/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>shadows means less details in the shadowed part
>highlight = lighter color / shadow = darker color

>>4198187

the more line bends, the thicker it should be

That's a big one, OP.

Here are some others I've had:

- Exaggerate the pose early on, cause every iteration will make it stiffer;
- Even detailed subjects usually have simple-to-read silhouettes;
- Gray looks like the complimentary color of whatever color you're using.

>>4198187
1. reflected light and core shadow - that was a long time ago but I still remember feeling like I've discovered the ultimate secret of the universe
2. perspective - still feel like an absolute retard for having neglected it for so many years
3. color theory, but im still working it out

>>4198199
>1. reflected light and core shadow - that was a long time ago but I still remember feeling like I've discovered the ultimate secret of the universe
dont do this lol, it only really works on specific lighting scenarios when there is a shit load. its a shitty habit to get into just like flipping your canvas. not everything has to have a core shadow or reflected light. because a lot of things in real life have overcast lighting.

>>4198198
>exaggerated the pose early on

Damn, this is a good one

>>4198221
anon You are fucking retarded.

>>4198198
>Gray looks like the complimentary color of whatever color you're using.
thats because grey is a perfect mixture of two complimentary colors in 50/50 proportions.

>>4198221
your one half-dead brain cell made you read my comment and all you understood was:
>this person uses core shadow and reflected light in a very exaggarated way and doesnt take take any other elements of light and shadow play into account

>>4198223
literally every course/tutorial on gesture drawings says this. this is also why building up stiff characters with carefully measured proportions isnt a good start to any drawing, sketching the ideas roughly and capturing the dynamism has to come first, construction next

>>4198236
Thanks Karl Gnass.

>>4198187
their art is so visually pleasing and the color theory game is spot on. i mean, its literally the same corgi dog over and over but i love it.

This

>>4198234
no lol i know what youre dumbass meant with that . you will end up like jeff watts with his meme core shadows lol

>>4198187
Using "multiply" to shade different sections and make them look cohesive.
No matter how much I tried, my autistic brain can't wrap around making appealing matching/corresponding shades so this was big for me.

>>4198265
can you elaborate please? do you mean this is helpful or figuring the hue of the shadow, or the shadow intensity? any example? (i'd like to learn)

>>4198221
>shitty habit just like flipping your canvas
You fucking mongoloid

>>4198187
>What has been your biggest "ahaaaa" moment?
You won't make a freelance illustration career by simply uploading stuff to social media in the hopes that you'll be "discovered" by art directors once you have enough followers, and that freelance opportunities will just land in your inbox.

>>4198285
mad lol

>>4198313
any ideas on how to actually do it? i'd be grateful for any advice.

>>4198187
Ambient Occlusion, I'm not that good yet

>>4198196
???
Got a good example for what you mean?

>>4198221
>drawing light realisticly is a bad habit
Unless you are drawing something levitating in the void, EVERYTHING has reflected light. I take it you only draw planets or something?

>>4198426
Villpu said it in a video, that is what i understood
he said that lines are like a flowing river, where water erodes the riverbanks more on bends, so the river is wider on bends

although this is obviously not everything to line weight

also I might be retarded please don't listen to me

I sometimes try to understand line weight on various drawings, the logic behind it and most often I conclude that it's all random and the variety of weight alone makes it look somewhat good

>>4198426
not op but i think i know what they mean. look at this drawing by mike mattesi for example, the lines are the thickest where he wants to show a sudden change of direction, like at the joits. his book "force" is really amazing. theres also a shot 4 part course on youtube that i think is much better than dymanic sketching by peter han. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07fusT-dwVE

>>4198444
forgot the pic sorry.

>>4198444
>>4198448
Thanks anon

>>4198439
Line weight and variation is normally just stylistic preference as to adding variety to your work and to make things look right. There isn’t much logic behind most line variation other than preference. If any artist tells you must always do x and be technical with your lines your work will be a parrot of the teachers which will make your work quite dull because of this. It’s one of the few freedoms we artist normally have to distinguish ourselves from others which will be learned through trial and error and master studies.

>>4198187
Construction and shapes changed everything for me. I could even do something vaguely resembling hands.

>>4198187
i was staring in the mirror trying to understand how i would foreshorten a 3d character with the box when it hit me. the box doesn't come first, the main measurement (head) does. and then you plot out where the vanishing point is and build the box around that. then to get the individual heads you just keep making Xs, halving and halving to desired measurement

>>4198448
looks /beg/

>>4198603
What???

