/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

if you spend more than 10% of the time on /ic/ as you do actually drawing you are ngmi

>>3962231
hitler was right

>>3962231
If you just hoard tuts and books and never read them, you're ngmi. Drawing is a mental activity first and foremost.

>>3962231
you're ngmi

If you arent asian you probably arent going to be disicplined enough to learn art because your parents suck.
If you aren't living in california or cant move to california you arent going to get good education but more importantly you arent gojng to get connections to work in all of the big movies, games, tv shows.
If you are creative and suitable for art and learn visually then you are probably completely fucked up from traditional schooling methods that have no idea how to treat you and instead label you lazy or retarded or autistic depending on when you grew up.

Sure.

>realistically, you probably aren't going to make it if you don't spend at least 30-40 hours a week painting/drawing/studying art
>nobody is going to go out of their way to market you/talk you up to others - it's all on you to advertise yourself/your work
>when & if you do 'make it', the money is going to initially suck because to everyone, you are no-one, therefore your time is not viewed as being nearly as valuable as someone who has an established name
>unless you can draw/ink quality pages in less than 7 hours (and do so consistently), no big-name publisher is going to publish your work
>likewise, if your writing is very strong but your art sucks, you're probably not getting published in a visual medium either
>you need to be a good communication skills to do anything/get anywhere - the only time it's remotely acceptable to be bad at communication is if you are unignorably great, and let's be honest: you aren't if you're still here
>nobody cares about your studies - finished, original pieces are the only things people want to see from you unless it's concept art
>if you are only doing art for yourself (and only ever want to do art for yourself) there is a very strong possibility that you aren't going to make it, mainly because everyone with money is looking to buy your time to create something they want to see
>if you don't do go out of your way to draw things outside of your comfort zone, you're stunting your growth
>just because you can complete a master study does not mean you are a master - masters understood/understand their process completely and had good time management as a result; if you take too long, people will pass you over because they want nice things and they want them now
>nobody cares about your personal struggles, ever, so don't bother telling anyone - but by all means, show them through your work
>if you spend all your time being awed by others' work, you will never have the time to create your own masterpieces

You shouldn't expect to get good art advice from anonymous strangers on 4chan

Nofap will help you with more gains

The benefits of no fap are a myth.

>>3962260
What does "make it" mean? I don't want to make money or earn a living off of my art. Just want to draw for fun. That's all I've done for years now.

Trace and photobash as much as you can. Clients can't tell the difference and will be impressed with how "realistic" everything is.

No one actually cares about age. If you're 80, and can draw a loli getting fucked in the ass well, you will get commissions.

If you consider yourself a disciple of the Christian faith I'm afraid to tell you you're ngmi

you only have yourself to blame

>>3962260
>>3962392
Very true, but these are more like black pills no?

>>3962260
>>nobody cares about your studies - finished, original pieces are the only things people want to see from you unless it's concept art

I disagree. I had a sketchbook on tapastic a while back and I'd post studies along with my anime drawings and I got a huge following.

http://www.primitivism.com/case-art.htm

>>3962368
being able to afford big dragon dildos is making it

>>3962361
>>3962365
Make up your mind /ic/!

>>3962231
1. Most real art students never work as artists
2. Most /ic anons won't

Nothing more really needs to be said.

>>3962231
there's no money in art unless you're female

>>3962453
worst redpill lmao

>>3962416
That's a really long winded way of telling me that I want to draw cute anime girls because I really want to get a girlfriend but can't/won't and that I should stop before it's too late and I exalt the fake over the real but I kinda already knew that

>>3962231
Late stage Capitalism has laid waste to the value of art as well as most anons prospects of future employment in the art world.

