/ck/ - Food & Cooking

>>16949498
gqtm

Breville grinder.

>>16949592
3rd for 9basedista

>>16949477
Guji-dimtu fag here.
I just couldn't help myself and decided to have a cheeky cup of the freshly roasted stuff at 1:30 AM. Yeah, it tastes... weird. I tried the second crack stuff so I'm sure a lot of it is to do with the roast. It's quite bitter, not at all like I remember it being last time, and I also tried it last time when freshly roasted. I'm going to try a cup of the lighter roast tomorrow, and if that's also overdone, I'm going to be very careful roasting the rest of them. Thing is, when during the first crack do I remove it for as light a roast as possible? I don't want to remove them when they've just turned brown but are still "raw." I don't remember what I did last time because it was a long ass time ago.

>>16950013
Try the same one again after a day. It might get better. Or not. A lot of natural process coffees do not tolerate full city, let alone crossing the 2nd crack line into a vienna. All those wild flavors which are interesting in light and medium roasts can turn pretty funky. It's all right. It's just coffee.

How are you roasting? I'm using a heat gun. I pull the gun way back when I want to slow down. The other guy is using a modded popcorn popper. He can adjust the heat and air to slow it down. Looks like the lesson is that hot air is easier to control. Convection over conduction. But this is what I was trying to convey. Take them off the heat when they look a little bit lighter than you want. Let the residual heat finish it off, then force cool. When really depends on the particular coffee. The roast color and the popping do not happen at the ame time for every coffee. Color is more important than exactly when you hear first crack. Crack is an audio cue. Color is the direct effect of caramelization of the sugars. It is hard to judge visually and by memory. When I nail a batch of a particular coffee I save a scoop of it and use it as a color swatch for comparison while I roast later batches. It is very easy to match the roast level of the previous batch this way.

>>16950059
>>16950013
Next time I do a batch of Ethiopian I'll do a side by side photo of what I think is a good batch next to an overroasted one. I did a shitty batch the other week and I saved it. Might as well use it for something!

>>16950059
>All those wild flavors which are interesting in light and medium roasts can turn pretty funky
This sounds like what's probably happening. It was intensely bitter for the grind size, brew method, and concentration. Also, I didn't get the lovely roasted aroma that I was expecting, and it instead smelled burnt, though the beans are below medium. Guessing the trace fruit elements do indeed burn or something.

I roast with an oldschool air popper. It seems to work decently. Again, the thing I'm most afraid of is stopping the roast prematurely; I've heard from some coffee roasters on youtube that there is a crossover between when a bean can pass visually as roasted, but will still taste raw. Maybe this was bullshit. The finnicky part to me is that, obviously, not all the beans will crack as loudly as the loudest ones. Tomorrow, I'm going to try to get a feel for it by halting the roast 15 seconds after I hear the first two cracks. I'll post pics of the batches, too. Thanks, anon.

>>16950092
>I've heard from some coffee roasters on youtube that there is a crossover between when a bean can pass visually as roasted, but will still taste raw
Forgot to add that they also claimed the first crack HAD to pass before this threshold was crossed

>>16950092
>>16950097
Maybe try turning off the machine when it looks a little bit lighter than you want. Get a stick in there and stir while the residual heat evens it out. It will continue to roast a little longer. The insides will definitely continue to even out. Every coffee roasts a little bit differently. I agree with the first crack minimum threshold.

the other day I got a little bag of beans as a gift
when I opened the bag, there was almost zero coffee smell. I couldn't believe my nose, it was like the bag was empty. only the faintest smell of coffee and cereal
the beans are small, and ridiculously hard, like you can barely crack one with your teeth, and you should hear the noises my burr grinder made when I put them through it
the brew tasted bland as fuck and that cereal-ish taste was still there
so what's going on? my first assumption would be that the toasting process wasn't done properly but then again I know almost nothing

>>16950113
But that isn't to say every bean must crack. First crack is a stage not a single point in time. It could be anywhere from a minute to two minutes from when you hear the first pop to when they stop. Every different coffee the roast color and the popping sounds are staggered differently. It's like the size, shape, density, sugar content, moisture of the bean. All this shit is like too many variables to translate between different coffees. You can't take a rigid time or heat schedule from one coffee and expect it to work for a completely different coffee. You can ballpark it, but for fine tuning each coffee is a self-contained puzzle. You'll get it. It often takes me a few batches to get it down.

>>16950133
Also, I remember the other popcorn popper guy once said he stirs with a stick at the beginning because the greens are too dense at first to circulate on their own. Wonder if that trick would help you any.

>>16950131
How light was the color?

>>16950140
I agitate the entire thing until chaff starts coming out. At that point, the beans are more than able to move around on their own. I'm also careful to load the popper up enough that it can get plenty hot.
>>16950133
This is what I did with the second, lighter batch. I'll have to try some in the morning and get back to you. Its appearance is pretty similar, though that might be because I didn't cool it fast enough. Would it be a fair assumption that you may only hear the first cracks very audibly when they're being rapidly heated, but the residual heat can push the beans past the cracking point much more silently due to slower pressure buildup? If that were the case, I would definitely try unplugging the thing shortly after hearing the first few cracks.

>>16950144
at a glance you would assume it's a medium roast
but it doesn't have any of the nutty/fruity notes you'd expect from one

>>16950156
>>16950140
Also, going to finally get some sleep now. I'll post more "tomorrow."

>>16950156
I think the violence of the popping does correlate with the intensity of the heat to an extent. Alo the thermal mass. I've found if I roast too small of a batch I never get a good, explosive rolling first crack. It's like piddly and sparse. For my gun in my roasting vessel 150g is a weak thermal mass. 300g is ideal. 450g is too big and it roasts unevenly. Lotta variables. Gotta figure out what works for you.

>>16950157
Crack one open and see if the inside is lighter than the surface. Sounds like it was underroasted or roasted too fast. Some coffees don't have much of a dry smell. They get dinged on cupping scores for that.

Fuck are all these valves for

What the fuck is the regular setting supposed to be? Why is it called regular?

