/biz/ - Business & Finance

[Anonymous No.55662460]

Why don't people understand Proof-of-work (PoW) is the innovation behind Bitcoin, and is the only innovation in the whole "crypto" space?

[Anonymous No.55662523]

Because it uses too much energy

[Anonymous No.55662551]

>>55662460
Kek whenever Maxi's feel threatened they cry "you don't understand bitcoiiiiin!!!" Even normalfags understand the concept, no one cares faggot.

[Anonymous No.55662569]

Proof-of-Work already existed before Bitcoin. You're an idiot.

[Anonymous No.55662590]

>>55662569
true, but bitgold was the first to use it ser

[Anonymous No.55662780]

>>55662460
do you understand how haircomb uses bitcoins PoW to destroy commercial banking?

[Anonymous No.55662817]

>>55662460
its not easy to understand the fundamentals of why Proof of Work is so great. you have to have a 110IQ+

[Anonymous No.55663244]

>>55662523
Energy argument didn't exist in early Bitcoin years. It just came up after the climate warming psyop became shilled more and more. do you know who wastes energy? You. You can make earth survive. Just kys

[Anonymous No.55663533]

a slow piece of shit with high transaction fees?
awesome innovation

[Anonymous No.55663545]

>>55662460
Because if people understood, all shitcoin jeet scams would rug and Bitcoin would be profitable again.

[Anonymous No.55663561]

>>55663533
I can send bitcoin payments with very little fees and instantly, are you too stupid to do it too? your shitty alternative will disappear or go to zero in the end.

[Anonymous No.55663581]

>>55663244
>Energy argument didn't exist in early Bitcoin years.
Because it didn't require it back then. PoW incentivises more and more energy to be consumed mining blocks to produce exactly the same TX output. That's a lot of wasted energy.

[Anonymous No.55663751]

>>55663581
It's better than the alternative, which will be either vulnerable to attacks, or subject to dilution of the supply in the case of centralized money, creating problems worse than having a working system using energy (like all monetary systems).

[Anonymous No.55663854]

>>55663581
its not "wasted energy" research more. also as a civilization advanced the energy consumption increases and increases until the civilization ultimately consumes the sun directly. You have no idea and perspective about :

- Electricity
- The electricity grid
- How electricity is produced (and how much is just wasted)
- Green Energy
- Energy in General
- Proof of work
- IT/DevOps
- Future vision

I'm an industrial engineer.

You severely lack knowledge about a very broad amount of topics. that's why you say "its a waste of energy"

there technically is nothing that is "a waste of energy" and especially not bitcoin. taking money creation out of the hands of central goverments and banks is actually already priceless but yeah. whatever. you don't even understand that part.

I'll give you afew on "future vision" point of my list. Basically Bitcoin drives a lot of technological advancement. it drives chip production and improvement. it drives energy production. (these are obvious. it is also building the biggest distributed hashing network in the world. right now these calculations only just "find the next block" but in the (not so far) future this network will dual calculate huge things. (its a a super A.I brain)

"a waste of energy" - t. sub 100 IQ with no knowledge about anything.

[Anonymous No.55663915]

>>55663561
Show transaction id or you're larping.

[Anonymous No.55663937]

>>55663915
>> what is Lightning network

I mean, bitrefil supports lightning. you can basically buy a gift card for any significant thing there.

you can use Bitcoin for small transactions too now.

[Anonymous No.55664003]

>>55662460
Because you and every single bitnigger is fucking stupid, that's why.

[Anonymous No.55664023]

>>55663854
>taking money creation out of the hands of central goverments and banks is actually already priceless
>trades for central bank usd notes
yeah nice subversive economy you got there. Cryptocucks are retarded

[Anonymous No.55664028]

>>55663937
>custodial wallets
>passing around digital IOU's
Yea I'm thinking were being herded back into the same old tradfi bullshit

[Anonymous No.55664072]

>>55663937
there is more btc bridged on avalanche than on lightning. IOU for IOU, i trust avax more

[Anonymous No.55664093]

>>55662460
I envision a new future of crypto. Where POW does not stand for proof of work, but proof of white. How can blockchain make this possible? Maybe some sort of game-theoried POS where validators need to confirm that individuals are white before they can confirm a transaction within a block?

