/jp/ - Otaku Culture

twowho sucks

>>17599459
just dont move dude

I really want ZUN to make another Phantasmagoria game.

>>17599132
In that case, why not just bomb through Shou? The game certainly gives you enough resources to do so, something that can't be said for LoLK.
And saying "just play on Legacy" isn't really fair, because that's not how the game was meant to be played, and not what it was balanced around. Sure, I slogged through on Easy to see the Legacy endings, but that wasn't rewarding, and it was after I had already come to hate the game by playing through Normal Pointdevice for days to see the real endings.
But in any case, if you don't see the entirety of stage 5 and Clownpiece as a "noticeably unfun part," then we'll never agree.

>>17599995
>that's not how the game was meant to be played
You realize that ZUN just trolled your ass?

>>17600133
How do you figure? From the very beginning, the entire reason for the game's existence was that he wanted to build an STG around the pointdevice mechanic; he explicitly said as much. And the game is obviously balanced around it. What would make you imply that Legacy is the intended way to play it?

>>17599512
That only works in DDC.
https://a.pomf.cat/bkgnpf.rpy

>>17600187
Well, his tendency to constantly troll his own fanbase aside. Why is Legacy mode in the game and why did he even bother with grazing mechanics then? If PD is the way meant to be played why not just remove it? Not to mention that almost everybody plays Legacy and will you to stay away from PD.
>and the game is obviously balanced around it
This fucking guy.

>>17600187
PD is clearly meant as a practice mode before doing Legacy runs, and as a way to play into the overarching theme of purity without forcing No Miss runs.

>>17600335
>almost everybody plays Legacy
Every time someone posts his 1cc chart here, LoLK's only colored spot is a Reisen/Sanae PD clear on Normal.

>>17600924
Good use of the 1cc charts anon

>>17600914
That's the wrong way around, though. The mechanic doesn't play into the theme, the theme was derived from the mechanic.
And again, ZUN said, both in an interview and right in the game's menu screen, that Pointdevice is the intended way to play it. If anything, Legacy is the bonus that was added for flavor reasons, because the true end is supposedly getting a no-miss clear without drinking the Elixir, even though that's completely unreasonable for most players.
Practicing doesn't even help that much in LoLK. Dying to some near-impossible bullshit 99 times then finally managing to land on the exact right pixel isn't very educational.

>>17599995
>>17600187
>>17600924

This "LoLK was designed around pointdevice therefore Legacy is trash" meme needs to stop. People have LNBs and LNNs of LoLK in legacy, and the only person with an LNB that I heard complaining about LoLK's "unbalance" was [name censored by janitor] and his "Pixel Perfect bullshit" meme on which he probably changed his mind by now. Everyone else that I've heard talking about it never called it unbalanced or incredibly hard compared to LNNs or LNBs in other games.

Even if you ignore the fact that you can bomb through the whole game, it's still very doable and fun apparently, if you know what you're doing.

Yes, ZUN designed his game around PD, that doesn't mean legacy is unplayable. Lots of games are designed around a certain mode and then have a bunch of other modes that are still playable, and LoLK is no exception.

>>17601076
>Dying to some near-impossible bullshit 99 times then finally managing to land on the exact right pixel isn't very educational.

Literally nothing is pixel perfect unless you make shit reading decisions, and especially nothing is near-impossible. This just seems like a classic case of "it's only shit if you're shit" like with UFO. Sorry anon but git gud

>>17601418
I agree completely.
Then again, it shouldn't be said that legacy is played the most anyways, because that's clearly not the case.

>>17600924
?

>>17601076
>The mechanic doesn't play into the theme, the theme was derived from the mechanic.
I think you'll find that the difference between these two things is much smaller than you'd believe.

>>17601418
This. It's a shame that it's so difficult to find good criticism of the game (as it does have some flaw, they just are rarely brought up). I enjoy it myself, but it's not perfect obviously.

>>17600924
Did you just look at the previous thread and call it a day?

>>17601418
>[name censored by janitor]
holy lel

>>17601418
>[name censored by janitor]
What

>>17602178
Janny's deleted every post and subsequent reply chain that even mentions any actual name, for good reason really. Applies mostly to western "e-celebs" though. Happens in the vn thread too.

At what point is bombing in LoLK PD acceptable? I'm at stage 5 and I'm assuming this is where the real terror begins.

>>17602645
You literally have infinite tries, getting through PD isn't really an impressive feat, bombs or not

>>17602668
>getting through PD isn't really an impressive feat
Shit takes a severe toll on your sanity though.

>>17602668
Yeah but trying to do this on Legacy seems like it would be a shitshow.

>>17602645
Don't bomb until you get to Clownpiece.

Okina is hard. Is there any sort of movement trick to her non-spell cards or do I just have to git gud?

>>17603276
Her non-spell patterns are mostly micromovement mixed with some specific movements. There's no real tricks to making it easier, but if you have some bombs you can use the invulnerability to rake up some insane graze and pretty much bring your gauge to full. She's good for release abuse in general thanks to the structure of her patterns.

>>17600924
>someone posts his 1cc chart here
excuse me but did you just assume my gender

>>17601076
>wrong way
ZUN says this in SCoOW.
>But it's not like you have to clear the game on Legacy Mode or anything
>>17601594
That's a really good chart anon, but HRtP needs some more love.
>>17601607
No, it's like that almost every thread and you know it.

>>17603509
My waifu isn't in HRtP, silly.
But seriously, it's just so different from everything else, and plays so weirdly. I just don't really feel any motivation to get a Lunatic 1cc, or even a Normal 1cc on the harder route.

>>17603587
Well, it's got some sweet music and it's a pretty neat game, but it's understandable. Also
>Lunatic 1cc
you probably know it already, but the tiles release bullets when you turn them on Lunatic.

Well I'm getting better at this.

>>17601418
Your post seems to me like a classic case of a very skilled player not being able to properly judge difficulty because everything is too far beneath him.
>you can bomb through the whole game
>it's still very doable
>nothing is pixel perfect
It's like we didn't even play the same game. Clowpiece is absolutely unreasonable, and basically singlehandedly makes the game impossible to 1cc on Normal for a Normal-level player. Her spells are fast and require extreme precision, meaning that even once you know how to do them, they still take a significant amount of raw skill, so they essentially can't be practiced.
But to be clear, I was never saying Legacy was "trash", just that it's not a reasonable alternative for a typical player who doesn't find Pointdevice fun. If you're good enough to play it, then yeah, it probably is the more fun mode.

>>17603670
>impossible to 1cc on Normal for a Normal-level player
The game definitely feels like LoLK normal is harder than Hard mode on other games.

Someone pass along a 1cc chart template including all PC-98 and fighting games, please.

>>17603782

WOO

>>17604085
Good work anon!

>>17604085
Good job, you won for real

>>17604148
>>17604197
My ass hasn't been that clenched in a while. This was my first time actually seeing her final spell card, so I lucked out hard.

>>17602645
I think it's acceptable to bomb once you've died so many times that you lose power. I went below 3.00 on one of Clownpiece's spellcards and it become just about impossible to capture without timing out as a result. I don't know why ZUN put a power drain in PD.

>>17604085
Is the English patch already out?

>>17604324
Dude it's been out.

>>17604322
it can only go down .50 per chapter, so I guess it was to make sure there was still a bit of a downside to dying?

How much of your dodging is subconscious, /jp/?

I guess I've kinda burned out on SA (yet, you can bet your ass I'll be once again playing this game very shortly) so I decided to go back to PCB and fill a bit of the Extra grid.
Probably the only game whose Extra modes I can actually deal with.
Why can't ZUN go back to this bombing system?

>>17604407
I'm like the Koishi of dodging

>>17602668
See
>>17568742
>>17589810

>>17603509
Should be grateful anon even included HRtP at all
>>17601418
wtf why was this deleted, it was pretty much spot on.

I wanted to try Mokou with the Scarlet Team after a long time not playing IN. This is the first try result. I wasted 2 deathbombs early on Possessed by Phoenix, and then held my ground without any bomb left for the last 30 or so seconds, and then captured Hourai Doll right afterwards.
Remilia is OP.

>>17603670
I might not have the best idea of what is generally considered difficult for a normal mode 1cc player, but I do feel like having to give people a reality check if they unironically claim that things are "pixel perfect" or impossible or anything like that. I don't think I can really convince you at this point, but all I can say is that there are tons and tons of runs out there that prove that clownpiece or whatever bothers you in LoLK is not exceptionally undoable.

Also, janitor, please cool it. I just gave an example people know about so they would know I wasn't talking out of my ass. I didn't make fun of him, I didn't even mention his name, all I did was mildly mock your """"policy"""" of deleting even the smallest mention of someone's existence. But the joke writes itself apparently.

