/jp/ - Otaku Culture

I never hated it...

I like Lambdadelta cos she is like Takano and some kind of cool. She have cool ribbons also.

Certainly not.

No, I just dislike the ending and hope the promised Rei will eventually be delivered and ease the pain a little.

Shkannontrice is probably too woven into the story to undo though.

i liked it because of zepar

>>8689325
best 2hu!

i would have liked to have a more drawn out Trick Ending. If you choose magic as the ending you get a ton of more story. The trick ending might as well just have been a screen that said bad end.

>>8689357

Trick end was one of the best scenes though.

>>8689342
Damn, he hides his dick well

>>8689376
zepar's tucking is a miracle of the universe

I like umineko's meta world. The attempts at having some real world story as well was not really working out.

At least he left the story open to have everyone alive, but with amnesia, if he ever feels like making a happy end.

Not really. I actually loved the ending; unlike the majority of ep 8 it was done pretty gracefully and Ricordando il passato is one fucking hell of a song.

no i still love it, the only shitty ep was the first half of 4 and pretty much of all 7 except for the tea party

http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=109298

this is really good if you are an umineko fan, ep 1 and 2 capture what you love about umineko so well

Don't understand why people didn't like the end.

Ryukishi07 said pretty early on that there would be no happy ending. Although I was still bummed at it I definitely didn't hate it.

>>8689858
It was a happy ending, but without love, it cannot be seen.

>>8689864
i call bullshit. i don't have any love but i still saw it.

I don't hate it, the first half was great and Chiru had its moments too.

>>8689874
That depends on how you define love. If you saw it, then you do have love, however little it may be.

>>8689864

I would call it a bittersweet ending. By writing standards maybe it can be called a happy end but my personal feelings define happy as fuck the plot everyone lives.

For those of you who haven't reached the "real answer" yet,
you should probably read this article here some day:

http://seizonsha.wordpress.com/2011/06/13/%E6%9C%80%E7%B5%82%E8%80%83%E5%AF%9F%E3%80%80%E3%81%86%E3%
81%BF%E3%81%AD%E3%81%93%E3%81%AE%E3%81%AA%E3%81%8F%E9%A0%83%E3%81%AB-answer-to-the-golden-witch-spec
ial-discussion/

Although I read it all, I still haven't found the "true answer"
(Well I am to lazy to read all of Umineko again to be honest,so I guess it's to be expected)

What did you think about Bernkastel's game.
I think it was one of the highlights of the EP8

>>8690092
I wouldn't mind R07 releasing a few more of those as some free DLC. I really enjoyed solving that.

Fuck they could even make it a browser game.

>>8690048
>R07: If I should still be writing in ten years or more, I might go and rewrite Umineko all over again.

Oh man. I'd read it, but shit, man, just think of the the backlash.

>>8690116

I typed out that entire game, color coded the words properly, rules, reds, typed my own brief summary of the characters and setting etc and give it to my friends and family to solve. Honestly it's a great little mystery with no noise and just pure solving fun.

>>8690048

Oh the link got screwed up

here's a better link

http://seizonsha.wordpress.com/2011/06/13/

>>8690116

see:

>Ryu07: Haha, maybe I wouldn’t go that far with it. There was a reason to Bern’s Trial that is correct. To have fun and enjoying so many grotesque things. Though it was a digression, the trial was fun, right? If it was to your liking, maybe I should create something different, based on the same rules. Something like „Furudo Erika’s Case Files“.

>>8690221
Couldn't you have just made a save file right before it started? I admire the effort but jesus there must have been an easier way.

>Furudo Erika’s Case Files

>>8690254

Not everyone plays the game or is a fan of anime related things.

I edited it out honorifics and such it make it less "weeaboo" but there really isn't much to it. It's surprisingly short and all together is only about 6 pages, with a ton spaces in between.

>>8690271
So you made into into your own little Agatha Christie-style closed room mystery story for people to solve? I can respect that.

Why does everyone hate Erika?

>>8690329
They're just jealous.

>>8690329
Who the fuck hates Erika? The only thing I hated was that R07 was too lazy to draw a pirate hat and eye patch sprite for her during that scene in EP 8.

>>8690329

I dunno but I think she's one of the most interesting characters in the Umineko franchise.
There isn't any character similar to her in any other VN / Anime / Manga, is there?

>>8690352

People are afraid of originality. She is the perfect deconstruction of the "young amateur detective"

>>8690346

An anime forum I went on to read up on eps 5-8, she's pretty much universally hated with vitriol. Best reasons I can guess without having played 5-8 is that she's the one who made Beatrice go comatose (I think) and just her general know-it-all attitude.

>>8690361
Not even. Battler, in all of his incompetence, was the one who made Beatrice go comatose.

>>8690346

Agreed. Who hates erika? If there's one thing i dislike is their choice of VA for her for the ps3 remake. But then again I thought most of the voices in that were poorly chosen.

>>8690361
Erika is fucking GOAT. I want her yo wear lambdadelta's leg as a strap-on and peg me with it.

Any argument against Erika can be dismissed by her act at the end of Ep6. Greatest exit ever.

>>8690388
>>8690395
Well shit I just realised I have no Erika pics saved at all.
Help me/jp/ you're my only hope.

>>8689310

you don't have thousands of Erika pictures?

How dare you!

>>8690425
was meant to quote >>8690417

>>8690436

Erika

Umineko is a babby's first VN of the worst kind. It's a bad series, a clusterfuck of setting and characterization that isn't very well done by any aspect, but which attempts to compensate for its weaknesses by adding in excessive shipping faggotry and META. The NEET anon can see this as the shit it is, and may enjoy it, hate it or be indifferent to it, but all the while recognizing that the series itself, regardless of their opinion, is plain bad.

However, these very aspects that try to smear over the shit of its core make it a breeding ground for normal, sociable, underage faggots who engage in every kind of faggotry both online and in the real world. The metaworld characters all trying their hardest to look cool, the magic, the peculiar, colorful clothes, the whole "colored text" faggotry and everything about the Umineko world fuels their escapist fantasies, while the pity-party character backgrounds, emphasis on love, and the overall preachiness of the whole series make it fit just right with the mary-sueish drives of your average preteen and his sense of unwarranted self-importance towards the world. Exactly the kind of shit that makes normals and underage retards eat this shit right the fuck up.

Umineko is basically THE series to attract the most hated visual novel fanbase known to /jp/, which is why, regardless of individual opinions, it is the responsibility of every anon to troll the fuck out of this franchise and everyone who likes it, and ensure that no Umineko threads ever encourage the normalfags to show their faces here.

>>8690439

>>8690442

>>8690441

>>8690452

>>8690455

>>8690460

I approve of the direction the thread is going.

I would contribute but sadly I have next to none Umineko pictures.

>>8690464

Dlanor needs love, too

>>8690460
>>8690457
>>8690455
>>8690452
>>8690448
>>8690442
>>8690439
>>8690437
>>8690436
>>8690425
Thanks guys. I saved all of them.