[Anonymous No.55664098]

PoS, implemented properly, would be strickly superior to PoW. The advantage of PoW is that is much simpler and verifiably secure, with the downside of energy usage. PoS relies on complex incentives and game theory that are easy to get wrong, but when implemented correctly are expected to actually be more secure than PoW and doesn't require mining energy usage.

Its just that do the complexity of PoS its a lot harder to definitively prove the security like PoW, and PoS is less battle tested to prove its secure. But if ethereum for example runs PoS for 10+ years with hundreds of billions kept safe, it will get harder and harder for bitcoiners to justify PoW.

The one advantage of PoW, and its specific to bitcoin, is that you don't actually have to define the origin block or even the protocol to determine what the "real" bitcoin is. The real bitcoin is the chain with the most combined "work" or summed difficulties. So PoW does have one advantage that only applies to Bitcoin, the first crypto. Every other coin you need a source of trust to determine what the actual protocol is to differentiate it from Bitcoin.

[Anonymous No.55664101]

>>55664093
this

[Anonymous No.55664104]

Because they want funny dog coins to .make them rich, no one cares about fucking tech nerd shit

[Anonymous No.55664107]

>>55662460
you mean xrp settling in 4 seconds for practically no cost isn't innovation? because 'muh centralized company with a ceo has half?'
let's pretend bitcoin isn't some honeypot scam, do you really think the central bankers are just going to kneel to bitcoin because it's a firefly nest surrounding the goddess of wisdom or some crap?
nigger please

[Anonymous No.55664123]

>>55664023
Either you're a shiny rock enjoyer, in much case you are more retarded because money needs to be digital, at the very least settlement needs to and gold cannot do it.
Either you're a dollar cuck and you're infinitely more retarded because the dollar is still trending towards surely to zero as we speak.
Either you're something else, in which case you're also retarded because there's no other ways for money to exist.
In any way, you've got to acknowledge that bitcoin will not replace all money overnight, so obviously some people will convert it for various reasons. Some don't, and in the end there won't be any need to convert anything.

[Anonymous No.55664128]

>>55664107
now try spending those xrp for actual goods & services, see how long your "settlement" takes. Meanwhile credit cards..

[Anonymous No.55664144]

>>55664123
there is nothing special about bitcoin as long as it trades like a fucking stock, which there is no way it wont be. It will always be used as a speculation vehicle to take real spendable money from retards like you

[Anonymous No.55664149]

>>55664098
A system where the people that have the most money(including those who control money) can use propaganda and power to manipulate the pos system isn't a secure system. The longer it goes the harder it will fail. Contrary to pow, where the longer it goes, the safer it is. PoS coins simply cannot be money. The game theory is flawed, and attacker with enough power already can accumulate indefinitely, for every chains and forks, for little cost, and disturb the network. It's not safe, not fair, it's pretty much garbage that are suitable for irrelevant projects, not for money itself.

[Anonymous No.55664155]

>>55664128
right because banks moving billions of dollars are going to use credit cards because 'they just work'
XRP is not for you
stay poor

[Anonymous No.55664158]

proof of work isn't the innovation
blockchain isn't the innocation
bitcoin is the innovation. the only decentralized neutral money we're ever going to see

you can't recreate the zero to one event with anything else, the entire space has been compromised and infected with financial incentives since even before litecoin appeared.
the product with bitcoin is and always has been btc. the technology will change, the use cases will evolve, but you'll never be able to get trustless access to the asset anywhere else.

everything else is the inverse, where instead of the technology servicing the asset, the asset is extracting value from the technology, like eth with the contract/token/nft ecosystem on ethereum, or xmr with the ongoing assumptions of privacy technology on monero.
the only exceptions are stablecoins.

[Anonymous No.55664171]

>>55664144
Nice way to completely dodge my post. Now read it again and try to understand why you're the retard here. Bitcoin will be very desirable and with more volume the volatility will lower, then we will price everything based on it as a last step.

