/fa/ - Fashion

>>6600349
Symbols go beyond logos and fabrics. Learn basic semiotics then red a bit more about the role these subconscious choices have in fashion.
Roland Barthes - the language of fashion
roland barthes - the fashion system
Marcel Denasi - of cigarettes, high heels, and other interesting things
Rebecca Arnold - Fashion: a very short introduction
Miller & Kuchler - Clothing as material culture

Visit your local fashion school/liberal arts college and spend some time in their library

>>6600381
>read a bit more

>>6600349
When you think about it, it all makes sense really and then you see how all the pieces fall together. I am not saying that I am completely aware of everything, but I do see the cogs of the whole machine so it becomes difficult to behave myself when I see that others do not see what I see.
The way we use branding and status is definitely a very primal instinct that it touches, but what's interesting is the way we have escalated its complexity and apply it to currency. I believe money is the most powerful thing in the world and the way we draw it out of eachother is fascinating to me. Fashion has its own way of doing this obviously: exploiting insecurities and the need to establish social presence.

I think that's a good way of simplifying it: exploiting insecurities and the need to establish social presence.

That is something that I definitely have a problem with when it comes to this board. A lot of posts lately have been the result of people who seem to be "into" fashion for some shaky reasons.

I feel people are not aware of what it really means to wear clothes, and the answer is as simple as stopping to think for a second. Separate yourself from your ego.

>>6600385
There's a lot more to it than that.You're not the first person to think about this.

>>6600381
I wouldnt be surprised, even certain shapes and such would have certain connotations. These could all be linked to fertility, class status, etcetera. Again, it's all part of how we use clothing as a cultural tool.

I wouldn't know which one of those books to dive in first so I will probably research them later.

But anyway, this thread is more of a discussion on /fa/ as a whole and how a bit of awareness would really liven the place up.

>>6600393
The Language of Clothes by Alison Lurie is a good read

>>6600385
I feel people are not aware of what it really means to wear clothes, and the answer is as simple as stopping to think for a second. Separate yourself from your ego.

I think of fashion as a way of expressing myself and most people on /fa/ that appear to be genuinely interested in fashion give off that vibe.

>>6600387
Didn't want to say I was the first person to think about this, and that is definitely a major point I want to bring up.

Why did you mention that part? Why did you have to to add that I was not the first to think of this? Is that cigar just a a cigar?

I'm just another person that is naturally coming to terms with the inner working of everything. Humility is the most important thing when doing this, which is what I ask of all the /fa/ posters. Understand what it is you are doing.

>>6600387
Who else has thought of it? I want to read into this.

>>6600393
Just read wikipedia articles about the semiotics of fashion, and understand basic semiotics stuff (de Saussure, Peirce) before you try to delve into [post]structuralist stuff

>>6600404
the same authors she mentioned already nimrod

>>6600397
of course, i notice that all the time here and it's great to see.

and i am glad to know that most of those people probably know that wearing clothes escalates to a much more complex form when it is used socially. I am saying this because I am tired of the what /fa/ has been saturated with very very recently

everything seems so narrow and so tunnel vision. i need a second to articualate this

>>6600385
Something that seemed interesting while I was reading your post was that we're not really influenced by the logos, but by what they represent. That's why a heavily branded shirt will get attention, but so will a really nice, low-key fit with no visible branding.

Obviously the latter won't get as much attention, but people with an appreciation for aesthetics will be able to see when something looks good, regardless of brand name. For better or worse, "nice" clothes imply high cost, which obviously implies money. Hence the idea of a nicely fitted (but cheap) suit looking better than an expensive, baggy suit.

As >>6600397 stated, I see clothing as a way to express myself and literally wear my interests. One of my friends recently said I wear "bling" because most of my money goes to clothes, while I don't have a really nice car or computer or anything else. But it's really just a coincidence that my main hobby ends up being worn on my back, and I think there's no shame in that.

>>6600406
the fuck you on about girl

あ

>>6600411
i think that it is great to see that you approach it with a more personal and "pure" perspective.
it's when people do it en masse and i see the businesses getting rich off of the exploitation of the system that I start to get hot and bothered.