I might get 7-eleven coffee again tomorrow. Technically today but I haven't passed out blackout drunk yet.

>>16950552
good luck anon

>>16950554
Thank you. I hope to wake up before noon. I'm also getting ridiculous stomach acid right now.

>>16950082
why not do a cold brew with it?

i know a great recipe it's so good you'll cum yourself

Been working part time at my friend's bakery for a year now

>>16950590
thinking about moving out of the parents' basement soon or nah?

>>16950625
seethe wagie

>>16950625
I actually have my own business but I just help him out when he is short staffed

what's the best way to clean the surface of these things

>>16950561
Not even chicory and anal beads can fix that batch. Imagine if a skunk took a shit on a fruit salad.

>>16950877
lint-free rag
a little windex on the rag will lift any spots

>>16950893

Here's my "so good you'll cum yourself coffee" recipe
Ingredients:
>Ground cafe du monde (or preferred coffee. Cheaper coffees require no cold brew hot bloom and can be directly cold brewed).
RATIO: ONE CUP COFFEE-4 CUPS WATER
>Star anise (~2 pods/1 teaspoon),
>Vanilla extract,
>Cloves (2-4 cloves to taste; you can always add more at the end but you can't take away!),
>Cinnamon (about 1/2 to 1 stick, or, 1/4 to 1/2 teaspoon ground),
>Ginger (4 teaspoons),
>Nutmeg (1 teaspoon. Remember that nutmeg is sweet and you're adding sweetened milk, this recipe makes 4 servings!) to taste,
>1/4 cup coconut cream (NOT CREAM OF COCONUT, that is sweetened), 1/4 cup sweetened condensed milk (total, so 1/16 cup or 1 tablespoon per drink, of each),

Cold brew, hot bloom your coffee: pour about 1.5 cups of hot water over the grounds, shove your spices and vanilla in while it's still hot, allow to bloom for 30 seconds, then pour over the rest of your water. Let steep in the fridge or at room temp--covered, obviously--overnight. Let those flavors get to know eachother and mingle. You can add your 1/2 cup coconut cream and 1/2 cup S.C. milk now, or 1/16 cup each, per drink, when you are serving it. I prefer now.

Take that bitch out, filter it through a fine meshed sieve. Drink it.

>>16950901
Thanks anon

>>16950945
This seemed too self-aware to be real.

>>16950590
>>16950762
>that text on the back of the waitress
No wonder you're short-staffed.

>>16950965
Short staffed meaning people ask for a day off occasionally

>>16950561
>>16950893
>>16950945
I’m both pleased and horrified that this has become such a continuing source of amusement for some of you

>>16950958
I can't tell who's the bigger jackass. Cumyourself or sgp anon.

Hey guys looking for a high-end home espresso setup. My budget is $250. I'm pretty set on the breville smart grinder. I spent 6 months reading studies of grinders at a similar price point. I've never really drank a cup of coffee but I didn't like how the professionals were measuring their data so I'm left to conclude that the sgp is the best grinder for the price. Was gonna spend the left over $50 on some A4 sheets from my local office supply store and just pour hot water through the grounds. You idiots always say the grinder is important so I figure that the breville will make it delicious anyway. Anyone got any FDA-approved, government-funded, peer-reviewed scientific data to suggest an alternative?

I'm back

This is the guji-dimtu. On the left is the lighter roast, which I just had a cup of. It definitely needs more time to degas. No harsh bitterness like the other cup, though I couldn't really tell how good of an extraction I got. The mouth feel is worlds different from the stuff I've been drinking for the rest of the month. I'm gonna roast another batch lighter than this later today. Do Ethiopian naturals usually respond well to lower brew temps and/or coarser grinds? My last cup definitely lacked sweetness, but was decently tart.
>>16952146
Not this tard again.

>>16952187
Wow, left one looks much better. You'll learn a lot from an even lighter roast, too. And no, kind of the opposite. Try finer/hotter. Experiment though. Your own taste is the bottom line. Same for the roast.

>>16952283
Although if you go light enough you'll find the minimum pleasant roast level. Too light and all the sweeter roasty flavors possible (caramels, sugars, chocolates) will be replaced with harsher acidic flavors. Sometimes the trade is worthwhile, sometimes not. It's a little tightrope walk figuring out the best tasting balance for any one coffee. This is why I like roasting so much. Part art, part science.

does anyone here like deathwish coffee

>>16952316
>It's a little tightrope walk
Lol. No matter how smooth my ror curves are and how exact my timing on the cracks is, its all subjective taste. A living hell for perfectionists, but at least you get to drink great coof and think about what to tweak next week.

>>16952388
Sometimes you have to let yourself enjoy good enough.

>>16952146
I recommend the Gaggia Classic™

>>16952283
>>16952316
Thanks for the input, anon. It definitely adds a lot of enjoyment to getting a good cup, but it's a little hard to get there at first. At least my grinder isn't working against me anymore. I'll try the beans again in a few hours to see if they've changed. I already grind pretty finely for pourover, but I'll try going a bit finer.

>>16952597
Don't change all your variables at the same time when you're testing roast levels. Keep stuff the same at first! (I have no idea what I'm doing, btw.)

How often should I be cleaning my hand grinder? Is once a month not frequent enough?

>>16952696
Some people clean in between doses lol. When theres a ring of congealed grounds on the bottom of the burr carrier, probably time to give everything a brush and a wipe.

>>16952696
It will eventually develop a fine patina that accentuates the flavour of your grinds. You should never clean it out.

Are these things any good on their own merits? i.e divorced from use in a Starbucks

>>16952726
I'm not doing a complete takedown my grinder every time I use it
>>16952728
That doesn't sound right, but thanks

>>16952775
Then clean it every bag.

>>16952729
they produced a strong, dark, coffee-flavored liquid that is the basis for many possible milk drinks

they perform this task so well (at the mere press of a button!) that they make better sense than training an employee to operate a portafilter, grinder, & tamper
and they do it quite quickly
and relatively consistently

if you’re so inept that you can’t bother to operate a proper espresso machine in your own home, there are superautomatics that are geared towards the consumer

>>16952729
If you need to make an absolute fucktonne of espresso-based drinks over the course of the day, the Mastrena machines were built with this in mind. Think hundreds and hundreds of shots within an average work day. The machine does most of the labour and the average employee can be trained to use its basic functions over the course of a day or two.

