The BOTTOM LINE for USA citizens for Crypto Tax

[Anonymous No.7240303]

The bottom line is that if you are a burger like me, the IRS is prepping to anally buttfuck us in a few years if we dont start a revolution soon.

I recently spent some money, and spoke to several crypto tax specialist tax attorney's and CPA's. The overall message is very clear:

If you do ANY KIND of trading with crypto, it is a taxable event. Crypto-to-fiat, Crypto-to-crypto, and fiat-to-crypto are all taxable events, and you must pay the gain on that tax. You realize a gain whenever you trigger this taxable event (trading) and you have a gain in the holding that you traded. The like-kind exchange loophole never applied, and was a technical loophole only. In the framework of the IRS, this never really applied.

When you do trade, this does not trigger capital gains tax, but instead triggers the SHORT TERM capital gains tax if the asset was held for less than 365 days. SHORT TERM capital gains tax is taxed in a very similar manner to income. You only get long term capital gains tax when you hold an asset for longer than 365 days. This timer is reset every time you trade an asset.

You CANNOT just pay taxes when you convert to fiat. The utter insane IRS expects you to pay taxes every time you trade crypto, even if you did not convert anything to fiat.

And when you DO convert your crypto to fiat, you are taxed on that as well if you experience a gain. You are taxed the minute you sell it for fiat. This will happen to many of us, as our crypto holdings far exceed any fiat we receive from our day jobs (if we have any).

If the market crashes completely, then there is nothing you can do, you still owe those taxes regardless if the market crashes AFTER your trade.

The only silver lining is that the longer you wait to file for taxes, the better off you will be, because the market will (hopefully) continue to explode into this year, so the amount of assets you will be forced to sell off will be minimal compared to if you sold it off now.

[Anonymous No.7240357]

the house literally opened a bill today that completely kills all this FUD youre shilling

please anon at least try to keep up with the times

[Anonymous No.7240358]

Is it easy to avoid taxes on crypto in DR?
Father lives there and got citizenship.

[Anonymous No.7240360]

Good thing every trade I’ve made so far has been a loss :-)

[Anonymous No.7240375]

>>7240303
did you specifically ask whether shitcoins 2 steps removed from fiat markets are "convertable virtual currencies" as defined in that one 2014 ruling. it seems a little unfair for them to be treated as such if you're holding less than a year

[Anonymous No.7240379]

>>7240303
just pay your 15-25% and stfu you retarded faggot
you will never start a revoution they will put a bullet in your head or throw you in jail for life

[Anonymous No.7240423]

>>7240358
Yes, delete this

[Anonymous No.7240469]

>>7240357
[citation needed]

[Anonymous No.7240646]

>>7240357
congress hasn't passed any bills affecting cryptocurrency taxation

[Anonymous No.7240714]

Honeypot thread. Dont respond

[Anonymous No.7240770]

>irs thinks it can tax an exchange of entries on a digital ledger
Kek.
Suck my nuts glow in the dark niggers. I have steel core 5.56 for anybody who comes for my crypto gains.

[Anonymous No.7240784]

>>7240714
This is not a honeypot thread you stupid faggot. I spoke with Tyson Cross

[Anonymous No.7240822]

>>7240714
Its true, i can confirm. IRS insider here, just witnessed a bulk shipment of KY jelly coming into the agency recently

[Anonymous No.7240854]

>>7240303
people who are not retarded knew this years ago

[Anonymous No.7240880]

>>7240303
>If the market crashes completely, then there is nothing you can do, you still owe those taxes regardless if the market crashes AFTER your trade.
capital losses offset capital gains in the same year, dipshit

[Anonymous No.7240891]

>>7240303
>B-bros we need to start a revolution

God you sound like such a faggot. The IRS will take these crypto gains from my cold dead fucking hands.

You think these fucking underfunded government monkeys are able to track every single fucking trade in a random exchange in Hong Kong? Absolutely not. These fucking clowns couldn't even build a proper UI for a state level emergency system. If you pay taxes on crypto you are the definition of a cuckold.

[Anonymous No.7240922]

>>7240891
>The IRS will take these crypto gains from my cold dead fucking hands.

If you don't revolt, the government will continue to grow in order to meet the demands it makes on you.

[Anonymous No.7240934]

>>7240303
wow OP nice detective work

[Anonymous No.7240953]

That's why I'm not doing anything this year. I'll wait til they make sensible laws and I'll take whatever penalty they throw at me. Fuck the current system! I'm not doing it! And they can't make me!

[Anonymous No.7240963]

>>7240922
No it won't. US government can barely function as it is and gets shit tier workers. Those autismos wouldn't be able to track my monero if they spent the rest of their lives trying.

[Anonymous No.7240977]

>start a revolution

Non retards were ready for this treatment (and were aware that this is how all other investments work) Go occupy wall street or something brainlet

[Anonymous No.7240986]

>>7240303
I have a question. My net capital gains offset my net capital losses, correct?

So if at one point I had $200,000 cashed out in USD as profit on Gdax, but then I bought back into the market and lost it all and then cashed out at a loss, I don't pay taxes on it right?

Meaning if my net difference for the year was a loss, then I don't pay taxes on it, correct?

In other words, at least technically, if someone made $500,000 in crypto and even cashed out to fiat, but then bought back in and then lost it all in a scam, that person wouldn't have to pay taxes on those former gains, right?

[Anonymous No.7241019]

>>7240986
Yes this is correct.

[Anonymous No.7241022]

>>7240303
Technically trading of any kind is considered a taxable event. If you trade mtg cards, you’re supposed to report it. If you make a sale on eBay or Craigslist, you’re supposed to report it. With this latest tax law, anything that holds worth is essentially taxable.

Thing is no one reports these earnings and the IRS doesn’t have the power to go after every single person. Just pay your taxes when you cash out and if they come after you, then you can try paying the taxable events and the minuscule fine.

Eventually the IRS will figure how to properly tax crypto in the following years and 2017/2018 will only be a hiccup

[visible sage No.7241051]

itt: 12 year olds giving advice on tax law

[Anonymous No.7241054]

>>7240963
>No it won't.
Yes, it will. Government debt and budget as a % of GDP is increasing
>Those autismos wouldn't be able to track my monero if they spent the rest of their lives trying.
That's irrelevant. They will shut down all fiat for crypto exchanges. They will shut down every online market. Dealing with crypto at all will be illegal (already a thing in India). Eventually, ISPs will monitor transactions broadcasts (which are all public, mind you) to find malcontents like you.

And even if somehow you can hold on to your crypto through all this. it won't matter. Your personal freedoms will be curtailed to the point that you will be nothing more than a serf

[Anonymous No.7241058]

>>7240303
>trade 100$ worth of eth for 100$ worth of shitcoin
>negative gain due to fees
not only is the tax 0 on that trade but you can deduct it from you taxes because its considered a loss.
not hard to fucking understand

[Anonymous No.7241068]

>>7240822
larp the I RS doesn't use lub

[Anonymous No.7241071]

>>7240986
Yes - if it occurs in the same year. If a crash happens like in 2013, and you owe taxes you cant pay in fiat, you're screwed. But I dont think we'll see a crash like 2013 again.

[Anonymous No.7241083]

Burger here
Suck my dick
>paying taxes on crypto to crypto
Don't make me laugh op you cuck

Also if i end up being forced to pay it, you only pay your realized gains when you cash out. END OF STORy

[Anonymous No.7241092]

>>7241019
Cool. So cash everything out of Gdax at the end of the year, make your own crypto currency on a contract address nobody knows about on Ethereum, sell to yourself via Etherdelta as a means of laundering the money, and claim it all at a loss.

Then have the mysterious person who scammed you mysteriously airdrop your money back to you January of the next year.

Or hell, even just get one of those debit cards that uses Tether and use an anonymous Bitcoin address for it.

I "lost my addresses" with all my stuff on them. No, even better, I gave them all to some guy for Bitconnect and Confido. Silly me whoops.
Why is this difficult?