Guess this post is going to the shadow realm as well now.

>>17602668
>bombs or not
PD LNB is a lot harder than Legacy Lunatic 1cc honestly. Having to do PDH and some other nasty spells can take some time.

>>17602645
If on normal, don't be afraid to use them on clownpiece's spells since they are apparently really rough. On Lunatic, save as much as you reasonably can for Junko. You'll need at least 1 for Junko's final, but expect to need at least 4 or 5 for Junko if you don't want to get stuck forever.

>>17604901
>not exceptionally undoable
For you. Again, if you're blessed with enough inherent physical skill, then it may seem easy enough. And I'm saying, for those of us who can't micrododge like a fucking madman at the speed of light, all the reply studying in the world won't make it better.

did't expect I' be able to lose an IN normal 1cc but with how bullshit sakuya solo is to play I actually made it happen, wow.

didn't play in 3 months but its ok cause cirno day gives you supernatural powers, only 2 9's though

What's the most difficult non-spell you've encountered in the series?

>>17605630

>>17604810
So you don't exist?

>>17605630
shou's 2nd

>>17605798
no, his dodging skills can't be perceived.

>>17605630
Cirno's first really throws me the fuck off just because of how fast it is immediately after a cutscene

>>17605946
Calling touhou's talking sections cutscenes is a bit much, unless we're talking about the unskippable ones like sakuya and youmu's midstage monologue lines but we obviously aren't right now

>>17605630
Well I am new, I played really only EoSD, but damn, stage 5 is harder than fight with Sakuya itself. Dodging some of those is so hard

>>17606138
He doesn't know about the safe spot! Everyone, point and laugh!

>>17606236
There is one? I was searching for something like that lately while grinding stage 5 in practice mode, but couldn't find it

Any tips for DDC? I've beaten everything else 1cc, even LoLK, but somehow this game fucks me up.

>>17606138
Non-spell refers to a boss phase that isn't a spell card, rather than the stage itself.

>>17605630
I'm going to say Clownpiece's first, but I haven't played the series all that long, and only fought Clownpiece once.

>>17606264
Pick the Crimson Slasher and press shift

>>17606307
Reimu with the bewitched weapon?

>>17606344
ye

>>17606264
Gonna need a little more detail than that, anon. What part is giving you trouble? Are you taking full advantage of the game mechanics?

>>17606307
I personally prefer needle Reimu, but isn't MariB the "best" for survival?

>>17606361
Isn't it Sakuya A and her slow-down explodoswords?

>>17606361
MarisaB is like Aya Fall in HSiFS
Semi-broken in Lunatic and useless for lower difficulties

>>17605630
Haven't encountered myself just yet because I always play Reimu B, but Benben's third non-spell seems like a bitch.

>>17606440
Yatsuhashi's are a lot worse.

>>17606361
Benben and Shinmyoumaru are the parts giving me trouble. Benben in general I suck at dodging and liberally bomb through and Shinmyoumaru trips me up with a few of her spells. By the time I get to her, my resources are so depleted that I can't feasibly get through all of her shit.

How the fu*k do you dodge books?

>>17606585
kill the 2nd one, the first one is invincible for 5 seconds

>>17606561
Both are pretty troublesome bosses, but I don't see how that's keeping you from a 1cc. You should be able to start stage 4 with almost full resources, so even if you use all those accumulated bombs on Benben, that leaves you going into stage 5 with full or almost full lives; if Seija isn't giving you too much trouble, then you should still have more than enough lives to beat Shinmyoumaru with any A-type character.
Running out of resources so easily means that you're either dying a lot with bombs in stock, or not taking advantage of the resource system, or both. Aside from the obvious advice of being more proactive with bombs and more aggressively using the PoC, you should also learn where you can trade bombs for life pieces.

>>17606678
That's probably the biggest other issue, I just take 0.5x bonuses or other small ones and get bomb pieces instead of life pieces. I don't start stage 4 with full resources besides almost maxed bombs.

>>17606374
>MarisaB is like Aya Fall in HSiFS
>Semi-broken in Lunatic and useless for lower difficulties
Everything you just said is so disgustingly wrong.

>>17606807
Explain with a reasonable argument why

>>17606820
To keep it short
>Semi-broken in Lunatic
You can reach max lives from the last two stages alone. And that's not even bringing up Extra.
>useless for lower difficulties
False, even normal has points where Marisa can easily grind out extra lives, something no other shot can do. And that's not mentioning how her shot is still pretty decent even without the bomb.
>Aya Fall in HSiFS is useless for lower difficulties
None of the things that make her such a good shot disappear in lower difficulties. In fact, her fantastic shotgun damage is even more abusable on Normal. Now, her subshot, sure, that's not as abusable when you're not on Lunatic, but it's still better than Winter on Normal and Hard thanks to the maneuverability allowing you to to effectively destroy bullets scattered across the srcreen.

>>17606844
You agree with my first point so why are you bringing it up?

>False, even normal has points where Marisa can easily grind out extra lives
Not as easily as higher difficulties
More bullets == more points
It's not hard concept to grasp you know

>>17606844
>it's still better than Winter on Normal
Wrong, Winter give you some good damage which is more useful for survival

>>17606851
Points don't matter in DDC which is the MarisaB we're discussing.

>>17606857
You still need more bullets
The arguments stands

>>17606851
>You agree with my first point so why are you bringing it up?
It's not just "semi-broken"

>Not as easily as higher difficulties
But still pretty easily. That's where it's semi-broken.

>Winter give you some good damage which is more useful for survival
The release doing so little damage means that, unless you're doing a no release run, Summer will end up doing more damage more consistently to bosses on average. Winter got nerfed hard from the demo in that regard.

I don't think you actually know what you're talking about, and remind me of a poster from that circlejerk of a general over on another board.

>>17606866
>It's not just "semi-broken"
Then you must have a very different defition of broken

>But still pretty easily. That's where it's semi-broken.
Uh no, that's why I said in higher difficulties
If you need to put some work to break something on a difficulty like normal then why don't you just pick up a good shottype?

>The release doing so little damage means that, unless you're doing a no release run, Summer will end up doing more damage more consistently to bosses on average.
It gives you a more consistent stream of damage on top of your shottype, try it with Reimu and you'll see what I mean, that is if you actually play the games. Because nobody with more than 15 minutes of experience uses winter for releases.

>remind me of a poster from that circlejerk of a general over on another board.
And once again you bring something completely unrelated to the topic because you have no arguments left, you are a really pathetic person you know.

>>17606886
>Then you must have a very different defition of broken
I'd say that yours is too loose. You don't have to be Marisa B MoF to be busted. Might as well call Sanae or Reisen in LoLK fair and balanced by those standards.

>try it with Reimu and you'll see what I mean
Oh, well that makes sense. Reimu has shit damage, so of course you'd worship the subshot that fixes her lame ass in standard, non-extra play.

>And once again you bring something completely unrelated to the topic because you have no arguments left
Only because I have yet to see any real arguments from you, aside from vague complaints of "b-but it isn't strong enough!" As well, your style of posting is obnoxious and fairly toxic.

Last pity reply.

>>17606054
my point still remains, her first non-spell is really fast for one right out of a conversation

>>17606917
They are overpowered, but then again LoLK is a mess of a game so it doesn't matter

>Reimu has shit damage, so of course you'd worship the subshot that fixes her lame ass in standard
She has good damage and the laser complement her homing shottype, how is this even an argument?

>Only because I have yet to see any real arguments from you, aside from vague complaints of "b-but it isn't strong enough!" As well, your style of posting is obnoxious and fairly toxic.
Who are you quoting? What do you mean by toxic? Are you lost? or just stupid?

>>17605630
Both of Satori's nonspells can go fuck themselves, especially if you're playing as Marisa.

Heh
What did you think of Aya in HSiFS?

>>17607038
What's wrong with Marisa?

>>17607045
In SA? A lot of things.

>>17607072
聞かせてもらう
I hope you have good arguments because I won't tolerate you talking shit about cutest witch.

>>17607045
Marisa's giant fucking hitbox guarantees her death in certain situations, Satori's nonspells being one of them.

>>17607039
She's okay, if ZUN had been less lazy she would have been definitely better though.

>>17607095
With her shot, that is

>>17607095
What do you mean?

>>17607106
Ayaya is a great character

After losing to Okuu last spell for like 4 times I took a break from playing Touhou, now I came back and had some fun with EoSD and HSiFS, might aswell finish the whole IN Normal chart.

>>17605135
What does the black dot at TD's Marisa mean?