[Anonymous No.55664181]

>>55664155
>he actually thinks banks will use his shitcoin
lmao midwit. Banks are doing fine without any of that crap, they dont need it. Keep holding like a cuck while traders make real money

[Anonymous No.55664184]

>>55664149
We'll see with eth. An eth staker with above average ether gets the same return as any other staker, their proportional ownership doesn't grow any faster.

[Anonymous No.55664213]

>>55664184
wrong. economies of scale are critical in ethereum because extracting mev value half your entire return, likely to continue eclipsing standard new issuance. that doesn't even start to get into multi-block mev and advanced strategies.

proof of work's economies of scale pale in comparison to what you can get away with in pure financialized systems like proof of stake. ethereum isn't going to be able to stop the restaking train.

[Anonymous No.55664223]

>>55664184
Okay we will see if you want but in fact there's nothing to see. What I've described is enough to understand why PoS system should never be used for "world money". Your last sentence makes me feel you didn't understood what I've said. It's not so much about stakers intrinsically, but about power that already exist outside the system. We're still primitive and in a way or another there will be energy spent to control/attack/secure the system. PoW is the most efficient and the most secure at scale.

[Anonymous No.55664225]

>>55664171
>we will price everything based on it
deluded

[Anonymous No.55664249]

>>55664225
Once again ignoring all of my points. Because you have nothing to answer and when you try to think about it it makes you feel stupid. Maybe because you are I'm afraid.
If the dollar trend doesn't change, what I've described will absolutely happen given enough time.

[Anonymous No.55664254]

>>55664213
>>55664223
MEV and influences from external value affects PoW too, its just that PoW coins like bitcoin never supported real smart contract until recently and don't have defi yet. The exact same issues will occur in PoW eventually if they catch up, and will requires separation of block builders and miners eventually which eth is already ahead on figuring out.

[Anonymous No.55664285]

>>55663854
> right now these calculations only just "find the next block" but in the (not so far) future this network will dual calculate huge things. (its a a super A.I brain)
No. That is for separate networks. Bitcoin doesn’t waste energy, except in the naive way that an alarm system or a police force wastes energy (“if everyone were just honest we wouldn’t need to spend this energy”). The energy is used to protect the integrity of the world’s money. Few things are less wasteful to spend energy on. Human civilization correlates directly to the integrity of our money.

[Anonymous No.55664298]

>>55664254
No, PoW prevents those in power to control the network as easily because it requires energy. There's really no way around it. PoS isn't as safe as PoW by a very long shot. PoS is unsafe the bigger it grows.

[Anonymous No.55664315]

>>55664098
>with the downside of energy usage.
its not a downside lmao.
> its more secure than PoW
the mere fact that the stakeholders / asset holders own the entire network is such a big flaw. PoS is centralized by default. you mint out of thin air and then distribute. its banking 2.0. there is no innovation. PoS is what we have right now in TradFi. the rich get richer sitting on their dollars. you might not understand it but whatever.

> if ETH
ETH was firstly premined by vitalik. the PoW version came out first but before it came out it was already decided they would move to Proof of Stake later. I don't know if you ever heard about the DAO hack? anyway Vitalik forked ETH because now a hacker had +-10pct of the voting power in the future Proof of stake network. Also, the owners of the ETH network have been set in stone from the beginning, well it would not have if they didn't move to Proof of stake, but they did!

> it will get harder and harder to justify PoW
no, it is not. you can not even obtain a fundamentally open / permissionless network without proof of work. if you set up proof of stake then it becomes permissioned. and the rulers are the 51pct stake holders and in most cases. those have been fixed from the start. so any "pure" PoS coin has been controlled from the start and ETH well, go investigate how that thing started and how much vitalik premined lmao. and gave to his friends and close inner circle. the network was owned from the start.

>> the only advantage

ULTRAKEK

[Anonymous No.55664321]

>>55664285
> hurr we need the equivalent of irelands entire power usage to ensure data validity of a fraction of a percent of global transactions

Can't wait for the future where a Wendy's needs a dedicated nuclear plant to run its PoS.

