/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>4350451
If you don’t get caught.

>>4350451
That's not traced. Maybe you can call it over referenced, but that's it.

>>4350451
Unironically yes, you will also have a ton of redditors defending you because crabs live rentfree in their heads.

>>4350451
DORFED.com

>>4350451
Not a trace

That is heavily referenced, not traced

>>4350451
Yellowroom is a known hack, but that's probably not traced.

what difference does it make if it's heavily referenced instead of traced

>>4350451
sure if all you want to make is close up of girls faces
go ahead and trace an entire gang bang, draw a dungeon as a background and work in the lighting for ten niggers playing twister over the corpse of the white race and you tell me

>>4350542
The first one is easier to do.

>>4350543
chill out Yellowroom.

>>4350542
The first one is harder to do.

>>4350542
The reason tracing is wrong is because tracing always looks like shit because you can't just translate a photo into a drawing that easily. The whole point of tracing being bad isn't muh pure art ethics but that it looks like shit. If you heavily reference you have a much better chance of getting a good image. Why do you think people can tell when a /beg/ traced something without seeing the reference?

No rules, only tools.

Can we not have not a defining tracing for kids talk? It's for normies who think real artists had their skill gifted at birth, pull their ideas from the Magic Kingdom and have their hands driven by the Idea Fairy. Everybody should reference as much as they can afford because it helps you notice ways of improving your work further.
And if some one is able to draw something without construction lines or refs it usually means that they've already drawn the same thing hundreds of times, over and over again.

TL DR original question: YES, copying (tracing AND beyond!) is great for learning. It's called doing a "study". You do it for classical artists for years if you go to art school.
But you can also learn just by trying to copy your friends or your favorite online artist. If they are actually pro they likely won't mind, as long as you don't take a work in progress and post it as your own obviously. Having "artistic influences" is fine.
Posted piece: if it's so easy because "it's just a copy" then try drawing the pic on the left. It's so heavily transformed the fact that they reused the anatomy and shades is like a few %s of the total work they did. Even if it hints at the person maybe being bad with posing etc. compared to what they try to show.

>>4350467
>>4350506

The fuck is “heavily referenced”?
If you place a layer ( or sheet of paper etc) over another image as the basis for a new image that’s tracing you absolute fucktards.

>>4350736
And that's not what happened here you absolute retard.

>>4350451
Tracing is the best method to improve your skills.

>>4350560
Tracing the work of other artists is one of the fastest ways to improve.
Most art schools in the east know this, it's only western art schools that are extremely against tracing for no reason other than "you have to find your own style" which is retarded since you create your own style by mixing other people's style anyway.

>>4350762
I was talking about producing your own work by tracing photos. I agree to some extent that tracing art for practice is helpful, but I think copying it without tracing is a lot better. I personally don't retain anything by tracing lines, I sometimes draw over works with crosscuts to understand form though.

>>4350451
>a good way to improve your art
not at all

>sell it to normies
totally yes

>>4350762
>Tracing the work of other artists is one of the fastest ways to improve.
What makes you think this?

>>4350736
It doesn't overlap.

>>4350451
why is the real girls face 10x hotter than the drawing?

>>4350736
Imagine being this dumb jfc.

>>4350788
its the dead eyes

>it has to line up line for line for it to be traced!

beginners lol

>>4350736

>>4350833
I'm not a beginner and I think that's not traced. Now what, hero?

>>4350844
damn got me now pyw

>>4350847
he just said he was a /beg/ stop throwing around "pyw" just because youre pissy

>>4350762
Tracing doesn't teach you anything that copying by eye won't, and copying by eye will actually teach you more besides. Tracing is a crappy learning tool.

>>4350451
kill yourself
not just for tracing but posting that garbage picture in the first place

Where can I find that garbage picture on the right?

>>4350744
>>4350776
>>4350792

Jfc indeed, it’s absolutely traced. Whoever it is added a layer and painted directly on top of the photo. I dgaf if a line or two or the eye is moved or bigger or the nose smaller.
Traced.
Fucking kys’s

>>4351050
These people are likely traceres/"""over-referencers""" themselves. "It doesn't overlap" is a common rationalization that they constantly parrot, as if artists don't purposely edit the image to ensure nothing entirely overlaps just for this very reason.

>>4351050
Eat shit, retarded faggot.
Literally nothing overlaps and you are a fucking retard screeching that it does when your very own picture shows the opposite.

>>4351060
(((heavily referenced)))

>>4351063
Hahahaha
Cope harder tracefag.

>>4350451
Depends how youre "tracing", If youre breaking it down and studying it, then you can improve from it. If its legit just tracing, obviously not.

