/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>3793723
delicious

>>3793723
>one minute to read
>probably years to apply successfully to own work
Sometimes it feels like tutorials are for intermediates or above average artist who just needs a little push in the right direction as they already have the skill to do it, just not a plan or approach.

>>3793723

>>3793743
common mistakes

>>3793733
No, it's for beginners.

Intermediate need to understand the underlying muscle and skeletal structure to go master.

>>3793744
pretty good for people with bad observation skills such as myself, thanks

>>3793926
It's a manga artist's tutorial. Lot's of useful tips and they are being translated now.
https://twitter.com/MangaMaterials

>>3793723
>>3793726
>>3793727
>>3793733
>>3793743
>>3793744
>>3793780
>>3793926
>>3793934
Why don't we do better? Find a tutorial, show your work following it. DO IT.

https://mega.nz/#F!H1kgGIDT!W53xR4GSjaEImDSz2DeB3Q

>>3793936
>find a tutorial
>follow it (even copy it)
>then do something from imagination using the knowledge

addin'

>>3793943
Where did you ge this? (Where can I find more like it?)

>>3793723
Maybe all the d/ic/ks should devise a "path to make it" and follow it as a whole, together. A pathway which will have a practical amount of work and will take a practical amount of time. I believe it's possible, if you think and plan hard enough. But of course, this will never happen because everyone will disagree on how to do shit. Maybe not though. Anyone up for this?

>>3793950
Here's my foolproof one-step guide to making it:

1) Just draw

>>3793950
aguri guide is the best out there.

that said the maker of aguri guide said it's outdated now and there's better resources, I wish we had an aguri guide v.2

>>3793934
Nice. Is this authors own images, or he translating what he/she find around the web?

>>3793723
90% of these are just garbage including op.

>>3793744
I always miss the traps from the side. Damn...so that's why my bodies always looked off but I couldn't figure out why. It's always the minor things. Good stuff

>>3793733
No, tutorials are garbage and retarded traps for noobs to collect hoping that by saving enough they'll get better. If they cracked open a book, studied, and drew from pictures/life then they wouldn't need 99% of the "tutorials" posted in the thread. The only ones that are somewhat helpful are different material or drapery images.

OP image isn't even anatomically correct, you're just fooled by the rendering.

>>3794181
then post something good instead of complaining

Any good notes on drawing dicks?

>>3794212
seconding this

>>3793733
The real meme is when you try to apply what you've learned from a different angle.
These single angle tutorials can be traps if you aren't careful. Training your brain to focus on lines instead of actual 3d shapes is pretty bad in the long run.

>>3793948
Pretty sure its done by @moyashitouhu on Twitter.

>>3793727

I think the author of this tutorial have confused "for" with "by" beginners.

>>3793943

>camera angle consistently obscures butthole in every angle

reeeeeeeeee

Can never understand the side of the hips and transition into legs and transition into front of pelvis. The whole area from head of the femur to groin and up

>>3794336
Femur head up into the obliques and glute medius as well. The whole pelvis is confusing

>>3793936
Not exactly a 'tutorial'?
But ive been reading through Anatomy for the Sculptor

>>3794387
Wow, this is totally readable and helpful! Thanks anon!

>>3794054
It's author's. He uses machine translation and some of his followers correct his English.

>>3793727
Wow this is a hot steaming piece of garbage. And of course this one must have gotten a million likes on tumblr or dA from people who don't bother to learn how the patella attaches or slides over when the knee is bent.

>>3793743
>>3793744
These are good but if you can't visualize the underlying structure aka tilts of the ribcage, skull and spine, you're SOL.

>>3794153
The one I've been looking for. Proportions. Thank you to the poster for introducing some quality content.

>>3794658
this is terribel

>>3794665
bad sculpt

>>3794657
>>3794667
>>3794661
what is the point of this

>>3793956
Just draw is slow as fuck though. Just draw with a good plan though? Sounds pretty effective.
>>3794034
I know about aguri, but I was thinking about a more "personalized" approach, I'm not sure all good artists read all the books or even reference them- since the internet is a thing. Specific important parts could be boiled down to be a few pages instead of a whole book- which would be much faster, since the artist would be spending time in applying art rather than reading books.

