat Sep 21 01:46:20 2013 No.11438682

>>11433889
I don't know shit about programming nor computer science, but just for the sake of it I went and read a bit of SICP and it's damn powerful, the way they describe processes and how complex processes are made of simplet processes that are really black boxes...that's really damn powerful, it's no understatement to say that the rise of personal computing has tremendously shaped our lives and even our brains and SICP shows you how. If you understand SICP, you understand how the world works. I'm not fucking kidding, the medium is the message. Also look for The Elements of Computer System to be a little more in touch with how a computer is made from the logical gates all the way to the OS

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 23 00:53:36 2013 No.11445331 >>11438587 What's your research area? Are you more on the theoretical or the applied side of CS?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 23 01:34:05 2013 No.11445416 File: 329 KB, 499x1200, 38472363.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] I have been very curious about functional programming for a while now so I think I will try Haskell

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 23 02:44:12 2013 No.11445602 File: 180 KB, 600x600, 1379752795335.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] I wish I could have a QT3.14 programmer waifu that specializes in low level languages like C and ASM x86-32/64. She could teach me while rubbing my back.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 23 02:47:59 2013 No.11445608 File: 428 KB, 1280x1707, 1378984710737.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11433979 It's not a joke, it's the most useful CS book that you'd ever read.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 23 03:46:18 2013 No.11445677 File: 855 KB, 640x360, 1367267614500.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11438498 >Prerequisites: High school algebra and a reasonable aptitude for mathematics.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 23 04:13:21 2013 No.11445709 >>11445677 Don't let it get ya down, son. 90% of programming doesn't require math skill, and when you do need math you can just look up a formula via the net.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 23 04:39:36 2013 No.11445739 >>11433620 No programmer you will ever meet irl will admit it, but that's about right.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 23 04:41:23 2013 No.11445742 >>11445677 Make no mistake, by 'reasonable', they only mean to say, you know how to add, subtract and multiply - divide would even be a plus.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 23 05:22:10 2013 No.11445790 File: 635 KB, 846x1200, 49b607b226474e86af573ff34c90893f.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >program langauges >nobody posted LISP-tan and you guys seemed such honest men.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 23 05:30:56 2013 No.11445801 File: 145 KB, 1224x969, wu-tan.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Mon Sep 23 05:32:56 2013 No.11445806

>>11445742
>>11445709
>>11445677

It's more about your ability to into logic than your ability to do arithmetic / any math you did in highschool.

If you can into logic you should be fine. When you need to do any uni/highschool maths is entirely dependant on what you're programming. If you need some graph theory algorithms, then knowing some stuff about graph theory/discrete is a plus. If you're writing a physics engine then linear algebra+calc+trig is something you should know. etc, etc.

Most imperative programming languages are just series of logical statements with logical conditionals controlling the flow between statements.

The only way to know if you'll be good at it is to program.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 23 14:45:08 2013 No.11446917 >>11423330 shame the newer versions suck staying with 12 for the time beeing

Anonymous Mon Sep 23 21:08:06 2013 No.11447911

>>11445806
I don't think all hope is lost if you lack the sufficient amount of logic. Sure you have a major disadvantage yet the common belief that brains cannot change over time is ridiculous! Brain plasticity is a well known theory, people can change over time unless you're severely disabled.

Anonymous Mon Sep 23 21:31:36 2013 No.11447956

>>11447911
The only reason I program is because I'm good at it. I can't imagine trying to do this shit otherwise. Maybe you could, but why? Why not find what you're good at and do that? I can't believe there's nothing you're good at - everyone's good at something right?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 01:30:51 2013 No.11455534 he

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 01:33:06 2013 No.11455541 Why is the easiest language to learn? I want something to do other than masturbate and browse /jp/.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 01:36:37 2013 No.11455547 >>11455541 assembly

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 01:38:52 2013 No.11455553 >>11455547 This. Now time for the thread to jr $31

