/ck/ - Food & Cooking

>>10677041
2040

At precisely the time that becomes anywhere close to sustainable and every human stops liking food that tastes good

>>10677057
>he thinks flesh tastes good

>>10677041
scientifically he looks like a faggot

I tell girls i'm vegan to bed them.
>but anon I thought you said you were vegan
>I am it's just a cheat meal
>oh ok, i'll join you then!!

>>10677090
Post body

>>10677041
>The UK is like 10% vegan now
wrong

I wonder how many you'll get with this campaign. What's the point? I'll figure it out eventually I guess, but still. I thought having them hooked on meats was working well for the other systems

Kept my new years resolution and went vegan this year. Grains, soy, greens, fruits, nuts, etc.
As of April I can no longer walk 8 miles, winded at 1. Sleep issues, hard time getting to sleep, and hard to wake up. Constantly feel weak and sick. Put on 80 pounds since January.
In early May my doctor told me I'm now pre-diabetic, lungs have become weak, and absolutely must lose the weight.
I'm two weeks into the way I ate last year and already feeling better, lost 5 pounds.
No fast food, never ate that crap, but lots of beef, chicken and fish with my vegetables.
Veganism nearly killed me, but I'm getting healthy again.

>>10677041
Wrong board buddy
>>>/lgbt/

>>10677095
To make the world a healthier place anon. They do it for their own free will. I gave up red meat and eggs a few weeks ago. It feels good. It's worth trying.

>>10677101
Post your fridge and prove it, timestamp included.

>>10677106
I'm not a vegan and I'll bet I can run farther than you. Tell me, fellow biped lacking a coat of body hair, why is it we evolved to be able to travel greater distances on foot than any other species on the planet?

>>10677135
to look for fruits meatcuck

>>10677137
If it takes you 26 miles to find fruit you would be naturally selected out ^...^>>10677137

>>10677041
never


also vegans keep saying its that much healthier but they are confounding the results with the simple benefit afforded by not eating crappy processed foods


essentially vegans are really bad at observation and critically thinking, but thats ok. It still is far better than the typical diet (simply because the typical diet is absolute garbage)

>>10677135
hunting

>>10677041
Never. They’ll perfect lab-grown meat first. We’re omnivorous, vegans, steak won, tofu lost, get over it!

>>10677167
This

it removes the ethical debate away from it
And that is why most vegans do it, they're giant pussies who don't want to admit that plants also have feels and try to protect themselves

life eats life

>>10677180
Vegans will find a way to object to lab-grown meat, guaranteed. It’s not really about morality, it’s about virtue signalling and being a contrarian.

>>10677193
If lab grown meat becomes the norm, you'll be the definition of vegan, dumbass. Quit talking shit about your own children, asshole.

>>10677239
>vegans preemptively moving the goalposts

If a cow ever got the chance he’d eat you and everyone you cared about!

>>10677041
>celebrity does things for attention
Hurr durr.

People will eat bugs before they go vegan.

>mfw my vegetarian coworker complained of her low iron
>hurr I eat lots of spinach though durr

I've told her to at least eat mollusks but she's retarded.

>>10677068

>>10677090
I tell girls I'm Vegan just to bed them. Chicks dig aliens.

>>10677180
>plants also have feels
why do retards keep repeating this meme

>>10677041
IS being a vegetarian no longer cool?? What's with this vegan shit? What's the damn difference?

>>10677057
animal products like meat and milk roughy 10 times as much space and water to produce. If Americans reduced their meat intake by 10% it would have a massive environmental impact. In the future we're going to be basically vegetarians who eat meat once in a while

>>10677101
fake and gay

>>10677135
to be able to carry stuff longer distances

>>10677041
wow he's so brave

>>10677193
environmental reasons
either that or something like the panic about GMOs not being fully vetted

>>10677486
you can explain to her that the iron in spinach has the wrong valence for hemoglobin so it's poorly absorbed

>>10677135
To be able to run away from lifes problems and complain about it on the internet.

>>10677843
dairy and eggs still require a lot of resources to produce and at least in the case of chickens their living conditions are shit

>>10677891
that's what alcohol is for

>>10677887
She says she won't eat anything that has organs. I told her plants have consiousness and organs as well as that she should consider either organ meat or mollusks to get what she is deficient in. I told her that clams are a simpler form of life than plants but she said they move therefore no.

>>10677918
well I guess she's weighed that against her bloodwork and made up her mind. you should still tell her though, she's only a little better off eating spinach instead of iron filings

>>10677927
I just don't get why you would value mollusks over plants and fungi. They're also ancient and fungi and plants both have higher levels of conciousness than mollusks. You can get enough b12 and iron from clams alone.

Delusional. Majority >50% population vegan? in5 years? WTF? Lucky if it ever happens in the next 200 years at least. What the fuck are you doing to yourself deluding yourself like this. What is the agenda here really?

>>10677851
So basically omnivores

>>10677851
We'll switch to cricket farming before that happens.

>>10677976
yeah. meat is going to become expensive as china gets richer. India too but they have a lot of vegetarians, but I think that's mostly out of necessity since a ton of them live on less than $2 a day and it's just too expensive to eat meat

>>10677106
Aren't parts of dandelions poisonous?

>>10677041
It will never happen. There's too many corporations that have to increase shareholder dividend growth yearly. They cant do it.

>>10677041
never, since 80% of people who start a vegan diet quit it within 2 years.

it's a fad diet for virtue signalling while in your early to mid 20's to get easy activist poon.

>>10677851
we get more open space.. for what?

What the fuck is their problem with eggs and milk
Eggs and milk are great

I could go vegetarian no problem, but not vegan.

It might happen with synthetic meats etc.

>>10677041
>vegan
>diet
>10%
You are wrong.
Vegetarian perhaps...vegetarians are cool.
Vegans are assholes...and usually smell like one.

>>10678175
grain to feed the extra 5 billion people on the planet instead of the livestock

>>10678196
Factory farming conditions

But meat tastes good. And is less expensive than its dietary alternatives.

But hey, once there is a vegan alternative to the experience of cutting into a medium rare steak, and the meat is so tender the knife just sliiiiides through it and then when you bite into it you just sort of melt into, I'd try being vegan.

>>10677843
>vegan
>vegetarian
>difference
Vegetarians are often at parties, receptions, dinners, and meeting serving food. You usually dont notice.
Vegans make a point to EVERYBODY theyre vegan.

Vegetarians to varying degrees do not eat meat. Many are fine with dairy and to a lesser degree eggs...some are fine with seafood particularly if it didnt have a face like clams and mussels.

Vegans do not eat or utilize(unless its convenient) ANY animal products...meat, dairy, honey, leather, many soaps, deodorants, makeup etc

One is a diet.
The other is a lifestyle.

>>10678285
Found the vegetarian

>>10677918
>I told her plants have consiousness

>>10677851
I dont think milk consumption by itself is a problem but meat is, most people cant even handle the consept of eating a meal that has no meat in itself but instead the meat/protein is subsituted by.. say a dairy product like cheese or with simple fucking eggs!