>>6600421
*conversation

>>6600409
people aren't developing tastes or paying enough attention to their surroundings. it's the only reason i can see with people coming up with uninspired and lazy fits

>>6600412
She's trying to sound pretentious and inaccessible; clearly more interested in imposing superiority over you than having a conversion

>>6600403
You're kind of just stabbing at the air, making grand statements without really understanding them, like when a fourteen-year-old reads "Made in Bangladesh" on his favourite tee and realizes that consumerism is a real thing, and then reads No Logo for the first time and thinks they have to save everyone they know from being trapped by big businesses. There are loads of ideas and things that can help you with understand, and I cited a list of them. If you're really interested in what goes behind things like visual marketing, things like magazine layouts and advertisements, read more about it, take a course in it. A lot of these decisions aren't personal philosophical choices. They're subconscious or emotional reactions based the way the contemporary American consumer is socialized to function

>>6600423
you're making an awful lot of assumptions

>tfw from bangladesh
>buying clothes made in bangladesh
>may have inadvertently caused the death of your relatives

>>6600423
Well that's is exactly what I am talking about?

I dont appreciate all those comparisons you're making.

Just because I become aware of things does not mean I am taken over by it like some teenager. I am not some air head, i keep my composure.

>socialized to function
elaborate on this, do you mean (as an example) the way proportions of a book affect our conceptual framework and how we receive information? etc

Are we seeing our first /fa/ catfight?

>>6600411
Also, regarding active wear and the whole yoga pants crowd: Are those people unaware the clothes affect how people view them, or are they aware of exactly that, and choose to wear yoga pants and trainers?

People might deny it, but clothes can and will completely change how people treat you. Since I gravitate towards menswear, I'm well received in stores like Saks, am often asked for help or directions from people much older than me, and am occasionally seen as being ~5 years older than I actually am--a gap that's nothing to shake a stick at while still in undergrad studies.

The only value I can see in wearing athletic gear is that it's safe. You fit in, and nobody feels threatened by you or your clothes; you're not elevating yourself above anyone, and therefore are not forcing anyone else to "keep up" with you.

>>6600417
What do you mean by "en masse"? Are you against everyone actually caring about their clothes, or are you against them caring about their clothes for the sake of showing off?

>>6600433
>first

>>6600437
are they others? did i miss berry vs prodigy or something?

sometimes I feel like the only reason I think dark-wash slim-cut jeans are better than the opposite is because /fa/ told me they were at a time when I had previously given no thought to fashion, and the idea has become so ingrained in my mind and /fa/ has hammered it in so much and I myself have perpetuated it so much that I cannot escape it

>>6600434
i mean en masse in that people use their money in ways that are not so bright and only because they have been sold the right image. i dont really care to be honest what other people do, and probably want to enter the market

>>6600434
Zuckerberg didn't get a bunch of shit for wearing hoodies. It depends on what your achievements are and what's behind the clothes.

>>6600444
no they actually do look better

>>6600446
see that's fine and all but it''s when people make a choice to be "fashionable" and use there money like fools that gets me bothered

again i dont really care though

>>6600451
you can't care and be bothered at the same time, you have to care a little

>>6600450
but even in a lot of fashionable" circles where I more or less agree with people's opinions I see them praising light-wash jeans that I think are hideous

I feel like /fa/ has thoroughly brainwashed me

this isn't just about jeans, obviously

>>6600423
also forgiveeme but is skimmed over the wikipedia article on no logo. i am not talking at all about corporations and am not talking about mrketing, i am talking about the way we PERSONALLY use clothing and the way we PERSONALLY influence each other. i am talking about the way we use clothes on a primal level and how those base impulses must not be ignored. this is talking to each other, not lecturing at a large group.

>>6600457
i care enough to wish to be part of the exploiters, and to be higher on the pyramid in this beautiful country

What a boring thread

>>6600478
natalie portman is disgusting

>>6600466
it's all in vain in the end

>>6600472
needs more drama

>>6600444
>>6600458
I know what you mean. After watching and rewatching my favorite 80s movies, I have a special place in my heart for light wash jeans and sleeveless denim jackets. It seems like dark wash is far more safe, and light wash is something only to be attempted when your'e fully aware of how shit it usually looks.

>>6600476
see this is why i really appreciate poet because his style of writing is very personal and REAL

he's always talking TO you, not at you and thinkg about how he's going to look when people read it

>>6600482
>implying you wouldn't let her squat over your face and piss in your mouth and then rim her ass after swallowing her piss

>>6600485
these are example of what i mean when i say fashion can be done at a very personal and pure level. it is you, an animal whose mind has developed a attachment to a certain concept

it is when we involve it with tacky and tasteless ideas that i begins to turn ugly. but of course theres nothing wrong with a little showing off!

>>6600493
shut the fuck up!

>>6600490

>>6600490
poet is a shameless drug addict who buys drugs off of people he meets in /fa/

>>6600349
I stopped reading two sentences in.

There's no thesis here. There isn't even a question or a direction of inquiry. It's just a bunch of very vague rambling and imprecise philosophizing.

Listen to this woman: >>6600381

And if you're going to read barthes, you might as well read lacan and foucault and derrida.