[Anonymous No.7241093]

>>7240986
correct

that's the nice thing about these worthless shitcoins i bought with a small chunk of my portfolio

they count as capital losses

[Anonymous No.7241098]

>>7241083
No. Gains are realized whenever you do a crypto-to-crypto trade and you have a USD gain.

[Anonymous No.7241114]

>>7241071
>>7241093
So like I mentioned here: >>7241092
This shit is still incredibly easy to fake and evade, yes?

[Anonymous No.7241124]

WHAT YOU DO WITH YOUR CRYPTO IS YOUR BUISSNESS AND YOURS ALONE


FUCK THE IRS BUY YOUR SHIT WITH YOUR COINS AND TELL THEM NOTHING

COINS ARE AN EXIT TO THE
CVCKBUX

freedom

[Anonymous No.7241165]

>>7241114
1. The IRS isn't stupid
2. 99.9% of cryptos have a fully public ledger
3. You have to account for where your profits came from or they will fine you, seize your assets and possibly put you in jail

[Anonymous No.7241171]

Nope.

[Anonymous No.7241188]

>>7240303
So basically you owe taxes on your gains. And the tax is triggered whenever you exchange. Why is that complicated?
You can also claim capital losses if you lose a trade.

[Anonymous No.7241192]

>>7240303
>I recently spent some money, and spoke to several crypto tax specialist tax attorney's and CPA's. The overall message is very clear:
protip lads

DO
NOT
TALK
TO
CPAS

DISCUSSIONS WITH CPAS ARE NOT PROTECTED LIKE DISCUSSIONS WITH LAWYERS OR DOCTORS

[Anonymous No.7241213]

>>7241165
Fuck off IRS.

[Anonymous No.7241219]

>>7241188
because /biz/ is fucking retarded and can't grok that it's basically no different than trading stocks where you trade stock A for stock B

[Anonymous No.7241272]

>>7241165
>99.9% of cryptos have a fully public ledger
I can make an ETH address with nothing more than a pen and paper and send my coins to it. Public or not it doesn't matter. And plenty of coins have private ledgers to use too but I didn't even include those.

>You have to account for where your profits came from
I unironically made close to a million dollars liquidating my ELIX addresses, which were airdropped to me for free, mostly right after the new year. Yes, almost a million dollars airdropped to me (each address was liquidated for roughly 55k at the peak and I signed up for as many as I could back when they were still Timereum). Also all the genesis addresses are publicly available online and you can see which have been liquidated and which have not been liquidated.

So it's pretty easy to use that and other airdrops as a scapegoat, really, with plausible records to "show it."
I have a feeling people who don't know the thousands of methods which exist for doing this exactly like I just described above aren't too familiar with this space.

[Anonymous No.7241290]

If I write a smart contract to keep me from being able to cash out or do anything with my gains which expires after new years, do I own my money during that time???

[Anonymous No.7241341]

>>7241272
airdrops are income lad, that's even worse than long term capital gains

IRS gonna fuck you hard if you cash out anything worthwhile.

[Anonymous No.7241366]

>>7241341
If you make below 7 figures the chances of getting audited are miniscule. like half a percent chance.

[Anonymous No.7241371]

>>7241366
>making below 7 figures
not even a human being desu

poorcucks get out

[Anonymous No.7241392]

>>7241272
Airdrops are considered income like mining and masternodes. If you liquidated it, you will have to pay short term/income tax on it, regardless if you got "scammed". It doesn't matter because you still owe tax.

[Anonymous No.7241397]

>>7241341
>airdrops are income
Again you're missing the point. I "lost all my money on December 20th". I "regained a million dollars on January 10th." This is ALMOST entirely true. The point is that faking this is incredibly easy to do even if you never really lost your money.

Incredibly easy to do, even in ways which are not traceable.

Doing so would, according to the tax law, exempt you from paying any crypto taxes. You'd have to do the same thing the next year again, of course, but yeah.

[Anonymous No.7241405]

I bet you idiots also calculate your taxes using solely your highest income bracket. Times like these makes me glad I never follow financial/investing advice from this board.

[Anonymous No.7241418]

>>7241397
yeah no way tax authorities will ever catch onto this and put you in prison.

>>7241392
actually it's possible that you have to pay income even if you never liquidate them

[Anonymous No.7241421]

>>7241392
You missed the complete point of my post.
The point isn't really whether I got an airdrop or not. The point is that after laundering your money for the end of the year and hiding it away successfully, it's trivial to "explain" where all this new money suddenly came from because of all the airdrops. Pick one and say you own however many addresses of it.

[Anonymous No.7241437]

>>7240358
They been doing a lot to fight the 40% evasion that currently exists but crypto is mostly under radar for now.

[Anonymous No.7241443]

>>7241421
And what will you do when you're on trial for tax evasion and you cannot prove that you own those addresses?

Better prepare that asshole of yours

[Anonymous No.7241449]

>>7240953
That is where you are wrong. If you are one of the unlucky ones who get singled out. Cash your crypto out and lawyer up and fight until you are bankrupt. Your money is gone either way. May as well set a nice precedent for the rest of us.

[Anonymous No.7241471]

>>7241421
You can hide the money away all you want, but you wont be able to use it. Once you use it, then the IRS is going to want to know where it came from and how you obtained it. Hiding it away doesn't matter.

[Anonymous No.7241480]

>>7241418
>actually it's possible that you have to pay income even if you never liquidate them
I automated signing up with different ETH addresses for some airdrops and still haven't calculated how much I would make on them if I liquidated.

What exactly defines ownership here? Like I mentioned here: >>7241290
If I can't reasonably convert my asset to fiat money, then do I really own it?

[Anonymous No.7241482]

>>7241471
this

[Anonymous No.7241529]

>>7241471
>>7241482
Ah but I have a way of getting around this as well. See I have friends in foreign countries which don't have taxes for crypto. I send them my crypto money, they cash out into their bank accounts, and I have debit cards and full access to their bank accounts. This method relies on trusting them, yes, but it has worked for me so far since I use family members who understand what I'm doing for this and who have agreed to accept about $2000 each in exchange for allowing me to do this. It works.

[Anonymous No.7241572]

>>7241529
>not only do i want to commit tax evasion, i want to expose myself to excessive counter-party risk as well while doing it

you're a genius anon

[Anonymous No.7241599]

>>7241572
If it works, it's not a problem though. It's also something I already did. Fight me IRS

[Anonymous No.7241630]

>>7240303

America, le keep 56% of your money face.

[Stock market No.7241636]

>>7240303
I talked to a tax lawyer and either you were lied to or you’re lying.

Like kind are most likely not going to be taxed, because you’re not recognizing gains.

So eat a dick with your FUD

[Anonymous No.7241672]

>>7241529
Are you in the US? Which countries are they in? Which countries does this work in?

[Anonymous No.7241678]

What happens if I just cash out what I put in?

And is there any concrete evidence that we cannot apply like kind trades for the 2017 tax year?

[Anonymous No.7241688]

>>7241636
>I recently spent some money, and spoke to several crypto tax specialist tax attorney's and CPA's. The overall message is very clear:

this line is a giveaway. imo.

[Anonymous No.7241699]

>>7240986
That is 100% INCORRECT

You are only allowed to write off $3000 a year in losses.

[Anonymous No.7241702]

>>7241599
consider the following
>the entire point of DLT is that accounts and transactions are public and stored forever

>there is no statue of limitations on tax evasion

>crypto has had so much money in it this year that tax authorities will be targeting people in it, especially because it's full of retards and libertarians who think they can get away with not paying

you will have to worry for
THE
REST
OF
YOUR
LIFE

about being arrested/massively fined

you'll never, EVER be able to go to passport control without fear

you'll have a jolt of fear anytime you read about governments going after crypto

[Anonymous No.7241729]

>>7241699
wrong faggot, 3k/year only applies to carry over to the next year

you can offset 900 million in capital gains with 890 million capital losses and only have to pay tax on 10 million capital gains

[Anonymous No.7241757]

>>7241729
>>7241699
also to kill this retarded superstition

https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/individuals/deducting-capital-losses-at-a-glance

>You may be able to deduct capital losses up to the amount of your capital gains plus $3,000 ($1,500 if married filing separately).