[Anonymous No.55664327]

>>55664144
> there is nothing special about bitcoin as long as it trades like a fucking stock, which there is no way it wont be.
Tell me which currency/money you imagine this is different from? Gold? USD? Yen? ETH?

[Anonymous No.55664364]

>>55664298
PoS is ridicilously easy to take controll of. how easy is it to obtain 51pct stake of an asset? you can get creative here.

suppose you are a group with intent to take control of ETH. suppose you have a $100M combined and you have a team of like 50 very high intel people and another 200 "workhorsemen" to obtain the 51pct you can:

- find out who big stakeholders are, threathen them coherse them to vote in your favor / give up their stake
- hack/exploit DEFI apps
- steal ETH from plebs like pajeets
- BUY ETH when its low
- Leverage trade to obtain more and more eth
... etc etc there is so many easy ways to obtain the 51pct stake of this virtual asset. if you are the U.S.A goverment for example, imagne how easy it is! imagine you obtained 40pct of the supply with hacking, exploiting, leverage trading, maniuplation after ~5 years of intensive work. FUCK! we only need 11pct more, well, if you are goverment or central bank connected group. or are them. YOU CAN JUST PRINT MORE MONEY AND BUY UP THE STAKE!

but what if the last percent of stake isn't for sale? then you have to send the your hitmen around again i guess. ethereum is a transparant blockchain. so easy to find out who owns what; especially for big entities.

meanwhile, in PoW/Bitcoin. Michael saylor who has 150k Bitcoins has no control whatso ever over the network. there's a seperation here. like how in govermental structures you also seperate church and state, or LAW and ENFORCEMENT i hope you get the idea.

TL;DR: obtaining 51pct of a virtual PoS stake asset is 1000x easier than obtaining majority PoW

[Anonymous No.55664372]

>>55664315
>PoS is what we have right now in TradFi, the rich get richer
This is such a stupid comment. Anyone can stake and get the same APY in ethereum, so just because you have more eth doesn't mean you grow your balance. Like if someone has 1 ether, and another 1000 ether, one had 1000x more eth. Then a year later if staking was 4%, then one guy has 1.04 and the other 1040, he still has 1000x, the wealth hasn't changed between people with different amount just between stakers and non-stakers.

And if you actually think that's an issue, miners wealth grows faster in PoW because there are much fewer miners compared to non-miners.

>>55664298
Mining just determines who gets to build the block. So MEV will happen on bitcoin with PoS eventually because miners can get extra value by building blocks certain ways. If you have 10% of the miner power, you build 10% of the blocks just like if you have 10% of the stake. The only reason it doesn't is because bitcoin isn't used for defi, primarily just a buy and hold coin.

There is actually a valid argument to never allow smart contracts on bitcoin, then you can prevent MEV, but its prevented by preventing defi, it has nothing to do with PoW/PoS.

[Anonymous No.55664374]

>>55662523
>>55663581
retards
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-7dMVcVWgc

[Anonymous No.55664382]

>>55664364
Its much easier for the US gov to take control of the top few bitcoin miners than steal millions of people's eth.

[Anonymous No.55664385]

>>55664372
in proof of stake you sit on your ass and collect stake for doing nothing. its the rich get richer doing nothing. in proof of work you have to deliever the WORK. I wont go much further here cause I am tired of explaining this fundamental difference to plebs who never really looked into it. but I suggest you do. anyway i have to go to bed.

[Anonymous No.55664391]

>>55664385
Did you even read my post>>55664372
> if someone has 1 ether, and another 1000 ether, one had 1000x more eth. Then a year later if staking was 4%, then one guy has 1.04 and the other 1040, he still has 1000x, the wealth hasn't changed between people with different amount just between stakers and non-stakers.

You're just wrong.

[Anonymous No.55664392]

>>55664382
no. go learn more about how mining pools work and all.

[Anonymous No.55664398]

>>55662460
every fag wishes he had 1/20 of the total supply so wants to be "Bitcoin 2.0"

[Anonymous No.55664400]

>>55664391
yes i did read your post. its a parrot i've read many times. and I actually thought the exact same thing a few years ago, PoS is great! Pow sucks! until i actually spend a few months really researching both, instead of just parroting the most simple lines one can find.

