/ck/ - Food & Cooking

>>4988159
Oops, add 2T oil to that.

Yeast is sold in packages where you are? How dreadful.
>flour by volume not weight
>not specifying flour type
>laughingbakers.png
>fahrenheit
>laughingrestoftheworld.jpg
>being this retarded
>potato.gif

>>4988169
Yeast is sold many ways here in the USA. You have the freedom to choose which kind you want.

The recipe is meant to be easy to follow and doesn't need any special equipment. You sound like a real expert, feel like contributing?

>>4988169
Dude, he was just tell telling us his recipe. I don't know what it is about bread, but I always found making it to be a pain in the ass. Of course I know practically nothing about baking and was using a recipe where you put the yeast in a separate container to rise and *then* mix it all together. And yeah, Imperial units/English units? I grew up with them and even I think they're retarded.

Any pictures of those breads baked, OP?

I've been baking my own bread for over a year now. Just started with sourdough, and I have to say, it tastes way better than any of the supermarket bread I've bought.

>>4988169
Isn't 4chan traffic mostly American? And the rest of us can convert those easily enough anyway because we're not retarded.

>>4988227
it only tastes better because its fresh

>>4988183
>>4988208
I don't care too much about measurements but when it comes to baking, particularly with bread, you'll want to measure by weight and not volume because the end product relies more significantly on correct ratios. A cup of flour for one person will be a different amount for another person because of distribution of air and you can test it out by weighing a cup of ordinary flour and a cup of sifted flour. It'll be an exaggerated result but it makes the point. If you really want to see how much of a difference there is, just weigh cups of flour at different times and see what difference there is. Many problems that are found when baking bread can be attributed to measuring in volume instead of weight and the only thing you need is a scale.

Sorry for the long post, it's just that I find weighing measurements to be very sensible. I suppose I don't have as strong an opinion as that poster but I do think it's important and can solve novice mistakes and for experts, it helps in making more complex or different varieties of breads.

>>4988227
They're just going in to the oven. Nothing fancy, just everyday bread. I had a starter for a long time but killed it when I went on a long vacation. I've never started another out of laziness. >>4988236
I suppose weight may be easier for novice bakers. I learned on the job an was taught to look at the dough and feel it to tell if it's right. My apologies. The dough should be loose and slightly tacky.

>>4988234
Not only that but I add a decent amount of salt. In the UK bakers of supermarket loaves have been reducing it year on year to the point now where it doesn't taste of anything.

Also, my sourdough's flavour is superior to Sainsbury's fake shit.

>>4988256
It looks like a Rabbit.

I bake my own. I've been trying to add in a lot more whole wheat flour because muh health. My recipe is similar to yours but I usually add only 1 teaspoon or so of sugar and I buy my yeast in a jar, so only 2 tsp of that.

I still measure by volume but that will all change once I get a digital kitchen scale.

>>4988281
Op here, I found to get San Francisco levels of tanginess I had to let my sponge go for 24 hours. Way better than anything available in my area. Did you start your own sponge, or get it from someone? I started my own and it took months to really develop is why I haven't done it. One of its babies is in Colorado, and I'm going there this summer so maybe I'll bring a piece back.

Need to get these on a rack

Yeast is the most expensive part of breadmaking by a wide margin. I am gonna make a starrter dough so I can grow yeast for leavened breads, but in the meantime, does anyone know any good unleavened recipes?

>>4988339
They came out really well it seems. Nice one!

Yes I started mine off with just organic, unbleached white flour, but yes it took ages to get going. Totally worth it though.

>>4988443
a 1 lb block of rapid rise yeast here is ~$5, a 2 1lb pack at costco/sams is like $7

The loafs of bread I bought are usually a dollar, and the french bread/italian bread is 1.79 I am sure that will be cheaper than making my own unless I can make more bread for the money.

I can get a loaf of bread for 45 pennies.

>>4988576
>unless I can make more bread for the money.

Yes, that is exactly what you can do. That's kind of the point here.

>>4988576
>this is what fat people believe

>>4988588

lol.