Also the over-use/prioritizing the "good" parts of meat ie the parts where steaks etc come from, apart from minced meat most people dont know shit about how to handle the... "worse" usually cheaper cuts of meat and even then they tend to fuck up the "good" cuts by being plain bad cooks and retarded.

it will happen when cheap meat animal products are no longer viable option
i've heard predictions of global crop failures becoming normal in as little as a decade, so maybe in a decade

>>10678251
???? you are basing your argument around there being a) no space left and b) not enough food for literally every person on the planet to live healthily, both of which are false.

>>10678341
Probably this. The models indicate the US livestock feed belt will be a desert by 2100. Unironically, the models from 20 years ago are proving correct and theg were far behind the tech we have now. If anyone should be proactively building a wall it should be canada, because amerilards will be the refugees in short order.

>>10677041
never because only faggots actively choose to limit the amount of delicious foods they can consume

>>10677041
Have fun with iron deficiency and lack of protein for those fading muscles.

>>10678285
I think Papa Franku said it best about vegans.

>>10678432
I think you underestimate the damage that global warming is going to do to the planet's arable land (and almost all of it is being cultivated already btw). Meat will continue to get more and more expensive because of demand due to population growth, lack of water resources, and more expensive feed. People will necessarily be priced out of meat consumption and will substitute it with plant products because they need to eat. So yeah, there literally won't be enough meat to go around, and no, there is not more space left. Space might be created in places like Canada as the planet warms but that will be offset by poor crop yields in places like Nebraska, where the wells are being dug deeper and deeper because the aquifer is drying out and not being replenished. There will be enough food for us, but it won't be meat

>>10677041
What year will people stop liking what I don't like.

>>10678528
Joji is a vegetarian though.

>>10678534
I will never stop eating meat, or decrease my consumption. If I need to I will hunt illegally.

>>10678740
You’ll be executed for poaching

>>10678740
That's fine, it's going to cost you though

>>10678740
If we go all Soylent Green, will you hunt the most dangerous game?

>>10677041
If the UK is 10% vegan, it's because the entire Paki population in UK is veg...thats all it is...

>>10678341
i've heard predictions of global crop failures becoming normal in as little as a decade, so maybe in a decade
Was that like an Al Gore 'prediction?' Like when he said that the Northern passage would be completely ice free by 2009? That we would experience cataclismic climate change the likes of which will decimate the 'Earth we love...'...
Problem is, is that nothing has happened...and will never happen...these are people that are offended by other people doing things they don't approve of...
Doom and gloomers have been around for hundreds of years...the Industrial Revoulution, and the introduction of Henry Fords Model 't' is a fine representation of the vile crap these fools believe...according to some of the claptrap written 100 years ago, 200 years ago, it was the beginning of the 'End of the World as we Know it..."
Yet, here we are, going though the same shit all over again...wash, rinse, repeat...

>>10678850
pakis aren't vegan have you seen how much butter and cream they eat?

>>10677149
>essentially vegans are really bad at observation and critically thinking
That's because their brains are starving for protein

>>10677090
why would you want to sleep with a vegan? wouldn’t their skin be all wrinkly?

>>10679086
there are plenty of hot vegans, they tend to keep to themselves about it. I think a lot of people underestimate how many vegans there are and think that it's only the shrill harpies that do it. I worked with a guy for 6 months before I found out. We went to a bar and I asked him "want to split some cheese fries"
>na cant dude I'm vegan

I want a vegan so I can feed my carnivorous plant

>>10679086
>wouldn’t their skin be all wrinkly?
No, pic related

So how do vegans feel about the billions of snakes insects and rodents that are killed and processed with the anual harvest of their fruits grains nuts and vegetables? I mean...we ALL eat other animals whether we want to or not. There may be an exception for someone growing and harvesting everything they eat by hand but if you are claiming to be "vegan" and then buy your grain or grain products from a retailer you are at best contributing to the death of billions of lifeforms every year..and eating more of them than you realize.

>>10677180
>who don't want to admit that plants also have feels and try to protect themselves

Not to mention that those fancy gardens and agriculture fields are not arriving out of thin air.
Their soybean meal, probably, cost some poor animal its home.

>>10677041
>everyone will be vegan by 2023
>5 years from now
Anon, I hate to tell you, but I'll still be alive at that point, and will absolutely not be a vegan.

>>10679210
Oh cool, so they look like a 45 year-old child.
>pic related mfw

>>10677041
Never. Veganism is just a fad by privileged white people. And that's funny due to people raving about privileges being mostly same people.

Most of the population can't afford to be vegans.
And if we just exclude those as not being a part of civilized world...

Still never. lab grown and insect based proteins are gonna hit the shelves first, eliminating most of the reasons of being a vegan. The term itself will most likely be obsolete in few decades.

>>10677193
This guy knows what's up.

So I've noticed lately that a lot of angry people I run into turned out to be vegan. So I did a search for angry vegan on reddit and ran into this little gem.
>Wife has decided to stop being vegan
>u/TeacherManCT
>I'm at almost 6 years, she is a little over four. She has had knee and back problems, and a neck and knee surgery. During the recovery from both she gained some weight (not that she wasn't already overweight). Her doctor today gave her a hard time about her weight and she so she has decided to start eating meat and cut carbs. We've had the conversation about counting calories and more exercise but apparently that doesn't make sense to her or her doctor.
>Am I wrong to feel upset/angry? I don't want to use the word betrayed, but that's closer to how I feel.
If this doesn't tell you how cult like and religion like veganism is and how fucking dumb these people are then I don't know what to tell you. This guy literally puts his rediculous beliefs above the health of his own wife. What's not a surprise is his support group on reddit all agrees with him lol.
https://www.reddit.com/r/vegan/comments/2t8ggq/wife_has_decided_to_stop_being_vegan/

>>10679691
>she gained some weight (not that she wasn't already overweight
What the fuck are they doing, mainlining cans of beans?

>>10677820
It's not a meme, how the fuck else would a plant know when to close on a fly to consume it. Plants are not vegan btw lmfao.

>>10677918
>but she said they move therefore no.
But plants move too. Buy her one of the obvious ones, like a fly trap.

>>10679691
Oh lord another post from the same guy.
>I just feel that this shift from her is an excuse to not be honest with herself. She doesn't exercise enough and for years hasn't really paid attention to what goes into her mouth. The result is weight gain, which she has blamed on vegan diet.
>One of her other docs also said she weighed too much and needed more protein so she told me she was going to eat eggs. I pointed out that 2oz of Gimme Lean sausage has at more protein, no fat, and no cholesterol and that killed the egg conversation.
>Hell, each morning I have a shake with 16oz of unsweetened almond milk and some vegan protein. 22grams protein and 200 calories total.
>For those who said divorce or move out, it isn't that easy. But I greatly appreciate the support from all of you.
I actually feel sorry for his wife.

>>10677969
Veganism is one of the bigger virtue signals that someone trendy can do these days!

Once meat becomes too expensive.

>>10677135
To chase down the pineapples

>>10679210
You should have chosen a better photo to post.

>>10679700
I literally shake bone meal onto most of my garden.

Keep drinking your goylent, estrogents! Don't question any of our prescribed ideological narratives!

>>10677858
big if true

>>10679691
>care about rebdit opinion
nah

when do you think vegans will become productive enough to stop giving a fuck about what other people eat

>>10678936
Climate change huh.