If I was opening a cafe in a high traffic area, I'd definitely try to cop one.

>>16952814
I said divorced from use in a starbucks you dense twat

>>16952846
and I’m not just telling you
>virtually none
I’m explaining the reason why

>>16952696
If yours has the bottom of the burr exposed, which it probably does, then clean that off with a brush every time that you use it. Then disassemble and clean the inside with a brush or air compressor once every month. Never use any water or cleaning solutions.

>>16952846
He's explaining why you dumb fuck

can someone please explain coffee scales to me? i was making a pourover today with a v60 and i felt like the scale i was using was inaccurate somehow. i put my decanter and v60 on the scale and zero'd it but as i started to add water in the blooming phase, the scale would gradually add weight even after i stopped adding water as the coffee dripped down slightly. at the end when i removed the v60 on top, more than 100 grams mysteriously vanished. do i need a specific scale for doing pourovers or is this just a bad scale? i'm new to coffee and i don't know if i need to shell out a hundred bucks for one of those fancy scales.

>>16952864
Your scale is either inaccurate or you were going over its maximum weight limit I would say. You don't need an extremely nice scale for pourover as you could get away with something like a 600g limit jeweler's scale that I used for a while but spending $50-$60 on something specifically suited to pourover is very helpful.

>>16952877
thanks for the quick reply. i was hoping it was just the scale having trouble calculating weight when water was slowly added. i was worried that it was an issue on other scales too though unless you get one specifically made for coffee.

>>16952864
a decade or so ago, it was easy enough to find an affordable laboratory-type scale that checked the right boxes:
>range of measurement within the window of how it will be used (if you’re always weighing under a kilogram, there’s no need for the scale to max out at 5kg)
>precision required (does it read in tenths of grams, half grams, whole grams?)
>accuracy & repeatability (put a known weight on the scale and take it on and off several times to see variation)
>water (or at least moisture) resistant
>easy to read
nowadays there’s probably coffee-specific scales that are made cheaply but get upcharged for being made-for-coffee-enthusiasts

I’d recommend the scale I have but I don’t think it’s made anymoar

>>16952889
what you’re describing is totally a factor of repeatability & accuracy
and also you’re probably underloading the scale, relative to its maximum capacity

I had a piece of shit kitchen scale for a while that would jump up 10-15 grams at a time while I sifted flour into it

>>16952889
I would say that if you are serious about pourover you should invest in something like the Black Mirror or that one Hario scale as those are both fairly well liked. I have the Black Mirror because I didn't like the design of the Hario from a spill protection standpoint.

>>16952864
refresh rate

>>16952814
>if you’re so inept that you can’t bother to operate a proper espresso machine in your own home

How do we get the people who think espresso is easy and no one should settle, and people who think espresso is hard and normies need to stay out, to fight in these threads?

>>16952864
>>16952894
If you're buying blind I would always buy a lab scale over a "coffee" scale

>>16952696
I take a huge roman bath with my grinder every day

>>16952914
>>16952941
>>16953092
>>16953128
thanks for the responses lads. i think i'll get a black mirror.

>>16953270
If you want something cheap first, people apparently like the $12 weightman on amazon.

All right, guys. I've had my 1zpresso k-plus for several weeks now. I decided to break it down today to clean it for the first time. The entire thing can be disassembled by hand. The inner burr shaft is removed by pushing up on the bottom of the burr and unscrewing a ring at the top of the shaft. The outer burr is fastened by a reverse threaded collar. The outer adjustment dial is also fastened to the top of the hopper barrel with reverse threads. This dial unit seems to be press fit together somehow so I did not attempt to fuck with it. There appears to be three bearings on the axle. Very smooth. Everything is very nicely threaded solid milled aluminum. The burr set is very sharp and nicely polished. I could not see any poor finish on the teeth. I have run maybe 10-15lbs of coffee through it since new so I honestly don't know if the burr finish was perfect or not when shipped. Went back together easily enough by hand. Overall fucking nice little machine.

I have 3 little nitpicks. The wooden crank knob is not drilled perfectly center. I notice this a little less than the first time I used it. The silver-colored plating on the tops of the little neodymium magnets set into the magnetic catch cup have abraded a little bit revealing a brassy base metal. It's perfectly functional and I actually like the magnetic cup more than I thought I would. In several years the silver may completely wear off and it may look ghetto. And lastly, concerning the outer adjutment dial mechanism: when you are zeroing the dial it is possible that you briefly lock the at zero and begin to unscrew the entire dial mechanism from the body trying to free it. This caused momentary panic the first time it happened while I was zeroing. I think I wrote the other week about how you can actually get a true zero to align with the zero mark. So that's cool. I think this is a really nice grinder for what they're charging for it.

>>16953544
>threaded solid milled aluminum
This nigga has no idea what he's talking about lmao

>>16953544
>threaded milled aluminum

>>16953591
It's milled aluminum with fine threads cut into it that screws the parts together. There are no screws or bolts, so no tools are needed for disassembly and removal of the burrs. The only plastic is the disk of plexi on the base of the crank handle and there's some kind of rubbery sleeve over the body for grip.

>>16953613
Do you mean billet aluminum, or are you actually insinuating that this part was made on a mill instead of a lathe? Or both? Are you a little slow, chap?

>>16953621
Yes. The body appears to be made from a billet of aluminum. Three spokes.

>>16953626
I'm fairly sure the whole thing isn't one solid piece. That would be a lot of wasted material and a very difficult machining process. Either these things and cast and spun (in which case, good on them for getting such a high quality cast), or assembled/welded before final machining

>>16953682
Isn't cut from one solid piece of billet* I should say

>>16953682
>>16953685
I'm not qualified to say then. Everything fits together perfectly.

>>16953696
I'm just crusting your walls, ganon. Chill.

