/fa/ - Fashion

[Anonymous No.13552667]

why did legitimate subcultures die, and get replaced by hollow "aesthetics"?

[Anonymous No.13552703]

Because everything is getting more and more generic to fit more people

[Anonymous No.13552729]

>>13552667
Several reasons:
1) Globalism. The continuous effort by govts to minimize cultural differences and celebrate everyone being the same means that being a part of a subculture is discouraged on a fundamental level. This filters down from group dynamics to the individual.
2) The internet: this allows the diseemination of style/fashion on an instantaneous level unparalleled in human history. Fashion TV couldn't do this as quickly as the internet can today, so styles are now moving faster than 1-per-season. If you have styles moving this quickly, then styles will not have enough time to be established within the populace...the only thing a population can do is buy the product literally for the immediate time-frame. The only thing that lasts is fit (i.e. right now slim-fit has lasted more than 5 years, which is remarkable)...but actual style has changed quickly.
3) Multiculturalism (tied to 1 and 2): with monocultures, the classes within form very hard boundaries to show each other who belongs in what. This necessarily forms subcultures which rebel against the norm. Multiculturalism destroys this, as there is no signalling between classes because other cultures signal differently, leading to unpredictability in dress. With unpredictability, you lose meaning, and when you lose meaning, then dressing withing a subculture is valueless.

[Anonymous No.13552732]

>>13552667
People stopped skating but didn't stop wearing skatewear because its sweet.

[Anonymous No.13552735]

>>13552729
all true, but I also blame pop-hip-hop becoming the musical monolith of the last decade's zeitgeist to a lesser extent.

[Anonymous No.13552749]

>>13552735
Yeah, but the reasons I noted above are the cause. Consider that heavy metal dominated the from 1991-1996/7 or so, but we still had subcultures at that time that were not obliterated by that dominant form of pop music. Similarly, when boybands and girlbands took over for a few years, once again it didn't destroy everything, it just focused the light on a different facet.

The problem today is that today there is no social cache to dressing 'as part of something'. Being a part of a group is not considered a good thing anymore, and this is directly tied to the globalist efforts to make people individuals (individuals are easier to coerce and control than groups, and far less powerful). Not surprisingly, it's against our instincts, which is why people now form very hard groups politically because it's the only thing that they have left AND it's something they can hide when it becomes inconvenient. You can't do that with clothing which is, in terms of function, primarily to signal to others what you are and how dangerous you are.

[Anonymous No.13552755]

Subcultures you only know from movies xD

[Anonymous No.13552779]

>>13552755
you're literally a teenager

[Anonymous No.13552810]

>>13552779
only mentaly

[Anonymous No.13552818]

>>13552749
In full agreement with you there. I would simply interject by saying that I think you probably overestimate the impact of the globalist(not globalisation) agenda. While there clearly is one, its reach is hard to quantify as far as dissolving (sub)cultural distinctions on a localised scale - especially when it comes to musical subcultures. I think the internet is the ultimate cultural solvent in that it incentivised a unified pseudo-culture, not necessarily as part of an agenda, but as a natural social order/hierarchy. The forced globalism part certainly plays into it, insofar that it further incentivises letting go of your own cultural norms (or not even knowing them) and embracing the superficial aspects of guest cultures, but again, the internet will homogenise culture regardless of its various constituents. In the absence of a globalist trend (and self-hating western trend) the internet would have dissolved musical subcultures in a different way - hard to say how, but its built-in feature is homogenisation, simply by virtue of throwing everyone in the same playground. Same reason why class distinctions are blurred now - rich old money kids (apropos of the old money thread) are less likely to enjoy classical music and listen to Niki Minaj or whatever instead. It would come at a cost for most to sacrifice time in order to acquire a taste for classical music. Even in their social context.

[Anonymous No.13552906]

>>13552735
Modern hiphop dominated fashion from 2013-2017

[Anonymous No.13553010]

>>13552906
Yeah, but its prominence and implicit dismantling of other musical subcultures started a bit before that. So what would you say dominates fashion in 2018?

[Anonymous No.13553060]

because everyone will think you're weird, you have to go with the current style as with any generation. It's not like you can start wearing some colonial shit. Who knows what the fuck will be the trend in 15 years when my spawn will be in college

[Anonymous No.13553068]

>>13552667
neoliberal capitalism

[Anonymous No.13553087]

there were no legitimate subcultures. everything got co-opted within years of forming.