Anyway, veganism is a giant bullshit scheme. Plants are living beings with feelings and fears too, but they don't have cute faces, so vegans ignore that.

You have to kill to live, that's just how it is. Also, veganism can only prosper in a country with less and less white people.

>>10677820
Cause you retards keep whining about the sentience of animals, because a chicken is obviously not sapient. Meanwhile you don't realise that by the actual definition plants and bacteria are sentient.

>>10677851
Tell that to almonds

>>10680033
https://www.nzz.ch/klimapolitik_verteilt_das_weltvermoegen_neu-1.8373227

Sourced for anon, because anon didn't. Probably because anon has never bothered to check the source and notice that it's selectively quoted out of order to mask that he's talking about the distribution of emissions, not wealth, and it's in German.

I have my biases. But the very first thing I do with anything that seems to confirm them is make god damn sure its true before regurgitating it for years on end.

>>10677041
>taking anyone with cum in their name seriously

>>10677041
They'll have ethical, artificial meat before they make it convenient and tasty enough for the masses to go vegan.

>>10679697

Yes. Most vegans can't really cook for shit, so they have to chew through a fuckload of carbs to get the necessary amount of protein and fat. Also, plant protein is a bit more shit from what I remember.

Also, how many buff vegans do you see? Skinny and frail, yes. Muscular and fit, no. It's just choosing to be dumb.

>>10681237
Most vegan men are strong. Vegans have higher testosterone. They're naturally built. Some are skinny, but being skinny is better than being skinnyfat or a lard ass, which is 95% of omnivores. Check out this picture is the vegan chess club.

>>10679086
there cum generally tastes a lot better

>>10681423
>"Vegan" bodybuilders that go full vegan after getting their IFBB
>Vegan "bodybuilders" that look like regular gymrats after 2 cuts
wew lad

>>10677041
The irony of the UK becoming vegan is that if it ever became something the majority of the population did it would require them to chop down what few woodlands they still possess in order for agriculture.

>>10677851
What is seafood, AKA the thing that is eaten the most in Bongland and refraining from is in essence ignoring their largest singular source of sustenance.

>>10680135
You will find literally zero academic research suggesting plant sentience is real. Actual zero. Do you even know what sentience means?

>>10681776
Actual zero or literally zero

>>10677041
Does receiving transfusion from babies and children's blood count as vegan diet?

>>10677135
To waddle to McDonalds and Walmart to stuff ourselves with factory-farmed beef obviously

>>10678740
>Carnies aren’t mentally i...

>>10677041
>The UK is like 10% vegan now

You're also a bunch of fags.

>>10679238
Veganism is about minimizing all that. Obviously growing x amount of food to eat directly has less of an impact than growing 5x amount to feed livestock which will eventually feed you. On top of that, it’s a poor argument when you do not consciously consider all that death and recognize it as bad, but do not change your own habits, similar to pic related

>>10678110
nigga we fucking pick dandelion leafs and eat it like a salad. Because farming origins, not because vegans

>>10681810
Maybe you boy,

I don't eat red meat. I eat chicken and fish. Organic even, free range, whatever meme words you wana put on top. You literally can't win this argument. My body is in better physical shape than yours and my cardiovascular system alone will outperform any vegans

>>10681237
>Also, how many buff vegans do you see? Skinny and frail, yes. Muscular and fit, no. It's just choosing to be dumb.
How many fat non-vegans do you see? 100% of all fat people aren't vegan. Also lots of vegans are muscular as fuck because it naturally boosts HGH and test, even the thin ones are probably stronger than comparable non-vegans.
>all the cope in this thread
lol

>>10681926
*lives longer than you
guess I win the argument

>>10681939
Honestly your fatphobia is disgusting, you really should stop body shaming such a sizeable portion of our population you bigot.

>>10681946
Time will tell.

>>10681954
Fat vegans are like skinny omnivores. Rare, almost a delicacy.

>>10681926
>Post referring to 99% of meat consumed
>But my high ground is more moral because I don’t eat that meat!
Give it up. Eating meat is indefensible at this point, and organic free range just serves as a financial and moral front for the shitty practices of the entire industry.

>>10681954
>that thing
>vegan
Maybe for an hour, until she scarfs down her next buger.

Protip, every pierced red hair dyed landwhale who talks about body shaming and feminism and whatever other gay retarded shit they love on tumblr these days is going to claim to be vegan, it's never true.

>>10681984
There's no morality in my reasoning. We need to eat animals. I don't eat red meat due to the possibility of putrefaction in the small intestines and colon, but please keep asserting your logic, it's not an argument I haven't won before. I know more about health than you.

>>10681983
>skinny omnivores
>rare
90% of the world's population sure is rare...

>>10681996
>he doesn't understand sarcasm in text form

>>10681991
Fried rice is vegan, your undesireables exist too, turdburgler. Junk food vegans and caketarians are as common as malnourished vegans/vegetarians. But go ahead, repost the same 4 guys that spent 6 years sculpting a body that looks like your average crossfit memelord after 2 years.

>>10682023
Listen man, no one starts threads trying to get people to eat meat. The only reason this exists is a flawed being is seeking any justification for the lifestyle xe choose after they watched a YouTube vid about Tyson chicken

>>10682023
>Junk food vegans and caketarians are as common
Nice cope. No-one believes this, not even you.

>>10682189
I believe it

>>10682189
>Inigo-Montoya.png

>>10681776
Sentience is the capacity to feel, perceive or experience subjectively.

Plants perceive their environment and react accordingly

>>10681678
myth

raising meat uses more land than using the land to farm food for humans

>>10682587
What you seem to be missing is that relatively little land is able to be used to grow crops that humans can eat, whereas those crops edible to animals can be grown nearly everywhere.

If you are raising only human-edible crops then a massive proportion of farmland is suddenly useless.

>>10681995
>We need to eat animals
>I know more about health than you.
>Imblying
Take your ego defense mechanisms elsewhere, they have no place in actual discussion

>>10677041
>10% vegan
You what, I have never met a single vegan in my life and I live in London and go to one of the faggiest unis. I know two vegetarians tho

>>10679210
her skin looks really sad and droopy under all that makeup. but you autists cant read facial expressions so you think people like this are “hot”. to me, this person literally looks like she is dying.

>>10681423
those men look so faggy. are you blind?

Little kike meat cucks getting triggered they cant slurp down their beefy big sausages anymore

>>10682993
They look faggy? Why? Are they usually the type of guys you blow?

>>10677094
>self-reported in an Oxfam survey

being vegan is pretty easy, cunts just have a big ego about their steak and bacon and make themselves look retarded

>>10683009
>Swallows semen
some vegan

>be me
>don't like animals dying but man's gotta eat
>have dream that I get reincarnated as animal
>freaks me the fug out
>internal conflict between feeling as though I don't want to contribute to the death of animals and feeling as though my actions don't really matter
>rationalize that if everybody thinks this way then nothing will ever change
>guess I'm going vegan
>still eat food that's going to be thrown away
>realize that I can do even better if I can get food that's going to be thrown away to be eaten by someone that would have eaten some other animal product
/blog
also plants have feelings, only eat fruit once it's fallen to the ground, resist the demiurge and so on
>>10677041
I don't think it's going to be anytime soon, but maybe there could be some massive shift. Five years is way too soon though.