FEELING the FORM

>>4198603
can someone translate

>>4198187
>you don't have to create a new layer for each different part of the lineart

>>4198607
>>4198628
i wont be able to explain it really, i learned about this from the book loomis figure drawing and it took me months to finally realize.

when you are drawing from life or from imagination the box does not exist yet. you just have to pick a starting point and its best to use heads because everything teaches you to measure based on heads. so you draw the head however you like. to make the box when you only have 1 head, ill say an absolute beginner should just do some guess work for how wide you want the figure to be and make marks at this width.
and then pull those marks into a vanishing point, the direction you want them to be foreshortened in (you can eyeball this in life drawing). so you have both sides of the box, and the top of the box which is just where the lines intersect with the top of the head (you can use two point perspective). finally to actually section out heads on the box you use the bottom left method in this image. and voila, you are set to create a foreshortened figure, and can make the box 3d to help guide in volume. its important to understand that the square you just made is for the back of the body and not the middle, makes it easier to create the 3d box to realize this

to separate a box that already exists into equal parts you use the bottom middle section. its all about perspective

>>4198641
>???????: The Post

>>4198607
>>4198628
>>4198651
>he doesn't get it

>>4198252
I was so happy to figure this out. Placing the hands first means the arm almost never looks wonky.

>>4198198
can someone explain the silhouette meme to me? supposedly you need to have a simple silhouette so your character stays memorable?
I don't think I've ever thought about any character in any medium as a black and white silhouette and I just don't see how the outline is in any way relevant to anything

>>4198187
usually whenever I figure out a way to indicate something complicated (usually repeating textures), it's fun to figure it out and there's immediate feedback when it works

>>4198606
your mother was looking for you anon, its time for your weekly bath time

>>4198603
i think i get what you mean anon but holy shit you can complictate things.

i understand you were trying to figure out how to draw a character in perspective if you establish a perspective box first, and came to a conclusion that omitting the box and just drawing the head first is also a method of establishing a perspective. thats right, but you're doing basically the same thing. the truth is you should be thinking about the perspective before you put the first mark on your paper. dont think about The Box too much just keep a consistent perspective and you'll be aready above 90% of this board.

>>4198678
im beg but Ill try to explain it to the best of my knowledge.A clear silhouette allows the pose to be more easily recognisable,even from a distance

>>4198651

>>4198678
take any of your drawings of a human figure and fill it with black. can you still recognize the silhouette as a human person? if not it might mean that your pose is too stiff and you need to work on design/invention.

This has been the most helpful thread in the history of the board

>>4198641
now i understand thanks nigga

>>4198686
why would you be drawing your character from a distance? I guess it makes sense in comics where there's lots of variation when it comes to composition but wouldn't the sheer fact that it's a comic with a repeating character make the design memorable and not the outline itself?
I guess my point is that if the character is the focus of your drawing then most likely it's not going to be a tiny speck and thus doesn't need to have a simple outline.
>>4198690
but why would you ever need to fill it with black? why would my character need to be recognizable as a black figure if I don't ever intend on drawing it that way? am I retarded for not getting it?

my moment was when i was little and realized all the great masters died poor, never made money and weren't famous until long after they were dead.

It made me just enjoy drawing and not worry about money or making a name for myself.
True love!

>>4198706
it has to do with dynamism of your pose, relevance of your design and can also affect the composition of your illustration if youre going for a finished artwork. nobody has to fill anything with black, its just that the first thing we perceive when we look at a drawing are shapes. its better to create a solid expressive shape and build design around that than to produce a stiff character and add accessories and clothes to it to create a design. look at this example from "skillful huntsman", you can easily tell what type of characters these slhouettes might be. its very easy to come up with clothing and other elements of design for these silhouettes.

this is not exactly /beg/ tier and it also applies to work from imagination, you dont really have to focus on that when youre doing a reference study.

>>4198252
huh, yeah, I never thought about it, but doing the hands first usually leads to better results,

>>4198719
>it has to do with dynamism of your pose
>its better to create a solid expressive shape and build design around that than to produce a stiff character and add accessories and clothes to it to create a design
so if the general shape looks like a mess then most likely there's something wrong with the design or the pose. I think I'm starting to get it, thank you anon!

>>4198678
Take a look at this pic.
It's full of complex details, but I can isolate it with 2 clicks of my magic wand: one for the general shape, another for the inside of the mouth.

Some specific drawings might require complex silhouettes full of holes, but they are the exception, not the rule, and will probably draw a lot of attention to its "noisy" nature..