[Anonymous No.7241808]

[Anonymous No.7241812]

I'm not paying taxes. Fuck all this.

[Anonymous No.7241845]

>>7241702
What kind of life do you live anyway, as a pussy?

[Anonymous No.7241850]

What I dont get is if crypto to crypto, how are you supposed to calculate the "gain"
Say you go from ETH to BAT and the ETH is trading higher than you bought it for. Let's say about $100 higher.
Where are you expected to compute the gain from? The average price of ETH that day? If so, where? Some random bumfuck exchange? IRS certainly wont have an accepted ETH price.
What a stupid fucking system.

[Anonymous No.7241884]

>>7241845
the kind where 15% of my gains is easily worth never having to worry about it.

[Anonymous No.7241889]

>>7241757
just for retards i'm gonna highlight the important part

>up to the amount of your capital gains plus $3,000

meaning you can deduct $3000 from gains you got through other means, e.g. you need to pay less taxes after your the salary of your dayjob

[Anonymous No.7241892]

>>7241850
> how are you supposed to calculate the "gain"
protip: you don't. You let cointracking.info do that for you.

[Anonymous No.7241907]

>>7241892
or bitcoin.tax

[Anonymous No.7241921]

Serious question... Can I literally just cash out like 100k and decided to pay 0 taxes on it? I thought the risk of an audit is like less than 1%. Or does coinbase reporting to the IRS mean I have to pay it or its automatically an audit?

[Anonymous No.7241963]

>>7241921
are you retarded

anything over 10k gets a suspicious activity report
they'll see it was from coinbase
coinbase already got fucking john doe supenoa'd


this must be someone LARP'ing as a literal mental defective

[Anonymous No.7241983]

>>7241757
Well what if he bought back in in less than 31 days ? Wouldn't that BTC buy fail under the wash rule ?
Also was his gain long or short term ?
If his gain was long term he can't deduct the short term loss.

https://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/062713/capital-losses-and-tax.asp

[Anonymous No.7241989]

>>7241058
This so fucking much. You can easily say I traded 100$ worth of ETH for 100$ worth of shit coin. Even when they say "hurr your eth appreciated in value" they cant even prove that it did at time of trade. Exchanges hardly keep records of what a coin was worth at a specific time in the past. The IRS proving any of this is next to impossible. How will they know if I'm telling the truth or not on my trades? What if I make 500k this year in crypto and give them my full logs of trades? How are they going to decipher the absolute volume of trading, figure out what coin x was worth at time of buying it, then when I "sell" it for coin y, figure out what coin y was worth accurately, then what its worth when I "sell" it for coin z? Its impossible to accurately do this. They will give up and settle for End gain - initial investment for tax year.

[Anonymous No.7242002]

>>7241983
wash rule doesn't apply to cryptos

[Anonymous No.7242027]

>>7241892
>cointracking.info
So they are just using an average then I guess, or it's an industry best guess. Thanks. I am algo trading this year so doing my best to keep my basis recorded. I imagine 2018 2019 IRS and SEC will have to make some better rules.
One anon said the accounting industry is working on a best practices for this year.

[Anonymous No.7242037]

>>7241699
Nope. $3k applies to income after calculating net capital loss. I am referring to net loss.

[Anonymous No.7242071]

>>7241672
Yes I'm in the US. I don't want to say the other countries. This should work in some small countries in Western Europe and I know for a fact it works in parts of East and Southeast Asia because their tax collecting is a fucking joke.

[Anonymous No.7242130]

>>7240977
This.
The laws are reasonable for what they are (gold and other securities are treated the same way). Everyone screeching about it are like hippies.

[Anonymous No.7242148]

>>7241921

If you cash out through any of the major fiat gateways and/or that money ever touches a US bank account your chance of an audit is 100%. All of that will get reported back to the Israeli Revenue Service.

You won't hear a thing about it for 4 years because you have 3 years to file amended returns and corrections. Meaning that if they audit you early you can simply fix your mistake and pay a small fine. They don't want just a small fine; they want to fuck you deeply. So the shekel police deliberately wait until after the period for you to file and amended return has passed then butfuck you to the tune of 5% compounding per month plus fees and penalties. You can easily rack up tens of thousands of dollars in penalties and fees in just a few months. Compound that for years before they send the shekelhounds after you.

[Anonymous No.7242221]

>>7241636
nice larp faggot. maybe you should hire a tax attorney that knows that doing a like kind is deferring tax not not eliminating it. good luck with your tax bill retard.

[Anonymous No.7242298]

>>7240379
>15-20
The real /biz/nessmen are looking at 28-40% federal + whatever your state wants. What have we received in exchange?

[Anonymous No.7242355]

https://www.trustnodes.com/2018/01/30/us-state-senators-introduce-bill-exempting-tokens-securities-laws

[Anonymous No.7242363]

>>7242130
That is to say, they never singled out cryptocurrencies for special treatment. They just classified them as a capital security, because that's essentially what they are now.
Now the NEETs realized that they actually have to do tax paperwork, so they're throwing a tantrum, and the libertarians are fanning the flames with fear-mongering to promote their agenda against IRS.

[Anonymous No.7242401]

>>7240303
If you go fiat to crypto you don't pay taxes until you cash out or trade for another crypto.

[Anonymous No.7242420]

>>7241884
>15%
lol poorfag

[Anonymous No.7242424]

>>7240303
No, crypto gains are not taxable because this is just a videogame. Virtual currencies are not real. They cannot tax you for something that doesn't exist. Are they going to try and tax my tetris score next? If they try and enforce taxes on virtual currencies, they legitimize them and aknowledge they are real. It's a catch 22 for them, they can't enforce shit, their just trying to scare you. Don't listen to the tax trolls.

[Anonymous No.7242429]

>>7240303

go some place else to cash out, it's not that hard

[Anonymous No.7242469]

>>7240986
Oops, seems like I lost all my money in PoWHCoin. Better luck next time!

[Anonymous No.7242483]

>>7242469
>ok, show us the transaction where you sent the coins and prove ownership of the wallet that sent them

>uhhhhhhh

>*gets jailed*

wew lad

[Anonymous No.7242503]

Introducing: Tax Smart Contracts!!!

I will write smart contracts on Ethereum which allow you to send your money to them and then neither you nor I can touch your funds, but I will "own" them. You can verify they're legit by reading the smart contracts which are, of course, open source.

Then, to get your money back, you simply send 0.005 ETH ($5) or something to a different address, one which I own, and the other smart contract will be programmed to send back your funds immediately when my address receives the 0.005 ETH. All of this will be open source in the smart contract, of course.

You can do this on December 30th and cash out again on January 1rst. Congrats.

Did we just outjew the jews of the IRS?? Someone tell me the fucking flaw in my plan.

[Anonymous No.7242517]

>>7241054
There are ways to avoid being tracked. Honestly quite simple, not going to reveal this in a honey pot thread though.

US can only do so much, as long as there is a country that allows fiat to be traded into crypto the US can't shut it down.

[Anonymous No.7242560]

Kek some cucks will actually pay too

[Anonymous No.7242567]

>>7242221
Capital expenses are deducted from capital gain, you fucking kike. The $1000 in ETH you "sold" is offset on paper by the $1000 on "spent" buying DOGE. You jews invented accounting yet you pretend to be unable to figure out how to add and subtract.

[Anonymous No.7242618]

>>7242483
>>7242483
You can't go to jail for not paying your taxes unless the IRS can actively prove you attempted to evade them. The IRS can pt the burden of proof on you to prove you've paid your taxes all they want, and they can demand virtually any number they want for taxes if you are missing any proof.

