russian stove

[Anonymous No.1979276]

Been looking into making one of these "pech" brick indoor ovens, but people who know are tight-lipped about this.

The idea is that the hot gases are routed throughout for maximum efficiency and heat dissipation, and what little smoke is sent to the chimney is completely cool.

These have been around probably for thousands of years but bricklayers are still chasing people away from conduction sites so they couldn't watch them build one.

We're on electric heat and lose power sometimes, so I'm looking to put one of these together, but can't seem to find good plans anywhere.

I've cobbled together something in sketchup based on a bunch of different designs, but it probably won't work very well.

Any ideas?

[Anonymous No.1979365]

Bump

[Anonymous No.1979376]

>>1979276
http://www.gottagodoityourself.com/the-great-traditional-russian-wood-stove-heater/

[Anonymous No.1979384]

>>1979276
European tile stoves are the same principle.

[Anonymous No.1979449]

>>1979376
Why make it go up and down? Why not ladder up left and right?

[Anonymous No.1979548]

>>1979449
Well for one, heat travels upwards, and that’s where you want the heat to go since you have your actual stove on the top of the hot bricks

[Anonymous No.1979574]

>>1979449
heat can only solve simple up-down mazes. Once you start getting left-right involved it doesn't know what to do and just gets stuck in one of the corridors, unable to find the exit.

[bump No.1979594]

>>1979449
how do gasses work?

[Anonymous No.1980605]

>>1979594
Help me understand, I know hot air raises and vice versa, but why is that any better than a left and right zig zag route? I know how it would go up, I don't understand how the fuck does it go down in the middle?

[Anonymous No.1980661]

>>1979276
Why build one of these instead of just getting a cast iron wood stove? If you want thermal mass then you could just surround the cast iron stove with bricks then.

[Anonymous No.1980736]

>>1979276
>>1980661

Pic shown the energy output of a woodfire made with 4kg of wood. which contains 16kwh of energy.
when the wood is burned with enought oxygen in a complete combustion it burns in about 80minutes.

a typical cast iron stove is rated for 8kw and the stovepipe ads 1kW. but the wood releases up to 20kW at its peak.

this means you can either close the air of the stove and starve the fire of oxygen but then you get a incomplete combustion loose energy and polute the air.
or you overdrive the stove by 250% possibly damaging it, and youre room will get way to hot meanin you have to open a window, and you also loose energy because of high exhaust temperatures.

cast iron stoves got popular in the 1850 when people started using coal as fuel, coal can once it burns be adjusted by starving it of air without the problems wood has.

[Anonymous No.1980743]

>>1980605
it goes down because of vacuum.
there is a small hatch at the front, not the main fireplace, but on the exit pipe.
before you fire up the oven you burn something in that small hatch so the air starts flowing. the hot air goes up. the drop in pressure sucks the rest of the air through the duct.

[Anonymous No.1980747]

>>1980736
also with a cast stove you need to put in new wood all the time, if the fire goes out it gets cold quickly again.

this diagram shows a wood fire burning in about 1½ hour releasing 22Kw at its peak. the tilled oven reaches inside temperatures of 1800°C and outside temperatures of 60°C, it then heats youre room for up to 16 hours with 2kW which is what most electric space heaters have.

[Anonymous No.1980761]

>>1980661
that was widely done in the 70s here, they got fired with coal, the house dust gets charred on the hot surfaces and gets cancerous, with wood they have terrible emissions.

a real tilled oven is designed to burn 3ft long logs in a verry short time,
traditional tilled stoves often come without air regulators while burning the door was wide open after the wood has burns the door was closed.

[Anonymous No.1980764]

>>1979276
>comfy

[Anonymous No.1983069]

>>1980661
Because the extended duct is so much more area for heat transfer. Cast iron is shit to work with while 1/4" sides and a 5/16" steel top plate and floor would last the ages so the slick solution would be to copy the Russian stove in steel plate with the top and bottom connected at a bolted flange for easy and complete cleaning. Stoves are generally welded boxes because that's cheaper but a weldor could DIY a beast (and many weld all sorts of badass stoves to keep their shops warm). Of course metal is more expensive than masonry and stoves are to save money.

[Anonymous No.1983685]

>>1979276
if you can't sleep on it then its not a real pechka

[Anonymous No.1984163]

>>1979276
There are plans for modern ones all over the place. You just need to use meme terms like "rocket mass heater"

[Anonymous No.1984443]

As a russian speaker, I can reveal some of this magic (you should use some translator, of course).
https://clubpechnikov.ru/otopitelnye-pechi/
http://eng.stove.ru/products

[Anonymous No.1984764]

>>1984163
how long does the barrel last.? the hottest part of the combustion hitting 0.5mm uncoated steel.

[Anonymous No.1984767]

>>1980605
With left/right zig zag all the air goes the same route from the fire to the chimney.
With up/down you get a "sorting" effect, where the hot air gets stuck at the top until it releases most of its heat and only goes up the chimney once it has cooled. This is the "bell" design, but >>1979376 has pretty small bells so I don't know how effective it will be at holding the hot air since the draft will try to suck it up the chimney.