>>4198743
yup, or if the silhouette isnt easily recognizable as a person or a specific type of object you wanted to draw then it could also mean its worth taking a step back and focusing on the general idea youre trying to portray. remember its all rather subjective and dont treat it as an absolute rule. no problem. a lot of concept artists post good tutorials about silhouettes because its the basic fundamental of concept art

>>4198746
cool drawing

>>4198711
what great masters died poor? are you referring to preradio/preexposure artists?

>>4198282
So basically what I meant is this is a means of shading the whole picture itself. Coloring with multiply does a lot of the colors for you that you would need to shade with and makes them feel cohesive.
You start off by filling in your lineart with flat colors and then you make a new layer with a different color (usually purple, red, or blue) and draw wherever you would normally shade with the layer setting for the shading layer set to "multiply"
This results in the color you picked overlaying over everything else you colored in and makes darker hues of whatever color you picked on your picture.

Watch 10:35 until 11:30 in this video, it shows what I mean and how easy it makes it to shade if you are not good at it.
https://youtu.be/ZkEZIjMwP0E

The difference between studying and drawing, I realize just drawing confident drawings is a lot better than making even a creative endeavor into a study.

>>4198187
blend modes use values 0.0(black) - 1.0(white)
that's why multiply darkens. When started out with digital art I thought multiply would lighten. color dodge is the blend mode for light.

>>4198678

>>4198695
The sad thing is, it's more helpful than the other threads where your supposed to get advice

main line of action for gestures

>>4198678
Think of it like this: Every split second the viewer spends thinking "what the hell is that thing supposed to be" makes the character less appealing and likeable.

That's why you want the character to be understandable and instantly recognizable from the silhouette alone. The silhouette is the first thing processed by the human eye.

>>4198800
you should try reading the krita documentation, its one of the first things they talk about

>>4198606
You are retarded. Congrats on disability

>>4198678

(Readable) silhouettes are important for a number of things but most notably character design and posing.

A character with a recognizable silhouette is more memorable, but also more readable.

If a pose has a strong silhouette, it usually looks more interesting (not always, there are some exceptions, but generally strong silhouette = eye catching).

>>4198682
no my post is saying that i couldn't figure out how to have "perspective in mind" in life drawing until i realized i could use the loomis head partitioning technique. its far simpler than trying to do it without the box, its just another tool

>>4198448
looks like shit honestly

>>4198957
yes, anon, thats what i said as well. its alright. im glad you figured it out. pat pat.

>>4198959
picrel another sketch by mike so you can all go crabbing somewhere else. the book has been praised by disney animators and mike taught the staff at dreamworks.

>>4198991
nice looks even worse, especially the lines on the face and pelvis, hands and legs something a beg would do.

>>4198991
>i understand you were trying to figure out how to draw a character in perspective if you establish a perspective box first
>and came to a conclusion that omitting the box
no this is what you said, and i said that was not what i was saying
>dont think about The Box too much just keep a consistent perspective
and then you said this which kind of felt like a downright dismissal of it as a tool, i never said it was this style defining thing or that its even all that important i just posted it in a thread about shit that took me forever to "get"

>>4198995
>>4198991
forgot to mention nice chode arm lol, reminds me of sakimichans t-rex arms lmao

>>4198187
tangents

>>4198995
>>4198998
you faggot its obviously a gesture drawing fuck off

>>4199001
Oh did i make you mad? poor lad

>>4198995
>>4198998
Thanks reddit for sending your retards.

>>4199001
They are trolls, don't mind them.

>>4198192
>shadows means less details in the shadowed part
That's entirely optional

Anyone have epiphanies related to coming up with nice looking poses?
I'm in a real pinch right now

>>4199087
As optional as rendering each individual hair.

>>4198641
>>4198603
>he spent months misunderstanding a basic principal about drawing
>a basic fucking fundamental

you can't make this shit up
every time I think I've seen the dumbest motherfucker here on ic, someone else takes the cake

that lines thickness

>>4199342
>comes to a thread explicitly for such a thing to gloat about it

>>4198187
Ambient occlusion and sillouette poses

>>4199346
I came here to read the things that people found actually useful, but that dumbass motherfucker's idiotic goddamn misunderstanding that they try to pass off as some major thing they learned just has me shaking my head
like how the fuck do you come to this board repeatedly and not even pick up on the basic fucking fundamentals of drawing a t a l l

>>4198196
its the opposite in anime

>>4198840
What I found mind blowing is that you could take those silhouettes (which imply a front view) and invert them to get a perfectly oriented/in perspective rear view

>>4198252
Huh. I've always kind of done this for foreshortening stuff. It's so much easier than constructing the arms in perspective first, and it also makes it easier to exaggerate the perspective a bit.

