/ck/ - Food & Cooking

According to BK Magazine, the cooks at Wattana Panich cool the leftover broth every night and store it in the fridge to prevent spoiling. It is used as the base for the next day’s stew. The cooks add about 25kg of beef to the stew every day, the flavor of which sips into the decades-old broth, constantly enhancing its flavor.
Nattapong Kaweenuntawong is the 3rd generation of his family to be running Wattana Panich, and hopes that his three children will become the 4th. Whatever happens, one thing is for sure, they’ll be using the same broth – or at least a bit of it – as the day the restaurant opened in Ekkamai, 45 years ago.

And in case you’re wondering abut that brown hardened shell around the large metal stew pot, it’s testimony to how long the broth has been used for. The owners of Wattana Panich have made it tradition not to clean the 45-years-worth of broth spillover. It’s not the most hygienic piece of history, but it’s history nonetheless.

that would be impossible in a western country due to hygiene laws and it is honestly quite astonishing to me that this doesn't make the people ill who eat it.

yet i am intrigued.

>>12686239
This reminds me of how Tootsie rolls could theoretically still have bits from the first batch since they recycle what's left the previous day's batch for every batch.

>>12686365
Not impossible at all actually. I've seen several gourmet hot wing places that use the same sauce and keep readding part of the old batch to keep the flavor intense. Same practice. As long it isn't left to sit at room temperature then how is it going to kill somehow? Sounds like they have a pretty solid protocol for handling it

>>12686365
How is it going to kill someone if its boiled. Its sterile.

>>12686365
think about what youve typed before you post

hey, it works for bread.

Ackshually, it's hasnt been simmering for 45 years because the heat is turned off every night. Article should read, "same soup base has been used for decades"

>>12686365
http://lecentralbistro.com/

The only way a perpetual stew would be 100% safe to eat would be for it to never leave a flame. Ever. As long as it's kept hot enough to kill pathogens. Letting it cool down in the fridge overnight opens up the potential of bacteria growing, dying the next time the stew is reheated, and leaving behind toxic waste that can't be cooked out.

>>12686467
What do you think happens to the bacteria after its boiled again after being cooled you fucking moron.

>>12686239
That's nasty as fuck.

>>12686365
Isn't there a burger place where they have deep-fried them with the same batch of fat for years, and in Japan there some guy who has been using the same batch of broth for decades, and he inherited it from his father even.

>>12686239
I was totally okay with this up until the part where they never clean the spillover, that's just gross

>>12686471
not all pathogens are subdued by heat. #botulism

>>12686723
This.

The broth continuously evaporates and has to be refilled with """"""""""fresh""""""""" Thailand water so it's not like it's really "the same" broth as 45 years ago.

>>12686365
This is the wh*test thing I've ever read in my entire life

>>12686467
I gotta read up on this. I know bigos is better when cooled down and reheated multiple times just like this stew but the thought of bacteria being allowed to fester when it cools down is worrying.

>>12686741
90% of thai people wouldn't be able to answer her question.

>>12686239
Pretty fucking inspiring. Imagine someone breaking in just to take a shit in the stew.

>>12686365

>quite astonishing to me that this doesn't make the people ill who eat it.

It's literally sterile

>>12686723
botulsim takes time to develop. not 24 hours.

>>12686239
Why cant we do this with a pizza?

>>12686760
They've had 45 years

Too much of a good thing. somewhere in that soup their is unidentifiable mush and way way broken down flavor compounds. Overcook a soup or a veggie saute and it really isnt as appetizing.

>>12686239
Honestly if it works with sourdough there probabaly are some other foods eligible.

>>12686471
It kills the bacteria but some toxins from the bacteria remain

>>12686970
botulism spores won't be killed, not unless under pressure and above 120 celsius, which they certainly don't do.

pizza places use literal ancient sourdough starters all the time.

place by me has a 200 year old starter. no one has died there (because of the pizza)

>>12687030
Sourdough is a little different since the microorganisms causing the fermentation in it are outcompeting any patogenic ones that might be introduced.
It's a bit like how you can become more prone to infection by longterm use of antibiotics; the "good" germs that were keeping the "bad" ones at bay are killed and then the nasties are free to move in.
If you took a sourdough starter, sterilised it with heat or radiation, and then left it out it might become infected with something less useful and get rotten or moldy.

