/ck/ - Food & Cooking

[Anonymous No.14398116]

What's the actual point of a roux when it's just added carbs? You can make a sauce without a roux by just using heavy cream instead of milk, or adding some xanthan gum to it and it's exactly th same. Were the French retarded?

[Anonymous No.14398131]

>>14398116
>it's just added carbs
It's texture and flavour, The darker the roux the more flavour flavour.
>You can make a sauce without a roux by just using heavy cream instead of milk
Yes, but it won't be the same sauce. There's a place for heavy cream sauces as there is a place for lighter sauces.
>or adding some xanthan gum to it and it's exactly th same
If you think it's exactly the same, you have some serious problems with your senses and have to be considered handicapped when it comes to cooking.
>Were the French retarded?
If this is not a troll post, you're retarded

[Anonymous No.14398134]

>>14398131
I miss my femboy French bf.

[Anonymous No.14398135]

>>14398131
>If this is not a troll post, you're retarded
Came here to say this.

[Anonymous No.14398142]

>>14398131
>If you think it's exactly the same, you have some serious problems with your senses
Elitism or autism, you decide. Unless you can explain the actual difference that's not just "omg it's #FFEBCD instead of #FFE4C4 we are doomed surrender at once!!!" that is.

[Anonymous No.14398150]

>>14398135
Can you tell me some sauces that absolutely positively need a flour based roux (and why) and can't be done with xanthan or heavy cream please?

[Anonymous No.14398154]

>>14398142
>uses different ingredients and methodology
>implies they'll have an identical end result with zero proof
>YOU need to show proof that they're gonna be different just because I claimed they would be the same despite using different ingredients

We really need to bring back debate as a required part of the curriculum.

[Anonymous No.14398158]

>>14398150
not either of them, but it'll probably taste different no?

[Anonymous No.14398169]

>>14398150
Anything Cajun, and heavy cream isn't a substitute for roux; I don't even understand this line of reasoning. It's also a moot point to criticize the French for not using xanthan gum when it wasn't even a thing 100 years ago.

[Anonymous No.14398173]

>>14398154
>>uses different ingredients and methodology
How though? The only point of the flour is to thicken things, and heavy cream is literally thickened milk. And xanthan gum is literally a thickener that replaces the starch from flour. Flour isn't used for its "amazing taste" or whatever you're imagining, it's just used because there was no other way to thicken things back in the day.
>>14398169
>>Anything Cajun, and heavy cream isn't a substitute for roux
Yeah but xanthan or guar gum is.

[Anonymous No.14398176]

>>14398150

When I was keto I made gumbo with XG, it was ok but not as good as with a roux. The texture was slimy and there wasn't the same toasty depth of flavor.

If you're a fat fuck might as well experiment with XG.

[Anonymous No.14398178]

>>14398173
>the only point of the flour is to thicken things
Can you also not tell the difference between a roux and a corn starch slurry?

[Anonymous No.14398190]

>>14398142
As I said, if you can't notice the difference, something is wrong with your senses and you need to be considered handicapped. Roux gives a much heavier floury texture and taste. If using brown roux, it will also have flavor of maillarded flour. Depending on how much roux is used, you can often see it on the plate/pot from how the sauce reacts to being stirred.
>>14398150
Not him but of the 5 mother sauces, 3 of them need a roux: Velouté, Espagnole and becahmel. Therefore, all their countless child sauces absolutely positively needs roux.

[Anonymous No.14398192]

>>14398173
>different starches are identical
>well they both thicken things!!!!!
lmao

[Anonymous No.14398194]

>>14398150
try arrowroot, its a replacement for corn starch but it's pretty sweet
fuck white flour

[Anonymous No.14398195]

>>14398178
>Can you also not tell the difference between a roux and a corn starch slurry?
Yeah I can, a slurry is added later when the sauce is not thick enough and you're too dumb to thicken things properly. It should not be used ever, if you use it, you already fucked up.