>>8690469

no problem,
I'll dump some more pictures but will stop in about 4 posts

>>8690476

>>8690481

okay I don't have any more pictures worth posting.

goodbye

>>8690369
Have you not heard of her "VERY GOOD"?

>>8690048
Better reread it. Seriously. There are a lot of hints which are unnoticable at first reading. Without rereading the novel you won't find the truth.

>No matter how much more I pile up on my writing by explaining it, it won’t reach the people who don’t know the feeling. How scary must it be, to be told that your partner „wants children“, when you have a body that cannot make love. That’s why Shannon couldn’t speak honestly.
>How scary must it be, to be told that your partner „wants children“, when you have a body that cannot make love.
>when you have a body that cannot make love

Ryukishi...

>>8690898
Even if Shannon's a trap, she can still make love. Well unless that scene in the EP7 tea party implied that she cut off her own genitalia...

Plus there's always adoption.

>>8690925
it was long ago implied that Yasu damaged genitalia in the cliff fall and became genderless

Looks like everyone loves Erika then?
<GOOD>
I'm still proud to hang my framed Erika portrait prominently in my room.

>>8690925
And she was male befoe

>>8690971
We need more Erika x Dlanor art.

>>8690965

To me this doesn't make a lot of sense. I think she was always trans/intersex but blamed the fall for causing her either physical or brain damage.

She was pretty crazy.

I hate the ps3 art. Everyone looks so forced and plastic.

>>8691001
This is why I always preferred the original Hirgurashi art to the PS2.

>>8690965
>>8690997

>R „I want to spend my future surrounded by many grandchildren!“, said George recklessly, already cementing a future with children. But it’s his desire to have children, right?! And I think you can guess that this put a lot of pressure on her.

>K Yasu said in EP7 that she has „a body that is unable to love“.

>R If you take this expression as a basis, you can imagine her sad fate of a having some kind of imperfection on a sexual level. I think it’s possible to get to that point.

>K At first I was thinking that it was maybe a terrible wound that chained Yasu to the bed. But that does not seem to be the case at all.

>R It is a pretty adult topic, so I had to obscure it’s depiction.

>>8690997
She wasn't crazy at all and Ryu would have told something or left a hint about brain damage.

>>8691001
Chiru wasn't that bad

>>8689357
I read somewhere that PS3 Chiru had an extended Trick ending. Can anyone confirm or deny?

>>8691090
it was just a rumor

>>8691071

>>R If you take this expression as a basis, you can imagine her sad fate of a having some kind of imperfection on a sexual level. I think it’s possible to get to that point.

>K At first I was thinking that it was maybe a terrible wound that chained Yasu to the bed. But that does not seem to be the case at all.

So I'm right, and there wasn't an actual injury, just her being crazy?

"Some kind of perfection on a sexual level" sounds like trans to me. I'm sad he considers it an adult topic though. When you know, he has killer lolis and shit going around.

>>8691089

She said something about some kind of injury, but I said it didn't fit, so she was just blaming the accident for how she turned out.

You know whats worse than umineko fans?
umineko fans from animesuki.

>>8691103
you forgot this
>a body that cannot make love

>>8691115
But Yasu still has an anus (I assume). Of course he / she can make love. Or at least receive it.

>>8691114
the man from 19 years ago in ep5 was talking about some kind of physical wounds that cannot be healed

The Golden Witch Beatrice will never severely troll you and laugh at you again to the sound of Rougoku ;_;

>>8691071
>>8691103

Although I posted that quote I am not quite sure how to understand this part alone,
but if you read that sentence here

>Or even if Battler had actually squeezed Shannon’s breasts, he might have noticed that they are fake.

I guess this means that Yasu is, in fact male,
and moreover I also think that he got castrated or something during the incident at the cliff,
based on the fact that the family should have noticed his changing voice...

or what do you think?

>>8691125
i don't think it feels any good without genitalia

>>8691125
but she poops from there

>>8691125

It sounds like the kind of thing a particularly dysmorphic trans person would say.

>>8691144
Males have the prostate gland up there. It would still feel good.

>>8691146
a guy without sexual organs doesn't develop

Would a boy made a unick from birth still go through puberty? This requires further research.

What if operation nanjo made sex-change operation and Yasu has a fake vagina?

>>8691158

Yeah, No T means no puberty, no drop in voice.

It bothers me that we don't know precisely what happened. It's the one thing I wish we could have found out.

>>8691173
ha ha

>>8691174
makes sense

Does it really matter?

The important part is that, somehow, her body became "unable to love." This played an important role in her motivations.

>>8691190

Yeah but we don't know if this actually happened, it could have been some metaphor. R07 said he purposefully obscured it.

>>8691172

No. Not unless given testosterone.

Because of Umineko, whenever I do something clever or think I do something clever, I snap my fingers with lopsided smile, pointing at nothing in particular.

I've been thinking of introduced the Red Truth/Blue Truth system into my mystery club.

>>8691190
it does

>>8691192
i don't think he would have gone that far with his metaphors

>>8691204
One day on Rokkenjima.
Yasu, sweetie, come here. We're gonna inject you some vitamins.

>>8691208
Be sure to shout "SAY IT IN FUCKING RED!" whenever you get into a disagreement with somebody.

>>8691192
He could have obscured it because he thought that it would be "disrespectful" towards his character. Or he thought that it was unnecessary for us to know details.

Anyone here who's still in school, have they ever tried recommending their teacher Umineko? I'm thinking of trying to copy Episode 1 into a disk and have my Mystery and Suspense/English Honors teacher play it.

>>8691307
Make sure it's pre-patched first.

>>8691270
and if someone will shout at you then say:
I'm not giving red truth for free like some fools, but if you love me you'll see my words as the red truth *lamdaface*

>>8691307

ahahahahahha

But anyway how could I hate it when it introduced the best character in years.

I just read this -

http://seizonsha.wordpress.com/2011/06/13/%E6%9C%80%E7%B5%82%E8%80%83%E5%AF%9F%E3%80%80%E3%81%86%E3%
81%BF%E3%81%AD%E3%81%93%E3%81%AE%E3%81%AA%E3%81%8F%E9%A0%83%E3%81%AB-answer-to-the-golden-witch-spec
ial-discussion/

and it really made me rethink R07's approach in the last few episodes.

But I'm still not fully happy with Yasu's motive, nor his covering up what actually happened with Yasu. There's already plenty of unanswered mysteries - if he'd have answered that and made Shkannontrice more workable/believable I'd probably be a lot happier.

I think he made it clear that it was never meant to be a traditionally solvable mystery, or even one everyone would "Get" though. And to be fair, that was said from the very start, but many people got fooled into thinking otherwise.

The ending and what happened with Battler is still bad though. I don't like how he glossed over that fact.

Also, apparently Sayaka Ohara knows EVERYTHING.

Time to run a successful anime convention, learn japanese, invite her over and get her drunk.

>>8691468

Well I don't have the ultimate answer either,
but I believe that the core of it is in fact Yasu's motive itself.
If you can fully grasp his/her motive, then I guess that you've reached the "goal" R07 is talking about in this interview.