>>4988183
>USA. You have the freedom to choose which kind you want.

How much of a pain in the ass is it to get a sourdough culture going? I've been baking yeast bread for about a year now, but I've always wanted to move onto sourdough. In particular, I want to make a sourdough dark rye. Is there a lot of trial and error in getting your culture to work?

>>4988443 Yeast is the most expensive part of breadmaking by a wide margin

You're doing it wrong.

Flour should be the most expensive ingredient, followed by milk, oil, and then yeast.

If you're using more than 10 cents of yeast per loaf, then cut back. It'll take longer to rise. But that's a good thing because it gives better flavor.

>>4988831
Thanks! That is surprisingly good advice. I usually use King Arthur flour; what kind do y'all use?

>>4988339
y is your bread so shiny?

>>4988831
>Flour should be the most expensive ingredient

WTF...yeast is like a dollar for one little bitch-ass packet and five pounds of flour is the same price. So unless you're taking the gamble of trapping your own little yeast fairies along with all the other wee beasties....good luck.

>>4988443
>go to costco
>buy a fucking brick sized amount of red star yeast for 5 dollars
fills up a small and a large mason jar
yeast for miles, baby

>>4991304

A jar of yeast (116g) costs $4. With that one jar, I can raise 45 1.5lb loaves of bread. Each loaf contains exactly one pound of flour.

45 pounds of flour = $18 (at most)
jar of yeast = $4

>>4991302
Probably an egg or butter wash.

>>4991335

To clarify, I use less than one teaspoon of yeast to raise one pound of flour. I've used 1/2 tsp before, and it works fine, but it takes longer to rise.

5 to 10 cents of yeast per loaf.

>>4991335

Bitch, I don't want to make 67.5lbs of GD bread. I might go through the trouble of making one or two a year, so the fuck; if I'm going to get your bullshit industrial quantities of yeast. Nigga, I already told you the damn packets are 99 mother trucking cents and they are only good for one damn loaf.

>>4991358

>>4991359
>>4991363

People like you should just stick with store bought bread. If you don't have time to make at least one loaf per week, then get some Wonderbread instead.

>>4991359
yeast lasts for ages, man. don't fucking complain about a 50 cent pack of yeast if you're making bread twice a year, cunt

I've always wanted to try making my own bread, but as I've never done any food-making in my life, for some reason the concept of having the yeast worries me. Like, I'm worried I'll overdo it or something, I don't really know. Is it possible to make bread without yeast that will still taste good?

Op here

It should be one teaspoon of salt, not a tablespoon.

Maybe I will try this tomorrow.

I make my own pizza dough, I occasionally make banana bread but I have never tried making normal bread. Also don't think I have a pan for it but I might give it a try.

Will use my food processor

>>4991458

Unleavened bread is a thing, it's just not going to be a thick loaf.

Look up roti.

I've tried making bread before and it just came out meh. I think I'm kneading it wrong/too hard.

Op here

It should be one cup of salt, not a teaspoon.

>>4992143
This troll doesn't even make sense. Even the most moronic baker realizes you don't have 1/4 of your dish be salt.

I bought costco brand pao de queijo today. Fucking fantastic. I wouldn't mind making some myself, except I have no muffin tin and my only oven is a two-slice sized toaster oven. Is it possible to make those fuckers in a takoyaki/pancake puff griddle?

still trying to get the hang of baking from starter, only ever had one good loaf all the others never raise, and they always come out of the oven dough and dense as fuck, been trying hard, build a little steam proofer, hoping that helps just started a sponge, hope it turns out well

>>4994843
it takes a long time for sd to rise. also have ur oven at 450+ for the first 20 mins mane

I forget where I found this recipe. It makes a very good, light and fluffy dinner roll.

AP Flour 100% / 538 grams
Milk 79.94% / 430 grams
Unsalted Butter, melted 21.96% / 118 grams
Sugar 7.0% / 37.7 grams
Salt 2.75% / 14.8 grams
Instant Dry Yeast 1.81% / 9.7 grams

Weigh ingredients. Melt butter and warm the milk. Combine dry ingredients together in stand mixer bowl. Add wet to dry and mix on medium until dough no longer sticks to the side of the bowl.