[Anonymous No.55664404]

>>55663854
>*enters the moNEGRO*
fuck off tard

[Anonymous No.55664415]

>>55664364
>he doesn't realize this same argument applies equally to BTC miners
The government if it wanted to could commission nuclear plants specifically dedicated to mining BTC and would cost about the same as buying 51% of all ETH. Plus if you send hitmen after miners, their operations are finished, whereas killing ETH stakers doesn't mean you can recover their coins.

[Anonymous No.55664445]

>>55664415
proof of stake : goverment prints dollars and buys majority stake
proof of work : goverment has to build enough nuclear plants to get 51pct of stake.

I hope you understand which is fundamentally more difficult?

[Anonymous No.55664452]

>>55664445
use some leverage trading, exploit some markets. vs building nuclear plants. what is more difficult hmm. especially when you can print dollars... HMMMMMMMMMM I wonder.

ok really have to go now

[Anonymous No.55664459]

>>55664445
>>55664452
I wonder how much ethereum is at exchanges. how much ethereum could the U.S.A goverement seize right now from coinbase and kraken? just by sending some letters? or the FBI for a raid?

VS

building nuclear plants. like 1000 of them

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[Anonymous No.55664472]

>>55664445
>>55664452
>>55664459
The government prints the money to pay the contractors to build the nuclear plants, so in that respect it's the same. Yeah okay, it might take some time. So would literally terrorizing and extorting 51% of ETH in existence lmao.

[Anonymous No.55664482]

>>55664459
ETH can also just move offshore like BTC miners do when getting (repeatedly) banned by China for instance.

[Anonymous No.55664485]

>>55664445
>>55664452
>>55664459
You are such an idiot. You realize this is a huge advantage of PoS? PoS is more resilient to 51% attacks. Its much easier for other validators to simply fork the network and ignore the attacker.

And besides, how much sell side liquidity is there for eth? A few billion? The gov would literally send ether to infinity dollars if they tried to buy 51% of the entire supply. For literally nothing because the attack could be stopped.

[Anonymous No.55664495]

>>55664472
its far from the same dude lets be honest. also, when alphabay assets was seized by the U.S.A gov they took 8 MILLION ETH. just like that, ! of course they also took 600k bitcoins, but that does not matter, cause for bitcoin you need to deliver hash rate , not just own the virtual asset.

when ETH experienced the DAO hack I think the hacker took of with like 15pct of total supply. of course vitalik then decided to fork the network. heh. couldn't have the hacker, an unknown enitty have any say in the future

[Anonymous No.55664498]

>>55664472
>The government prints the money to pay the contractors to build the nuclear plants, so in that respect it's the same.
kek
you're retarded

[Anonymous No.55664503]

>>55664485
>PoS is more resilient to 51% attacks
hahahah
so many idiots itt

[Anonymous No.55664517]

>>55664498
>hurr durr ur retard
Not an argument

[Anonymous No.55664523]

>>55664249
the dollar has devalued 99% and its still going. Your inflation argument falls flat on its face, because they can keep the scheme going forever as long as there are workers and production. Prices rise? so do wages.
Your points:
>you're retarded money needs to be digital
it already is
>you're a dollar cuck and retarded cause dollar going to zero
it can devalue another 99% and still be used, no problem
>something else you're retarded
whatever
>we'll price everything in btc eventually
no you wont. Increases in production means goods get cheaper, there is no incentive to spend if your btc appreciates. Maybe if btc didnt have a hard supply cap you'd have a point, but the 80/20 rule will always apply. Tx costs alone means you cant buy cheap goods with it, only good for buying property and other expensive things.
>inb4 lightning network
you're back to square one with centralized bank like entities controlling most supply as with gold, not to mention the power you're giving to power companies and those who control energy (the same people that control banks today). All in all there is nothing revolutionary or subversive about your system, the same people as now would be in charge

[Anonymous No.55664526]