>>8691478

The problem is there's no way for someone that thinks they're right to check their answers. In that regard, they may as well be wrong in a sense.

Also, haven't those who "get" it explained it to everyone, and it's just that people don't expect it? That love coupled with her dysmorphic body drove Yasu crazy?

Killing people as part of some murder mystery game. I can totally understand a murder motivated by love, if they were to kill someone who'd abused or killed their partner, or something like that.

I like the idea that what happened in the "real" world was just the murder mystery party, but then the bomb went off.

Actually, maybe that is what happened - there were no actual murders in the real world, just on the various "Gameboards". Depending on how mental you believe Yasu to be, she is or isn't capable of murder. In reality, she isn't, but the pressure George, Jessica & Battler put on her led her to use Kinzo's method for reaching a decision, possibly being unsure of whether or not it would actually happen.

That much I can buy. The solution present in "My Confession", not so much. I think the piece of Beatrice is acting with meta-knowledge in that(or insanity in the real world).

>>8691468
Yasu's motive is simple. Maybe it doesn't make sense for someone but for her it does. Ryu wanted us to understand how Yasu's mind worked, to understand her feelings and to be able to see her truth. That's all.

Also he might answer later. We still have manga and another hane/tsubasa.

>>8691497
It really seems to be that Yasu wanted to kill people but couldn't and someone did it instead of her. Or she knew that someone was planning murders and decided to make herself into a "red herring".

I think one of the problems is that as Umineko went on I found myself relating more and more to Beatrice and who I suspected she was. I started to get the impression she wasn't really the murderer - she was covering up the truth from Battler by creating an evil witch to cover everything up, but was compelled to give him the opportunity to solve it in the hope that doing so would get him to better understand her and the family he left behind.

I don't feel comfortable relating to a character who's basically a murderer, even a repentant one, and I feel sad that a character I thought I could relate to may have turned out to be one I can't. What I gathered from the "Real world" ending in Ep.8 was that in that world, Beatrice hadn't killed anyone, but if she's now the culprit officially, that means she did?

When R07 talks about "a woman's heart" etc. it makes me wonder how much he really understands one, at least one that has faced some of the same issues that Yasu has.

I would love to discuss this with him(I have a translator), but he doesn't seem to reply to emails.

Maybe this is why he didn't want to give a clear answer, but at the same time I should be able to feel more comfortable in "My" solution than he's allowed me to.

But why did she want to kill someone in the first place?
And who?

She does feel guilty - that was hinted during the story, but guilty of what?

and most importantly, what do you think about this part of the interview:

>R ...And EP8 is something like an afterword to round up the story. What I wanted to portray in EP8 were two things. One was a message towards those who has arrived at the truth. The other was a party feeling to those who did not find it, saying „You may not have understood everything, but it was a hell lot of fun.“. Though in your case KEIYA, EP8 might have not been much of a festival, but at least I seem to have moved you at many points.

>K Why do the two parties need to fight? The epilogue where Ikuko and Tôya reunite with Ange. When I saw those scenes it all came rushing back to me. Aah, so that’s what it was about.

>R In that part are so many interpretations, I think that is fantastic. You can easily divide the deductions of those who arrived at the truth and those who did not. That’s why it’s enough to just look at your thoughts and say, „Yes, he arrived at the truth!“. But because you are one of those people, I think you will sadly never understand how the opposite side feels.
>Why do the two parties need to fight?

That's the question I really don't have an answer for.

Someone care to explain their theory on that?

>>8691553
She felt guilty for thinking about murdering her family. I guess "the many worlds" she refers to are stories about family murders which she wrote.

>>8691553
Japan must know

>>8691497
I saw the meta-motives in Our Confession as something that might apply to the main game boards too. It would mean the culprit is basically the author who descended into her own story and played around with locked room murders just because they'd make a fun mystery puzzle, not because she wanted to express some deep psychological need to slaughter 15 people in the real world.

>>8691698

it's because shannon/yasu always wished, to have battler read her self written novels. but battler didnt came back since six years. with all her sadness and stuff, she is still playing the mystery novel thing as a witch you could say

shit, you didnt read umineko did you?

>>8691553
>She does feel guilty - that was hinted during the story, but guilty of what?

In EP8 I think it was said early on that she felt really guilty about her message bottles spawning the media environment that destroyed Ange's life.

Our Confession?

Would you mind telling me more about it?
Is there a translation yet - and where can I get it?

I've read the interview some anon posted above,
but I haven't read "our confession" yet,
it seems to be worth the read!

>>8691709
Working on mystery novels does not equate to wanting to murder people. What exactly do you think happened between 1984-1986 that would transition from the Yasu we last saw to an irrational maniac who thinks killing everyone she knows is a good idea that Battler will forgive her for?

I told you Kei-chan, I told you about the psychotic bitches.
Damn, I'm really enjoying the novels.

The music was god tier, writing descended into shit tier thanks to Chiru.

Then again, I liked the mystery far more than the cheesy love drama. EP1 was without a doubt my favorite, the ambiance and uncertainty was very enjoyable, it felt like there just might be a good puzzle to unravel here, rather than the piece of shit we were given.

If he really does retcon Umineko, Shkanontrice needs to die, it's an odious copout that people were jokingly discussing by EP2 and 3.

>>8691710
There is no full translation yet, but here is a summary:
http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost.php?p=3927670&postcount=26755

>>8691776

A thank you
I don't visit Animesuki so I've missed it until now

>>8691774
Yasu is the core of this story. And if you can't accept that it's your problems. There are many people who liked whole umineko, ecpesially Chiru.

>>8691790
Many people also like objectively bad music, unfortunately for Umiunko, not only do the people who don't mind the downward spiral it took have bad taste, they are also in the minority.

I don't have any problem with Yasu, but if there were a hypothetical retcon, I'd want to see more development of the Kanon side of her personality. And maybe some more technically clever abuses of the Shannon/Kanon/Beatrice switching, like Ryuu was hinting at in one of his interviews. EP3 T1 was a good start, but there's tons of other things you can do with it.

>>8691819
umineko won't become shit just because you say that it is one

Umineko is dogshit. I really cannot understand how anyone can think otherwise. The first book is good, and each successive book is worse than the one that proceeds it (obvious exception being 4 because nothing is worse than 4).

The story had no concrete foundation to start off with, and certainly didn't have one by the time the story was concluded. It was a massive clusterfuck of lolis, identity issues, and the most unreliable narrator(s) of all time.

And this is to say nothing of R07 wasting literally 50% of what is supposed to be an answer book berating the reader for not having "heart" because we don't recognize R07 as the next Agatha Christie.


Umineko was jusn't bad in execution, it was bad by design. ATTWN and MOTOE were meant to be read in a SINGLE DAY, not 5 FUCKING YEARS.

R07 is a hack and anyone who defends him is shit, sorry. At least the music was good.

>>8691892

I don't think he was trying to be Agatha Christie, or write the next big murder mystery.