[Anonymous No.13553856]

>tfw live in northern europe where there's still strong subcultures

[Anonymous No.13553871]

>>13552667
the idea of a real community died slowly when the internet was born.

[Anonymous No.13553938]

>>13553856
i want to be friends with everyone in this pic
infest and mayhem are tight

[Anonymous No.13553997]

>>13552667
you arent int he club if you think theyre dead. subcultures have, do, and will exist, just without you, it seems.

[Anonymous No.13554066]

>>13552667
tfw I woke up today with a thought of creating the same thread on /fa/
>>13553856
>Infest
good

[Anonymous No.13554130]

Function over fashion

[Anonymous No.13554178]

>>13552818
Music is a very interesting aspect though, and it is in many ways very different to fashion. With music, we can always conceal our allegiances. Unless you're blasting it at the highest volume out of your earphones, then no one knows what you listen to on the Tube. Fashion on the other hand announces to the general populace (minus the blind) who you are, where you come from, what you do, how dangerous you are, etc., and this can be crafted for the biggest or smallest impact.

It's very difficult to demonize someone for listening to a particular style of music....or maybe I'll put it this way. It's tough to socially castigate someone publicly for listening to something. On the other hand, it's easy as pie to ridicule someone for what they are wearing.

That's why I don't really see music and fashion in the same boat, and why I think they've developed differently to each other in the internet age.

But then that takes us to the question: does listening to a specific type of music have social cache or value in our modern world? With fashion it's rather easy; we can see when something is expensive, or fits well, or has valuable materials. We can 'wear' wealth to show others. But can we 'hear' wealth? Not like the single album Martin Shekreli had and no one else had....that's a statistical rarity. But will a woman be attracted to you because she hears your headphones blaring Ferneyhough instead of Mozart? Will non-musicians respect you because you listen to jazz instead of Andrew-Lloyd-Webber?

I'm not convinced...but because of this, I think the answer to internet dissemination of musical culture is a simple one. That because there is no way to signal to others online your status simply because of what you listen to, the only hierarchy that can be built would be through your knowledge of the genre, how you explain the genre to others, and how you critique within that genre. Knowledge and argumentation would be the status. cont.

[Anonymous No.13554180]

>>13553997
This anon gets it.

[Anonymous No.13554193]

>>13554178
Fair nuff. You gave me a fair amount to chew on, but too drunk to reply satisfactorily at this moment in time (I think we've started talking past each other anyways). Bamping the thread nonetheless so I can respond later.

[Anonymous No.13554195]

>>13552818
>>13554178
cont.

But consider that that type of status wholly removes the sexual competitive component which is so vital in fashion; a great majority of fashion as a practical element in the real world (as opposed to the runway) is about making normal humans look better than they are, and that usually means accentuating physical features or complimenting (or even hiding) other ones so that we appeal to the most and we communicate simple ideas to the most. The suit (money), the biker jacket (rebel), etc., and if it's slim fit (person is trendy and in shape) or if it's excellent leather (then it's expensive), and all of that.

There is one area where music cache does exist, and we saw it heavily in the classical music industry just before the beginning of the end in 2005: who goes to what kind of concert. For example, if you regularly went to 'the symphony', you were a part of the usual rabble. You could be a casual listener, a seasons-ticket holder, or a student. BUT! If you were someone who went to contemporary-art music concerts, the kind of stuff that most normal people think is noise, then all of a sudden your musical cache increased heavily, because the assumption was that you were intelligent enough to 'get it'. Needless to say, audiences in these venues always said the same thing i.e. 'that was interesting'....'that composer really challenged the ideas of sound', etc. All this meaningless shit that told us that so many of these people were true posers, there for the cache and the impression of looking truly cultured, when they had no fucking clue what was going on, especially if you asked them specifics.

But that culture has disappeared, at least where I am, and it's disappearing in a lot of parts of the developed world. The internet has changed how we consume music, and the majority now do it digitally instead of live, which brings us back to our point. Fashion is still a social thing by default...music not so much. Whaddaya think?