Cool.

>>4198221
>its a shitty habit to get into just like flipping your canvas.
how is flipping the canvas a shitty habit

>>4198187
Finally reading the sticky after years of being here

>>4199436
It isn't and neither is drawing reflected light, that anon is retarded.

>>4199342
I guess it's possible to stumble into pitfalls like this if you've literally never drawn anything before and then only look at the pictures from Loomis books and never read anything he actually says.

>>4199348
any tutorials on ambient occlusion youd like to recommend? i saw only one posted and it was confusing to me, and i really want to learn :(

lets pretend the retards didnt come here and have a nice helpful thread

>>4199436
Depends how much you flip it, te purpose of flipping a canvas is to see the drawing/painting with fresher eyes, but if you habitually flip frequently you will get used to seeing the painting from both sides which defeats the purpose of flipping the canvas in the first place, I recommend only flipping once in a while

>>4199327
motion and force

>>4199340
Kek’d

>>4198187
Grinding shit and drawing from life a lot more. Once I realize being good in art isn’t just reading shit and doing the stuff what the book stated and instead do repetition and getting use to the form and becoming more intuitive in what you’re drawing, copying, grinding and important painting/drawing from life and using references helped me so much.

Heres a tip, when you’re not drawing, draw with your head instead and observe life with your eyes, observation skills is also important.

What a delightful, wonderful and excellent piece OP.

>>4198706
>but why would you ever need to fill it with black? why would my character need to be recognizable as a black figure if I don't ever intend on drawing it that way? am I retarded for not getting it?

It's biology. We register the overall shape of things in a split second to determine how we should relate to it.

>>4199390
Kys

>>4198432
>Not drawing your celestial bodies with reflection from nearby galaxies
What are you, a symbol drawer?

>>4198631
i can feel the pinch

>>4198313
It can happen but it's the exception and not the rule.

>>4198252
now, how do I draw hands?

>>4199390
you have a very strong opinion over something that anyone else who isn't schizo could read and move on in a nanosecond if it didn't interest them
and then there's you: completely unhinged and typing probably some of the dumbest shit i've had the displeasure of reading all day. i hope the brain chemistry in your head rights itself after a debilitating car crash so you know what an asshole you are too late in your life

When Peter Han talks about wrapping lines in his dynamic form exercises, he's talking about the same thing Vilppu describes as "feeling the form".

>>4199417
Not exactly, it only works when they're drawn with little to no perspective distortion.

Let's say Leela points her arm at the viewer -> the hand becomes super large.
Now if you flip the character, the same hand has to shrink, because now it's far away from the viewer.

>>4201320
It's almost like I care about drawing and the fact that there is some beginner little crab spewing off their misunderstanding of basic fucking drawing principles as though it was something that other people should learn, here on a board about fucking drawing, is offensive

tl;dr ngmi

>>4201437
Just post which advice here is misunderstanding and why or gtfo. If you dont you're just a retarded child that spews hate to troll and nobody cares about your opinion

>>4199583
Ambient occlusion is deceptively simple. Go somewhere with good lighting (outside) and slowly put your hands together. Just before tey touch you will see that very little light can get between your hands and in doing so appear a lot darker. When they are touching there will be a small dark area between them where no light can reach. This is ambient occlusion: the ambient light of a scene being occluded (blocked) by an object this causing a certain area to be darker as a result of less light. It occurs when things touch or are very close. e.g. the underside of a car as it sits on a street.

>>4199583
Haha ambient occlusion:

[Step 6] Create new color layer above Layer A, make sure to clip it or tether it to the A layer below.
[Step 5] Set your shadow layers C & D to multiply.
Layer D- Use grey to airbrush only the darkest crevaces. [Step 4]
Layer C- Use very light grey to airbrush the shade [step 3]
Layer B- Create your linework and set opacity to 10 or so low that you can barely see it. [ Step 2 ]
Layer A -Draw a white silhouette[ Step 1]

>>4198187
economy of attention

>actually useful thread on /ic/
Monitoring this thread.

>>4198187
Spending hours zoomed in to add as many small details as possible won't give you good results. Painting became much less frustrating for me.

>>4201707
oh i remember loish talking about this in some interview, she said it changed her life forever because she would work on 100% zoom and keep adding details and then it looked really weird zoomed out and she felt like she wasted her time. i also stopped doing that after i heard her say it.