Even from the Ep1 ???? or hell the Tea Party this should have been obvious.

You should read the interview link posted above. I'm curious as to why you kept reading past 4 though if it was so bad.

>>8691892
Umineko is not shit, you are. Besides Ryu never said that umineko was a mistery so you can't compare him to Christie

>>8691892
if umineko is shit to you then why you are even sitting here

>>8691892
>ATTWN and MOTOE were meant to be read in a SINGLE DAY, not 5 FUCKING YEARS.
True. And I'm thankful to R07 for trying to make a 5-year-long mystery.
I read ATTWN in a single day, and I forgot about it in a single hour. Now, Umineko...

>>8691942
he likes to bathe in shit.

>>8691914
>>8691899

Right, thats why there are characters named after Mystery novel writers and multiple characters are detectives.

Do you fanboys seriously believe the shit that you spew?

>>8691948
i don't think i'll forget about umineko anytime soon, though it's mostly thanks to the delicious zepar.

>>8691947

I started watching this shit and I couldn't BELIEVE it didn't turn out to be a real mystery, despite SEVERAL of the characters referencing famous detectives in their names.

The writers are obviously stupid stuck up idiots who think they can be the next Conan Doyle. I know this from the fact that the show is named after one of his characters.

>>8691948

>I read ATTWN in a single day, and I forgot about it in a single hour

>if it doesn't have lolis and magic battles and isn't 8 books long it isn't good

you people are legitimately retarded

It's a pity that the screenshot generator is gone and I can't make an appropriate "this argument is stupid" image anymore.

>>8691947
yasu loved mysteries. wanted to create a mystery for battler to solve. isn't it enough?

>>8691981

if you honestly believe that milk holmes carries the same pretense that R07 intentionally injected into umineko then you are sadly mistaken.It's still a better mystery than Umineko anyway

>>8691983
why you're sitting here then? go to another fandom which is not retarded

>>8691995
umineko is not a mystery

Umiunko

>>8691983
Now, It's plainly obvious that you're trolling, but you got me, I admit it. I'll answer seriously:
No, it doesn't need to be 2500 pages long or have magical loli. But the fact is that ATTWN is just a mystery story. I read it, I understood it, I was surprised for some seconds and then I forgot about it. The fact is that I still feel strongly about Umineko after more than four years since I touched it for the first time.
For people whose concept of literature is about enjoying and feeling, Umineko is a masterpiece, even if the prose is mediocre and the solution is the most retarded thing that has ever appeared in a story.

>>8692020

Good post, sums up my feelings too.

1-4 was great, giving Umineko huge potential.
5 was okay, Erika saved it by being fun to watch.
Could have skipped 6.
7 was one of the better, if not the best, episodes of Chiru.
8 was surprise and disappointment. Trick ending was good and I also enjoyed the magic ending, although amnesia is shitty plot twist and fuck Battler/Toya possibly dying. Why have Ange reunite with him so he can die 5 mins later? Bittersweet ending? Bullshit, R07. I maintain the thought that Toya is/was a fugue.

And whoever asked about Nocturne having an expanded Trick end(I can't find the post to quote), well it doesn't. Some guy at Animesuki was uploading vids of specific scenes on YouTube via request. I and others asked for the Trick ending and we got it. 2 days later, all of his shit was removed from YouTube cause dat copyright. I was able to catch the Trick end, though. Playing the video side-by-side with the SN, I realizedit wasn't different. Just had voices and imagery.Still was a good watch though.

>>8692109
What makes you think Tohya died?

>>8692117
What makes you think he didn't?

>>8692157
The fact that this makes no logical sense. What is the cause of death?

Wait, there are people who seriously believe that Erika wasn't the best character?

>>8692162
how would he met dead people otherwise?

>>8692194
i know right

>>8692194
Erika is my favourite but she's defently not the best in the story.

>>8692206
The same way Battler met dead people in EP2.

>>8692222
>>8692206
>>8692162

>Implying a personality can't "die" in Umineko

Most simple answer here is:

The last remnants of Battler inside of Tohya were able to find peace finally
and "died"

>>8692117
It's possible to think that he did, considering that we're supposed to think of Toya(WheelchairBattler) as different person than Battler, yet it isn't Battler(you know, smooth, handsome, possibly bisexual oh so perfect redhead) who ends up in the Golden Land with everyone. It's CrippleMindBlownGuy who gets there. I get you can interpret the scene in other ways, but considering the factors, it's likely. Toya has to be in his fifties at least(R07 said somewhere that he wasn't as old as Yukari!Ange was, and he's 38{or turning 38, I forget}). There's his bodily and possibly brain injuries. Golden Land possibly being a metaphor for the afterlife. There are probably some others, but I don't remember them as of now. Plus it's been a while since I read Ep8.

>>8692222
That was inside a forgery. It doesn't count.

>>8692236
There are different interpretations but I prefer to think that he died.

One thing that I hadn't yet listened to with my new headphones is Umineko music.
I'm doing it right now. Fuck yes.
I hope we get more from zts and the gang(?) for RGD.

>>8692257
EP8 epilogue was inside a forgery. It doesn't count either.

>>8691505
What is her motive then?

>>8691553
"Why do the two parties need to fight?" reminds me of the love duel from EP6. But who knows if that's what he's talking about. As for why she feels guilty, I believe that R07 said she was "a" culprit in the interview, so she's one of the people involved in the incident but certainly not the only one. But that still doesn't mean that she murdered anyone.

Guys, if you want to believe that she never murdered anyone, or even that everyone survived, it's still possible to do that. Feel free.

Heck, that was what Ange's fight with Bern was all about, wasn't it? That she's free to believe that they all survived if she wants. Because in her world, Red Truths don't exist. After all, Red Truth is a rule of the game board, not the real world.

>>8692206
Who says they're dead?
"Beatrice died" does not in any way imply that "Yasuda is dead."

In fact, I believe that she was not dead. Beatrice is a persona of sorts, a role, a personality. She died, and Yasuda made a new one. That new persona was Ikuko.

>>8692241
Yes, it is a possibility that he died. However, there's still no good reason for why he'd die in this situation. But okay.

Personally, I believe that fantasy scenes (for example, the scene with all the characters that he saw at the end) are metaphors.

Just like how Ange brought Maria another Sakutarou, she brought Tohya a new Rokkenjima of sorts. He felt like he was there all over again, standing in his past. Maybe he was able to feel like those memories belonged to him. Because of that, he became something like Tohya+Battler, which means that Battler "revived." In turn, this "revived" Beatrice, and there's your BattlerXBeatrice happy end.

>>8692292

I don't like that interpretation with regards Ikuko, there's no real hint for it.

It's possible Beatrice survived in some form.

You don't need the personality trick to cover the Umineko ending. It happens in the real world. The witches are just being clever - their red can't apply with certainty to the real world. It can only apply with "almost certainty" based on the model they have of it in the gameboard.

Either R07 forgot or the fans forget - Red doesn't work outside the gameboard.

>>8692292
Why you even need to make umineko this complicated when the truth is obvious?