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 08:26:31 2013 No.11456186 >>11455541 depends on how motivated you are and what other languages you already know. For example it's easier to learn German if you already know Dutch.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 10:45:24 2013 No.11456413 Programming languages are just like Japanese language: You can't learn it.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 11:05:28 2013 No.11456444 >>11456413 Of course you can.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 11:56:30 2013 No.11456511 >>11455553 Is this one of these legendary "jump right" instructions that actually physically move your PC by a few centimeters when being executed?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 12:05:46 2013 No.11456526 >>11456511 It's the "jump register" instruction, with the register $31 which is (partially by convention, partially for technical reasons) the register containing the return address. The ISA in question is MIPS.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 16:05:44 2013 No.11457055 >>11433145 to be a nerd (and in extension otaku) is mandatory in CS.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 16:08:44 2013 No.11457062 >>11456413 I'm am learning both. What is your excuse, anon?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 16:09:59 2013 No.11457070 >>11457062 I can't afford Adderall

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 16:26:46 2013 No.11457128 >>11456526 What's this in non-nerd speak?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 16:35:31 2013 No.11457156 >>11457128 "jr $31" means "return".

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 17:14:18 2013 No.11457244 >>11457156 Then >>11455553 makes absolutely zero sense.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 18:03:23 2013 No.11457394 >>11457244 You are quite right.

Anonymous Thu Sep 26 19:24:42 2013 No.11457612

>>11457244
I am not either of those people, but you don't need to know assembly at all to know that the when the main function of a program "returns" it means the program ends.

In low level languages like C or assembly there is not "quit" function, you just "return" and that ends the program.

So "time for this thread to return"
>>11455553
is like saying "time for this thread to end"

Anonymous Thu Sep 26 19:33:29 2013 No.11457633

>>11457612
> In low level languages like C or assembly there is not "quit" function, you just "return" and that ends the program.
Actually, C has a function named "exit" which does just that.

> ISO/IEC 9899:1999 5.1.2.2.3 1
>
> If the return type of the main function is a type compatible with int, a return from the
> initial call to the main function is equivalent to calling the exit function with the value
> returned by the main function as its argument;10) reaching the } that terminates the
> main function returns a value of 0. If the return type is not compatible with int, the
> termination status returned to the host environment is unspecified.

Also see ISO/IEC 9899:1999 7.20.4.3: "The exit function"

(Based off of "Committee Draft — Septermber 7, 2007" because ISO is jew.)

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 19:34:59 2013 No.11457638 >>11457612 Implying C is a low level language. Implying returning (even from main) ``ends the program''. Nigger, did you even read the specification?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 19:36:44 2013 No.11457645 >>11457633 >ISO/IEC 9899:1999 C99 is obsolete. Please renew your ISO subscription and upgrade to C11.

Anonymous Thu Sep 26 19:39:45 2013 No.11457650

>>11457638
lol what even is this?
* C is low level
* calling return _does_ end the program
Who cares if it's not instant, it sets in motion the sequence of events which lead directly to the program ending, in almost any program language.
and from a symbolic standpoint, calling return from the main function is essentially the same thing as ending the program.

Anonymous Thu Sep 26 19:56:59 2013 No.11457706

>>11457650
The return statement is just a specialized jump statement. That's like saying goto causes pigs to fly because that's what it does in *your* program. A return statement just terminates execution of the current function and returns control to its caller. You can end a program without a return statement, and you can use a return statement without ending a program.

C is not a low-level programming language, it's a high-level programming language and always has been (though it does have some features more reminiscent of a low-level programming language). Stop reading Wikipedia and start reading (reputable) textbooks.

Anonymous Thu Sep 26 20:03:30 2013 No.11457725

>>11457706
So what, if using that jump statement in a particular way causes the program to end, then that's what it does.... it ends the program. I don't see how you can argue that.

As far as the low-level-high-level argument, how can that even be considered a fact. Whether something is low level isn't written in stone, and I think it's retarded we are even arguing over it since I used it in a very off handed way in the first place that doesn't change anything even if it's not.

