General Butchering/Meat Cutting Thread

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694554]

The butcher is in. Ask me your beef processing and meat cutting questions.

[Anonymous No.3694574]

In the supermarket, other than by gristle/fat amount, how do I discren those cuts meant for bbqing quick and those meant to cook slow to soften the gristle/sinew?

[Anonymous No.3694581]

What is the difference between a hanger steak and a butchers steak?

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694583]

>>3694574

There's a lot of different approaches to bbq/grilling when it comes to selection of beef.

Typically you want a more tender piece of beef it you're planning on a typical bbq/grilling/cooking of a piece of beef.

If you're looking to slow cook, while you can still use a tender piece, you're also given the option to pick a less expensive piece of beef.

Typically when I'm grilling a beef, making kabobs, etc... I'll use a sirloin (top sirloin or beef knuckle- it depends on what's on sale or how important the meal is) or similar beef. It has enough fat it in to keep juicy while being cooked, and the gristle isn't too intrusive.

For slow cooking, the fat content can be higher and gristle could be more present as well- chuck roasts and just about ANY round/hip sub-primal will be more than qualified to be slow cooked and have a good amount of flavor and a nice broth. Adding some seasonings and herbs will also work wonders with these pieces.

In short; bbq/grilling = steak/meat from a more tender section of the animal (sirloin or beef knuckle from round section will suffice). Roasting = lesser cut that has some variety of stringiness to the muscle arrangement (pulled beef) or a good grain to cut against such as bottom round (roast beef).

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694595]

>>3694581

The Hangar Steak used to be called the Butcher's Steak because the butchers would cut the piece off of the beef to keep for themselves before it would go through the processing line. They're often hailed as the best piece of beef that you can buy. It's rumored to be even more flavorful and tender than the Fillet Mignon. I've seen some poorly cooked Hangars in my day, and I've had some good ones.

That being said, I honestly prefer the Bone-In Ribeye to most steaks just for the fact that while they're quite tender, they're also packed with flavor from the bone in addition to any additional herbs or seasonings you would like to add to the beef.

More on the Hangar/Butcher Steak...
The steak supposedly got its name because during processing when a beef was cut open, the piece of meat would be dangling or 'hanging' where it could be seen by the naked eye. At least, that's the story I was told by the eldest butcher when I was learning to cut.

[Anonymous No.3694606]

what cut should i use to make fajitas?

[Anonymous No.3694613]

>>3694554
Hey butch, for years I have been getting cheap as fuck pork chops , every year they go on sale for 99 per pound about once every month or so.

This year they are never less than 1.99.
What changed?

[Anonymous No.3694617]

>>3694606
is this related to that fajita thread

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694623]

>>3694606

Depending on your availability, there's quite a few pieces you could pick from.

That being said, I'm going to assume that you have a full meat department to work with- and I would suggest the Skirt Steak.

While it's not regularly available in the store I work in, we can still get it in if needed for customers. Quite a few meat clerks aren't taught to accept the Skirt Steak as a viable option since it comes from a 'unfamiliar' section of the beef. Many times the Skirt Steak will end up in the grinder too; since modern meat cutters don't always get to learn about qualities of beef, they're only there to cut the meat and put grinds out in the cases.

--> Skirt Steak is a great choice for fajitas.

--> If no Skirt Steak is available (or cannot be ordered in), pick a price efficient piece of beef that will still be tender and juicy if cooked as a stir-fry. In this case, I would advise a using Sirloin. Since Sirloin is lean, while still being able to have good flavor- it is also not too bad in the gristle department. The grain is easy to see and use to your advantage while prepping your fajita beef.

[Anonymous No.3694633]

I thought the butchers steak was the chuck eye or chuck delmonico because there were only 4 per cow and it was not worth the butchers time to label them separately so they just took them home.

[Anonymous No.3694634]

>>3694613
It costs more to truck those pork chops and they finally couldn't afford to have that sale.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694637]

>>3694613

I actually have a pricing book right here beside me. Let me check my book for the sales prices of the pork... There's a chance your store has raised the price of the pork over what it should sell at; but my guess is that due to food costs rising due to transportation (and E-85 fuel using up some of the food for animals) and the general cost of land and up keeping of the animals.

In case I'm wrong though, I'll double check my price book to see what the whole pork loin is per pound for you anon.

I'm certain you're talking about typical bone-in pork chops from the loin/rib section of a whole pork loin; so that's the price I'll check.

[Anonymous No.3694642]

>>3694583

Thanks!

[Anonymous No.3694657]

>>3694637
>>3694637
Actually I think in my area they cut all sorts of crap into "chops" that they then sell on the cheap. Pretty sure I have seen picnic roast sliced into chops with just a round bone in the center.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694659]

>>3694613
>>3694637

Just checked my book... If they sold for .99/lb again, they'd be selling for more than $1 UNDER price to get them in, trim them, and cut them. Waste included with labor, it's surprising that they're selling them for $1.99/lb... Most likely the price is $1.99/lb to pull in additional customers and sales into the department as a promotional value. If they're getting bulk pricing, they can probably get the whole bone-in pork loin at around 1.59/lb... After waste and cutting expenses, 1.99/lb is not too bad of a deal anon.

>>3694633

There is only 1 Hangar Steak per steer.

The Chuck Del and Chuck Fillet come off of the whole Chuck Roll. There's also a piece that is cut off of the Chuck Roll called the "Short Rib". While they're not the best cuts, they're typically decent for the price you pay for them. I couldn't say that I've ever heard of Chuck Dels or Chuck Fillets being called Butcher's Steaks though. In addition, both of those steaks (and the Short Ribs) sell relatively well in my area.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694672]

>>3694657

You could be talking about "Shoulder Steaks" or "Butt Steaks". It's like cutting a "Fresh Ham Steak", if you've seen those ham cuts in the cryo-vacs.

Or, you may be thinking of "Round Bone" cuts, like they sell for Veal/Lamb use to keep costs down while you still get a little bit of meat to use for stock/soups.

Let me know as much as you know about the cut of pork, and I'll help you out anon.

[Anonymous No.3694689]

>>3694672
Pretty sure they toss in all of the above that you mention and call them "assorted chops" the top ones are normal looking loin chops then underneath there is just mayhem.
But for .99 cents a pound I never complained. at 1.99 I am looking at other stuff.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694694]

>>3694689
"Assorted Chops" is a term I can work with- thanks anon.

Assorted Chops is a meat cutter's term that is used for when they turn Loin Roasts and Rib Roasts into chops. That's where the different color comes from on the chop. The darker looking pieces with the bone in the center are from the loin section, while the lighter meat in the packs that have more bone are from the rib side.

Typically the Assorted Chops come on sale when the whole loins are cheap and plentiful when the Loin Roast, Rib Roast, Loin Chop, and Rib Chops are also on sale. It's a way of pushing out more of the product in a slightly cheaper manner while still appealing to grillers to keep them moving off the shelves.

[Anonymous No.3694705]

I assume as a butcher you can help me with this.

Venison. I live in Scotland so it's not exactly hard to find. What cut would you recommend for someone who loves beef fillet? Anything I should know before cooking it?

[Anonymous No.3694709]

what is a flavorful cut for fajitas? i usually use skirt steak or flank steak, but the prices for these cuts just keep getting higher and higher. is there anything similar?

[Anonymous No.3694713]

>>3694694
Ahhh I see. Good info Butchanon.I like the darker chops that you describe much better than the lighter ones.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694722]

>>3694705

Is the price of the Venison a concern? If not, you'll want to look for what is typically called "The Back Strap". It's a term used to describe the most tender and delicious piece on the Deer.

If the price is a concern... Let me know and I'll think of what else you could use for a tender and flavorful roast/steak- depending on how you like to use your venison.

>>3694709
Fajitas have been covered here-> >>3694623

If you don't want to use Sirloin cuts, let me know and I'll try to figure out something else for you.

[Anonymous No.3694724]

Why do you hate animals?

[Anonymous No.3694738]

>>3694724
>>3694724
Meat eater do not hate animals.Because of us there are more pigs in existence than we could ever sustain if our society were vegetarians.
Its the vegans that must hate animals.If they had there way modern pigs , cows and chickens would not even exist.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694739]

>>3694724

I don't hate animals. In fact, I only butcher animals which have already been killed. I don't work in a slaughterhouse; I'm freelance and work for friends, family, and the community. If they're going to kill an animal and not know how to properly utilize the entirety of the carcass, I find it to be a dishonorable kill.

When I break down a carcass, I will take EVERY scrap of meat off of it. The cheek meat will be saved, the bones will be broken down and used for stock. The neck meat will be taken, the fats will be used for their natural properties, etc.