>>10682189
What. They're incredibly common.

>>10683448
Eh, losing eggs would suck for a lot of people. Cheap as fuck, easy to cook and a good protien source.

>>10683493
Apparently the answer is that semen swallowing is
A: vegan
B: something else they allegedly excel at
http://veganfaq.blogspot.com/2007/09/is-human-breast-milksemen-vegan.html

>>10682956
So you have no rebuttal, tell me how your a vegan diet allows for prolonged joint health after decades of exercise without collagen introduced from meat

considering the primary food supply on mars will be grubs, never

>>10684014
Tell me this without making a passive aggressive statement about not needing to exercise if you don't eat meat, string bean

>>10681683
We are overfishing the seas already and that's only going to get worse. There's plenty of aquaculture already going on. And I hope you don't like shellfish because the increased acidity in the oceans literally dissolves their shells. 90% of the great barrier reef is bleached, 40% is beyond repair

>>10679720
>I pointed out that 2oz of Gimme Lean sausage has at more protein, no fat, and no cholesterol
When will people learn that fat and cholesterol does not automatically equal unhealthy?

>>10677041
this is an extremely liberal/leftist tactic.
i won't address the question because it implies that i am not civilized if i'm not a vegan.
you're a piece of shit for being the way you are.

>>10677057
Yeah, if only veganism was sustainable. We should feed animals all of our crops instead so we can eat like 10 bites of yummy meat

>>10677041

Go take your bullshit to reddit and see what happens.

>>10677041
veganism and keto are the meme diets right now. a few years ago it was paleo/primitive, before that it was Atkins and traditional vegetarianism and pescetarianism, etc.

i'm not vegan but i enjoy making healthier vegan options from time to time for the sake of variety. vegans will die off as soon as people realize that calling yourself a part of a diet movement doesn't help you lose weight if you don't change your activity or your cooking habits. i say it's got two or three years max, OMAD or intermittent fasting might go meme-tier by then

>>10685099
A vegan that doesnt understand shit about agriculture? Say it aint so

>>10677041
vegans are baby killers

fuck you for killing our children with malnutrition

>>10685226
>caring about weight
>caring about exercise
>cooking
Oh boy. Let me guess everything in moderation right? Counting calories is good?
Fucking sheeps when will they learn.

>>10685269
> t. literal blob

>>10685293
Lol I'm underweight by modern standard.

>>10685240
>trophic levels
>cellulose
>99.9% of livestock are just fed soy and wheat
Another instance of farmer Cletus knowing the world around him

>>10677041
Never since most beer isnt vegan

>>10685997
>not drinking liquor

>>10677041
>vegan
>awakened
lol no, you fucking troglodyte

>>10681423
>>10681939

roids are vegan btw

>>10677146
Well guess what, there's ample evidence to suggest that early humans ate mostly vegetarian diets with only a little meat on the side (which is understandable, considering how dangerous it was to get). Even now, our closest evolutionary relatives and extant hunter-gatherer tribes predominantly eat fruits and greens. Thus, most popular 'paleo' diets trending in public are shams far removed from prehistorical fact.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2115127-ancient-leftovers-show-the-real-paleo-diet-was-a-veggie-feast/

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/foodfeatures/evolution-of-diet/

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/paleo-diet-may-need-a-rewrite-ancient-humans-feasted-wide-variety-plants-180961402/

I don't know, man, I was vegetarian for the first 20 years of my life pretty strict, but I was also chunky and unhealthy due to a mostly sedentary lifestyle. I was never averse to meat or hated it, I actually thought it looked incredibly appetizing but I couldn't bare the thought of hurting an animal or whatever for my food.

Then my dumbass realized that literally no matter what you do, something has to die for you to continue existing. Transporting goods, harvesting crops, all that shit takes resources that displace and kill hundreds if not thousands of animals all the fucking time, so there's virtually no point in being vegan other than the virtue signal points.

Plus, even when I was vegetarian, I would salivate at the thought of a cheeseburger or a big ass steak and when I finally tried it just a few years ago, I couldn't believe what I'd missed out on. Not only that but I'm 100% OBJECTIVELY healthier than I was when I was vegetarian.

>>10686203
did you even read those before you posted them?

>>10686495
https://www.health.harvard.edu/heart-health/sodiumpotassium-ratio-important-for-health
>Our Paleolithic hunter-gatherer ancestors took in about 11,000 milligrams (mg) of potassium a day from fruits, vegetables, leaves, flowers, roots, and other plant sources, and well under 700 mg of sodium. That's a sodium-to-potassium ratio of 1 to 16. Today, we get more sodium (3,400 mg) than potassium (2,500 mg), for a ratio of 1.36 to 1.

What's your sodium:potassium ratio, by any chance? Do you even know? I bet you don't. I bet you're just a fast food kiddy like the rest. Doomed to bowel cancer.

>>10685989
>Oh shit he pointed out what a retard I am
>Better throw out some words I dont understand and stats straight from my ass

>>10686536
>triggered cleteus is mad about his beef estrogen induced tits
>We found that USA beef contained much higher levels of estrogen, particularly E2, than Japanese beef (Figure 1). The median concentrations (pg/g) of E2 and E1 in USA beef fat (14.0, 7.7) were 140 times and 11 times, respectively, higher than those in Japanese beef fat (0.1, 0.7). In red meat, E2 and E1 levels of USA beef (3.8, 1.0) were ∼600 times and 10 times, respectively, higher than those of Japanese beef (0.0, 0.1).
https://academic.oup.com/annonc/article/20/9/1610/218592
Enjoy your induced transsexualism when you invert your own dick L M A O

>>10686547
>Vegan continues to regurgitate without understanding
Saturated fats make you fat, dietery cholesterol gives you cholesterol, estrogen gives you estrogen. It must suck being this much of a brainlet.

>>10686565
>ur wrong
Found the head of the debate team. Are you a lawyer anon?

>>10686516
>our ancestors were literally sodium deficient
Yes, It is hypothesized to be the reason we like salty foods, and why sodium resobtion in the kidneys is much more efficient than potassium resorbtion

>>10686587
Because cow estrogen and human estrogen are totally the same thing right? Every thread vegans decide they can suddenly read these studies and miss 90% of the content for the 3 words they can actually understand.
>Durrr more estrogen
Wow the steroid used in cheap ass beef has a cattle specific estrogen that when eaten too much raises risks of reaching stage one or two ovarian/prostate cancer by like 3% great find.

>>10686610
Actually estradiol-17β is a naturally occuring estrogen in humans, its just 99% useless in males. The only link ever actually found was that some guys get longer laster sperm from it, though its a rare occurence. Give women great big milkers though if they eat too much beef.

>not having backyard chickens

LOL!

>>10686665
>Give women great big milkers though if they eat too much beef.
>too much
I don't understand.

>>10686610
>cow estrogen and human estrogen are totally the same thing right?
They are literally the same thing. You brainlet.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estradiol
>In 1926, Parkes and Bellerby coined the term estrin to describe the hormone on the basis of it inducing estrus in animals.[74]
>>10686665
>its just 99% useless in males
Full retard. It's essential to bone development and prostate health in conjunction with test.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11730247
>>10686721
>give women breast cancer and endometriosis/infertility
>this is a good thing
http://www.cumc.columbia.edu/publications/in-vivo/Vol2_Iss10_may26_03/

>>10686741
But that's not what you said. Great big milkers in and of themselves aren't a bad thing.