Anonymous Thu Sep 26 21:47:38 2013 No.11458070

>>11457612
> assembly there is not "quit" function, you just "return" and that ends the program.

I have no idea how assembly programs on other architectures end, but on x86 it is through interrupts, since the return instruction would cause the program to jump to whatever adress is stored at the top of the stack which may or may not be the address of the exit system call. On linux ret instruction at the end of execution hands out a segmantation fault and Windows probably does something similar.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 22:34:31 2013 No.11458189 >>11457612 >In low level languages like C nice one, C is high level

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 23:22:49 2013 No.11458320 File: 1.40 MB, 2786x1480, 1379831862888.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] T-Dawg here. Anyone who doesn't understand every part of this flowchart needs to get the F out. Now.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 26 23:45:34 2013 No.11458420 >>11458320 how do I read flowcharts?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 00:14:37 2013 No.11458565 >>11458420 follow the arrows that lead to Hadouken.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 00:26:55 2013 No.11458637 >>11458320 But what if I'm here to learn?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 00:31:54 2013 No.11458670 >>11458565 Fighting games are not about flow charts

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 06:23:15 2013 No.11459623 >>11458637 >I This thread isn't about you, buddy.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 07:14:04 2013 No.11459693 >>11459623 I'm sorry, I didn't mean it like that. Please forgive me.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 07:49:19 2013 No.11459779 File: 65 KB, 1280x720, 1376845285185.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11459693 Get. Out.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 08:46:34 2013 No.11459883 >>11459779 A-Alright, I'm sorry.

Anonymous Fri Sep 27 11:13:34 2013 No.11460115

>>11458565

ive got it, you know what would be good for revitalizing cs? by holding ai competitions using competitive games.

ASSFAGGOTS like LoL are pretty big right now, so that can be an easy starting point. you can even have different 'weight classes' in terms of different machine benchmarks.

Anonymous Fri Sep 27 11:35:37 2013 No.11460165

>>11460115
Building an AI on a closed-source system is nearly impossible, because there is no way to get the information from the game that the AI would desperately need to make decisions. For example, how many resources do I have? Do you want to analyze screencaps?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 11:56:20 2013 No.11460205 File: 51 KB, 282x443, 1372148248146.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11460115 *DON'T* reply to me, FREAK.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 11:57:35 2013 No.11460208 I don't know even basis of math. May I be good programmer?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 12:05:37 2013 No.11460222 >>11460208 Yes. Heavy math is only required in maybe 5% or less real world applications. I have been a programmer for almost ten years, and I only used math more difficult than add/subtract/multiply/divide once or twice.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 12:19:09 2013 No.11460243 >>11460208 coding only needs mathematical insight.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 12:20:39 2013 No.11460245 >>11460165 im not sure what you mean by closed source, of course they would be connected to the game? how else would they play. you can download bots to play games for you already.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 12:25:26 2013 No.11460258 File: 34 KB, 500x500, I AM THE LAW.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11460205 you cant tell me what to do.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 13:10:39 2013 No.11460363 File: 107 KB, 1061x720, 1374632161863.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11460258

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 16:28:32 2013 No.11460834 File: 76 KB, 500x500, but thats against the ruurs.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11460363 the shame of society is not my shame, as i follow a higher calling. what i find shameful, others will soon follow. I am the decider.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 17:05:00 2013 No.11460950 File: 108 KB, 360x318, 1379347055533.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11460834

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 27 17:14:46 2013 No.11460974 File: 1.09 MB, 693x800, BE NOT AFRAID DESU.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11460950 NO ALLEGIANCE, I WILL SWEAR NO OATH. CROWNED BY GOD NOT BY THE CHURCH AS MY POWER IS DIVINE.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 28 10:42:37 2013 No.11463683 >>11434536 please respond

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 28 11:03:53 2013 No.11463736 >>11460974 I am listening to that song right now

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 28 11:23:37 2013 No.11463779 >>11463683 Look at her stockings.

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/jp/ - Otaku Culture