[Anonymous No.13554203]

>>13554180
Hopefully, but as always I'm open to hearing ideas that challenge mine so that I can learn.

>>13554193
Cheers Anon. It's been a great discussion so far, and I'm about to get my drink on me-self. Drink deep, drink hearty my lad.

[Anonymous No.13554214]

>>13554203

[Anonymous No.13554216]

>>13552729
Well-said, anon. It's mind blowing how until recently one could be in different countries/regions and know this simply by looking around at what styles and clothing people wore, and discern your location from that. Now, with a few exceptions and maybe minor differences, people from one country will dress exactly the same as someone from someplace on the opposite side of the world. We are now one amorphous, nondescript blob. The sad irony is that in doing so, true diversity has been destroyed.

[Anonymous No.13554268]

>>13554216
I completely agree with you on this. One thing that has also come into play is that now it's almost a kind of social one-up-manship happening with regards to what you described. That if you wrongly identify someone in terms of where they are from, then they see that as a compliment towards how well they are able to mimic an aesthetic direction from the past.

There are some reasons for this of course. I think all of us have noticed how after the 70's trend came back in the late 90's, people started mixing and matching aesthetics heavily in the 2000s, to the point where shopping at antique/vintage/thrift stores was not just a thing to do out of practicality but was actually a chic thing to do. It was trendy to say, 'yeah, this is from the 60's....these earings are from the 80's, etc'. The provenance of the piece (and implied history within) was more important than the person wearing it. To me, THAT's scary. The clothing is more important than the person, the history of the clothing is more important than the history of the person wearing it.

That used to be limited to certain specific items (biker jackets come to mind)....but now it's in everything from the shoes you wear to the glasses. To me, that's the ultimate in the removal of the self from the whole thing. Remove group identity....remove self-identity...that's awful.

And then the companies selling us clothes have the gall to advertise their clothing in a way that suggests that by wearing their clothing we're all of a sudden going to express our individuality. That a specially patterned pair of Doc Martens is going to make us different compared with the person who bought the previous pair.

Perhaps I'm being too harsh...but sometimes the mechanisms of fakery that cause us to repurchase things we don't need just to satisfy an artificially supported newspeak of fashion identity and individuality really get to me...

[Anonymous No.13554278]

I thought we all just got fed up of confining and committing ourselves to specific things and became more Free and authentically ourselves, but I guess that's just me leaving adolescence and looking back at all my atrocious phases.

[Anonymous No.13554306]

Two main purposes of subcultures:
*get you to buy lots of shit
*work up to convincing people to be gay and trans

Just about every girl in the West will tell you to take her to see Disney, Star Wars or Marvel movies and she'll buy the merch.
There's no need to make her adhere to an aesthetic in fact it would decrease the profitability of the merch if you had to look a certain way to buy it.

Similar deal with the gay and trans stuff. They want you to suck a cock and they don't care what you look like.

[Anonymous No.13554315]

We're honestly better without subcultures. Find yourself instead.

[Anonymous No.13554317]

>>13554306
you don't know what a subculture is, do you friendo?

[Anonymous No.13554350]

>>13553010
The "aesthetic" scene is definitely something that's been strong for the last 2-3 years.
The particular look always changes, but you can tell when you see it because it's always some kid in their teens or early twenties dressing in a way that incorporates elements from a lifestyle they don't live.
I've seen this a lot in streetwear, the whole art hoe look, hipsters and trendhoppers

[Anonymous No.13554374]

>>13553871
>>13552729
The internet seems like a really strong culprit for this based on my own observations and those ITT.
However I still don't think that subcultures completely died, they just became digital.
The advent of the internet and the eventual explosion of social media meant that people would have an easier time finding others like them online.
Ironically 4Chan is a perfect example of this.
There are many boards on this site, many of which have communities that will never interact with each other outside the occasional cross-boarder.

[Anonymous No.13554383]

>>13554317
If you think they are not designed top-down to get you to buy shit then you are mistaken.

Notice how you didn't actually me what you believe one is in your post? That's because you're afraid I or someone else will find something in your belief to pick on.
This is why /fa/ sucks today. It's all talking shit, no posting fits.

[Anonymous No.13554384]

>>13552729
*Global Capitalism

[Anonymous No.13554385]

>>13552703
fpbp

[Anonymous No.13554441]

They continue to exist, outside of the eyes of the normans.