>>10686750
>I enjoy a less fertile society and the death of my people
Confirmed subversive leftist.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12650711

Try turning this into a vegan.

>>10686758
Your persecution complex is showing. I said >>10686721
and
>>10686750
in response to the specifically related segment. I don't care about the other shit, I just liked big titties.

I'm not gonna lie, a good chunk of the reason I have any interest in being vegan is a sense of smug superiority that I see vegans having. I want in on that. Just be like "Oh yeah, I'm vegan, you know how it is"

>>10677041
>awaken
what did he mean by this?

>>10686762
I'm sure his doctor already has. The average age for pear shapes in the US is 55.

>>10677041
That's not a civilized person that's a fucking alien and was that shit written by the chick from the commercials with the dogs that got their shits kicked in?

>>10678566
>goes on a show to eat a bunch of hot chicken wings
The fuck are you talking about.

>>10677041
on the DOTR when we establish the 4th Reich and ban the consumption of meat

>>10686203
A lot of the memeing about chimps being vegetarian comes from some misunderstanding where people think insectovores aren't carnivores/omnivores. Chimps love to east insects constantly. Moreover, larger chimp tribes have been found to regularly arrange hunting parties to tear apart animals to eat meat. Chimps are total omnivores.

>>10677041
Why would you deprive your body of vital compounds we cannot naturally make?

>"B...But x crop contains similar compounds found in meats and fish"

Most plants that contain, say, Omega 3 would need to be consumed in huge amounts to come anywhere close to the compound density of fish. Another example could be certain amino acods our bodies need but cannot produce on our own, meats are dense in amino acids we need. As for protein, same applies, whilst some legumes like peanuts are more protein dense than most meats, all vegetables and legumes aren't anywhere close to insects in protein density.
In instances where a crop can provide a suitable substitute, it is usually very expensive or the land used to grow it is reinforcing a subsistent existence on the third world farmers that grow it, essentially making them cash crops 2.0.

>"Killing animals and fish is bad"
Completely objective viewpoint everyone has a different view on. Ethics is a muddy area and anything can be argued. Plants have been shown to release electrical responses to having leaves and fruits picked off them, on the other hand fish possess no capability of feeling pain, only a pressure differencial between their environment and their bodies, and you could counter those two examples with your own. Ultimately fuck off forcing your ethics onto other people.

If you want to be a vegan though, go ahead. Just don't force your lifestyle into every interaction with other people.

>>10688934
A lot of these people think that every one of the weird plants they need for every nutrient can be grown in every country for some reason.

>>10677041
>only 30% of vegas stay on-diet for 2 years or more
>only 14% of vegetarians stay on-diet for 2 years or more

there's your problem.

>>10681033
THIS

>>10688934
>Most plants that contain, say, Omega 3 would need to be consumed in huge amounts to come anywhere close to the compound density of fish.

Our body doesn't use much EPA+DHA. You only need trace amounts of ALA in your diet to stay topped up in normal circumstances. There are credible arguments for some nutrient deficiency in the vegan diet, omega 3 isn't one of them ... vegans have high blood levels.

http://naturallyintense.net/blog/diet/nutrition/fish-is-not-necessarily-the-best-source-of-long-chain-omega-3-fatty-acids/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20861171

>>10686810
Watch the filthy frank video on vegans

>>10689497
Here I'll link it. LOL perfect for this thread
youtube.com/watch?v=Yxs_mTRjLAU

>>10689500
Whoops.

Okay I'm mobile posting, fuck haters

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Yxs_mTRjLAU

>>10689503
>>10689497
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/lifestyle/2018/05/vegans-are-right-about-meat-s-impact-on-the-environment-study-confirms.html
Joji claims he's a vegetarian and said he feels bad about tossing meat and chicken feet all over for his videos.

>>10677090
Are you the same shitposter that pretends he fucks muslim women? Fucking degenerate.

>>10677041
>The UK is like 10% vegan now. My guess is 2023.
thge proofs please

>>10689934
Killing as many westerners as possible before you get taken down is the most impactful way to preserve the existing environment.

The environment will do fine any way. Who cares if we're a mass extinction event, life will go on regardless.

>>10677486
I eat beans and am fine.

>>10678740
Why don't you hunt humans, big man? Shouldn't you be defending your home from the foreign hordes?

>>10689934
>Joji claims he's a vegetarian and said he feels bad about tossing meat and chicken feet all over for his videos.
He ate chicken wings on Hot Ones, so unless had converted in the last 8 months, no.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=14&v=kjNU-dbG3ek

>>10677041
I don't object to being vegan

I'm just to keep lazy to change my diet. If they replaced my food with vegan food that would be fine

Vegan sausages and stuff

>>10677104
If you are concerned about health you might also consider giving up processed meat as it's considered to be a group 1 carcinogen. Consumption of 50g of processed meat per day essentially has about a 1/100 chance of resulting in early death from colorectal cancer. It increases your odds from around 5% up to a little over 6% if I recall correctly.

>>10690041
>Vegan sausages and stuff
This exists: http://beyondmeat.com/products

>>10681954
Fat people are disgusting and decrease quality of life for the rest of us. I shouldn't have to share my seat with your belly fat. I shouldn't have to pay more for healthcare because of your easily preventable chronic diseases. Stop being fat you disgusting monster.

>>10682958
You honestly ask everyone you meet if they are vegan? You honestly sound like the worst kind of faggot.

>>10677167
>>10677180
>>10677193
L A B G R O W N M E A T
A
B

G
R
O
W
N

M
E
A
T

>>10677167
>>10677180
You both are demonstrating a fundemental lack of understanding of what veganism is. Here is the definition from The Vegan Society, which was founded by Donald Watson (the person who coined the term "vegan"):
>Veganism is a way of living which seeks to exclude, as far as is possible and practicable, all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose.

Lab grown meat, if produced without animal exploitation, is definitely vegan. The fact that it is "meat" has nothing to do with whether it is vegan. That being said, the companies working on this still have not found a viable substitute for fetal bovien serum. There are alternatives to fetal bovine serum for other purposes, but nobody has produce any evidence of having much luck working with them for the purposes of in-vitro meat production. The problem with fetal bovine serum, is that it requires constant harvesting of cow fetuses. Fetal bovine serum is the source of nutrients for the stem cells. This means that the mass of the in-vitro meat comes from nutrients in the fetal bovine serum. Due to the laws of thermodynamics, it is very easy to demonstrate that this is an inefficient way of producing meat. The amount of calories that go into producing the cow fetuses will be far greater than the number of calories which can be obtained from the final product. This makes it less sustainable and arguably less ethical when compared to even standard animal agriculture practices.