>>16953544
so…basically it's like a weed grinder but you're putting coffee beans in it?

>>16950191
would toasting it further by myself on a pan be of any help at this point?

>>16953830
I've done this before and it does work. It's not ideal, but it works. Stir constantly.

>>16953830
The fucking hardest ror crash.

fooc

What is a good grinder that makes uniform grinds? I have a cuisinart one that was gifted to me, but I find that it just does whatever grind it wants, finest sometimes comes out well…less fine than what you’d expect

>>16955224
Breville

>>16955224
Breville SGP

>>16955851
>>16955879
First google search is people complaining about them… why? Are they really bad?
I just didn’t want to dish or for a full industrial one

>>16955224
>>16955943
EG-1

>>16955943
>First google search is people complaining about them
Wait thats all it took? Lol fuck.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbqjH5QmLiA

coof

>>16955943
They're meming because some retard in the last thread was dead set on getting one despite its poor performance.

Guji-dimtu fag back again. Holy shit, I just had a cup and I ground a bit finer. This shit is delicious; it reminds me of tart cherries and dark chocolate. The mouth feel is incredible and it's almost creamy. This is really, really good. I would like just a hint more of the body to come out, but that could just be a time thing at this point. I'm also going to try mixing the two roasts at 2:1 light to dark to see if it makes something interesting.

>>16957373
I had to get high after that whole ordeal. Ended up ordering some origami cups lel.

>>16957373
You're talking about the lighter one, right? Yeah, try mixing them. Every time I tried sneaking in some of the bad batch into a good batch it brings the good stuff down. Find out if it works or not. It probably won't though.

>>16957522
My idea was it might add a little bit of caramelized flavor, but actually, maybe I should just add some medium roasted washed beans to it. I fucking love coffee, man.

someone here posted a video about tips for making better french press coffee anyone have it?

>>16958647
I don't have a video, but I have this image guide https://imgur.com/a/VXW3y

>>16958647
you needs a video to show you how to push down on a plunger?
>>16958684
>imgur
kys

>>16959237
>tfw he plunges french press
ngmi

Does filtered water make coffee taste better?

>>16959460
Depends how bad your water tastes to begin with.

>>16959237
Catbox doesn't do text for a guide

What's the cheapest method to make good coffee? Is it the french press?

In case you wonder what I mean by good coffee: black coffee made from actual coffee beans and water, without any nonsense. I know that the most expensive thing is obviously the coffee, and I buy a local roast pretty cheap, but I'm wondering what METHOD is the least expensive in the long run.

>>16960116
turkish

>>16960135
Thanks anon. Have you tried turkish, did you enjoy it?

>>16960116
In the long run, I guess French press sure. You would make significantly better coffee if you got a pourover dripper and paid for the minuscule upkeep of paper filters.

>>16960151
im gonna have to disagree with turkishanon that stuff's an acquired taste and not in line with what most people think of when they think of coffee

personally i think the best answer to your question is pour over
but don't overthink it like the spergs here do you can literally use a funnel and a fucking folgers filter

>>16960299
Post a picture of you brewing with a funnel and folgers paper or shut the fuck up.

>>16960299
>but don't overthink it like the spergs here do you can literally use a funnel and a fucking folgers filter
Yeah we get it you can make coffee with a sock and you can make every IBA cocktail with a sippy cup and a lemon we get it just shut the fuck up already retarded shitposter

>>16960953
A good grinder should cost about $7.50 tops. Motors and plastic are essentially free.

>>16961075
Then make one and sell it. Even the chinks charge you plenty for decent burrs.

>>16960902
no, i dont have any and im not gonna go out and buy a pack of coffee filters just so that you can have that satisfaction

yes, i run a v60 but never for a moment do i think that fact makes me any better than someone who just flips on a mr coffee every morning

>>16961107
Mayyyybe $12.75.

>>16961183
>i run a v60
Ah gotcha. So you're just as spergy, but don't like admitting it. Changing filters from tabbed v60 to cafec mediums won't make you a better person. It'll probably make you better coffee though.

>>16961197
dont lose sight of the fact that we are still just talking about some sort of cone or funnel and a piece of paper

>>16949477
i like ristretto but with lighter roasts which isn't exactly a common occurrence
>t. too poor for my own espresso setup
other than that i just drink my v60 every morning, it's what gets me outta bed, always looking forward to tasting that sweet goodness and smelling the grounds
currently got some decent natural ethiopia light roast with an amazing peachy aroma

>>16961399
Yep, and using a motor oil funnel with no air gap is going to significantly impact the flow, resulting in overextracted bitter coffee. Same shit happens when chemex filters suck completely to the walls. Not too complicated of a concept.

>>16961107
>decent burrs
No such thing. All burrs are the same and you have no empirical evidence (HARD DATA) to prove otherwise. The Breville SGP™ is the ONLY grinder with comprehensive analysis of its grind quality available and is therefore the de facto best grinder available for $200

>>16961183
>never for a moment do i think that fact makes me any better than someone who just flips on a mr coffee every morning
Why? You should think of yourself as better than those "people" in the same way that you should think of yourself better than the "people" that sweat by the Oestropress

What's a good, inexpensive espresso machine? Loved working as a barista and now I want to keep making drinks at my new place.

>>16961770
People like you are insufferable, that's why.

>>16961796
define inexpensive
personally wouldn't go below a gaggia classic

>>16961822
>you can literally use a funnel and a fucking folgers filter
>i run a v60
People who recommend shit they don't do themselves is way more insufferable.

>>16961827
I was hoping for around $300, but I could go higher if there seriously wasn't anything worth using below that.

>>16961844
your not putting astronauts on the fucking moon here your just soaking beans in water and then filtering out the solid shit

>>16961856
since you're a smoothbrain retard who can't tell immersion from pourover i won't even bother asking you why you wasted your money on a v60 if folgers papers in a funnel are so good

>>16961862
Different guy, but how is a v60 significantly different than any old funnel? I totally see how different weights and qualitis of paper filters affect brewed coffee, but the cone itself? Legit question: how?

>>16961871
aspergers-related screed coming in...

