Ask an electrician anything

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Anonymous Thu Apr 4 18:44:25 2013 No.430384 [Reply] [Original]

Ask an electrician anything

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 18:47:10 2013 No.430386 >>430384 hi my house has 2 prong plus ( ungrounded) whats the best way to ground them, or at least a few. im worried about my big screen tv and amp/soundsystem getting fried

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 18:52:11 2013 No.430392 What can I do to avoid the "thump" sound I get in my speakers when turning on and off the light?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 18:53:25 2013 No.430394 >>430384 do european appliances work in korea or do they have a different voltage?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 18:53:55 2013 No.430393 >>430386 Things live tvs and sterios are usually double insulated and do not require an earth connection. The only way would to earth it I'd imagine would be to rewire it though. I recommend an rcd socket or attachment

Anonymous Thu Apr 4 18:57:10 2013 No.430397

>>430392

I've never seen that before. It could possibly be volt drop. This may be down to your electricity provider. Unless your circuits have not been run properly for instants if your power is coming off a sub board far away from your main electrical intake and calculations have not been carried out

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 18:58:55 2013 No.430398 >>430393 ok thanks! rcd is gfi? how do I wire baseboard heaters? do you have any good resources for diy home wiring?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 18:58:55 2013 No.430399 Which country first had plugs as commonplace? And why aren't the plugs in the world all the same?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:00:25 2013 No.430401 >>430394 Ive heard of some that have. You'll be lucky though as Korea is 60hz and Europe is 50hz. Different power frequencies. If your thinking of buying something Korean, dont

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:05:40 2013 No.430402 >>430399 England I think. They're different because of different voltages and regulations. We should all have the same. Going on holiday would be easier!!

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:06:25 2013 No.430406 >>430399 Probably America. Because power is different all over the world. Safety regulations are too.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:08:56 2013 No.430409 >>430386 Do any of those appliances have grounded plugs? If the plug is two prong, a grounded outlet is moot. Anyway, grounding is there to protect PEOPLE, not equipment. Polarized plugs, internal fuses and circuit breakers protect equipment.

Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:13:40 2013 No.430414

http://connecticuthistory.org/the-worlds-first-detachable-electric-plug-today-in-history/

Before the Hubbell plug, power was provided by either bare screw terminals on the wall, or from a light bulb outlet. Some early appliances, like toasters and radios, had a "plug" that looks like the medium screw base of an ordinary 60 watt light bulb

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:14:56 2013 No.430415 File: 24 KB, 500x283, standards.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>430399 probably something like this

Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:15:26 2013 No.430417

>>430398

I'd usually wire them to a fused spur. I'd recommend getting an electrician to have look though even just to pick his brains before you do anything yourself. Electricity can be dangerous if wired incorrectly! Books change whatever country you are in all regs are different. Coud be more cost efficient to call in a pro

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:16:10 2013 No.430419 >>430409 yes some appliances have grounded plugs I do believe. Im not positive though, i don't get the house until next month. hypothetically speaking, what are the downsides of having ungrounded appliances?

Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:16:40 2013 No.430418

>>430384
I have a similar question to >>430386 where I need to ground some of my two prong outlets for my computers but I don't know what to ground them to. Any advice?
Someone told me to just throw a GFI on it and be done with it but I don't feel comfortable without knowing for sure. Your advice is appreciated.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:18:41 2013 No.430422 >>430419 if something happens to short within the appliance, and the chassis becomes energize, you can get shocked.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:22:10 2013 No.430427 >>430422 oh shit. is that all? fuck that could be bad.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:22:25 2013 No.430428 >>430418 Yeah a gfi should protect them, I'd recommend earthing all your sockets though, you would earth them all back to your fuseboard

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:24:25 2013 No.430431 >>430418 Do I need to run the groundwire through the wall in order to meet code or can I run it alone the baseboard?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:28:55 2013 No.430438 >>430431 I'd say through the wall. It's worth rewiring tbh

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:32:10 2013 No.430444 >>430431 If you are going to do it, do it right.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:36:11 2013 No.430447 How much does a 1.8MW transformer cost? Need to replace the old one.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:42:55 2013 No.430454 >Live in the UK >Never considered 2 Pin plugs can be ungrounded Also to OP, if you were called to fix a problem with 3-Phase Electricity (Assume there are no complications, some fairly standard problem) how much would you charge per hour?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 19:47:26 2013 No.430458 Just so people don't freak out, not all appliances need a ground. If it was bought within the last decade and came with a two prong plug, thats what it was meant to have.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 21:19:12 2013 No.430499 Brazil and Switzerland plugs aren't the same. Officially Brazil uses that plug but only a few newer houses have a socket for it and many consumer electronics lack the earth pin.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 4 21:32:56 2013 No.430504 When creating a tiny mobile house, what would you recomend for a novice? I am looking to wire up my mobile tiny house and such and was wondering if I should either call a professional or teach myself basic wiring.

Anonymous Thu Apr 4 23:51:41 2013 No.430611

>>430418
when you come across older outlets in the US that only accept two prongs, the metal box and pigtail are typically your ground
three prong adapters have that little lug on them for just this reason
remove the screw to your coverplate, plug in adapter with lug over screw hole, replace screw
congrats, you now have a properly grounded 3 prong outlet with minimal investment of time or funds

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 01:04:27 2013 No.430661 >>430611 If its a 2 prong outlet, chances are the romex wont have a ground wire. Your method doesn't make sense

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 01:47:54 2013 No.430686

>>430384

I have shitty old outlets in my house that are loose as moots mom. I can plug a wall wart in and it just falls out.

I replaced a bunch in one room when I painted with some nicer ones that have the little flaps that close when nothing is plugged in.

But anyways, Do you have any recommendations on some bad ass outlets? Or at least some tips on what to look for?
Or is it just the typical slap some $1.00 Home Depot specials in the wall and replace them when they get old...

Also. Let's say I shorted out the power line incoming into my house. What's the worst that would happen? Blow the breaker on the line?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 01:50:23 2013 No.430687 >>430686 a violent explosion in your breaker box kills you and burns your house down. If you manage to dead short both mains to neutral

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 01:55:23 2013 No.430697 >>430687 Good point. Any advice on the outlet situation?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 01:56:09 2013 No.430698 >>430686 also you can get outlets with USB power built in at like 1.1 or 1.5amp too. they need deep boxes though. They are huge. This could make them a nightmare for a new to install. Slack management was always the hardest thing for me.

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 02:02:09 2013 No.430702
File: 31 KB, 260x456, plug.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>430698

That would be cool, but only probably 2% of the things in my house are powered via USB.

It would just be easier to make a charging station for all the USB powered things (Phones, PS3 Controllers etc. etc.)

Guess there is no bad ass tech when it comes to uber pimp outlets.

You'd think after 100 years we'd maybe come up with something better yet backwards compatible.

>pic related
>would be good for a bedroom outlet

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 02:14:53 2013 No.430709
File: 53 KB, 360x400, boxntail.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>430661
>Your method doesn't make sense
just because you can't make sense of it doesn't mean it doesn't make sense
that's ok though! i'll hold your hand because that's just how i roll
>If its a 2 prong outlet, chances are the romex wont have a ground wire.
very good. there is likely no ground wire. that does not mean a connection to ground is not present.
>wat? how do?
reread my previous post
>>430611
>the metal box and pigtail are typically your ground
motherfucking pic related motherfucker
soooooooo.......trace ground back to panel from the adapter: faceplate screw to outlet frame/chassis to outlet box to pigtail to panel
eat a bowl of dicks

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 02:14:55 2013 No.430707 >>430447 wait wut. no. You can't afford it. That's not a transformer, that's a fucking substation.

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 02:22:40 2013 No.430711
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Apart from Australia these are also used in NZ. NZ's 15 amp socket is different to Aus however and better in my opinion. Ours [aus] are the same as pictured with a bigger earth pin. Don't know what they were thinking with that design.

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 02:26:39 2013 No.430715

>>430709
residential wiring never uses armored cable in a wall. Why would it?

He's right, you can't expect there to be any path to ground just because its a metal box. Even if it looks like it has one it might be to a floating ground like a water pipe because sometalented /diy/erdid it.

also, depending on local code, the metal conduit may not be suitable for a ground source, unless its rigid metal with threads cut and screwed into the boxes

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 03:05:24 2013 No.430728 >>430715 >never it's in tons of old apartment/condo buildings single family homes, not so often remodeled a couple hundred kitchens over the years and see all kinds of weird hacked together shit

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 03:26:23 2013 No.430736 >>430715 Clearly not a red seal certified sparky. Bx is used in residential homes, but mainly as a 'scab it in' type job.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 03:29:54 2013 No.430737 File: 330 KB, 900x900, 1318639311288.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Is OP's image legit? WTF italy?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 04:10:53 2013 No.430745 >>430384 the danish outlet seems to be the happiest in the world

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 05:58:09 2013 No.430768 >Denmark :D

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 06:30:09 2013 No.430774 >>430707 No, old one is 2500kva, fed by 22kv lines. Just wanted a ballpark figured so I don't get too screwed by the electric company.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 08:17:11 2013 No.430821 >>430736 I've seen BX in many older homes, along with cloth covered Romex. If you are going to use the armor as the ground, by todays code, it must be marked and manufactured for such usage.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 08:24:54 2013 No.430826 >>430384 china's wrong

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 09:28:04 2013 No.430848 >>430392 fuck yes this is so annoying. and its really loud too. i figured it has something to do with the shitty chinese switches they used, only happens with my cheapass ikea lamps.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 09:31:05 2013 No.430851 >>430737 >WTF italy? italy makes the most sense to me tbh, its got all 3 nessecary connectors in the most logical and convenient alignment.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 09:43:04 2013 No.430856 >>430851 But also in the most likely arrangement to break

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 12:50:34 2013 No.430938 >>430709 You explaining how to ground GROUNDED electrical. You have NO CLUE what you're talking about. Please anyone reading this don't listen to his advice. Pure retardation.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 12:54:33 2013 No.430940 >>430821 dont feed the trolls

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 13:40:18 2013 No.430960

I'm curious, I live in north america so obviously the ones style shown here is very familiar to me. The ground and two pronged style makes sense and the difference between the american flat head and EU circular prong seems like a simple matter of ease of production vs durability. I am looking at the other styles and I don't see the benefits of the crazy israelie one or the italian one.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 13:57:04 2013 No.430970 >>430406 Fixed >Probably not America.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 14:05:50 2013 No.430974 >>430970 Americans love taking credit for anything. They jumped in at the end of ww2 then claim they saved the day. U WOT M8

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 14:56:03 2013 No.430999 >>430974 they didn't?