As a vegan, I do look forward to the day when that technology is perfected and does not require any animal products to produce (besides the initial sample of stem cells which can then be reproduced indefinitely without live animals)

>>10677486
>mfw my vegetarian coworker complained of her low iron
>hurr I eat lots of spinach though
The problem is not that vegan diets are inherrently low in iron. Anyone who regularly eats legumes (which everyone should, given that it's the only commonality between all blue zone diets). Spinach and other leafy greens could potentially give enough iron. They certainly have enough per calorie. However, it requires a very large volume of them. The real problem is that most people within the vegan community bury their heads in the sand and pretend like they are magically immune to health problems if they are vegan. Many of them eat terrible diets or undereat as a result. Nonvegans are usually deficient in one or more essential nutrients as well. Unfortunately, nutritional deficiencies are very common regardless of whether a person is vegan. If you want to be healthy, you have to do some research either way.

As far as the story about your coworker's alleged iron deficiency, I am actually pretty skeptical. Studies show that vegans on average have higher iron than nonvegans. I think it's more likely that you are making things up (as nonvegans often do for some reason) or your coworker never spoke to a doctor and simply assumed they were iron deficient. As someone who tracks my micronutrients religiously, I find it's pretty difficult to be deficient in iron without being calorie deficient also. Was it possible your coworker was using veganism as a thinly vieled cover for anorexia?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3967195/
>The consumption of dietary poly-unsaturated fatty acids, dietary fiber and iron was related with the degree of restriction, with the highest consumption for vegans and the lowest for omnivores.

>>10682587
>>10682594
Also doesn't account for pastures, which is a climate that will all but disappear if grain agriculture is increased (as would be necessary to cover the calorie requirements)

>>10686203
>extant hunter-gatherer tribes predominantly eat fruits and greens
"no"

>>10681983
You'd be surprised. There are a ton of pudgy vegans out there who guzzle Diet Coke and eat other fake shit because its technical Vegan.

>>10688934
Plants in general are just not very digestible for humans. All vegan diets are starvation diets and the only reason anyone is able to stay on them for so long is autophagy.

>>10682594
>>10691325
The primary crops grown to feed farmed animals are wheat, corn, oats, and soy. We grow so much of this to feed farmed animals that it could actually sustain all the humans on the planet multiple times over.

>>10690900
I've been on a vegan diet for awhile, dealing with the crazies is certainly irritating, as more pick it up, they'll start going away due to being a minority.

Regular blood tests, and consulting with a doctor, as well as regularly taking vitamins to fill in deficiencies is important.

>>10690872
As soon as we develop a culture of stem cells that can reliably be grown without injecting fresh harvests that wont be a problem, studying the cow genome is part of this, give it time.

>>10691340
They still eat less than most 1st world people eat. Mostly grains and such, with meat as a side dish, and not always for every meal or even every day. Even if they're eating meat on a regular basis, it's still less than you get if you're eating nothing but meat as the majority of each meal.

>>10691410
>hunter-gatherers
>grains
And no they do not. The Hadza men eat literally nothing but meat. They eat root vegetables in times of starvation but this is considered lowly and undesireable.

>>10690900
Unfortunately, nutritional deficiencies are very common regardless of whether a person is vegan. If you want to be healthy, you have to do some research either way.

But muh B12 that's fortified either way since farm animals are supplemented

It's physically impossible to be 100% vegan without having a B12 deficiency.

Some vegans claim that the bacteria living inside you produce their own B12. This is true. However those bacteria reside in the sigmoid colon and rectum, far beyond where absorption occurs. You would need to re-digest them again to make the B12 absorbable.

So vegans are B12 deficient unless they either
A: eat their own feces or
B: take B12 vitamin supplements, which are produced from meat byproducts, or from fecal bacteria

>muh environmental veganism
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpTHi7O66pI

>>10691437
It's very easy to be iron deficient as well. Only paper shot like spinach is iron-rich but our bodies cannot process the iron we need (we evolved eating meat and fat after all). Same shit for Omega 3s, the ones in stuff like flaxseed is useless when compared to the one from fish.

>>10691437
Vegans will ignore your logic. I like your post and it is accurate. Keep being intelligent anon.

>>10691437
Farm animals should obtain the bacteria to make B12 from the soil covered roots of the plants they eat. Most, at least in the US, don't and are supplemented with this

>>10691585
>Bacteria that make B12

>>10691585
The bacteria is in their gut. The reason they have to be supplemented in the US is due to antibiotics.

>>10677041
>awakens
nigga we are animals, we eat other animals

>>10677135
I agree 100% with you. Humans evolved the way we did BECAUSE we ate everything. Switching to veganism is going against evolution

>>10691596
http://news.mit.edu/2007/b12

The bacteria is still found in the soil

>>10691631
Same as preserving those unfit for the world, anon. Hard pill to swallow but humans have been keeping retards and disableds alive against the will of the planet. We need a cleanse to become a powerful species again

>>10691644
What's the bioavailability of this source of B12 for humans? Can these bacteria survive human stomach pH levels (the one of humans is degrees more acidic than herbivores)?

>>10691537
Thanks.

Like I can see the emotional appeal to veganism, if it's based on the fact that you're most likely causing fear and pain in an animal before you kill it. It's why I'm personally against fur trapping, although I can respect that people needed to do this to survive for thousands of years.

But biology is what it is. You HAVE to eat something from an animal. If your aversion is to unneccesary suffering, then you should still at least eat fish, who I would say are BARELY sentient, if at all.

DEENZ my nigga

>>10677043
I agree with 2040. That seems like the time we will have made cultured meat-like products that have the taste and texture of meat but are cheaper than the real thing. I also expect the new products to have a healthier fat profile.

2030 at the earliest

>>10679735
Trends die fast as they bloom

Dude lmao, beerfartdick cumragdocked

>>10693106
Benedetto Corkhammerploop

>>10691517
>Same shit for Omega 3s, the ones in stuff like flaxseed is useless when compared to the one from fish.
Humanity almost certainly didn't evolve on the coast, so fatty fish is almost certainly not the dietary source of omega 3 we've evolved to consume.

Blood values of omega 3 in vegans is just fine. Trace amounts of ALA is all you need. Not eating a lot of Linolenic Acid is much more important than consuming omega3 outright.

>>10677041
I like him unlike many so I hope he does the diet right. It's one of those unnecessary diets that requires proper supplementation so it's hard to be healthy.

>>10677167
>We’re omnivorous, vegans, steak won, tofu lost, get over it!

Being omnivorous doesn't mean a shit when your specie can take dietary supplements.

>>10685241
>This post
What?

>>10693735
Omega 3 supplementation is only necessary when one ingests too many Omega 6s which come from grains (we're not fully adapted to process these) since both of these are polyunsaturated fats. Naturally raised animals on their own are mostly saturated fat so omega balance is not an issue. If you're a vegan that eats only veggies, avocados and coconut oil you're plenty of healthy probably.

>>10691386
>Plants in general are just not very digestible for humans.
Source?
Because from what I know, it's meat that is harder to digest due to the length of our intestines and the ph of our stomach.

>>10693735
>Trace amounts of ALA is all you need
Not if you're eating soy, corn or vegetable oils in general

>>10693753
>Omega 3 supplementation is only necessary when one ingests too many Omega 6s which come from grains
It's an interesting theory, which I actually repeated ... but I forgot the last tidbit from the blog I linked before.

