/diy/ - Do It Yourself

[Anonymous No.1315315]

>want to get into electronics
>already have the soldering setup I want figured out
>start reading about the dangers of lead poisoning and crosscontamination
>everyone says lead free solder is shit + tin whiskers
>become insecure and sad

How bad is lead really? And is lead free solder that much of a shit or is bashing it a meme?

[Anonymous No.1315318]

Can you stop misusing the word 'meme' please? This place doesn't need to be any more like r*ddit than it already is.

And you'll be fucking fine. Use the leaded solder, just don't breathe in the smoke. It's not going to suddenly poison you and if you're anything like any other 4chan user you're never going to use it enough to get there without literally trying to get poisoned.

[Anonymous No.1315326]

>>1315318
Soldering irons do not get hot enough to vaporize lead. The smoke you see is from the flux and does not contain lead. There are other nasty chemicals in it though; but those are usually worse in lead free-solder. Lead is being phased out to protect the environment from the billions of electronic device we dispose of. It's not being done for the safety of hobbyists and assemblers. With lead solder you should wash your hands afterwords and not eat at the same table. Also don't let toddlers near it; the stuff tastes like candy.

[Anonymous No.1315328]

>>1315315
I've been soldering for 20+ years, and I've seen a lot of people over ready about lead. Lead is like get poison. If a rat ate an entire box of rat poison in one sitting, it would walk away happy and full. However, if that same rat ate just a little bit of the box today, and a little bit tommorow, etc, then it would be dead before the week is up.

Likewise, if you eat some lead solder, you'll be fine. If you inhale the solder and flux smoke one day, you'll be fine. If you inhale the smoke for a few hours a day, everyday for a month straight, then you may be able to poison yourself.

Do like I do and hold your breath when soldering. It will keep you from inhaling the smoke, and it will keep you from blowing on the solder joint. Win-win. Also, wash your hands when you're done, just for good measure. Skin contact with solder doesn't really pose a threat, but if you immediately eat without washing your hands it's no longer just skin contact.

[Anonymous No.1315338]

>>1315315
Lead free solder is garbage. Use leaded solder. Don't rub it in your eyes or eat it. Wash your hands when you are done. Use some kind of ventilation to reduce the fumes from flux.

[Anonymous No.1315341]

>>1315328

prediction: this one post will take on a life of its own, and weeks from now will the arguments will still be raging as to whether or not you are an idiot.

[Anonymous No.1315342]

You're not a commercial enterprise who needs to follow RoHS regulations.
>insecure and sad
Stop being a pussy and just go with leaded solder. You are not going to hurt yourself, you aren't inhaling lead gas, you aren't eating lead particles. Just wash your hands when you are done work, and don't eat at your desk. Or do, idgaf.
It's not a "meme" when people say lead solder is shit, it's because it's harder to work with.

[Anonymous No.1315353]

>>1315341
So which side are you on? Idiot or not?

[Anonymous No.1315354]

>>1315315
as above i gues.

i use an outflow, but also a chemical filtered gasmask. you can switch diffent airfilters, from partical to chemicals etc. if you will be etching boards you should use this etc. but nowdays its cheaper to load up the schematic and order boards.

[Anonymous No.1315362]

>>1315326
>>1315328
>>1315338
>>1315342
What about cleaning the flux? I'll have to rub with some microfiber cloth or brush. Am I supposed to throw them out because they have lead now? If not, where am I supposed to wash them? I don't want lead near my family's bathroom or in the fauced. It just seems too much of a hassle, I'm not at a workshop, I'm in a flat.

Can the caveats of leadfree solder be mitigated in some way?