If I didn't utilize the whole carcass, I could understand why you'd be upset. But I think you should understand that Butchers are public servants. We were originally derived around keeping food around for our families and helping to keep our communities alive. If there is going to be a death of an animal, it's good that the entirety of its carcass is used; otherwise the animal died in vain.

Picture related; a full deer after being MOSTLY trimmed without the final trimming for soup meat, tips, and other small pieces.

[Anonymous No.3694743]

>>3694722
Thanks very much. I don't start my new job until July so a cheap alternative would be nice to know as well. I've never cooked venison so I'm open to suggestion as to cooking it. I reckon it would be quite nice stewed with juniper berries, obviously that would require a cheaper cut.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694757]

>>3694743

If you've never cooked a gamey piece of meat, I'd advise going with some variety of a roast to first understand the strength (or lack there of) of game taste that the particular cut of meat has. Deer is relatively friendly in this regard, but I would definitely advise first attempting a roast with your venison in order to get a feel for the seasonings you'd like to use, the quantity of the seasoning, or if you need any seasoning at all (some people like to have a strong game taste as the main taste of a dish).

With this in mind, I would advise getting something from the rear 1/4 of the deer or a 'chuck roast' equivalent from the front quarter. The reason I'm going to say "Equivalent" many times in this post is because I'm not sure what terminology your butchers would use over in Scotland for their particular pieces of Venison, but if you go to a local shop, you can ask for the equivalent to a chuck roast (stringy in texture due to how the muscle works), or the equivalent to a bottom round/rump roast (more able to be cut for roast venison slices) and they *should* be able to point you in the right direction.

[Anonymous No.3694777]

Just a question about you if that's alright.

How's business? Over the last few decades in my country many independent businesses have closed down and are being replaced by supermarkets. Greengrocers seem the worst hit but I know a lot of butchers and fishmongers are struggling too. At the same time though, appreciation of foreign food, cheaper cuts and home cooking in general seems to be going up. Do you think this is enough to save or offer a resurgence to specialists like yourself, or is butchery a dying trade? Do you try to compete with supermarket prices or do you rely on the quality of ypur meat?

[Anonymous No.3694783]

>>3694757
Great advice, thanks very much. I've seen your posts here quite a few times and you always offer detailed, knowledgeable replies.

[Anonymous No.3694788]

Have you ever looked at a rude customer and thought about what would be involved in taking them apart?

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694802]

>>3694777

The art of butchering is definitely a dying art. I'm the YOUNGEST butcher that I know, and I'm already into my 20's. When I show up on the scene to cut something for a client of a friend, they say "Did your dad bring you?". I've been told by other butchers that I will probably be the last "real butcher" in my town aside from the self-sufficient farmers that also live around me.

Since there's no longer hanging meat allowed in stores, more and more of them are moving toward pre-cut or pre-boxed meat. My local grocery stores actually still have meat cutters in that break down sub-primals that arrive in boxes that are pre-sorted to help assure that cuts can be done quickly and efficiently.

I do fear that butchering will dye out aside from the mass-production slaughterhouses and "master butchers" that do the work for wholesaling companies. As a general rule, it's hard to make a living doing just butchering. That's why it's not all that I do; as I'm sure that I wouldn't be able to make a full living on it on its own.

Since I am a specialist that is called to the customer's house to slaughter the animal, I can charge a fair rate for my services. They hang it in their cooler, basement, garage... wherever they'd like- and then I come in and slice it up. I can either take my pay in meat, or in cash. For this reason, I don't really have to compete with anyone aside from other 'freelance butchers' (where there aren't many in my area).

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694810]

>>3694788
While I have not... The elderly butcher I learned from was actually related to some old school mobster action via his father from "the old country" as he would say. He always said "when you have a problem, and it follows you to work, others will take it home. That's how we did it in the old country". When I said "What exactly do you mean?" He wryly remarked "Do you know anyone that can tell the difference between human meat, and that of a steer? It almost looks like veal, if you're good at what you do."

He then asked me if I was going to eat the donuts I brought with me from the local bakery, or I was willing to share a few with him. I think you know what I did :-p. The old man was a great guy, probably never killed anyone... but he always made it out like it'd be really easy to take someone apart.

[Anonymous No.3694847]

>>3694802
Cheers for your honest reply. I hope that is not going to be the case but I fear it probably is. I'm not one of these people who preaches about supporting small businesses just to be part of a bandwagon: I really do think it's very sad that things are changing so much. Ultimately supermarkets and other huge businesses mean that profits go into the hands of the few rather than the many, and there are far fewer good trades school leavers can go into. You can't chat to the person behind a counter in a big business the same way as in a small one. Maybe I sound pretentious but I fucking lament it every time yet another Tesco opens: it's a kick in the balls to the little man. The changes made on the high street in my town just in the last twenty years are unbelievable.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694911]

>>3694847

I can assure you that the market for butchers is getting smaller. My first boss told me when I was first learning to cut that what I currently see in the store requires half as many butchers/meat cutters as it would have when he was younger-- even though we cut MORE beef now than we do then. The quality has slipped to allow fewer cutters to put out more cuts out onto the shelves.

At the store I work at (part time), we still follow the same methodology that was used by the old butchers. We're a local, family owned store that provides quality product (select, choice, and angus) beefs to the customers while also being able to provide information about the cuts, where they're from, how to properly cook them, and even different seasonings and rubs are available in the department that compliment compliment chicken, beef, and pork. We also offer ready-to-cook items such as stuffed chicken breasts, stuffed chops, bbq chicken and spare ribs, and all sorts of other items that make evenings easier for the consumer. We provide cooking instructions and methods that help keep their product fresh and juicy from our counter to their dinner plate. It feels good to know that small town life can be appreciated and effect the community in a positive way.

However, even our store is slowly becoming closer to that of a regular store that has prepackaged meats and items. We're ordering in from other companies now for some of our pork products (pre packed links and sausages) and for some of our turkey (pre-ground ground turkey). It's a shame to see it go down the tubes, but it's definitely the easiest way for a company to make profit.

[Anonymous No.3694924]

>>3694911
Would you take on an apprentice, if they were willing to work for free, but had no aspirations in the butchering business? I'm currently a line cook but I feel it would be useful if I were to learn about butchering and everything.
How long would it take to gain a working level of knowledge in the trade?

[Smith the CIA Agent No.3694948]

>>3694802
Perhaps in your spare time, you need to note down how to butcher a cow so that sometime in the future, somebody who wants to try his/her hand at butchering has a good reference book.

Also, ever heard of moving to Asia? Hong Kong has a large expat community and there's a shocking LACK of Western style butchers. There's a good quantity of Asian butchers but they have no idea how butcher a side of beef into cuts recognizable in Western cuisine.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694964]

>>3694924

To be honest, at this point and time... butchers are few enough that it would be hard to find someone to take you as an apprentice- especially if you didn't plan to use it as your career. The butchers I know are very interested in helping preserve the trade; but you might have difficulty getting one to believe that you would use it for your cooking requirements if you weren't planning on using it for the 'original trade' as well. Your best bet is a local butcher shop and asking them if they'd be interested in having someone shadow for them and offer to help them clean the shop at the end of the night for free. They might be enticed to help you because of your general interest in the trade, or they might like the idea of free temp labor in exchange for your full attention. You will lose time for the knowledge; but if you can get the knowledge, it's worth it- as it will be harder and harder as the years go by to acquire the skills.

I would be alright with training someone if they were local... But I would also be interested in doing e-mail lessons, skype, or another method of knowledge transfer if there was enough interest in the field. I'm more than happy to help keep this trade alive if I'm able.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3694971]

>>3694964
>>3694924


Depending on how hard you work on learning to cut... or how hard you're willing to work on even just reading the charts for a full beef and its cuts and locations of cuts... you could pick up a decent basis to work off of within a few weeks. If you wanted to learn to actually cut, process, and treat beefs in the way you would need to in order to sell them in a local beef counter... you'll have a long time to learn to do it well enough.

I recommend starting with poultry. Chickens and Turkeys are easy in comparison to pork... which is easier than a beef. The hardest animals (in my experience) to work with are lamb and veal due to the extremely low tolerance for error. If you cut the wrong way, the meat is practically ruined.

If you're interested in some help/tips... you can keep posting in the thread or you can contact me on youtube (ckButcherOP)


>>3694948
I have started to gather a wealth of pictures from charts I've seen over the years to help identify cuts of beef for those who are interested. I also have cooking times (general times) and all sorts of other information about beef, pork, veal, lamb, chicken, etc. that would help any aspiring cutter to move forward in their research.