>>8692387

well tell us your interpretation then

>>8692366
There are hints though.

We have a random woman from a wealthy family who loves to write mysteries. She mentioned that she has a family, but that they don't allow her to leave the house, and yet somehow she was out in a car and was allowed to pick up a random guy off the side of the road who was badly injured and take care of him... Her reasons for taking him in make absolutely 0 sense unless she's either crazy or is Yasuda, and there's also no reason why her family would have allowed her to do this if they do exist.

>>8692387
Because it's not that obvious.

>ikuko is yasu
not this shit again

>>8692404

I have to agree
it doesn't make any sense

Maybe Ikoku is Meta Beatrice
but there is no way that she is the Person Yasu

>>8692399
>Her reasons for taking him in make absolutely 0 sense unless she's either crazy or is Yasuda
Remember when Shkanontrice made "absolutely 0 sense"?

>>8692404
It's a valid theory. You don't have to believe it if you don't want to. But despite that, there are plenty of things that have no explanation unless she is Yasuda, and Yasuda fits all of the criteria for being Ikuko.

>>8692409
Except we're not going to be getting any more novels to explain why it might actually make sense. "Shkanontrice" does make sense now, but this still doesn't.

>>8692415

So Yasu was driving a nice car on the mainland

while Battler was fleeing the island and nearly drowned?

>>8692422
The epitaph got solved the first night.

The adults all started killing each other. Kyrie was all like "Sorry I didn't promise I would treat you like a gentleman, say goodbye to your head" but she actually just grazed her and Yasu woke up later, left the island, went back to her backup mansion which she bought with some of the gold she liquidated, and then decided to go for a joyride to celebrate her freedom.

I don't know why people still argue about Umineko's truth when the last 3-4 episodes are made up on the spot due to BT dying.

>>8692435

Why didn't she help Battler or stay by his side or take him with her?

>>8692440
I don't know why people perpetuate this crap that BT was the real writer.

>>8692412

The Person Yasu is Meta Beatrice though. The character is one in the same. She isn't an imaginary figment or alternate personality, at least anymore than Meta Battler is.

I am actually pretty sure that Ikuko is meant to be *actual* witch. That comment about her being unaging was pretty telling.

For the whole setting to work, magic has to exist somewhere, it's just that real magic doesn't exist on the gameboard. Battler agreed, don't bother him about it.

>>8692445
The roulette already gave her an answer. She left his fate to the new masters of the island.

>>8692440
>>8692453
We have no reason to believe BT was the writer or anying, but it's a funny thought to entertain. What if the bullshit direction the novel took since EP6 and the stupid solution were just R07 trying to piece together BT's (supposed) ideas? What if with his death we lost an earth-shattering ending for an excellent beginning?
...Damn, I want to go back. I m-must... t-t-time ma-ma-machine...

I prefered the theory that BeaTrice was really BT, which is why at the end it dedicates the story to "My beloved witch Beatrice." BT was actually a secret transsexual which is what inspired the gender aspects of the stories. When BT died, so did Beatrice.

The plausibility of this is what makes it the most engaging theory.

>>8692481

Presumably her love for him was the reason for the whole incident - and in the end she just abandoned him to his fate?

That seems really far fetched to me

>>8692491

Oh god that sounds too stupid,
please this can't be the answer Ryu

Are there any explanations for the scene with Battler and Beatrice on the boat? Where is Eva?

What is going on there?

>>8692511

It's fiction - magic.
So we don't really know what happend there

Well hey, at least it's not fucking Penguindrum.

$10 says R07 worships Ikuhara though.

Guys, Yasu was suicidal. She wanted to DIE. Why she would suddenly become Ikuko?

What is more lewd between Reimu's armpits and her asshole?

>>8692537
who cares?

>>8692422

lol, Nice Car.

How do people take this fucking shit seriously? It's so badly written and laughably terrible, how is it so popular? Is it because of the EPIC KILLER LOLIZ XD or the fat fangirls masturbating over Battler and Lion?

>>8692639
It's all because you suck

>>8692537

I want to lick them both, so it doesn't matter

>>8692668
How about licking Lion's dick then?

>>8692639
>EPIC KILLER LOLIZ XD
EPIC KILLER WITCHEZ XD
there are no lolis in seacats.

>>8692694
Bern, Lambda, Erika are lolis

>>8692422
And how did Tohya find out that he was in a car accident in the first place? He was unconscious. Ikuko told him that story after the fact, just like all that bullshit about her family. Even Tohya realized there was something wrong with it.

>>8692719
Tohya saw what happened. It's just he couldn't move.
Also Ikuko could have thought that she hitted Tohya with the car

>>8692697
erika's almost an adult.

>>8692765
but looks like a loli. also dlanor

LIONS DICK IS EVERYWHERE

Tohya=Yasu explains everything

Is it true that one can solve Umineko from just reading the first EPs and (or alternatively) the Umineko anime?

I cried when I got to the end

>>8696145
It's a lie. To learn the truth you need to read all novels. Especially Requiem.

>>8696193
everyone did, bro. everyone

>>8696193
Are you a fag?

So what was the translation of that book that came out. Anything about what really happened?

Yasu is not really the daughter of the Beatrice Rosa met. She died when she was with Rosa and she didn't really seem like someone who had experienced sex, let alone child birth. Yasu is just someone from the orphanage that Genji chose to revive Beatrice. As long as Kinzo was able to believe it was Beatrice reborn it was fine. Also Yasu wanted to be connected to the Beatrice legend, so she accepted being her daughter regardless of if it was really true. Yasu is actually unrelated to the Ushiromiya family.

>>8696274
What the fuck is this? Did you even read umineko?

>>8696319
You're the one who didn't read it. It makes absolutely zero sense for Yasu to actually be her daughter. All that matters is that Kinzo thought she was and Yasu thought she was too.

>>8696274
It was never hinted in the novel. And since when Yasu became a "girl"?

>>8696324
why Ryu even needed to create this complicated shit?

>>8696145
>>8696145
I remember a statement saying that R07 confirmed that it's possible to solve the true mystery without Chiru.

>>8696361
And since you can't reach his bullshit "answer" like that, it's his hint that BT actually wrote 1-4 and told R07 who he was challenging to solve it that it was now solvable.

>>8696377

I'd like to see someone (smart) try attaining the truth just using information from the first four games, as was said. It seems difficult.

>>8696396
Reading the reports of a team of analysts paid to get conclusions from EPs 1-4 would be insanely fun.

>>8696361
At least the EP1-4 game board stuff was all definitely solvable by the end of EP4. I remember seeing people post theories for all of the major pieces, including the whole fake-murders-turned-real thing.

>>8692020
Well that's just like your opinion man. I read ATTWN just because Umineko had so many references to it and it was a way better story than the whole of Umineko was. Why can't people just accept Umineko was shit? Everywhere you go someone has to defend Ryukishi and call us goats. Umineko was just a crap story, Ryukishi says in that interview that the truth is clear to the people that understood it but he is wrong, nothing was clear in Umineko, it was a big clusterfuck.