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 15:19:49 2013 No.431004

I live in an old house, like turn of the century, maybe from the 20s or 30s. Anyway its old, and I keep tripping the breaker(if thats the correct term) due to the amount of power modern appliances, pcs and TVs etc use.

How should I go about getting more juice, is it safe for me to do it myself with little training or do I need to call in a pro? What would the parts to do it cost if its something I can do easily?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 15:20:04 2013 No.431005 >>430999 we did a lot of the grunt work in the pacific, but Russia did most of the work against the nazis, and italy was a group project.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 15:20:04 2013 No.431006 >>430686 Buy hospital grade NEMA 5-15 duplex outlets. Hospital grade is the best. Daniel Woodhead products are sweet too.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 15:21:03 2013 No.431008 >>430940 fuck you that was a real response

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 15:23:49 2013 No.431010 >>431004 You need more circuits run from the breaker box.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 15:25:04 2013 No.431012 >>431010 How much does something like that cost in Amerikkka and how hard is it to install? Ideally i'd like to do it myself so I can learn how to fix my house up better and deal with shit like that.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 15:26:49 2013 No.431014 >>431012 its not hard buy you need to do it to code. You are supposed to pull a permit in some places

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 15:30:04 2013 No.431017

>>431014
Well, I live in a red state, so they tend to have less codes, but I would like it done well, and have it done problem free.

So its not a very expensive thing to do though? I don't mind spending money, I just don't want it to end up costing me a whole lot of money if it doesn't have to.

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 15:54:03 2013 No.431037

In a thread on /diy/ a little while ago, somebody mentioned some sort of breaker in the main panel that will detect current in the ground line and break the circuit accordingly. Not a GFCI, a breaker installed in the main panel. I don't remember the name for it.
My house doesn't have one. Neither does anybody's house that I know, or my high school, or my dorm, or the TV studio where I work.
I have never seen one but this anon in that thread seemed pretty certain that they were required by code. Can you shed light on this?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 15:59:04 2013 No.431039 File: 10 KB, 300x300, gfci-circuit-breaker.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>431037 You sure it wasn't gfci? They have gfci breakers

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 16:02:49 2013 No.431041 >>431039 OH I found it. It's an earth leakage circuit breaker. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_leakage_circuit_breaker

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 16:12:49 2013 No.431052 >>430715 Calling BS on this. My grandma's house, built in the 1800s and wired for electricity around WWII, uses exclusively flexible metallic conduit. More recent builds don't seem to, but it IS a thing.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 16:21:05 2013 No.431056 >>431052 >flexible metallic conduit >not suitable for ground under modern code.

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 16:22:04 2013 No.431058

>>431052
hes not saying bx isn't a thing.
hes saying its not used in new home construction.
You're calling BS on something you know nothing about,
If bx is used, its for a special applications and reno's (not explaining why, google it), but implying a whole house is wired in bx and you can use the sheathing as a ground is retarded.
also, this guy is retarded >>430709

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 16:26:50 2013 No.431061 File: 4 KB, 100x65, 2006_NEMA_Chart_Countermat_101107.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Just to fuck your mind.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 16:28:19 2013 No.431062 >>431041 I just read the wiki. I'm not sure if this works in conjuction with grounded outlets ( 3 wire) or will it also cover ungrounded outlets.

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 16:29:36 2013 No.431063

>>430392
I have a similar problem. Whenever someone turns a light on or off in the house, I hear a 'click' in my speakers. There is also a room with a dimmer switch. If someone lowers that to less than full, my speakers start buzzing. What's going on there?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 16:29:36 2013 No.431064 >>431058 I was calling BS on the "never used" part. Not implying that you can use the sheathing as a ground. The house in question actually had no grounded outlets originally.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 16:34:19 2013 No.431070 >>430737 IDK, while in Mexico, all the outlets I saw were like Japan's, not the ones like it says Mexico has in OP's image.

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 16:35:20 2013 No.431072

>>431064
how could it be "never used"? it exists and has a purpose.

You took the quote out of context.
For the purpose of this discussion, 99.999999999999999999999% of homes aren't wired with bx or metal sheathed wire.
lets forget about that being an option for grounding, mkay?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 16:35:50 2013 No.431071 >>431061 consider my mind fucked

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 17:07:49 2013 No.431091

Ok, BX was very common in the 40's and 50's, as common as Romex is today. It fell out of favor because it was easy to damage the wires in the older versions.

The sheath CANNOT be used as a ground. It is against code to do so. Modern Armored Cable has either a 3rd copper conductor for ground or has a flat "bonding strip" as part of the assembly.

Again, it is against code to ground with the jacket of BX.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 17:16:49 2013 No.431099 >>431070 Where in Mexico you were? I'm a Mexican and those are legit, at most what you saw where a couple similar to those but without the ground but they are different from the Japan ones.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 17:26:34 2013 No.431107 >>431099 Michoacán. The plugs were all 2 prongs.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 17:39:19 2013 No.431114 >>431107 Yeah, but see how the Japanese one have little notches. The ones in Mexico are like the ones showed here but the old ones don't have the ground.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 17:45:05 2013 No.431117 How to measure 400V without MM and/or dying?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 17:55:19 2013 No.431120 http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=484690

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 18:27:50 2013 No.431143 >>431070 I have some like it in my old ass house.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 18:28:04 2013 No.431146 >>431117 Get a fucking meter rated for 600 volts. Are you measuring at a panel or from an outlet? You kinda sound like an idiot.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 18:34:05 2013 No.431150 >>430384 wtf switzerland doesn't use that plug, i was just there in december and used EU shit all day errday

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 18:35:34 2013 No.431152 >>430394 i can say a lot of US shit you can plug in in japan

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 19:08:20 2013 No.431168 File: 1.65 MB, 1872x1224, 2006_NEMA_Chart_Countermat_101107.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 5 19:23:05 2013 No.431170 >>430384 I won't lie, I just now realized why the plugs are all different It's to prevent international competition between appliance manufacturers

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 19:52:34 2013 No.431175
File: 263 KB, 485x293, SonySCPH-113Adapter-h450.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Okay, so here it goes.

I need to make a 7.5 volt battery, that can last more that 4 hours, rechargeable, preferably.

I'm using it to power my PSone, which I love dearly.

Now how could I make this? I know what I need (Five batteries, 1.5V * 5 = 7.5 V) However, I have never made a battery case nor bought batteries before (All mechanical shit).

The adapter gives out 2.0 amps as well.

Help?

Anonymous Fri Apr 5 23:14:07 2013 No.431280
File: 112 KB, 480x640, 1364877639751.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>431175
We have these fancy things called Lithium Ion rechargeables.

We also have these fancy things cause series and parallel circuits.

Let me break this down for you since you have the first part already...

You're going to need 5 1.5V batteries right? Cool.

You need 2 Amps.

So what you're looking for is Amp-Hour ratings.

Lets say it says 2000 milliamphours....

That means it can put out 2000 milliamps for an hour.. or 1000 milliamps for 2 hours.. get it?

So.... 1000 milliamps = 1 Amp.

1 Amp * 4 hours = 4 Amps-hours

Or 4000milliAmp hours.

But you want 2 Amps.. So you'll need 8000milliAmp Hours.

You can wire 5 batteries in series for 7.5 V at whatever Amphour rating ONE of them is.

To get more Amp hours out of it you need to wire a second set in parallel.

So lets say one of the batteries IS 2000 milliamp hours...

You'll need 5 for the 7.5v and then an additional 5 for each 2000 milliamp hour boost.

Seeing as you need 8000 milliamp hours. You'll need 8 / 2 = 4 sets in all.

Or 20 batteries.

QED.

>pic unrelated, but enjoy dat sexy ass

>>	Not OP Sat Apr 6 00:09:51 2013 No.431302 >>430386 Change them

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 00:13:07 2013 No.431304 >>431302 change to what, 3 prong? are you retarded? if it were that simple there would be no discussion.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 16:37:18 2013 No.431699 >>431152 The voltage is different. 110V vs. 100V

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 17:06:54 2013 No.431728 >>431699 Most devices can handle that. In fact, most devices are fine with 50/60hz, the transformer will just be slightly less efficient.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 17:17:08 2013 No.431752 >>431728 True that. My entire house is 130v and everything does fine with that. I had to use 4 different testers because I didn't believe it. lol

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 17:40:11 2013 No.431772 >>431699 >>431728 >>431752 >implying line voltage doesn't change depending on a shitload of factors.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 17:50:38 2013 No.431784 >>431772 But... it does. That's what I was saying, devices are tolerant of a wide range of voltages. Hell, after Hurricane Sandy, for a few days my house had like 95 volt mains. Most things worked fine.