[Anonymous No.13554671]

Politics are the only subcultures left now.

[Anonymous No.13554686]

>>13554383
your first point was right your second point was fucking retarded

[Anonymous No.13554700]

>>13552729
But I like it. I’m a nonwhite living in a third world country, really far from the US, and I can’t imagine NOT wearing brands that are currently hot in NYC. I want to be on par with you. I want to be equal to you. I don’t want to be your servant when you’re visiting my country for holiday. I want my country to look like yours, because it’s better that way.

If “being right” means me being lower tier than you, if it means I’m being the jungle ape nigger I “should” be, then I’m fine with “being wrong”. I live in a third world country and I want us together to ERASE the boundaries of “third world” and “first world”. If immigration is wrong, then I will build my own NYC in my country. I live in a third world country and I wear Uniqlo and Manhattan Portage.

Fuck you, I’m not third world in mind and heart.

[Anonymous No.13554706]

>>13554700
What you want is a bunch of meaningless post-modernist mindless garbage. Embrace your culture and if foreigner whitey doesn't like it tell them to fuck off, i also live in a third world country and i hate how the US influences our culture, American culture is based on corporatism and consumerism, it has no substance to it, the only worthwhile American culture is not found on the metropolis that you crave to experience.

[Anonymous No.13554711]

>>13554700
fighting for national liberation from US economic and cultural dominance is /fa/

[Anonymous No.13554722]

>>13554706
Whatever. I’m just saying that we will continue using the internet, so that everyone in this world can simultaneously enjoy and learn the same thing together. I’m pretty sure university curriculums in my country is the same with american curriculum. We watch the same thing, we visit the same website, we grow the same work ethic, we listen to the same music, we’re speaking the same language. I don’t like my culture, bcause it doesn’t allow me to be the bisexual person I am, it looks down on the celibate life that I want to live, and it will see a person like me (who’s passionate about graphic design and pretty skilled at internet marketing) as useless. I can only be useful and having fun in the libertarian modern society. We can’t deny it, the west is the best and the rest is garbage. But with the internet, we will erase the traditional west, the traditional east, the traditional everything, and together we will form a new universal modern culture, that when someone asks “who shapes this culture?” The answer will not be “whites” anymore. Everyone influencing each other. Through the internet. We will stop calling blacks nigger again, because blacks will learn the same thing as what whites are learning. Through the internet. Same with southeast asians, indians, etc.

I don’t want to be what I am right now. I’m sick of not being part of the superior group that shapes the modern progressive world. But that will change.

I hate traditionalism, I hate my strict religious parents, and when the time is right, I will leave everyone and everything behind. I will have to be comfortable with declaring myself as anything, I will have to be comfortable with declaring myself as an atheist, and I will mix with a white person, so that my inferior genes can stop existing because my offsprings will mix with whites thus I my future offsprings aren’t gonna be southeast asian. Or I will not mix at all.

[Anonymous No.13554733]

>>13554711
It’s not. Those people aren’t wearing hot shit like Lemaire or Margaret Howell. They don’t listen to Chelsea Jade or Anderson Paak. They don’t follow cool photographers and graphic designers on Instagram. They don’t even have instagram. They’re also religious and prejudiced. Like my parents, religious and prejudiced. When the time is right, I will leave them behind and never come back.

I’m too good for this savage society and I deserve a better society where I fit in perfectly.

[Anonymous No.13554735]

>>13554722
Cringe. Please be a 10/10 troll or under the age of 20.

[Anonymous No.13554737]

>>13554722
That's a really fucked up way of looking at the world, disliking your home culture doesn't mean you need to crave another country's. No genes are really inferior btw so stop self-hating. The United States is not heaven, the west is not the best because of all the shit they sell, only reason you can see a more liberal thought in it is because of pure materialism and being more advanced due to going trough different historical phases before anywhere else in the world, they have lived in capitalism longer than the rest of the world for example.

[Anonymous No.13554744]

>>13552667
THE INTERNET

[Anonymous No.13554756]

>>13554735
No I really am a shitskin, look at my filthy skin. I always fantasize working at a creative agency in NYC. Life must be cool as fuck and I would be satisfied with my life.