I plan to stay in the US though; even though there would be a market for the traditional butchering techniques in other nations.

[Anonymous No.3695563]

I work as a meat cutter in a warehouse club so we sell bigger packs of meat. It's interesting to hear from an actual butcher since I'm basically a guy who takes the boxes of sub primals and makes them into steaks, chops and roasts. I like to cut the chuck eye steaks for myself and I only get 2 or 3 out of each whole chuck. I feel like butchering is a dying trade because businesses would rather pay less to people like me at the store level than have a skilled butcher they have to pay much more for. It's sad but it's also cheaper for customers. Meat prices keep going up. Anyway just wanted to say its interesting to hear from a real butcher

[Anonymous No.3695585]

What did the animals ever do to you to deserve this.

[Anonymous No.3695586]

do you offer any brazilain steak cuts?

[Anonymous No.3695589]

>>3695585
they were born raised to provide nutrition for human beings

[Anonymous No.3695592]

>>3695585
Everything dies. You included.
Once dispatched, the animal experiences no more pain.

[Anonymous No.3695648]

>>3695563
I'm in a situation similar to this anon's, I work as a meat clerk for a big grocery. I've managed to learn a fair bit from working with some old guys who were real were meat cutters, but they're disappearing fast. Sad thing is, it just makes perfect sense to go to centralized cutting given the reduced shipping, equipment, and labor costs - not having to train employees at the store level is no small part of that. Most customers are satisfied with the average-sized portions that the plant produces, there simply aren't enough people looking to have things specifically cut to make that service profitable.

The store where I work is particularly sad, the past couple months the company actually took out the band saw, slicer, and our production-sized grinder. So yeah, knowing how to cut stuff is almost completely irrelevant now, if people want things cut we have to refer them to a local competitor (seriously). The only things we cut are a handful of boneless steaks for a display case and even then... we have a newer manager who cross-cuts sirloin steaks 50% of the time. And if you wanted a tenderloin roast trimmed up? There's only three people in our department of ten who know how.

[Anonymous No.3695669]

I'm poor. What's the best cut for taste to price ratio? Also, if I have to buy the crappest cuts, how to tenderize them?

[Anonymous No.3695691]

>>3695669
Depends what you're looking to do, and local variations in price, but the trick to most cheap cuts is to cook them low and slow. Personally, my favorite 'cheap' cut is a bottom round roast - I roast mine in a dutch oven and slice it for sandwiches (or just serve with roasted vegetables, stew style).

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3695701]

>>3695563
Meat prices are speculated to continue their current upward rate. I don't see any good price reductions on anything in the foreseeable future, so it's probably in the process of fading out in the larger picture. There will always be specialty shops though that thrive specifically on butchering local cattle, sheep, etc. I didn't really get paid that well when I was first learning. I think I was making $7.50/hr while learning how to cut everything from marrow bones to fillet mignon, chickens to veal. I guess they ran me through the mill; but in the long run I will see more out of it than had I not learned and made slightly more. Glad you're enjoying the Q&A session.

>>3695586
I don't do any foreign cuts. I was only taught how to butcher by American standards for shop sales. Sorry anon.

>>3695648
That's pretty much how the meat market is going now. Places like your shop are becoming the normal. My boss always said that "any day now we're going to get told that we can't have any servicemen to cut, and we're just going to be in here stocking shelves when it becomes the only way for meat to be profitable"-- I always hoped he was wrong, but I knew he was right. America is becoming more and more lazy and more and more profit driven. If they can find a cheaper way to do it while still keeping the customers happy, they will. I think the local shops in my area will be the last ones in my state to give up since it's now becoming a 'local specialty service' that doesn't cost the customer anything extra... but as soon as it's not profitable anymore, I'm sure we'll ditch the meat cutters in our area too.


I'm headed out until morning. I'll try to answer as many questions as I can before heading to work tomorrow. Thanks for the questions guys, it's been fun so far. Looking forward to some more questions tomorrow.

-The Butcher

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3695714]

Last one for the night...
>>3695669

>>3695691 <-- This anon speaks the truth. If you're looking merely to put food on the plate that will be decent without spending boat loads of money, the Bottom Round is a solid choice. The Rump Roast is only ~10-20 cents more a pound, and is a little nicer... but if it's price vrs. effectiveness, the Bottom Round Roast is excellent and so is the Chuck Roast. Bottom Rounds are more like roast beef sandwich material, as the meat holds together a little nicer. The Chuck Roast will tear apart nicely like a pulled beef due to the stringiness in the texture of the beef.

On a general basis, the Bottom Round is the king of cheap, reliable crock pot roasts- especially when it's on sale. The Chuck Roast is typically cheap too when it's on sale. If you want to know other cuts, let me know and I'll get back to you about it tomorrow morning when I get up before I leave for work.

[Anonymous No.3695724]

>>3695714
>>3695691


Thank you. I will be on the look out for bottom round roast and chuck roast on my next market stop.

[Anonymous No.3695740]

I've got a question- what the fuck is up with the price of bones? I wanted some bones to roast and make a soup stock out of, but when I went to the butcher the bones were freaking expensive. I can't remember just how much the price per pound was now, but I remember just a few bones were over $5, which I can buy a 10lb. bag of chicken quarters for .50 an lb and make chicken broth out of that so I was like shit, man. I thought they'd be just about fucking giving bones away, but nope. Should I call around and ask for different prices, ask for some different bones, anything like that?

[Anonymous No.3695764]

>>3695585
Moralizing infant.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3696163]

>>3695740

There was a time when bones were practically given away and/or thrown into the garbage bins due to their lack of value at the time. Now that people are all about home cooking, there's a market for bones because of the quality of stock that they can help produce.

Typically if I'm making stock (and if I don't have bones around), I'll snag the cheapest bones possible (typically marrow bones)- I think they cost around $2/lb at the local stores.

I'm not sure why your bones would be so expensive at your local store. What type of bones are you trying to buy? I would probably ask around and see what other stores in your area are charging for 'soup bones' or 'bones for stock'. If they seem unaware (most counter workers don't seem to know much about meat)-- ask for marrow bones and see if you get anywhere. The price shouldn't be too steep... but, maybe we just have a great deal where I'm from.

Good luck anon.


Keep the questions coming /ck/, I'll be glad to answer any question I can for you guys to help out with your processing/meat related questions when I get back from work.

[Smith the CIA Agent No.3696184]

Went grocery shopping today and because NZ is vague as fuck with naming their food...

Which bit of a the chicken fillet? (I guessed breast but it looked like a deboned thigh for some of them)

Speaking of soup bones...I saw that I can order "Cannon Bones", which bit of these bones are for? And why are they called cannon bones?

What exactly is gravy beef? Looks like stewing/slowing cooking meat but what not "stewing beef"?

Would a Bolar or Topside Beef Roast lend better to simple oven roasting?

I have like..a billion and one more questions, but I'm sure I can solve the rest of then with simple Google searches. But those questions have been rustling my jimmies even since I got back from the supermarket.

-

[Anonymous No.3696362]

Quality thread!! Thank you, Mr. Butcher for taking questions. Hope to see you around on /ck/.

[Anonymous No.3696384]

I've got a butcher's shop I just discovered that's not too far from my apartment. Are there any standard questions I can ask to tell if they're decent or shit-tier?

[Anonymous No.3696449]

What's the best way to butcher a rabbit? I tried once with one I shot but I fucked it up pretty badly... I am no butcher, but I'd like to know so I don't have to pay to have it done.

[Anonymous No.3696597]

>>3696449
Nigger, is you fer serious? You pay to have game butchered? If you're gonna hunt it, lrn2cleanit.
>w/ a fuckoff sharp knife, cut around the b-hole
>make incision in belly, slice up through breast plate
>cut esophagus close to head.
>grab esophagus and rip guts out w/ swift downward motion (should come out clean if your b-hole incision is sufficient)
>cut or twist off head
>cut off feet
>make incisions through fur on inside of each leg
>pull fur off
>BAM

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697196]

>>3696184

For your chicken fillet question: There are many ways to label a chicken... I would assume that it's a chicken breast fillet. Though it could also technically be a thigh fillet; depending on where it is cut from. The naming market is ridiculous for meats; especially when going between countries. If I had a look at it, I could identify it a lot better. Is it dark meat or light meat?

I've never seen cannon bones for sale in my surrounding area. According to what I've learned though, the cannon bone seems to be the shank bone. I haven't ever used that term in the local area though, so I'm not sure if I'm completely synched up with your local butcher terms. I can look into it for you though, if you'd like. I'd be wiling to be that they are bones from the legs of older cattle though; and they would probably be used for soup/stock flavoring; just as the marrow bones are.