3...

2......


1............

>>16961871
Those ridges are not decorative. They keep the paper filter from clinging to the wall of the cone and choking itself. We're talking about a product you can buy on amazon for $20 with a glass carafe. Why fuck around with a funnel?
>>16961888
>Hey I'm looking for cheap daily driver to get to work
>LOL UNICYCLES WILL WORK JUST FINE DON'T BE RETARDED.

>>16961862
>retard who can't tell immersion from pourover
You keep posting this but I haven't seen any evidence that you (or anyone) can tell the difference.

>>16961901
you can't argue with trips, sperge

>>16961901
>yet another false equivalence from the resident midwit
It's all so tiresome.

>>16961916
>Any hammer recommendation?
>LOL GET A 2x4 YOU'RE JUST POUNDING IN NAILS
Kill yourself.

>>16961904
nigger what? they're two completely different methods of extraction

>>16961978
>they're different because... because they just are okay

>>16961994
>They're the same because I feel they're the same

>>16961770
okay i'm watching this unpleasant display of yours play out here
i can probably get my hands on a paper filter or two without much hassle and without spending any money

shall i do a side-by-side with the V60 for you?
should i earmark a day where i can do a whole thread about this for you?

lemme know, thx

>>16962040
>i can probably get my hands on a paper filter or two without much hassle and without spending any money

>>16962021
>No explanation.
I see, so they are the same then (hot water mixed with coffee grounds).

>>16962040
>should i earmark a day where i can do a whole thread about this for you?
kek. Don't even joke about it, you'll send him into a weeklong schizophrenic fit.

>>16962067
>datafag is back
https://coffeeadastra.com/2019/07/16/why-do-percolation-and-immersion-coffee-taste-so-different/
>The crucial difference between a percolation and an immersion is simple: a percolation extracts coffee with clean water, and an immersion extracts coffee with water that is gradually becoming more and more concentrated, because water sits in with the coffee grounds for the whole brew.
Don't know why I bother. You're not going to read it.
>In other words, the chemical profile of a percolation brew will be very strongly correlated with their extraction speed, whereas an immersion brew will be instead strongly correlated with how abundant each chemical compound is in the coffee bean. It’s like listening to music with two different equalizers on.

>>16962082
well then that seals it for me
let's see if we can't top cum-yourself-cold-brew

Would a lever machine and hand grinder be affordable alternatives to a full on espresso machine/grinder set up? If I did go with that, would a milk steamer to go with them be affordable?

>>16962040
I genuinely have no idea what you meant by this collection of schizophrenic ramblings. Did you reply to the wrong post by accident or something?

>>16962120
no
that was just the last time (you) responded to (me)
apparently everyone else thinks you're full of shit too

>>16962086
That article assumes percolation and immersion taste different, which is what I am disputing. There was no actual data there either. It's a physics simulation about extraction speed of different soluble compounds. The assumption is that they affect the flavor.

They could've directly proven you right, but didn't feel like it:
>One way to test this would be to perform blind test comparisons of a Hario immersion switch and V60 brews, but keeping all other variables constant will be a real challenge – just think of how the slurry temperature evolves during the brew in both cases; depending on the kettle temperature, constantly changing the brew water versus keeping the same water in an immersion will have a significant effect on the temperature profile, unless extreme caution and precise instruments are used !
The reason is
>keeping all other variables constant will be a real challenge
which is basically what I thought. Any difference in taste is likely due to uncontrolled variables.

>>16962123
>apparently everyone else thinks you're full of shit too
Literally what the fuck are you talking about, schizo? All that I said was that people who use the Aeropress are subhuman. And you
replied to that post saying some incomprehensible nonsense about stealing filter papers and "making a whole thread about this" (Nobody knows what "this" means) And now apparently you and all of the voices in your head think that I'm "full of shit" (Again no idea what you meant by this)

>>16962139
>That article assumes that 2 +2 = 4, which is what I am disputing. There was no actual data there either.

>>16962148
>hurr durr 2+2=4
That's your go-to when you get BTFO.
Fuck off retard, there's nothing special about your preferred method of mixing coffee and water.

>>16962164
>Espresso is the same as percolation brew. It's just ground coffee and water. Any differences in taste can be accounted for by uncontrolled variables.

>>16962143
this has nothing to do with an aeropress
if I had one I would throw it in the bin

you asked me to post pictures of brewing coffee with a funnel and a cheap drip filter

it didn’t seem worth the effort at the time, but now I see that you are a lolcow prime for milking
so I’ll get those paper filters for you, old chap this will be good

>>16962139
>they don't taste different, they just taste different because of differences

>>16962173
Oh okay so you're just a schizo who thinks that everyone who replies to you is the same poster. Either way, I don't think that you fully understand what a lolcow is if you think that you somehow wouldn't be the lolcow in that situation. Everyone in the thread is laughing at your dumb ass for thinking that putting a filter in a funnel is a legitimate and good method for brewing coffee and totally equivalent to a pourover. So go ahead and record yourself doing that retarded shit so that we can laugh at you even more.

>>16962189
>you're just a schizo who thinks that everyone who replies to you is the same poster
Common occurrence among dipshits. Coldbrewfgt and sgpfgt both did it.

>Oh hey there neighbor. I'm in a coffee argument on a Jamaican basket weaving forum. Do you think I could borrow a few coffee filters? Oh and also a funnel? Why are you backing away?

>*pant pant* oh pwease oh PWEASE no pwessy wessy anon my gwounds just can't take it pwease noooooo *pant pant*

>That article assumes percolation and immersion taste different, which is what I am disputing.
tfw he doesn't understand the difference between suspended solids and dissolved solids. No chance that affects the taste.

>>16962113
There's a reason good espresso machines cost four figures. Something like the Flair will do ok shots, but can never reach that level.
You can check this veganfag's setup for ideas - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WakY8DVUoYc

>>16962258
>can never reach that level.
Citation needed. Assuming all variables are the same(basket, grinder, setting, temp, profile,recipe), what do you feel is the limiting factor?

>>16962275
The pressure fluctuates too much in manual espresso.