>>17607397
>What does the black dot at TD's Marisa mean?
I was trying to specify that i got the alternate ending on that one so i tried to put a plus in there but with how pixel are it got a bit too blunt, I'll probably change it to an A or something

>>17606445
Are you kidding? Those are infinitely easier. There are gaps about everywhere you look. I'm talking Lunatic, by the way.

How do I beat this fucking womanlet final boss in DDC? Her knives spell has such little lenience to dodge the homing knives and the spell where she makes you bigger isn't accurate on the hitbox and I get hit by random kunai. Her last spell, well, I just can't dodge well enough.

>>17607397
>no SA or DDC clear

If you can manage PD LoLK, you can manage both. It's a matter of maximizing your resources.

>>17607470
Just bomb through everything. If you can't get to her with enough lives to do that, practice the other stages until you can; the rest of the game is a lot more learnable than her fight.

>>17607498
I think I'm too dumb to learn when to bomb for lives. I get to the last stage with either 3 or 4 lives.

>>17606863
m8 MarisaB is enough to break Normal

>>17607397
Great job with those games anon!
Also listen to >>17607472, you got those on the bag.

>>17604884
Congrats anon!
Remilia deals tons of damage if you place the familiars well.

>>17607560
Why would you break such an easy difficulty?

Anyone know how I could slow down my replay?

Playing EoSD

>>17607515
Four lives should be enough; certainly five is. If you're not confident fighting Shinmyoumaru with that many, then I take back the previous post; you should actually practice stage 6 a bit. But you're obviously close, so just work on every stage a little bit and you'll be fine.

>>17607645
On the vpatch.ini file that you should be using, there is "ReplaySlowFPS = 30", you can change 30 if you want to make it slower, then while watching the replay press focus.

>>17607654
The time I got there with 4 lives I ended up losing 2 to dumb stuff and with bombs left. Very upset.

>>17607472
Yeah I know I can beat SA already, I even got to her last spell with 2 lives left but I choked horribly, right now I'm not feeling like playing it again because it ruins my mood so badly, but I'll give DDC a shot since I haven't played that game for months.

whats a good 2hu to start at for newshits

>>17608274
6

>>17608281
Ty

>>17608274
6, 7, or 8

>>17607463
Odd, I can do Benben's reliably, but Yatsuhashi I can't fucking handle.

How many/which games do you have to 1cc before you're considered good?

>>17608274
EoSD and TD at the same time. The former for learning how to play, the latter for making you feel better about yourself when you get a quick 1cc.

Trying to get through Kanako on continues. Holy shit why.
I just want to beat it so I can then practice the level. Should I just give in and download a scorefile?

>>17608472
>1cc
>good

>>17608472
Define good. A single normal 1cc in any game probably puts you above half of the population of people who's ever touched the series at all. Is that good enough for you?

Just beat Byakuren. She was easier than most final bosses but damn, that stage (and UFO in general) had the best atmosphere from all the games

>>17608472
get on jap ``official'' score list and you might be considered decent

>>17608472
I'd say LNBs are pretty soild and are a mark of a good player. They are a decent start for mastery of a game as instead of doing the usual bombspam, you're forced to really learn the games' actual patterns.

>tfw I've hit a wall where I've gotten too comfortable
>lose lives to stupid shit like stray bullets because I'm not paying attention
>don't want to bomb because I feel like I can clear spellcards without it, which means I usually die with like 5 bombs because I fuck up
How can I turn myself back into the nervous shitter who liberally cheesed hard spellcards with bombs and didn't lose 1cc runs in stage 4?

>>17609182
Try a harder difficulty.

>>17609175
I'd say LNBNMNF's are pretty soild and are a mark of a good player. They are a decent start for mastery of a game as instead of doing the usual bombspam/life abuse/focus abuse, you're forced to really learn the games' actual patterns.

>>17609021
>best atmosphere
>not SA

>>17609021
>Those heartbeats when you reach the end of stage 6

>>17609248
>want to hate the game because it's difficult
>start to develop Stockholm Syndrome for stages 4 and above because everything is really well-designed

>>17609222
I agree! No Focus is definitely a good challenge factor to add into runs. It encourages learning how to precisely steer your character in dangerous bullet situations.

Maybe throw on a 90 fps or a no vertical condition.

>>17609021
>Returning to Makai after PC-98 years
>Saintly image suspense played up by devoutness of all stage bosses (except Kogasa)
>Space Invaders tribute
>Suspenseful music
>Witnessing the Second Coming of the "Jesus" of Youkai
>Boss finally representing a non-Shinto aspect (Buddhism), and is also based on an old religious story

As much as I dislike the Buddhist crew, nothing can ever top the intensity of UFO's finale.

Who am I quoting

>>17605630
Blue Hecatia's non-spells are complete bullshit.

>>17609248
SA is such a good game even if I'm too trash to 1cc it on anything above normal. Everything about it forces you to get good, be it the fact that it goes full throttle right from the start, the fact that you only get life pieces by not dying, the fact that using a bomb actively weakens you so you can't just spam bombs unless you want to make bosses take forever. Plus the atmosphere is top notch (that fucking stage 5), the music is probably all around zun's best work syncing near perfectly with the stages, and the final boss is you going toe to toe with a living nuclear weapon. Complete with blaring klaxons. Not to mention all the crazy fun spell cards.

I can barely 1cc this game on normal and I love the hell out of it anyway.

>>17609248
>not IN
It was the comfiest game.

>>17609429
It's all about planning your bombs and doing the attacks you know you can do confidently, anon. Orin and stage 6 are doable with low resources. I think my first Lunatic 1cc ever I got to Okuu with one/zero extra lives, and didn't lose any until Subterranean Sun.

>>17608522
Don't cheat, you pussy.
First, practice your faith point collection route for the first three stages to make sure you can get all the score extends by stage 6. Then, practice the bosses you're having trouble with to figure out which cards you can capture and which you have to bomb through. Finally, get to Kanako with max lives and wreck her shit.

>>17609070
These shitposts are the worst.

Steady progress.
I still don't understand how to do Okina's second and fifth cards in the Extra, but muddled through somehow. Not at all looking forward to doing it with Marisa.

>>17605630
junko

>>17610479
Marisa's lasers do a lot of damage, so it should be pretty easy with her. Only issue is the stage portion since her shot cant home in on the fairies before they fire their danmaku, obviously.

>>17610479
This is a nice looking chart. What are the strikes on TD for?

>>17610630
I'm more worried about getting knocked off-center during Okina's patterns and not being able to do any damage. Most of my failed runs so far have been because I died multiple times to those.

>>17610815
いいタイミング
Those are two-part cells to represent getting a regular 1cc vs the secret ending.

>>17610840
Clever!

>>17609432
>>17609354
>>17609289
>>17609267
>>17609248
>>17609182
>>17607472



Who are you quoting?

>>17611441
Your spacing really makes it clear that you're not from this board so stop scolding others for not fitting in when you can't yourself.

>>17611441
Does anyone know how a post is shitty due to clues from the formatting?

>>17609924
Holy shit, I got all the way to halfway through Mountain of Faith before dying this time, on my first credit.
I don't even want to continue this time, I want to try again from the start.

What combinations are good for survival in TH16? I wanted to use Marisa Winter for the extra damage but I realized Im too likely to get hit and something that actually lets me use c would be good

>>17612177
People often say Summer, but personally I think it sucks. Maybe I'm just not using it right. Spring has served me well enough if you just want to play survival.

>>17612177
Anything/Summer
inb4 that dumbass normalmodofag suggests Reimu/Winter.

>>17612195
>but personally I think it sucks.
You clearly have no idea how to use it, then.

>>17612177
Summer. You can skip several cards outright with it. People have said that fall is better than summer, but only on higher difficulties. Takes getting use to, though, so you should probably go with summer. Don't be shy with your release.

>>17612223
>People have said that fall is better than summer, but only on higher difficulties.
I don't think that's completely true. In general, regardless of difficulty, I personally find that summer gives you an easier early game, while fall gives you an easier late game. Where this cut off is, however, depends on the difficulty.

I got pretty close to no missing this on my first 1cc. One death on stage 5, and one death to Okina's nonspell with the blue kunai.

>>17612223
Which ones are good opportunities? I only know April Wizard from experimentation.

>>17612320
Jesus that ugly interface. Autopatcher was a mistake.

>>17612320
Not really sure of all the names, but Eternity's second, Aunn's third, the twins' second and third cards (I always go with the green one, but i think the red's second can also be done this way), one of Okina's, though another one you can do severe damage to her during. And Narumi's last card, too. I think that might be it, and I'm not sure if all of those can be skipped on all difficulties.It definitely works on Aunn and Eternity on Lunatic. Though you'll have to be quick with Aunn, she can still get you.

>>17612223
>>17612197
>>17612195
Im gonna try Summer, any character I should go with for survival? I think Reimu is a good option so far

>>17612320
Also congratulations, only 2 deaths? I need to step up my game.