[Anonymous No.1315384]

>>1315362
get no clean flux and skip the cleaning
Clean with rubbing alcohol and nylon brush

[Anonymous No.1315386]

>who cares about brain damage if I can get muh shiny joint?

lmao, go lead free OP.
https://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1174752-overview

[Anonymous No.1315388]

Use leaded solder, lead free sucks. Just don't eat food while soldering and wash your hands after. If your going to be doing a lot of soldering, you probably want to do it in a place where you'll never eat food, because lead accumulates in your body so it's good to be careful. The smoke when the solder melts is the flux (probably rosin) there is no lead in the smoke. I don't know much about any other fluxes but rosin is somewhat an irritant, I just breath it in anyway because I like the smell, but if you have asthma or whatever you might want to get a small fan

Good luck with electronics :)

[Anonymous No.1315389]

>>1315362
You're worrying way too much about this.
You will probably have more lead contact from using your leaded brass housekeys than you'll ever have from playing with electronics. If your flat is old enough it probably has lead solder in the plumbing.
Just buy a dollar store toothbrush and use it only on circuit boards. No you don't have to throw it out, or wash it, keep it for electronics and don't brush your fucking teeth with it.
You're not going to put your family in danger by cleaning up in the bathroom.

If you're that scared and afraid of the "hassle" just get non-leaded solder and /thread this shit.

[Anonymous No.1315401]

>>1315386
>lead poisoning is totally a huge threat and you'll totally get it the first time you touch lead solder!
lmao, learn how that shit actually works and then come back.
>guys, you can't go outside when it's below freezing! You'll freeze!

[Anonymous No.1315411]

>>1315401
>muh first time
It's a hobby, retard, you'll touch it many times.

[Anonymous No.1315413]

>>1315411
'many' isn't enough to get lead poisoning. Even casting your own lead bullets on a regular basis for years isn't going to give you lead poisoning, and that deals with ACTUAL, PURE lead. It's a completely overblown concern, and as long as you don't literally fucking eat it or lick your hands constantly while soldering, you will not get lead poisoning.

[Anonymous No.1315419]

>>1315413
You stop soldering and go wash your hands, you open the door, bam, there's lead on the door handle now, you turn on a light or something and bam, there's lead on the switch, you open your faucet and bam, there's lead there too. You wash your hands and then close the faucet, you now have lead in your hands again. If you live with other people, they'll catch it too. That's literally cross contamination.

[Anonymous No.1315421]

>>1315318
What a fucking stupid reason to be mad.

[Anonymous No.1315425]

>just use lead solde-
https://io9.gizmodo.com/5877587/the-first-artificial-sweetener-poisoned-lots-of-romans

[Anonymous No.1315434]

>>1315419
How much lead has to be in your body before you are "poisoned"?

Is one part per million enough? One part per billion? One part per trillion? I think that we can agree that a single lead atom isn't quite enough. So how much then? In your opinion.

[Anonymous No.1315438]

>>1315434
The less the better. This shit is dangerous, you repair a mobo, put it into the pc case, turn it on and bam, lead dust coming out of the case through airflow and straight into your nose constantly.

[Anonymous No.1315439]

>>1315419
Yeah if you paw at everything like a retarded animal.
If you're careful you can clean up without getting lead on everything.
Take everything you just said and apply it to stomach viruses. You're basically saying there's no point in cleaning up because you're doomed from the start. Your concerns are way overblown.

[Anonymous No.1315442]

>>1315439
How do you clean lead dust from a surface?

[Anonymous No.1315444]

>>1315438
You're missing the point that >>1315439 is making. You are subjected to lead everyday. Your filtered drinking water has more lead in it than you will ingest from a whole day of soldering and wiping your hands on everything. You are literally ingesting lead right now! But you fail to recognize the importance of the magnitude of what you're ingesting.

If you're so fucking scared, why don't you just wear gloves while handling solder?

[Anonymous No.1315445]

>every electronics youtuber having deformities, twitches and odd stuff
>the EEV guy looks like is on literal mushrooms when talking and makes retarded down syndrome facial expressions
Yeah, I'll stick to lead free.