>>3793938
this is my favorite artist rn. thanks for the link anon

>>3793950
>>3794764
It's incredibly hard to make because people's idea of "making it" wildly varies. The path for everybody early on may have a lot of commonalities, but anything beyond it branches out into thousands of different possibilities.

Some people want to do animu, some other traditional fine art, some want to do concept art, and maybe a few wants to be graphic designers, etc. And there's even more branching paths within it.
What kind of animu? Actual animation? Illustration? Painterly/impressionistic style like Krenz? Or a more linear rendering? Western-Eastern hybrid?
What kind of traditional art? Watercolor? Oil? Portraits? Figure? Animals? Very tight rendering like Bouguereau? Or loose like Schmid?
And the lists stretches on...

This still doesn't even begin to take into account the hundreds of shorter-term goals inbetween. Artists will most likely have wildly varying interest of what aspect to hone on first. Maybe some wants to focus on figure construction, maybe some other anatomy, maybe environments are their interest or maybe they want to learn animals. And none of the choices will truly be better than the others, because artists' skillets don't progress perfectly evenly even if they start together.

It's just impossible to make a perfect guide for everybody. Even the best guide will have to leave a huge chunk for the reader to figure out on their own.

The closest you can get a to perfect guide is to hire a mentor that you truly aspire to be. That is, if they can teach well in the first place.

Maybe if you specify some sample artists as an anchor, this will be slightly more feasible

>>3794797
At one point, yeah, people's tastes will differ. But before that point there are fundamentals, right? I'm specifically talking about these. Sort of "Key" points to study, if you will. I believe that with reasoning, the (practically) non-subjective subjects/problems can have simple answers. The bloat can be trimmed away and a clear path can be made- it will be straightforward and be as plausible as possible. The path can even be a modular tree, i.e, "skip this if you fit in the X group", and so on. I think this will need a lot of brainstorming and reasoning though, and everyone would need to participate.

>>3793723
>hogarth tier shrink wrap skin
yeesh

>>3794661
wow i thought i was the only one that drew that way

>>3794162
Everydayrobots.jpg

>>3794812
Maybe that's possible I suppose. You'd probably need a lot of test subjects to figure this out, though. People that can actually try it out in real-time, give feedback, revise, rinse and repeat.
Guides created in a vacuum without field-testing from really early on are usually pretty ineffective.
Honestly, it'd really be a huge undertaking.

>>3794813
Hogarth is GOOD, redart!

>>3794827
I don't think such a thing needs to be tried on real-time, or need test subjects. This guide we're talking about would be agreed upon by every participant that contributed to make the guide. This means that the creators of the guide are confident enough to try it themselves. Otherwise the guide would need to get a rework, since there's a problem with it if the creators themselves aren't willing to follow it. As for the feedback, since contributors will be following the guide, I think it's a safe assumption that there will be feedback at least from them. If something's wrong; revise, rinse and repeat as you mentioned. Reasonable debating would lead to reasonable conclusions, and the guide would essentially be /ic/'s state of the art "road to GMI".

>>3794847
Is this book still not scanned yet?

>>3793723
Anything on color?

>>3794661
what program is he using for that big cross to show up on the screen?

I think something like that would be helpful to keep track of the cursor in case it blend in with the bg color and you lost track of it

>>3794177
Where'd you get this?

Anyone has something for body language/gestures?

>>3795052
namajake

>>3795119

>>3795145
This is retarded. These "tutorials" are a joke.

>>3795231
Mind elaborating? Or are you just gonna complain?

>>3795243
Sure thing. The claim of >>3795145 is clearly stating that you're work should always be like the right, and never like the left. Right good, left bad. Ooga booga.

However, look closer at the things on the left that are supposed to be 'bad'. Keep in mind that these are specifically referring to the ball & cones, though I am not arguing that the left is better than the right. I'm focusing on the concepts, not the balls.

>not much contrast at all
Contrast is a tool that you can selectively use to compose your work. You can choose to have areas of higher contrast, and you can choose to have areas of lower contrast. This is trying to say that lower contrast is always bad, and that everything you make should always be high-contrast.

>everything everywhere has the same color dominating.
Again - that's not necessarily a 'bad' thing. There is nothing wrong with having the 'same color dominating (even though these are B&W). Color contrast is not much different than value contrast - they both can be higher or lower depending on what you're drawing.