"What was interesting was that in spite of the fact that Tsimane mothers ate corn almost daily, their average breast milk ratios of omega-6 to omega-3’s was 4/1 as opposed to the American mothers whose ratios came in at 8/1. One explanation put forward is that the higher percentages of LA (and trans fats) in milk samples from American women was due to their consumption of LA rich vegetable oils and processed foods containing LA and hydrogenated oils- thus the problem may not be so much a matter of a simple need for increased omega-3’s but also an avoidance of processed LA rich oils."

Sometimes I fear the raw food nuts have it right. In that case though, fuck it ... not worth it to live a tiny bit longer.

>>10679720
Can you actually imagine divorcing or moving out before your partner wanted to eat meat? What the hell is wrong with these people?

>>10693782
>One explanation put forward is that the higher percentages of LA (and trans fats) in milk samples from American women was due to their consumption of LA rich vegetable oils and processed foods containing LA and hydrogenated oils- thus the problem may not be so much a matter of a simple need for increased omega-3’s but also an avoidance of processed LA rich oils."
You've gotta be careful with studies like this. They're good for showing correlations and thus investing in actual in depth RCTs that ultimately might show causation. One of the problems with nutrition "science" is that everyone goes around dangling correlations that often contradict themselves. Read this short meta-study in studies.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1182327/

>>10693756
He's referring to the fact that plants are full of fibrous bullshit that we can't digest.

Remember, if you dont eat farm animals, they become mostly useless and will dissappear. Save the cows, eat them.

>>10694140
Unironically this.
Every species of animal we regularly consume exists exclusively because we do so.
Chickens, cows, and even most pigs would rapidly die in feral environments. They're domesticated, docile, intentionally.
Do you want a genocide on your hands? Go vegan!

>>10694144
>they'll all die out at once because everyone will go vegan at the same time
Hundreds of trillion already die each year. You used the word genocide, so you admit it's murder? You're part of that. Think about it.

>>10689962
uhmmm hello delusional retard have an air pollution map from NASA

>>10689962

>>10694182
We raise more of them in their stead.
You're talking about literal extinction of multiple species by going vegan.

>>10690011
No need to. Master Cheif Trump does that for me

>>10694182
>>10694203
Also
>hundreds of trillions
You've never taken a math class, have you?

>>10694210
Are you retarded?

>>10694220
Are you?
Do you even fathom how large a trillion of anything is?

>>10694188
Small particles of soot get washed down with the rain and the plants won't give a fuck. Most animals don't give a fuck either. It's mostly a problem for asthmatic humans who don't have enough natural selection.

In environmentally persistent pollution there is nothing which can compare with what is needed to feed the consumption of a westerner.

>>10678311
There is no way around meat if there were the Army would have found it. Men need meat to wage war on other men.
Only women, slaves and livestock were vegans. Because that was all they needed to do their jobs. Enjoy some truth. If you can stomach it.

>>10694120
That wasn't a conclusion of the study, that was speculation by the black body builder who did the literature research.

All we know for a fact is that there is a human group consuming lots of maize and no high omega 3 fatty fish, with good omega 3/6 balance in their breast milk.

>>10694472
Why would the army care about going vegan? If it's more expensive, less nutrition dense and lowers troop morale why would they even bother.

IDF has vegan MREs though.

>>10681423
That's not strength. Its weakness and poverty.
The strong can march to war and win.
If the Armies of the world could find a way around meat they would have, and its not for lack of trying.
Its because you need meat in order to win battles. Roots and leaves don't win you battles.

>>10689934
This is a lie. They will just toss the meat in the trash if its not eaten. The animals are killed anyway. Its all paid for before it hits the market. Its paid for in debt which comes out of your taxes and higher interest rates. Expansion is the only economic model there is. It seems that someone wants to export meat, by lowering domestic consumption.

Animals taste good, and collectively we are stronger than them, so in an uncaring universe like this where nothing ultimately matters, it is acceptable if we eat them.

>>10694130
>He's referring to the fact that plants are full of fibrous bullshit that we can't digest.
Grass and leaves, yes. But not fruits, vegetables and other plants that we do eat.

>>10677101
I am not meming or lying, i went vegetarian for a month in january and it was basically a 4 week long ibs flare with horribly painful shits of undigested food particles and diarreah. I also felt like shit.

Back on the meat train now, feeling good.

>>10694498
IDF doesn't need real rations because they can literally just order takeout.

>>10694474
>All we know for a fact is that there is a human group consuming lots of maize and no high omega 3 fatty fish, with good omega 3/6 balance...

We know for a fact there is a specific group with specific criteria with such results that one time

>>10693782
The tsimane people of Bolivia consume meat and other animal products so I'm not sure why you're holding them up as a holy grail of veganism. They're also incredibly active, only spending 10% of their awake hours being idle. The arapaima gigas is a common fish found in the Amazon river and its surrounding ponds( you know the area the tsimanes inhabit) and is very rich in omega 3s. Maybe you should actually look into the literature yourself instead of repeating what some dumb nigger says.

>>10677106
Bullshit image, the bioavailability of that nutrient to humans is very very minimal, you have to eat several pounds of this shit to get the result this image speaks of.

>>10677969
>What is the agenda here really?
Its a fad diet designed to sell overpriced branded food like "organic" bullshit.

>it's another vegan propaganda thread

>>10690800
The day I worry about a 1% increase of early death is the day I'd just kill myself willingly.

>>10677137
>meatcuck
Is that even an insult?
pic semi related

>>10690872
There are still vegans who say they would never eat lab-grown meat even if it didn't involve exploitation of an animal because they view it as some kind of spiritually contaminating substance to be avoided no matter what.

>>10690800
>It increases your odds from around 5% up to a little over 6% if I recall correctly.
It was from 5% to 5.9%

>>10691410
>They still eat less than most 1st world people eat.
They eat less of everything than most 1st world people eat. I don't think hunter-gatheres eat a lot of grains either, since that usually means you're a farmer.

VITAMIN B-12
WHERE DO YOU GET IT FROM, VEGANC U C K S?

>>10681423
Look at all those skinny legs lmfao, they've practically turned into chickens

>>10677041
who? i dont have any autism

>>10677104
vegetables arent really all that exciting
hey kids come buy some carrots

>>10677104
wait, what about potato chips?

>>10677041
After the completion of the white genocide the only vegans on Earth will be monks living in monasteries on remote mountain tops.

Eating insects will become socially acceptable in the west long before that happens. Don't be delusional.

>>10694981
It's true, they're only a few miles away from a fucking McDonalds at any given time. Their rations kind of reflect that.

>>10697294
Post quads and timestamp

>>10697335
Found the creepy, racist trump boomer who posts all the "u mad white boi" threads on /pol/ and /b/

>>10697430
I'm very confused by that guy. He appears to have an obsession with giant black dicks.

>>10697420
Not sure why you want to see my legs.
Because I'm not a bodybuilder, I can't point out the fact that they're entirelyskiplegday posterboys?

>>10677167
Stay still fatty

>>10697705
you're a big guy

>>10697705
>Fat fuck on a toilet

>>10697857
Wait, I know that big gay ass.

I love that people have swallowed this brainwashing that not eating meat makes you virtuous. Next you'll be eating your bug rations, homos.

