/fa/ - Fashion

I loooove yohji but why are his recent collections so mediocre? am I just so used to his style that it's a known quantity, or is he in a rut?

also this coat is unforgivable

>>12894464
>why are his recent collections so mediocre?

From when are you thinking of? Personally I'd say a lot of his recent (~2-3 years?) works is great! But obviously his aesthetic and style isn't as big of a wake-up call as it was when he debuted in Paris.

>>12894476
YYPH fw17 was actually pretty good (although a lot of what he was doing in it didn't grab me), but his last two women's shows had pretty uninspired makeup and looks that seemed thrown together. I know the thread is about YYPH but since I actively disliked his most recent men's collection I'm wondering if it's part of a trend (or if people even agree with me).

also YYPH fw13 is underrated

>>12894564
A German man and a Japanese man talking to each other in English is difficult to understand. The only part I liked of it, or at least remember well, is the juxtaposition of the camcorder with the static (photobook) and moving images (driving through the city) and that you are looking at two screens at times.

>>12894506
Sorry I don't really look at the women's line at all so I can't weigh in with anything noteworthy. However I think YYPH has been strong since 2014 or so.

>>12894564

Where can I currently buy a shirt like Yohji's inn this pic? One or two similar breast pockets and all. Love the boxy military look at the moment.

>>12894591
yeah, wim wenders probably wasn't the best pick to make that doc

What are you all's favourite Yohji fits? As in worn by Yohji?

>>12894786

reply to >>12894751
...

>>12894786
I liked him at fw15

shitpost

>>12894786
i liked his simple fits from the late 80s like in "notebooks on cites and clothes" >>12894564 that is the aesthetic that i'm personally going for myself
>>12894792
w2c manlet clown boots?

All time favorite has to be the Ground-Y Evangelion collection. Have to find this coat

>>12894879

>>12894701
pls respond

imma bump

>>12894879
legendary

How does he justify the prices? Is it the quality of the materials and cut or are they just over inflated prices like anyone big name?

>>12896823
I assumed his prices went up after he filed for bankruptcy and received new investment. basically his customers are luxury fashion consumers so they'll bear the cost. not really sure though, maybe someone knows about his pricing pre-2009.

>>12894879
he is really /ourguy/

>>12894879
Is that inverse of >>12894881 or is that just the back? 'Cause I'd >>12894881
literally give up whatever the rest of mu life entails for that

>>12894792

>I didn't want to to disturb peoples eyes

>>12894464
i would say he sold out but i think hes really just not as inspired or passionate anymore, irene silvagni touched on it in her interview with bryonesque

>>12894879
thats so fucking bad hahahaha

at least he used a diffusion line for it and didnt ruin his mainline

>>12896823
he is still using the same fabric manufacturer as he always has which is incredibly expensive (notice how a lot of similar brands went to cheaper fabrics over the years i.e. comme switching a lot of production from wool to polyester) also he does stupid expensive processes like handpainting jackets and other dumb shit like overdesigned straps and stupid little details + you're paying minimum 30% mark up over japanese retail in the west and usually its more than that

also keep in mind brands frequently arbritarily raise prices to seem more luxe and so when you see a yohji coat for 12k usd on farfetch you go "wow what the fuck this is expensive" but look at a gucci leather jacket thats as embellished that sells for say 25k kind of puts things in perspective, the only pricing increases for yohji clothes that makes it unsustainable in my opinion is in the 2nd hand market 2012/2013 you could buy full runway fits for like 35k yen, now youre looking at 100k or more

>tfw no yohji core gf

>>12894464
I think he's stagnating aswell
The seasonal Men's collections have consistently largely been a play of the same old warped suiting tropes he's used since the 90s (intensive loose suiting) . However since 2012 it's taken a kind of Dries flourish where it's always withdrawn to playing with new bold graphics.

>>12894476
It's great but pales in comparison to his early 2000s work, even his contemporary runways suck.

>>12894591
The movie is fucking horrible. it's over an hour of wim wenders stroking his dick and exoticising Japanese fashion globalisation with a infantalising and endearing tone. As if it were cute to observe.

>>12898118
[Citation needed]
CDG has always used plastics in blends with wool... i have a sweater from 1984 which is acrylic wool blend. I don't think comme has switched.

What are you trying to say by comparing japanese retail to west retail prices?

the second hand market stuff is such a fucking shit show now. But... I've managed to nab pretty old sample Yohji for 4k yen at times because people sleep god bless.