This dough is wet enough that you can knead it with one of those high powered hand held mixers that comes with two dough hooks. Just mix it until the dough pulls away from the side of your mixing bowl.

Transfer dough to well greased bowl, rise until doubled. Transfer dough to a lightly oiled working surface, like a very large cutting board.

Gently press down dough (punching down is a rather violent description for such a gentle process).

Divide the dough into 16 equal pieces and shape into balls. I weigh each piece of dough out to 70 grams. Cover gently with lightly oiled plastic wrap and rise until nearly doubled.

Bake at 400F for shiny aluminum etc, 375F for dark or non-stick pans.

If your oven runs hot, turn the temperature down a little. If your oven runs cool, turn it up a bit.

Try not to make these too often (special occasions only), as they're rocket fuel.

>>4994847
i do, and a i have a water pan in there to help with steam

i guess i just have to let it rise longer

>>4994906
Are you kneading enough? Are you using whole wheat? Show me the recipe and explain your process.

You're just starting out, I strongly advise you to go buy a digital kitchen scale. Weighing your flour is much more accurate, as flour compacts easily.

My bread baking was terrible until I bought a scale. Cost me $20. It has more than paid for itself.

Does anyone have any french bread recipes? I like to make myself french bread pizza from time to time.

>>4988236
weight will also be different due to humidity and elevation. As >>4988256 said it is about feel and look.

>>4994991
I find that flour stored in an air conditioned home on the gulf coast tends to maintain a more or less negligible level of humidity.

Other people will have different experience, however. I'm just saying that I've never had to adjust hydration to compensate one way or the other.

>>4994931
i have a old spring scale

im sure im doing it wrong but
its just a simple
1 part flour
1 part starter
1/2 part warm water
(so 8 oz flour 8 starter 4 water)

then i let it site for a time

the ad it another 4 oz of flour& 1 tsp salt
then knead in 4 more oz of flour if i can (thats a rough guess on that last part i don't really measure the second additions of flour is should though

>>4995032
If your bread isn't rising it's probably because the dough is too dry, a weak starter, and/or not enough kneading.

Without knowing exactly how much flour (and what kind), water, etc. is in your dough it's really hard to troubleshoot what's going on here.

#1 Buy a digital scale. $20 almost anywhere. 5lb capacity and 1 gram accuracy is all you'll probably ever need, and never ever overload it (ie sit a bag of potatoes on it)

#2 Take a teaspoon of your starter, put it in a jar. Add 100 grams of flour and 100 grams of water in it. Let it ferment at room temperature. This is now a 100% hydration (ie, 1:1 ratio of flour:water). Keep it in the fridge and feed it occasionally.

The most important thing about this step is we now know exactly what the hydration of the starter is, and 1:1 is easy to remember.

#3 Find reliable recipes, which sadly, that is not. Google 'the fresh loaf' and read their forum, check out their recipes. Also poke around the King Arthur flour website for recipes.

#4 if you really want to get kinky, go pirate Excel and find a copy of 'DoughCalc' by some german programmer named Dolf or some shit. I found the link on Freshloaf. Makes keeping track of sourdough bread formulas so much easier.

>>4995045
alright

also i already have a good starter
( i think its good it keeps getting a layer of yellowish fluid on top of it a few days after i feed it

also i make sure to do a 1 to 1 on that, its in a big ol jar... ( i have a great deal of starter waiting for x-mis when i think im getting a kitchen-aid stand mixer

>>4995052
>i think im getting a kitchen-aid stand mixer

Brofist, me too. Can't fucking wait.

>>4988183
MUH FREEDUM

but you have inspired me OP, except for the fraction of the cost part. cheap wholewheat flour is hard to come by in shanghai, as is single serve yeast packets. maybe i can order online

What does it mean to let it rise twice?