>>17612337
You'll have no issue with reach if you use summer, so Reimu would be kind of redundant.
Go with Marisa or Aya to compliment the winter spread with some actual damage.

>>17612337
If you're someone who has trouble dodging, try using Reimu. Otherwise, Marisa's pretty good.

>>17612329
Thanks a lot for the tips, I'll put them to use with Marisa next.

>>17612197
ReimuWinter is ok
t. got my first ever lunatic 1cc with it

>>17612452
Good luck anon, but honestly, you should be fine with any character. Even I could clear everyone with summer.

He did it!

>>17612778
*sigh* can't wait for this and the next gameplay thread to be cancer again as usual

How many are you from Eientei?

>>17612895
I know right? Because you can't keep an episode of scoring vs LNN fake drama in a single thread, no it has to go on in the next thread too.

>>17612197
If only it wasn't bugged and didn't fire only one laser which is basically a handicap.

>>17612959
They really can't stop posting about their talent everywhere. Janny will delete it soon, don't worry.

>>17612963
You mean they stack up to a single bigger beam or actually increasing the number of lasers won't influence the damage?

>>17612956
Only you, hime.
>>17612971
He means that he has outdated information.

>>17549860
>>17607472
>>17607563
I finally got it after months of trying, thanks to all those who have believed in me.
>>17549652
It worked thanks.

>>17613069
Great job anon, I knew you could!

>>17613069
Masturbate more and you'll become a god

>>17613069
Bravo!

>>17613069
Good work anon, I knew you could do it!

Got really fucking close to beating HSiFS with winter, but I always end up jobbing at one of the later 3 stages (In this case, stage 6, and that's the easy one for me). I think Summer gave me bad habits that don't jive with winter very well.

>>17612197
>inb4 that dumbass normalmodofag suggests Reimu/Winter.
But ReimuWinter is the goto for LNNN.

>>17612967
So which of you discord niggers is the /jp/ janitor?

>>17614089
There's a discord?

>>17614089
Who is this janny person? Go away /sp/.

Guys, help
My eyes are welling up and it's messing with me on my retry

>>17613069
Did you read doujins about Orin being raped.

I went back to 1cc IN as Marisa/Alice and I can't seem to do it. Every other team is easier.

>>17614419
Alice is actually so bad that she actually brings the team down, MAlice cannon aside.
Try to avoid using her bomb at all costs.

I did it. Beat MoF after devoting my weekend to it.

Where to go from here?

>>17614533
HSiFS is pretty easy, try that or IN if you just want to start filling spots.

>>17614533
Play them in order you brainlet.

>>17613069
>>17614533
Nice job, both of you.

>>17614232
It's okay, anon. Cry it out.
We'll be here for you when you can come back.

>>17613127
>>17613136
>>17613182
Thanks again, I've been bitching about this game for like 5 threads so I'm bloody happy about it. There were many other anons who were playing SA and for those who are still struggling with it: don't give up and remember, ReimuC can be your salvation, her bomb pretty much gave me the 1cc and it makes Satori easier (or atleast easier than ReimuA)

>>17614235
No, rape is gross.

>>17614232
What game are you playing anon?

>>17614697
Rape complemented with mindbreak is top tier, faggot

Anyone know why SA only has ONE (1) good shot type? Picking any other shot other than Reimu A turns your run into a fucking nightmare and it's taking a toll on my sanity. Why did ZUN do this?

>>17614780
Bombs too good in MoF had to make everything you do in SA shit to compensate

>>17614780
Why are all of the shot types so fucking weird? I mean there's Nitori who's pretty standard all things considered. But using Patchouli makes me want to jump down a well.

>>17614780
Honestly, I think Reimu A is overrated. The bomb is abusable and the damage is high, sure, but your range is pretty pitiful and unlike Marisa shots of that nature you don't have the speed to really make up for that. It's still strong for SA, but in any other game it would be crap. Reimu B is fine if you treat it like a piercing shot, Reimu C is actually pretty decent in all regards, Marisa A has bomb abuse, Marisa B has a strong bomb and is the only really good spread shot, and Marisa C has a bomb that gives you a strong safety net.

>>17614799
Reimu A can warp to the other side of the screen, which simplifies streaming, deals high and consistent damage and has an amazing bomb as you've already mentioned. Her shot range is also much better than Reimu C's and Marisa C's. She's not overrated at all, she's simply the most useful for survival.

>>17614955
>Reimu A can warp to the other side of the screen, which simplifies streaming
Only in a few cases does this truely help. The slow speed leaves you vulnerable, and it's easy to accidentally warp into harm's way. I personally find Aya's speed and Suika's collection to be consistently more useful.
>Her shot range is also much better than Reimu C's
Objectively wrong. Reimu C is aimed.

>and Marisa C's.
Well duh.

Reimu A is probably the best SA shot, but she's not that far ahead and is crap next to the shots in pretty much any other Touhou game.

>>17613127
Yuyuko-sama is SO DAMN CUTE
HNG

>>17615025
She's just a fat ghost.

>>17614780
If you're not intentionally exaggerating, then you need to play the game a bit more and actually learn how to dodge stuff instead of just warping away from everything.

>>17614795
Patche's shot is the most rewarding once you learn how to use it.

>>17614419
>>17614515

Magic team is the best for survival

>>17615351
nice meme

>>17614795
>But using Patchouli makes me want to jump down a well.
Hey that's what the game is about, good going anon.
btw that's something that makes SA so great, is has got the best shottype variation.
>>17614984
>I personally find Aya's speed and Suika's collection to be consistently more useful.
Agreed, Suika's passive can be more useful than most think on lower difficulties, and Aya' speed combined with her bomb can clear the entire screen on stages and deal incredible damage to bosses.
>>17615025
The cutest!

>>17614697
MarisaC is my personal favorite for SA because it helped me practice a lot of spells instead of bombing through. Plus it gives you a lot more resources. ReimuA and MarisaC are probably the best two shot types in my opinion.

>>17615099
Shut the fuck up Patchy. You're even worse than Sakuya in IN.

On my new PC my DS3 only allows for movement with the analog stick in Touhou. Will using x360ce in the Touhou folder allow me to use the dpad?

>>17616616
Just play with joystick

>>17616726
Analog stick is unplayable.

>>17616761
Say that to that guy that LNB'd SA with one

I did it! DDC 1cc Normal clear!
I managed to do as you guys said and amass enough resources to make the final battle a little easier but I still made a lot of stupid mistakes, like during Shinmyoumaru's knives attacks. Now I've cleared 1cc Normal in every game except for LoLK Legacy.

>>17617163
It seems like you even managed the final spell card without dying, congratulations!

Am I legit yet /jp/?

>>17618015
Not quite yet, anon. Time to endure all those Extras and that Phantasm.

>>17614765
>>17614686
Actually I'm >>17614533 (and >>17612140
/>>17608522).
>>17614548
>>17614542
IN it is then.

>>17618015
Nice! now time to get clears with all the shot types.

>>17618424
Yeah you should move on to IN, you can also try EoSD and TD.

>>17618015
That's quite a bit of Marisa, anon, try taking a specific game and beating it with the other characters, then maybe move up a difficulty. Do extras, too.

>>17618523
There is nothing wrong with focusing on Marisa.

>>17618544
Nothing wrong with it, sure, but it's fun to try other shot types.

>>17618523
She's best girl aside from China

>Get through nearly every character in PoFV without 1ccing any
>Immediately 1cc on my first go with Aya.

This didn't feel as satisfying as I thought it would, even though it was really close. I was playing significantly shittier than usual, too.

>>17619706
PoFV is heavily reliant on RNG in the later stages so be happy you have good luck.

>>17619706
Aya slays the PoFV ai.

HSiFS is ridiculously easy in Normal mode. Enjoy your free 1CCs

>>17619994
Did your post get lost in a time warp for a month?

I've been trying out Mystic Square for a while. I'm also thinking of playing the fighting games as well.

>>17620134
If you actually 1cc'd LoLK, then you can easily fill in pretty much every single Normal cell on that chart. What are you waiting for?

What's the worst Touhou game and why is it EoSD?

>>17620406
That it's the ugliest there is no denying, one or two songs of the soundtrack are nice but as a whole the music in it isn't that great. It doesn't have any particular game specific mechanic though, which puts the game under an objective light though if you're new to the series that's negligible or even a downside. So to give it a last word, play this title at least as your 4th game if you want to like touhou.

>>17620337
LoLK isn't hat hard.

>>17620406
This needs an update

>>17621318
the extra stage is literally hell.