I would say that gravy beef (at least locally) is a fattier cut of beef that is not tender until cooked for a long duration. The idea is that with more fat, more flavor can develop from it. Since you're going to be cooking it for a long time, the piece will end up being somewhat tender too. I'd wager that it comes from the Chuck primal of the animal; though I could be wrong.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697202]

>>3697196
>>3696184

I can only answer from my experience in this field, so I would rate it as follows:
If you're roasting, I would say that the Topside (London Broil) would be better so long as you marinade it first. The Topside Roast isn't as tender as it may appear to be; as it is relatively lean. Giving it a quality marinade will certainly help. You could also roast it at a lower temperature for a longer duration, and that would help it some too.

The Bolar Roast comes from the Shoulder Clod from the Chuck primal. If you use it in a slow cooker or a crock pot, it will be an excellent cut.

You're welcome to ask as many questions as you'd like, or contact me via YouTube for more direct inquiry if you'd like Smith (my account is mentioned earlier).

>>3696362
Glad to help!

>>3696384
It depends on where you're from... There's plenty of questions you can ask to determine a quality butcher from a second rate butcher. A lot of times as long as they know their cuts, your meat will turn out fine. If you're truly concerned of their quality, let me know and I'll think of something you can ask them.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697209]

>>3696449

Field dressing is extremely important if you're going to learn to hunt, kill, and break down your game. Something as small as a rabbit is relatively simple though. I do it in a slightly different order than the other anon does; but his method would work. You need to make sure that you remove all of its intestines, its anus, and all other internal organs, tubes, and sacs that hold fluids or take up space inside the animal. The fur must also be removed. When removing the fur, find an area that isn't vital to your meat if you're a novice or beginning cutter. Once you get a small incision through the fur, you'll be able to almost pull the skin off while following along the inside with your knife. If you make a large enough incision, you can practically start pulling it off while severing the light connective tissues between the fur/skin and the meat underneath. You could always start at a leg and work your way forward toward the head. If you don't plan on keeping the cheek meat, you can find a way to dispose of the head. There's also neck meat that's good for stew. Depending on how far you're planning on processing, this might be as far as you need to go... if you're planning to debone the entire animal and cook it- there's a little more to do. If you're planning to break it apart completely (which is a little more work than a rabbit is worth in my opinion), you can ask me and I'll help you with further detail.

Essentially...
-Shallowly cut chest (as not to rupture the stomach, intestines, or other organs)
-Remove innards
-Skin it
-Process it

[Anonymous No.3697221]

Do the meat departments in supermarkets like Vons, Ralphs, etc. butcher their own meat? No Supermarket around me has brisket (I live in California). I ask this cuz I'm wondering if I could ask them to cut me some brisket.

[Anonymous No.3697229]

What do I ask for if I want to get the cut of meat to make a pot roast. Last time I asked this of /ck/, no one could agree.

[Anonymous No.3697232]

Is there any part of the cow that you would not eat, and why?

[Anonymous No.3697233]

What is a good price on crab in your area? And hwhat area are y'all in?

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697240]

>>3697221

Most supermarkets do not butcher their own meat because of the cost to effectiveness ratio. They already know that people will come to buy their products since it's simple one-stop shopping. I know of a few places that are local that do- Sam's Club and Costco both have butchers on staff, but I'm pretty sure they get boxed meat in to their location. After it arrives, they remove the cryo-vac and then cut it into different sizes- depending on how much the customers in the area are typically able to consume. Sometimes you can special order things from stores like this, and it is a great value. However, since I don't believe they have hanging quarters, halves, etc. on their premisses, I do not believe you would be able to go into a store like that and snag the brisket. You could always try special ordering. You'll typically pay market price +30-50%; depending on how hard/easy it is to get in. If you buy the whole case of Brisket, it's possible to get them to sell at close to market +10%-20%...

Also, it's hard for me to say; I'm on the East coast of the US, so I am unfamiliar with your markets.
(continued in next post)

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697245]

>>3697240
>>3697221

I know that the Wal-Marts in the local area do NOT cut ANYTHING. They grab it out of boxes and put it immediately onto shelving units. I have asked simple questions of them only to find out that they had no idea what *anything* I asked meant, or how to help me with my 'purchasing assistance' that I 'needed' from their 'qualified customer service personnel'.

My best guess would be to ask if they have any Brisket around or if they can special order it. If they can't, look for a local butcher shop. Most times they're quite experienced and very friendly. If you can keep a local butcher shop alive and healthy, they'll keep you alive and healthy too. The better your community treats real butchers (even though they're slightly more expensive typically), the better the butcher will want his product to taste and look to you.

Best of luck getting that Brisket though! It's a great cut.

>>3697232

I do not like to eat Offal/Organs... I don't know why; as I don't mind using them to make some delicious gravy and other dishes. Just something about tripe has always bothered me... I've had tongue, heart, liver, and a few other ones with little to no success outside of using them for gravy. Perhaps my cooking skills aren't good enough to get proper taste out of them; but they're not on the top of my menu ;).

[Smith the CIA Agent No.3697255]

>>3697202
I forgot to take pictures as I was in a hurry, I will try to take pics next time and even then it's iffy because they don't offer the full "list" of things you see on their online site at every store. I didn't find out about the chicken fillets and cannon bones until I found that you can order online and have them ship it to you sometime next week.

[Anonymous No.3697257]

So I was watching Chopped recently and they gave the contestants a cut of beef called Chicken Steak. Not chicken-fried steak or anything like that. It was beef. I had never heard of it. It was said that next to the filet (mignon) it was the tenderest cut of beef. I thought this was weird because I have never heard of the cut myself in steakhouses or anything. Is this a real cut of beef? Is it really that tender? Why isn't it sold more or is it sold all the time under a different name? Thanks for clearing this up butcher man.

[Anonymous No.3697261]

>>3697245
Why are you saging, bro?

[Anonymous No.3697264]

Esteemed Butcher:

What cut would you suggest for Jerky production? I pretty much solely use Flank, cut thin along the grain after hardning it up in the freezer for a bit. Every other cut I have tried has turned to fail, but I was wondering if there was some secret you might know that would work well.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697265]

>>3697233
I'm from the East coast.

While seafood and shellfish are not my area of expertise... I do have a general meat pricing booklet at my disposal. According to my price booklet, Steamed #1 cooked crabs sell for approximately $200/case.

A local store sells blue crabs at $169 per bushel for very good #2 crabs. They also sell some excellent quality and good sized (also very meaty crabs) for $289 a bushel...

He's one of the best in the area though, and will have had his quality establishment around for 40 years (if memory serves) next year.

As for "good prices", that's about the best I can assess. I don't typically buy seafood since it has a very short shelf life, and I haven't learned many recipes for most of it yet. It's not the best excuse to avoid learning the market, but I'm more worried about my own sustainment than their prices :-p. Sorry that it's not more informational for you anon.

[Anonymous No.3697266]

What is a solid fundamental butchering text/resource I should get?

I normally harvest one moose and multiple caribou per year, and I don't want to just make the standard roast and burger butchering job. I was wondering if there is a guide that discusses in what order to butcher the animal to harvest it and get all the good stuff, e.g. top sirloin, bottom round, flank, porterhouse.

Obliged

[Anonymous No.3697271]

>>3697265
Ok I'm sorry to bug you with this if you don't know or whatever, but I'm talking poundage. How much does a case weigh? I obviously don't buy by the case so I don't know....in any case I'm just curious.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697285]

>>3697257
I know of the steak, and I have certainly seen it in stores around my house. Not often, as it typically is sold as a whole piece in my area. I'll attach a picture of a chart that will show you more about where the chicken steak is from, my friend. I disagree that it's as tender as has been said (coming from where the steak is from), but it is certainly a good piece of meat. One of the best from the section of animal that it's from. It's more commonly known as the Top Blade (or the Flat Iron) cut/steak.

As weird as it sounds, it is a name given to this piece; and is therefore a real steak. If you're looking to try it, look for a Flat Iron Steak (or a whole Flat Iron)- they're an alright treat when cooked properly.

>>3697261
I'm saging (while the thread is busy) to allow more questions to be asked before the bump limit is met. I'd like to help as many anons as possible while the thread is still alive.

>>3697264
The most important thing for jerky production (in my experience) is to have a LEAN piece of meat. If there's too much fat, the jerky has some nasty pockets to it after it's been dehydrated (I haven't tried baking yet, in honesty... sorry if that's what you do). Flank steak is great if you have the money for it... I used bottom round last time I did it. It turned out quite well, actually. I got it for 1.99/lb and made approximately 8.5 lbs of total jerky weight. Every customer was satisfied. Top Round is supposedly a little better, so I'll try that next time. I'm on a bit of a budget when I'm making my jerky, so that's what I've been using.