I know I am hopelessly ignorant, but what is a "starter"? and youse are talking about it's babies and feeding it and such. i am confuse

>>4995052
I recommend you create a weighed starter so you can know exactly the hydration of your starter.

Cups are, by volume, 8 oz +/- half an ounce.

Flour:
One cup of flour, measured by volume, can weigh as little as 125g (4.41 oz) to as much as 148g(5.25 oz).

Water:
One cup of water should be about eight ounces.

Even if you're mixing one 'cup' of water to one 'cup' of flour, you're still not sure how much of either you actually have.

>>4995181
Sourdough starter is just a mix of flour and water that ferments perpetually. You add flour and water to keep the yeast and souring bacteria alive and healthy. Every so often you use some to make bread or sourdough pancakes or whatever, and replace what you poured away with fresh flour and water.

Im gonna request gluten free bread alternatives.

Is it easy to cook Tortilla's from scratch?

>>4995188
and you can just keep it in your cupboard?

Wow this sounds great

I was actually planning on making my own bread. My father used to make some bread but made with rice but holy shit was it dense I didn't think he let it rise or some shit


Anyways how do you let the bread rise?

Do you put it out and plastic wrap over it or what?

>>4995239
Op here, yes you can keep it in your cupboard, I kept mine on the counter or in the fridge to slow it down so you don't have to feed it every day.

>>4995180
You let it sit in a warm place until it doubles in size. Then you punch it down, form it how you want it and let it rise until doubled again.

>>4995198
Corn tortillas are just masa, salt, and water.

>>4995257
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xmbb4c_the-basic-steps-of-baking-bread_people

Brought to you by the CIA.

>>4995061
its going to be sweet man

right now mixing is holding me back from backing more often it suck having to mix ingredients by hand

>>4988694
Looks pretty simple based on this:
http://www.thekitchn.com/recipe-basic-sourdough-starter-47337

What were the anons doing that took a year or so to get it right? How did you experiment?

>go to grocery store
>want to make cheap /ck/ pizza
>grocer won't let me buy 80 cents worth of flour
>or 5 cents of yeast
>or 25 cents of tomato sauce
>or a dime of cheese

tl;dr you're all fags if you don't grow your own wheat and aren't self sufficient for every single calorie you ingest

>>4995174
You live in shang hai? Not to derail, but where did you move there from? And how do you cope with cooking?

>>4996814
Depending on the particular yeast culture you get it can take a while for the starter to become vigorous. Expect really long rise times at first, the longer you have it and keep it going the better it gets.

>>4995174
You can use any kind of yeast, just google how much of what to substitute. I think it's 2 T of dry active yeast to one package. I also just noticed that the salt should be one teaspoon, not a tablespoon. My bad.

>>4996850
The how-to guide for starter in the says to feed it daily for about a week, pay attention to a few different signs, and then toss it in the fridge, and feed it weekly. It also says that adding a pinch of commercial yeast is optional, and that you can rely on natural yeasts from the air.

Would feeding daily for a longer period of time help?
Are any specific yeast cultures more conducive to sourdough bread than red star or other commercial brands?

>>4996862
I've never added any yeast. The old timers split and fed every day and I believe this creates the most vigorous starter (please correct me if I'm wrong). I think they're telling you to put it in the fridge to slow it down because you won't be using it every day. From what I understand it's luck of the draw, some people's go gangbusters out of the gate, mine never have.

>>4996871
>Split and fed every day
What do you mean by split?

>>4996880
Throw half of it away. Or give it to a friend. Or bake with it. It's where people would get their yeast when it was all sourdough bread. They would take half of it and use it to bake with, then add flour to the remaining starter to bring it back to the original volume. Repeat the next day.

>>4996821
Im going to start next year building grow towers because i have no space

This is probably going to sound extremely dumb to all you pro bakers out there but

would I be able to bake bread in something as flat and wide as this? It's the only thing I have that resembles a cake or bread tin. The scotch bottle is inside for size reference. If it's not going to work I can get myself a reasonably sized bread tin no problem I just thought if I can use that it would be better.

Thoughts?