>>55664517
if someone thinks it is as easy for gov to build nuclear power plants as to print more fiat, then he is too retarded to talk to.

he can't even notice how not every country shits dozens of nuclear power plants, while every one - even the poor one (especially the poor ones too) print fiat exponentially

noose yourself cretin(s)

[Anonymous No.55664534]

>>55664498
>>55664503
well, /biz/ is shitcoin central and many people here just shill their aboslute trash print of of thin air (usually PoS) asset. Probably I shouldn't have expected anything else.


there's the avax shills, I met a venezulan girl online who gets paid to shill avax. in avax of course, pretty funny.

then there's the chainlink shills, their stink trash asset is also staking now. can you imagine that sergey printed 1 Billion chainlink tokens and gifted himself 600 million tokens. then managed to somehow meme magic it to like 500x from 10 cents to 50 dollars and now he's dumping on it forever? he just pirnted it himself! the chainlink tardos don't see anything wrong with this i guess.

[Anonymous No.55664536]

>>55664523
>>inb4 lightning network
>you're back to square one with centralized bank like entities controlling most supply
what is this midwit talking about?
LN is decentralisation. And improves BTC's decentrl (by keeping blocks small on layer 1)

[Anonymous No.55664544]

>>55664503
You're the idiot lol resilience to 51% attacks is one of the biggest advantages of PoS. Validators can much easier fork the chain and remove the attacker's entire stake compared to PoW where the attacker can just follow the fork and fuck it up too.

If the gov attacked bitcoin by taking over the top miners, its over for bitcoin. If the gov literally destroyed the dollar to buy 51% of all eth, the network could just fork to steal their stake and it would be over for the DOLLAR.

[Anonymous No.55664576]

>>55664534
now that i think about it chainlink it the prime example of the shit tier b.s that is proof of stake.

>> be SirGay
>> print 1 billion tokens on ethereum (copy past erc20 contract
>> give myself 600 million tokens.
>> give some other early investors and birds I know another XXX millions of tokens
>> DUMP .. 50 Million tokens the past few years
>> still have full single control of the entire chainlink system

AH yes, proof of stake! the superior ... KEK

[Anonymous No.55664580]

>>55664576
oh don't forget

>> have majority stake anyway
>> just dump stake forever

KEK

[Anonymous No.55664588]

>>55664576
Its not like you can't make premined PoW shitcoins lol. There are plenty of shitty, scam PoW coins.

[Anonymous No.55664591]

>>55664536
and how is that BTC distribution? surely its evenly distributed among the population? nope

[Anonymous No.55664599]

>>55664588
if you read above, you would have noticed I tlaked about ETH. ETH was premined by vitalik. 70pct of total supply was premined. and then he did the first ICO.

[Anonymous No.55664613]

>>55664588
of course you can make premined shitcoin pow coins. but that's beside the point. you don't have any control over the network by owning those coins. you have no say in what happens. in proof of stake, if you control 51pct of stake, you OWN then network FOREVER and no one can EVER challenge you. fundamentally different than POW.

[Anonymous No.55664615]

>>55664181
what makes it mine?
you don't think banks would be in on it? for plausible deniability?
kek

[Anonymous No.55664688]

>>55664544
>Validators can much easier fork the chain and
he thinks this is a good thing! LOOL
your brain on altcoins

[Anonymous No.55664690]

>>55664526
You're honestly a retard for thinking it's hard lmao. The context was a government willing to terrorize and extort 51% of the total global ETH supply. Such a government would not have an issue commissioning nuclear plants or any other high yield energy producing infrastructure via executive fiat (legislature not needed, "the people" not needed, except as wageslaves and literal slaves). You missed the whole point because you're a dumb bitnigger.

[Anonymous No.55664696]

>>55664591
>surely its evenly distributed among the population?
are you some retarded commie? why you think this is a good thing if it would be?