But as far as going to jail or any criminal charges, the burden of proof falls back on the IRS to prove you actively evaded taxes rather than made a simple mistake.

In other words, the worst any person who isn't a complete moron could get is a fine.

[Anonymous No.7242626]

>>7242503
>Did we just outjew the jews of the IRS?? Someone tell me the fucking flaw in my plan.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_evasion

[Anonymous No.7242642]

>>7241092
airdrop is a taxable event. great idea non the less.
to throw a cherry on top of this you need to use a "trusted" vpn the entire process.

[Anonymous No.7242643]

>>7240303
lmfao only soyboys worry about paying taxes.
Just transfer all your coins to monero and don't use US exchanges and your'e golden.
fucking soyboys literally.
crypto in itself is a revolution because governments can't control it. The only problem we would have is they decided to put a firewall. We would still find ways around it no matter what.
Literally don't worry about it. the government can suck my dick.

[Anonymous No.7242644]

>>7242298
>he real /biz/nessmen are looking at 28-40% federal + whatever your state wants. What have we received in exchange?

Immigrants because
Diversity is our Strength.
War is peace.
Freedom is slavery.
Ignorance is strength.

[Anonymous No.7242650]

>>7242002
>citation needed

[Anonymous No.7242652]

>>7242618
oh ok so they can take all your money that's fine then

[Anonymous No.7242659]

>>7242626
>using legal loopholes in the tax code to avoid paying more in taxes is now tax evasion
This is why you will never "make it."

[Anonymous No.7242678]

>>7242659
enjoy prison lad

[Anonymous No.7242686]

>>7242652
Like I said above, if you've sent all your money to a family member/friend's account in a country that doesn't have crypto taxes and then just use their account with full access and their permission, the IRS can't do shit.

[Anonymous No.7242731]

WAAAAHHH MOMMY WHY DO I HAB TO PAY TAXES :(((((

[Anonymous No.7242828]

>>7240303

[Anonymous No.7242858]

>>7242503
even if this method specifically doesn't work legally for whatever reason, there's no way people aren't going to find one that does.


the only working way to tax crypto is:

1. taxing cashing out.
2. taxing payments for services/goods, IN the crypto-currency the payment was made in (not FIAT or anything else).


anything else the authorities come up with will be loophole-able. even once they start making taxation laws specifically for crypto.

[Anonymous No.7242892]

>>7242858
I do >>7242686
to avoid being taxed cashing out.

[Anonymous No.7242948]

>>7242626
you're stupid many-many institutes/people with unusual sources of income search for and successfully find legal loopholes.

e.g.
http://crwwgroup.net/en/tax-evasion-tax-avoidance-know-donald-trumps-taxes/

>Trump openly admitted to taking advantage of U.S. tax loopholes at the second presidential debate. “I absolutely used it, and so did Warren Buffett, and so did George Soros, and so did many people who Hillary is getting money from,” he said, adding that he knew more about the U.S. tax system than anyone else.

[Anonymous No.7242969]

>>7240303
>The utter insane IRS expects you to pay taxes every time you trade crypto,
Why did you spend so much time writing this all this out? The is the exact same thing that happens for stocks, it's just that Turbotax has an upload feature where you can upload your trades and they calculate the best way to write down your trades (LIFO/FIFO)

>If the market crashes completely, then there is nothing you can do, you still owe those taxes regardless if the market crashes AFTER your trade.
Yes but if you exit your position you can use the loss to reduce your tax burden in the year you recognize the loss, it's actually completely fair.

[Anonymous No.7242978]

>>7242858
You're right though. And I haven't even started with all the loopholes involving private ledgers. I still think the average legislator and even investigators in finance who are supposed to be working on this don't fully understand yet what they're dealing with. Or if they do, they're cleverly trying to make laws which normal people will simply give in to and people who know what they're doing will just end up avoiding anyway.

[Anonymous No.7243138]

>>7242969
Crypto money is, on a fundamental level, really no different than trading Runescape money or money in any other video game. While the IRS continues to try to crack down on US citizens who can thanks to technology easily access these global markets, they really can't stop US citizens from dealing in these markets any more than they could stop them from trading in Runescape. I think the IRS either realizes this already though or will realize it very soon because it's kind of a fundamental problem which undermines enforcement of their entire tax law.

[Anonymous No.7243160]

>>7240303
>taxing crypto

Yeah that won't happen. What they gonna do? Tax air? Hahahahahahaa.

Anyway fuck the government since they use my hard earned tax dollars for useless ventures to extol war. Fuck the USA Government. I cannot wait til we become a third world country due to piss poor decision from the leader of the free world.

[Anonymous No.7243250]

>>7240977
To be honest anyone who legitimately understands what crypto is knows the government and banks will try to destroy it. We are approaching that stage now. It will be over 400k by 2020 and then it will trade sideways and altcoins will make people millionaires with minimal trades.

[Anonymous No.7243290]

>>7243160
>Joe, Sally, and Jimmy all have pieces of paper on it saying that Chris has $50,000.00 in fakemoney.
>Bob has a company which says he'll give Chris $50,000.00 cash if he decides to take it and then Joe, Sally, and Jimmy will all agree that Chris will no longer have $50,000 in fakemoney.
>Chris says that's very nice of everybody but since fakemoney is air he doesn't want to play
>IRS wants Chris to pay $17,500 in taxes anyway.

[Anonymous No.7243302]

>>7240986
Capital losses only 3k a year

[Anonymous No.7243378]

>>7243302
Nope. We've been over this $1000 times. Capital losses can be weighed against income up to $3,000 a year, but are first calculated against capital gains to get the NET gain or loss for the year.

So if you make $200,000 in a year but lose $400,000, you don't have to pay any tax on it, at all, and in fact you can take $3000 off your income after the fact. Not the remaining $200,000, just $3000. But you don't have to pay a cent on the original $200,000 you made.

And that's where all the loopholes and evasion schemes are.

[Anonymous No.7243397]

>>7241192

get your lawyer to hire and pay your CPA, then everything you tell the CPA is covered under attorney-client privilege.

but yeah don't ever talk to a CPA without going through a lawyer. CPA's are bound and encouraged to rat on you to the IRS

[Anonymous No.7243411]

And when I work 60 hours a week in my shitty warehouse they tax nearly a third of my fucking overtime. You can't escape the thieving ass kikes.

[Anonymous No.7243469]

>>7243138
Sort of. Until fiat stops being the dominant method of exchange, and people start accepting cryptocurrency in real transactions, people are going to need bank accounts. The bank account is how they control us and control the system. Anyone who deposits more than what they usually receive are going to trigger the flags that rings the IRS doorbell. And most people do not have the luxury of having friends in other countries that can do their banking for them.

But I mean, the good news is yeah, the downfall of the IRS and the fiat dollar system is already underway. Once the decentralized exchanges come out in full, people can trade with full anonymity and peace of mind that no IRS can subpoena those exchanges for records. Combine that with the anon coins and you already have an untraceable network, all you need is merchant adoption.

[Anonymous No.7243476]

>>7243397
People actually expect their CPAs to risk aiding them in tax evasion and destroying their entire careers instead of watching their own back kek

[Anonymous No.7243536]

>>7243411
They can't tax bottle caps, bruh

[Anonymous No.7243540]

You're a cuck if you actually pay taxes on altcoin trades.
Remember, you never traded alts. You bought BTC on Mt. Gox and are now selling it, only paying taxes on long term gains.

[Anonymous No.7243544]

>>7243411
>ITS THE JEWS FAULT I HAVE TO PAY TAXES

so tired of hearing about the fucking jews already
you are so god damn immature and ungrateful

go fucking live in some shithole if you dont like it here, or use the power of your vote to elect a politician who will lower taxes. blaming jews does NOTHING. NOTHING.

[Anonymous No.7243605]

>>7241757
nah ur fuckin wrong idiot

gains - losses = income (if positive). If it's negative you can only deduct up to 3k in losses to offset the rest of your income and you carry the rest over to next year(s).