You can say that you’ll continue to pursue art either way but a most normal jobs are designed to crush your spirit and make you too exhausted to do anything but watch television and sleep after your work is done

Luckily I’m considered retarded by the state of California so I could always fall back on disability checks, but it’s not a future I’m looking forward to

>>3962231
Art is the journey. When you Make It the journey is over - a true artist never makes it and continues exploring

>>3962231
>Art is 100% mathematical and scientific and you can prove why everything in art works. What still can't be explained will be explained in the future.
>There's no such thing as man vs machine, man built machines, if a machine outperforms you you were just outsmarted by another man.
>newer tools =/= better tools
>3dcg isn't magic. 3dcg is just sculpting & claymation on a computer. It's not very different from what you should be doing in your head as an artist too. If you see 3dcg is heretical you either don't understand it or are jealous of it.
>mileage isn't enough, drawing needs to be 100% conscious and you should be sitting down thinking how to do something more right today.
>pencil and paper is still the definitive best tool for art. If you can't make something good out of pencil and paper you probably shouldn't be chasing mediums and sit down to improve. There are very few people who are an exception to that and they are LITERALLY 1 in a million. If you know you are one of those exceptions then you still should probably sit down and learn how to think with pencils too.

>>3962231
Art IS a talent just like singing. Sure you can grind for years and learn how to do it "properly" but if your voice is shit you'll never amount to anything actually good. Same goes for art.

>>3962496
Sakimichan would like a word with you
Think of all those great artists working in the industry right now, the TOP names..the most skilled of skilled
Sakimi makes 15-20 times what they do

>>3962239
>>3962231

>>3962731
>Sakimi makes 15-20 times what they do
You're delusional if you think that's true.

>>3962749
You are delusional if you think she doesn't.
This was the last time she had her earnings public, she has 7400~ patreons now. That is only ONE of her income sources, she also does kickstarters for art book projects, sales for prints, con appearance, and many other things. Her income sources are insanely diversified.
She makes more on her patreon in a month than the majority of 'industry pros' make in a year mate.
>Naughty Dog Artist Salaries. Artist salaries at Naughty Dog can range from $109,869-$120,851
Just as an example
Sakimichan makes 20 times more a year than this guy who is an art director at a AAA studio https://www.artstation.com/johnsweeney

>>3962755
Kim sells his works for 20k a piece. So yeah.

>>3962722

nah, fuck u

>>3962757
And how many do you think he is selling a year?
Sakimichan made 30 every TWO WEEKS and that was half a decade ago
Even if you scale linearly at her lowest tier it is around 80k ...EVERY TWO WEEKS anon. I don't think you comprehend this enough, that means 2.08 million dollars yearly from a single income source
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/562899406/art-of-sakimichan-vol1
Here was her last kickstarter
> CA$ 252,686
Here goal was like CA $25,000
CA $252,000 is almost USD$ 190,000

>>3962765
>And how many do you think he is selling a year?
Well, he's been all over the world and draws more in a single day than she does in a week so, a lot. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyGOzr0SiUU

>>3962771
lol believe what you want dumbass

>>3962777
It's ironic you can't face the truth in a red pill thread

>>3962784
It's ironic how in the face of facts and numbers you just say 'well kim draws a lot!'
Show me kims yearly income

>>3962788
>facts and numbers
I did that and you just ignored it. Kim's work is worth way more than anything made by saki.

>>3962788
don't post this image ever again

>>3962792
>dude he sells pieces for like 20k
Okay, how many does he sell a year?
And even if he does make more than her, he is a one of a kind savant that everyone worships. Sakimichans work can be done by literally anyone.

>>3962231
Every art is shit!

>>3962797
>Okay, how many does he sell a year?
With the amount of drawings he does there's no way to tell but let's say he does 2 drawings daily, that's 40k every single day

>>3962231
If you are working 8 hours a day you just don't have enough time to get good at art. You'll be crushed by an enthusiastic neet.

>>3962797
>Sakimichans work can be done by literally anyone
Then why aren't you doing it and making 2 mil a year too?

>>3962797
>Sakimichans work can be done by literally anyone.
PYW

>>3962231
"Learn realism before you learn anime" is a meme, realism and cartooning are largely independent and learning one won't help much with the other.

>>3962239
Correct.

>>3962249
>If you arent asian you probably arent going to be disciplined enough to learn art
This is retarded, white people took art farther than any other race on the planet. I think most of the best art is coming out of Asia today but no one can call the old masters undisciplined.