>everything is on the same plane
>every object only has the shadows that come from their own shape
>highlights are always at the edges
Not all drawings need to be grounded in a believable 3D space, or utilize realistic lighting.

>Using too much outlines may cause it.
??? This isn't even a complete thought. Are they trying to imply that line work is bad?

Overall, my biggest issue is that this tutorial implies that stylization and deviating from the right is always bad, and that all work needs to be some form of realistic 3D digital painting.

>>3795145

Ironically the photo of the left has a stronger sense of form where as the photo to the right have a lot of flattened shapes.

>>3795258
>>3795261
Yeah, very good points. Thanks.

>>3793943
OVER 70LBS OF TITS AND ASS!

>>3794199
>>3794660

can someone explain the color zone shit

>>3794836
He had his uses for exaggerated anatomy but beyond that it's useless and jarring.

>>3794813
>doesnt lift

>>3795391
it comes down to subdermal distribution of fat (yellow), blood (red), and lack of blood (blue). those color definitions are a bit loose, it's all ratios in reality, but that's basically what they mean.

>>3794817
nope its a great way to develop volume.

>>3795391
sss or subsurface scattering. skin is fairly transparent and when the light shines into it it bounces around and you see what's inside. really apparent with things like ears, nose, fingers, etc. seeing the redness of blood and everything inside.

>yellow
bone/skull
>red
blood
>blue
hair from beard. you can use this with care for women but it's more for men who you might put a green or blue there for 5 o'clock shadow/hair under the skin.

>>3795685
>he says, having seen Hampton's feet and other shady abstractions

Hogarth is given a worse rap than he deserves to be honest family.

>>3795145
Is there a good tutorial for adding depth of form to your work outside of “just draw until you figure it out/read the sticky/Loomis?”

>>3795258

its not retarded at all, its pointing out potentially unintuitive, relevant concepts of representation of light, and design.

if you want your art to look more like the right, you will pay attention to the information

>>3795750
>>3795771

oh ok thanks this makes a lot more sense when you know what it's about, might actually be usable

>>3795880
>oh ok thanks this makes a lot more sense when you know what it's about, might actually be usable
that's why these threads are retarded. wisdom without the underlying knowledge is useless.

>>3795840
The sticky is a resource, including a google drive with tons of books. Loomis is just meant to be construction made easy.

Anyone got something focused on feet? Not for fetish, just haven't found something that clicks for me yet. Also necks? Mine always end up super long and I can't seem to get my heads attached to them properly if I don't draw the head first.

>>3793723

>>3794034
>>3794764
>aguri

hello. aguris guide suggests olson's perspective videos. Unfortunately i dont have access to those here in Shitholistan. Can I replace it instead with Gary Meyer's Fundamentals of Perspective vol.1?

>>3795991

Dumping from pixiv... 1

>>3796149

2

>>3796150

3

>>3796151

4

>>3796153

5

>>3796157

6

>>3796158

7

>>3796159

8

>>3796161

9

>>3796162

10

>>3793727
These knees are fucked up. It's kind of funny to see someone do a tutorial on something that they have no idea about.

>>3796149
This image makes me freak just thinking about how someone stared at syrup and studied it to just to get this kind of effect in their art work by replicating with their hand.

>>3796163
What's his point in this one? The results look the same.

>>3796276
Last step is highlights if that's what you mean. I'm not sure exactly what you're referring to.

>>3796278
like the two balls at the end looks the same, but for some reason be prefers to treat the core shadows as his "highlights" step and start with the shadows from the midtone.

>>3793936

>>3796481

>>3796483

>>3796484

>>3796486

>>3796481
SUKA BLJET?

>>3796487
these excercises are great desu

I need more coloring tutorials like >>3794970 please

>>3796488
cyka pls

>>3796496

>>3796492

>>3796488
ye not quite but slavic

i'm fucking shit and i just dont know where to put the arms, does anyone have anything relevant for posing them in just resting or not in exaggerated poses

>>3796610
I think Hampton's book on figure drawing should help you.

>>3794657
wow, this is fucking terrible.

>>3797596
gonna give it a read, thank u anon ily x

>>3794212
>>3794214

>>3798154

>>3798158

>>3794846
Here's the rest of these

>>3795991
Maybe this’ll help?