And that's that! Well, I'll still finish up all the sub-season clears, but those are just box-ticking.
Unlike certain easily-angered posters, I had no problem with Okina's being the Extra boss as well, but I do worry about the precedent being set by the latest two games. As in, I'm going to be mad if the standard from now on is having to clear the Extra just to resolve the plot of the main game. It was easy enough this time, but what if the next one is actually up to the usual level of difficulty?

>>17620406
But it's not.
>>17621346
Nah, my post is there.

>>17622052
But Extra in LoLK didn't resolve the plot of the main game, it was about as removed from it as UFO's and DDC's were

>>17620406
It's fucking TD. The Trance mechanic is shit, it's the easiest game, so much so that you can 1cc Normal on your first try and Lunatic after a little rote memorization.

>>17622187
>Extra in LoLK didn't resolve the plot of the main game
Yeah, it's not like the Lunar Capital wants its denizens back or something.

>>17619951
Is it really that much RNG? It explains why I've gotten so close only for Shiki to then job the moment I get my second continue.

>>17619968
I had heard that, but I didn't think it'd be that much of a gap.

>>17622052
Since you have strikes for the TD ending's shouldn't you do the same for IN?
btw nice touch for GFW, I might steal that

>>17622201
That's not part of the main game's plot, though

That's just Junko and Hecatia going for a last "fuck you" before leaving

>>17622233
Ai is on a death timer so they should die at around the same time, unless they get boxed in by large objects such as Reimu's ying yang orbs. So I don't think you can really blame RNG for not 1ccing. Sometimes it just lets you off easy.

Like the other anon said Aya, (and also Medicine) absolutely murder the AI regardless. A fair amount of characters, like Mystia or Reisen, have like no capability to accidentally kill the AI.

>>17622281
>unless they get boxed

>>17620337
I just spammed Reisen's bomb.

>>17622887
And? You could do the same in any other game.
Consider this: at the "peak" of my skill at LoLK, I couldn't manage a clear even with spamming Reisen's bomb, yet I can clear every other game with relative ease even while a little rusty. So if you can clear LoLK at all, even through cheap tactics, you should be able to breeze through the rest of them.
Looking at that chart, I don't know if you're intentionally avoiding SA and UFO or if it's just a coincidence, but let me assure you that neither are as tough as some people make them out to be. If you make an honest attempt at them, you'll succeed easily.

>>17623026
>So if you can clear LoLK at all, even through cheap tactics, you should be able to breeze through the rest of them.
Shit logic bro.

>>17605946
This so much, especially because I always forget about it and EoSD's earlygame is so simple otherwise that I'm really comfortable and relaxed by the time I get to Cirno. Getting a wide-spread shotgun of icicles suddenly is a surefire way to get the heart pumping.

>>17622281
I saw a video with the timer on the back of the character, is there a way to get that? Playing against Shikeiki for literally 3 minutes and she doesn't get hit once is bullshit.

>>17623128
That's the Extra mode you are talking about

>>17609182
The biggest hurdle I have to overcome to achieve my Normal 1CCs is just learning to bomb more often, so the resources aren't going to waste and I'm not dying to stupid shit.

How long does Reisen's bomb last in LoLK?

>>17623182
3 hits, or the end of the stage.

>>17623064
I realize it may be difficult for you to hold two thoughts in your head at the same time, but try reading the sentence before that first to see how I reached that conclusion.

>>17623207
Yeah, it's shit logic. If you wanna compare games difficulties, at least do it right. LoLK isn't the hardest in Legacy Mode, like it or not.

>>17623249
Not that guy but what? Which game is harder? Mind you the chart in question is Normal 1ccs.

>>17623258
SA, GFW and UFO are all easily harder than LoLK Legacy, on normal mode.

>>17622496
those are small objects though. Cool gif nonetheless

>>17623026
I'm sorry man but I think you're the exception here. LoLK Reisen is insultingly easy. Anon should go for SA/UFO normal 1cc nevertheless.

>>17623295
>UFO
Oh boy are we having this argument again?

>>17620406
I love EoSD. Learning to read books is a spiritual journey in itself.

>>17623026
I started this chart around 4 months ago and have been playing on and off. I've played a bit of sa and ufo but haven't spent time memorizing anything past stage 4. I will get to them eventually but i want to play other games as well. I also find LoLK an overall fun game to play, which is why i have all the normal pd clears.

>>17623295
GFW sure but I don't agree with SA or UFO unless you're doing a normal 1cc as Reisen in LoLK.

>>17621156
>ESoD
>as a whole the music in it isn't that great.

Everything you said is spot, but i'm going to really disagree with you here.

Literally everything is top tier except for stage's 2 music, which is only meh and is saved by piggybacking on Cirno's iconic theme. If it wasn't for ESoD music, I really doubt touhou would have reached it's massive popularity that it has today.

>>17621156
>>17623671
The fact that EoSD doesn't have a game specific mechanic is good though, some of the other mechanics are lazy and do nothing but remove difficulty from the game. Trance and seasons are shit. UFOs, supernatural border, IN's time/last spells are much better mechanics without taking away much from the difficulty or altering the playstyle significantly.

>>17623595
That's a given.

>>17623752
How is choosing the cheese bomb character the standard for considering the difficulty of LoLK. In that case, Marisa/Nitori in SA are equally as cheesy, unless you go the full shitter route with Reimu/Yukari.

LoLK was a bad game.

>>17623700
>EoSD doesn't have a game specific mechanic
That was probably supposed to be the spell cards, or maybe the rank system, but he decided to keep the cards.

LoLK is still not good.

>>17623763
>How is choosing the cheese bomb character the standard for considering the difficulty of LoLK
Well, for measuring difficulty, you always take the best option into account, silly.
And no, MarisaC is not even close to Reisen. Not even SakuyaA from DDC.

>>17623804
Nah, Spell Cards were meant to be enduring, and there was a ranking system in all the first-gen games. The real answer is that EoSD was a rush job that didn't even have as many generic enemies as ZUN originally wanted.

I like LoLK and PoFV

>>17623763
What if I used ReimuC in SA?

>>17622052
So, let me get this straight, you're not okay with the story being extended into the extra, but you're okay with completely missing out on a new character and branching out story? You're a retard.

>>17623900
No you don't. By that logic no one would be able to agree on a difficulty because not everyone plays the same character for a number of reasons. You take either a standard shot that is not too good or too bad, or all of them, and that determines the difficulty of a game overall. There will always be attacks in which you'll struggle on more than others, regardless of cheese potential in one or two shots out of all options. LoLK is objectively harder than the other games due to higher density and speed combined. SA and UFO are harder, and GFW is even easier than all of them unless you're going for a no freeze clear, since the game is shorter and freezing is how you're meant to play the game anyway.

>>17623900
No you don't. By that logic no one would be able to agree on a difficulty because not everyone plays the same character for a number of reasons. You take either a standard shot that is not too good or too bad, or all of them, and that determines the difficulty of a game overall. There will always be attacks in which you'll struggle on more than others, regardless of cheese potential in one or two shots out of all options. LoLK is objectively harder than the other games due to higher density and speed combined. SA and UFO are easier, and GFW is even easier than all of them unless you're going for a no freeze clear, since the game is shorter and freezing is how you're meant to play the game anyway.

>>17624126
The best shot IS the standard shot anon.
UFO won't give you resources unless you learn and route the ufos, which is harder than bombing + grazing.
SA is harder and has a more punishing resource system.
GFW has a complex system for most people on the start, being shorter is meaningless and the bomb system also punishes harder than LoLK.

>>17624437
>The best shot IS the standard shot anon.
What an awful opinion.

>>17624451
Get used to it, it's how it goes for everything.

>>17624454
Not everyone is a tryhard who's willing to sacrifice what they find to be more fun for what is most efficient.
Ergo, it's not right to assume that everyone will be running the best shot types at all times.

>>17624460
It's not what everyone do, it's what the game makes you capable of.
LoLK is not the hardest to 1cc because you are capable of bombing the shit out of it and farming lives like no other game lets you to, whatever you choose to or not.

Posting progress since I won't be making any for a while it seems, got stuck.

>>17624467
An option which is only open to two of the shots, one on difficulties harder than normal.
An option that can't be abused by every shot is an option that shouldn't be considered as seriously when discussing a game's overall difficulty, a term which you seem to struggle with understanding.

Of course, this all stemmed from your desire to prove that you're not weird for completing a traditionally more difficult 1cc than a traditionally less difficult one, and to that I say who the fuck cares? Just work on your normal 1ccs you faggot. Don't get pissy when people say that you should be able to 1cc a game, just pull up your big boy pants and give it a whirl until you get it. Honestly, SA and UFO normals aren't too bad once you get the hang of things. SA bombs are stupid good on normal, and it's easy to get a shit ton of lives on UFO normal. At where you are, I could see you getting SA and UFO 1ccs after a little bit of work.
And of course, there's HSiFS, which is exploitable as fuck, and unlike LoLK you can exploit it with all shots, so no idea why you haven't gotten that one yet either.