(GBS image, on wrong laptop, sorry.)

god can anyone read these fucking yohji interviews without laughing?

talk about old dogs not being able to learn new tricks, christ.

dude was dead in the water 4 years ago
https://hypebeast.com/2012/9/yohji-yamamoto-talks-fashion-bankruptcy-and-death

guess some poor fuker has to hold this shit down,

i'm writing in your favour.

naively think i'm unfukable on Yohji shit but i'll keep it real and haven't seen any of his shit in the last two years.

fight me

>>12898163
>>12898163
sure comme has used blends since forever but i was talking about their 100% polyester fabrics, which as far as i was aware was brought in as a cost saving measure instead of using wool or wool blend

also the anon was wondering why retail was so expensive, i assumed he's only seen western retail prices online(this is fa after all) so mentioning that there is a signifcant markup on those prices over japanese ones is relevant

and yeah yeah there are still steals but its harder and harder these days

blue V and dg combo
still the thing to do

>>12898189
100% polyester has been consistent in CDG CDG (not mainline)
although mainline has started relying more heavy on polyester i would say that's with intent opposed to fiscal compromise.

Plastic fabrics have characters which may desired that natural fibers don't have.

it's important to discern between that "was this material the right choice here?"
that kind of consideration says a lot

Blends aren't always a cost saving measure, sometimes offer elasticity and shape integrity pure wool wouldn't satisfy.

Yohji retail is expensive everywhere, it's a luxury good. It's probably cheaper in Japan because MAYBE department store premiums and cost of transportation don't need to be accounted for.

But for clothing, even relatively it's extremely expensive.

Sure is. Second market will be hustlers market in 5 months, unless a dude is infoed up- always b up on the info.

>>12898196
info like watching for ripples

WHEN U COME OUT UR SHIT IS GONE
WHEN U COME OUT UR SHIT IS GONE
WHEN U COME OUT UR SHIT IS GONE
WHEN U COME OUT UR SHIT IS GONE
WHEN U COME OUT UR SHIT IS GONE
WHEN U COME OUT UR SHIT IS GONE

>>12894701
Price point?

Thrift stores drown in it for the most part.
it's a careful consideration of shape

yohji's one is highly specific but wim wenders much more accessible- by lets say miyake's offerings (shirts like that come and go around $80)

in general:
note the billowing around the waist,
the shape of the shirt as it passes from the torso into the sleeve (on wim wenders)
the squarish shape is very typical of 90s and early 2000s japanese suiting, and thereby shirts.

RUTHLESS N FREE, IT'S ALL SUICIDE ME
RUTHLESS N FREE, IT'S ALL SUICIDE ME
RUTHLESS N FREE, IT'S ALL SUICIDE ME
RUTHLESS N FREE, IT'S ALL SUICIDE ME

I have this large black yohji scarf and have no idea what year it was made or anything. Do any of you know?

>>12898221

>>12898221
https://vintagefashionguild.org/label-resource/yamamoto-yohji/

mid 2000s ish

I have a jacket with the same emblem from early 2000s
Use to have a runway shot from somewhere in the 2000s where that label was stitched onto the outer, but in red.

>>12898229

I see, great thank you!

>>12898288
ight well op died and this thread is officially dead
maybe later

>>12898298
fuck OP, this thread is going places

one of the highlights from ss16 imo, good to see yohji doing more conventionally fitted suits even though I love his loose fitting ones

>>12898542

Shoes ruin it

>>12898544
yeah, I wish he would have played it safer with the shoes that season.

>>12894786
this one is also just a really flattering photo imo

>>12894792
Dude dresses like my bioethics teacher, who really isn't /fa/.

>>12898630
post pic

>>12898642
Will if I remember when I see him again

>>12898655
ah I thought there might be a pic of him on the internet or something, don't worry about it

>>12898111
This one? https://www.businessoffashion.com/articles/opinion/op-ed-when-passion-was-everything

>>12898899
bigger ver

>>12898553
Damn that's good.

>>12898926
>>12898140
this is a pour homme thread my friends

>>12898140
>tfw gf wears yohji

feels good man

Is this Yohji?

>>12898940
according to shui's lookbook post his pants and cardigan are

good thread

>>12899000
cardigan? isn't that a sweater tho

>>12899072
it's hard to tell but I'm pretty sure it's a cardigan. I can't link to the original post but if you search "shui tsang 14812 lookbook" you'll be able to find it.

>>12898536
this

>>12894464
Because yohji did sell out, to an extent. Since his parent company set a 20-year-plan to bring him out of the red he's changed his tone from "I think it's hard to imagine my brand without me. I think Yohji Yamamoto will die with Yohji Yamamoto" to "I really don’t care if the label exists after I’m gone."