>>4201497
>>4201677
thanks a lot guys, i will try to make a study and post my (hopefully not too retarded) results

>>4201723
It's pretty fucking bad because it kills your motivation, since you put so much effort into it to get shit results. Pic related is an example of it if anyone is interested. I think it's pretty self explanatory.

Details on things that don't matter, scales all fucked up with everything important way too small, nothing coherent globally while everything is still very detailed...

>>4201738
>>4201707
You have to learn to squint to see the big picture, value relationships and remove unnecessary detail. You have to constantly step back and look at the whole picture and develop it as a whole to ensure consistency and make sure everything is rhythmically working together, properly proportioned and in correct perspective. Work from large to small, dark to light. This process is the same for both traditional and digital.

>>4198187
>economy of details
what's that?

>>4201752
>dark to light
I thought that part was specific to traditional because of how the paint works in layers?

>>4201782
i think they meant that you shouldnt use complex details everwhere in your artwork, but rather around the focal point only and also consider how light/shadows affect the amount of detail.

>>4201785
hm there are traditiona techniques where you go light->dark, serigraphy for example. dont worry, i think there are people who work this way and people who work the opposite way, although i think dark-> light is the most popular one. i start from medium and push the darks and lights from there. picrel here's a small quote about this from loish' artbook

>>4201782
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzCGP6kUvLU

That "less is more" and "never aiming for perfection" actually compliment each other when you end up focusing on your strengths.

>>4202457
Based Marco keeping it simple

>>4198711
Most great masters were rich and famous during their time. That's the way they got work, they had patrons.

what blew my mind was when I realized all drawing teachers were basically teaching the same things. It's all just form and perspective. The fundamentals are the same no matter how you learn it.

I wasted so much time jumping back and forth between "drawing methods" trying to decide which one was the "best". What confused me more is when teachers would go and say that their method was the quickest way to learn to draw, or that you have to learn their system of drawing to get a better foundation, or that their system was best for animators and board artists.

And what made things even worse was when everyone disagreed on how to do the gesture. Vilppu had one way, Steve Huston had another, Matessi had another, Karl Gnass, Andrew Loomis, Michael Hampton, Sycra, Proko, etc.

As a beginner I took these things seriously and I thought these were like different styles of martial arts, like boxing vs muay thai, wrestling vs BJJ

>>4201782
If you draw a wall you don't draw every brick.
If your doing hair, you don't draw every strand.

There's an impulse to draw what you know is there, but you have to stop drawing the physical object and concentrate on how the brain sees that object.

>>4198313
yeah ilya

>>4198792
using multiply tints everything with a darker value, but there are no hue and proper value shifts. That's not how rendering and light works, you're just following the deviantart beg approach

>>4201785
I only work in charcoal at the moment but the point I’m making is you need a clear definition of values between light and dark to tell if the half tones reside in the dark or light. It’s hard to tell the first value you put down on a white sheet since all you can compare it to is white, it tends to look much darker until you get darker values in. As far as I’m concerned this is the best method for learning but I think it can vary between mediums and lighting scenarios. I don’t do digital but I don’t see how there’s no reason you couldn’t put in a middle value for your shadow then put in the darkest darks and work your way down.

It’s easier to know your values when you have the darkest value to compare it to.

>>4202574
It’s important to stick with one method and master it, from there you can reform it to fit your needs.

>>4198448
I thought her knee was a giant dick at first, my two coomer braincells are unsalvageable at this point

>>4203249

disagree, I think you should be fluid in your approaches and try them all and incorporate what works with you. an artist could study bridgman for a year and might not get any drawing epiphanies but if he took a moment and looked at hampton/huston/whoever something might get the cogs turning and suddenly what bridgman was trying to show makes sense now. i think it boils down to constantly taking in information and cross referencing what you know/what others are saying but knowing that the fundamentals are ultimately the roots

>>4203348
Bridgeman is for idealized anatomy and structure not for learning various methods of construction like Reilly, loomis, Hampton, sight size, Huston etc. If you’re going all over the place you’ll never internalize one method well enough to properly use it, you can’t be fluid in an approach if you’re always trying something different. Use your main method always but see how another method can help but only once you’re comfortable with the main method. If you just switch from method to method then you’re replacing most of the information from the last method and wasting time.