Fairy Wars is a different set of skills, so I won't touch that one.

>>17624495
That's a great looking chart, but why's STB gold? Gonna do that for every finished chart?

>>17624500
That's the idea, unless they end up looking too ugly, but they shouldn't.

>>17624495
Fill in that PCB Phantasm gap, anon, you should be able to without too much issue, and it'll give you a sense of progression.
If you use Marisa B in DDC's extra, getting a clear shouldn't be too hard either. Look up the bomb only run to see what I mean.

>>17624495
Can I join the club? I'm stuck too. Can't do anything I want to do and there's some obvious undone stuff that I just don't want to do.
Don't want to learn HRtP, SoEW feels shit to play, Yumeko keeps fucking me even if I play as Yumeko, don't really want to NB LLS/MS extras, don't want to learn GFW, Nue and Okina keep fucking me on extra NMNB attempts every single time, Hecatia keeps fucking me on NB attempts, keep dying stupid early deaths on PCB LNB, keep choking on Mai&Satono on HSiFS LNBNR, don't feel like learning other LNBs since they feel fairly out of my reach, way too rusty with SA to think about LNN, Miko's 17 consecutive coin tosses card in ISC kills my motivation to grind out that and the other two cards I don't have, and no interest in pure box ticking, scoring or fighters.
I think I reached my limit as a not-super-talented player. Will still throw in some credits now and then for fun but that's about it until I find the drive again. Back to eroge for me.

I don't know if it's being unable to get through stage 4 without deaths, or just Youmu herself, but I think I've hit a wall with PCB. How do I deal with Youmu's cards?

>>17624495
why not clear TH16's EX? You can clearly do it if you can NB NR Normal Mode

>>17624849
He could also do hard/lunatic considering his clears on other games.

>>17624870
I'm puzzled as to why he bothered to complete normal with every character and every subshot.

>>17624877
muh checklist

I feel like the checklists should just have the tasks, not every single shottype of every game, I mean if you know you can do it why i the list not full until you do it with E V E R Y O N E

>>17624890
Because, ultimately, clearing LoLK extra with Reisen and clearing LoLK extra with Marisa are two completely different tasks of completely different difficulties.
Having every shot gives context to the accomplishment.

>>17624890
A border team clear in IN is not really equal in difficulty to a Sakuya solo clear, a SanaeB clear in UFO is not really equal in difficulty to a MarisaB clear, etc.

>>17624890
I've cleared HSiFS with everyone, but only on Summer, if I just had each character filled out with no regard for subseason, it'd seem like I had more skill than I really did.

>>17624437
No, it isn't. By standard shot I meant not broken, not entirely bad.
Sanae is the only character whose bomb you can abuse for graze, it's risky doing it with Reisen and the other two completely shut down grazing. UFO doesn't need much more routing than DDC needs it for life pieces or LoLK needs for grazing. And it's infinitely riskier in LoLK since you have to be close to the danger source as where as you can summon UFOs even when there are no bullets on screen, if you moved away from shooting them they'll come back to your damage range and they'll even do you a favor and cancel bullets when you destroy them.
SA has high density but not nearly as speedy as LoLK. Not harder. The resource system is pretty forgiving by letting you get life pieces even when bombing. There is no bombs per life limit which makes it by default more abusable than limited bombs, there are stage portions that even allow bombing with instant power recovery and oh what a coincidence it's the hardest parts since it has the highest amount of enemies onscreen.
>Being shorter is meaningless
Says who? Learning freezing routes isn't much harder than routing in other games, especially when there are less stages. Having less stages is very meaningful here. And how does the bombing system punish you? Hell, it even gives you a higher ice area by freezing fireballs which can't be normally frozen.

All of this has me wondering, have you even played the games? Your description of the games sound like they're made from a very secondary perspective.

>>17625105
Forgot to mention that ZUN revamped the hitbox of most bullets in LoLK so that makes it objectively harder than any other game that came before.

>>17625105
Fairy Wars is the only 2hu game where routing almost feels like a must on Normal. The only game that comes close in that regard is UFO.

>>17624616
>can 1MNB SA
>can't NB Hecatia
Nigga what? I still bomb every Lunatic 1cc and NB'd Hecatia with all characters and NMNB'd Nue. HRtP is not that hard to get a clear on Normal, can't argue your feelings on SoEW though. But like you said, you just lost your drive to keep playing. Come back to it when you regained it, might be healthy exploring other interests too.

>>17625190
That's just your skill level showing after a while of playing them. With an average skill level, most games need routing before you get a clear on them. Be it UFO for life pieces, GW for freezing, DDC for life pieces, LoLK for grazing or HSiFS for releases. Well, actually you might even get a clear on HSiFS without releasing properly because of the high amount of bomb + release spam, and TD is easy too, you shouldn't need more routing than just "see a purple spirit, trance". I guess you could also count SA as routing if you rely on bomb planning.

>>17625221
I'd add that depending on how many lives you need in TD, you might need to memorize where the optional life piece enemies appear so you can collect them all. There's also the matter of where you can trance in stages while still being able to refill your meter before the boss, which was important for me for beating Seiga early on.
And to be clear, "routing" doesn't necessarily refer just to resource collection, right? Like in MoF, you don't really need to worry about bombs or lives on Normal, but if you don't preemptively move to the right parts of the screen during stage 4, you can get totally fucked, so memorization and planning are still important.

>>17625105
>Having less stages is very meaningful here.
I have to agree with the other anon on this single point. Having fewer stages doesn't mean shit when the difficulty increases more than twice as fast as normal and the whole game requires the memorization and precision of an Extra stage.

>>17624509
I got bullied in that run anon, might try again later.
This no bomb only run is hilarious as fuck btw
>>17624616
Let's learn IN LNB together anon!
You would get it fairly fast though.
>>17624849
>>17624870
>>17624877
I'm leaving that Ex for last among the windows ones.
It's a very nice game and I enjoy playing all the shots a lot but I don't wanna burn down so I'll be playing the other games in the meantime.

>>17626415
Translate it weebs

>>17626458
"The pleasure of being danmakued inside."

>>17626458
Red squares: bullet hitbox pre-DS
Blue circles: bullet hitbox in DS and onwards
It's a comparison image

>>17626919
>Blue circles: bullet hitbox in DS and onwards
I knew there was something wrong when people were claiming that this was LoLK on. The ISC star bullets felt weird to me as well, at least. That makes sense too, as TD was a new engine if I'm not mistaken.

>>17626415
That's a gigantic difference, wow.

>>17626415
Someone post a comparison for the fucking butterfly bullet. Not many post-DS games use them, but Ex Doremy's first spell is a nightmare, the hitbox feels gargantuan.
>>17626919
Guess that's another reason why I found StB easier than DS.

>>17627460
That fucking ISC spell dude.

mofu 5MNB as first LNB, now that's quality.

Generally, how long does it take you to get a 1cc on a game you haven't played before?

>>17628568
Don't you think that heavily depends on the game?

>>17628568
What difficulty? What game?

>>17628568
probably a few days because i only do one run per day

>>17628315
Great job dude!
>>17628568
same as >>17628660

>>17626263
Hmm. It all depends really. I'm not an expert on resource optimization on TD since I don't need that many resources, so I'd argue that TD doesn't need that much routing since the low resources match the low difficulty as well.
Yup, but to be fair there aren't many parts that require you to be on the right part of the screen to do it correctly. It's very very few per game actually.

>Having fewer stages doesn't mean shit
It really does though. You don't need to spend as much time memorizing and routing the game as you would with a main game, neither is the effort to get to the final boss fight as big as it is on main games. There aren't more non-spells and spell cards on stages 1 and 2 as there are on standard games. And the difficulty increase may be fast but you still have the freeze option, which highly cripples it because there isn't as much dodging that needs to be done.

>>17628568
If youve already 1cc or at least beat a game before then a few days if you continously practice.

>>17626415
>>17627183
How accurate are the claims that this started on DS? I think I can explain why it was more noticeable on LoLK. TD and DDC didn't use as many of the danmaku that got the most noticeable changes in their hitbox (the 6px and 10px spheres for instance), in fact barely at all if you think about it. And FW and ISC have different mechanics that don't focus on dodging for the most part.
It was an uncalled for change if you ask me, since it makes spell cards like Danmaku Paranoia nearly impossible if SA was patched with the hitbox change as well, and it's what made high density attacks on LoLK extremely annoying too.

>>17627460
The butterfly's hitbox always had a nearly 1x1 hitbox ratio in the circle, you can test it on PCB, SA against Satori or PoFV against Aya.