Even though the brand/clothing from the 90's vs. 2017 could just be considered as the brand's aesthetic evolving over time, yohji as a brand is def pandering to new gen fashion consumers who fuel the brand's profits (especially Chinese/Koreans) b/c they love highly visual and "obvious" branding. That's why the logo/his paintings of himself/bold graphics are splattered all over recent collections, because they'll eat that shit up.
I don't think most old ladies who technically fall into yohji's target demographic would buy most of the busy yypf runway pieces nowadays. But a gigantic puffer covered in paint splatters is gonna garner more brand interest on social media than a simple black cardigan.

The brand is definitely selling the myth of the master along with the clothes. The yohji empire has so many different lines and collabs it's ridiculous to think he personally touches everything and sniffs the fabric while holed up in his studio like some zen master shokunin hermit. I think this quote from a dazed interview accurately explains it: "How can you avoid becoming a fashion victim? 'It’s quite easy: don’t copy your friend... Don’t be one of a group. Be yourself. Stay a little bit monotone – walk on our side of the street, don’t walk the mainstream of fashion. You’ll be polluted by trends" which basically translates to "hey don't follow Gucci/Balenciaga but follow kleeheelk/dianashi/davidlee on instagram because they all wear oversized black shit [even though everyone wears oversized black shit] and hate branding [even though they're all carrying logo tote bags]"

srry this was long and rambly

>>12899389
i really don't think cares that much about that korean retard

>>12899473
Loool I don't think so either but hey it's free advertising they have to keep up the PR relationship to some extent

>>12899389
>Implying gods can die

>>12899389
Good post. I think I agree with you, even as a buyer of current Yohji. I prefer the "tamer", more subtle pieces.

>>12899389
yeah good point, although a lot of his clothes feature weird skeleton versions of himself as well as images of rei, so I just assumed that was because he's been preoccupied with thoughts of his own death and his memories of her. like, I saw that as him trying to make more personal statements with his work rather than just branding himself, but I might be wrong. there was an interview with him (can't remember where from) where he was saying that he used to design by giving himself strict limitations (no traditional clothing, sparing use of colour, etc), and that only recently he started feeling like he was free to do whatever he wanted. fyi, I'm the person you replied to, so it's not like I'm happy with the path he's on now.

>>12899736
read: I don't like colour

>>12899118
Obviously that isn't a cardigan, doesn't matter what the lookbook says

>>12899771
Colour sucks ass

What kind of shoes would go with yohji fits? Is there certain qualities i should look for in a shoe to pair with yohji?

>>12899736
I prefer wearing his simpler pieces too, simply because the runway garments are just impractical for everyday life, and I think most people will say the same. But as they say, the aspirational 20% of a collection moves the other 80% commercial product. Maybe if I was a rich grandma with important brunch dates or working as fashion PR/stylist I'd be able to consider buying those pieces. But for a job that requires running around? Nah. Even the man himself (and pretty much every other fashion designer ever) doesn't wear ostentatious stuff.

>>12899770
It could easily be a bit of everything! Maybe his financiers asked him to capitalize off his persona and it allowed him to become more introspective and also give less fucks in a sense.

>>12899853
It's a cardigan.

>>12899896
Oh yeah. I'm blind. It's a cardingan open over a t-shirt

>>12899907
it's just hard to tell with the original photo since the brightness is so turned down. everything having to be grayscale is definitely something I don't miss about that gothninja era.

>It's one of those good threads we get once a year

>>12900320
this isn't a good thread lmao

>>12900330
go make a good one then

>>12900816
literally no point on fa

>>12900827
then get a life and leave?

Requesting pic of Yohji giving the rude finger

>>12900877

>>12900895
Thanks mate

>>12900900
there's another one of him and limi flipping off the camera somewhere but I can't find it

>>12900902
Neat. I haven't seen any other editions of Yohji flipping the bird.

>>12900895
Is the girl his daughter or wife?

>>12900930
his mom

>>12901148
i want pants in this cut, but grey speckled wool/tweed

>>12901188
cool

Do you guys buy during the sales or full price? Most second hand stuff i've seen is totally trashed.

>>12901401
all of the second hand yohji I've bought has been good condition. pic related arrived in the mail yesterday and I'm loving it. I can never afford buying new because his prices are so out of control.

>>12901536
It might just be wear I was looking but I found most of it was pristine condition for almost the same as buying new or in double digits for totally destroyed stuff. Maybe I should dig a little deeper.

>>12901401
Both, as necessary. Some items and sizes sell out fast. I've given up on most of the second hand Yohji market since prices exploded.

>>12899389

So what you're saying is that like most things, Chinese consumers are ruining everything?

>>12901940
his post is more nuanced than that - go back to /pol/

>>12898536
regret abandoning you
had a couple of hectic nights
ITS GOES IT GOES IT GOES

>>12898542
This is a very tantilising look, i'm inclined to go through his recent mens finally.