>>3798164

>>3798167

>>3798170

>>3798172

Remember to always draw from general to specific! Always make sure the whole piece progresses through these steps at the same time

>>3798184

>>3798186

If you've ever been confused by someone saying "imagine you're tracing over the form / feel the forms in your drawing" cause yours is too flat this is what they mean

>>3796124
IIRC Gary Meyer actually taught Olson and others?

Should be fine, maybe use a perspective book as well to go with it.(perspective made easy, framed perspective, or scott robertson's how to draw are all fine)

>>3798192

>>3798198

>>3798201

>>3798204

>>3798207

>>3798209

>>3798211

>>3798213

>>3798217

>>3798218

>>3798219

>>3798222

Something interesting from James Gurney's blog. Someone used eye tracking software to see where people's eyes lingered the longest on a photo. The spots they looked at the longest are the biggest circles, and are in focus. The things they did not look at or spend much time on were blurred out. This looks very much like painterly abstraction, where you leave out details to draw more attention to the important ones.

Just a reminder to everyone, especially those of us working in digital, that not everything in the picture has to be in focus and rendered to shit.

>>3798223

>>3795991

>>3798237

>>3798239

>>3798240

anyone got shading tips

>>3795991

>>3798238
who made this?

>>3798241
i can see it but explain what's going on here

>>3794845
big head is definitely the most popular it seems

>>3798525
No idea, it's some folder I downloaded named "Unknown - anime anatomy"

>>3798527
This is something portrait photographers use, you'll see it if you look back at school yearbooks. There's a lot of psychology and body language in the poses. They're generally going to try to make the men look more square and strong, whereas for women the goal is to put in some soft curves. I think there's something psychologically about the way you tilt your head, too. The feminine one is more submissive, and makes the shoulders and torso look smaller usually (I dont think they moved the guy's torso for this just his head).

Don't know if I explained it well but tldr make men look strong and square and women look curvy and dainty.

>>3798493

>>3798154
thats a pretty bad tutorial ngl

>>3796180
Then,why don't you share your vast knowledge on the matter by posting a tutorial of your own?

>>3798572

>>3798572
It's accurate for the placement part, I won't argue that it's terribly drawn though. That one bothers me too they're all puffy like doxy dicks.

Anyone got any better dick tutorials?

>>3798572
>>3798580

these don't look like real penises though, they look like chibified dicks. Sure, they're cute, but they just don't look like real dick. The balls are A+ tho.

>>3798237
Fuck AA, it's so fucking difficult, but such a great looking effect!

>>3798578
so you have to make your own tutorial to say that another tutorial isn't that good? wut

>>3794846
when you love chicken scratch so much that you turn it into your style and almost makes it look good.

>>3796483
what is this even supposed to show? oh 2 random muscles out of 2384923 muscles. k den.

>>3794813
lmao that pec

>>3794658
>>3794657
I like how the white parts are just like, yea fuck you, you'll have to figure that out by yourself.

also who learns from this. you'll just get stuck at some point and then have to learn real anatomy.

>>3798828
what part? i don't like hogarth at all but not many actually represent that bundle near the armpit where all the portions of the pec layer over each other before connecting to the humerus.

>>3798833
If people who looked for tutorials wanted to learn real anatomy, they would have just looked at life. So obviously, your audience is scrubs.

>>3796157
ballhead strikes again.

even loomis didn't draw the back of the skull this far down.

>>3798838
well you can still learn the general sense or how to approach drawing the body without getting spoonfed some weird shapes.

>>3798842
lol just lol

>>3798842
Why does no one ever upload her content? I find it hard to believe there's not a single sakimichan supporter on /ic/.

>>3798848
it has been uploaded and it's trash

>>3798842
What happened? Her anatomy in these ones are so much better than her current work.

I can't wait to save all these and never reference them

>>3798860
That's not even the worst part. It's saving all of them and referencing every single one and realizing how empty they actually are of information.

>>3798861
that's the best end to someone like me who loathes these threads lol

>>3798836
The way that he drew it makes it look like the lower pec is torn or dislocated from the humerus.