>>16962282
He's not asking a genuine question, he's just an autistic shitposter. Don't bother responding to him

>>16962282
what if you're running a PID on your manual machine?

>>16962290

>>16962282
>laughs in sep
So if I'm able to replicate shots by following along a graph, whats the limiting factor?

>poorfags coping with their cavemen coffee tools
is this what every thread comes down to?

I can't believe that you cargo cultists think that you need a grinder to make coffee. There is no data indicating that whole beans soaked in water tastes different from ground beans soaked in water. They're literally both the same thing, coffee and water.

>>16962320
based

>>16962291
Ah yes, the standard Pressure Interface Device. You plug it in and it normalizes your brew pressure...
>>16962282
https://slayerespresso.com/slayer-leveraging-pressure-for-flavor-profiling/
>By adjusting pressure during brewing, it is possible to highlight any one flavor more than the others or play them equally. At a fixed brew pressure of 9 bars you don’t have this flexibility.
Slayer seems to think this variability is a good thing.

>mfw cafe owners spend tens of thousands of dollars on espresso machines
>mfw I get the exact same result by putting a PID on my french press and pressing at 9 bars
Fucking suckers, they're wasting so much money and profits kek

>>16962336
>Slayer seems to think this variability is a good thing.
so where;s the japanese with fuzzy logic espresso machines when you need them?

>>16962336
variability =/= inconsistency
But you know this and you're just being obtuse on purpose

>>16962340
Where can you find a PID that goes on a French press?

Seems to me that a ridged cone would be inferior to a smooth cone. If you were to assume that the paper filter making a decent wet seal to a smooth cone slows down the flow rate significantly more than a ridged cone, you would be completely reliant upon paper filtration rates (more expensive, thicker papers with a completely different dissolved solid content than thinner papers), whereas a smooth cone's smoothness-related seal could simply be negated with something like a bamboo skewer placed into the cone. How would this not give more veratility and control over flow rate, with a better set of options? Tell me I am wrong. Why would a person box themselves into using more expensive filtration media with less versatility?

>16962367
kek

>>16962355
If you're having trouble holding consistent pressure on a direct lever, hit the gym.

>>16962170
Another strawman. You seem stupid, just stop posting.
>>16962184
They don't taste different though.
>>16962245
Yes unfiltered coffee tastes different than filtered. That's not what we're talking about though.
>>16962282
Temperature also fluctuates a lot with your typical manual like the flair.
>>16962298
Based.
>>16962320
Nobody says this.
>>16962340
This is the real reason you need a double walled stainless press.
>>16962349
>fuzzy logic
Just a marketing word for PID.
>>16962367
It's called a chemex.
>bamboo skewer placed into the cone
People actually do this because it does clog.

>>16962381
Hush. I'm trying to play along. I want to ee where it goes.

>COVID fucked up the smell of coffee

>>16962383
So at first the "variability" of the inconsistent pressure was actually a good thing, because just now learned what pressure profiling is and for some reason conflate precise changes in pressure at precise moments during the brew with random changes at random times caused by human error. But now suddenly the variability doesn't exist. Which is it?

wtf my dark roast smells like humid chemicals

>>16962385
Make a pourover, and then make some French press and pour it through a filter. You'll kill yourself at how wrong you are.

I just had some of the ethiopian with a meal, and it increased my enjoyment 100fold.

Ok why the fuck is my Gaggia shooting out coffee?

I tamped perfectly 16 grams of my fine grinded dark roasted beans, when I engaged the brewing it sprayed out… but on Sunday it came out smoothly with perfect crema and we’re taking about the same coffee
>reeeeee how do I into repetibility?

>>16962474
Sounds like you need a Breville spart girnder pro for more repetibility

>>16962474
gonna need a PID for your tamper

>>16962385
It's easy to distinguish pure immersion and percolation, even blind. Virtually all percolation brews have some hint of astringency from channeling, something that is completely lacking from any entirely immersion based method.
Pure immersion referring to methods in which water never has to filter the coffee at any stage, so French Press, Turkish, cupping, etc but NOT Aeropress, Clever, etc. Once you learn to recognize that taste, you can reliability tell if there was a percolation stage in any given coffee sample depending on if that astringency is present.

>>16962490
>It's easy to distinguish pure immersion and percolation, even blind.
I bet you can't cite a single peer reviewed study that would support this.

>>16962498
I've done the blind testing myself. Triangulation testing solo with a lazy susan for randomization, and a couple different kinds of more formal blind testing with some coffee friends. You really just have to look for that little peak of astringency, no immersion brew (at least made with normal methods, you could probably force it to by like sealing it and shaking it up while brewing or some shit) has that taste in it. It might be possible to brew a percolation brew that entirely lacks that taste to fool the method, but I've never tased one.
Other interesting notes from blind tasting experiments: it's super easy to taste differences in water alkalinity, but outside of that all water tastes the same in coffee unless you're getting completely fucking bonkers high mineral content

>>16962397
>for some reason conflate precise changes in pressure at precise moments during the brew with random changes at random times caused by human error.
I'm not sure why you think watching a real time display of pressure and flow and adjusting accordingly is random. And yeah, human errors are just that. Human errors. You can fuck up profiling on a strada mp too.

>>16962529
>some coffee friends.
god I bet you're just thrilling to be around irl

>>16962498
He doesn't have enough peers for that.

>>16962529
So no actual science then, just your biased opinion?

>>16962548
What? Do you not have friends you know through various hobbies?

>>16962570
Blind testing is not an opinion or biased. Lack of interest from scientific journals does not make a topic unscientific.

>>16962578
Most people aren't going to cooking classes to try to make friends. They just cook. Similarly, most people just treat the beverage as a beverage. They don't use it as an excuse to harass coffee shop employees and invade into their lives.

>>16962540
>I'm not sure why you think watching a real time display of pressure and flow and adjusting accordingly is random.
What model of the Flair comes with that? Just curious

>>16962467
They both taste the same if done properly.
Paper filtered french press is retarded because you have to wait another 5 minutes for the sludge to filter. You obviously haven't tried it despite spamming it all the time.
>>16962490
I was thinking pourover vs clever/aeropress. I know what you mean though, and it's the reason why I don't drink unfiltered coffee.