>>4350744
>>4350776
>>4350792
>>4350843
These are the same retards that deny shit like this is traced because "it doesn't line up".

>>4351083
it's literally not traced.
To trace means to literally draw on top of another picture and then it would actually line up.

This pic is an artist looking at a picture and drawing what he saw so it looks similar but isn't actually the same.

>>4351091
>paste "reference" on layer
>draw over it
>HeAvIlY rEfErEnCeD BrO
Lmao, keep tracing retards. This is why you have to take most art you see online these days with a grain of salt.

>>4350775
Because learning theory and practicing on your own will only take you so far.
Like for instance, I learned every single surface muscle in the human body + all of the major bones, yet I still had no idea how to actually apply that knowledge.
The fastest way is to simply copy that from someone else, or you could ofcourse spend a long time figuring it out yourself through trial and error, but why reinvent the wheel?
Same with how to draw clothes.
You can study the physics of different fabrics all your life, doesn't mean you can actually draw it.

You see a lot of /beg/s who have a good amount of knowledge about certain things, but just don't understand how to properly use that knowledge. Copying is the fastest way to get over that hurdle, either by tracing or just copying by eye, doesn't really matter.

>>4351098
It's not drawn over. If it was it would overlap, you retarded faggot.

>>4351102
>it doesn't overlap!
Lmfao, like clockwork with these retards.
>>4351060

>>4351104
Why are you replying to your own retarded post?
Just because you pat yourself on the back it doesn't mean you're not retarded anymore.

It's like you never seen an actual tracing before.

>>4351104
I don’t come here that often. I didn’t even know these people were a thing. I knew people did it of course I just didnt think they pretended it was something it wasn’t.
Yeesh.

>>4351111
Hey you're the same faggot from the yesterday's "muh culture" thread. FUCK YOU.

Good to know there's only one or two of you retards.

>>4351108
>REEE
Note how hard these tracing retards seethe when you call out their methods. It's the fear of being exposed as shitters. They desperately repeat "but it doesn't completely overlap!" hoping to convince everyone else. No one buys it, keep tracing though retard. Or "heavily over-referencing", whatever you want to call it.

Has it ever occurred to retards here that you can trace badly, or sloppily, or trace and make minor alterations precisely so images don't line up?

>>4351116
Hah. You were probably one of the people defending cultural appropriation with weak sauce. Now you’re saying tracing isnt tracing.
Woohoo.
At least you have a hobby.
Don’t do drugs and stay in school kid.

>>4351119
>muh strawman.
I have a strict rule to never copy or replicate anything, draw exclusively from imagination, study female anatomy from the pictures of male bodybuilders in a completely different pose and on;y used a reference when a commissioner specifically asked "do like this picture".

However you are a retarded faggot and i'm calling you out on being a drooling retard, because you're retarded.

Tracing exists, and that isn't it.
In reality you catch tracers without having to search for their ref, you can simply tell because one part of the image is good and another is bad. like
>competent body
>very poorly shaded
>clothes look flat on top of it
>face doesn't match the neck
There you can tell a faggot is stealing shit he can't own.

Now your oppic has everything slightly different and the light is coming from the other side, and it's all painted really fucking well.
That's just a good artist following a popular meme.

>>4351142
Bzzzzt.
Wrong.
It’s tracing.

>>4351142
>REEEE
Yeah sure thing retard, keep it up

>>4351142
Except you can trace and also be a competent artist, ya fucking dingus.

>>4351132
>cultural appropriation
It's cultural exchange. Kind of like the ancient Greeks invented the mathematics and everybody adopted that.
Because the cultural patents don't exist and nobody owns the culture or ideas.

When the Chinese open Russian restaraunts that's not appropriation or theft, it's a demonstration of approval and admiration. Same with the Pho stands in the west. The Vietnamese soup is the fucking food of the gods.

Oh and you're a leftie faggot. if you hate Trump just remember that the people electeed him only ta stamp out your leftie filth "muh microaggression, help i'm oppressed" out of the western culture and in his second term when he cant get another re-election he will come down at you hard.

Bros the lines don't overlap at all, why did the DB artist get so much flak from the public?

>>4351148
>you can
Well you can have a car and take a skate to the next city, but why would you?

>>4351154
I actually love Trump. And I’m actually pretty fucking hard-right.
I also used yo be a “wigger” for 20 years and it got me nowhere and nothing but sadness in the end. I love my culture now and I think our kids, like you, have been turned into emasculated weeb weirdos and it breaks my heart.
Frankly I don’t have a problem with tracing as a learning device. That’s how the old masters used to train their apprentices in their workshops so they could reproduce their style.
The one thing that isnt cool is tracing and saying you aren’t. Or ripping off the Japs and saying you aren’t.
Im sure you have a lot of talent and potential. Believe in yourself, and your people and learn to stand on your own feet.
When you do, we’ll be here for you.
You’re valued.