>>3793723
Every time I see this image in the catalog I get this primal urge to destroy my meat
but then I get over that urge and continue scrolling

I think it would be better to actually read a book about topic that interests you.
Having one page of the artists "book of tricks" is nice but in the end you miss out on all the other knowledge this artist has to share.

https://80.lv/articles/anatomy-in-character-design/

http://cedarseed.com/portfolio/human-types/

http://kitasite.net/us/cgkoza/muscle/arm3/arm3.htm

http://fucktonofanatomyreferencesreborn.tumblr.com/
>actually a fuckton of everything

http://www.mediafire.com/file/6db2ju5ck75ce6x/2700AMMePDF.zip

https://www.youtube.com/user/thang010146/videos

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B8VO-JQCy3HgelpRajdPY3RSXzg?amp%3Busp=sharing&amp%3Btid=0B8VO-JQCy3HgZ0U3QkVvVm4wREE
>An incredible thing, worth checking out.

>>3799390
Thanks for the links anon. I think i'm at that mental block stage where I'm just trying to absorb as much information from as many different sources as I can, but at this point I'm just overthinking it. I just gotta start drawing.

>>3799430
I think I know what you mean, I am struggling with this block as well.
Its hard to start drawing when nothing under your pen comes out looking even remotely satisfying but I tell myself I have to fight through this.
Sure sometimes a single page explaining concept very well gives you a push in the right direction but hoarding materials without practice can only take you so far.

>Coming from a guy doing roughly the same shit as you.

>>3799443
Godspeed bro

>>3798811
Well it would help give your rather vague opinion some substance and you wont end up sounding like a pretentious artsy cunt.

>>3799430
Yes just bust out drawings. Gesture drawings are good for the art blocks, do it every day as your warm up and you'll get some proportions/anatomy practice out of it too.

>>3799443
I get the feeling that nothing comes out looking even remotely satisfying. Look back at your past work, a few months or even a year back, and see how you have improved. Look at what you've consistently had trouble with and tackle it. Try going after those fundamentals and just draw draw draw as much as you can. Even when you want to give up and fucking kill yourself, just keep trying and keep comparing yourself to your old drawings.

>>3799430
Whats that image supposed to be for?

>>3799705
commons ideas for female poses?

>>3798858
Maybe she has trouble with the exaggerated lol-thicc body types she does now? These women do seem thinner than she paints now.

>>3794700
>>>3794661
>what is the point of this
Sculpting.

>>3800049
then go to /3/ with your shit ass """""""""tutorials""""""""". zarins already made a book way better than any of the shit in this thread, that and eaton is practically all you need.

>>3800061
What is clay?

>>3800111

>>3794843
Source please.

Eventually I will get around to doing this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQlXkAlUkdk

>>3800766
Artistic anatomy
Should be in the artbook threads somewhere

>>3801775
Do it today.

for coming up with ideas https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMhFyKBBdbI

>>3802105
really terrible video

>>3794847
isnt this the basics behind drawabox?

>>3798839
>muh loomis when the pic is about anime

>>3802783
God damn

>>3798159
>I enjoy drawing globby semen

>>3802783
MY DICCCCKK

>>3802783
that image is entirely loomis

>>3802783
god I wish that were me

>>3798848
>I find it hard to believe there's not a single sakimichan supporter on /ic/.
me, though poorfag so I just save what I can find

>>3802833
Mirin stronk ribcage

>>3799393
>skin shininess #2
>simple hot spot with secondary softer spot

That's the effect you see all the time in anime and anime art, I fucking love it especially when its on the shoulders and breasts

>>3802851
Oh you like shoulders and tits that look like zits? Gross.

>>3802853
You'd have to be retarded to mistake them for zits

>>3799394
Nice reminds me of

Anyone have that boob tutorial showing an accurate and inaccurate pair at different angles?

>>3799393
>There's no cheating with digital, only results

good point

>>3802813
>even loomis didn't draw the back of the skull this far down.

From the words of that other anon

>>3802906
idk what you're saying but i was saying the red anime pic posted is all loomis proportions

>>3802912
And I posted that pic because it has the "ballhead" that anon complained about yet still looks good

>loomis proportions
What does that even mean, just because the anatomy/proportions are realistic doesn't make it "loomis" he didn't invent proportions you know

>>3802783
Where's her diiiick

>>3803003
hiding under the skirt

>>3803009
this

>>3802783
I wish the little girl on the right actually looked like the woman on the left.