Anonymous Sat Apr 6 17:55:54 2013 No.431790

>>431784

Yep, most things are converted down via transformer anyways. Let's say it's a 12v circuit.. The Transformer probably puts out something like 18 to 32v and then it's Voltage Regulated.

At least in a well designed circuit. That way it has some leeway with a voltage swing.

Usually large swings are temporary anyways.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 18:29:39 2013 No.431821 Do electricians and carpenters want each other dead?

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 18:51:40 2013 No.431853 >>431821 No, But I hear Ninjas and Pirates have a fued going. As well as Isrealis and Palestenians. and Christians and Atheists. Not to mention Heliocentrists vs. Geocentrists.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 18:56:24 2013 No.431857 >>430384 Japan is so efficient at everything.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 19:56:38 2013 No.431894 >>431062 It will work whit any kind of earth leakage, so it wont matter what kind of circuit it is put on. I live in Norway and I believe its now required to use them on all new house hold installations.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 20:20:40 2013 No.431910 Just took the njatc aptitude test, there's some sort of interview further along, any advice?

Anonymous Sat Apr 6 20:23:54 2013 No.431912

>>431017
I'm European so things might be different and I could not be undestanding the situation. What kind of breaker are we talking about here, what is its max current?? If its 10A or lower you could just change it for a bigger one if the wires on the circuit is big enough to handle it. That is very easy.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 20:25:38 2013 No.431914 30 amp GFCI breakers were expensive as shit, so I put a 50 amp GFCI on my whirlpool. Am I going to die?

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 20:26:09 2013 No.431916 >>431914 (whirlpool/jacuzi/etc.. actually a kohler. wanted to clarify that i didn't mean kitchen appliance)

Anonymous Sat Apr 6 20:33:53 2013 No.431920

>>431912
>>431914
>>431916

>Can I put a bigger breaker/fuse on something meant for a smaller breaker/fuse?

In a nutshell.... NO! IT'S RATED FOR THAT FOR A REASON!

That's a fucking awesome way to catch shit on fire and burn your whole fucking house down.

You NEVER exchange for a higher amp rating.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 20:37:54 2013 No.431921 >>431920 There is no reason not to if the wires can handle it, which is why I added: >if the wires on the circuit is big enough to handle it Much less expensive too.

Anonymous Sat Apr 6 20:57:25 2013 No.431936

Is there a shortcut for grounding plug outlets?
can I drive a bar into the ground and run a ground wire to it for an individual plug?
Building code is NOT an issue. I live in a cheap ass brick tract housing in Mexico, and the no outlet in my home is grounded. I've checked and there is no ground wire in the conduit. I've lived in the house for ten years without a problem, but it bothers me. I have tvs, wall unit air conditioners, computer, ect and i feel it is a matter of time before something goes wrong.
There is only two fucking circuits in the house. One is fixtures and the other is wall outlets.

Anonymous Sat Apr 6 20:59:38 2013 No.431938

>>431921

>implying you can tell all the way down the line is the wires can handle it.

>implying you know how many outlets/whatever are on the circuit.

>implying something on the circuit isn't EXPECTING that the breaker will blow at a certain amp rating.

That's making a lot of potentially lethal guesses.

I may have 00 wire on a residential circuit if I overkill it... That can hold around 145 Amps.

Think my outlets can take that much juice? What if someone pigtailed off that with a smaller guage wire down the line? Typical 12 gauge or something?

Sure you can hope everything is good.

Just like the guy above about grounding. Sure you can survive just fine without proper grounding for a long long long time, maybe forever.

But the day your house burns down and kills your entire family or in the BEST case scenario you lose everything. You'll think.. "Gee, Maybe I should have listened to those regulations. Those guys might have had a point!"

But it's your shit bro. Electricity, Thermodynamics... Hell Physics and the universe in general doesn't really give a shit. It's perfectly fine with letting you fuck things up.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 21:03:39 2013 No.431941 >>431938 >*if the wires can handle it. Typo fix. Also, To add a little sarcasm. Go ahead though bro. Makes perfect sense if it's cheaper. Houses, belongings and lives don't cost that much.

Anonymous Sat Apr 6 21:15:23 2013 No.431954

>>431938
>implying you can tell all the way down the line is the wires can handle it.
You follow the wires and look them, usually it wont be harder then that. Its a house we are talking about here right?

>implying you know how many outlets/whatever are on the circuit.
You could check, but I don't see how that is even relevant?

>implying something on the circuit isn't EXPECTING that the breaker will blow at a certain amp rating.
What would that be? I know regular outlets probably has a max amp rating in america too, but as long as you are below that I can't think of anything other than the main fuse which wouldn't be dangerous, but only annoying.

Since when was it so hard to find these basic things about your installation?

Anonymous Sat Apr 6 21:19:39 2013 No.431960

>>431954

>Since when was it so hard to find these basic things about your installation?

Since these fancy things called walls got in the way.

>What would that be? I know regular outlets probably has a max amp rating in america too, but as long as you are below that I can't think of anything other than the main fuse which wouldn't be dangerous, but only annoying.

Probably when you have a short before the fuse and the small gauge wire in said product heats up super fucking fast cause you're letting it draw an untold of amount of amps. Then the nearest flammable thing goes up.

>You could check, but I don't see how that is even relevant?

Cause you know.. Things pull power... You kinda need to know the entire circuit. See back to the annoying thing about having walls.

Anonymous Sat Apr 6 21:38:38 2013 No.431973

>>431960
>Since these fancy things called walls got in the way.
Then you check the wire when it goes in and out from the wall and any boxes that it might go to. In a house installation it's not that difficult. I wouldn't want to hire an electrician who just says that I have to split the overloaded breaker whit out looking at anything.

>Probably when you have a short before the fuse and the small gauge wire in said product heats up super fucking fast cause you're letting it draw an untold of amount of amps. Then the nearest flammable thing goes up.
If the short is before the fuse then it would be the one of the main breaker's job to break the current. You changing the fuse wouldn't have any effect on that. Are you even a electrician?

>Cause you know.. Things pull power... You kinda need to know the entire circuit. See back to the annoying thing about having walls
I think your understanding of a fuse's job is flawed somehow.

Anonymous Sat Apr 6 21:46:40 2013 No.431979

>>431973

>If the short is before the fuse then it would be the one of the main breaker's job to break the current. You changing the fuse wouldn't have any effect on that. Are you even a electrician?

Nigga what? That's the whole purpose of this discussion. I didn't say shit about the fuse.

I'm saying this is why breakers are rated for a specific current rating.

Whatever bro. If people believe and listen to the original bullshit and burn their house down it's no worry of mine.

Anonymous Sat Apr 6 21:49:23 2013 No.431984

>>431920
I read that as him asking about installing a circuit for his jacuzi, not about modifying an existing one.

in which case, sure, build a 50amp circuit for your 30amp jacuzi. Circuit breakers protect you from fire, fuses protect your appliance.

what about the Mexican ground?
could he run neutral and ground out of the box and run that to the ground rod to keep it all bonded?

I'm guessing no. I know he can't just toss a floating ground rod out there.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 21:54:10 2013 No.431988 >>431984 Yeah, but the guy I was talking to made it general with "Sure you can replace one breaker with a higher rated one." That advice will lead is disaster.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 22:01:09 2013 No.431994 >>431988 I never said: >Sure you can replace one breaker with a higher rated one. All I wanted to say was that it doesn't necessarily have to be that expensive. It's a very common thing to do in older installations since they usually used small fuses.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 22:05:54 2013 No.431997 imagining a using a TDR, split grounding, and ohm distance to verify every leg of a circuit is rated for the correct amperage for your new circuit Wasted more money in tools and labor than just running new wire

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 22:07:08 2013 No.432001 >>431997 wasted more money in funeral and housing costs than just doing it right or wasted money and time having to do it right in the end when the house won't sell because of code violations

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 22:16:38 2013 No.432009 >yfw you buy a house and every receptacle is installed upside down

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 22:18:09 2013 No.432014 >>431821 no, but it's kinda annoying when an electrician is installing undercabinet lights and drives a screw right through the bottom of your cabinet

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 22:21:09 2013 No.432017 >>432001 I guess you don't know what I meant by any of those, but you could locate any split or damage to the line and verify the current capacity of the wire meets, or doesn't whatever new rating you were thinking of.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 22:26:53 2013 No.432022 >>432017 Assuming everyone had access to a TDR.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 22:29:54 2013 No.432027 File: 74 KB, 640x480, ovenplug.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] 50amp 3-prong range plugs. why are they oriented like this? wouldn't it make more sense if the prongs on the plug were flipped 180?

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 22:41:38 2013 No.432036 >>432022 yesss, thus the wasting more time on tools and labor than just running a new wire.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 22:43:24 2013 No.432037 >>432027 Many plugs and sockets are intended to be installed with the ground at the top. That way, if it comes loose, the ground is exposed instead of hot.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 23:20:10 2013 No.432054 >>430384 What is the typical culprit in electrical fires?