Another important aspect is your marinade... I typically allow mine to marinade for 12-36 hours (depending on how soon I can get back to my jerky making with my busy schedule). If I can't marinade it for at least 12 hours though, I don't try to make jerky.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697294]

>>3697266

Anything you buy from askthemeatman(dot)com is a GREAT purchase. They offer slaughtering and processing videos, knives, cut proof (practically) gloves, charts, and many other resources that someone who would like to learn about cutting would find great value in. While there are better knives and materials, for their cost, they're very nice.

I'm not sure if there's a 100% accepted process for start-to-finish butchering in order of primals and what not. I was taught a few different ways... and I've kind of learned a way of my own. I don't know if it's the best way, but it's efficient and works for me. I'm sure that the videos from askthemeatman would have some variety of solidified format for butchering animals.

>>3697271
Indeed- sorry anon. I forgot to list the weight of the case. According to this, the #2 case weight is 43lbs (for 125 dollars), and the #1 case weight is 50lbs (for 200 dollars).

[Anonymous No.3697328]

>>3697294
And by #1 and #2 I assume those are different qualities, right?

[Anonymous No.3697335]

What knives do you use? What sharpening methods?

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697337]

>>3697328
#1 is a larger crab, #2 is a smaller crab. There's specific dimensions allowed by the #, but a friend of mine says they can change depending on where you are.

This is what a website told me:
All of our Male crabs are graded into different weights, and sizes, except when sold as mixed males. Male crabs are graded by measuring from tip to tip, and checked for fullness. This is our grading guidelines,

Super Jumbos- 6 1/2” and up
#1 Males- 5 ¾” -6 1/2”
#2 Males- 5”- 5 ¾”

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697343]

>>3697335

I never evolved out of my first set of knives, since they've lasted the entire time I've been cutting. I started with a set of Victorinox/Forschner knives. I prefer the rosewood handle on all my knives except my breaker.

I use steels to hone my blade very regularly, and I will use multiple stones to put an edge back on my blades. If there was a time where I had killed the blade too much, I would allow myself to use a sharpening wheel (spinning wheel with abrasive paper on it). I've been offered to use a friend's whetstone, but I've not used it yet. I find the oiled stones that I learned on to be the best sharpening method for mid to mild dulled blades.

My mentor always said "use your knives until they can't be used anymore"-- so unless I decide an upgrade is needed, I'll be sticking with my old faithfuls.

[Anonymous No.3697370]

I don't have any questions, but the thread made for a good read.

You're a pretty cool dude.

[grocery store cutter No.3697375]

Butcher, do you have a piece of meat that confounds you? I know a lot of people say a top round. Mine is the shoulder clod. Until recently, I had a heck of a time finding the proper angle. Also, I'm not very fond of the knuckle/sirloin tip and cutting it all into steaks. Trying to keep that thing upright is a pain in the ass. Sometimes I grab some scraps from the trim tray to stuff underneath it and that helps a little bit.

[Anonymous No.3697398]

>>3697229
>>3697229
Answer me bro!

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697422]

>>3697398
>>3697229

Sorry anon. I was reworking some pricing catalogs while answering questions; I completely missed yours.

Let's see here- pot roasts...

Are you trying to get it to be like a pulled beef? Or are you trying to get it to be like a roast beef that you can slice into piece for sandwiches and whatnot?

If you're going for a pulled beef, you will want the Chuck Roast. It's efficient for cost, flavor, and effect. Give it some carrots, potatoes, and whatever else you'd like. A bullion cube or two, or some other variety of extra seasoning. If you're more into herbs, you can use your herb mixtures too. It'll make a good beef broth to go along with the cooking roast's natural juices. The carrots and potatoes will be infused with everything, and it will be a great pulled beef for a dinner.

If you're going with the roast beef aspect, the Rump Roast or Bolar Roast are both acceptable choices. If you can't get a Rump or Bolar, the Bottom Round can also be a good choice- since it comes from the same piece of meat that the Rump Roast comes from.

If you were looking to do something as a general roast (not crock-potting), a Top Round London Broil will be a decent choice if you keep it moist. I typically will marinade it to help break down the tissue in the meat for optimum results.

-If you have additional questions about the ideas behind the roasts, or if you'd like different pieces, let me know and I'll try to work with you (and hopefully get back to you sooner). Sorry that you had to remind me of your post, but it's good that you did. I would've missed it otherwise.

[Anonymous No.3697432]

>>3697422
Thanks bro! Very useful information.

Now that you mention roast beef.

How do?

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697453]

>>3697375

I really don't have any pieces that annoy, puzzle, or otherwise cause me problems. My least favorite piece to cut while I was learning, however, was the Flat Iron. That clod was always a pain in the ass... The center of it has the nasty useless materials that if you cut too deep while trying to get the Flat Iron steaks, you need to re-trim the steaks to get them to be edible and look presentable to the customers. At first, it's easy to overlook it and think of cutting the Flat Iron into 3 even pieces... Once you learn though, it's not too hard to get the 2 nice sized Flat Irons and get rid of the crappy scrap in the middle for grinds or composting.

The Knuckle (Sirloin Tip for the anons) wasn't too easy to learn at first either. However, once you get some time with them it's not too bad to find the
seams and work with them.

>>3697432
The roast beef would just involve cooking the above said materials (from the last post under my roast beef comment) at a low temp for a decent duration. Making sure they stay moist is of high importance. Typically cooking medium will be fine; but if you're worried about getting sick, you can do medium well at the most. If you cook fully well done, you're going to get crap for roast beef. Once it's done, you can cut and section the meat to any thickness you feel required. If you have a deli slicer, that works nice too.

[Anonymous No.3697455]

I went to culinary school and have been in restaurants since I was 14. I have recently become burnt out on them (now 23) and I was looking for a career change.

How easy is it to become a butcher. Can I just apply for a job somewhere or is there schooling involved. How did you get started and how is the pay?

[grocery store cutter No.3697482]

I was going to ask about your knives and sharpening preference. I like Forschner. I've only had mild success with the 3-sided sharpening stone and the sharpening wheel/knife grinder is a quick fix. I prefer a 10" cimeter and a 6" boning knife. I was due for a new set of knives but I was too lazy to order them. I knew there was a stash of ICEL knives at work, so I grabbed a 12" and a 6" to use. I also brought a 8" breaking knife from home because I never use it. I'm quite happy with this setup and I have a combo steel (part smooth, part regular). I've been using these knives for two or three weeks and I haven't had to sharpen them yet.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697499]

>>3697455

If you want to be a meat cutter (not a full-fledged butcher), there's a chance that you could apply at a place and offer to take a slightly lower wage than their regular meat cutters and then work your way up the pay grade over the years. That way they might take you on for the cost savings. It's not too popular of a job market near where I live though. I think the meat cutters at the local grocery stores (when they even have a position for them) earn around $10-14 USD an hour.

In honesty, I think you'd still have some difficulty trying to get into the meat market for cutting even with your level of other culinary experience. However, knowing how to cook is half the battle of a butcher- as they need to know how to tell their customers to properly cook their products so that they will come back to the place where they got the 'good food'.

That being said... becoming a butcher would take some schooling or shadowing experience. It's not for the feint of heart, and it's not for everyone. Knife handling is a top priority (assuming your culinary experience, you should be fine here). But you also need steady hands and an open mind to not get sick while cutting your first animal. When you look a steer in the eye before it's killed, it can be difficult until you get used to it. The flailing of the animal as it realizes its death is imminent is a bit much for most people.

(continued)

[Anonymous No.3697500]

>>3697455

Dude, I'm F5ing like crazy here. Butchering animals made me very happy in the kitchen, but it was a small part of my job. I've also been working out lately with the intention of being able to throw animal carcasses around. I've been working at a coffee shop for the past year and it's killing me.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697505]

>>3697455
>>3697499

However, if you're just going to do what I'm doing... you won't have to worry about being the slaughterer and you'll just come in to tear down the animals.

I got started in the trade when I was about 16. I had started working at a local grocery store and I was always interested in what the meat cutters were doing. One of the old guys took me under his wing and taught me how to do the cuts at the store. When he realized that it wasn't enough for me, and I was ready for full-scale butchering (as he used to do), he pulled out some of his old tricks and started teaching me the methods for full processing through detailed instructions. I then was asked to help friends and family to butcher their deer when they got them. From there, it was all clock work. I'm not the fastest, but I've never had a single customer turn back a single steak or grind the entire time I've been in the meat industry.
(I hope that answers your question. If not, please ask something a little more specific and I'll see what I can do)

[Anonymous No.3697511]

>>3697500

sorry I got impatient. But on the note of looking the animal in the eye, I am also a very amateur hunter. Nothing mammal yet, just geese.