[Anonymous No.1315447]

>>1315444
>Your filtered drinking water has more lead in it than you will ingest from a whole day of soldering and wiping your hands on everything.
But my pipes don't contain lead.

>You are literally ingesting lead right now!
Through air? And how is it comparable to straight up lead dust from solder wire?

[Anonymous No.1315450]

>>1315447
You know, at first i thought you were actually serious and concerned, but now I know you're a troll.

You know that, even though there is an fda limit to how much lead can legally be in the water system, that doesn't mean the amount of lead in the drinking water is zero.

>inb4
MY drinking water doesn't have lead.
None of MY walls have a layer of lead paint in there somewhere.
I'VE never taken a breath anywhere near an automobile.

Fuck off troll. Don't solder anything ever. Leave it to all the older more experienced people, like pic related.

[Anonymous No.1315451]

>>1315450
Are you literally living in the 50s? Lead plumbing is banned for intakes, lead paint is banned, gasoline has no lead nowadays. And I'm the troll?

[Anonymous No.1315453]

>this thread
So I'm not supposed to have a lead pipe in my distiller? It gives a sweet tasty flavor to the distillate. How serious is this?

[Anonymous No.1315457]

>>1315451
Yah, you're definitely the troll. You're feigning like you think all of the lead in the world magically disappeared.

We don't even have a lead test sensitive enough to detect more than 3-5 ppm of lead, but you are literally trying to worry about single atoms.

And where does this 'dust' come from that you are convinced is constantly blowing off of electrical connections? You know liquid solder sets in to a single solid metal, right? RIGHT? Are you planning on filing down each solder connection or something?

You're either a troll, or you really are too stupid to solder.

[Anonymous No.1315458]

>>1315457
*detect LESS than 3-5 ppm

[Anonymous No.1315460]

>>1315457
>And where does this 'dust' come from that you are convinced is constantly blowing off of electrical connections?
Just by handling dust you can notice your hand getting dusty, it somewhat dissolves into dust, it's a very soft metal.

[Anonymous No.1315463]

>>1315460
handling lead*

[Anonymous No.1315464]

>>1315451
You know what they make the little weights to balance your tire from?

[Anonymous No.1315466]

>>1315460
Again, either trolling or really this dumb.

[Anonymous No.1315472]

>this concerned about lead

>doesn't realize that flux poses a much bigger risk

[Anonymous No.1315476]

>>1315472
>lead
>brain damage

>flux
>err... muh asthma I guess
>muh skin irritation

I'd get asthma over becoming retarded any day.

[Anonymous No.1315496]

>>1315476
>over becoming retarded
You're too late for that.

[Anonymous No.1315507]

>people used to make cutlery and drinking vessels out of lead, lead water pipes, lead makeup, lead windows, lead fishing weights

Lead obviously isn't good for you, but it takes daily exposure over years in much higher amounts that you'd ever encounter in hobby electronics to have an effect.

[Anonymous No.1315513]

Sometimes I wonder: when anon posts "I've been using leaded solder forever and it seems fine to me", is it the truth or has it just poisoned them enough that they can't tell their mind is going?

This thread has definitely answered that question.

[Anonymous No.1315519]

>>1315315
when i use lead solder i blow on the joint I'm soldering to avoid inhaling the smoke, and disperse it. you can go all out and use a filter but i find a cracked open window and my blowing technique is ok.
>inb4 blowjob references i give amazing blowjobs fuck off

[Anonymous No.1315529]

>>1315507
t. poisoned man

[Anonymous No.1315873]

>>1315529
>muh California sticker
Oh no, I smelled a glass of wine, guess I'm drunk now
t. (you)

[Anonymous No.1315877]

>>1315513
probably has more to do with their parents letting them eat paint chips as a baby

[Anonymous No.1315880]

>>1315315
lead is not going to hurt you unless you swallow small pieces of it often enough

and silver solder is good

[Anonymous No.1315992]

>they don't add small musical grade rosin bits to their tobacco to get wonderful flavor
>b-but muh irritant

[Anonymous No.1315995]

>>1315318
A meme is literally a thought or idea that spreads between people.