>>13554737
Capitalism is not wrong. Socialism has killed hundreds of millions of people, look it up. It’s not common sense at all.

>>13554744
And it’s a good thing. What do you lose anyway? Nothing. You have nothing to lose, internet or no, the west would have looked the same. But it’s a major thing for us in the unfortunate parts of the world, where we’re cursed with shitty genes etc.

[Anonymous No.13554761]

>>13554756
>Capitalism is not wrong.
Capitalism kills 20 million people per year, anon.

[Anonymous No.13554762]

>>13554733
I live in the middle of this "better society" and work in this industry. I can tell you it is no better than the place you come from. It is filled with filthy rotten, terrible people who will fuck you over on a dime's notice. Everything is fleeting, vapid, and meaningless. The aesthetics are a ploy to cover up the fact that everything in my world is empty, everything is so useless to actually making history. You are upset with where you are, but you are chasing an illusion that will only disappoint you.

[Anonymous No.13554769]

>>13554761
This is why I can’t stand nonwhite cultures. Both communism and capitalism were invented by whites, but you chose the irrational and wrong one, for stupid reason. I hate being lumped in the same group as you, because you’re stupid, your idea is stupid, and most people who look like me would agree with you. That’s embarassing as fuck.

>>13554762
I’m pretty sure it’s fun, you’re just choosing the wrong kind of scene. It must be fun to be associated with those cool people, talking to them, actually seen as being on par with them, having them seeing you as their equals, etc etc.

I don’t need your version of “meaning”. I don’t need family, I hate kids, I don’t trust women. I just want to live a modern and intelligent solitude life.

What’s the alternative? Working bank job, having a family in my own country? It seems scary.

[Anonymous No.13554775]

>>13554756
Go away you pseudopaki "agency" working motherfucker. This is the 20th thread this week where you smuggl in your adolescent contempt and juvenile whining about your "traditional" parents. go to >>>/adv/ or >>>/r9k/, but mainly shut the fuck up, grow up and bear your own cross with some fucking dignity. You're right about the west being the best, but it's mainly because it's predicated upon individual liberty, rights and responsibility, more so than any other civilization. Judeo-Christianity, Western jurisprudence starting with the Magna Carta and Western Enlightenment all led to this and strengthened the idea that our societies should serve and look at humanity as individuals rather than collectives, or groups and that one should be responsible for oneself, whereas the rest of the world had a much more collectivist social order. Having said that stop being a whiny self-hating shitskin and have some respect for yourself, your parents and your culture. Maybe get to know them better before you criticize them.

>>13554761
Socialism killed over 300 million people mate. Capitalism reduced global wealth inequality and increased standards of living for every socio-ecenomic group more than any other system (also increased inequality domestically, but raised the standard of living for the poorest. So the poorest of the poor are richer than they have ever been). It propelled medical technology into the future saving millions of life and prolonging lifespans by 25%. Agro technologies sustained by capitalism made food more available and affordable than ever before. It halted infant mortality by access to medicine and food.

You're embarrassing mate. Go flaunt your ungrateful, prepubescent anticapitalist whinging cuntmouth in your fashion management class with other "artsy" historically illiterate peers, but leave Cameroonian Hamper Weaving Forums be.

[Anonymous No.13554786]

>>13554775
>sucking capitalist ding dong.
Cant expect more from right wing imageboards. All the shit you said is propaganda, do you seriously think the burgeoisie would say good shit about socialism and recognize capitalism's flaws? Are you that retarded? 300 million my ass, each year they keep changing the number, how come every death under socialism is because of it and every death in capitalism has nothing to do with it? Use the same logic for both, dipshit.
Also
>Reduces poverty
Poverty can be changed to whatever number you want.
>Medical access
And yet you have to pay for it as if its not a human right, same for food and water, housing. Capitalism is pathetic and stagnant, This shit will lead us to cyberpunk land but since you get to buy shit as a middle class its fine amirite xd. Fucking boomer.

[Anonymous No.13554788]

>>13554775
That’s right and I believe in the same thing. I’m trapped in the wrong skin color and society. I should have been a white person. I believe you see me as below than you as well, and it really bothers me. That’s why I overcompensate so hard irl. I always try to get into impressive shit because I feel bad about stuffs that I can’t change. My race, my culture, my country, my penis size, my family, etc etc.