I've tried baking bread and every time, I've fucked up with the yeast.

Do I use the full packet, and pour the stuff into warm water? How long do I let that sit? How much water do I use? How much do I actually pour into the bread?

Seriously, it's just the fucking yeast that gets me.

>>4994977
We love this. It makes two huge loaves and it's gone within a few days.

>>4997416
Free form that shit, you don't need pans for bread really. And yeah, it's too wide and shallow. You could probably make good cakes/cornbread in there though, might be too big for brownies.

>>4994905
Rocket fuel? What?

Dearest beginner friends: http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/08/dining/081mrex.html

Also, stop worrying about the yeast. Use however much you want to use, and start focusing on reaching volumetric end points in the leavening stages. For most simple lean doughs, you should bulk ferment until doubled and proof until 1.75x in size, regardless of however long that takes. More yeast and less salt = shorter rise times and less flavor. Less yeast and more salt = longer rise times and more flavor. The above link relies on the latter method, and produces really great loaves of bread with minimal effort.

>>4997472
Tee-hee. Stupid euros.

>>4988159
So I'm trying to into baking, and am I correct in assuming that letting something rise twice means letting it rise to twice its original volume?

>>4998471
No. Let it rise till it doubles in volume, punch it down, then let it rise to twice its volume again.

>>4998471
No, let it rise to twice its volume, then fold it over a few times to get rid of the big air pockets and so forth.

Then let it rise to twice its volume again on whatever you plan to bake it on, then bake.

This seems like an appropriate enough thread. What kind of recipe would you bakers recommend for a decent hamburger bun? And not just the kind of shitty store bought bun, but the kind that hamburger joints make themselves to get them "just right".

I'm from Belgium, so I don't have much choice. There's very little selection in store-bought buns and they're all terrible, like they've been out getting stale for at least two days.

>>5000945
google "light brioche hamburger buns". There's several recipes out there for them, and light brioche buns make the BEST hamburger buns.

>>5000946
Thanks man, appreciate it. Feels good knowing I'll eat decently this weekend.

>>5000948
You are very welcome!

>let rise twice
um, what does this exactly mean. I don't really /ck/ and bread in specific is one thing I've never actually done (though I always wanted to, hence why I'm here)

Also has anybody here made focaccia? I fucking love that shit and have been wanting to make some for a while, but procrastination and no experience making bread has deterred me

>>5000952
No worries anon.
So, after you make and knead your dough, you have to let it rise once (usually until it's doubled in bulk) in an oiled bowl, covered with a tea towel , in a draft free place. Then you "punch it down", basically just fist bump it, lol. It will deflate some, and then you form it into your loaf of whatever. Then, you let it rise again (second rising) until it's doubled in bulk again. Then bake as directed.

>>5000955
Technically, those are referred to as the bulk ferment and proofing steps. Usually when people say "rise twice", they mean to allow the dough to rise twice during the bulk ferment stage, degassing between the two, prior to proofing. I guess that means there are three total rises. I can't say I've ever truly understood the purpose of that method. Perhaps to enhance the flavor of the bread by prolonging the fermentation period? Long, slow rises in cool environments (read: your fridge or cellar) are sufficient to produce really knockout-quality bread flavor.

>>4996837
from Australia. its very cosmopolitan man, you can get almost anything here. I live next door to an "international" supermarket where I get things like cheese, corn chips, chocolate, balsamic vinegar. cant get Vegemite but my mate brought me a jar.

i have seen yeast before but it was a 200gm bag and i wasted most of it because I wasn't baking bread at the time. but now i'm gonna try

>>4997506
>>slow ferment = more flavor
for bread it seems possible to get an extra long ferment in a cold refrigerator if you use a lager yeast or other yeasts that ferment at low temperatures for extra long fermentation

>>4988169

>laughingbakers.png
>laughingrestoftheworld.jpg
>potato.gif

Really itching to use greentext, eh? This is too far gone...

>>4991359
>>4991363

We get it. You don't want to bake bread.

OP was just proud of his baking so he extolled the economic virtues of homemade bread.