>>8696361
He's wrong though. You can't solve the true mystery even with Chiru.

>>8697148
the truth is clear
and if you're blind that's your problems

tell me about your truth,
I'm eager to hear it.

>>8697148
>nothing was clear in Umineko, it was a big clusterfuck.
Even worse, a no-solution clusterfuck. But my point still stands.

I remembered one question I've had since forever. I won't let it go this time:
I think it was in EP6, when the mystery ends right after Hideyoshi being stabbed. Somebody (who was it?) said that "There's no need to continue the game; if you understood the rules, you should be able to know what happens next".
What's up with that? What would happen next in that episode and how would one be able to know?
Oh, and also, who the fuck killed Hideyoshi and how? I think the door was closed, etc.
And who was it that was hidden in the closet and half-saw his death? I forgot about that.

>>8691174
Isn't it possible that Yasu is intersexual? I frgot if it was specifically stated that its genitals got damaged in the fall or if it was born like that.

>>8697271
it won't make any sense for you anyway, goat
why should I bother writing it down?

>>8697407
It was told that Yasu wasn't born with this injury but obtained it in the accident.

>>8697410

I wasn't the guy who were arguing with earlier,
I was just curious whether you're just bluffing or figured out some satisfying answer.

But I guess you're just bluffing in the end
- or trolling if that sounds better for your

>>8697418
Just ignore them, it's the same shit every time. "I know the answer but I'm not telling because you wouldn't get it."
Who do they really think they are fooling?

>>8697401
Dunno about the continuation, but Hideyoshi wasn't really dead. What Natsuhi overheard from the closet was him pretending to cry and get murdered for her benefit. By the time Erika arrived on the scene, Eva was holding the supposed murder weapon, and Erika just assumed that it had been pulled out of the body.

>>8697769
>What Natsuhi overheard from the closet
Oh, now I remember, somebody (Yasu, right?) had told her over the phone to hide there?

I'm still interested in how one could know what would happen next. I suppose it was Battler that said it, that'd make the most sense. I can only imagine he (or whoever ended the game abruptly, I don't remember) meant "You should already know that Yasu chooses different accomplices each time, and then everything goes to shit, and this won't be the exception, so there's no need to see the rest", not "You should know exactly who's going to die, when and how".

>>8697418
Which truth you want from me?
About Rokkenjima prime? Who was the real murder or what?
This story wasn't about "what really happened on Rokkenjima". It was about Yasu.

Ryu wanted from us is to understand Yasu's heart, her feelings and to reach her truth. That's the only thing Beato wanted Battler to learn in her game.
Read at least this part of the interview:

>- This feels really similar to the reactions that appeared concerning Yasu’s motive. Many were understanding the motive, but because they weren’t satisfied with it they denied it.
>R I have this feeling that most of the people who arrived at the truth were women, because the key is being able to imagine Yasu’s feelings. Umineko is something that cannot be read by people who never fell in love with somebody. It is something that people who have no experience in love and relationships have trouble understanding. „Love can become a motive that has more power over you than life or death“, that is something which is pretty hard to explain to people without this experience. Most of them will think that it’s just „an overdone motive“. But for people who have known love and experienced how much it can make you suffer, they understand that love can turn your world upside down. If you are told „I will come for you again!“ and for 6 years there is nothing, it can make you go crazy, but people who have even slightly suffered due to love will say „those 6 years must have been hell“. But people who no nothing of that pain will probably wait for nothing less than a dramatic gadget to appear, like the heroic story of „at age X her mother and father were brutally murdered“.

>K Love is really a sufficient motive even for murder, isn’t it?!
>R And I think people who do not know that, will sadly never understand Umineko. Because Umineko is „the story of a single girl who arrived at that point because she imagined an incident because of the love and madness in herself“, no matter how much I express that, people who don’t share that feeling will never do so. If I had to compare it, it’s similar to a kick in the crotch or menstrual pain. No matter how much more I pile up on my writing by explaining it, it won’t reach the people who don’t know the feeling.

You still can understand umineko without solving it like usual mystery. It's not even a mystery and more like a puzzle.
Also, even if umineko wasn't about RPrime it still gives blurred image of what happened.
And yes, maybe Shkanon definitely wasn't the best solution to "how dunnit" it still was an interesting part of "why dunnit" in the forgeries.

All of the truth was already exposed in Requiem, Answer and Our confession. Probably Ryu will even write more stuff to confirm some things.
And I'm satisfied with everything so far.

What kind of truth you want to hear from him? The one that will satisfy you?
I don't think you'll get one.

>>8697840
>>8697842
I understand the basics of what R07 is trying to say there. I understand it very well. My own life is hell only because I was/am extremely sensitive. Some people have childhoods ten times worse than mine and they grow up just fine.
BUT. Even if we're in animu world. Even if I loved Umineko. Even then.
Battler said that when they were 12 years old. Twelve. Years. Old. He said he'd come back with a pony.
I can understand R07's idea of 'that unfulfilled promise was brewed through the years into the deadliest poison imaginable'. I suppose some of the cruelest real-life incidents happen because of things like that.
But it's bullshit. Even if I can imagine it happening in real life, it's bullshit. It's a shitty reason for such a fun mystery.

>>8697877
Yasu grow in very "friendly" environment. All of the things which were shown about her past formed her personality, her worldview and fears. Especally the fear of being unloved, being alone. She was still a naive dreamer in her 12. Battler was the only person she was talking to about her fellings and she trusted everything he said(aside from pony part and things like that, of course ).
With this promise Battle gave Yasu hopes. She started thinking about her future. About a future in which there is someone who cares for her. And in the end three yars of wait were rewarded with "I don't even remember about you lol". Despite the fact that Yasu's dreams were broken she still had hope left deep inside.
And then when she solved epitaph she learned about her body condition. I think exactly that was the worst for her. From that moment she was unable to see herself as a human anymore and became afraid that no one will ever love her if she tells the truth. And then goes her gender disorder and "furniture complex" which is the sourse of her love problems, which are important to her "why dunnit" and etc. The most important part about Battler's promise, in my opinion, is giving her dreams about a future, which were crushed lately and and left her with her fear of being alone, which was formed in her childhood.

Umineko was never said to be realistic, just logical.

>>8697842
These are the answers I wanted:
-A less roundabout answer to all the Shkanontrice bullshit, for example is there actually cross dressing involved?
-A proper explanation for what Beatrice is exactly, why she died at the end of 4 and was resurrected later.
-What happened on Rokkenjima Prime and the culprit there, I have heard everything from Battler culprit theory to nobody died until the bomb to "It's not meant to be solved!" and none of them are clear.
-The whole deal with Touya and Ikuko, was he really Battler at all? Did he die in the last scene?
-The whole letter conundrum, did George hide it or what?
-The whole deal with Meta-Battler's drastic personality change.
-What was Battler's real feelings? In the end we find he is just as much of an unreliable narrator as everyone else. So was he actually an asshole like the ep7 teaparty portrays or what? There is the Genius Battler Theory floating around that comes up with some crazy stuff about him.
-The whole deal with the Red and Gold text - what was the gold text exactly, did the red text really only apply to the gameboards and not Rokkenjima Prime?
-Was Jessica a lesbian?