[Anonymous No.13554790]

It's not that subcultures died out, it's just that you're probably too old to notice them now. Subcultures are for teenagers, most people grow out of them in early twenties. I used to be a punk kid and hang out with almost exclusively punks, metalheads and skins but now only a few of my old friends are punks/metalheads in their twenties.

[Anonymous No.13554793]

>>13554756
Are you Flip, anon? The self hatred is real. Get a grip on reality and lay off the /pol/ Kool-Aid.

[Anonymous No.13554796]

>>13554756
>Socialism kills more people than capitalism!
>A bunch of dudes who dont care about the masses would totally provide real information to protect them rite.
You're a fucking idiot and you fell for the neoliberal meme, congrats. Go live in NYC and enjoy your poverty, high rent, high medical bills, shit wages and non existent culture.

[Anonymous No.13554799]

>>13554793
No, indonesian.

>>13554796
I don’t need culture. What can a culture give you? An unfulfilling life. You’ll always envy whites. But with a universal modern culture, everyone will be equal.

[Anonymous No.13554802]

>>13554788
Im a mexican brownskin and dont feel ashamed of myself, grow up and stop using 4chan that much idiot. No one in the liberal world you want to live in cares about your skin and it doesnt change jackshit, your self hatred is the one of a 13 year old. Jesus fuck.

[Anonymous No.13554803]

>>13554796
socialism has failed in every application

[Anonymous No.13554824]

>>13554786
Yeah, the Great Leap Forward, the Chinese famine, the Holomodor, dekulakization, death camps for the arbitrarily picked bourgeoisie (mostly dissidents) and many other gems are quantifiable events in the history of socialism and directly led to the deaths of hundreds of millions of people.

Poverty can be made into a relativistic term, but what I'm referring to is wealth adjusted to inflation and purchasing power adjusted to inflation. Both have gone up, inequality between capitalist nations has been reduced and the poorest are richer than ever before despite domestic inequality having increased by a bit.

If you're striken by an illness that is expensive to manage and treat your chances of survival and good care are significantly better in the capitalist West than any other place at any moment in time regardless of where you're situated socio-economically. Yes, capitalism saved millions of lives, both through advancing medical technology and science (tests and medicine) and giving people access to affordable food more than any other system. And yes nigger, I expect you to contribute something if you want care. Me going through medical school for ten years, relinquishing most avenues of youthful instant gratification for the research of pharmaceutical chemistry so I can treat your cancer ridden ass implies that you at least have no issue with holding a part time job so you can pay your taxes and get insured. Yes, that's the least you can do for our social contract to work. And no, you shouldn't expect to get stuff for free just because you've sanctified yourself as a godly person with rights. You have responsibilities too nigger.

>>13554788
You need to seek help mate. And the answer is no. As in no, I don;t think you're inferior becaus eyou're a shitskin. I think you're inferior because you're a self-hating whiny shitskin who still brings up his contempt for his "traditional" parents on an anonymous forum

[Anonymous No.13555550]

>>13553856
Wearing a graphic t isnt subculture, those poofters aint shit

[Anonymous No.13555565]

>>13555555
who get em?

[Anonymous No.13555610]

>>13554761
Capitalist competition is responsible for every major societal advancement in recent history.
There is no perfect system, but communism is so fucking idiotic that those calling for it shouldn;t be given platform.

[Anonymous No.13555622]

>>13555610
Something doesn’t become imperfect just because ppl die. I mean, in capitalism, ppl die bcause of age. In communism, ppl die because they’re killed by the dictatorship.

Some low IQ apes in this thread are so dumb that they see capitalist death as the same thing as communist deaths. In capitalism, ppl die because humans die.

[Anonymous No.13555683]

The innovation adoption curve of Rogers is a model that classifies adopters of innovations into various categories, based on the idea that certain individuals are inevitably more open to adaptation than others.
Summary of Innovation Adoption Curve of Rogers. Abstract
www.valuebasedmanagement.net/methods_rogers_innovation_adoption_curve.html

[Anonymous No.13555871]

Capitalism.
Search for "zero books Vaporwave"
Or "hauntology", it's too long to write it down on 4chan

[Anonymous No.13555993]

>>13554786
medical access should never be a human right. if it were free, then that would make all doctors slaves. then no one wants to go to college for 7 years to become a doctor slave. we've already seen these affects for years due to obamacare and high malpactice insurance costs. young doctors are avoiding general practice and are going into specialties instead. there's a hugh shortage of general practicioners, but no incentive for a doctor to choose it. that just fucks over the consumer.