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 6 23:34:39 2013 No.432057 I made that TIFI infographic at the top (used to work for Cheezburger) ... is it helpful in any way?

Anonymous Sun Apr 7 00:43:54 2013 No.432082

>mobile home park
>get a new 200amp pedastal meter base put in for a new trailer
>get the wiring in and call the guy out to inspect it and install the meter
>he doesn't like the way the hole is punched out in the bottom
>fix that, call him again
>suddenly tells us the wire we are using is too small, and the whole thing has to be buried
>spend two days wrestling with some heavy gauge aluminum wiring that has to go through 2in conduit, and in to the meter base/breaker box
>inspector faggot could have saved us an assload of time and money if he had explained all the issues from the start, instead of giving it to us bit by bit

Why is the electric company such a pain in the ass to deal with? We should have been given the book with all the standards from the start.9

Anonymous Sun Apr 7 00:49:54 2013 No.432084

>>432082
Also, because the length of the wire had to be buried instead of just neatly hidden from view under the trailer, we had to dig a big trench to wear it goes up into breaker box, which just happened to be directly over a big old tree stump, the roots of which were wrapped around giant fucking boulders. Also, it had been raining a lot so the clayish dirt had turned to really annoying tacky mud.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 7 01:18:41 2013 No.432091 >>430384 How much would you pay to have sex with Amy Wong from Futurama?

Anonymous Sun Apr 7 01:27:54 2013 No.432094

>>431853
>>432014

joiner here and it would not be out of the realm of possibility for an electrician to be disliked by the rest of the trades. in fact if you have friends from other trades its because eventually they will ask you to wire shit up. the rest just hate

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 7 01:33:39 2013 No.432096 >>432054 one is federal pacific breakers not shutting off like they're supposed to. they're not a company anymore for a reason

Anonymous Sun Apr 7 02:29:39 2013 No.432104

>>432091
This is a trick question, unless you mean to pay someone who has abducted her or something.

>>432082
Park dweller here. The reason is because inspectors don't know WTH is going in regards to trailer standards....and that's \because no one who lives in a trailer bothers to comply with code or call an inspector out to began with.

Anonymous Sun Apr 7 05:41:09 2013 No.432201

>>430974
if you don't think we (the Americans) were a key player in the victory in ww2 than either you are ignorant, biased, or a troll. See the war wasn't on our continent so we weren't there when it started and our presence brought a more rapid end to the war which is why "we came in at the end" see how that works. It was our man power and manufacturing capability that turned the tide aka"saved the day" I could go on and on but i think I made my point well enough, Think what you want if you need to just build up your national pride. Also I didn't hear of you guys turning down our aid before we entered the war and after to help you guys rebuild. People like you make wish we let you guys figure it out...and by "it" i mean how to speak German and suck Nazi cock

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 7 11:08:15 2013 No.432313 File: 54 KB, 600x750, idiot2[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] I dropped out my apprenticeship now I'm stuck pulling 185-400mm industrial cables... Was it a smart idea?

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 7 11:18:46 2013 No.432316 What kind of education do you need to become an electrician in America?

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 7 13:01:15 2013 No.432370 >>432313 electrical work is electrical work. your wasting your life either way..

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 7 13:43:17 2013 No.432394 >>432316 A diploma. Very good dexterity.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 02:40:01 2013 No.432817 How do I get free electricity/steal electricity and how do I not get caught

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 03:03:31 2013 No.432824 When I go to turn flip a light switch, sometimes the screw that holds the plate gives a light zap like if I was wearing socks on carpet and touched someone. Should I be worried

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 03:23:45 2013 No.432834

I have 2 large UPSes in the basement. I want to run power from one to my office, one floor up. I don't want to move the UPS to my office; it makes to much noise.

The wire will come through the floor. Getting into the wall will be far to difficult. What kind of wire, plugs and markings should I use? Solid 14-3 with an inline plug? Or with a box at the end of the wire?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 03:24:01 2013 No.432835 >>430386 >2 prong plus (ungrounded) If you have a 3 prong socket, but the ground is unconnected either get a proper ground in there or change the socket to 2 prongs.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 03:45:46 2013 No.432842 >>432824 no you're fine. It's just that it grounds you and the static charge in your body grounds out through the switch plate screw which is connected to earth. It's the same principle of shocking someone.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 04:27:16 2013 No.432853 >>432316 high school

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 04:27:45 2013 No.432852 >>432201 >completely ignoring the Soviets were the ones that took Berlin

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 04:29:16 2013 No.432854 >>432817 That ones tough for a diyer without a basic electrical background. At least without getting shocked, or fucking up the transformer for you and your neighbors.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 06:13:16 2013 No.432878 >>430384 Let's say i have an apparatus that uses 110v and my powerline in my home is 220v. It's small and pulls 200w How safe or unsafe is it for me to jerry the plug for it so that one of the phases goes to ground and use it on my wall outlet.

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 07:45:16 2013 No.432891

>>432201
hi ameribro, russky here. I highly appreciate american help during war, especially lend lease. btw, I am sorry for that peace of bloody shit, stalin, didn`t return your stuff after the party. but, I fairly believe that my country did greatest effort. with all respect.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 08:49:30 2013 No.432905 >>432878 it doesn't work that way, son

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 09:11:46 2013 No.432918 >>432853 Trade school would probably help.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 09:25:01 2013 No.432926 >>432891 This. Russia won WW2, England, Canada, USA and the rest helped.

>>	Nickola Mon Apr 8 10:46:17 2013 No.432962 >>431921 terminations should come into play here as well, not just wires.

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 10:56:31 2013 No.432971

>>432878
There are not many places you get 110v from just one phase. So It would still be 220v if you used the ground as a connection.

If you have checked and you do have 110v in one phase; then it probably means that your ground doesn't go back to the transformer in which case I wouldn't do it, as your resistance to ground could be high which could mean the current might find an easier path through your ground wires, you and something like a pipe.

Nickola Mon Apr 8 10:56:31 2013 No.432972

>>432082
>We should have been given the book with all the standards from the start
It's called the National Electric Code (or the NEC) and it's published by the NFPA. Anyone can buy one, but nobody's going to "give" you one. Most people couldn't even figure out how to read it properly anyway.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 11:03:00 2013 No.432978 >>432972 So you don't need to know the National Electric Code to work as an electrician in America? That seems somewhat dangerous.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 11:11:47 2013 No.432985 >>432854 If you have the patience to list some buzzwords, theory, and do nots, I'm willing to get those special gloves and boots and take that risk

>>	AllAll !!Pe8/IxcXVF4 Mon Apr 8 11:12:47 2013 No.432986 >>430384 Why?

>>	Nickola Mon Apr 8 11:14:16 2013 No.432989 No, I never said that. Read the post I was referring to to understand what I was saying. Working as an electrician in America actually requires extensive training.

>>	oops Nickola Mon Apr 8 11:15:16 2013 No.432990 This >>432989 refers to this >>432978

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 11:33:16 2013 No.433006 Am I right in thinking that some of those outlets aren't even grounded, because they have only 2 holes? See: Japan. Though I must admit, it is rather charming how the Danish one seems to smile at you.

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 11:48:00 2013 No.433013

>>433006

polarized single phase outlets don't really need a ground, as one side is grounded at some point in the system (at least that's true in america). part of the issue is that that wire carries current, so it is not going to be at zero volts, and the larger issue is that outlets didn't used to be polarized, so you and your appliance had no way of knowing which wire was neutral, so neither was grounded to the case.

having a third ground wire eliminates all these issues, at the expense of more wiring and more complex receptacles.

Drege Mon Apr 8 12:59:46 2013 No.433051
File: 37 KB, 497x500, Front1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Whats the typical numbers in a sub-station? Like 10,000 volts, 500 amps or something??
Why can I see 100 amp 3 phase Hubbell from outside the gates?
If one lived near to one of these how hard would it be to hook up to the connections and syphon off millions of watts or amps off the grid. And how hard would it be for THEM to discover that you were stealing electricity, like if I connected a socket and buried the wire, going from the sub station over to my property.

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 13:50:31 2013 No.433072

>>432817
You connect a separate panel between the pole and your electricity meter. Playing around with unfused 2 phase 220v is non-trivial and will get you killed if you don't know what you're doing. Either that or you wait for a black out to get the work done.

You also have to hide this connection from physical inspection. The person reading your meter will report any modifications. You have to hide the panel from inspection also. From (say) an insurance or fire inspection.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 14:21:46 2013 No.433087 >>433051 Go cut the lock on the gate and use a multimeter and test it.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 14:44:02 2013 No.433112 >>433072 Worth mentioning here; If your house burns down for any reason, and they find a panel with outlets before the electricity meter. You might not get anything from your insurance. Especially if it's an electrical fire.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 14:50:47 2013 No.433117 >>433112 you wont need a house seeing as you will be in jail

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 15:02:16 2013 No.433125 File: 774 KB, 1291x1800, 1363465602791.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Hey OP, If per say I was planning on becoming an electrician, how would I do so?

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 15:13:20 2013 No.433136

>>431041
>>431062
It will work with a 3-prong.

A GFCI compares current leaving the hot with current coming back thorough the neutral. If less current is coming back than went out, some current must be going somewhere it wasn't supposed to so the GFCI interrupts the circuit.