[Anonymous No.1985186]

Thanks to this thread I've been watching hours of Russian youtubers build masonry heaters and stoves and I don't understand a word of what they are saying. It's pretty cool stuff though.

[Anonymous No.1985247]

>>1985186
You can turn auto captions

[Anonymous No.1985707]

>>1979376
The thing I always wonder about these designs is how does the soot not build up in the low spots? How are you ever supposed to clean these?

[Anonymous No.1985711]

>>1985247
>be of so where ten wimble breakfast drumwell henceforth illiterate monkey is comprised of many parks where be is tiki tiki tembo

[Anonymous No.1985735]

>>1985707
Vertical passages are less prone to soot build up, but it happens nevertheless, so in some places of the "pech" so called "cleaning doors" are installed for cleaning out the soot with some long and flexible tool. In the stove scheme I've posted >>1984443, for example, they are in the back-bottom, front-middle and left-bottom.

[Anonymous No.1985737]

>>1985735
In the worst case, you may take out one brick by moistening the clay cement and scratching it out with some chisel, clean the stove through this hole and put it back. Moreover, cleaning the stove should be done after every heating season.

[Anonymous No.1988688]

>>1980605
fresh smoke keeps coming in, which helps it overflow on the other side

[Anonymous No.1988989]

>>1985735

I want those manuals for Russian stoves. My dream home in the middle of Northern Ontario would have a big Russian/Rocket Stove in the middle heating the immediate rooms and then everything else heated with hydronic radiant heat piped through the stove. Ultra efficient whole home heat with just wood I can pick up in the surrounding forest. It's a silly dream but it's my dream dammit.

[Anonymous No.1989904]

>>1988989
There are stove schemes and drawings with integrated boilers and water heaters on the sites I gave the links to. For example,
http://eng.stove.ru/products/kotlyi
http://eng.stove.ru/products/kotlyi_dvuhkonturnyie
The first site (https://clubpechnikov.ru/otopitelnye-pechi)) contains schemes and also general instructions for clay cement proportions, stove foundations and so on. Don't be lazy and read it through Google translate. I can also give some more links to scanned russian books on this topic.

[Anonymous No.1990289]

>>1989904

Thank you friend. I can ask my dad to help translate, he learned Russian in the Army back home.

[Anonymous No.1992305]

bump

[Anonymous No.1992706]

>>1979548

>Well for one, heat travels upwards

Wrong.

Heat travels from hot to cold.

Hot air rises because it is less dense.

t. 'member high-school science?

[Anonymous No.1994202]

>>1979276
Have you ever Youtube "Rocket Mass Heaters? They seem to be easier to build than this. They use 85% less wood, my friend in Ohio has one in his basement when I told him about them, he built it!!! Cheap build, very GREAT HEAT.

[Anonymous No.1995584]

>>1994202
No OP here. I've seen rocket mass heaters but they don't seem to be able to incorporate an oven and stove top like the masonry heaters unless there's something I've missed.

[Anonymous No.1996456]

Bumping cause mass heaters deserve more attention.

Back in the day in the rural areas here it was a thing to make a tilled stove (like a normal cooking one) with a thermall mass being built into a central wall. In the effect the stove when heated up during the day worked as a big ass radiator through the night (or whatever).

[Anonymous No.1996607]

>>1988989
if it weren't for our government, canada would be the worlds best place to go live off the land like that.

[Anonymous No.1996622]

>>1979276
>russian
I much prefer the German, thanks

[Anonymous No.1997105]

>>1979276
I always really liked these things
Theres a bunch of stories of people sleeping on them and being extremely comfortable

The chinese made them too, really big ones that would heat entire buildings such as inns far in the cold mountains and people would sleep on them

[Anonymous No.1997108]

>>1997105
bed stoves are neat
Here's an American guy on one in a Chinese Inn
Must be pretty neat to travel to foreign lands in the past and stay at comfy inns that have warming beds

[Anonymous No.1999350]

>>1996456
do provide sources anon, or at least names

[Anonymous No.1999697]

>>1999350
For example here's a stove placed in a wall (you will need to google translate that shit):
https://www.kominki.org/piece-kaflowe/technika-zdunska/art,5083,scianowka-podlaski-piec-pokojowy.html

But that's just a tiled stove, my grandmother had in her house a cooking stove where the smoke channel was passed through a tiled wall being a piece of the house central wall, something like:
https://www.kominki.org/piece-kaflowe/technika-zdunska/art,4932,piece-podlaskie.html

From what i heard that was a popular solution in my region (it was kinda cold out here in the dead of winter) in "ye olden days when" people rode velociraptors for sport.

[Anonymous No.1999715]

>>1999697
o dzięki stary, akurat rozumiem polski hahah

[Anonymous No.2000893]

>>1984163
rocket mass heater is bottom burning mass heater built with a barrel because its cheap
go here, google translate
czysteogrzewanie.pl/podstawy/rodzaje-kotlow-weglowych/
they show you diagrams of bottom and top burning boilers
instead of heating water you can heat thermal mass
or both
I'd go with both if your system can take it but for that you need high pressure system with water tank and appropriate heat exchangers and pumps, you cant just hook it up to radiators