Yay.

>>17629203
It would certainly explain why Shinmyoumaru's survival card feels so difficult.
Anyway, it's obviously a consequence of changing how the hitboxes are determined, so it can't really be helped now.

>>17627870
That spell card is hell. Thank fuck for sub-doll point blank shooting, otherwise it would've probably been impossible to capture without items.

>>17629167
What? Just because the game is shorter doesn't mean it takes less time to route and memorize; quite the opposite, because the stages are much more dense and demanding than usual. Not to mention that in other games it's mostly routing to collect resources, but since that's not a thing in Fairy Wars, it's all about timing your freezes. So instead of just losing out on a bomb or life piece when you mess up, you fucking die.
As for the freezing, the entire game is built around it, so it doesn't "cripple" anything. There are still a fuckton of fireballs, bullets that aren't dense enough to freeze, waves of bullets that come too soon after one freeze section to freeze again, and so on. After stage 1, freezing just takes the danmaku from impossible to merely challenging to dodge, though IIRC it actually becomes a downside in stage 3, because don't the lasers turn ice into more bullets? Regardless, the entire game is a tightrope walk where one mistake ends your run, but even playing perfectly still leaves you with a game that's at least one difficulty level higher than usual.

Someone just fucking pull the trigger for me
I got the balls to not reset after stupid deaths, and then snowballed into a series of REALLY stupid deaths until I died to Lunasa's first nonspell twice and Game Over'd.
Then when I kept going I captured ALL of the Prismriver cards, including Lunasa's solo card that I can never fucking get otherwise, as well as most of Youmu's. And I can't save the replay because I continued.
At least I got the Bad End on Hard for the first time. That's some form of progress.

>>17629773
now you know you can do it, friend, so you'll get it soon!

>>17629813
Not really, since I used three continues in the duration of the Yuyuko fight.

>>17629562
>Just because the game is shorter doesn't mean it takes less time to route and memorize
Do you realize how legitimately retarded you sound?

>the stages are much more dense and demanding than usual
The attacks on normal aren't much more threatening than playing the demo of a main game on lunatic. And since you have freezing as a weapon of choice, you can just freeze it all away to get rid of the danger.

>it's mostly routing to collect resources, but since that's not a thing in Fairy Wars
So that's one less thing to worry about. Not sure how that adds to the difficulty.

>when you mess up, you fucking die
As far as I'm concerned there are mistakes in the main games that make you die as well. Even trying to benefit from the resource system can make you miss sometimes.

>As for the freezing, the entire game is built around it, so it doesn't "cripple" anything
The game is built around freezing so it cripples the difficulty because you have far less waves to freeze.

>There are still a fuckton of fireballs
They're not hard to dodge if everything else in the screen is frozen.

>bullets that aren't dense enough to freeze
Then how are they a threat to the amount of lives you have?

>waves of bullets that come too soon after one freeze section to freeze again
Cancelling bullets with ice restores a bit of your ice power, not to mention you can shoot whatever's making more bullets to increase it, and if that isn't enough make sure you're grazing a few bullets while you charge your freeze and you're good to go.

>don't the lasers turn ice into more bullets?
Yes, into extremely small and slow, non-threatening bullets as long as you're paying attention and out of the way of a laser. And they only appear during non-spells, too.

>the entire game is a tightrope walk where one mistake ends your run
No it doesn't. The game shits out a big amount of motivation for you to make several mistakes, maybe 5, without losing out on a 1cc. You just have to not be a shitter and die 5 times in a row.

>but even playing perfectly still leaves you with a game that's at least one difficulty level higher than usual
You would have a point if it was pure dodging and bombing, but it isn't. There's barely any dodging, freezing and bombing.

Seriously, all you're doing is tripping on your own argument and claiming things that aren't true. It's almost as if you never played the game. And no, not reading the manual to learn basic shit that you should be knowing before going in isn't an excuse to say the game is harder.

>>17629562
>Just because the game is shorter doesn't mean it takes less time to route and memorize
Do you realize how legitimately retarded you sound?

>the stages are much more dense and demanding than usual
The attacks on normal aren't much more threatening than playing the demo of a main game on lunatic. And since you have freezing as a weapon of choice, you can just freeze it all away to get rid of the danger.

>it's mostly routing to collect resources, but since that's not a thing in Fairy Wars
So that's one less thing to worry about. Not sure how that adds to the difficulty.

>when you mess up, you fucking die
As far as I'm concerned there are mistakes in the main games that make you die as well. Even trying to benefit from the resource system can make you miss sometimes.

>As for the freezing, the entire game is built around it, so it doesn't "cripple" anything
The game is built around freezing so it cripples the difficulty because you have far less waves to dodge.

>There are still a fuckton of fireballs
They're not hard to dodge if everything else in the screen is frozen.

>bullets that aren't dense enough to freeze
Then how are they a threat to the amount of lives you have?

>waves of bullets that come too soon after one freeze section to freeze again
Cancelling bullets with ice restores a bit of your ice power, not to mention you can shoot whatever's making more bullets to increase it, and if that isn't enough make sure you're grazing a few bullets while you charge your freeze and you're good to go.

>don't the lasers turn ice into more bullets?
Yes, into extremely small and slow, non-threatening bullets as long as you're paying attention and out of the way of a laser. And they only appear during non-spells, too.

>the entire game is a tightrope walk where one mistake ends your run
No it doesn't. The game shits out a big amount of motivation for you to make several mistakes, maybe 5, without losing out on a 1cc. You just have to not be a shitter and die 5 times in a row.

>but even playing perfectly still leaves you with a game that's at least one difficulty level higher than usual
You would have a point if it was pure dodging and bombing, but it isn't. There's barely any dodging, and there's freezing and bombing.

Seriously, all you're doing is tripping on your own argument and claiming things that aren't true. It's almost as if you never played the game. And no, not reading the manual to learn basic shit that you should be knowing before going in isn't an excuse to say the game is harder.

LoLK on even Normal is a fucking nightmare to 1cc. I'm clearly too dumb for this game, I can manage PD just fine but attempting to 1cc even as Reisen in Legacy, keeping a bomb shield up all the time while attempting to graze for max resources, I get my shit pushed in by Clownpiece so by the time I even reach Junko, I'm already out of resources and get my shit slapped handily. Any tips for maximizing resources/grazing and not getting whooped by everything in stage 5 and beyond?

>>17630096
That was so fucking spot on. I love you.

ngh

>>17630096
On the contrary, I know what I'm saying is true because I have played the game, and your chopping sentences in half to remove context doesn't invalidate that.
A difficult game that only takes fifteen minutes to play through can still take many more days or weeks of practice to learn than an easier game which takes thirty minutes to play through. It can take just as much routing, but since each part is "do I get hit by an undodgeable wave of bullets" rather than "do I get a bomb piece", each mistake is much more dangerous.
As for the rest of it, you're basically just saying that it isn't difficult because you can do it, but the fact that you're talking about clearing a Lunatic-tier game with only five lives clearly puts you above the average skill level.
>There's barely any dodging
That alone shows how fucked your frame of reference is. If that's what you call "barely any", then what even is challenging for you?

>>17630556

>>17630812
Not really appropriate, considering that nobody said Fairy Wars was bad. Unless you consider difficulty bad?

>>17630411
>Slowdown 8.15%

>>17630967
protip: stop replying to /v/ tier mangry rants!

>>17630096
God you have your head too far your ass to realize how difficult this game is for normal players.

Any tips for Kaguya's first spell?

>>17630980
and? is impossible to avoid

>>17631226
Lol it is not.
Even if so, more than 5% invalidates any run.

>>17631227
tell me more

>>17631233
Well you could try to optimize your setting to not get a fuckload of slowdown.
Anex86 is good when it comes to not giving a lot of slow, even if some graphics and sound effects will be shit.

>>17631130
This.
Anon can't really measure why a game is hard in the first place, arguing with them won't lead to anything good.

(things that help you win) minus (things that help you lose) equals difficulty

It shouldn't even be a question. An easier game has more numerous and more powerful resources, with simpler stage layouts and bullets. Simpler stages let you move wherever and kill what comes, while complex stages have things like enemies spawning closely or behind you, and bullet sponges that stay on screen long enough to flood the screen with bullets.
Simple/complex isn't exactly the best dichotomy since insta-kill memo attacks increase difficulty while not being a complex thing in and of itself, but we're not that autistic, are we? The addition of memo makes the stage more complex by restricting your movement.

Also obvious, but easier bullets are slower, less dense, and don't have properties like homing.


To make it EVEN SIMPLER: the more you're allowed to get away with, the easier the game is.
As for what game is harder for a specific individual, it is again obvious that it depends on what the person is good or sucks at.