[Anonymous No.3697520]

>>3697505

A fine answer. Would you mind telling me what you get paid? And if you get benefits with your job.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697534]

>>3697482

The key to keeping knives sharp is not necessarily about maintaining the knives when they need it; but making sure that you hone the blade on a regular basis to make sure that it's *always* in prime condition. If you get your blades to the point that you honestly need to sharpen it, you could get yourself into trouble. I use my steel quite often, and I'll hit the fine stone (remember to always maintain the same angle on both sides of the blade, and never to change the angle of your knife- sharpen with the natural angle of the blade) I don't doubt your technique, but I figured I'd offer a friendly tip from the butcher ;).

>>3697500
I'm glad to hear you're enjoy the thread. It makes me happy to know that this information is useful and enjoyable to others as well as myself. I enjoy sharing my tales and knowledge with any who wish to hear about it.

I know how leaving the full-scale butchering can feel bad... I'm working at a grocery store right now where I'm mostly on the counter, but still get to cut some select pieces on occasion. Since there isn't much game being killed right now by friends and family I'm not able to keep up with my regular butchering.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697553]

>>3697520

At my current counter job... I make just under $9 an hour. It's completely dismal. I know enough to run the department, order the inventory, and cut all the pieces in addition to scheduling and maintenance of blades and tools.

I've often thought of attempting to start my own meat store for locals only... but I'm still too caught up on my college studies to do that. Plus I'm kind of strapped for cash due to my college studies.

It's sad, really. Since I butcher for my friends and family, I typically only take meat from them in exchange for the service. I've been told that I could charge around $25-35 an hour for quality processing work in the local area, so I suppose you could say it's a fairly profitable trade if you're busy and taking the cash.

Since I'm part time at the store, there's no benefits to anything- and since I am freelance for butchering, there's no benefits there either. I suppose the only real benefit is knowing that I'm always getting the freshest cut and it will always meet my specifications.

>>3697511
Geese are good for learning how aviary structures function. Feathering will be similar to other birds, and the processing will also be similar. It's a decent bird to start with. Chickens are a little easier though.

Mammals are definitely a bit more complicated and a little more 'real' when you start hacking them up. Like I said- don't look them in the eye unless you've got an iron stomach and a strong will. Old man Jack told me one time that when he was taking cows in for slaughter he caught one crying (or at least water was near one of its eyes) as though it knew the end was near. He had to leave the slaughterhouse floor and go into processing. He lost his will to take the lives of the animals he worked on because he associated the dew near its eye for human emotion or higher thought process.

[grocery store cutter No.3697570]

>>3697520
As with anything, you'll have to start at the bottom and work your way up. And grocery stores are going to prepackaged meat, so your future is limited. If you get to any position of responsibility, you'll find that it's the same old grind. I make about $18/hour, get wonderful health insurance and 4 weeks of vacation but that's only because I've been working for the same company for more than 20 years.

[Anonymous No.3697581]

Have you got an axe to grind? hurhurhur

[grocery store cutter No.3697607]

>>3697553
>At my current counter job... I make just under $9 an hour. It's completely dismal. I know enough to run the department, order the inventory, and cut all the pieces in addition to scheduling and maintenance of blades and tools.

That's sad. With your knowledge and experience, you should be making much more. I hope your college studies turn into a more profitable career.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697617]

>>3697607

Here's hoping. If I can't get a job in the field I'm studying, I'll be glad to get back into the market and perhaps open my own shop. Since I would be going by the old traditional methods, I might be able to get a permit to have local beefs hanging to be cut specifically for the customers that come in. Otherwise, I would have everything in the modern boxes like they do in regular stores... but I would open the package for the customer when they came into the shop, slice it for their specifications right then and there, and grind their beefs fresh before their eyes. I'd hide nothing because there would be nothing to hide. Sterilization between each usage and only the freshest and most sanitary actions would be used in my shop. I think it'd be great. I've run some price charts before, and if I don't have to pay anyone else, I could sell my steaks for over a dollar less per pound than other stores do on a regular basis. Since my overhead would be much lower, I'd be able to do it... overhead for large stores is most of what drives their prices up.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3697758]

I'm out for the night, but I'll be glad to answer more questions tomorrow /ck/. Leave your questions and I'll try to answer then either tomorrow morning (before 6:00am EST) or in the afternoon (after 2:00pm EST)

[Anonymous No.3697806]

I just wanted to thank you. I have nothing to ask, I am still pretty early on into learning. Eventually I'd like to work my way up to hunting and stripping the animals down to the bone, but all I've really done is just purchase whole chickens (as in gutted and plucked) and attempt to butcher it using a regular chef's knife. I need better knives for the job... but thats besides the point.

Thank you for all of the information. Thank you for doing what you do. It really does interest me. I love food, I love meat. I love cooking.

[Anonymous No.3698094]

Hey there Butch, just wondering if you reckon there'd be any butchers in the US that aren't struggling and if so, where would they be?

Over here in Ausfagia, any area that could flirt with the title of civilisation is coastal. You can't go very far without running into a fishmonger, most of which know how to turn the fish into cuts. What I'm really asking is if you took a trip to the farm belt (which I assume has buttloads of livestock) do you think there'd be a healthy supply of butchers and other such food professionals? I can understand supermarkets eating the food revenue of places that are trying to avoid looking like a backwater, but surely people aren't such slaves to convenience in the countryside as to put you guys out of business. Right?

[Anonymous No.3698099]

>>3698094
Are you just looking to live somewhere where there is a butcher? I saw plenty in Jolly Old England. It was pretty cool.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3698270]

>>3697806
It's my pleasure to help out. I know my cooking has gotten better as I've learned about the subprimals and how to properly utilize the animals that I have learned to break down over the years. It's surprising how much there is to know... Once you think you've got it squared away, you realize that there's more names for the cuts than you already know- and to accommodate those who are form a different background or area, you will need to learn those terms. Especially in the market of cooking. Try to pick up as much as you can and it will surely help your cooking and enjoyment of food anon.

>>3698094

There are definitely skilled food professionals and butchers in the livestock regions of the US. A lot of the beef that the stores order in is from North and South Dakota. Quite a few companies are completely run out of ND and SD- and the butchers that live there do well for themselves. They break the carcass down, package it, and pocket some solid bills... They're what I earlier referred to as "Master Butchers"- because they're the ones that managed to land a job with a HUGE processing company that will always need them to survive, and because of the company, the butchers will survive too. Their cuts are seen around the entirety of the US for that reason though, which is pretty cool.

There will always be some local meat cutters or butchers in every state though (I would assume). Where there's a will, there's a way- and when people want to know something or if a service is required, someone will pop up to take care of that section of the market.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3698273]

>>3698094
>>3698270

As for thriving butchers, aside from the middle of the US and the plains for beef production, I know that Pennsylvania has some decent farms for production because of their Amish and native farming techniques. There's quite a few farmers that own decently large businesses with live butchers on site. It's a pretty big tourist attraction, and there are websites explaining their way of life. They're a simple people (the Amish, that is)- but they're hard workers with skills to spare.

Long story short... I'm sure there are butchers in the US that are surviving and having plenty of profit around to keep their families sustained; but not too many of them are around compared to what it used to be. Major beef production states will have butchers, and farming states will also have decent pockets of them around. Major US cities will also have them to keep the freshness level up- but will also charge a premium for it.

Speaking of work though, I'm headed in myself. I'll be back in about 8-9 hours to answer more questions if /ck/ has any.

[Anonymous No.3698284]

I go to a Butcher in the UK whenever I can, mostly because the selection of meats/cuts are amazing, but also because he's an awesome guy who never hesitates to throw in something extra or give me a little discount when I shoot the shit with him while he's getting my stuff ready. Do all butchers do this, or just the cool ones?

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3698786]

>>3698284

Only some butchers/meat cutters are willing (or able) to lower their prices for their favorite customers. Sometimes they give small discounts for loyalty as well. But not many meat cutters (or butchers) that I know offer any incentive for your laughter or for your regular business. They might try to help you get fresher cuts either way though.

I'd say that the cooler guys will typically try to help you out more often though. We've got a lot of arses around here.

[Anonymous No.3698868]

Op,

Let's say you were getting 1/2 of a half of cattle (not rear or front 1/4)

What cuts and approx amounts would you prefer given a hanging weight of 700lbs?