>>16962606
See.
>>16962300
Turns out if you have a threaded pressure gauge, you can swap it out with a bluetooth transducer.

https://www.naked-portafilter.com/product-category/smart-espresso-profiler/

would a zassenhaus santiago coffee mill grinder and a flair classic be a good place to start for home espresso?

>>16962636
also, what else would I need on top of that?

>>16962628
>Spending $460 on a pressure profiler for a lever machine
KEK yeah that will look great on the shelf next to my $130 french press you fucking moron hahahahaha
>>16962636
No. You need a Breville SGP

>>16962641
You'll want a better grinder.
>>16962647
See.
>>16962310

lmao this grinder looks like a nightstand

>>16962628
jesus...a fool and his money, eh?

>>16962647
>>16962659
>No. You need a Breville SGP
what makes it more worth the extra $100?
also, unrelated to the home espresso part, would it be able to grind fine enough for turkish?

>>16962659
>See.
>>>16962310
That doesn't even work, you larping poorfag. If you cared about good gear then you wouldn't be buying a fucking lever in the first place.

>>16962596
>coffee shop employees
I met a couple guys in a coffee swapping Slack group a few years back, hit it off, stayed in touch, met up a few times. Yeah it's kind of dorky, but whatever.

>>16962623
Yeah, Clever/Aeropress kind of immersion I wouldn't be able to reliably pick out of a lineup of pourover. I'm not confident to go as far as to say it can't be done, but I know I can't do it. But the taste isn't really filter related as much as "was the coffee liquid, at any point, pushed through a bed of coffee grounds" that seems to cause the taste as far as I can tell. More than anything, blind tests are humbling, you can sometimes learn to taste interesting things (like the astringency tip), but more often than not you just learn you can't tell jack shit apart.

>>16962660
>>16962636
Mediocre grinder. Used to have one. The burr isn't stabilized at the bottom at all. I had to build in a reinforcement myself. Ended up giving it away when I upgraded to a Lido. There are better hand grinders than the Lido available cheaper these days too.

>>16962682
>There are better hand grinders than the Lido available cheaper these days too.
could you show me?

>>16962667
Please don't buy an SGP.
>what makes it more worth the extra $100?
Consistency. If you want a budget hand grinder(with way fucking better performance than what you have) skim through this. And give him a thumbs down because I don't like linking his shit.
https://youtu.be/MV6awoNQXHU
>>16962665
If you can't afford it, just say so. I originally had it on a $160 scratch and dent flair signature with a lunar underneath because I thought it would upset people here. It did and continues to do so. Well worth.

>>16962706
>If you can't afford it, just say so.
If you can't afford an actual espresso machine and can only afford a lever, just say so. I cannot even fathom being such a fucking retard that I would squander $460 on a PID for a FUCKING LEVER. If you actually had money and cared that much about pressure profiling you would own a Decent. Instead you're flaunting this absolutely retarded waste kek

>>16962682
>"was the coffee liquid, at any point, pushed through a bed of coffee grounds" that seems to cause the taste as far as I can tell
I always felt it was the overextracted fines getting stuck on the tongue causing the lingering astringency and chalky mouthfeel.
I don't get that with espresso/americano but also don't end up with as much sludge/fines in the cup as a french press.

>>16962623
>They both taste the same if done properly.
No, retard. And yes, I've tried it on multiple occasions.

>>16962674
>larping poorfag
?
>>16962725
>you would own a Decent.
You know, I was kind of thinking about it when I get fed up with the 58. But faggots like you who don't own and won't own a decent turn me off of it. You remind me of car guys. They drive a rusted out Camry, but they've got some strongly held opinions on Porsche.

>>16962753
>I totally could own a Decent if I wanted to, I just choose not to and choose to waste money on retarded crap like meme lever devices instead
Retarded poorfag cope?

>>16962753
Imagine spending that much on a grinder that has no data backing up its efficacy when the Breville SGP, the only grinder that has been clinically fact-checked and subject to multiple peer reviewed studies on its grind distribution, can be had for a mere $200

>>16962762
>lol look at all the money he wastes, hes gotta be broke!
>>16962770
I fucked up. Could have bought 8 sgps :/

>>16962698
The Aergrind was the cheapest good one when I was still keeping up with the market. It may have been outdone by some of the Chink handgrinders by now, idk.

>>16962725
NTA, but I own a Decent. Owned a lever (Strietman CT1) before it. Almost anything I can do on the Decent I could also do on the lever and vise versa, with the one stipulation being the lever had a maximum shot volume. Actually considered picking up a lever again, but most of my disposable income goes to other hobbies these days (gun shit is expensive).

>>16962733
I know what you're talking about, but different kind of taste. It's an astringency that is in Aeropress/Clever/V60 etc but not in French press and similar. It's easiest to learn to taste for it by comparing Clever to meticulously filtered French press back to back. God only knows why you'd want to though, I don't really advise purposefully training yourself to pick up defects better unless you're making coffee commercially for others or have an unhealthy obsession.

>>16962788
Since the SGP gets 50% of its grind output within the acceptable range, you could have run one dose through all 8 of your SGPs and gotten 400% of the grind within optimal range, which would be better than whatever that unknown machine could put out, according to science

Have any of you fellow coffeebros had any experience with being gangstalked? Any coffees to help deal with it? Drinking the last of my El Salvador bourbon natural right now, real blueberry pie and brown sugar notes rn frfr no cap.

after some research and posting in the thread, I just think that I don't really have the funds for home espresso yet; until then, what would be a nice alternative? I already have a small bialetti moka pot.

>>16962841
Yes. Just stop brewing coffee with tap water and start using colloidal silver mixed with orange juice instead. Will turn you blue, but will also stop the gangstalking.