"Earth leakage breaker" is a type of GFCI (unless you have a really old one that measures voltage instead of current). You should be able to replace it with a GFCI if you can find one that fits your panel.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 15:15:17 2013 No.433139 >>431062 >>433136 Sorry, misread your post. It will work with a 2-prong since it's comparing current on hot & neutral, not on ground.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 17:00:48 2013 No.433215 I would like to know if renewable energy would save me money yet. I pay $0.028601/kwh Would wind or solar be the way to go?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 17:28:50 2013 No.433244 >>433125 In the uk it's an apprenticeship and usually 1 day a week college for 4 years, if your from anywhere else I wouldn't be able to help sorry

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 17:30:03 2013 No.433248 >>433215 I won't even bother with the hastle tbh. I'm not an expert but if it were me I wouldn't think about doing it unless I was planning in staying in the same house for another 20+ years

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 19:28:33 2013 No.433307 >>433215 Are you sure you have your price right? 2.8601 cents/kWh is helluva cheap. I live in the land of Socialized Hydro Power (aka Quebec) and pay 5.532 cents/kWh

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 20:06:35 2013 No.433326 When I touch my PC's case while also touching a radiator, I get shocked. Why does electricity run through the case?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 20:39:54 2013 No.433360 >>433326 You shouldn't. Something in your machine is wired wrong. It might be your power supply. I would fix that asap.

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 21:08:08 2013 No.433379

>>433307
>>433215

If you're really paying under 3 cents per kWh, generating your own power is probably not for you. That is beyond cheap. Assuming an average price of $0.70/watt of panel (not including any other associated expenses) and a 1000W panel, it's cost you $700 for just the photovoltaics, which would (fudging 6kWh of power daily, which is pretty optimistic) generate a little over 17 cents of power a day and take a little over 11 years just to pay itself off.

Now if that was a typo and you actually pay nearly $0.30/kWh (outrageous but not necessarily unheard of), the numbers look much more attractive, taking only a year to pay off the panels.

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 21:14:08 2013 No.433386

>>433087

This sounds like a good plan.

>>433051

As far as stealing power goes, I think it'd be damn near impossible to tell from an electrical standpoint (assuming you're only using as much power as your average house), but I'm pretty sure SOMEONE would notice you digging shit up near a fucking substation, let alone the actual connection just sticking out like a sore thumb to the next person to inspect the thing.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 21:51:23 2013 No.433403 >>433386 >implying anon wouldn't fry his ass alive trying to hook up connections to get free electricity.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 22:21:09 2013 No.433418 I know nothing about electrical engineering but plan on learning by attempting (and likely failing) to make an electric buggy. How many car batteries will it take to make it move with a person on it?

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 22:32:39 2013 No.433425

>>433418

Anywhere from one to..lots...

Will depend on the motor and controllers you use, plus your range requirements.

However...

>car batteries

Car batteries aren't meant for this sort of thing. They have porous electrodes, giving them a high number of reaction sites and making it so they can put out a lot of amperage.

The problem is these change composition when discharged (that's how electrochemical reactions work in the first place) and deform. Car batteries lose loads of capacity every time they're fully discharged.

What you'd want are deep-cycle batteries, which have solid electrodes and are made to be repeatedly discharged.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 22:45:09 2013 No.433435 if i plug a boombox into a power inverter as a permanent alternative to a car stereo, would this damage my car in any way? i guess what i'm really asking is, would using a power inverter to power something every time my car is powered on be a bad idea?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 22:47:39 2013 No.433439 File: 1.14 MB, 200x147, 1359711756430.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>433435 It'll probably permanently damage your pussy game. That's ghetto as fuck.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 22:47:54 2013 No.433438 >>433435 As long as you don't leave it plugged in for a long time while the car's off, you should be fine.

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 22:51:08 2013 No.433446

>>433438
oh that's another question i had.

if I leave a phone charger or something plugged into my power port overnight, would it drain the battery completely?

>>433439
>implying i'm not already a 22 year old driving a 92 chevy lumina minivan with a smelly couch in the back

pussy game? what's that?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 22:54:39 2013 No.433450 File: 82 KB, 589x1023, Sexybaby100.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>433446 LOL, Damn bro. Just... Damn... >pic related >Something you're missing out on

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 23:02:09 2013 No.433464

>>433386
Think I could get a 100A - W and 5 feet of 00 (to go beneath the ground), and splice 12AWG to that (with liquid
tape), would 12g a melt in my trench?
Also I'd do this all under the cover of night.

>this is hypothetical, the nearest substation I know of is like a mile away. Seriously.

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 23:02:39 2013 No.433462
File: 128 KB, 960x1280, 1264732533100.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>433446

Depends entirely on what it is. Most car batteries have a capacity of at least a few hundred watt-hours and could easily charge a few phones without being recharged by the alternator, but you're risking damaging the battery at little by powering something drawing more than a dozen watts or so for that long.

You have to remember, the design philosophy behind a car battery is totally different than most electrochemical devices. Most batteries try and strike some sort of balance between energy density, power density, and cycle life. Car batteries are made to dump as many amps as they can and that's about it.

>>433450

Women are overrated.

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 23:13:08 2013 No.433478

>>433464

Those substations are upwards of 400+ Amps and KILOVOLTS.

You'll fry your fool self trying to do anything.

00 can't hold that and 12 AWG would most likely explode.

Check out this video for a glimpse of what you'd be walking into.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hIkNY5xjy5k

Anonymous Mon Apr 8 23:14:38 2013 No.433479

>>433464

>Think I could get a 100A - W

I have no idea what that is.

Most of the problem is that substations don't spit out the 240V that goes to a home. They provide between like 3kV and 15kV to the lines that feed the pole pigs, which in turn step that down to 240V to route to the breaker box. You can't just casually splice a wire into a distribution center and plug your toaster into it.

If you REALLY wanted to steal power directly from a substation, you'd need several thousand feet of high-voltage wire and an appropriate transformer to actually get something usable. This would all likely come at cost sufficient to cover your average power bill for a decade or so. At that point, you're better off installing solar panels and a small wind turbine.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 23:34:23 2013 No.433506 >>433307 Ontario here. I pay anywhere from 6.3 cents to 11.8 cents depending on the time of day. Not to mention that the delivery charge is more than the power I did use. Shit is fucked.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 8 23:38:09 2013 No.433511 >>433464 You can get plugs that fit that hubbell device you mentioned. The voltage and amperage varies, however.

Anonymous Tue Apr 9 00:11:09 2013 No.433542
File: 16 KB, 240x240, a20791a13cdf4958835c34_m.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>433478
I used to work at a place called hollywood lights/lighting services and we used 0, 00, 20, 30, 50 amp cam and twist lock and ran long runs from some city connections on the city grid power with the blue 5 pin 3phase 50 and 100 amp "hubbell" plugs (shown in pic)

Down the street from work I noticed a substation with one of these outlets on the side of a transformer and wondered if one could syphon power off the grid there.

>>433478
And yea I know that in reality I'd die, pretty sure the youtube link is the chinese painters that knocked there scaffolding into the above head lines and fried as I've not copy/pasted it yet.
Shit 20 amps is enough to kill if your hands are wet, 50 if your grounded well and your hands are bone dry.

>>433479
I think we called the type W cause they were 00, 000 or 0000 gauge.

Yea our 100 amp panels I think were several 10's of 1000's (we had a blown one sitting in the shop they told me the back story, some n00b disconnected the 3 phase in the wrong order and fried the box - he was fired)

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 01:01:10 2013 No.433565 Do you have any knowledge as to what Electrical Engineers do on a day to day basis? I know you aren't one, but I figure you might know

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 01:04:54 2013 No.433566 >>433565 Depends on the job bro. Not OP here. Not an EE either. But I am an Engineer that sees a wide variety of companies. Everyone has different needs.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 01:05:41 2013 No.433567 Hypothetically couldn't you just wrap a fuck ton of wire around a power line and use induction for free power?

Anonymous Tue Apr 9 01:12:23 2013 No.433570

>>433567

Try it.

Also. A tip for life.

If it seems easy. It's not.
If it sounds too good to be true. It is.
If it gets you something for free. It doesn't work.

and pretty much, If it was simple, cheap and hugely effective.. It would be everywhere.

But still, try it.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 01:14:54 2013 No.433573 >>433570 I'm saying hypothetically. Clearly it isn't a good idea in practice.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 01:19:39 2013 No.433576 >>433573 Hypothetically you can neglect Air resistance too. Also hypothetically Op-Amps are infinite gain devices. There are A LOT of idealized situations.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 01:22:54 2013 No.433578 >>433576 Well I just don't see why it wouldn't work. If I had the wire that could handle what would be going through it, had a perfectly stable setup for it ,why couldn't i?

Anonymous Tue Apr 9 01:28:39 2013 No.433581

>>433578

The biggest most obvious reason is what are you wrapping your hypothetical wire around if you're not paying for the electricity?

The power on the line?

Also you need loops of wire, you can't really just lay one on top of the other and have it work.

It's been a while since I've done the Math on it. But suffice it to say you can wiki Transformers and get the necessary info on what you're asking to do.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 01:42:55 2013 No.433589 >>433581 Disregard, I'm a fucking moron. I don't know what I was thinking.

Anonymous Tue Apr 9 02:34:38 2013 No.433625

>>433578
it does work. People have done it and created new frontiers of criminal prosecution.

doesn't work well with distribution lines. You want a high voltage feeder. Just get a big transformer and set it on the ground under them.

the power company will detect the drain in a few weeks and dispatch a guy to look at it. Vthen he will call his manager, who will call security, who will call the police and the lawyers.

you will not believe how much money it will cost you, I guarantee it. Terrorist

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 03:33:23 2013 No.433644 >>430384 How much of a pain in the ass was it for you to actually become an Electrician.