[Anonymous No.7243612]

>>7243544
Suck my dick nigga I understand tax and don't mind paying tax but when you bust your ass 60+ hours a week you don't need to be taking a third of my overtime just to use it to help pay for Tyrone and his 13 kidz

[Anonymous No.7243651]

>>7243544
You realize your taxes go to pay for the debt occurred by the Federal Reserve printing money? It's a giant scam. Your taxes go into a black hole. The entire government runs on credit...taxes are utterly meaningless.

[Anonymous No.7243688]

>>7243612
then talk to your employer about adjusting the amount that is withheld from your paycheck.
I assume you are upset that he is witholding more than necessary for the sake of playing it conservatively
you owe the taxes you owe, based on your income over the year. Tyrone has nothing to do with it.

>>7243651
>taxes were invented in 1913
l m a o alright if you say so

[Anonymous No.7243698]

>>7243290
>>IRS wants Chris to pay $17,500 in taxes anyway.

Jokes on you. The IRS can't figure people out on wallets. That is the whole point of cryptocurrency.

Also the same reason why MA & PA shops do cash only because they don't want to pay taxes either.

Once again. I'm not paying for wars and seeing people die for limited resources.

Also. I want to point out that the people who designed this bourgeois game, also designed it for you to lose.

Not gonna believe your boogie man propaganda. Good luck trying to tax cryptocurrency, ya covert irs agent.

[Anonymous No.7243704]

>>7243612
whoa, that's racist don't forget miguel

[Anonymous No.7243722]

>>7243688
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenue_Act_of_1913

Signed by Woodcuck Wilson, banker stooge

[Anonymous No.7243732]

>>7243698
>my boogie man propoganda
I'm on your side man. Read every other post I've made in this thread.

[Anonymous No.7243764]

>>7243722
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenue_Act_of_1861

[Anonymous No.7243798]

>>7243764
"Despite its sweeping reform, the ineffective enforcement mechanism coupled with a 3% flat tax rate failed to yield the desired revenue.[12] The income tax provision was repealed in 1862 while the tariff and property tax provisions expired around 1867"

[Anonymous No.7243822]

>>7243651
who paid for the army if there were no taxes? :think:

state services or what? they couldnt exist today

[Anonymous No.7243883]

>>7243798
they repealed and replaced it with another one in 1862
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenue_Act_of_1862

its besides the fucking point anyway. taxes have been around since ancient fucking rome

[Anonymous No.7243897]

>>7243651
>Federal Reserve printing money
Money literally used to pay for public good? You can argue that it's not efficient, or it's spent towards something you don't like, but
>Your taxes go into a black hole.
is false.

[Anonymous No.7243907]

>>7243544
The "pay your fair share" argument goes out the window when the IRS oversteps. This is extremely unfair, double taxing and massively high rates. It cannot be enforced anyway, also this will set a precedent to tax all digital goods. World of Warcraft gold. Microsoft points. Any digital assets.Land in second life. CS:GO weapon skins. Tf2 loot boxes.

We have to fight this. The IRS must lose this battle or they will use it to destroy and punish everyone who makes use of digital goods.

FIGHT THE IRS THIS IS A WAR ON ALL DIGITAL ASSETS!!!! We have to make them pay for breaking the law! They cannot be allowed to set this precedent!!!

[Anonymous No.7243915]

>>7243883
The USA was not founded with Income tax. Income Tax is Unconstitutional and the IRS is a criminal organization.

[Anonymous No.7243995]

>>7243915
yes I am well aware of the history of the American Revolution and the tax laws that sparked it

but it is hardly unconstitutional or criminal,
in fact it is LITERALLY part of the constitution now, its called the sixteenth amendment

[Anonymous No.7244000]

>>7243897
>Money literally used to pay for public good?
No, its not. Fiat is only used to enrich the Elite that control this nation. You can't be this stupid.

>Your taxes go into a black hole
>is false
>Is absolutely true, see the US DEBT IS OVER $20 TRILLION YOU BRAINLET! ITS MEANINGLESS! IT GOES NOWHERE!

You really think taxes pay for the roads? You fucking idiot, the federal reserve literally prints money out of thin air. Why do you think they dont want to be audited? Why do you think they CANT be audited?

Your "taxes" dont do shit. Its only a way to keep the populace in line, enforce authority, and keep the American worker from prospering, keep the people working 50-60 hours a week like they do now. Its a system based purely on debt and its a gigantic scam wake up.

[Anonymous No.7244011]

>>7243688
Personal income taxes didn't start in full force until 1913 upon passing the 16th amendment. United states briefly had income tax under Lincoln but that was repealed in 1871.

Before then federal income came via excise taxes and tariffs.

[Anonymous No.7244025]

>>7240303
>If the market crashes completely, then there is nothing you can do, you still owe those taxes regardless if the market crashes AFTER your trade.
Kek, let's see how long these laws last when they are stepping on the toes of millions of normal people
IRS is sustained by apathy
now people are motivated into its demise
millions of people
that have a vested interest in seeing its restructure
or destruction

:)

[Anonymous No.7244059]

>>7243995
Its unconstitutional and was not intended in the founding of the United States. Thats why the IRS is not a Government agency. It's private just like the Fed, its a fucking scam run by a mafia.

[Anonymous No.7244078]

>>7243907
Read >>7242130.
And no, you are not "double taxed".
>massively high rates
Literally the same rates as your regular income taxes.
>this will set a precedent to tax all digital goods
They never taxed those. They made a new rule for cryptocurrency literally because cryptocurrency was special. They laid out clear definitions.
Continue fear-mongering, hippie.
>We have to make them pay for breaking the law!
They made the rules. Grow up.

[Anonymous No.7244158]

>>7244000
Are you literally denying that tax money is used for anything? Are you literally claiming that public spending has no source?
I'm done. Not wasting time with fairy tale conspiracy theorists. Keep buying gold and keep your tinfoil hat on tight.

[Anonymous No.7244226]

>>7242130
>The laws are reasonable

Laws? Reasonable? Boy oh boy you are 100% Laws are designed for philistines like you and me. NEVER for the elite and those who made the laws.

How fucking dumb are you?

[Anonymous No.7244268]

>>7240303
>I recently spent some money, and spoke to several crypto tax specialist tax attorney's

Funny my tax attorney said you only pay taxes when capital gains are realized when you cash out

For ex. you hold stock A, sell it, buy stock B sell it, buy stock C sell it and go to cash

You add net gain/loss on sale of A, same for B and same for C

Say you bought A for 10 sold for 15. net gain +5

Bought B for 15 sold for 20 net gain +5

Bought C for 20 sold for 10 net -10

Capital gain was zero


Trading is the same. bought XRP for equivalent $10, traded for equivalent of btc $20 = $10 capital gain. etc.


Each trade is taxable but not a gain until its "realized"

[Anonymous No.7244402]

>>7244158
>Are you literally denying that tax money is used for anything?
It's used to pay for the debt incurred by the Federal Reserve printing money. This is fact, not conspiracy. But if you want to spazz out and act like a child, be my guest.

>Are you literally claiming that public spending has no source?
No, you brainlet. It's source is the Federal Reserve. And they "borrow" as much as they please. I'm not exactly sure how to make this any clearer to you.

The Federal Reserve is a private bank that prints money and lends it to the Federal Government at interest. Someone has to pay off that debt - that's where you and I come in, cuck. Your taxes go to pay off that debt, which doesnt even need to be there, but its there anyway because the American People have been conned. That debt is now over $20 trillion dollars. It's therefore become absolutely meaningless, because there is no possible way to pay off the debt and the spending is completely uncontrolled.

Do you get it now, brainlet? Thats why the IRS is an illegal racket, and why it's no where mentioned in the Constitution. 16th Amendment doesnt count. 26 USC 631 "The Secretary shall collect the taxes imposed by the internal revenue laws."

The defining term for "Secretary" is, "The Secretary of the Treasury of Puerto Rico." Those revenue agents operating in all the states are not United States employees.