>>5001581
Lager yeast is a wasteful expense. Just use active dry yeast and less of it. If you want to get the down and dirty on 'retarded' fermentation, go check out the pizzamaking.com forum. Pete-zza's papa john clone ferments in the fridge for a week.

Day 4 of my sourdough starter experiment. I've been feeding half a cup of water and flour a night. Today is the first day I've had a lot of activity in the starter. Much more bubbles, and the lid popped off the container that is holding the starter. While there is a yeasty scent to the starter, no sourdough tang has kicked in yet. I'm thinking I'm going to keep feeding daily beyond the week period the website I read recommended, before refrigerating.
This thread has really kick started a baking frenzy for me!

>>5004289
You'll probably need more like another 2 weeks of twice daily feedings before your starter is really ready for the prime time.

>>5004361
I've only been doing once daily feedings. Should I keep the total amount the same for the day, as in 1/4 cup water and 1/4 cup flour 2x a day, or a half cup at each feeding?

>>4988588
Get fucked, will you? A home kitchen can't compete with a factory when it comes to production costs - there's just NO way.

>>5004419
They can't easily compete on raw material cost because of economy of scale, but the home baker also don't need to inflate prices to cover overhead such as equipment, union (or non-union, for that matter) wages, distribution costs, advertising and promotions, etc.

The home baker also has the ability to tailor their bread to their tastes, and to experience breads that would otherwise be unavailable regionally.

You can make many kinds of bread that are higher quality and less expensive than the cost of buying them retail.

I love making homemade bread from time to time... It is a bit time consuming, but I'll generally do it on the weekends.

I also like to add some honey to my recipe, gives it a subtle sweetness.

And lets face it... When you score the bread, and it comes out perfect, it's fucking heaven.

Hey OP used that recipe, this is what came out.

1/2

>>5006983
Served warm with a pomegranate blueberry reduction sauce. This is amazing....

>you can bake bread that is better than what you can buy in a store for a fraction of the price
you must have a lot of free time
also no good ovens

>>5007024
Different styles of bread require different amounts of involvement. Google 'no knead bread'. It's a full flavored, crusty loaf of bread that requires maybe ~30 minutes of actual activity.

We get it. You hate bread. You hate baking. For that matter, you hate cooking, which is why you spend all your time trying to convince people that they should buy fast food instead of cooking at home because it's cheaper, right?

>>4996974
Grow towers?

What about just using a breadmaker?

ive never seen a thread go on for 7 days. a weekend, 3 or 4 days? sure. but 7? damn.

and a mediocre thread as far as bread threads go

>>5008280
Bread makers are usually terrible unless you really splurge on a Zojirushi or whatever, and even then they usually don't do a very good job of kneading the bread.

If you rely on them to bake the bread and not just mix it, you can more or less bank on disappointment. Your mileage may vary.

For those of you who don't own a stand mixer and can't justify the expense, consider using a food processor to knead medium sized batches of dough. It works surprisingly well, though you should be careful to not over knead the dough. Google around for the specifics.

>>5009020
Go to the thrift store. You can get a zojirushi for 20-30 bucks.

>>4988159
Not really OP.
We have many excellent local bakeries here. They do better than I can.

Since this seems like a bread thread gonna ask here: anyone got a good recipe for whole wheat bread?

>>5009132
Not exactly a recipe but you can just substitute white flour with whole wheat, adjust the water amount until the dough feels right and and a tsp of wheat gluten for each cup of flour, and your recipe will work. My not be the best, but it will work.

I'm new to bread, so forgive me if this is a dumb question. My recipe calls for a broiler pan to produce steam. If I don't have one of those, is there an appropriate substitute? Can I just use a regular, uncovered pan?

>>5009172
Yes

>>5009172
Assuming pic is what you're talking about, yeah. You could also just throw an ice cube in the bottom of the oven, or mist the oven heavily with a spray bottle when you put the bread in, whatever.

>>5009132
http://www.kingarthurflour.com/recipes/classic-100-whole-wheat-bread-recipe