And probably many more that I can't think of at the moment.

>>8698099

You're a moron if you don't know the answers to those yet.

Did you even read the damn thing, or are you another "I watched the anime and want to know what happened" people?

>>8698099
- It seems to be that there was. At some point.
- A proper explanation? I want one too. I have few ideas but they aren't proper at all.
- It seems to be that Ryu decided to leave it to our own interpretation.
- Novel says that he was Batora once then it must be true of some sort. If it wasn't true Ryu would have told something about that. I think that Tohya died, but Ryu left it to our interpretation again.
- Our interpretation(3).
- Learned the truth and it changed him.
- Our interpretation(4)
- Some of the red text applied only to gameboard, another, like the one Bern used at the end of ep8, to prime.
- Maybe Kanon/Jessica was a part of Yasu's imagination. At least novel shows that Jessica is interested in boys, not girls.

Most of these Ryu sees as unimportant stuff, or things everyone will see their own way and we won't get any confirmations.

>>8698099
- Kanon was witnessed by Jessica's friends and Gohda, so yes, although the only one on the island who needs to be out of the loop is Gohda.
- She was originally Ikuko's idea of Yasu. After her "resurrection", she was Tohya's idea of Yasu.
- Unprovable, but possibly a mystery game derailed tragically by paranoia and greed.
- Yes, Tohya used to be Battler. I don't think he died, but can't prove it.
- Deliberately left unknowable, according to an interview.
- Compare 18-year-old Battler who knows nothing and 30-year-old Tohya who figured everything out and feels guilty.
- Genius Battler was confirmed by EP8, but that just means he wasn't an incompetent GM in EP6 like everyone thought. Forgery no. XXX implies that Tohya knows Culprit Battler is false, but isn't willing to come forward and deny it.
- Gold truth is something that you decide to accept as true. Certainty doesn't exist in the real world, so any red applying to it is just somebody's gold truth that they wrote down in a story with red ink.
- Dunno, does falling in love with a eunuch count if the eunuch dresses like a girl half the time?

So can anyone explain in clear terms who wrote what in the end? I get it that all the game board events and murders were written by Yasu and later Ikuko, but what of meta-world? So apparently Tohya and Ikuko wrote that shit too, but when is it mentioned in the game in the context of real world of 1998 and onward? Seems like this thing's completely flown over my head.

>>8698471
Things like the Meta-World and the 1998 scenes seem to exist on a completely different plane than the game board, so I'm willing to bet that such scenes were not part of the original forgeries.

>>8698016
I understand this much. I've read all 8 novels, the interview, and the summary of Our Confessions, so this much is obvious. However, you didn't explain the most crucial part:

Does Yasu have a motive for murder outside of creating a mystery for Battler? They said that love can be a reason to kill, and that's all fine and good, after all it's true that the pain of unrequited love can drive you to do some crazy shit, but for her it simply does not create a sufficient reason as far as I can see.

Despite that, the interview went on to call her a culprit when the real world was being discussed.

I am not going to accept things like this, okay?
-She somehow expected to gain Battler's favor by committing murder(s).
-She simply went insane from the pain and decided it would be better if everyone died.

Those are cop outs. Only people who are too lazy to think will settle for something like that.

I'm not asking for the truth of what happened in the real world, mind you. I only want to understand Yasu's heart in that world as well.

In the whole of Umineko there is just one thing I can't accept.

And that is the idea that Yasu, as a male, was kept secret from Kinzo, to avoid Kinzo raping Yasu due to being re-incarnated Beatrice.

I just feel that it only leaves the possibility for Yasu to be female.

>>8699929
Men can be raped, too, and Kinzo's obsessed. The two don't mix well.

>>8699929
Also Genji started worrying about You getting raped only after Yasu falled off that cliff and was raised as a girl.

after a thousand years I've finished EP8 and came to /jp/ to read some umineko discussion because I wanted to know more about yasu's gender (I don't think I have enough patience to find and read every other thing besides the novels, while learning japanese to do so)

first thing I find is a thread with more than 250 replies just about that specific topic

amusing

also reading this thread right after reading umineko made me feel like it was a discussion among goats

>>8698904
She wasn't insane but in her eyes by 1986 the death was the only option for everyone to be happy. It's not like she murdered people for real, just planned it and afterwards realised that she couldn't kill anyone and someone did it instead of her.
It's also possible that she knew about someones intention to kill everyone and decided to be a "red herring". But it's unsupported and a little stupid.

>Many were understanding the motive, but because they weren’t satisfied with it they denied it.

Your case?

I don't hate it but it sucked
Entertaining, sure, but it sucked
I don't believe in wasted time but I kind of want my 200 hours back here

>>8700368
>but because they weren’t satisfied with it they denied it.
That's not it. I'm satisfied with the motive, but my problem is that it does not appear to give her sufficient reason to kill. This leads me to believe that I'm missing something. And I want to understand Beatrice, so I can't move on until I feel that I have reached that goal.

Your argument seems to be that either:
A. She didn't kill.
B. There is some fantasy-based motive, for example, to bring everyone to the Golden Land where they can be happy. I've seen someone else give me the idea that she was actually using the epitaph as a magic spell to revive Beatrice.

I'm sure everyone will think that option B is the equivalent of "she went insane" but, let it be known that I really couldn't care less.

>>8700760
I mean that maybe for us such reason wasn't enough but for her it was. With all of the stress she got in the last two years made her think that the death is the only way to end all of the problems, and not just hers, Ushiromiya family as well. But after all in RPrime she wasn't capable of murdering anyone. And felt guilty for "commiting countless sins in countless worlds" and making this fake murder game, which went wrong.

If you read the interview he talks about how George wanted to have kids, etc.

I think when R07 talks about "Love" being Yasu's motive, he means in general. Battler complicated things by coming back.

>>8700403
>200 hours
Holy shit, how slow do you read?
...Unless you're including the time for speculation and discussion.

>>8701326
Not him, but it took me anywhere from 4 days to a week to read each of the 8 novels. I don't know how many hours that was, but it was 2 months before I finished. Not everyone is a fast reader.

Despite that though, 200 hours is probably an exaggeration...

>>8701421

I really hope you read only 2 or so hours a day and it took you 4-8 days doing that.

If you mean total read time 4-8 days, that is 96-192 hours, per episode, then shit something is seriously wrong.

>>8701649
About 4 hours a day. I'm slow, but not THAT slow...