>>4203463
you are a detriment to art, you idiotic fucking cunt
learn something about constructive drawing for once in your goddamn stupid fucking life

>>4203526
Nice argument, but it’s always better to have a couple teachers showing one method than it is to have multiple teachers all telling you something different which in the end causes confusion and causes far less progress. Generally Athletes train specifically for one role on a team, marathon runners don’t have the same routine as sprinters. If you’re learning everything all at once then there’s no focus or good muscle memory training. As good as the information is on nma, it’s not the best place for a beginner to learn because there’s too much information, contradictions, methods, etc... some methods go well together and some don’t but those will already be incorporated into what the teacher does. Repetition is the mother of skill, It’s how you train your mental and physical memory and what has been proven to be the best for learning but feel free to ignore what’s been proven throughout the past centuries. You’re free to believe what you want it doesn’t mean you’re right.

>>4203550
I didn't read any of your spew because anyone saying "Bridgeman is for idealized anatomy and structure not for learning various methods of construction " isn't worth fucking trying to reason with

>>4199390
the thread wasn't made explicitly for (you) now was it

>>4203550
I swear this happens on /ic/ all the time, people desperately arguing for the sake of arguing. As the argument progresses, the central premise becomes more and more shifted and distorted to the point it's not even clear what are you guys even disagreeing about in the first place.
Let me do a writeup for you:

>>4202574 = All methods that art teachers teaches boil down to the same fundamentals, despite it looking different on the surface. (just common sense stuff)

>>4203249 = Stick to one single method by a single teacher until you're a master (premise already started to shift here)

>>4203348 = No, you should probably not box and isolate yourself exclusively to one method or you'll risk tilting yourself

>>4203463 = Okay it's fine to use multiple teachers, but you shouldn't switch teachers every 5 minutes like a spastic madman (which is totally what you said)! You should start out with one method, and then move on to a second method instead of learning 15 methods simultaneously! (sure this is common sense, and you also never said otherwise, but I HAVE to disagree with something!)

>>4203526 = What?

>>4203550 = Yeah, that's right you shouldn't learn simultaneously from 30 different teachers teaching completely contradictory information, why are you so dumb? (This, again, has nothing to do with what you were saying, but I'm just desperate to disagree with you)

>>4203596
please see
>>4203583

>>4198187
Always design everything as a abstract 2D composition before you do shit like construction and perspective. If you do it the other way around, you are literally working backwards and your compositions/poses will be shit.

>>4198187
bump

Simple: Stop watching youtube artists. The vast majority have nothing to say, and they almost all rely on shitty crutches.

And don't get me started on the female youtube 'artists'. Holy shit, it is possible to draw something other than a 'in muh style' quirky girl for the thousandth time.

>>4199664
No you dumbass. the purpose of fliping the canvas is to check the balance of the composition. we have a dominant eye that provides a greater degree of input to the visual part of your brain, and it usually tilts the composition if you are not aware. fliping the canvas makes easier for the dominant eye to spot error. the ''fresher eye'' thing is a side effect that can be provided just tanking a break every 1 or 2 hours. Is important to flip multiple times in the early stages of a piece and don't be afraid to be ''overdoing it'' or you will lose more time time fixing it later.

>>4207020
you're so fucking stupid you must be the brother of the guy you're replying to

I hope we haven't hit the bump limit yet, I still need to read half of this thread.

>>4198187
I noticed that I got more effective at doing studies when I started doing art in a more professional capacity.

I've always been a naturally analytical person who figured out how to retain visual information early on, but the shift from "it would be cool to be able to draw this" to "I need to be able to draw this" made a big difference. Somewhat counter intuitively it also put less pressure on the process of making studies since there is less ego involved.

>>4198603
youre making it too technical man. way too technical. try starting out more simple.

>>4207182
im gonna cum in your foreskin

>>4198187
Kinda /beg/ stuff but

In lineart:
pic related is a great size-sensivity map, mostly because it focuses on two things: light weight and heavy weight can be accessed easily; lines can start and/or end in a pointy tip.
Editing lines is okay when done in moderation and is necessary to get things done fast.

In painting:
To paint, the only thing you need is a opacity-sensitive brush.
Little details can be drawn as blunt lines and dots, without any shading.

This thread deserves to be alive.

>>4198187
Other people but especially other artists can feel when it's not something you really care about. Pros and art directors on conceptart.org used to talk about this years ago, saying they could see it in portfolios people sent in if there was a lack of passion or enjoyment or something. A lack of personality?
I'm not saying this is the spark, but it definitely adds something to your work if you're doing something you really love. So if you spend all your non art time playing World of Tanks or some shit, put more tanks in your work or big armoured guns and treads, I don't know. Embrace who you are, people can see the joy in your work. The love in every stroke.

Also keep a folder somewhere which is just things that make you remember why you became an artist, can be webms or music or anything too. There shouldn't be tons of stuff in there, it's not an inspiration folder, it's for the really special shit that makes you remember. It's useful sometimes.