>>3962231
Its easy to make money in art and you dont even need that much skill the reason most artist are poor is self-sabotage and/or bad business skill

If you go to college, you need to enroll in a degree that is STEM related. Art should be a hobby until you make it, which statistically, you will not.

>>3962722

Singing is a trained skill too, dumb ass

>>3962722
So turns out i have talent? Nice

>>3962813
>>3962814
Yeah lets just ignore the 300 sakimichan clones out there.
Sakimichan makes that much because her real skill is marketing and targeted production

>>3962438
schrodingers nofap

when you need it, it works, when you dont, it does not

>>3962849
>nazi
>doesn't understand the difference between past and present tense

>>3962239

Hitler was wrong and killed European art.

>>3963337
>killed European art
that was WWI not WWII

>>3962731
she still sucks though

>>3962755
you do know what taxes are, right? besides she probably has a team of management and copy artists at this point and they all need payment.

The Golden Ratio proves creation.

>>3962755
Wow, good for her. I’m proud of her.

>>3963337
Modern art is what killed the European art.

Because the european art is fuckig hard, but the commie fucks feel entitled to success despite having no skills, talent or even ability to learn.

>>3963401
based art history phd

>>3962231
>If you're sensitive (great for pouring your soul into art) fucking take care of your health. Eat well, exercise, take care of your body. A lot of hapiness stem from your physical condition.
>if you're a beginner: learning to see in 3d is the biggest fundamental.
>Drawing skils are not innate. Almost anybody can learn it.
>A lot of smug artists forgot / will omit they started not knowing how to draw at all.
>Those who had the chance to start young passed the "everything I draw is shit I feel so bad" phase while drawing as a kid without realising it. Everything just feels so good when you're a kid. Kids' brain are made to have fun while discovering / learning new shit, dopamine levels go down as you age.
>If you started late just draw and grit your teeth. It's normal to not like your drawings when you can't even draw the lines and shape you want.
>Working in art as a wageslave is often tiring but at least you can train your technical skill all day long.
>Anybody can learn technical skills with enough time but what will make your art great is what you have to tell.
>Learn to let go of your frustration even if you mess up your drawings for days. You won't pull out masterpieces for a long time.
>It's okay to not make it. Drawing is not only about fame. Don't forget you're also developping your brain as you draw. It is really about the journey. Compare your art to other for learning faster, compare yourself to your older drawings for your ego-boost.
>Real art is about having fun with your mind. Explore your conscious and subconscious self by playing with your imagination. Your imagination is a world on it's own. It could become a schizo hell or allow you to vomit your thoughts on a canvas and make it visible to anybody. Sometimes both.
>Drugs, while being dangerous, can help a lot. Just don't take those that mess up your dopamine levels retard.
(1/2)

>>3962231
>>3963420

>When you see an art piece you like fucking save it. Find out what you like about it. The subject ? The line art ? Colors ? Background ? Format ? Anything that you can reuse in your art. When you feel down open your art folder to remember why you started drawing.
>You have to learn to learn. Stop always asking what to do when you heard what to do. See your flaws and work directly on them. If you don't know how check quick tutorials on youtube. You just have to reproduce the exercises for a long time.
>Never forget to ignore bad thoughts ("I'm so shit wah why can't I produce masterpieces"). Learn to appreciate drawing lines (kids do it naturally). Learn to boost your ego by seeing your improvments. That's why you should save at least your best drawing of the day so you can compare to your older self.
>Learn to not take everything people say on the internet seriously. Crabs can truely bring you down if you're in the wrong mood and don't pay enough attention. Even narcistic artits could bully beginners for a quick shitty ego boost.
>never trust anything on 4chan, it's just a condensed shithole reflecting the state of the world, wah wah.
(2/2)

>>3963421
>>3963420
Based.

>>3963420
>>3963421
The light of the brightpill will outshine the darkness of the blackpill

>>3963401
All of that was a reaction to the extreme gatekeeping in art education and refusal to allow experimentation. Extreme tradition lead to extreme anarchy.