Read more here, brainlet: http://www.supremelaw.org/authors/gould/part05.htm

We've been scammed. If you're going to act like petulant child, then see ya! Kiddie table is outside this thread.

[Anonymous No.7244447]

>>7244158
> Keep buying gold
>he thinks gold has a value

Tell me. What backs gold? Obviously the people back gold because they just simply believe it does. The only reason they believe is because their neighbors simply believe. With out the people, gold is not back or valued.

just like in 1400 east Africa where shells from the beach were a currency and the only reason shells had a value is because they just simply believed.

[Anonymous No.7244454]

>>7244078
> And no, you are not "double taxed".
Blatent lie, you are forced to cash out in order to pay taxes which is a double tax event.
> Literally the same rates as your regular income taxes.
Its twice as much and extremely high risk because its VERY EASY to end up owing more taxes than you made.
> They never taxed those. They made a new rule for cryptocurrency literally because cryptocurrency was special. They laid out clear definitions.
Continue fear-mongering, hippie.
Its sets the precedent. This is the IRS completely moving in on all digital goods. World Of Warcraft gold is very profitable. Also the definitions are extremely unclear.
> They made the rules. Grow up.
We have to fight them on this or they will enforce taxes on ALL digital goods. We will never be able to even play an MMO without having to report it to the IRS.

I plan to bring crypto into the gaming scene in the near future because its a great profit model. You assholes are going to fuck EVERYTHING up. You fucking assholes you will ruin me you pieces of shit! FUCK YOU!! I am going to do it, I will make you fucking force 8 year olds to report their earnings I force you fuckers into the worst nightmare you ever seen. accountants paying attention to how many times a dragon was slayed!

EAT MASSIVE AMOUNTS OF PAPERWORK YOU FUCKING ASSHOLES. I am coming for you fuckers. You will be counting how many slimes some kid killed while saving up for an iron sword for the rest of your pathetic greedy fucking lives. You will feel PAIN!!!!!!! I will add extra transactions just to make shit more complex. YOU BETTER HOPE I FAIL!!! If the line isnt blurred I'LL FUCKING BLUR IT MORE!!!! Loot crates and gold using smart contracts. game currency will be crypto.

DIGITAL ASSETS CANNOT BE DIRECTLY TAXED!!! FIGHT THE IRS ON THIS!! WE NEED GAMING AND CRYPTO TO BE COMBINED!!!

[Anonymous No.7244526]

>>7244268
I spoke with the best in the industry. He said that its realized at every trade. Every time you trade crypto-to-crypto and there is a gain, the gain is realized because you completed a transaction.

It doesnt matter if its stocks or crypto, all the IRS cares about are the dollar symbols attached to them.

[Anonymous No.7244550]

>>7244526
sauce or gtfo

[Anonymous No.7244560]

>>7243544
Sounds likkke a jew.

[Anonymous No.7244610]

>>7244526
>trading crypto to crypto is taxable
RSGP is a tradable crypto tethered to Runescape GP prices.

That makes trading gold in Runescape a cryptocurrency transaction. Tell the IRS that if they want to start taxing my barrows armor cryptocurrency purchases in Runescape they can fuck off with that impossible to track bullshit.

[Anonymous No.7244637]

>>7244526
> It doesnt matter if its stocks or crypto, all the IRS cares about are the dollar symbols attached to them.

Yep, and this will be when we dismantle the IRS through severe attrition. You fuckers better pray, better HOPE nobody makes a popular game that has smart contracts or crypto as a seamless aspect of the gameplay.

[Anonymous No.7244715]

>>7244637
Every single video game effectively already does this though. No differently than crypto. The algorithm for mining is just harder since it's literally time spent within a game, which is what I tried to explain here: >>7244610

[Anonymous No.7244768]

>>7241989
Their whole policy is literally “we can assume whatever we want and you need to prove us wrong.” This is why tax lawyers exist, if they see you have legal muscle they’ll realize you’re more trouble than your worth unless you made millions and never filed.

[Anonymous No.7244779]

>>7244560
great contribution to the thread. thanks for visiting /biz/. diversity is truly our greatest strength, reallly glad the /pol/ posters are still here


>>7244059
there were state taxes during colonial era even, you know this right?

[Anonymous No.7244823]

>>7244715
You are absolutely correct. I completely agree with you. Also I didn't know RSGP was crypto. But anyone who claims assets in gaming are not digital goods is full of shit. In the near future I am going to make it a bucket list item to make a fairly grindy game that has crypto and smart contracts at its base. It will be designed not just as a game but as a direct attack on the IRS.

[Anonymous No.7244825]

Comfy waiting for cryptoterrorism to start this year.

[Anonymous No.7244913]

>>7244078
>>7244158
Nice straw man, faggot bootlicker

[Anonymous No.7244923]

>>7244823
Digibyte made that Minecraft version where you could mine DGB, but I think it kind of died. Good idea though.

[Anonymous No.7244962]

>>7244610
this x 100. i made buckets 5 years ago botting rs and rwting that shit.asked my tax guy and he said it wasnt trackable on what was invested, so couldnt be taxed on the gain

[Anonymous No.7244981]

>>7244923
I will check this out for sure.

I am actually pretty serious about researching this more. It will be a bit before I go into this full out but it will be soon. We as the crypto community need to treat these games as ideological battle against taxation of digital goods.

Anyway /rant

[Anonymous No.7244998]

You guys should pay your taxes like a good citizen. You wouldn't want to go to jail would you?

t. Not IRS

[Anonymous No.7245003]

>>7240784
Did you ask if you can do LIFO? My taxes are literally half if I do LIFO rather than FIFO.

[Anonymous No.7245022]

>paying taxes when there's many ways to get around it.
nice try IRS

[Anonymous No.7245038]

>>7240880
Ok but it crashed in January so a lot of people had gains from trading in December.

[Anonymous No.7245078]

>>7244981
Just be sure to include tons of microtransactions and a currency that supports transparent/shielded transactions. That will drive them extra crazy.

[Anonymous No.7245092]

>>7240303
What happens if I put all if my money in to crypto which for the purposes of this question is $10k. I go all in on link And I turn that 10k in to 200k. Then right before the end of the tradable year I buy a ponzi scheme like bitconneeeeeect. Then right after the year ends I owe 100k in taxes but before I can cash out to pay it the ponzi scheme I'm in dumps and I lose 99% of my money. Do I still owe the irs 100k even though I'm broke?

[Anonymous No.7245124]

>>7244526
Except most crypto isn't traded for fiat

[Anonymous No.7245162]

>>7245092
Yes. Because the 190k capital gain was realized with your trade out of LINK. And you didn't realize your capital loss from the scam coin by trading out of it until next year. So you'll just have a -200k short term loss for next year. And you'll only get to deduct 3000 of that from your other income every year.

[Anonymous No.7245175]

>>7245092
Can someone help answer this?

[Anonymous No.7245177]

>>7244402
Excuse me. I misunderstood your other posts, because you were incoherent.
Debt exists to cushion taxation. Because people wouldn't appreciate massive volatility in their tax rate.
It makes it easy for the government to raise cash quickly, instead of sending a bill to all taxpayers and waiting for them to pay.
It's not a system to profit just the rich. You can go ahead and buy government bonds and treasury notes to join the "Elites" and get those great returns whereof you seem so envious.

[Anonymous No.7245209]

>>7245078
>>>7244981 (You)
>Just be sure to include tons of microtransactions and a currency that supports transparent/shielded transactions. That will drive them extra crazy.

The current design is to generate a reward pool based on various aspects, micro transactions is one of them. character progress will be based on profits. Profits == levels basically, so if you don't profit from the reward pool your character wont get stronger. And funds will likely be funneled between privacy coins back to faster coins for more dynamic aspects.

I probably fucked up and gave away my identity away by talking about this. But yeah this profit model will be tried and I want to encourage others to do the same.