>choose wisely; you are being judged

[Anonymous No.3698890]

Prime Rib or Filet Mignon: which is the classier cut of meat?

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3698955]

>>3698868
This question is sort of rigged.

First, a side of beef is typically 300-500lbs. For a side (untrimmed) to be 700lbs is a bit over the top for an estimation.

Secondly, it would really depend on what I planned to do with the meat that I was processing. A side of beef has quite a few possibilities for many aspects of cooking... is there any chance you can redefine your question? Also; am I supposed to be trimming the steaks? Are you looking to keep them as roasts? How much ground beef would you like to have? There's a lot to be considered when processing an animal. More than just saying "hmm... fillet here, chuck roasts"- and the like.

Also; just making sure- when you're talking about your side of beef, you're aware that the steer is split down the center, not from side to side- right? I don't really get to pick amounts of particular items if I'm just given a side of beef. It's a little more complicated than your original question allows.

Would you mind rephrasing it so I have some parameters? Or was the point so that I would analyze the approximate portions of the meat per side and pick the 'better' of the two? The primals are sort of linked to the size of the beef; so again my choices are sort of limited here...

>>3698890
Fillet Mignon is more classy due to its prestige and its cost, but on its own the flavor is much less than that of the Delmonico. If I had to pick the steak that I would enjoy more, I'd pick a Delmonico.

[Anonymous No.3698965]

What made you want to be a butcher? I think it would be a fun career and I want to be somewhere in the food industry. I am not squeemish around blood or the like. Where did you train?

[Anonymous No.3698985]

>>3698955
Hanging weight of whole animal = 700lbs

YOU'RE preferences, not mine. However no delmonico bs.

I was going to ask if you were the namefag from before but you've solidified that withthe delmonico stuff.

>please continue

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3698996]

>>3698965

I originally wanted to learn how to cut beef when I first started working at the local grocery store when I was 16. I was always good with knives, and was always interested in saving money- I'm a frugal kind of guy. When I kept poking my head in to check on the guys at work, one of them took me under his wing and taught me the store cuts. After that, he continued to help me learn about the uses for the steaks, roasts, etc. From this point, he helped me get an idea for how processing worked; and gave me tips on where to get started. He had described in enough detail that I was able to help my friend butcher his deer every year after that without getting a steer first. I've since had time with all sorts of animals; but my first butchering job was on a deer.

I never had a 'professional' school or any sort of culinary training from a trade school; I just learned all about it from one of the older butchers and took to it. I have a very good memory, and from there I was able to place all the pieces as I was cutting them, and come out on top with a fully processed deer with minimal loss, tons of jerky, ribs, and all the tender and delicious cuts in more than satisfactory condition. The other guy always beat the crap out of his steaks, roasts, and his grinds sucked. I managed to help him learn from the first time how to skin it better, how to not use a hacksaw to get the legs apart, and many other important factors that help a clean and quick processing.

It's definitely not a job for squeamish people, so you should be alright if you're not too upset by the sight of blood. Just be weary that if you start getting into it, don't look at the animal's face or eyes after it is dead. You'll associate humanity to the animal, and you could lose your interest in the process.

If you have more questions, please ask.

[Anonymous No.3699010]

>>3698996
I've never seen a female butcher at any of my local shops, are they that rare? Do you know any? I know it doesn't seem like a typical female job. I still think I would like it though.

[Anonymous No.3699051]

>>3694810
sounds like a pilot you could pitch to HBO or BBC

[Anonymous No.3699055]

>>3699010
I recall seeing female butchers in the UK. Thing is though, its a tough job, and requires a lot of strength. Cutting meat is hard.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3699056]

>>3698985

I don't see how the delmonico is bs. Different strokes for different folks, I suppose...

Anywho- back to the topic at hand.

750 total hanging weight (dressed) means that the total weight of take home meat, trims, and misc. items will be close to 600 pounds if the steer was very lean. So I would be getting approximately 300 pounds of beef at this rate.

The break down is pretty crazy on a side since ~1/3 of the weigh is Chuck cuts, ~1/5 is Round cuts, ~1/5 is "Thin Meats", ~1/8 of it will be Loin, ~1/10 will be Rib, and ~1/20 of the meat will be misc pieces.

Now that our ratios of beef are out of the way, there's only the side left to chose. Since the short loin (where the fillet and the new york strip are from- also the t-bone/porterhouse steaks) is in the center of the animal, you need to figure out if you want the New York strip or the Fillet Mignon. Based on the volume of the steaks, I would probably take the side with the majority of the New York Strip over the Fillet Mignon portion. Since most of the other steaks are transferrable or have counterparts, I believe this should clear up the breakdown of the carcass. I will still get skirt steak, round roasts, sirloin, loin pieces, some rib meat, and plenty of chuck to go around in addition to plenty of trimmings to turn into any variety of grinds I'd like.

[Anonymous No.3699059]

General career question...

Where/how long did you train before you could work as a butcher?

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3699073]

>>3699010

There aren't many female butcher (or meat cutters) in my local area. I can think of probably 5 female meat cutters off the top of my head (2 are butchers) compared to the dozens of male meat cutters and probably 10-15 male butchers.

One of them works at my local grocery store- but processed beef at a large plant about 30-40 years ago. She's a pro, and the men don't give her any lip because she's stone-cold and could probably slaughter today if it was legally allowed to have slain cattle in the back room. The other one is a novice; but she's the best in her town. So that pretty much solves that mystery.

While they're uncommon around where I live, it's possible that there's an abundance of female meat cutters and butchers in other parts of the world anon. Just not near my house. What about the trade interests you anon?

>>3699051
This post made me chuckle. It would be a really crazy series if the man who said it was really one of the people involved. He used to be an actor and a performer for musical halls and small reproductions of classical movies and plays such as "The King and I", "Les Miserables", and many others. He still speaks Italian like it's his job, and he's a great guy. He's got some wild stories too that would certainly add to the series if it would ever happen. I think they might be calling it quits on "Stereotypical Italian" shows for TV after the Sopranos stopped though :-p.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3699102]

>>3699059

I took two years learning about animal processing and retail cuts before I had an opportunity to process my first animal. I took a lot of the two years to learn about the different cuts, the primals, the subprimals, the importance of steaks and roasts, typical cooking instructions, beef care, etc. in addition to learning how to sharpen and care for my blades.

Once that two years was up though, I had some opportunities to butcher deer (as explained earlier, my first cutting experience was a deer). I took what I had heard, learned, and picked up from various shows and watching other butchers work to make sure that I made the cuts the same, and that I had left nothing to waste. When I was done with my first deer, the guy thought I'd been butchering for years... But I have to thank the two solid years of reading, listening, watching, and a lot of helpful people that molded me into what I am today. The rest of the years have been refining techniques and continuing to work toward being a better butcher.

[Anonymous No.3699108]

OP,

Troublemaker here again. Why is the zabuton cut not more popular in the US?

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3699178]

>>3699108

The "zabuton" is also known as the "Denver Steak". It's a steak that has caused a lot of confusion in the market. I have never cut one, but I have heard of it. Since not many people in our area know what these "fancy steaks" are- we don't typically cut anything that's not very mainstream for my day job.

The "zabuton"/"Denver Steak" is from the underblade portion of the Chuck Roll. It has a lot of marbling that helps it taste good, stay moist, and have a beefy flavor. I've never had one, but that was the description I've been given on many occasions.

Since I don't sell the steak, have not had the steak, and only know where it comes from- that's about the best I can do for you anon.

[Anonymous No.3699228]

>>3699073
I've always liked knife work, and I want my career to end up revolving around food. I think it would be less stressful than working in a kitchen at a nice restaurant, and I could still be in the industry. How hard was it to get into? Were you a natural, or did you have a lot of fuck ups at first? Though I am all for more humane slaughter, I don't think the humanity aspect would get to me. I think people who act like no animals are harmed in the making of their bacon cheeseburger are dumb shits. Like meat eaters who oppose non-sport hunting. I think it's something I could be good at it is the main thing. Also I would like to try my hand at hunting and would like to know how to properly butcher meat to minimize waste. A lot more reasons but those are some. How is the pay?

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3699658]

>>3699228

It wasn't too hard for me to start. I was lucky though; I was only supposed to work at the counter in the meat department, but after I showed interest for long enough; they let me learn some cuts.

To get into actual butchering wasn't too much harder, to be honest. My circumstances provided me an in though- since my friends and family hunt deer and they didn't feel like paying someone. I was allowed to essentially apply everything I'd learned on their fresh kills and see how it went.