[Anonymous No.13556422]

>>13554195
Good poast

[Anonymous No.13556469]

>>13552749
I kek'd

[Anonymous No.13556738]

>>13555993
Good fucking thing the rest of the proles work like slaves. Middle class trust fund kids are fucking retarded.

[Anonymous No.13557627]

>>13552667
The hell are talking about boy? There are tons of active subcultures all over the place. Maybe get off fourchinz for a bit or something. Go to an electro-industrial show, or get into motorcycles. Seriously there are so many legitimate subcultures, all you gotta do is get off your ass and look around.

[Anonymous No.13557643]

>Implying they aren't already hollow aesthetics.

Punk was a hollow aesthetic from the get-go.

[Anonymous No.13558004]

>>13552667
>legitimate subcultures
lmao, they were never anything but teenage fuckwittery

[Anonymous No.13558036]

'legitimate' subcultures were just as shallow as today's subcultures.

You either don't understand today's subcultures or don't want to admit the subcultures of your youth weren't all that deep.

[Anonymous No.13558044]

>>13554722
>we will erase the traditional west, the traditional east, the traditional everything, and together we will form a new universal modern culture
This is literally an outdated vision in the west, which was tried and found to lead to a horrible dystopia. You're just way behind the curve, guy.

>>13554733
>I’m too good for this savage society and I deserve a better society where I fit in perfectly.
Lel, hard knocks for you then because the societies of the west won't welcome you as an equal and you won't fit in at all.

[Anonymous No.13558047]

>>13558036
Internet culture now dies within few months, remember that faggot spinner? didn't even last until the end of 2017. Remember day way meme? Died around March

[Anonymous No.13558054]

>>13558047
YOLO

[Anonymous No.13558062]

>>13558054
That shit was back in 2010 that lasted years.

[Anonymous No.13558064]

>>13558047
Are you saying a single meme == a subculture?

Think about how long things like art hoe and nu goth have been around mate.

[Anonymous No.13558067]

>>13558064
meme is part of subculture, to lesser extent though. Hipsters are one of it.

[Anonymous No.13558072]

>>13558067
A meme is a unit of culture, not an entire subculture itself.

Blessed, cursed, aesthetic, esoteric memes, etc, these are all subcultures of memes.

[Anonymous No.13558272]

The 4chan/discord trans "community" is a subculture; one whose existence makes us suffer

[Anonymous No.13559085]

>>13552729
i feel as if social media plays a large part in this as well, people would rather belong to whichever glamorised niche aesthetic they know will garner them the most followers on instagram. they don’t want to commit to a dated subculture because it risks leaving them socially isolated and they enjoy likes on their selfies.
could be totally wrong tho

[Anonymous No.13559301]

That's a good thing. Subcultures are cringey and a prime example of herd mentality

[Anonymous No.13559544]

>>13558064
He's saying, that as part of a greater trend, popular things explode and vanish in a matter of months these days due to exposure; whereas before, popular things would get popular and stay that way for quite a while longer before they became "uncool".

[Anonymous No.13559727]

>>13554775

Wow this guy makes an actual attempt to rebuttal, and people like
>>13554786
>>13554796
just try to gas light him loool.

wew lads, regardless if he or she "made" up the statistics, he or she is so much better arguing a point than you guys.

[Anonymous No.13560201]

I think there's still subcultures you've just become old and out of touch.

[Anonymous No.13560202]

>>13554761
So what's the alternative? Sorry friends but the free market is too damn useful to give up.

[Anonymous No.13560208]

>>13554700
Fuck you. You're not like us. Even other Americans that move to NY are different from us.

[Anonymous No.13560594]

>>13554769
Genuinely curious question here: Where did these values of yours come from? Friends? Education? General feeling of neglect? Mainstream Meadia in Indonesia? Access to American TV and Films? The internet? Chans specifically? A weird family member who managed to escape? Elsewhere?