[Anonymous No.7245212]

>>7245092
you don't owe them anything because they have no clue you made all that money with link. Don't fall for the fear mongering. The IRS
can't even catch regular tax evaders. As long as you aren't retarded and deposit 10k+ to your bank account they have no idea. Don't use coinbase either.

[Anonymous No.7245221]

If I don't file my taxes for crypto will I get penalized when I cash out years later?

[Anonymous No.7245232]

>>7245162
That's fucking scary. I better make sure I cash out right before the end of the year or I could end up a homeless man in prison because the government says I owe them money.

[Anonymous No.7245264]

>all these retards falling for IRS fear when they can't do shit to you if you aren't retarded.

[Anonymous No.7245268]

>>7245232
if youre in prison you arent homeless anymore :^)

[Anonymous No.7245309]

>>7245232
That's why the majority of /biz/ is actually fucked because most of them did trade in December at peak FMV and then lose a lot of gains this January without having cashed anything out for taxes.

[Anonymous No.7245341]

>pajeets in here thinking the IRS is gonna come after them with their 4 figure gains

[Anonymous No.7245354]

>>7240303
fiat to crypto is NOT a taxable event, it's like buying a stock

fucking brainlet

[Anonymous No.7245361]

>>7245264
>>7245212
So what are the correct steps to avoid taxation?
Just don't deposit more than 10K?

There has to be more than that.

[Anonymous No.7245385]

>>7242298
In states that have an income tax, yes. I'm planning on moving to a state with an income tax (either Washington or Nevada)

[Anonymous No.7245392]

>>7240303

Look at the positive... this is the best legal money laundering scheme in the world.

1. Do your evil criminal business, make a pile of cash selling elephant tusks to the South Korean company that uses them to make genetically modified K-pop creatures

2. Report the earnings to the IRS, pay the legal amount of tax on your profit. Tell the IRS... hey, it's crypto, you want records? You're lucky I'm paying. IRS takes the cash and gives you a receipt.

3. Bring your now clean money out into the open, and use it to buy new granite countertops at home depot.

[Anonymous No.7245394]

>>7245361
>buy gold
>btc atms
>localbitcoins
>move countries
pick one

[Anonymous No.7245406]

>>7245212
If you traded and associated your name with Bittrex or poloniex though you're taking a gamble that they won't subpoena the trade histories from those exchanges like they did with Coinbase and charge you with tax evasion if they find unreported trades.

[Anonymous No.7245428]

>>7245406
ever heard of privacy coins?

[Anonymous No.7245434]

Who the fuck do these people think they are. The only reasonable amount they should get is the equivalent of a sales tax on a candy bar. Fucking delusional boomers wanting a fix. Money is literally debt and they just want another hit. In truth cryptocurrency is an appreciating asset that will produce infinite amounts of money for them because as the dollar loses value by the day, crypto gains value.

Yeah, we have crashes every now and then but it's not dead now; meaning that if the worst still couldn't kill us then we are still on track to have a flippening of crypto and fiat currency. There is nothing they can do to stop their ship from sinking. It was the system's fault when they tried to bleed the common folk out of every last penny and keep us in everlasting poverty.

[Anonymous No.7245445]

>>7241757
yes, you're not deducting anything
YOUR CAPITAL GAINS ARE NET
as in capital gains - capital losses

if you have losses but no gains, you can write off only $3000

[Anonymous No.7245454]

>>7245428
I said if you associated your name with the exchange... trading for monero in that case will do nothing.

[Anonymous No.7245495]

>>7245177
>I misunderstood your other posts, because you were incoherent.
No, because you're a brainlet.

>Debt exists to cushion taxation. Because people wouldn't appreciate massive volatility in their tax rate.
No, Debt exists because someone has loaned money to a borrower. In this case, the Federal Reserve has loaned money, which is passed down to the taxpayer, and the government has not properly balanced the checkbooks.

>It makes it easy for the government to raise cash quickly
And? Yes, taking out a loan is a means to raise quick funds. The government should not be entitled to spend itself into infinite debt.

>It's not a system to profit just the rich.
But, it is. Only the Elite who control the banking system are the ones who benefit the most from this scam.

>government bonds and treasury notes
Lmao, you've listened to nothing I've said. The USD becomes worthless, every fiat currency does, because its backed by nothing and the government spends itself and continually prints money until that money becomes worthless.

[Anonymous No.7245552]

>>7241480
According to the IRS yes

Yes it is stupid

[Anonymous No.7245669]

CP from my cpa

The coin trades will generate a taxable event at every swap where you have to calculate the capital gains/losses at each step and report them. The total gets reported on your Schedule D.

[Anonymous No.7245685]

This might be the dumbest shit I've ever read. The goddamn state of this goddamn board.
You buy bitcorn for 10 dollars. If your 10 dollar purchase goes to 20 and you trade for shitcoin x, you owe on the gain of 10. If shitcoin x tanks along with bitcoin until you panic back into bitcoin for 5, you write off your loss of 15. Your net is -5.

I don't understand why this is so difficult for you brainlets. It is a running goddamn tally. In 99% of cases it will equal out to "fiat in, fiat out".
I hate all of you and the fact that this board is littered with the "investments" of people who don't understand a ledger, let alone know how to keep one.
You will all be raped bloody by the taxman or an accountant and you will deserve it.
Hire a professional, at least they will rob you for being to dumb to know better instead of the government.

I hate you all so much.

[Anonymous No.7245757]

>>7245385
The fed is the biggest problem, I plan on just leaving the country entirely.

[Anonymous No.7245772]

>>7240891
There is no statute of limitation on fraud. They can always come after you later and fully prosecute you. Grow up and pay you taxes or prepare to live in fear for the rest of your life.

[Anonymous No.7245839]

>>7245685
Except losses don't carry over to the next year, so people who made fucktons and lost it all still owe for money they might not have.

That's why crypto to crypto is bullshit, they can't put that rule on a market as volatile as crypto and expect people to take it seriously.

[Anonymous No.7245913]

>>7241165
>>7241471
>>7241702
>buy monero with my coins
>send my monero to another exchange without id
>buy whatever coin i want
>send it to my personal wallet
come at me IRS niggers, you can kiss my ass. once I get another citizenship I'm renouncing this garbage and burning my passport, fuck you and fuck your taxes.

[Anonymous No.7246076]

Until I see someone actually get jailed for not paying crypto to crypto trades, I'm not going to give a fuck.

You have to be realistic, are they going to punish every brainlet for this when they haven't even made anything clear.

I'll gladly pay my taxes if I cash out to fiat, but people spending all the time and money calculating crypto to crypto trades are cucks.

[Anonymous No.7246089]

>>7240303
Then I will literally just disappear with the money.

[Anonymous No.7246126]

>>7245092
>I buy a ponzi scheme like bitconneeeeeect.
Something tells me you're not happy with em. Yikes!

[Anonymous No.7246373]

>>7245772
Classic Boogie man. always extolling fear into the minds of the young. Boy do you hate them millennials, huh? Bet you the type od older generation the fucked over the people and now you want these, "Hipsters" to be in line to ,"Pay taxes" ? Ha!! For-fucking-get it, dude.

This generation knows how fucking corrupt our system is. WE know we will make a new imagined power that is more powerful than this imagined power. There is no way in HELL! that the irs to going to tax Cryptocurrency. It's intrinsically not worth their while to waste even more of your taxes just to put in the fucking thought of how much of a mind fuck it is. they would literally have to catch savants (more of your tax dollars wasted again to catch savant) to make that work out for them. The IRS has zero fucking chance to. None.

[Anonymous No.7246472]

>>7241068
Are we allowed to lub up our on asses before they come see us?

[Anonymous No.7246501]

>>7245913
I'm thinking Bahamas

[Anonymous No.7246524]

>>7246472

They don't tell you. Sorry.

[Anonymous No.7246551]

>>7245913
>>send my monero to another exchange without id

is their such a place?