>>3803079
w-hat

>>3803087
The girl on the right looks more slender and shorter and no, it's not just a scale difference. Her face also looks like a fairly typically shojo style young girl face, it would have been great if she had a mature looking face, something like how Samus's face usually gets drawn.

>>3803090
>mature
She's not some old hag, baka

>>3803095
I just would have preferred if she looked like an adult rather than a teenager and that the front view matched the body type from the back view.

>>3803097
just shut up and enjoy the sexy anime backs

>>3802047
See, look.. I only saw your reply 16 hours later.
It's a whole different day now AND it's already half over.
I'll do it later.

>>3803009
BUT I DON'T FUCKING WANT TO DRAW MIDDLE AGED MEN IN THONG FFS

>>3803554
DO IT

OR YOU'LL NEVER BE ABLE TO DRAW THIS

>>3803578
>fateshit
Ironic weeb tier franchise

>>3803592
Nice buzzwords

>>3803554
Don't liesten to this>>3803578

That's just a meme. Mastering 3d shapes and anatomy is far more important for anime.

As long as you don't symbol draw you can do it.

>>3796276
>>3796288
It's showing two ways of drawing the same thing, and stating the artist thinks the second way is easier to do.

>>3798217
Hate how artists think everyone can read their deformed calligraphies. Fuck you, GRIZandNORM.com!

>>3803638
>As long as you don't symbol draw
Anime is all about symbol drawing

>>3803654

Bullshit.

That guy is talking about Da tier drawings.
Pros draw anime with construction not symbols.

>>3803595
He's almost right, fgo is trash.

Anyone have some good resources for drawing guy butts or muscles? Just to give them enough differance from drawing females for instance.

>>3803657
Everything is symbol drawing

Got any for doing nice water or other elements like that?

>>3802869
Dream bedroom

>>3803009
Do I need to be Greek too?

>>3803904
For the realistic anatomy studies yes, then for anime swap to being Japanese

>>3803657
Who's Da Tier?

>>3803908
>no racial change surgery yet
Only can only hope so much for the future

>>3803554
>>3803638
honestly it's unironically important to have a really strong basis in realism if you want to do stylized work because anime fucking lies and bends the rules in a lot of ways that aren't immediately apparent . you don't need to do algen-tier levels of renderwhoring or anything like that but you should strive to be able to understand planes & structures on this level at least

>>3793727
it looks good to me.

Can anyone post a tutorial for drawing clothed people?

>>3803657
Read the post but didn't read the pic, did ya?

>>3803655
>Understanding Comics by Scott McCloud

Would highly recommend purchasing this, amazing resource.

can anyone post a reference for the geometry of anime heads. thank you.

>>3804151

OK, guys, help me with this.
I want to learn how to draw, but I mostly need to do simple stuff relatively quickly. I've been doing loomis for a time but I fucking suck at combining geometrical shapes. Is there any other book or tutorial that would help me with this?

>>3804268
Do Drawabox

>>3804295
>Drawabox
Looks great, thanks!

>>3803655
I can see a plug just fine, plugface
And my continent doesn't even have that configuration
Some people are really limited by their own minds

>>3803911
DeviantArt tier*

>>3805751

Reminds me of Aeon Flux.

>>3794657
what exactly is wrong with this

>>3795761
I had no idea this was viable

>>3795960
Can someone explain the bottom right statement about taking too much depth if there's a cube? Is this just saying the sketch needs to incorporate a second vanishing point and make it 2-point perspective?

>>3805876
There's only a cube if the vanishing point is so far away the converging lines become parallel.

>>3803886
This is inherently false.

>>3795960
It's a continuation of the depth explanation from before. The cube is actually too long which is shown when you move further left of the VP.

>>3805703
context matters

I fucking hate asians with their insectoid like diagrams on how to fucking draw they manage to make everything autistically tedious

>>3806790
Mad because bad

>>3806790
>insectoid

The only good bug is a dead bug!

>>3807112
only an insect brain would manage to transform an art tutorial into a diagram,they dont even try to make it appealing to the eye

>>3807427
Lay off the /pol/aid

>>3802869
how did i instantly recognize this as Lain's room without seeing the image title

>>3808147
reallyl y makess yu thtink

>>3793950
People don't want to make it, they want excuses for why they don't.