I know you're specifically interested in fashion, but once you crack open a little pomo, you reallu should go the rest of the way.

>>6600512
Thanks Mr English teacher sir.

Hell yeah it's ramblings, I just smoked a bowl before typing.

You're weird dan, and that's coming from a some one who pretends to be Natalie Portman on the internet

lol jk!

>>6600504
what a cutie pie!

>>6600518
Are you a girl or a ftm?

>>6600523
100% NATural!!!

>>6600497
I agree, but I also agree with the rest of /fa/ in that you need a foundation of basics to know the rules before you can start breaking them. After that it's all up to you, whether it be light wash denim vests or drop crotch sweats or wool trousers.

Owning it and really making it yours is what matters. There will always be someone who hates your outfit, but then again there will always be someone who hates you as a person. What's that quote about making enemies? Something like "If you've made enemies, that means you've stood up for something in your life." And the same goes for clothes. If everyone you've ever met only says "Oh yeah s/he looks pretty nice," then you're boring.

Even "normal" nice clothes like menswear are hated by some people, especially on /fa/. But that's fine, because it means you're doing or wearing something interesting enough to be worth mentioning; whether or not it's positive isn't really important as long as you're achieving the look you want. People making fun of you means that you're doing something they don't like or don't understand, but at least you're making them feel something. By really being you, you evoke some emotion that would remain dormant if you just dressed yourself like any other person, and because you're being you, you don't care what other people will say.

As long as you dress for yourself and accept fair criticism from yourself and others, it doesn't matter what you wear.

With that being said, some styles will obviously be more respected than others. If you feel that ugly jeans and video game tees are the proper way to express yourself, you won't exactly get a lot of fans.

>>6600528

fag

I see where you're coming from OP.
I think it's ridiculous the way people will buy lots of stuff with logos on it specifically to show their social status.
I have shoes that are worth more than Nikes, but basically nobody will know because they have no logo and aren't a distinguishable popular (in North America at least) brand.
I also hate that people ignore things such as this:
http://www.insideindonesia.org/weekly-articles/women-workers-still-exploited
because of their ignorant, selfish need to show off their income level.

I just want to buy really expensive streetwear so I can get a ton of pussy ;_;

>>6600523
it's just some dude who pretends to be natalie portman

>>6600553
fuck you heterosexist pig

>>6600547
great toast

Are you guys seriously thinking this deep about clothes? loool People wear their clothes for many different reasons but at the very core of it all, it's just clothing, nothing more to it.

>>6600935
>Are you guys seriously thinking this deep about x? loool People do x for many different reasons but at the very core of it all, it's just x, nothing more to it.

i'm not sure why you felt that posting a thought-terminating cliche would in any way contribute to the thread, or why you've got a trip, tbh. you can obviously say "it's just clothing" and not be wrong, but not be right either. it's not only my opinion, but clothing plays an important role in culture (as do many other things), and it is perfectly valid to discuss these implications, especially on a fashion board.

peace and love tho

>>6600935
You must differentiate between the utilitarian purpose of clothing and as a means of artistic expression. The utilitarian not being only the practical aspect but also social dress code and status.

Anyhoo, each timeperiod has it's patterns (i'm using this in the broadest definition) with it cultural conno- and denotations. They repeat or are altered and i'm sure in the future we perceive these the way we do when looking at past fashion.

>>6600573
check ur privilege tranny scum

>>6600573

>>6600935
There is a reason why there are highly paid professional designers and expensive clothes.
At the end of the day, a painting is just a painting, but the perceived value, quality, and meaning behind it is what is desired.
If there really wasn't anything else behind clothing, everyone would be walking around in the cheapest, most efficient outfits, which is obviously not the case.

>>6600935
None. Due to my status as a privileged white male, I am not allowed access to a category 1 license for possession of and/or use of personal belongings. I already broke my belongings-curfew once by buying an assault-beard trimmer, and had to spend 7 years in a gender-awareness penitentiary and fuck going back into that hell-hole again.

I’m just sad that my grandchildren weren’t born trans, so I wouldn’t have had to report them for pro-cis activity and drown them in an anti-patriarchy well. It would have been nice to enjoy some quality time with them one day.

Still, it’s not all bad, my appointment with the anti-violence execution squadettes is coming up, and I for one, can’t wait for the sweet embrace of death.

TLDR; People judge you on your clothing. I'm so deep, I can see it all

>>6600504
I had a really bad night, I think my family is falling apart.
I'm sorry.
Everyone loses it sometimes.
I'm over it as of this morning.

Yeah, I just come here cuz I like to look at cool shit.

It's a base inclination and I'd rather not make a vain attempt to glorify it with over-analysis and justification.