Trying real paint(even if it was just watercolor in my case) after struggling with digital color for a long-ass time. Changed my perspective completely. I still don't understand why.

>>4198199
Perspective is a real bitch, too. Especially when working with organic shapes.

>>4212652
that is a terrible curve lol, i dont think you understand what the variables are on there.

>In painting:
To paint, the only thing you need is a opacity-sensitive brush.
Little details can be drawn as blunt lines and dots, without any shading.
simply not true

>>4201309
>Look at your hands
>Draw them. You fuckin dummy

>>4213631

This helped me understand how to place my horizon and how to place distant objects in relation to my defining object.

>>4213613
Well, it works for me. Can you elaborate on any of these points?

I struggled with gesture for a really long time, but one day I decided to do a study of this, and just tried to draw the body in each of these frames and suddenly everything clicked. Grinding 30 second gestures and reading through Force didn't help me, but studying this did.
It really helped me realize how useful it can be to study other artists when you want to obtain their skills rather than just doing everything from photos and try to reinvent the wheel yourself every time.

>>4213652
Post your work please.

IDK how but this month something really clicked when drawing faces for me. Earlier I had trouble looking at the faces I draw and found something wrong about it but didn't know what it was. I now understand what goes wrong and avoid it

>>4213652
hmm. i will do a study tomorrow and post the results.

what wa your biggest "holy yikes" moment?

>>4201738
This has a lot of soul

>>4213606
Same in my case, trying real materials in general. I think I forgot that digital tools are supposed to imitate real tools??

>>4198313
GMI

This one needs to happen to more anons, honestly. Art directors and buyers don't scour social media for talent, they don't have time for that shit.

When I was in college, one of our illustration teachers was a big time art director - the kind of guy who oversees a multi-million dollar media buy every year. He said "Are you on my rolodex? (this was before cell phones) No? How do you get on my rolodex? You contact me, remind me you exist. I simply don't have time to find you, and when I have work, I call the people I think of first, to see if they're available. It's nothing personal, I just don't have time to look for you."

>>4198356
Not the anon, but it's really simple. You know who you want to work for. You contact them, and ask how to submit a portfolio for consideration. If you want to do, for example, fantasy novel book covers, you contact all of the fantasy book publishers, ask for the art director/art department, and ask. They won't be mad, it's part of their job. Some of the best advice I got early on was contacting art directors and asking how to sell them art - and if I got them on the phone, I'd ask questions. Most people like talking shop, and if they have a minute, will talk to you.
The most you'll get done with social media is attention/gratification, and private commissions, but if you want to work in the pro space, you have to talk to the people who do the buying. They don't have time for social media, they're busy. You have to set up a portfolio site, send out mailings occasionally with new work, always be pimping your book to everyone. That's what an agent does for you, if you get big enough to need one.
Nobody is gonna come find you. You have to make yourself known.

>>4198252
Oh fuck, I did this on my own, never knew it was an actual thing

>>4199327
Don’t think about poses, think about actions. Poses are stiff, actions are snapshots of movement. It’s better to over exaggerate than to under exaggerate. Also act things out with your own body to properly feel out what’s happening on the page. If it feels really unnatural for your own body, chances are there’s an error in your drawing.

>>4199583
https://youtu.be/7fLV5ezO64w
Surfaces that are close together will receive less bounced light.

>>4213645
this is why self taught artist are a joke.

>>4198631
You don't have to but it's very useful to separate layers of a complex linework

>>4213652
I'm not surprised. Force is a horrible book usually recommended by idiots that paid for his course. Copying from good animators will get you much farther. Mattesi is a hack fraud.

>>4203732
Can you give an example of what you mean/clarify?

>>4213652
artist name?

>>4213606
I think it keeps you grounded in reality. When you have a limited palette vs every color possible, you don't have to worry about finding the right colors and can focus on values.

That women don't have brow ridge

>>4213661
I am not great at gesture by any means and still struggle with it, but I feel like I've gotten a lot looser with my figures since then

>>4214403
Sakuga Booru says Shuhei Hanada

>>4214674
ilu nessie!

>>4213652
Translation: I'm only interested in Japanese style, and looking at real people didn't help.

Miyazaki was right.

>>4199417
Ah the Chuckdee method

>>4214229
Why do you say that? if anything I think his method is the easiest one to understand

>>4214674
Oh nessie, hi

>>4214674
I dont do gestures and my shit looks way better than that.