>>12686239
more than likely there isn't an element in the stew that is more than a week old

>>12686239
>The owners of Wattana Panich have made it tradition not to clean the 45-years-worth of broth spillover.

>>12687080
This. Nothing in that stew is actually 45 years old

This place is 10 min away from my office. Should I /ck/?

>>12686948
how would you overcook a broth when it's strained every day, there are no old armoatics in there, those are fresh every day

this is common restaurant practice btw, albeit not this extreme, but at the end of service, leftovers of the day will usually end up in a new sauce or broth at some point.

>>12687126
ofc! report back and tell how it is.

>>12687134
I could imagine some of the flavors dissolved in the liquid still remain unfiltered.

Then again really, it's probably been eaten enough that its virtually as if the broth is only a week old or so as someone mention previous

>>12686365
hello whitey

>>12686467
>dying the next time the stew is reheated, and leaving behind toxic waste
So you're saying the stew is not only safe, but ALSO acts as a biologically safe vaccine-esque connoction that strengthens your immune system?

>>12686741
that answer hurts my brain

>>12687183
Everyone here is white until proven subhuman

>>12686467
toxins that cause food poisoning take time to develop, and if the bacteria is constantly being killed, the ssmall amount of pathogens they produce will probably have very little effect, especially because the soup base is diluted by the new water and ingredients added daily

>>12686239
this soup has nen

>>12686239
its called master stock
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master_stock

>>12686829
i think Poilâne Bakery does something like this
it was the bakery where salvador dali bought his bread bedroom
they keep adding a bit of the old (first) bread into the dough of the new one and basically keep selling the old (first) bread

>>12686239
isn't it stale?

>>12686434
>Article should read, "same soup base has been used for decades"
probably no molecules remain that are older than a few days/weeks max
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avogadro_constant

>>12688307

It's called sourdough.

>>12687144
>report back
>5 hours+
I think he's dead.

>>12686467
>and leaving behind toxic waste that can't be cooked out.
please keep posting, this is great

>>12686239
What im getting from this isnt that the broth is 45 years old, but the broth is reused every day.
How is that a problem at all?
Its probably way more sanitary than what happens in your local fast food joint

>>12688342
>sourdough
dear redditor i dont think i mentioned sourdough or sourdough bread
maybe try to read my post again more carefully

>>12687018
Botulinum is anaerobic.
It REQUIRES an oxygen-free environment to grow.
The spores are harmless. The toxin they produce when they grow isn't.

If they can't grow from spores due to oxygen, they can't produce toxin.

>>12688449
No you didnt mention it, but you did describe it, without mention the specific word.

>>12688465
>>12688342
Technically the dough hasn't fermented that long, so its diluted fermentation due the recycling.
So its a sourdough yeast starter, but not a sourdough bread.

>>12687046
Most bakeries just recycle their sourdough unless they fuck up.
So long it gets enough nutrition, the yeast will stay dominant. And as long as that happens, the culture survives.

>>12688457
Half an inch under the surface is anaerobic, retard.

>>12688482
Most intestines recycle their beneficent flora too, you stupid fuck. Maybe if you had better reading comprehension you wouldn't be stuck kneading dough for a living.
Nobody is suggesting that sourdough isn't being, as you retardedly refer to it, recycled.

>>12688342
>>12688465
after actually looking at it again it is sourdough bread from sourdough
here is a video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUxClvWBHtk

i remembered they just add a tiny piece of bread into the ready dough for marketing purposes (so they can say its the original bread sold to dali) and i assume that would not be sourdough

>>12688482
>sourdough starter but not sourdough bread
what do you think defines a sourdough bread you utter dumbass?

>>12688516
using a piece of yesterday's dough (which isn't the same as a sponge or levain) to leaven today's is an old technique which I think still falls under the sourdough umbrella. or at least "naturally leavened" vs using commercial yeast

>>12688499
Right, because oxygen can't be dissolved into liquids. Fish breath by MAGIC.

Soup is water.
Water can hold dissolved gasses.
The soup is, presumably, aerated quite thoroughly by the constant motion of being simmered, scooped out, poured into a strainer, and back into a cookpot.

Maybe don't call someone an idiot when you don't know basic middle-school level science class shit like dissolving gases into water.