[Anonymous No.14398197]

>>14398190
>Not him but of the 5 mother sauces, 3 of them need a roux: Velouté, Espagnole and becahmel. Therefore, all their countless child sauces absolutely positively needs roux.
And *why* do any of them *need* a roux instead of xanthan or heavy cream? Just because some retard in a stone house without indoor plumbing said so 500 years ago when they didn't even have potatoes?

[Anonymous No.14398198]

>>14398173
>How though? The only point of the flour is to thicken things, and heavy cream is literally thickened milk.
Thickeners thicken things in different ways and as it has been pointed out already, flour also contributes to flavour. Cream taste different than milk + roux and has a lot more fat. That's not necessarily a bad thing for some uses, for other uses, you don't want as much fat.
> Flour isn't used for its "amazing taste" or whatever you're imagining.
You're the one imagining things here, maybe because of autism/aspberger. If you had actually been able to sense, you'd clearly be able to notice differences from what thickeners are used for sauce.

[Anonymous No.14398199]

>>14398198
>flour also contributes to flavour.
By making it taste floury, yeah. Does anyone actually like the taste of flour and didn't just adapt to it because they're too poor for a better sauce?

[Anonymous No.14398205]

>>14398195
When using cornstarch as thickener, there's no fucking need to do that in the start, you do it later. And if you didn't guess it, he meant if you can tell the difference in your fucking mouth, not how they technically differ.
>>14398197
The reasons are already mentioned. Texture and flavour. More than anything, espagnole needs it because the added step of browning the roux gives the flavour of maillarded flour.

[Anonymous No.14398207]

>>14398205
>maillarded
I too watch Babish fellow Redditor how much did you donate this month?

[Anonymous No.14398208]

>>14398199
Again, it's not JUST about flavor, different thickeners thicken differently. You're not going to get an identical end product using different thickeners, not only will the taste subtly change, but the texture and smoothness of the sauce will as well.

Eating isn't JUST about flavor, even if the sauces are close in flavor, the texture alone is enough to warrant the use of a certain starch over another.

No one is saying you CAN'T use xanthum gum or other methods, but you can't at the same time also pretend your end result is identical to a roux based sauce. It simply isn't.

[Anonymous No.14398209]

>>14398195
You've spent this entire thread asking people to explain the difference, and yet when asked yourself all you could say is, "hurr you're too dumb to thicken things properly".

[Anonymous No.14398213]

>>14398207
If you deny the maillard reaction changes the flavour of flour, then you are either a troll or your senses are handicapped and not working like in normal humans. I'm guessing autism/aspberger is the problem here.

[Anonymous No.14398222]

Should've kept to your original thread >>14395335

[Anonymous No.14398232]

>>14398209
>>You've spent this entire thread asking people to explain the difference
Yeah and no one did it yet. Do you deny that there is a clearly superior way to do some things, or are you one of those "it's all a matter of taste" people so it's completely pointless to even have recipes because everyone will do it in a "subtly" different way anyway?

[Anonymous No.14398295]

>>14398232
>or are you one of those "it's all a matter of taste" people
It is all about the taste (and texture, in this case). That's why people use roux instead of just using corn starch.

[Anonymous No.14398298]

>>14398232
This is real, authentic, non-4chan-memetier autism, isn't it?

Fucking Christ why are people against generic engineering again?

[Anonymous No.14398303]

>>14398232
The differences have been pointed out several times.

1. Texture: Flour offers a clearly distinct texture from all other thickeners, hard to describe it other than floury because it's so distinct that anyone with functioning senses can tell the difference.

2. Taste: Both browned and white roux has a distinct taste. This is especially clear in a sauce like espagnole that uses brown roux. Again, everyone with functioning senses should be able to tell the difference.

If you prefer xanthan gum to make "espagnole" or like to make lasagna bolognese with flavoured heavy cream instead of bechamel, that's your personal quirks and makes you a weirdo.

[Anonymous No.14398327]

>>14398303
Oh man, lasagna with a cream based sauce sounds fucking awful, that would end so poorly.

[Anonymous No.14398343]

>>14398232
Retard

[Anonymous No.14398367]

>>14398173
Have you just read an article on xantham gum and decided to make a thread? Be honest.

[Anonymous No.14398370]

>>14398173
>heavy cream is literally thickened milk
??????