I took to it pretty naturally compared to what I had anticipated it would be. I thought I'd be screwing up cuts left and right; which made me even more nervous for my first real butchering attempt. I was trained very thoroughly by the older two people in the department though, and it made it much easier than I would've thought. Your results may differ though... It's not as easy for most people as it was for me to get into learning to cut meat, and then applying myself to learn how to butcher.

(continued)

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3699659]

>>3699658
>>3699228

You mention humane slaughter. In my freelance experience, it's already dead through very quick (and relatively painless) kills. Unless you're working at a slaughtering house, you probably wouldn't need to kill anything. But if you're hunting, you'll get the full monty on that one. It's certainly a good experience to know how to hunt, kill, and process your own meats in case money gets tight you could always get yourself your food. Knowing how to have a solid garden is also good; but it's not my forte- nor my general interest :-p. Most larger places have assembly lines that allow people to work one section of the animal while another works on another. That's the typical job for a modern butcher since the local shops are closing down.

The pay scale can be great if you get into a full-scale processing plant as a butcher. If you decide to take the meat cutter route you could still make decent money. The guys where I work (that are 'butchers' (glorified meat cutters) get ~$12-15 an hour with at least 80 hours a week. Typically 85-90. The manager probably gets closer to $18-20/hr... but we're just a local family owned store. You could probably make more at a larger location.

I know some butchers that charge .50c a pound for processing of animals. If you process a 700 pound beef, that's 350 bucks for spending a day cutting. Sometimes they take part of the animal as their pay in addition to cash.

[Anonymous No.3699677]

>>3699659

80 hours a week?

Jesus fucking shit. If I have to work 30 hours a week I feel like a fucking slave.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3699683]

>>3699677

My bad. 80 hours per payment schedule. I'm a little brain dead at times.

They work 40-50 hours a week. They always hit 40, but we pay bi-weekly; so typically their paycheck has 80-90 hours on it. It must be nice. Benefits and 401k plan is also included for the full-time meat cutters.

[Anonymous No.3699712]

Hey butcher, is the pussyness in this thread >>3697808 justified?

How do you like your burgers?

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3699753]

>>3699712

Humh. I don't see what the big deal is. I know plenty of people that like their burgers, steaks, and anything else they cook 'black and blue' or 'pittsburg rare'.

Though I honesty do prefer around medium myself (typically a little under, rather than over- if it can be helped)... I understand that medium rare is essentially the ultimate for texture and flavor.

Different strokes for different folks.

While food-borne bacteria can seriously jack up your day (or week)- If you've got a strong immune system and you're not missing meals and shit, you should be able to eat some rare/raw food sometimes. The human appendix (though now practically useless since we cook our food and have crazy good sanitation for the most part) used to be for handling portions of raw or undercooked meat, according to what I learned in science classes.

I don't think anyone needs to be a baby about how their meat is prepared; but everyone has their own preferences, I guess.

If it's over medium I usually frown. If there's red juice coming out, I'll usually eat it. If the center is pink with a dollop of red, it's still game. If I get a pink disk and a red center, I might put it back on for a minute or so.

--> Long story short: Prefer medium/a little under. --> People shouldn't be crying about 'lack of safety' of the burger as long as OP ate it, and they didn't. Who gives a crap if someone else eats something you don't want to eat? Is there a greater risk of food borne illness? Sure. But most of the practices for processing beef now are much more sanitary than they used to be... so I wouldn't be too worried so long as he doesn't eat it all the time.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3699911]

I'll be around for a few more minutes tonight before I head out. Ask anything you'd like /ck/ and I'll try to give you the answer in the morning before heading in to work.

Looking forward to getting some more questions.

[Anonymous No.3699934]

>>3699911
What is your height and weight?

[Anonymous No.3699989]

I work at a Sam's club and started there cooking the chickens and cleaning up. I learned how to cut from the other cutters and moved into a cutter position. We're technically called 'meat processors'. I work with a little mexican lady who barely speaks English and has been working there like 15 years. I started at $8/hr and am at $15/hr after 8 years. 401k and health insurance. It's not a bad gig. We're in a highly Hispanic area so we sell a lot of beef tongue and knuckle/sirloin tip and thin cut meat. it's a good place to get meat, it's all choice, we get a lot of cuts.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3700477]

>>3699934

5' 10 1/2", 210 pounds. I'm not a ham beast since I've got muscle too; but I could stand to lose a few pounds. Stereotypical butcher, I guess.

>>3699989

Sams Club is a great gig. Being the company size they are, you should be pretty much locked in to keep your job even with the current financial status of the US and the penny pinching stores and consumers. Sounds like the pay is pretty solid too- not that I'm too surprised. Sams Club is a quality employer with a good bit of purchasing power in the market. That being said, I'm sure they keep you pretty busy while you're in there working. While I'd like to make more than I currently make at my local gig, I'm still happy to have a job at all. My area isn't exactly a wealth district, and jobs are quite scarce. I just hope that there's more butchering jobs coming my way so that I don't have to stand behind the counter at the local grocer all summer.


--If anyone else has any questions about meat cutting or processing, I'll answer them when I get home from work at ~5pm EST.

[Anonymous No.3702152]

what do you consider the perfect internal tempurature for;

Rare, mid rare, medium, mid well, well one, "the im retarded and like cardboard"

just wondering. thought about making a thread to see who thinks what. but this seems like it just fits here.

[Anonymous No.3702154]

>>3702152
well done*

[Guardian_Wing !rqSouLGHfY No.3702216]

I'm not a butcher or anything like that at all, but I just wanted to say this thread was a great read bro. I appreciate what you do, and the information you've given us all.

On your reply to the guy asking about innards and all that, I really think that it's an acquired taste. I personally LOVE chicken gizzards and liver, but most people I know hate it. Then again, around here, if it's not "mainstream", then people tend to stay away. I also like tripe and most innards of animals lol, I'm wierd like that I guess.

I've got a question for ya though, what's the recipe for you're favorite steak (any kind)? Seasonings and all that jazz.

What's your take on hog-mause,chitterlings,goose-liver? (I love them all) Do you like fried chitterlings or boiled? Have you cut them yourself before? I tend to take a long time cleaning those bastards out, but no amount of cleaning will get the smell of STANK out of your house when you're cooking them. lmao

As a butcher, I'm pretty sure you've got damn good taste.

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3703096]

>>3702152

I typically follow standard ratings for temps when it comes to cooking beef.

~115 for 'blue' or 'extra rare', 120-125 for rare, 130-135 for medium rare, 140-145 for medium, 150-155 for medium well, and 160+ for well done.

According to health nuts, ground beef is always supposed to be cooked between 160-165 at the least. I don't typically follow these guidelines for ground beef though- I typically have it cooked medium anyway... Haven't gotten sick and died yet. But in terms of pathogens/health, technically 160 or so is what you want for ground beef. For good taste and texture; cook to your preferences.

>>3702216

If I'm going to do a marinade, I have a special family recipe that involves using Scotch or Irish whiskeys (depending on the wealth/occasion. I typically use Irish whiskey because Scotch is rare in my house) in addition to a bed of fresh, home grown herbs. I don't want to spill the beans on it; since it's kind of a family secret.

(continued)

[The_Butcher !!RFkffHyG4XO No.3703102]

I can say that it's delicious, typically uses Jameson Irish whiskey and some soy sauce in the marinade, and involves the use of garlic, a dash of parsley (mostly for look; marginally for taste), a little rosemary, and a small portion of thyme.

If I'm grilling, I typically use an herb rub with a honey, orange, or lemon glaze.

Pig stomachs (pork maw) serve their purpose; though it's not my favorite (the stomach); whatever was cooked inside is typically delicious.

Chitterlings is not on my list of favorite items. However, it's certainly a specialty item for many people.--> I would say that boiled makes more sense to me for health aspect, but if you don't like the taste, you could offset it a little with the frying. I didn't grow up with a fryer in the house, so boiling would've been my only option. Cleaning out intestines is a pain in the ass. Seriously. There were a few local casing companies that lost a lot of business a few years back when people realized that the casings weren't properly cleaned.

In regards to cutting them; since I butcher freelance and most times people hunted their game/food, they typically drop the intestines when they're field gutting/dressing the animal. For this reason, I have no experience 'properly' extracting them from the animal. Everyone that would've had me remove the intestines wanted them thrown out- and since I don't particularly like them myself, I didn't take care to save them.

I haven't liked any sort of liver, goose is no exception. Sorry Guardian.
--> Perhaps you have a good recipe for me to help me enjoy them? There's a chance I haven't been properly taught how to prepare them to make them taste good.