>restaurant open for 45 years, hasn't been closed due to people getting sick
>people arguing that it could be poisonous
?

>>12688406
he's right in theory, that's why if you cook and eat rotted meat it will still make you sick despite all the bacteria in the meat being dead, their wastes are toxic as well and the heat won't break them all down.

>>12688846
This is /ck/, some people have argued that in your own cleaned kitchen, they would rather throw out a whole steak if it fell on the clean floor before cooking than eating it.

The soup isn't that old. Assuming they sell half of it everyday and reuse the other half, after seven days you're left with about 0.7% of the soup from seven days ago. It's also filtered and kept safe with heat and refrigerators, there's more concerning matters in the kitchen for hygiene folks.

Within days you wouldn't have more than trace amounts of the stew, and nothing of the shit they put in last week. This is just a retarded marketing gimmick for white women to post on instagram.

>>12688846
>restaurant open for 45 years, hasn't been closed due to people getting sick
>IN THAILAND
That's the big detail you're missing. I'm pretty sure restaurants in Thailand don't get shut down for health concerns unless every customer who eats there dies before managing to finish their meal, and this goes on for at least three days.

>abut that brown hardened shell around the large metal stew pot, it’s testimony to how long the broth has been used for. The owners of Wattana Panich have made it tradition not to clean the 45-years-worth of broth spillover.
If anything, THIS is the part that worries me.
A literal mound of rotting stew stagnating eternally around the entire cooking pot, not inches from the edge of the stew. If anything is going to make you sick at that place, it's anything eaten/cooked around that black/brown ring of death.

>>12689140
So if you get food poisoning, would you go back to that place?
I sure would not, and I doubt others would either, and if it has stood for 45 years with this item on the menu, I assume it is not a problem, no matter where you are.
Except bongland, bad food is the basis of their civilization

Bump

>this thread
The broth is fine you smoothbrains

https://youtu.be/dLE_hnu_4uE

>>12686239
It's got nothing on Master Stock

Once the base stock has been prepared, it is then used as a poaching or braising liquid for meat. Chicken is the most common meat that is cooked in a master stock, although squab, duck, quail, and pork are also often used.[1]

The defining characteristic of a master stock from other stocks is that after initial use, it is not discarded or turned into a soup or sauce. Instead, the broth is stored and reused in the future as a stock for more poachings sometimes for up to 100 years. With each use, the poached meats and other ingredients absorb the stock's flavor while imparting their own back into the stock. In this way, over time, flavour accumulates in the stock, making it richer and more complex with each poaching, while subsequent poached meats absorb this flavor and likewise become more flavorful.

>>12689140
thailand is big on tourism, why wouldnt they take restaurant hygiene seriously?

America does the same thing.

>Haute cuisine versions require mixing pre-cooked roasted meats with beans that have been simmered separately with aromatic vegetables,[citation needed] but this runs counter to cassoulet's peasant origins. In the process of preparing the dish it is traditional to deglaze the pot from the previous cassoulet in order to give a base for the next one. This has led to stories, such as the one given by Elizabeth David, citing Anatole France, of a single original cassoulet being extended for years or even decades.[9] The San Francisco bistro Le Central has kept its cassoulet this way for over 43 years.[10][11]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_stew

>The San Francisco bistro Le Central has kept its cassoulet this way for over 43 years.

>>12690742
Because it's Thailand? It's not like every location is the flagship Hilton for that country. Much less one local or ghetto joint that could sink or swim and the country wouldn't bat an eyelash at it.

>>12686729
Thanks for adding nothing to the conversation.

>>12691072

Yes, next question.

>>12691129
well, since you asked;

"A brilliant transplant surgeon has five patients, each in need of a different organ, each of whom will die without that organ. Unfortunately, there are no organs available to perform any of these five transplant operations. A healthy young traveler, just passing through the city the doctor works in, comes in for a routine checkup. In the course of doing the checkup, the doctor discovers that his organs are compatible with all five of his dying patients. Suppose further that if the young man were to disappear, no-one would suspect the doctor. "

>>12691135
that's not a question

>>12686365
Are you retarded? using the old as a base for the new is common practive in backery. there's no problem reusing the broth like that every day, it's cooked. Reusing the same pot for everyday without the cleaning because you refilled it all day long was common in all europe until the industrial era.