[Anonymous No.14398532]

I just made a keto Dijon sauce with butter, a bit of almond flour, a bit of Xanthan gum, milk, mustard, parmesan, salt, pepper, and thyme, and it was perfectly fine. Why all this spergery?

[Anonymous No.14398538]

>>14398532
>and it was perfectly fine
I mean if thats good enough for you good job I guess

[Anonymous No.14398555]

>>14398532
No one is arguing that you can't make a sauce without a roux.

The point is you can't make a sauce without a roux and pretend it's the same sauce made WITH a roux.

[Anonymous No.14398575]

>>14398538
How would you have made it?
>>14398555
But it has a roux, it's just an almond flour+Xanthan gum+butter roux, not wheat flour+butter roux. Tastes the same, looks the same.

[Anonymous No.14398586]

>>14398575
>Tastes the same, looks the same.
lol no, you're retarded if you believe you can substitute two ingredients and get the SAME exact thing.

Will it be close? Sure. But it isn't the same.


Hell making two kinds of roux with two different kinds of flour will give you a different results as well. They're both roux, but they'll be differences.

Same shit when you brown your roux, a sauce made with a browned roux is going to taste different than a sauce made with a fresh white roux.

[Anonymous No.14398701]

>>14398116
flour and butter are cheap and versatile ingredients you always have laying around, and the roux can be modulated to add flavour if browned. If you got a gluten allergy or youre an autistic no carb /fit/tard of course you can replace it?

[Anonymous No.14399064]

>>14398701
>you can replace it?
With what? Everyone so far said it's irreplaceable.

[Anonymous No.14399071]

>what's the point of searing steaks again? you can just sous vide to temperature and it's exactly the same.

[Anonymous No.14399073]

>>14398134
Could've just said French bf

[Anonymous No.14399160]

>>14399064
Depends on semantics. It's replaceable in the sense that other thickeners exist, but not replaceable as in it will be the same, far from.

[Anonymous No.14399167]

oily grit defense force tripping over itself t'day lmao

[Anonymous No.14399207]

>>14398232
>are you one of those people that enjoys the taste of your food? HAH, BRAINLET. My IQ is far superior to yours, I use heavy cream because it's not about the flavour, it's about not using flour.

Ok....

[Anonymous No.14399281]

seriously i have not seen a single argument against using xanthan gum instead
>muh burned flour and sand texture
its 2020
lets actually move forward

[Anonymous No.14399316]

>>14399281
Pretty sure you can just burn something else to get the same flavor btw, why not just put some charcoal in it?

[Anonymous No.14399394]

>>14399316
ahh yes, why use flour when you can use xanthum gum and charcoal...

[Anonymous No.14399451]

>>14399281
Do autists really sense the texture of roux based flour as "sand texture"?

[Anonymous No.14399485]

>>14398116
>xanthan gum
Well hmmmm. I don't have xanthan gum. but I do have flour.

>>14399281
>sand texture
troll harder.

[Anonymous No.14399507]

I don't have xanthan gum in my kitchen but that's ok. I'll just get some at the xanthan gum store, the one on xanthan gum street. I'll better get the big pack cause I sure like my xanthan gum, nice and sticky :)))))))) I wonder what xanthan gum brand I should try next.

I'm gay btw if that matters

[Anonymous No.14399521]

>>14399281
You've seen loads of arguments, you're just choosing to ignore them. Some people prefer the flavour of a wheat flour roux over xantham gum. Flour and butter and more readily available in people's pantries than xantham gum and whatever else you suggested. Also, you can replace and substitute loads of ingredients in a dish but it won't be the same as the original, just like replacing the roux with something else.

I'm not sure how much more I can dumb this down desu

[Anonymous No.14399634]

>>14398150
I know you are asking an honest question and really don't want to be rude, but you must either be retarded, have broken tastebuds, or not cooked very much

[Anonymous No.14399665]

>>14398116
Ah yes, heavy cream, famously free of carbs.
Fucking mong lol

[Anonymous No.14399667]

>>14399073
nice

[Anonymous No.14399690]

>>14399634
So you don't know any, thanks.
>>14399665
I'm looking at my heavy cream and it has 2g carbs per 100g. Flour has 70g per 100g.