These retard fights would be more productive if you all would rank games together in groups of difficulty instead of each game individually (and stopped replying to retards.)

>>17631515
Another fucking obvious point, but different goals like clearing and scoring need separate rankings because, again, the addition of scoring affects how you must move. Likewise with different shot counts. I'm sure some dude somewhere has a chart of every game with every difficulty, character, and shot type ranked from easiest to hardest.

>>17631531
*shot types fml

>>17631515
>These retard fights would be more productive if you all would rank games together in groups of difficulty instead of each game individuall
We already do tho

-Normal Mode-

-Easy group
PCB
MoF
IN
-Normal group
TD
PoFV
EoSD
DDC
-Hard group
GFW
UFO
LoLK
SA

This thing has been around for a while

>>17631607
>UFO
>Hard

>TD
>Normal

>>17631792
Yes, you can read.

>>17631607
TD is one of the easiest games in the series, only difficult part is Mamizou who's one of the harder EX Stages

>>17631607
Shouldn't that be updated with HSiFS in the easy group?

>>17632021
True, now we should determine just how easy it is.
Personally I think it should go in between MoF and PCB, maybe even below PCB

>>17632021
True, now we should determine just how easy it is.
Personally I think it should go in between MoF and PCB, maybe even below PCB.
We could also discuss and add PC98 games!

>>17632077
I thought the whole point of the buckets was that you don't rank games within them, so it's broad strokes that most people can agree with rather than nitpicky exact rankings.

>>17632096
I mean sure, that's the intended way to see it anyways, how you arrange them within them is just personal impression/preference

>>17632077
In my opinion, I think it might be the easiest in the series.

>>17631792
The "UFO is hard" argument is based on the assertion that gathering resources via ufos is itself a challenge, which only holds if you're an exceptionally bad player who believes they absolutely need every last possible pickup the game has to offer in order to win, and they bother with routing to the detriment of actually playing the game. The easiest way to solve this is for someone to play a perfect run on normal without picking up any ufos, then again while grabbing every life ufo to compare potential resources both ways.

>>17631607
Swap ddc with ufo and I'll take it.

>>17630422
I've seen that video. He was clearly drunk by that point, which contrary to popular belief actually makes you worse at Touhou.
Also, Ancient Duper is kind of gimmicky and requires proper spacing at the start of the card.

>>17631607
MoF can be kind of tough if you don't know how to bomb efficiently, which you won't as a normal-modofag. I'd swap it with TD.
PoFV and GFW should be in a separate category entirely for being so different, along with the photogames and ISC.
Move EoSD down to easy.
Put HSiFS into easy.

>>17632185
4 waves for Marisa? Weird

>>17631225
be talented and don't get hit

>>17631225
Don't hang out at the bottom of the screen, and avoid having to dodge lasers and bullets at the same time.

>>17632190
eosd is far too hard to be in the same group as in and pcb. Everything past stage 2 is rough and bosses have more variety.

>>17631226
I recently got a LLS 1cc on Hard too, with 1.63%. I used Neko Project II, though it needs a specific file for LLS or it will crash on startup.

Why the fuck do the same autists always show up for the same "muh difficulty" argument?
Please and most sincerely remove yourselves from the gene pool.

How do I beat LoLK 1cc?

>>17632500
No way. EoSD's patterns are generally straight forward, the gaps are typically larger because they weren't designed with a visible hitbox in mind, and the game lacks a real wall like PCB's stage 4 or MoF's stage 4. I'd put it as the hardest game in the easy category, but it really isn't that tough.

>>17630556
How does it remove context? I'm just breaking down your arguments and replying to them individually, which you have yet to do by the way because all you resort to is regurgitating the same shit over and over hoping that somehow you will be right this time.

>than an easier game which takes thirty minutes to play through
But that's the thing, a game like LoLK isn't easier. You're just repeating your initial claim as part of your argument instead of actually explaining why you think it works that way.

>but since each part is "do I get hit by an undodgeable wave of bullets" rather than "do I get a bomb piece"
Oh please, do pick any route of your liking and tell me how many parts it has that include an "undodgeable wave of bullets". I can guarantee you that it will be no more than 3, up to 5 maybe. You have freezing to deal with those and even the parts that aren't as a matter of fact undodgeable, just difficult to do so it's not like you have to dodge much before resorting to ice. Also, again, you can lose a life while aiming to "get a bomb piece" in other games as well, so not sure why you're trying to imply that you can't lose lives while making mistakes in main games.

>you're talking about clearing a Lunatic-tier game with only five lives clearly puts you above the average skill level
Nigger, I'm talking about clearing a lunatic tier DEMO, with the addition of two spell cards at most exploiting freezes and bombs. That is not above the average skill level. You just need to be used to STGs which is required to clear any of the existing games. Stop pretending that having a basic skillset is being highly skillful.

>That alone shows how fucked your frame of reference is
If you actually played the game like you're supposed to, you would realize that there's barely any dodging because it's mostly freezing. A game isn't harder due to crippling yourself by trying to dodge everything you're supposed to overcome differently.

In fact, if you dodged every pattern like you dodge arguments maybe you would realize how this game is by no means the hardest there is out there.

>>17631214
>>17631251
>can't really explain why they think a game is harder
>NUH NUH NUH! YOU HAVE YOUR HEAD TOO FAR UP YOUR ASS! YOU ARE INCAPABLE OF MEASURING DIFFICULTY!
Try using arguments next time. Quoting you, by the way.

ULiL and HM are shit. Why did they give up on the complexity of SWR and Hisoutensoku?

>>17633597
>complexity
Oh boy I sure do love Typhoon.
And an rng based super system? Fantastic.

>>17633699
I'm not talking about the weather system, not that the popularity system is much better. I'm talking about the actual character mechanics.

>RNG based super system
wat

>>17633597
>complexity of SWR and Hisoutensoku
I sure love the complexity of RNG literally everywhere.

>>>/v/

>>17633718
The combo system as it exists in Soku is overrated. The timing on chaining together certain melee attacks and projectiles makes little sense and feels oddly tight, and movement in general could be better. As well, border escape gives too easy an out to pressure. That said, ULiL is not perfect mechanically, obviously, but combos are far more satisfying and generally feel more freeform. I'd say character diversity is a bit better as well, as every character has an interesting gimmick or mechanic to play with. Its biggest flaw is how strong defensive play is, also balance could be better and Kokoro needed a fucking nerf jesus.

>>17633728
This is a Touhou gameplay thread faggot.

>>17633831
Not him, but you and and I both know that this thread's primary purpose is mainline games.
If you want to discuss the fighting games, nothing is stopping you from making a thread.

>>17633835
There's no reason to when these threads are perfectly useful for it as well.

>>17633873
You're unlikely to find your intended audience by posting here, and some may come to believe that you're attempting to usurp an established thread in order to push your own agenda and draw players into your community.

HSiFS Cirno sucks. She fucking SUCKS.

She's slow as fuck in a game where that doesn't give you any advantage, her damage is for shit to the point where some spells/nons seem outright impossible to capture without using releases to add damage (even with the Winter subshot!) and she doesn't seem to have any special properties, like Reimu's smaller hitbox or Marisa's lowered PoC. But I refuse to believe there's not some advantage to playing as her as opposed to the other characters, I'm just not seeing it. So what is it? I seriously want to know.

>>17634199
>she doesn't seem to have any special properties
I did notice that the manual doesn't give anything of note about any of the characters. The manual in DDC and LoLK stated what the special skills of each character was, but HSiFS has nothing like that.

where do you guys go to catch high level shmup streams? can never find anything on niconico. maybe I'm just not searching right

>>17634199
She is just shit. Having the privilege of being a playable character despite being a fairy is enough.

>>17634294
cavetube
twitter links
twitch

>>17634199
Her winter sub is actually one of the best combos in the game, I don't know what you are on about anon and frankly I am disappointing.
> like Reimu's smaller hitbox or Marisa's lowered PoC
You must be thinking about other games, that isn't present at all on HSiFS.

>>17634341
That really sucks. It's like ZUN couldn't be arsed to bother as long as there was someone there to represent Summer.

>>17634253
>>17634398
>Her winter sub is actually one of the best combos in the game
I assume you mean "her and the winter sub". Didn't feel that powerful to me, honestly. Like, I couldn't capture Nemuno's second spell as Cirno with any of the other seasons, and it wasn't any different with Winter (maybe it can be done using the release, but I'm talking about NOT using it).

>I did notice that the manual doesn't give anything of note about any of the characters.
>You must be thinking about other games, that isn't present at all on HSiFS.
I didn't know ZUN removed Reimu and Marisa's unique abilities for this game, but that still leaves Cirno as the worst player character all around.