>>4351161
>why did the DB artist get so much flak from the public?
Because that's PLAGIARISM you fucknugget.
An entirely different concept about entirely different things.

Tracing is when you steal somebody's LABOR, just copy the lines and claim that you did it.
Plagiarism is when you steal THE IDEAS and concepts, not the labor itself.

Holy shit just how fucking dumb you are.
Here's tracing, an actual example.

>>4350451
Mutt's Law

>>4351173
There's no tracing there retard, dude just slapped a filter on it and painted on the face a bit.

>>4350844
I'm a pro & I can clearly see that is traced, then modified to look 'original'.
FFS

>>4351046
Blacked. com

>>4351164
I'm learning from the Japs because I legit love dome things they are doing.
Look at them, they have a thriving entertainment industry, it's fun, sexy, it's for adults, and for kids, it's unapologetic, they respec the artist's freedom, they are fucking killing it.

And look at the west, no fun allowed, everything must be about your mandatory feminism propaganda.

I think we're in a position where we should look at the guys who are doing better than us and learn from them.

Oh and no I refuse to be called a weeb, I don't worship everything japanese, I'm not a fan of Japan as whole, I'd hate to be a member of their society, but hey, they do some things fucking great and we should learn that.

>>4350451
Literally not a trace. Only /beg/ level normies think referencing like this is tracing, it’s funny how you the more you talk ITT you announce to everyone reading this thread your poor skill level lol

>>4351192
cope

>>4351063
imagine being this stupid

>>4351182
I'm a pro and I don't jump through loops to crab.

>>4351182

>then modified to look 'original'.

I bet you have never drawn before.

prove me wrong.

>>4351192
he copied so heavily from the reference yet it still looks like shit. why defend this garbage

>>4351245
Yeah. That "modified" part is extra bullshit.

>>4350461
>implying normies really care
It's really easy to just ignore the angry mobs. Noone that was actually going to give you business or a like cares about losers complaining about something irrelevant to them.

>>4350762
yeah they're training people to do tweening

>>4350806
but they both have dead eyes

>>4350467
that is an obvious trace my friend. Get away with it all you want, but can you live with being half the artist you could actually be otherwise?

>>4351050
t. so bad at drawing that he couldn't copy something at least as accurate as that. You might wanna read drawing on the right side of the brain, it seems to be up your speed level.

so much of tracing / not tracing spam and not a single anon posting an overlay

based

>>4350451
The right picture is a meme, there are hundreds of these images. The drawing is a reference to the meme so in this case the artist wanted it to look like the source material.

Sometimes I can't tell if you guys are just full retard.

>>4351609
>m-m-m-m-m-MUYH NOT LINED UP LINE FOR LINE
why can't you just stay in the /beg/ threads seriously

>>4351643
if it's not 1-1 it's not tracing

>>4351643
Why can't you copy a picture without tracing? It's really not that hard. I find it astonishing that you cannot fathom that this shit is not traced.

>>4350461
Normies don't care either way.

>>4351102
Yeah, because it's so hard to move one or two features in order to not look like a 1:1 copy.
Keep coping like that and you'll never make it.

>>4351162
Your analogy is in reverse.
Some artists do it to cut corners even if they can reproduce it competently without tracing.
All you need is context.

>>4351353
I don't do the stuff OP does. Yellowroom is a known hack. I just think this particular drawing isn't traced.

>>4351634
I get your point, but this artist is known for tracing in general.

>>4351744
Then post an actual tracing you dumb nigger.

>>4351750
Stop calling people dumb niggers just because of your insecurity.
I'm not going to go search through Yellowroom's library, but we already had a few threads about him tracing other artists in the past. It's confirmed he does that.

>>4351757
>calling people nigger because of insecurity
Welcome to 4chan newfriend, enjoy your stay!

>>4351260
>>4351245
Haven't got time, got to to take 20 or so paintings to my newest gallery this weekend. Still framing them.
But no, I've never drawn before, lmao....

>>4351827
>sells paintings in a gallery
so does illustrat, and he sure as fuck can't draw lol

>>4351833
Point well made. We're not all like him, thank fuck.

people in the industry do it all the time
its not just jokes like Greg Land who trace
Neal Adams not only traces but promotes the practice
make sure its your own photography you trace

but lets be real for a second. do you really need reference for such a simple pose? what the hell man