This guy literally thinks memes are restricted to image macros and lulzcats.

[Anonymous No.1316005]

>>1315315
Lots of things are poisonous. Brass has lead in it, a lot of paints have cadmium in them, car exhaust has manganese, aluminum is possibly neurotoxic, stainless steel has nickel and chromium in it, the list goes on. The human body can tolerate it so long as you don't go out of your way to eat/inhale those things. Wash your hands, don't pick your nose. Get some 60/40 solder and have fun.

[Anonymous No.1316009]

>>1315519
The smoke doesn't have any lead in it, look it up. Enjoy your cold joints.

[Anonymous No.1316027]

>>1315318
The dude used meme in a much more proper sense than it gets thrown around in these days, and you get mad. I was actually pretty pleased to see it being used properly for a change.

[Anonymous No.1316063]

>>1315386
>who cares about brain damage if I can get muh shiny joint?
Unironically this. Everyone's IQ drops to zero eventually.

[Anonymous No.1316083]

>>1316063
>In this patient we can see the effects of lead neurotoxicity
>He has no longer the ability to make correct judgement when faced with a choice such as either preserving his health at the expense of a non-shiny joint or poisoning himself for a shiny bit of metal.

[Anonymous No.1316087]

>>1316083
>being so much of a coward that you're unwilling to trade your health for aesthetics
Enjoy your boring ugly life, prole.

[Anonymous No.1316110]

You can also use a vacuum cleaner with the wide attachment to suck fumes away. I don't mind the noise since I wear foamies out of habit (aircraft mech) so no interference with concentration. I do it because I dislike smoke in my face working in close quarters.

Safety is easy with forethought. My bros wife had to get chelation therapy because her white trash father cast bulk lead bullets indoors.

You will die anyway.

[Anonymous No.1316121]

>>1316110
>My bros wife had to get chelation therapy because her white trash father cast bulk lead bullets indoors.
>>1316009
>The smoke doesn't have any lead in it, look it up. Enjoy your cold joints.

So which one is it?

[Anonymous No.1316136]

>>1316121
It's both.

[Anonymous No.1316143]

>>1315315
People were using leaded solder for over 100 years. I know literally 0 (none!Zero!) cases of death / lead poisoning due to excessive use of leaded solder.
You will be fine.

[Anonymous No.1316175]

>>1316121
It's because he was casting lead in the kitchen and probably using the frying pan and ladle for it. I can picture the asshole now, just crack the can of chili right on top of the lead, cooks it fast.

The lead is a contact risk. You are thousands of degrees away from vaporizing the lead where it would be an inhalation risk.

The rosin is an inhlation risk, and may be bonded with oxidized lead... So no, don't breath that shot in, get a fume extractor.

The big cloud of smoke is rosin, not vaporizng lead.

[Anonymous No.1316734]

>>1315318
>picrelated.jpg
Litteral OM yelling at cloud.
I hope your kind will die soon so we can get those frequencies back for relevant use

[Anonymous No.1316780]

>>1315315
Leaded solder smoke gives me a huge headache that lasts for hours

Just rmemeber that we used to use leaded gasoline and people sitting in traffic had high levels of lead in their blood. It damages you over a long period of time staying in your system.

Soldering at home won't ever elevate your levels to anything super dangerous even if you are breathing the smoke.

It's like every other thing you breath in you shouldn't, brake cleaner, cutting fluid/coolant, sawdust etc etc

[Anonymous No.1316796]

>>1315445
Or he is just a spaz engineer

[Anonymous No.1316925]

Are there any instances of soldering hobbyists having a high enough amount of lead in their body to do harm after touching lead-solder joints every day or so? If you're really worried then wear gloves and maybe even a respirator, but I really don't think it will be significant. But note that it is an accumulative poison.