I am huge fan of the series at the start.
Ep3 was great, I love the troll end and it takes a genius like R07 to turn it into shit.
If the game is standalone you can judge it separately but in this case every episodes are actually connected.
Why Umineko sucks?
Retarded motive and story telling
->Every episodes are fiction written by our truly gay incest loving Shkanon and memory loss main character
->Heavily implied that the two said writers are somehow indirectly involved with the massacre and in the case of the dickless crossdressing maid directly involved on it
->Justify all the retarded solutions (crossdressing, people pretending to be dead, unable to differentiate a dude wearing pads and a dude without pads, getting out of a room by killing inner personality & etc) by saying they were written by our 2main writers
->Real Rokkenjima has no such mystery, they were just massacre by Ange's family and bomb
->Meta fiction to match the siblings inner personality conflict and lolamnesia mystery writer
->R07 worst offense is however forcing the reader to pick MAGIC and this inturn does a true 180 compare to ep1 point
Pure escapism.

Umineko is a 3/10 game.
I give it 3 for the music, the only good thing about the game.

>>8703473
Sorry, goat, but Umineko isn't for people who are looking to have the answer spoonfed to them at the end.

1. No way of getting the answers from the author? Don't feel like thinking? Well shit, might as well say it's all 100% fiction and blame it on R07.
2. Actually, it's implied that neither of them ever killed anyone.
3. What were you expecting? These are logic puzzles, and they're supposed to be challenging. The solutions are obviously going to be things that you wouldn't think of so easily.
4. That was never confirmed, not even close. The EP7 Tea Party was "truth of a sort," and NOT necessarily the truth of the real world at all. We also never saw the contents of Eva's diary. R07 wasn't planning to give us the answer for this from the start. Get over it.
5. No idea what you're even talking about here. The Meta-World scenes can be interpreted in any number of ways, but I've never seen someone say that they were about the siblings.
6. Poor narrow-minded humans being forced to choose an answer that can't be objectively proven to exist? Escapism!

>>8703573
Are you stupid or have a reading comprehension of Battler level?
Who was complaining about R07 not giving answers?
>implied that neither of them ever killed anyone.
Oh really? Not even in self defense?

>they were about the siblings.
Think back on who the real writer is. It is not Tohya only. And guess who is the main MC of all the long winded meta shit, it is mincemeat-chan.

We dont need to know the content of the diary if it broke Ange and lolamnesiaBattler down right rejected his memory to know the shit that went on.
They wouldnt react this way if it was all bubbles and sparkles.

Goddamm are all umiunko fan that retarded that can only go GOAT GOAT and eat up R07 bullshit.

http://miharayuki.blogspot.com/2011/12/umineko-hane-screenshot-preview.html

well there is still more material people....

After briefly skimming about 1/4 of this thread it seems everyone likes Umineko. If that is the case then why was there such a huge uproar and shitfest about it back then?

>>8703654
The two TIPS in Hane don't give us anything new. One of them, we've already seen, and the other is about a play Jessica wrote.

>>8703595
>Oh really? Not even in self defense?
I said it was implied, not that it was proven. And it was implied. In "October 6, 1986" Battler stated that Beatrice did not commit any sins in this world. There was also Beatrice's statements in EP8 about how, if she does have any sin, it's that she left those message bottles behind.

In Battler's case, we at least know that he is not the culprit on any of the game boards because of a Red Truth spoken in EP5, which explicitly applies to all games. Furthermore, he never seemed to be feeling any guilt over any supposed crime he might have committed, and he was pretty much always tied with Natsuhi for 'most morally good person in the entire family.' It's so difficult to make his personality fitting for a culprit that, when R07 created Culprit!Battler in one of the TIPS for Tsubasa, he was like an entirely different person. Is he even capable of killing anyone?

>They wouldnt react this way if it was all bubbles and sparkles.
So that means that some tragedy happened, but does that mean Kyrie and Rudolf killed anyone? Not even close. We know so little about what happened in the real world in Umineko that we could even theorize that magic exists in that world and a witch did it all. It's entirely possible.

>Who was complaining about R07 not giving answers?
You hate the Magic ending because you know it's all human tricks and therefore this is escapism, right? You were also upset about the stories being fictions (when actually, they all probably contain some degree of truth). I'm getting the impression that you're butthurt.

>>8703595
>lolamnesiaBattler down right rejected his memory to know the shit that went on
He didn't reject his memory though. He had trouble regaining it due to the physical pain (headaches etc) it put him through. He was also unable to relate to the Battler in his memories when he did regain them, feeling like he was ceasing to be himself. That was because of the brain damage, not because the truth was unpleasant for him.

>>8703712
I suppose it was in part the same kids of always who have fun saying everything is shit, and in part people who liked it but were at the time too focused in the bad points of the novel, which are quite many.

>>8703753
What about "17 years old Angel" tip? Will someone translate it?

Uuu...

>>8704900

Dammit Maria!

How many times do I have to tell you to stop with that stupid noise?!

>>8704914
UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!!!

>>8704929
how did you suddenly change your outfit, maria?

>>8706452

It's magic witches ain't gotta explain shit

>>8706452
I changed her outfit

>>8706765
Did you touch her body while doing so?

>>8706735
maria isn't in her witch mode or in the meta world, so there's no magic involved.

>>8706452
She was wearing the new outfit(sans jacket) under her usual dress. She simply took off her old clothes, showing her new clothes underneath and took the jacket out of her purse since she was a little cold. Pff, amateurs.

“Erika is, without a doubt, the best character in Umineko. Period.
Why? The reason people like Erika more than any other character in Umineko is pretty logical: She’s the most developed, and you can either pity her, find her loveable or like her because she’s just brilliant but batshit crazy at the same time. Everyone can find something desirable in her character.
Yes, she was characterized better in THREE (short) episodes than Battler was in SEVEN. In ep 5 we saw her ruthlessness and how desperate she was to be accepted and praised by someone (Bern), and witnessed her underhanded tactics in ep 6 (as well as some interesting background story, her using her detective skills to reveal her lover’s affair).
What makes her a great villain is that she really wasn’t a villain at all, just a character on the opposing side. She’s probably the most human, and out of everyone does the least amount of angsting.”

>>8710046
that purse is hardly big enough to fit a big coat and completely new set of clothes. they would barely fit even in a large backpack, so a small kid purse couldn't hold them.

you could at least try to come up with a coat rack standing off screen or a sofa where her other clothes were on, erika. your detective sense is slipping, even battler's small bombs made more sense.

This might just be me, but if the following things happened:

- Mother kept as sex slave by father
-My father is my grandfather
- Crazy woman tossed my ass off a cliff as a baby
- Forced to live as a girl, and a servant
- Forced to put up with assholes on the regular
- Solve epitaph and meet father/grandfather
- Receive half-assed apology and dead mother's dress

I would make plans to kill the entire family as well. So Yasu wanting to kill everyone is more than justified. Of course, if you throw love into the equation, Yasu probably believed that killing them would be doing them a favor. Yasu could get revenge, and everyone could go to the Golden Land and live the lives they were supposed to have.

As for the real world Rokkenjima, I don't think Yasu killed anyone. The guilt they felt was because they spent so much time imagining a murder scenario, and then to have it happen, it probably felt to them that they caused it. I also think Yasu could be Touya, who took on the Battle/Touya persona after the real Battler died/killed themselves.