Anonymous Tue Apr 9 11:02:54 2013 No.433811

>>432918
Not unless you take a lot of math classes in trade school.

Minimum requirements are high school diploma, driver's license, and you must be 17.

College and/or have previous construction work experience give you extra points. College looks to be a must these days as the majority if not all new applicants are coming in with college transcripts (which tells you something about how the economy is going).

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 11:52:10 2013 No.433821 If you only have a tester that lights up for current how can you tell the difference between ground and neutral if all three wires are the same color?

Anonymous Tue Apr 9 12:10:38 2013 No.433831

>>433821
get a better tester.
or (with power off) tie two of the wires together at the reseptacle. Test your three at the breaker for continuity. The two that are continuous are one. The third is your third. Make that your ground. Go back to the receptacle, tie one of the others to ground. Test that at the breaker box. Call that neutral. Last one can be hot. You have to cover the wires in appropriate colored electric tape to where they enter the box now.

Anonymous Tue Apr 9 12:57:54 2013 No.433853

>>433625

If you're talking about hooking your own transformer right into the line... and sitting it on the ground... You're asking for more trouble than just the stealing of power. If you don't kill yourself you'll kill some stupidtalented /diy/erthat walks up trying to figure out what the hell that thing is.

You'll go down for theft, negligence and who knows what else.

For the other thing about induction on the lines... You should probably just watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNf8KtWeW1s

Anonymous Tue Apr 9 13:26:39 2013 No.433867

>>433506
QC is in fact 5.41 cents for the first 30 kWh a day, 7.78 cents after that. And it's been going up in the last few years. But yeah, Socialized Hydro Power FTW!

The funny thing is I have friends who complain about the price of electricity. "They" promised us free electricity when it was nationalized, back in the 60s. To which I say "if it's free, it gets wasted" Everybody out in the country has high powered lights on full time in their yard "to keep the coyotes away" Compared to the just over the border in Vermont, where everything is pitch black at night.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 13:29:39 2013 No.433870 >>430384 hey OP i recently bought a lincoln pro mig 180 welder. i runs on 230v/20amps my question is what size breaker and what gauge wire do i need?

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 13:30:08 2013 No.433871 >>433870 20 amp breaker, obviously. Wire gauge depends on the length.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 13:52:39 2013 No.433879 >>433565 I'm an EE and I work as a "Consultant". I design the power, telecom, lighting, fire alarm, and security systems for buildings. I work closely with architects and mechanical engineering consultants.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 13:56:39 2013 No.433880 >>431168 Midget locking devices?! I need some for my wiring, yeah my wiring. They sure don't look like tiny little handcuffs to me, wouldn't they shock the poor thing. I thought they banned that stuff worldwide in the 50's unless you work for the circus.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 13:57:39 2013 No.433881 >>433880 Kinnnnnnnnnkkkyy

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 17:15:39 2013 No.433974 >>431920 That makes no fucking sense. I don't see how a HIGHER amp rating would start a fire.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 17:35:53 2013 No.433995 >>433974 >That makes no fucking sense. I don't see how a HIGHER amp rating would start a fire. future darwin award nominee

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 17:41:55 2013 No.434000 >>433974 Are you dense? Breakers or fuses rated higher than original will allow more amps through whatever they supply power to, which can easily cause a fire.

Anonymous Tue Apr 9 17:45:40 2013 No.434005

>>433974
Let me illustrate. A circuit wired with 14 AWG should be protected by a 15 amp breaker, as 14AWG has a 15 amp max current capacity. IF something should try to draw more than 15 amps, the breaker will trip, keeping the wires from overheating and other bad things from happening. IF you put a larger breaker, say, one for 20 or 25 amps, on that 14AWG circuit, the breaker will NOT trip when the wires get overloaded.

So, if you are constantly tripping a breaker, you either need to put in more circuits, upgrade the existing circuit, or take some of the load off the circuit. You CANNOT just put in a larger amperage breaker.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 17:48:54 2013 No.434007 >>433995 >>434000 >implying the circuit breaker wouldn't trip first

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 17:52:54 2013 No.434012 >>434007 The circuit breaker doesn't know the amperage of the wire used in the circuit it protects, just how many amps it must allow before it trips.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 18:12:09 2013 No.434035 >>434012 im so fucking confused now

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 18:23:26 2013 No.434042 >>434035 just read >>434005

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 9 21:21:11 2013 No.434145 Why are you allowed to parallel two 3/0 for 400 amps. Should not the area of the paralleled wire be equal to the next highest single wire. Everyone does this and I know it must be a physics thing. Could you explain?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 02:27:33 2013 No.434283 >>434007 >implying the circuit breaker wouldn't trip first Yeah, that's exactly what we're implying! If you arbitrarily exchange a properly sized breaker or fuse for a higher amperage one, you can overload the wire without tripping the breaker. Duh.

Anonymous Wed Apr 10 02:36:58 2013 No.434288

>>430386
The proper way to handle this situation without a complete rewire, is to use GFCI outlets with the ground pin disconnected. Then any fault that would have caused the ground pin to carry current will simply trigger the GFCI and shut off the outlet. I believe this is even to code, but the outlets may have to be labeled as not having a true ground to be fully in compliance.

Anonymous Wed Apr 10 11:58:09 2013 No.434486

Ok I want to wire my boiler to run off a generator. It seems to me it would be easiest to wire a twist lock plug into the power feed into the boiler that way you don't back feed. Is this right also will the generator fuck up the relay or do I need a voltage regulator?

T.plumber

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 12:39:09 2013 No.434511 >>434005 >breaker would not trip Wat. It would still trip regardless of whether you put a 100A breaker or 15A. The breakers sense the resistance on the wire. It stays the same regardless of the breaker you put on it.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 12:58:57 2013 No.434518 I'm thinking about becoming an electrician, how do I go about getting an apprenticeship? Is there schooling I need to do before the apprenticeship?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 13:22:25 2013 No.434522 >>434511 Breakers don't "sense the resistance". Most breakers in distribution panels are thermal: they trip when an internal component deforms because of heat generated by excessive current.

Anonymous Wed Apr 10 13:51:41 2013 No.434534

>>434511
>breakers sense the resistance on the wire

Nigga you just went full retard. Who the fuck told you that?

A breaker is a very dumb device. All it knows is the current passing through it. A 20 amp breaker will trip ONLY when the current passing through it exceeds 20 amps.

Like >>343522 said, the internal mechanism of a breaker is usually just a bimetallic spring that changes shape and forces the breaker open when the current gets high enough to heat it up. In a fuse it's a narrow strip of metal that melts when the current exceeds it's rating. In neither case does the resistance of the wire come into play.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 13:57:40 2013 No.434537 >>430709 In theory, that might be right. In practice, I've never stumbled across a legacy 2-wire install where the box was actually grounded - there's always a break in the armor somewhere, and that's if the fuse box /breaker box is even grounded

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 13:57:54 2013 No.434539 >>434534 >>434522 Reistance only comes in to play in that sense that A = V/R. Lower R means higher A.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 13:58:54 2013 No.434541 >>431039 GFCI, RCI, and Earth Leakage Breakers are all different words for the exact same thing. You can buy BOTH GFCI outlets and GFCI breakers, although you only need to use one or the other to have full protection.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 14:01:39 2013 No.434545 >>432316 HSD with some honors physics courses, or a couple years of trade school. Then you generally have to go through a couple years of apprenticeship. Which you can't because there's no openings right now.

Anonymous Wed Apr 10 14:03:55 2013 No.434546

>>432878
Depends on what country you live in and thus what kind of 220 you are getting (i.e. split phase vs. 3 phase).

If it's american style split phase, that's fine and has been the practice in large appliances roughly forever. If it's european style 3 phase just don't do it.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 14:26:57 2013 No.434558 >>434511 The breakers sense the resistance on the wire. >this is what /diy/ actually believes

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 15:11:26 2013 No.434588 >>434511 No. Breakers sense the current passing through them. A 100-amp breaker on a circuit wired with wire rated for 10 amps will blow at 100 amps, and your wires will get hot. Not safe.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 15:17:10 2013 No.434591 >>434558 BroScience man, BroScience.

Anonymous Wed Apr 10 15:28:24 2013 No.434594
File: 1.39 MB, 1920x1200, 1282069795973.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Journeyman here.
I got told by an inspector the other day that you can't phase tape wires under 6's (IIRC.)
Know where in the code that is? I haven't bothered looking for more than 2 mins.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 15:34:39 2013 No.434600 >>434594 Article 200, I forget which section speciffically though.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 16:56:10 2013 No.434646 Why is the grounded conductor bonded to the grounding conductor at the main breaker box?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 16:58:11 2013 No.434648 I'm >>434646 How does grounding prevent you from getting an electric shock? Why is the ground at the break box connected to the water/gas pipes? How/when does electricity follow this path?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 18:21:09 2013 No.434686 >>434522 And what causes the heat, buddy? Resistance.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 18:30:54 2013 No.434690 >>434686 No. Heat is generated by current. You could have a 1 ohm wire, it will not generate heat. Put 15 amps through it (15*1 = 15 volts), it will heat up. Now take a 100k ohm resistance, put 15 amps through it (iow 1.5M volts) it will generate heat.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 18:34:24 2013 No.434692 >>434686 Your mental model is wrong. Voltage = force Current = work Impedance = resitance to the force

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 18:45:39 2013 No.434695 >>434686 REgardless, breakers don't know the resistance of a run of wire, they only know the resistance of their own internal workings.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 18:50:09 2013 No.434699 >>434534 Try this, you tard. Get a 15A rated breaker, a device that pulls 30A and use 8AWG wire. Let me know if the breaker senses the 30 amps and trips.