>>12686723
>botulism
>developping in cooked soup
>developping overnight
Americans, the more you try to teach them words, the less they understand anything about life

>>12691042
This so much

Bump

>>12686239
>"mmm that's pretty weird-shaped table looks like cold lava... uh? what did you say? i-it's not a table but 45-yo broth spillover?!"
imagine the smell.........

>>12691142
There are two types of people in this world, anon: those who can extrapolate data from incomplete sets

>>12686391
I don't think you know what the word sterile means.

>>12687144

Tried it today, nothing outstanding on the flavour side.

It's a good thai chinese style beef soup but it's not amazing.

bump

>>12688339
Thank you for this input I was wondering if any atoms from the older soups could be present

>>12692020
Haha I’m one of those people!

>>12691072
why don't they spend the time stopping the train instead of switching pieces

>>12686365
McDonald's uses the same oil to fry their garbage day in day out lol

>>12691072
Stop wasting your time posting bullshit gaynigger meaningless philosophical babble

>>12691135
>>12692020
fatass fedoranigger fucking lol get laid kid you fucking dweeb god damn quit posting unrelated bullshit on a cooking board.

>>12692854
lol imagine being this stupid that someone merely posting thoughts sends you into a fit of rage lol lol

>>12691153

>>12686729
>>12686723
Botulinum toxin is denatured by boiling you massive retards. The spores aren't, but the spores themselves don't cause illness (otherwise you'd die with a spoonful of honey).

>Though spores of C. botulinum are heat-resistant, the toxin produced by bacteria growing out of the spores under anaerobic conditions is destroyed by boiling (for example, at internal temperature greater than 85 °C for 5 minutes or longer). Therefore, ready-to-eat foods in low oxygen-packaging are more frequently involved in cases of foodborne botulism.

https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/botulism

>>12686829
Isn't that how Sourdough is made? By using a pinch of the last sourdough loaf and mixing it into the new bread mix?
So like a sourdough crust pizza maybe???

>>12686365
Ppl replying to this r so dumb lmao. Extremely hot oil is different from simmering temp

bump

The only thing that really skeevs me out about this sort of thing is that I find it really hard to believe that in 45 years, the refrigeration never failed, the stove that simmers it never broke down, and the people handling the broth never got lazy/forgetful in their methods. Theoretically, broth CAN last forever if properly stored and heated. IF. And I've worked in enough kitchens to know that if anything can go wrong, it will happen eventually.

>>12693277
but do they really?

>>12686391
The broth could accumulate cancerous molecules. It's not all that hard to understand the rationale that would make someone wary: for instance we know how unhealthy pretty much all burnt foods are. Even something like potatoes leach out harmful chemicals (acrylamide) when they are cooked to very high temperatures, by deep-frying or baking.

>>12687030
>no one has died there
>(because of the pizza)

bump

>>12692046
Neat.

>>12686365
Faggots like you are the reason why other races hate us

>>12693277
buttburger can't handle the banter

>>12691072
The trolley does not kill anyone.

Remember, to cover a distance, you have to cover a half distance. And to cover a half distance you have to cover a quarter distance.

Etc etc etc.

Because it's impossible to cover an infinite amount of half distances, the trolley will never make it to the people, so I can just walk away!

>>12686239
i bet there's a ketchup bottle sitting outside on a gray wooden table out there that was refilled and never washed for longer

>>12686239
>dishes served at this Thai eatery may put a lot of Westerners off.
>made with stewed and raw beef, tripe, meatballs, internal organs and spices
I wouldn't trust tripes and other organs in such countries. Heck I don't even eat it where I'm living.

>>12686442
>13$ for rillettes and bread
>28$ for a roasted chicken with fries
Holly molly, and I bet it's only half of a chicken.

>>12686442
>San Fagcisco
No thanks, i dun want AIDS

>>12686741
She cute

>>12686365
There's a bakery that makes its sourdough with a 200 year old starter.

bump

>>12696437
was that really banter? thought banter was supposed to be witty

>>12686239
>45 years
>old

People eat 3000 year old butter.

bump

>>12688869
>he's right in theory
He's not. Unless you pretend the context is a world in which time flows at a different rate than it does on Earth.