>>16962848
Just learn to enjoy pourover or french press

>>16962770
now I know you’re trolling

>>16962808
SGP as a precrusher, kruve sifters under that pulling off the 1/3 of fines, then run the rest into the key.
>>16962790
>Actually considered picking up a lever again
Just wait for an argos?
>most of my disposable income goes to other hobbies these days (gun shit is expensive).
This. I like my headphones, I like my coffee. I'd use better headphones more often than a decent or better sitting around. But I like my headphones. So I just edge myself until I get too stoned and order shit. I ended up with a bunch of glock lowers to build out and I really don't feel like it so they're sitting in storage.

>>16962851
unironically this

>>16962849
Is this a terry davis reference in /ctg/?

>>16962870
Oooh, I'd not seen the Argos. I was considering a Strietman CT2, but that thing looks perfect for a fucking around with experiments lever with the spring or manual configuration. And a lot cheaper, which is nice for a machine that's more of a toy off to the side than my primary machine. Might actually preorder one.

>>16962851
>>16962871
how about turkish? I remember enjoying it at a balkan cafe one time. do you guys know what would be a good grinder for that? I could get a fairly good one, since I'm not buying an espresso machine this time around

>>16962910
SGP

>>16962905
Argos looks based. If the flair58 is the pavoni killer, the argos is the 58 killer. I'd probably take one of those over a cremina.

What's the best espresso hand grinder around $150

>>16963172
The Google "It"(TM) U-redheart

>>16962910
>>16963172
1zpresso JX pro :-)

>>16963172
>>16963248
Probably the correct answer. Not a whole lot of people seem disappointed with em.

>>16963283
>>16963248
+30 social credit

>>16963304
1zpresso is Taiwanese though

>>16952846

one of those costs about $15,000, they're just helpfully advising you that if you're a retard who doesn't want to actually learn to use an espresso machine, that there's consumer grade full-auto coffee machines much cheaper than a huge one used to make 9000 shots a day in fucking starbucks, but maybe you should buy it

>>16963465
My brother-in-law is a salesman and he can get me one at below cost. How hard do you think it would be to maintain a machine like that for home use?

>>16963459
Taiwan is a part of China
-30000 social credit

hi /ctg/ I am a frequent coffee drinker looking for an aeropress alternative as it is very impractical for multiple cups of coffee. What would you guys recommend?

>>16963742
espro p7

>>16963742
Breville SGP

>>16963742
Multiple aeropresses.

>>16961796
If you want something to toy with you can get one of those chinkshit machines with 58mm portafilter and unpressurized basket. They start somewhere above $150.
For $300 you can get a chinkshit "dual boiler" with PID.

>>16959485
Let's see how many clean my water is. Installing a filter at the tap; let's see what the filter catches...

>>16963742
La Marzocco Strada 3 group

Guji-dimtu fag here.

I drank a really good cup yesterday morning and it had me wired all day. Not really sure what happened, but I got some crazy buzz. I only drank 25% more than usual.

Also, I decided to say fuck it and bought a Lido 3. I'll return the timemore. I just really like how this thing looks and I got it for a really good price.

>>16963742
A big Moka pot? You could also do a French press or pour over for the same price range.

>>16964908
The Lido 3 is quite possibly the worst hand grinder that money can buy

>>16949477
Supermarket brand breakfast blend black

Tried to drink a kcup recently and I'm convinced that they put more than just coffee in that shit.

It gives me the runs. This doesn't happen when I brew at home.

>>16961796
Gaggia classic ? It’s relatively cheap and it’s a good machine

>>16965481
Looks cool, grinds well, don't care

>>16961796
>good, inexpensive
Pick one

>>16965481
Ohno not another one

>>16965697
It actually looks like shit and grinds worse than grinders of a similar price point. The guy who designed it also intentionally made it so that the handle folds in on itself every 30 seconds while grinding.

>>16966045
They're also a bitch to return to amazon.

Just scooped most of the crema out before making a cortado. It was good, I will do it again.

Should I buy a Flair 58?

>>16966045
Nah, it looks great and just happens to be expensive. I'm getting it for 100 bucks shipped in mint condition, so I'm more than happy. Beats having an ugly, functional, Chinese 1zpresso

>>16966432
Cope

>>16966203
I like mine.

>>16966432
>looks great
Enjoy your plastic crap.

>>16963891
link?

>>16949477
>0830
>walk into dinky little coffee shop
>been up since 0530 gettin' shit done
>buncha fuckin' normies in here drinking their lattes 'n' shiet
>fat fuckers filling their coffees full of sugar and cream just to mask the taste of espresso
>place is fairly busy 'cos lazy cunts are just getting in after getting up and heading to work
>gonna grab a couple'a cups'a joe
>plan to take one around to my girlfriend who's at work already
>walk up to wagie
>wat can i get yu ser??
>morningmatecanigetacoupleoftripleshotextrahotlongblacktakeawaysplease?
>say this fairly quickly but not so fast that he wouldn't be able to understand it
>people in line gimme looks for not ordering a frappasnappawappacino with seven sugars
>he goes through each aspect of my order one by one writing it onto the cup as i confirm it
>takes him 5x longer to write down the order than it does for me to actually place it
>he's struggling
>guy working the machine has beard and is only one not wearing wagie cap
>very obviously the boss
>he's giving wagie the stinkeye at this point
>he fucks up the eftpos terminal, i have to input it manually
>i ask him for a receipt
>line's being held up at this point
>he keeps apologising when really, he doesn't need to
>finally done ordering
>standing there waiting for my coffee
>bossman's making mine
>turns around and hands one coffee to me
>gives me a wink and goes back to the espresso machine
>i'm standing there waiting for the second one
>10 seconds later wagie asks me if i need something
>yes, i do, i'm waiting for the second coffee i ordered
>boss starts yelling at wagecuck
>wagie's making excuses that it wasn't his fault
>they get into an argument, boss is clearly winning
>GET OUT YOU'RE FIRED
>wagie throws apron and cap into grounds bin, storms out cursing loudly
>interject that i'm going to be late even though i'm not really
>boss smashes out a second coffee quick and refunds me for both
>turn 360 degrees and walk away
anyways the coffee was pretty good

>>16963172
get a kino for 200