Anonymous Wed Apr 10 19:25:40 2013 No.434717

>>434699
Yes, in that situation the breaker will trip, because it is a 15 amp breaker conencted to a 30 amp load. Wire size isn't the deciding factor in your scenario.

But that was never what we were talking about anyway. We were talking about using a 30 amp breaker on a 15 amp max circuit.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 19:42:40 2013 No.434725 have you ever been the victim of copper theft?

disconnect this Anonymous Wed Apr 10 19:44:40 2013 No.434727 [DELETED]

File: 526 KB, 1600x1200, 130410_001.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

has anyone ever encountered a connector like this?

I got a broken samsung plasma screen tv, im trying to ebay the only valuable board in there. it is connected to some "buffer" boards and i cannot get the damn connection off.

I tried poking in at those three lil holes but rather the plastic just deforms and nothing moves

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 21:22:55 2013 No.434828 >>434591 /diy/ and /fit/ - A Compendium of Broscience.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 22:18:09 2013 No.434885 >>434828 Internet's largest and finest.

Anonymous Wed Apr 10 22:20:39 2013 No.434886
File: 3 KB, 300x300, dial.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Can I use one of these dials used for ceiling fans for a box/round fan. The fans that I have even on the lowest setting are too loud/push to much air for the small rooms I use them for and would like to lower the speed a bit. I know little of electricity I would rather ask than burn my house down. Thanks in advance.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 22:23:39 2013 No.434889 >>434886 Not OP, but no, you can't, not really. You could hook it up to control an outlet, but that would probably be dangerous. Just buy a new fan.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 22:26:39 2013 No.434893 >>434886 http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lutron-Credenza-300-Watt-Plug-In-Lamp-Dimmer-White-TT-300NLH-WH/100145680#.UWYfN5NQxHs

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 22:32:40 2013 No.434904 >>434886 Yes, you can.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 10 22:59:25 2013 No.434944 >>434518 read this thread. I've already answered this.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 02:00:12 2013 No.435062 >>430384 When will Apple sue Germany for stealing their invention of the plug that fit both ways?

Anonymous Thu Apr 11 02:33:25 2013 No.435076

>>434886
You can't. Those are for a resistive load. They work via PWM. This means cutting out part of the normally sinusoidal AC. So you get sharp slops at the cut off. Sending that a sharp slope through a reactive load (aka motor) will give you very high current spikes. This will fry your motor, or your wiring, or your dimmer. It might also light a fire.

Here comes the math : A = dV/dT (A == current, dV== delta voltage, dT == delta time) So you go from 60v (say) to 0 in 1 ms (say) you get A of 60/0.0001 == 60 kA. Granted this is 60kA for 1ms, but it happens 120 times a second.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 02:42:40 2013 No.435078 why the fuck does Japan not have grounds?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 02:44:54 2013 No.435080 >>435078 Earthquake country. Ground isn't reliable.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 03:07:54 2013 No.435085 Eurofag here, why won't my washing machine work if the plug is upside down?

Anonymous Thu Apr 11 04:49:11 2013 No.435108
File: 345 KB, 707x873, whatisthis.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Hey electrician, I'm looking to become an electrical apprentice after some wasted time at uni, and I'd like to pick your brains.

1. Would calling actual employers and trying to get an apprenticeship that way be worth it? I don't want to go through a group training company but I will if I have to. I'm 20 if that has any bearing.

2. How could I improve my chances of getting an apprenticeship outside of cold calling? Work experience? Do electricians take people on work experience? I'm too late for the intake of the cert II in electrotechnology (career start).

Thanks

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 08:31:55 2013 No.435187 >>434486 Still mad that our prevailing wage is higher?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 08:48:57 2013 No.435199 >>435076 I'm not really an expert and may be wrong, but isn't I=dq/dt as in coulomb per second?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 09:15:54 2013 No.435227 >>435085 Try bending the cable from the plug end and see if it works. If the machine starts while you're playing with the cable, replace the cable.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 09:48:25 2013 No.435248 >>435062 It doesn't tho

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 11:32:12 2013 No.435298 >>435076 There are dimmer switches meant for fan motors. One of those would work, I believe.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 11:32:40 2013 No.435297 >>435080 What? Is this really a thing? Does no place have ground in Japan?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 11:37:10 2013 No.435301 >>435298 Yes. Those are designed for reactive loads. And they cost 10x more then light dimmers.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 11:41:55 2013 No.435303 >>435301 But thats what you need, unless you like burning out fan motors.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 11:57:12 2013 No.435315 >>435303 I have one for my kitchen fan. I'm not the Anon that asked the question.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 13:25:39 2013 No.435349 >>435227 No, plenty of people report the same thing. Apparently it's a feature.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 15:57:56 2013 No.435408 >>435349 Oh, then do washing machines pretty much always have a 90-degree plug? I gotta try this feature out.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 16:15:55 2013 No.435426 >>435108 if you have a local electricians union join it and they'll help you find an apprenticeship

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 17:16:41 2013 No.435459 Whats your favorite nema motor?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 18:35:40 2013 No.435484 >>434486 Plz respond

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 20:50:40 2013 No.435555 >>430384 mind helping me out, OP? >>435550

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 11 21:20:10 2013 No.435579 >>435248 It does

>>	Nickola Thu Apr 11 22:47:29 2013 No.435622 >>435426 find a trade school, like the local community college. They probably have an apprenticeship program like the JATC or similar

Anonymous Fri Apr 12 03:36:59 2013 No.435731

>>434648

It prevents you from getting a shock by providing a more direct, lower resistance path to ground than through your body.

If a device fails in such a way that it, ungrounded, would normally shock you when you touch it, when grounded the device will instead simply short to that ground and trip the breaker.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 12 03:42:00 2013 No.435735 >>435731 But the breaker is too slow. That's why we have link related. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Residual-current_device

Anonymous Fri Apr 12 04:01:00 2013 No.435740

>>434699
It will trip at 15A, because it is a 15A circuit breaker. That's its entire purpose in life and its only reason for existence.

If you have discovered a type of breaker that doesn't need to be properly chosen, but instead automagically detects the resistance of the circuit it is protecting and trips accordingly, you should run to the patent office immediately. You're going to be rich. You've got two super-neat tricks going on there: 1) differentiating between the resistance of the wire and the resistance of the connected load, and 2) measuring resistance while only being connected to one side of the circuit.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 12 04:06:32 2013 No.435742 >>435078 i loled.

Anonymous Fri Apr 12 04:18:46 2013 No.435748

>>435735
Even if the breaker doesn't trip in time, the device's ground should still be the path of least resistance and protect the human. Unless you've got some odd situation where a control knob or switch is energized but not the body of the device. Then grounding does nothing to help anyone.

But yeah, GFCI / RCD does a much better job of protecting humans than ground + circuit breaker. IMO it nearly makes grounding obsolete/redundant.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 12 04:38:30 2013 No.435758 If I want to wire a single LED to the power led connector on a motherboard, do I need to put my own current limiting in the circuit or is that shit handled by the motherboard?

Anonymous Fri Apr 12 05:07:16 2013 No.435769

>>430384
I'm an electric guitarist, and I appear to have what most people reckon is a grounding problem. The issue is where.Basically, whenever I plug my guitar in and touch the metal parts of the guitar there's a quiet click or pop. Static right? Happens on both my electric guitars, a Gibson LP Studio and a Yamaha Ibanez Copy.But here's the weird part - the guitar techs checked electronics in my guitars and there's nothing wrong at all. Also, if I remove myself from the circuit entirely, put down the guitar and walk away, then touch something else metal - ie: the unpainted part of a radiator - my amp still clicks.

What the fucks going on??

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 12 05:13:45 2013 No.435771 >>435769 I followed you just so I could find out the answer because I'm so damn curious.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 12 06:46:32 2013 No.435788 >>435758 put a resistor in series with the LED. look at the data sheet for the LED and pick a voltage and current that will make it bright as you want, then subtract that voltage from the source voltage; the resistor is then = V/I.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 12 11:15:09 2013 No.435857 >>435748 Well yeah, kinda obsolete. But who would want a shock from a broken device just when someone touches it in the wrong place in the wrong situation. Also the ground can protect from ESDs and such things well.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 12 12:06:55 2013 No.435876 >>435758 The power LED connector on a motherboard already has the current limiting circuit. You just need to connect a LED between the 2 poles.

Anonymous Fri Apr 12 14:16:25 2013 No.435943

>>435769

I'm assuming your amp is picking up "noise" from the grounding system. The fix for this would be to run a circuit with an isolated ground for your equipment only. I know recording studios require this because the recording equipment also picks up the "noise".