[Anonymous No.7246571]

>>7246551
binance

[Anonymous No.7246616]

>>7245839
Wrong.
You can only deduct 3k losses, but you can carry over the total losses for over 10 years, maybe 15.
Maybe you took 100k loss this year. You can only write it off as -3k this year. But you get to write off the next 97k against your gains next year.
This is structured so you can't make bad investments intentionally to reduce your tax burden.
This is so you can't claim the gubment owes you money.
If you are so stupid that you can't bother to read the tax laws that you are breaking, you deserve the IRS's 14" thundercock down your throat.

You brain dead halfwits who can't be bothered to learn deserve to be bled dry of every penny you accidentally gained.

[Anonymous No.7246670]

Alternatively, never cash out and just buy shit with your crypto. Because crypto will become a stable currency that you can use to buy things, r-right guys? Taxman never has to know.

[Anonymous No.7246712]

>>7246616

This is how you know the IRS is mafia. This is how they talk to you.

[Anonymous No.7246727]

>>7240303

>paid real money to tax fags to explain what everybody already know

Bro you couldve gotten the same information by Googling for 15 seconds.

Moron

[Anonymous No.7246745]

>>7243544
guys, I found one

[Anonymous No.7246865]

>>7244158
can somebody make a list of all irs and federal reserve staff and share it. I'm sure there are many interested parties that would enjoy seeing this list.

[Anonymous No.7246912]

wait so lets say I started with 10K and hit a bunch of moon missions up to 100K and then dropped my 100K on XVG and TRX at ATH and now I only have 50K I can cash out all 50K and then write off 3K in taxes because every trade is a taxable event

lmao IRS cucked themselves

[Anonymous No.7246964]

>>7246616
>>7246616
>>7246616
>>7246616
Oh so that's awesome. Someone who lost everything in the January crash but owes, say, 500k from last year can take off 3k. Problem solved! Oh wait, not many people can make 497k in a year. But that's ok, they can sell their house and live on the street. Oh, they live with their parents? Ok then, no problem, they just have to go to prison. But it's cool, because when they get out several years later without a penny to their name they'll can deduct 497k from taxes they will never make because no one will hire a felon and they offed themself anyways. Problem solved.

[Anonymous No.7246976]

>>7244779
found another one, lots of them in the tax threads... be a patriot, pay your taxes, israel needs your money

[Anonymous No.7247025]

>>7246745
> here is another

[Anonymous No.7247055]

>>7244998
irs or israel, ameritards are sleeping

[Anonymous No.7247073]

>>7245092
you owe zero regardless of any of your crypto gains or losses

[Anonymous No.7247119]

>>7245232
fearmongering. no one is going to jail, ignore these tax threads.

[Anonymous No.7247206]

>>7245669
tax attorney here, ignore these Israeli and irs posters, crypto trades are not taxable.

[Anonymous No.7247227]

>>7245685
the feeling is mutual irs stooge

[Anonymous No.7247253]

>>7245772
fearmongering stooge. nobody is going to be prosecuted because virtual currency isn't dven fucking real.

[Anonymous No.7247297]

>>7246126
yikes, i don't know anything about crypto but someone paid me to post "pay your taxes".

[Anonymous No.7247333]

>>7246472
i don't know, when you invite your irs friends over do they normally use lube?

[Anonymous No.7247340]

>>7247253
>>7247227
>>7247206
>>7247119
>>7247073
>>7247055
>>7247025
>>7246976
You do know this board specifically shows your anon, id right? Are you trying to pretend you're different people? HAAHAHAHAHAHAHHA

[Anonymous No.7247357]

>>7246616
okay irs employee, tax dollars hard at work here.

[Anonymous No.7247406]

>>7247025
found another... israelis on a tax post like flies on shit

[Anonymous No.7247421]

>>7247340
no one is pretending except you

[Anonymous No.7247426]

>>7247357
>>7247406

you're the same guy. I don't understand why you're pretending to be different people.

[Anonymous No.7247491]

>>7247421

Yeah you are. I'm not a fucking idiot you dolt!

[Anonymous No.7247514]

>>7247426
is english your first language, who said I am pretending. cant argue facts mr. shekelstein, now trying to distract and demonise the messenger.

[Anonymous No.7247531]

>>7247491
I have multiple posts, not pretending to be anyone else. idiot

[Anonymous No.7247548]

>>7247514
>now trying to distract and demonise the messenger.

What?!

[Anonymous No.7247573]

>>7247531

Yeah you are. You literally are! Because you keep changing personality types on these post. You're trying to stir shit. Don't play fucking coy with me, buddy. I know exactly what you are doing.

[Anonymous No.7247671]

what the fuck

[Anonymous No.7247775]

>>7247671
wtf, the nerve of someone responding to our crypto tax propaganda.

[Anonymous No.7247816]

>>7245772
You can only go to prison for tax FRAUD if you file a tax return.

If you are a crypto millionaire NEET why would you file a tax return? That's for wage slaves. If you are a wage slave there's no law that says you have to file a tax return (which is a scam, there are steps you can take to eliminate withhodling). Millions of people don't file taxes every year and less people go to prison for tax evasion than tax FRAUD.

Can someone make an image that dispels common tax FUD?

[Anonymous No.7247843]

>>7246964
Ok, so you reinvented debtors prison, and you somehow owe 500k from last year, but you live with your parents.
If you somehow owe 500k, it's because you realized 1.5mil + gains.

You are literally too stupid to have money.
It is a good system that makes sure that you are poor.
It's hard to believe you even figured out how to buy anything outside of coinbase.

You are hopeless. Your gains are accidental and undiserved.
Dumb luck is all you have going for you.
Kys.

[Anonymous No.7247852]

>>7247775
I see it's literally your first day on 4chan so I'll throw you a bone. You can multi-quote people so you don't look like a massive fucking faggot

[Anonymous No.7247926]

>>7241449
>If you are one of the unlucky ones who get singled out.
We need to support them. They will have to change the laws when they know they can't scare >us into paying.

[Anonymous No.7247985]

Ive been staying up all night thinking about this and I realized that this is all moot, If BTC continues to explode. Cliff High says that BTC is going to $100k this year. If so, then it doesn't matter.

I have a very simple solution that will help you sleep at night.

It's very simple - HODL and defer paying your taxes. Declare, but dont pay it. You want to declare, because you get lighter penalties than not filing at all.

DONT pay, because the interest and late penalty will be minimal slaps on the wrist, versus the upside of hodling in the long run. Dont liquify your holdings to pay tax NOW, defer and let the value of crypto rise as the value of USD shrinks.

That's all you need to do.

[Anonymous No.7248104]

>was really stressed about figuring taxes on 90K crypto gains this year because of tens of thousands of tiny trades associated with margin borrowing and multiple crypto-to-crypto trades executed
>spent hours dicking around with cointracking and excel to pare everything down to two 8949-compliant attachments of four pages or less
>completed Schedules A, D, and Qualified Dividends and Capital Gains Tax Worksheet
>end up owing only about 10 grand above and beyond what was withheld on my W2

Was a pleasant surprise, to be honest.

[Anonymous No.7248161]

>>7244454
this but unironically kek

[Anonymous No.7248323]

>he is registered in a country that has capital gains and income tax
How retarded can you be? You can still live in the US all year. Just buy a shitty house in some tax haven.

[Anonymous No.7248351]

>>7248323
nice larp
>he thinks US citizens can get tax non-resident status
>he thinks it even exists for US citizens
>he doesnt know he has to spend over 350 days outside the US per year to exempt up to 100k

[Anonymous No.7248382]

>>7248351
If you haven't rescinded your US citizenship then you're beyond help to begin with.

[Anonymous No.7248499]

>>7241437
>>7240423
>>7240358
>DR shilling
>shilling so people can move to a shithole where Haitians larp as if they Spaniards

[Anonymous No.7248646]

Funny, irs hired contractors from israel to scare taxpayers into paying. This might have worked on reddit where people view by "hot" but here this thread will be dead and burried before americans even wake up. the incompetence is hilarious.