[Anonymous No.55664707]

>>55664523
bitcoin having limited supply, the world will continue moving towards that rather than dollars "devaluing 99%". thinking the dollar can devalue forever when an alternative is quickly rising in price is totally ignoring reality. markets determine the value of money, and the market, which isn't made up of the us only, will certainly pick a non deprecating currency vs a deprecating currency.

money has to be a store of value, you need to be able to save it, and the dollar fails at that, so like I've said if the trend continues, it will disappear.

furthermore as you know, a currency that keeps losing value, eventually ends up accelerating towards zero faster and faster.

people will still invest and consume if btc "appreciates" (it will stabilize and stop appreciating that much). you can already see it in action, many people with bitcoins just invest it in order to get more of it.

>you're back to square one with centralized bank like entities controlling most supply
either you don't know what is the lightning network, or you're really retarded. the LN has nothing to do with the control of the supply of bitcoin. it will always be 21 millions no matter what people build on top. that's the fucking point. savers in bitcoin won't get their savings devalued by politics.

[Anonymous No.55664733]

>>55664613
If you have the majority of a coin, you can fork, and then dump your share for the new fork and swing the price of the original chain to near zero while the price of the new chain astronomically higher and all miners are incentivized to mine on your fork.

Imagine if Craig Wright owned 12 million BTC and swapped it all for BSV. BSV would be #1, BTC would be dumped to 0, and it would be millions of times more profitable to mine BSV.

>>55664688
It is because cryptos have to adopt to fix vulnerabilities.

[Anonymous No.55664757]

>>55662460
Proof of work with the difficulty adjustment.

[Anonymous No.55664776]

>>55664696
so you're ok with a couple neckbeards and jews owning 90% of supply?
>if you're against a massive plutocracy you must be a commie
fucking retard lmao
>>55664707
>alternative is quickly rising in price
its called a pump and dump, nothing is pointing to adoption, quite the contrary. If goods could be priced in btc without the usd intermediary, it would already been done. The only reason anyone accepts btc, is cause they can trade for dollars. Rest of your post is pure cope.

[Anonymous No.55664784]

>>55664707
>money has to be a store of value
that is simply impossible. As long as technology advances and production increases, everything will lose value. You cant store value except with factories and land, and even then you will lose. Your economic theory is flawed

[Anonymous No.55664814]

>>55664776
>Rest of your post is pure cope.
not cope, it's rational thinking and facts which you're apparently too stupid to respond to. You are unable to prove me wrong that's why you didn't said anything.

>nothing is pointing to adoption
whatever you say retard

>If goods could be priced in btc without the usd intermediary, it would already been done
guess what it can't moron, that's why I've said that it will be a unit of account as a "last step". I've told you bitcoin cannot become money overnight, remember? it shouldn't be too hard to understand this one.
bitcoin is appreciating vs the dollar and the trend is certainly not reversing, especially when dollar cucks like you feel okay with it devaluing 99% more.

[Anonymous No.55664828]

>>55664814
its not about being ok with or not, you think in feelings i deal with reason and logic and facts. Dollar can and will devalue another 99% over this century, it doesnt fucking matter. You could increase dollar supply 100x right now and adjust wages and prices, nothing would change cause inflation is not the real issue. You austrians are fucking retarded.
Btc worth 10 million? probably cause money supply has also increased, doesnt change a thing will still be pumped and dumped for usd and those usd traded for real goods / land / workers / tools / business etc

[Anonymous No.55664876]

>>55664784
literally no one agree with your opinion, store of value is one of the three function of money and according to cambridge it's the most important one.

>>55664828
sure dollar accelerating to zero doesn't matter, tell that to savers and especially those who don't want to gamble it like traders. the market will select what is more valuable, and so the regular people. dollar not needed. I'm not wasting any more of my time talking with someone having such ridiculous opinions.

[Anonymous No.55664899]

>>55664876
>store of value is one of the three function of money
name anything that has been used as money that has stored its value throughout time. It doesnt exist. Fiat doesnt store value, gold doesnt store value, bitcoin doesnt store value.
Nobody "saves" in fiat thats retarded, thats why investments exist. Nobody ever said you would conserve your purchasing power holding fiat.

[Anonymous No.55664905]

>>55664899
Gold has stored value for thousands of years. If you bought gold in 2000 BC and passed it through your family until now it would still have value.