Im just glad i live in an age where traditional atelier education based on fundamentals can coexist with creative individual expression.
I think digital art is the best thing that bas happened since oil painting in the art world and single handedly is reviving traditional teaching methods out of sheer demend to train so many new artists.
And the internet allows us to look at shitty art teachers and see them for what they are.

>>3962231
Realism is for low imagination plebs

>>3963477
>hyperrealism*
ftfy

>>3963006
This.

If you are betting your life on making money from art youre going to be miserable

>>3962453
>there's no money in art unless you churn out porn
FTFY

>>3963421
>>When you see an art piece you like fucking save it. Find out what you like about it. The subject ? The line art ? Colors ? Background ? Format ? Anything that you can reuse in your art. When you feel down open your art folder to remember why you started drawing.
This. I do this all the time. It greatly helps if I'm having an artblock and want to find some ideas. I recommend downloading an image viewer with the feature to sort to random

>>3962501
>>3962260
>>3962237
>>3963420
>>3962812
>>3962701
>>3963421
>>3962990
>>3963006
BEST advice so far.

>>3962849
>realism and cartooning are largely independent and learning one won't help much with the other.
Lets see what a veteran Disney cartoonist/animator thinks about this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8s6Md4RXqg

>"Just because you're creating a cartoon so to speak doesn't mean you can get away with away with not knowing the anatomy, as a matter of fact you need to know it even more because you need to know what you're abstracting."
>"If you know the reality, then the character is that much more believable"

This is one of the first things that Blaise really tries to make clear as he gets into the demonstration. He practices what he preaches as well - he draws animals from life all the time as much as he does from imagination. What better way learn the reality of animals and characters than to teach it to yourself via drawing in order to apply it to your cartoons.

>>3962259
this1

>>3962231
JUST DRAW is the most effective methodology

realisticallythe narrative of success doesnt depend on anything but yourself. so I did a 23and me and fkund out in 2% Chinese and am gonna make it (ngmi) but who cares man I grew up loving western cartoons like hey Arnold and Doug and I want to make it ultimately as a russian speaking american based mangaka. so I dont have the california connections as mentioned earlier man. hokusai didnt hit it big till his fifties and kept working till he was 90 or some shi t. hokusai is your mantra vilppu torrents are your education then just work hard and have fun make enemies

>>3962755
She's an outlier. She got lucky, in other words, like early adopters on YouTube like the Pewdiepie dude. Her career, such as it is, is not a career path anyone else can follow.

>>3962701
ty

>>3962231
You are never going to improve if you don't regularly make finished pieces, and studies should be made for the purpose of preparing for the former. Even if you suck, finished pieces are a good way to assess your level, and the only thing that give a goal for your studies and let you understand what you should be working on improving next.

>>3962809
holy shit what a retard. It does not matter how much he draws, it matter how much people want to buy them. 70 iq faggot

>>3964101
Obviously Kim's work is way more in demand than a fucking fanartist

>>3964102
we dont know for sure. he likely sell some pieces yes. But we have no idea how many people want them. I'm pretty sure it's not alot. Enough to make a living, but it not like he cant keep up with the demand

>>3964106
You can't spell and you have no idea what you're talking about

>>3962849
>"Learn realism before you learn anime" is a meme, realism and cartooning are largely independent and learning one won't help much with the other.
NGMI

>>3962231
"Just draw" is not a meme if you're doing it right.

>>3962812
I work 8 hours a day and get up early enough in the day to where i have 5 to 7 hours of free time on any given day. That's not NEET time but it's enough to make progress.

just draw lol

>>3964106
You're fucking retarded lmao. Kim is a fucking rockstar.

Kim Jung Gi is an artist but
>has his own agent
>walks around in limited edition Yeezys
>always traveling around the world
>people pay to watch him draw
>can sell anything he does for thousands of dollars
>constantly gets commissioned by big entertainment companies and rich people alike to do expensive murals
>sells out overpriced artbooks
>"Kim has earned more than 300 million won since 2014 from selling drawings at places such as British auction house Christie's and exhibitions in Paris, France."

http://www.donga.com/en/article/all/20180103/1178250/1/Drawing-artist-Kim-Jung-gi-talks-about-live-drawing
let that sink in

>>3964219
its wild that he blew up kinda out of nowhere, i didnt hear about him until i started visiting /ic/ back in 2014 or so

>>3963404
>art history at high school

>>3963421
>>3963420
Based and extremely enlightened individual

>>3963613
>BEST advice so far.
But >>3962812 and >>3963006 directly contradict each other.