>>10697108
Vitamin B12 is produced by bacteria that live in soil. However, due to modern agricultural practices, it is not typically found in sufficient quantities in the end product consumed by humans. This is why B12 deficiency is one of the most common amongst both vegans and nonvegans. Luckily, B12 is very cheap since it is mass produced for the purposes of feeding to livestock, since they also become deficient without it. I spend about $6/year on B12 supplements and my blood tests are fine. Additionally, many products are fortified with B12, so it is questionable whether I even need to supplement at all.

>>10682495
>Plants perceive their environment and react accordingly
Stop being a retard. The ability to react to something is not the same thing as being able to feel or experience anything subjectively. A bear trap can react to external stimuli. A 10 line computer program can react to external stimuli. That is not the same thing as sentience. Sentience is an evolutionary trait developed by animals in order to learn from mistakes and successes.

>>10679238
It would be great if animals didn't die in the harvesting of crops. Veganism is about minimizing animal exploitation. Currently, the best way I know of to minimize the number of animal deaths from crop harvesting is to switch to a fully plant based diet. More crops are required to feed animals for human consumption compared to growing crops directly for human consumption. When you hear about deforestation to plant soy crops, that's not vegans who are responsible. Soy isn't even a particularly unsustainable crop. The part that makes it unsustainable is how much we are growing. The reason we are growing that much is to feed farmed animals.

>>10694498
>hurr durr vegetables and grains are too expensive
The cheapest foods on the planet are plants you fucking retard.

>>10677041
the majority of the world will massively change a huge section of their economy, business and personal lifestyles in five years?

riigghtt..

>>10677041
that will never happen, It would mean the extinction of lots of species, like cows and chickens and stuff. The non extinction society wouldn't be having it.

>>10698120
>plants are no different to bear traps and computers
This is how stupid you become when you're a vegan.

>>10698187
>ad hominem attacks are a valid way to carry a debate
Sentience is an evolutionary trait we developed in order to learn from our successes and failures. Plants have no evolutionary need for such a trait. They are really not much different from computers, although you can say the same thing about any living thing. All cells follow programming. Humans have even learned how to understand and rewrite the programming of single celled organisms. Sufficiently advanced artificial intelligence could have sentience. The difference between a computer program which is sentient and a computer program which is not sentient has to do with whether it modifies it's logical decision making patterns in response to stimuli in a manner which is either self-perpetuating or self-avoidant. The same thing is true when talking about literally anything. If an entity does not have that basic criteria met (ie. plants), they cannot be considered sentient.

>>10698212
Lol get the fuck out of here with your philosophical crap. Only a tool grown up on a man made diet learning in man made systems so far removed from nature can mistake a plant and a computer.
You've got some fucking cheek bringing up ad hominem when you start your post by calling other people retards. So go fuck your mother.

>>10678534
>global warming

I thought it was climate change?

>>10698224
>Lol get the fuck out of here with your philosophical crap
It's not philosophy. It's based on a modern understanding of how neural networks work and also how artificial intelligence works. This is something I study as a software engineer.

>mistake a plant and a computer
That isn't what I did. I compared the two. Are you really going to expect people to believe you are so stupid you can't tell the difference? Do you think pretending to be stupid helps you make your point somehow? I compared them because there are a lot of similarities. If you refuse to acknowledge that cells follow programming then you are completely ignorant and need to study microbiology.

>You've got some fucking cheek bringing up ad hominem when you start your post by calling other people retards.
You seem to have a misunderstanding about what an ad hominem attack is. Calling someone names is not the same thing as an ad hominem attack. If you weren't such a fucking retard, you would know that an ad hominem attack is "a fallacious argumentative strategy whereby genuine discussion of the topic at hand is avoided by instead attacking the character, motive, or other attribute of the person making the argument, or persons associated with the argument, rather than attacking the substance of the argument itself." The only post where I referred to someone as a retard, I also directly attacked the substance of the argument as well. By definition, that is not an ad hominem attack. I stated a fact which directly refuted the substance of the other person's argument. Please stop being a retard.

>>10698250
>literally write an essay to justify comparing plants to bear traps and conputers
You are a joke. Also you seem to be in love with your words and ideas and probably think you're hot shit. Kek. Go spread your nonsense to people who will listen fag.

>>10698265
Why do you even bother to respond at all if you are only going to resort to more ad hominem attacks? Do you think you are making your side of the argument seem more intelligent by doing this?

>>10698272
Why the fuck would I waste my time arguing with a faggot who think plants = computers?
Like I said, you're in love with intelligence and words and nonsense you learnt from a text book. Go look at a tree and tell me it's like a computer. Retard.

>>10698275
>I dun need no gorsh darn science. Learnin's for them stuck up city folk.
So you are still pretending that you think I believe plants are the same thing as computers even after I specifically addressed that already? Why do you continue to respond at all when you only make yourself appear more ignorant and more incapable of backing up your point of view with every post? You have completely derailed the conversation due to your complete lack of ability to either support your own point of view or refute mine. You are literally making an ad hominem attack with every post. Trolling is one thing, but it's obvious you actually hold that point of view and you are really hurting your own cause by putting your ignorance on display.

>>10698275
Not the same anon, but you sound like you're just letting out rage in keyboard form as a projection of your own homosexuality. You wanna make out?

>>10698286
>blah blah blah
Go summit this to your biology professor you fucking nerd. See what he thinks about your idea.
>>10698288
>>>r/vegan

>>10698295
>Go summit this to your biology professor you fucking nerd. See what he thinks about your idea.
So is your final answer that you believe plants are sentient? Yes or no.

>>10698310
Sentience is a man made concept. Can plants feel? I don't fucking know. But a plant is a living thing. You pluck it out of the ground and it dies. In that sense it's capable of the same thing I can and other animals can. I don't discriminate among living things.

>>10698320
If you feel that strongly about it, you should know that less plants will die if you follow a plant based diet when compared to feeding plants to animals for human consumption. The laws of thermodynamics prevent us from getting the same amount of energy out of the animal as we put into the animal. Please, for the sake of all the voiceless plants, go vegan. Please stop paying to have soy, corn, oats, and wheat crops mass slaughtered for animal feed. If you don't take action, who will?

>>10698331
I've already tried vegan diet for 2 months. My family has history of diabetes and heart diseases. It made me binge eat, lose all my muscles, and have chest pains.
I care about other living things but I have to live.

>>10677180
>who don't want to admit that plants also have feels and try to protect themselves

Why do vajins never address this? its always ignored when they virtue signal.

>>10698120
>Sentience is an evolutionary trait developed by animals in order to learn from mistakes and successes.

Kind of how plants evolve?!

Doesn't matter vagins only do it to virtue signal, you are already arguing the definition of sentience. Your ignorance is showing how it leads you down a path of feeling superior.

>>10678285
Diets ARE a lifestyle you fucking jackass.

>>10698337
>It made me binge eat, lose all my muscles, and have chest pains.
No, that was just you being a retard. I suppose I can see how a retard could use that as justification for mass slaughter though. You win this time.

>>10698120
>>10698212
>Sentience is an evolutionary trait developped by animals
You have no proof for this.
Also, how would it be beneficial? There is nothing sentience offers in terms of survival that would be as effective as just memory and intelligence.

>>10698668
Of course I win. I get to eat meat which is delicious and its actually good for me. Have fun with your leaves and grass diet.