>>12899389
i don't think it's worth like... compounding 25 years and assuming "evolution" there's a lot of detail there that's been dismissed and worth discerning in detail.

i also feel lke this is thinly veiled xenophobia, there have always been consistent east asian clientele, there's just a substantially larger and more wealthy consumer base there that's surfaced.
... That "eat shit up" bullshit you're trying to thrust is not endemic of Asian people, it's a global fashion phenomena- paradigm shift.

Does anyone imagine yohji or... anyone is personally touching or sniffing fabric?

you've also like, really overread that quote to fit your narrative.

But as a cautionary measure I would say it's really not worth trying to unpack anything Yohji says- more worthless now than ever.

>>12899473
I think his company cares about making money, and probably has some awareness of booming luxury consumer markets

>>12899736
That's concerning.

>>12899770
Okay before we do this weird fucking like psychosomatic readings of Yohji I think it's important to contextualise his as this incredibly sexually frustrated 70+ year old dude who is so dumbfounded by contemporary fashion culture all he does is recycle the same four sentences ad nauseam.

>>12902080
not sure what you think psychosomatic means

>>12899884
I think with the articles talking about his bankrupcy it became clear that the management side (which he has never had an interest in occupying) has been left in the hands of someone else, probably much more competent.

By saying this I mean, if we could read Yohji (wanted to waste our time on that) I don't think there's anyway of understanding the company's marketing strategies through him, because he doesn't do it.

>>12901188
The wool/tweed would be hard to negotiate, might be too heavy for the same shape and movement.

A rayon/linen/wool blend marbled might be as good as it gets for you there.

>>12901536
If that jacket is what you selected I feel as time goes by you'll realise there's a lot of value in being a bit more discerning and careful with what you buy opposed to loading up on lots of affordable things at once,.

>>12902088
I know what it means and I used it purposefully.

>>12902072
You might be reading too deep into my original post. Maybe it's my fault for being too blunt and losing any nuance my post could have had b/c I'm not on 4chan to write research papers, but I never implied that brand obsession is endemic of Asian ppl and nobody's world should ever be taken as final say esp on 4chan. Yes, people are more brand-conscious than ever bc we've got the internet at out fingertips, and conspicuous consumption happens to be a prevalent trait amongst the newly emerged Chinese/Korean markets that can actually afford luxury clothing at retail. Yohji's profits and relevance are higher than ever but that's not because rich Europeans suddenly decided they wanna start wearing yohji. I'm not being xenophobic, I'm literally full-blood Chinese.

There are lots of people out there who still believe designers like yy/cdg/ro/etc are just small studios of maybe 10 people cutting shit up with fancy shears brainstorming revolutionary ideas when a good majority of the actual legwork at most luxury labels involves up to tens or even hundreds of people sitting behind computers plugging excel spreadsheets, emailing contractors, sourcing fabrics, comparing lab dips, making sure samples match spec, etc and don't realize the role of creative director is mostly managerial. Hell, most avg people think clothing production has been automated to some extent and don't realize that clothes are still sewn by a person physically sitting at a sewing machine

>>12902280
Nope that's bullshit.
The post specifically profiled East Asian demographics, re-read your post:
"def pandering to new gen fashion consumers who fuel the brand's profits (especially Chinese/Koreans) b/c they love highly visual and "obvious" branding. That's why the logo/his paintings of himself/bold graphics are splattered all over recent collections, because they'll eat that shit up."

Conspicuous consumption is global, the internet is global. There is discerning consumption too- which is global, not region locked.
We're not in a region locked market.

Being full-blood Chinese doesn't excuse xenophobia, what?

I'm not suggesting that it's Europeans that are driving Yohji's profits, I'm saying how Yohji is marketing himself seems to do well at pandering to the contemporary market, to global trends which are highly valued in luxury consumer culture (i.e. eccentric visual appeal).

I feel like those people you're describing are in the minority... and really probably have no interest in understanding clothing production pipelines.

he is right, most people buying yohji are rich ass new money chinese people

they dont give a shit about the deeper meaning you thing there is lol, they just buying it cuz its hot and they are the ones giving yohji the fat pay cheque

>>12902328
No one's disputing that Chinese people are buying heaps of Yohji Yamamoto.

I wouldn't say it's because Chinese people intrinsically love gnarish design (like what was being suggested) but that the current consumer market highly values on a social capital and material capital level those kind of designs, it just so happens a minority of Chinese people are ultra fucking rich and can afford it.

No one gives a shit about the deeper meaning garbage, because Yohji is a puddle.

not sure