I've traveled enough myself to know that what you're saying isn't necessarily unique, that many others I've met in similar places of similar ages feel the way that you do, but it's astonishing to me that it's such a hard rejection of one's values within such a short amount of time, and I'm curious as to your thoughts on what >>13552729 's (and the following conversation) thoughts on globalism play a part in your story.

We all like to believe our instincts and tendencies and what not come from within, but it's rarely the case.

Care to share?

[Anonymous No.13560681]

I hate tattoos. They are a completely meaninglessness accessory in 2018. Tattoos were once a pretty good indicator of what someone might be into. Women with a lot of tattoos were relatively rare and most likely involved in niche sub-cultures represented in their ink.

Today I see more females covered in tattoos than males. These tattoos tell you nothing of their background and serve as little more than Stacys permanent jewelry.

[Anonymous No.13560865]

>>13554706
That's not what posy-modernist means. Go clean your room again you fatass lobster.

[Anonymous No.13560876]

>>13555550
>those poofters aint shit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-EWquKhZTg
lol

[Anonymous No.13561042]

>>13552732
I feel like there are more skaters now than ever and skatewear just makes sense for them to wear because it's practical. And that's not even including the fact that many skate brands are owned and operated by skaters.

[Anonymous No.13561050]

>>13560208
You're right. No one is like a New Yorker. New Yorkers are the best at making and becoming slaves. It's incredible. They're rivaled only by the UAE.

[Anonymous No.13561126]

>>13560681
great relevant Post 10 out of 10

[Anonymous No.13562025]

>>13552729
Weren't subcultures almost always international? My big sis used to be a goth and looked the same as any American goths did.

[Anonymous No.13562151]

>>13552667

[Anonymous No.13562317]

>>13562151
Oh shit is the liquid in those actually white?
Looks fucking disgusting

[Anonymous No.13563992]

>>13554722
Pathetic

[Anonymous No.13564164]

Postmodernism

[Anonymous No.13564232]

because you form too much of your worldview from the internet

[Anonymous No.13564235]

>>13562317
It tastes like lemonade, its actually not bad.

[Anonymous No.13565754]

>>13560681
tattoos are for boring people these days

[Anonymous No.13566427]

susanwainwrightcore should be a subculture

[Anonymous No.13567088]

>>13553856
They look like posers

[Anonymous No.13567104]

>>13554700
there is a different between wanting to become the best and wanting to surpass the best. america has a lot of cultural flaws and if you can elevate yourself while also maintaining your own unique character then you would become true overmen. remember, even europeans were barbarians once.

[Anonymous No.13567107]

Innovative subcultures and scumcultures like cyberpunk, furries, juggalos and hick hop are on the cutting edge and not mainstream yet. The prison (tattooed), punk, goth, skate, street, athletic casual and nerd subcultures exist but their fashion style were mixed into mainstream normie fashion so they lose their edge.

[Anonymous No.13567119]

>>13567107
Also I think Arab culture and their baggy clothes will influence western fashion

[Anonymous No.13568288]

because susancore

[Anonymous No.13569315]

>>13552729
I wish some microbrewery would make a beer and use this pic for the packaging.

[Anonymous No.13570638]

>>13560681
>>13565754
>tattoos are for boring people these days
+1

[Anonymous No.13570640]

>>13567119
>I think Arab culture and their baggy clothes will influence western fashion
naw, you're wrong

[Anonymous No.13570654]

>>13554195
How is music not a social thing? If your black and you listen to death metal, and tell people so, Im pretty sure you're gonna get strange looks

[Anonymous No.13570665]

>>13554268
Plus, i didnt know people could talk civilly on 4chan, keep up the good work

[Anonymous No.13570679]

>>13570638
"hey i saw you at the show the other day but i was too shy to say hi"-core

[Anonymous No.13572021]

1. the internet, like others have mentioned. Subcultures exist, just they have no reason to manifest in the real world.

2. Clothing is getting more corporate and global. Unless you live in the US its literally impossible to find brands catering to a certain lifestyle. Everything is engineered-to-be-replaced fast fashion and this will only get worse.

3. people don't really identify with their consumer choices as much as they used to. This is really more of a good thing t bh