[Anonymous No.1316992]

>>1315315
Exhale when you are doing an actual solder joint and wash your hands when you are done. Lead free is aids, buy 63/37 rosin core.

[Anonymous No.1317168]

>>1315315
Don't breathe the smoke

[Anonymous No.1317192]

>>1316780
The smoke is from the flux, not from the solder itself. The iron doesn't get hot enough to vaporize lead.

[Anonymous No.1317240]

>>1316992
>2018
>rosin
Enjoying your long and tedious clean ups?

[Anonymous No.1317241]

>>1316780
>>1317168
I unironically feel safer smelling acetone or rosin than lead. At least those are not accumulative.

[Anonymous No.1317321]

>>1317192
>>1317241
I'm not sure how much lead is actually in soldering vapours, but from the small amount of research I did it wasn't significant. But it would be pretty easy to test by melting some solder in a small, closed environment with a beaker of nitric acid and testing the solution for concentration of lead ions.

[Anonymous No.1317439]

>>1317240
>a minute or two with a toothbrush and IPA
>long and tedious
hmm
that said, no-clean fluxes are nice. water-soluble fluxes are a nice compromise between stronger activity and easier cleaning

>>1317241
>acetone
the body generates several grams of this a day. it won't even notice unless something happens to get dragged in with the acetone
>rosin
it's not the rosin that'll getcha, it's the acid activator. HBr fumes are bad, mkay

[Anonymous No.1317507]

>>1317168
y tho

[Anonymous No.1317510]

>>1315425
Or you could try not eating it, and instead use it to connect electronic components to a PCB.

If everything we expose ourselves to was okay to eat then people would be eating Tide pods.

[Anonymous No.1317617]

>>1315328
as a kid i used to open up those button cells, and play with the liquid merc. How fucked am I?

[Anonymous No.1317638]

>>1317617
You aren't fucked at all. Relax, are fine.

[Anonymous No.1317647]

>>1315328
>>>1315315 (OP)
>I've been soldering for 20+ years, and I've seen a lot of people over ready about lead. Lead is like get poison. If a rat ate an entire box of rat poison in one sitting, it would walk away happy and full. However, if that same rat ate just a little bit of the box today, and a little bit tommorow, etc, then it would be dead before the week is up.

Wait, what?

[Anonymous No.1317689]

>>1317647
Cumulative poison. That's how rat poison works and that's how lead poisoning works.

[Anonymous No.1317702]

>>1317689
Also how 4chan works

[Anonymous No.1317790]

It's not that bad, just ventilate properly and wash your hands afterwards. Lead is treated so seriously mostly for liability reasons (ie quarantining houses with lead paint found in them)

t. airgun shooter and reloader

[Anonymous No.1317799]

>>1317790
Wear gloves. Nitrile is dirt cheap and worth having for countless other jobs anyway.

[Anonymous No.1317800]

>>1315445
>>1316796
His voice is sandpaper on my eardrums

[Anonymous No.1317802]

>>1315315
>lead poisoning
that fact that you are concerned of this meme is shocking
kys ASAP

[Anonymous No.1317837]

>>1317689
But it doesn't mean it's more deadly to eat a smaller amount of rat poison over a longer time than to eat a larger amount of rat poison all at once. Unless you mean that the rat will die either way but it will take some time within the week for it to happen?

[Anonymous No.1317919]

>>1317617
bretty fucked/10

>>1317702
the man did say get poison

>>1317689
a single large dose of warfarin causes eternal bleeding

>>1317802
>>>/pol/

[Anonymous No.1317955]

>>1315315
>How bad is lead really?
Pretty bad if you ingest it. I unconsciously bite my nails. I'm not taking chances.
>And is lead free solder that much of a shit or is bashing it a meme?
Bashing it is a meme. I've been using it for 20 years.
Lead free works *just fine* and anyone who claims it's shit just doesn't know what they're doing.