[Anonymous No.55664915]

its not even the OG bitcoin anymore. if you don't understand this, it's why you keep getting rugged.

[Anonymous No.55664923]

>>55664905
it stores some of its value right, like fiat "stores" value by not dumping to 0 overnight. But it lost a lot of that value compared to holding land

[Anonymous No.55664983]

>>55664905
>>55664923
and for the final pill: gold could be stolen/confiscated. So could land. You and your genes are the actual value, if you're actually worth. Thats why the same bloodlines keep rulling the world, they didnt store their value on something material, but in knowledge and blood. The knowledge on how to do business, how to control the masses, how to manipulate. Sure gold and land was their go to wealth keeper, until they found a better option (fractional reserve banking). They will find a better option once again, cause human nature doesnt change. You cant materially store value, period.

[Anonymous No.55665002]

>>55662523
It doesn’t use it, it absorbs it. Bitcoins final form will be attached to poweplants using excess energy. Saving literal trillions.

[Anonymous No.55665011]

>>55664923
>>55664983
In Babylon in 500 BC an ounce of gold bought 350 loaves of bread. Today a loaf of bread cost about $2. So 1 ounce of gold today will buy you 982 loaves of bread, not just a store of value over 2000+ years, a 2.8x gain. Now most of that is due to the economy being more efficient at producing bread. But that's the entire purpose of money, its value is from people who use it as a system of accounting, not the intrinsic value of the medium.

[Anonymous No.55665154]

>>55664690
>in my fairy tale governments can easily shit up tons of nuclear plants
come back to this site when you are 18+ years old.

[Anonymous No.55665240]

>>55664776
>so you're ok with a couple neckbeards and jews owning 90% of supply?
because you were too slow. cope and dilate
(he will again miss the Bitcoin boat now, same as in 2009... could become a millionaire by 2030, but he will not, and he will probably blame ZE JUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUS for it or smth)

[Anonymous No.55665308]

>>55663244
>Energy argument didn't exist in early Bitcoin years
Yeah and people back then still said Bitcoin was going to be the money of the future until everyone realized it was total shit and now it's 'digital gold.' Things change

[Anonymous No.55665354]

>>55665308
True but being "digital gold" makes it about a billion times more valuable than being one of a dozen payment systems available, most of which are currency neutral anyway.

[Anonymous No.55665456]

>>55665011
we produce more than 10000x the amount of bread today, so it lost a lot of value
>>55665240
lmao stfu retard you probably dont own even 3 btc

[Anonymous No.55666084]

>>55665154
>he still refuses to get the point
Bitniggers truly are the bottom of the barrel, worse than midwits.

[Anonymous No.55666124]

Ive observed the crypto industry and the people who dabble in it for a long time, and from what i can see the main difference between people who 'get' bitcoin and people who dont and cannot, and often end up in wild spasms of jeering rejection of it in favor of some altcoin they want to pump, are the people who are able to comprehend that bitcoin is not a product in the capitalism sense, its not something someone somewhere is offering to a 'market'. Its a discovery, like fire. Like the wheel. Like mathematics (which is what it is really), and the people who will enver understand this. Its something that will eventually seem so obvious in hindsight but which changed the human condition forever. Bitcoin is pure, raw technology of the same sort of import as the discovery of AC current for transporting electricity.

Now of course, bitcoin can certainly be productIZED, and it is. But it is not itself a product, any more than say, water is. Now that we have discovered it, it just is.

Unfortunately ive noticed that most people born and raised inside the capitalism paradigm, which is pretty much everyone except maybe north koreans now, are literally unable to process the results of human endeavour in any other frame of reference other than 'profit bearing product', and i guess the proposition of Bitcoin makes those types of people feel very uncomfortable, leads them to reject it as being some type of scam they just cant see thru yet.

This also unfortunately has the secondary effect of generating all the conspiracy theories about who 'controls' bitcoin, since the real answer is nobody which was bitcoins core innovation, but if youre born and raised inside the lens of a capitalistic hierarchy theres a good chance youll be psychologically unable to process information in any other context, in my opinion, which sucks.