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 12 15:55:08 2013 No.435996 I've hooked up an old phone charger to a case fan, the charger is giving the fan 9 volts, but the fan is rated for 12. Will this cause damage at all? Also, the charger heats up about 5-10 degrees celsius after approx 30-40 minutes of constant use.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 12 16:13:53 2013 No.436010 >>435996 Hard to say, give it a couple of hours and I think you've found it out.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 12:10:33 2013 No.436397 >>435484 Still no answer

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 12:45:34 2013 No.436405 >>431063 It means theres a shit load of harmonics on your circuit fucking up the sine wave the power is delivered in. Dimmer switches and computer power supplies do really nasty things to a AC power.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 12:49:32 2013 No.436406 >>431063 you could get a power factor correction device for your stereo. Hundred bucks ish. Dlbe careful, people sell snake oil called the same thing

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 13:10:32 2013 No.436414 >diode >20mA, 1V What do these mean? I mean I can up the current as much as I want depending on my power source. Not like they're static, as far as I know Was always self evident in HS but don't think I ever understood it beyond how to do the exercises

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 13:25:18 2013 No.436418 >>430384 Most of my house seems to be ungrounded is there a quick fix I can do in one room that has my main electronics.. also what would the proper fix be?

Anonymous Sat Apr 13 13:32:48 2013 No.436421

>>436418
Rewiring the house.

Your panel is almost definitely grounded. If not, do that too. Probably just upgade the whole panel while you're at it since it's probably 50 years old.

Then replace all the wires with modern 3 wire romex.

You could just do one or two new runs to your computer room I guess. You might not have enough screws on the neutral bar in your box to ground to though?

Anytime I give anon advice on electricity I always think, if you have to ask, you probably don't want to be messing with it.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 13:42:03 2013 No.436425 >>436418 Do you have electric heating? If so, you can get a ground from that. If not... maybe from some metal pipes. But make sure the pipe is metal all the way to the ground in the basement.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 13:50:33 2013 No.436431 >>436425 The metal pipes have to be bonded to the PGE. It probably isn't. This is terrible advice and people need to stop following it.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 14:30:02 2013 No.436441 >>436431 I did state metal all the way to the ground. The original question was for a quick fix. Pulling new cable through an old home is not a quick fix.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 14:31:19 2013 No.436442 >>436431 1: what is PGE? 2: is grounding better to copper pipes better than nothing?

Anonymous Sat Apr 13 14:34:02 2013 No.436445
File: 14 KB, 300x300, gfci-receptacles-00.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>436442
2- Depends on what you need the ground for. Using a GFI with shorted? floating? ground is safer (against shocks to humans). Getting a ground from metal pipes will keep your UPS/power filter happy.

Pic related, it's a GFI.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 14:53:05 2013 No.436455 >>436442 Copper is best- if you have city water jump the water meter with a section of bare copper wire if you have well water make sure it isn't coming in plastic if it is jump a wire from the copper to a stake in your concrete basement

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 15:19:43 2013 No.436463 >>436455 I have city water, but we don't have meter's, just a main line (copper). >>436445 >shorted? floated? power filter? wtf bro try helping instead.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 17:59:39 2013 No.436528 File: 23 KB, 200x300, outlet.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] What is this outlet for? Its a US outlet.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 18:34:40 2013 No.436539 >>436528 That's a GFI. Measures the current gtravelling through the hot and back through the neutral conductors. It shuts off the power immediately if it senses any current leaking (i.e. dropping a blow dryer in water, you getting shocked, etc.)

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 18:54:40 2013 No.436549 >>436539 I think he means, why the one sideways prong?

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 19:09:38 2013 No.436553 >>436528 >>436549 It's a combo : NEMA 5-15 and 5-20. You can use a 5-15 (120v, 15 amp aka normal 3 prong plug) or a 5-20 (120v, 20 amp) plug in it. It's also GFI.

Anonymous Sat Apr 13 20:05:42 2013 No.436590
File: 385 KB, 1296x972, DSCN5368.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>436463
That's not what Anon meant by "copper".

What you need to make sure is:
a- you have a properly grounded metal pipe (pic related, one example of pipe grounding, green wire is the ground)
b- the pipe is metal all the way from the grounding point all the way to where you want to run a wire to your outlet, for grounding
c- you have proper electric contact between the grounding wire and the pipe.

Unfortunately, the only way to do point b- reliably is a visual inspection. Less then this, you are going on faith. But if you can see the entire length of pipe, you can probably run some solid wire up it and install a properly grounded box.

Point c means taking a buffing wheel or sand paper to the pipe until it is shinny; no paint, no grime, no verdigris. It also means using a proper fitting (like in pic) to create the contact.

Anonymous Sat Apr 13 20:07:42 2013 No.436591
File: 383 KB, 1296x972, DSCN5374.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>436590
Another example of a grounded pipe, this time on the cold water line.

>But Anon, that fitting is covered in verdigris!
On the outside, yes. Chances are slim there's verdigris on the contact points.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 20:11:41 2013 No.436596 >>436591 It seems like there's some galvanic corrosion going on there.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 20:57:55 2013 No.436619 >>436596 Yeah. That's the cold water line. It drips with condensation in the summer.

Anonymous Sat Apr 13 21:01:51 2013 No.436622
File: 389 KB, 1296x972, DSCN5372.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>436463
>>shorted?
This means shorting the ground and neutral lugs. Don't do this with a GFI.

>floated?
This means leave the ground lug unconnected aka floating. IIRC, this is the proper thing to do to a GFI if you don't have a proper ground. Be very sure to mark the plug as ungrounded ON THE OUTSIDE.

>power filter?
Setting up a GFI like above will protect you from getting fatally zapped from faulty equipment or use of equipment. Some equipment however really wants a proper ground. Things like UPSes, surge suppressors and power filters.

Pic related, it's a urge suppressor + power filter.

Anonymous Sat Apr 13 21:37:42 2013 No.436631

>>431063
definitely extraterrestrials. move away from powerlines. buy place w/ underground power.(those big green boxes in the yard. no sign of power lines except near busy road) you never get electrocuted w/ underground power....obviusly b/c all the wires are already grounded.

Anonymous Sat Apr 13 22:45:43 2013 No.436678

>>436441
>>436442
PGE is the primary ground electrode. The ground rod that's hidden in the wall under your electric panel. It's bonded to the neutral/ground bar in your meter and in turn bonded to the power company ground.

Just running a wire out of a junction box and grounding to any ol' ground, even a proper 8' ground rod is not right. It needs to be bonded to the Main Ground Neutral for the whole house.

Don't fucking use water pipes, goddamnit. NEC will come and kick your ass if it's new work. The city water pipes are plastic too.

A ground rod stuck at the corner of your house is going to be 10k to 20k+ ohms to the actual ground neutral of the electric circuit. It's not going to do shit to trip a breaker. A water pipe that is not bonded to the MGN will be the same case. 10k+ ohms to electric ground, even if it's 99% oxygen free pure copper running 100' underground, if it's not bonded, it's worthless for power grounding.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 22:55:53 2013 No.436689 >>436678 You missed the part were I show the pipes tied to my panel's ground in my basement. It's not like I didn't post 2 pictures showing it (one of hot lines, one of cold). Oh well.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 13 23:19:15 2013 No.436713 >>436689 Yours at least works. I wasn't sure if you meant that was going back to the panel or not. Seemed ambiguous to me. I didn't think I was addressing you anyway. Mostly that guy that said to dig back before the water meter and attach to that.

Anonymous Sat Apr 13 23:29:40 2013 No.436720

I have 2 largish UPSes. One for servers, one for my office. The office one makes noise (fan) so I don't want it in my office. It would be relatively easy to get a cable from the basement to my office. What kind of cable should I use, and what kind of plugs on the ends? Solid 14/2 with a box and NEMA 5-15? Or can I use an inline plug?

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 14 06:21:41 2013 No.436904 >>434486 Still no answer

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 14 13:26:19 2013 No.437023 >>436904 You don't need a voltage regulator, the generator will have this built in. All you need is a changeover switch to switch the boiler between generator and grid power. These are available, you can also put other circuits like a freezer on it.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 14 16:36:16 2013 No.437111 >>437023 What I want to do is just wire a twist plug into the line so when I lose power I can just unplug the line from the house and plug in a line from the generator

Anonymous Sun Apr 14 18:42:35 2013 No.437181

>>437111
Using a twist lock will work. As would using any plug rated for 250v 20 amp (or whatever your boiler needs). I do not know if it will be up to code. I do know that people install changeover switches to do what you propose. You can even get automatic ones.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 15 08:39:49 2013 No.437457 >>437181 My fear is that the Taco relay will get fucked up somehow- I know they are pretty fragile to the point where supply houses refuse to take returns after you buy them.

Anonymous Mon Apr 15 11:42:11 2013 No.437527

>>437457
If you're that concerned about it, put a fast-acting fuse in line and build a crowbar circuit.
Any overvoltage will cause a dead short before the relay and blow the fuse instantly. Should protect the relay.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crowbar_(circuit)

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 15 12:25:39 2013 No.437547 >>437527 That's the same thing as a line filter/surge suppressor. Wouldn't it be better to buy one?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 15 12:28:58 2013 No.437550 >>437547 Oh, I guess that would work. It never occurred to me, I usually just build such a circuit into the power supply of a project if it's really sensitive.

Anonymous Mon Apr 15 12:34:01 2013 No.437554

>>437550
Yeah, really depends on one's skill level. But if Anon is asking here about how to connect a generator, I assume he doesn't have the skill to build a crowbar circuit. Not that it's very hard, but playing around with 120v or 220v (Anon still hasn't said what he needs) is not to be done lightly.

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/diy/ - Do It Yourself