[Anonymous No.1317961]

>>1317837
Nope. If the rat eats it all at once he will poop out most of it and never be poisoned by it, where as if he ate a little every day he would definitely die.

[Anonymous No.1317974]

>>1315460
That's just a layer of oxidation. It's going to wash off even better.

[Anonymous No.1318014]

>>1317961
Huh, the more you know.

>>1317974
The amount of lead oxide anywhere is minuscule, especially if you're using flux.

[Anonymous No.1318285]

>>1315326
>not eat at the same table

[Anonymous No.1318346]

>>1318285
Ever pick your nose after soldering? Bite your finger nails? Sip some coffee?

Yeah you're fucked m8

[Anonymous No.1318579]

>vaporize lead
>thinking a metal can phase change as if it was water or something

[Anonymous No.1319062]

>>1318579
They can turn liquid, but can they turn into steam like water?

[Anonymous No.1319072]

>>1317168
i love the smell

[Anonymous No.1319077]

>>1315328
>I've been soldering for 20+ years, and I've seen a lot of people over ready about lead. Lead is like get poison. If a rat ate an entire box of rat poison in one sitting, it would walk away happy and full. However, if that same rat ate just a little bit of the box today, and a little bit tommorow, etc, then it would be dead before the week is up.
>Likewise, if you eat some lead solder, you'll be fine. If you inhale the solder and flux smoke one day, you'll be fine. If you inhale the smoke for a few hours a day, everyday for a month straight, then you may be able to poison yourself.


>if a rat ate an entire box of rat poison it would walk away happy and full

This is your brain after 20 years of lead exposure...

[Anonymous No.1319469]

>>1315326
>nasty chemicals
It's usually rosin, tree sap. Nevertheless, breathing smoke is not good.

[Anonymous No.1319517]

>>1315315
lead free is fine for your arduino hobby soldering

[Anonymous No.1319579]

>>1315413
>Even casting your own lead bullets on a regular basis for years isn't going to give you lead poisoning, and that deals with ACTUAL, PURE lead.
>PURE

The vast majority of cast bullets are alloyed with tin and antimony.
Everything else checks out. Lead is a seriously overhyped hazard. It's not an ideal thing to deal with frequently, but I wouldn't worry if I somehow swallowed a chunk, let alone the meager exposure soldering would present.

[Anonymous No.1319851]

>>1315413
>>1319579
A famous artist called portinari died because of his paints

[Anonymous No.1319887]

>>1317241
You can piss out like 3mg of lead a week. It's only cumulative if you're eating the stuff.

[Anonymous No.1319941]

>>1319887
If you've really been building it up in your system, it may take a little longer to get out, because it progressively replaces the iron in your blood. Hence, taking an iron supplement helps to get lead out of you.

But in general, you're totally right. You have to be eating it every day to cause a problem.

[Anonymous No.1319961]

>>1319851
Paints do not contain metallic lead, but rather lead salts of some kind. Soluble lead salts are far more deadly than metallic lead as they get into your bloodstream instead of just passing through you. Prolonged skin contact with leaded paints is definitely something to avoid if only because of the surface area, to say nothing of their added toxicity.

[Anonymous No.1320195]

>>1319941
>>1319961
that's why you shouldn't eat fish : )

[Anonymous No.1320221]

>>1320195
Unless you're in a particularly polluted area, you're not going to get heavy metal poisoning from eating fish. The Japs are some of the longest lived people in the world and they eat fish more than any of us.

[Anonymous No.1320223]

>>1320221
they live in suffering

[Anonymous No.1320230]

>>1320223

I mean, yeah, but anime doesn't have anything to do with their diet.

[Anonymous No.1320314]

>>1320195
I think you're talking about mercury

[Anonymous No.1320788]

>>1320230
Nice.