>>4214890
pyw then

>>4214844

Post your gestures and finished work

>>4203550
>Generally Athletes train specifically for one role on a team, marathon runners don’t have the same routine as sprinters.
That's when you're already deep into sports/athletics and want to specialize into being a master of a role. You wouldn't start off a couch potato who just wants to lose weight with the regiment of an Olympic relay runner.

>>4214890

post your pyw

>>4214902
>>4214891
relax nessie, your "gestures" are the least of your problems when your lines look like that.

>>4214674
The lines don't look very good.

>>4214932
stop using my name you dipshit
is this some kind of a smear campaign

>>4214939
Stop impersonating me. Grow up, baby.

>>4214943
Little baby is mad

>>4214929
You're not replying to me, anon. If gestures are the least of my worries than I'd be very happy, because it was my goal for 2019 to get better at it.
What looks so bad about the lines? It is a phone photo of the drawing so a lot of the crispness of the original drawing is lost

>>4198187
Nintendo 3ds nee art academy and vittuvianstudio are one of the best art lesson. Most awesome art drawing books are pre 1920s and free at arhive.org and project gurenberg. Get started with this
http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/14264
Favorite quote:
Art is expression plus representation

general philosophy:
- always be thinking when you draw things to actively improve
(this is the single biggest thing, if you actively self crit + think about how to improve your work everything else will come naturally)

rendering:
- hard brush, no flow settings, focus on blocking in forms (think of objects as groups of values instead of lines)
- vary hues while shading, use saturation/temperature sparingly

drawing:
- how to have fun with sketching, how to add complexity, make appealing linework, create depth/forms (from reading dodson, studying kjg + katsuya terada)

a lot of what ive learned so far are small epiphanies and understandings of how other artists do things by studying their art and critiquing my own

>>4214844
there's nothing wrong with studying people who literally do simplified forms in motion (animation) as their job to improve gesture (simplified forms conveying motion)

>>4199327
Draw a dynamic line and fit skull, spine, ribcage and pelvis

>>4213606
Digital brush and color vs real ones is like playing mario kart vs driving wrc. On real media every brush hair and every color gradient behaves differently

>>4215155
To be fair, we should tread digital as just another painting medium

Ink drawing helps artists get ballsy.
Be good with pen and ink (not too much texturing stuff, mainly anatomy, gesture and shading) before start painting. Mastering tip pen first,dip pen after, then go to brushes and painting

>>4215180
This, I keep a big pile of copypaper and a ballpoint by my computer to do sketches on, and it's helped me improve my line confidence by a ton

>>4215141
>http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/14264
Thank you for this link!

>>4198187
realizing that no matter how good your computer is, theres always a miniscule amount of lag when drawing digitally so it will always feel different than drawing on paper. That might not be a good or bad thing, but it will always feel different and i need to be aware of it

>>4198265
Though this can be helpfull you're just using your computer to do the thinking for you anon. You'd be better trying to learn off yourself by doing some tradition painting.

>>4212801
Thsithisthis this this HERE

The industry's killin it and everybody wanna draw weird shits and have false ideas about what they should be drawing but yeah this post sums it up well

>>4214229
name one who's better at gesture than him

>>4207020
>dominant eye causes art to get tilted towards it
Dang, I never thought about it like this. I always wondered if I was just a terrible artist for being a thing I have to correct often when I flip but with the recent realization that my left eye is notably weaker than my right (mainly when I have my right eye close), this makes a lot of sense. Thanks a lot.

>>4215354
Unironically Proko.

And Vilppu, Huston, any of the main teachers you find online lol. Take your pick.

- Tracing
- Using of zbrush/keyshot to investigate lightning patterns of the scene

>>4201309
honestly, I think hands are one of the things that you just have to practice a lot. I read a ton of useful stuff on hand, but only when I tried drawing ten hands every day did I actually improve. of course you have to actually think when you practice, not just rot repetition. it will come eventually.

by the way that was my personal "ahaaa" moment, realizing that I could tackle some issues by just brute force them.

>>4201309
Most of the time when I don't know what to draw, I just draw my hand.
They're not Da Vincis, but I can bust out hands real quick now.

>>4215354

reiq

https://youtu.be/hRX9NiM156s?t=424

https://youtu.be/JhYW6isAZTY?t=190

>>4215141
>tfw need vpn to access this because of backwards ass german copyright laws
or I could just wait 8 years, haha

>>4216114
based

>>4215141
>Nintendo 3ds art academy
I second this, though you need to shut down the music lol

>>4218548
Just use tor, for small files like a pdf the shitty bandwidth doesn't matter.