[Anonymous No.14399702]

>>14398116
>CARBS BAD

[Anonymous No.14399741]

Fuck off, Karen. Nobody cares for your meme diet, and the only one who has to be subjected to your terrible cooking is you, your 2.5 kids, and your fellow bored housewives from your little literature club.

[Anonymous No.14399786]

>>14399451
he probably made it wrong

[Anonymous No.14399828]

>>14399451
>roux based flour
are you dyslexic or does this sentence make sense in some way I'm not getting?

[Anonymous No.14399838]

>>14398116
>or adding some xanthan gum to it and it's exactly th same.

sorry I don't want to add xanax to my dinner wtf lol

[Anonymous No.14399914]

>>14399828
*flour based roux

[Anonymous No.14400028]

>>14398701
You don't need wheat flour or butter. Any flour and any fat will work.

[Anonymous No.14400039]

>>14399451
Roux-based sauces have a grainier texture than other sauces. This is easily noticeable, and not a flaw.

[Anonymous No.14400048]

Kek XG has a gummier viscosity to it than a traditional thickener. Come on OP, anybody with a palette past that of a pleb can tell the difference.

[Anonymous No.14400059]

>>14399281
If there’s a sand texture then you don’t know how to cook lmao

[Anonymous No.14400249]

>>14400028
Actually almond flour, coconut flour, and even stuff like chickpea flour doesn't brown properly.

[Anonymous No.14400270]

never seen a person worried about carbs that wasnt incredibly fat

[Anonymous No.14400648]

>>14400270
So?

[Anonymous No.14400691]

>>14398116

Xanthan gum tastes gross.

Cream does not thicken, it thins out whatever. Its a liquid.

Roux will thicken things. Whats so hard to understand? You can use different starches and fats in the same ratio for comparable effect but roux thickens stuff. Cream does not. Xanthan gives a dofferent texture and tastes gross in amounts needed to thicken sauce like roux.

[Anonymous No.14401837]

>>14398116
>using gum instead of starch
>wanting gummy slurry
ew

[Anonymous No.14402237]

>>14398116
>adding some xanthan gum to it
this is why the world hates white people

[Anonymous No.14402250]

>>14398232
>food is about THICKNESS not flavor

Anon plz

[Anonymous No.14402345]

>>14400691
Thanks for the info brah
I bet OP just doesn't know what versatility is required for most basic roux

[Anonymous No.14403168]

>>14399690
>he thinks fat and carbs are different
Oh dear

[Anonymous No.14403171]

>>14401837
i'll give you my gum slurry baby

[Anonymous No.14403184]

>>14400270
Well, when you're a fat sack of shit you probably don't associate with people that put effort into their physique. Most people who exercise 5+ hours a week are on some form of low carb, or at a bare minimum, avoid wasted carbs.

[Anonymous No.14403191]

>>14398116
Anons right, let me just get my FUCKING XANTHAN gum out of my pantry

[Anonymous No.14403243]

>xanthan gum

[Anonymous No.14403345]

>>14398116
>why add this thing to a sauce that your body can digest when instead you can add this thing that it can't digest
uh same reason i don't eat glue you toadstool eating maladapted protohuman

[Anonymous No.14404142]

https://youtu.be/k5jnmuMNr30?t=355

Could this be replaced with a keto version? How would you do it?

[Anonymous No.14404173]

>>14398134
did he have nice feet?

[Anonymous No.14404176]

>>14404142
https://www.ketovale.com/low-carb-thickeners-and-cornstarch-substitutes/

[Anonymous No.14404654]

>>14400039
What shit tier cooking has done this to you. Roux based gravy or white sauce should never be grainy. If it's grainy somebody fucked up somewhere.

[Anonymous No.14405502]

>>14404176
Does it really need one though, I made it with no flour or anything, just stock and a tiny little bit of xanthan, and it seemed perfectly fine. I made the version that only calls for the cornstarch slurry, not the roux obviously. Is the roux version a lot better?