>>3964219
you are either a 14 year old who have pink glasses on about your "art future" and uses kim as a validation for that despite not knowing anything other that superficial fluff around him or straight up retard.

300mil won is 250k usd. sound about right. If you think there is infinite number of people lined up to buy his drawing for 20k a pop, you are delusional retard.

Holy shit you are guys retarded.

>>3964504
You just got BTFO.

>>3962368
When people say "make it" they generally mean making at least decent looking art that has little to no obvious flaws while also being able to make decent money off of their art

People on the internet are all retards and don't know what they're talking about. Don't take advice from no name trash artists that incessantly parrot whatever they heard on some random forum.
Also, all teachers are hacks. Those who can't do, teach.

>>3964531
By your definition, you are a retard

>>3962755
Sometimes when I see numbers like that I can't even imagine what its like to have money like that, to not have to worry about a thing. And she made all of that on her art, which isn't even that great in all honesty. Sometimes I really fucking feel helpless when I look at people like sakimi and others than look back at my work. Jesus fucking Christ sometimes I wan't to give up so bad.

>>3962231
Finishing something is a skill in and of itself. Doing one finished piece beats doing 100 studies, and no matter how much better you think you are at doing one thing it's worth nothing if you don't put it together with everything else needed to finish a piece.

>>3964561
Doesn't mean he's wrong.

>>3964504
Don't move the goalposts - you act like he doesn't sell a lot of art or is in demand but he clearly is. 250k is just for selling the drawings alone. Not factoring in what he makes from books and how much he gets paid for his drawing shows, workshops and lectures that he does all the time. He's built up his reputation as some sort of a drawing wizard so I doubt he's making appearances for chump change. He could easily get 20k for one of his large-scale live drawing murals because that would hugely appeal to fine art collectors due to his popularity, after people paid to watch him make it.

You don't have to have an infinite number of people buying your shit for the right prices, but a small number of the right people. This is how fine art has always worked.

>>3964531
Kim Jung Gi also teaches. Many of the greatest artists in history were also teachers. Retard.

>>3962501
>Late stage Capitalism
>I’m considered retarded
Yes I see

>>3962701
>Art is 100% mathematical and scientific and you can prove why everything in art works. What still can't be explained will be explained in the future.
brainlet_pretending_to_be_smart.jpg

>>3963337
How so?

>>3962259
These are just excuses to give up,
NGMI

>>3962231
Every time I see that statue I am reminded that a bunch of hooligans broke it and I get upset.

>>3962260
>nobody cares about your personal struggles, ever, so don't bother telling anyone - but by all means, show them through your work

Actually it's the other way around - people love hearing stories about how one rises from nothingness into being a good artist. Just seeing one's work means nothing because you have no reference or any sort of guidance on how to achieve that level yourself. I really don't understand why you would come to such a false conclusion, maybe it's just you who doesn't care.

>>3962438
My experience -for what it's worth- is that it's about gaining time. No fap in itself is no magic and unecessary, it just makes you realize how many times you are browsing porn in a week. So, reducing time spent on libido = more time to draw.

>>3962259
Excuses.
>>3962260
Redpill.

>>3965256

I think your personal stories need to be heavily curated though, atleast if you have a tendency to pour your heart out. I think your story needs to have a positive arch. If you can tell some version of the hero's journey that will pump people up but no one wants to hear about your financial difficulties for instance. Those who try to get pity commissions are the worst.

>>3962260
>>nobody cares about your studies - finished, original pieces are the only things people want to see from you unless it's concept art

Only if they are shitty doodles. Normies love photo studies, for instance.

>>3964684
>Finishing something is a skill in and of itself
The most based bigdik anon right here