/biz/ - Business & Finance

[Anonymous No.28880686]

just found out crypto-to-crypto is a taxable event in my country what the fuck do i do i swing like a retard
>inb4 never cash out
>inb4 dont pay taxes
i dont want to get ass raped in prison

[Anonymous No.28880764]

i shouldve seen this coming since i live in kikeland

[Anonymous No.28881517]

juscht dont shell it fuh muney

[Anonymous No.28881603]

a skinny white kid in jail, youll be bottomed out cuz youre a twink

a fat white kid in jail, youll be assfucked cuz youre thicc

[Anonymous No.28881689]

>>28880686
koinly

[Anonymous No.28881734]

>>28880686
The IRS should be sent to prison for domestic terrorism

[Anonymous No.28881735]

>>28881602
when i wrote kikeland i meant israel. although, when i think about it, usa is also a certified kikeland

[Anonymous No.28881775]

>>28880686
>crypto-to-crypto is taxable
damn what cuck country does this?

[Anonymous No.28881860]

>>28880686
Isn't it gains only though? Which is the same total taxes amount as taxing the total once at the end

[Anonymous No.28881906]

>>28880764
Based, gam oved be Intel?

[Anonymous No.28881913]

>>28880686
>>28880764
>>28881735
S H A L O M

[Anonymous No.28881958]

>>28881860
This, you’re just fucked if you had huge gains and then lost them all

[Anonymous No.28882040]

>>28880686
just don't report faggot

[Anonymous No.28882054]

>>28881906
שלום מוסד. פ"ת או חיפה?

[Anonymous No.28882142]

Move to a better country.
Stop feeding Tyron you cuck.

[Anonymous No.28882223]

>>28882054
קרית גת לצערתי, blue collar wagecucking it.

[Anonymous No.28883095]

>>28881860
they expect you to track all the fiat-equivalent prices at trade time and declare capital gains based on those numbers even if you don't convert to fiat
you can get absolutely fucked if you have unrealized gains across calendar years from swapping shitcoins
>take 1ETH and swap to 175700 SHITcoin at 0.01
>SHITcoin 100x's and is worth $1 ea
>dump bags and get 100ETH
>according to crypto-to-crypto gains your $1757 just became $175700, better pay 25% taxes on that short term capital gain, you owe $43925
>HODL your ETH
>ETH suddenly crashes to $100 because bobo leaves his cave or your country regulates/bans crypto
>you now have $10000 in ETH and $43925 due

[Anonymous No.28884057]

>>28883095
Taxation is literally robbery. Funnel all of your crypto shit through monero and then to a clean wallet or something to hide it I guess?

[Anonymous No.28884180]

>>28883095
>>28880686
Anon, why the FUCK would you report anything like that. Topkek.

[Anonymous No.28884330]

>"oh I lost the wallet I sent that ETH to"
>"uhh all this ETH I'm converting into fiat I bought in person over a year ago"

[Anonymous No.28884842]

>>28883095
>they expect you to track all the fiat-equivalent prices at trade time
don't the tax form generator services like koinly just fill in the blanks with the order history export files you give them? that's what i assumed anyway

[Anonymous No.28885265]

>>28884330
>>28884057
yeah i was thinking something along the lines of
>wallet got hacked and all my funds are lost
>convert it all to XMR until i move out of this shithole

[Anonymous No.28885335]

>>28881775
land of the free
home of the cucks

[Anonymous No.28885560]

>>28883095
this happened to some plebbitor
he has like 800k in bitcoin
gambled it on altcoins, not knowing crypto to crypto is a taxable event
they all shit the bed during the great bear season and dropped him down to 150k
he didn't care that much until he got a letter from the IRS saying he owed taxes on about 500,000 worth of capital gains

[Anonymous No.28885676]

>>28885335
Wait
Wait
Oh fuck me

[Anonymous No.28885699]

>>28885560
continue?

[Anonymous No.28885947]

>>28884180
coinbase and other KYC exchanges report to the government for you ;)

[Anonymous No.28886012]

>>28881775
Germoney

[Anonymous No.28886102]

>>28886012
>Germany
I thought in germany crypto was tax free if you just held and bought for a year?

[Anonymous No.28886140]

>>28880686
tell them you're Jewish.

[Anonymous No.28886143]

>>28881958
Could you claim your losses and balance it out?

[Anonymous No.28886224]

>>28885699
well, he was asking /r/legaladvice and they all just told him to get a lawyer. crypto laws are retarded, and about to get worse anyway

[Anonymous No.28886277]

>>28881775
Costa Rican here, I have no fucking idea if this applies to me hahaha

[Anonymous No.28886436]

>>28881775
Sweden also does this

[Anonymous No.28886511]

so you're telling me I should just hold in one crypto for over a year and then take it out to get taxed as little as possible?

you're telling me that if I'm american that moving a stack to another stack is taxable?

so if I moved 100k coins around 10 times I'd be taxed 10 times more than if I had just held it?

am I understanding this correctly?

[Anonymous No.28886579]

>>28880686
You're making a mountain out of a molehill OP. No one's going to throw you in jail because you made a $200 profit in the current financial year. Just cancel a select few of your OF subscriptions and you'll be all good fren

[Anonymous No.28886583]

>>28880686
It isn't a big deal, dude. You end up paying less in taxes this way, assuming you were short-term holding anyways.

>>28881860
It's actually less because you get to deduct your losses (which includes gas + fees) from the total profits.

>>28885560
This is literally only an issue between years as you get to write off losses... and your losses can even be pushed to future years.

[Anonymous No.28886654]

>crypto is supposed to be anonymous & decentralised
>get taxed on crypto-to-crypto transfers
explain this to me

[Anonymous No.28886665]

>>28886511
No you fucking retard. You get taxed on your gains/profits only. You weren't taxed x10 the amount.

[Anonymous No.28886675]

>>28886583
This is /biz/ though, noone here ever has any losses

[Anonymous No.28886774]

>>28886143
That doesn't work if they tax the event right? Like it would be capital losses if you never cashed out and went negative. But crypto to crypto is a taxable event. So even if you traded 1 btc for 50,000 shitcoins at 1 dollar each and then those 50,000 shitcoins all ended up being worth 1 cent, you still owe taxes on that initial transaction, whatever you initial capital gains were from that bitcoin at 50k from your entry point.

Hilariously FUCKED

[Anonymous No.28886800]

>>28886102
True but OP is talking about swing trading. This is usually done with less than 1 year of holding time in between swings.

[Anonymous No.28886951]

>>28886583
It's not a capital gains loss because it was actualized... it's seen the same as cashing out, isn't it? if you cash out your gains into fiat and then "lose" them all, you don't get to write it off as a loss. You traded your shitcoin for a shitcoin. you realized your gains in that moment and you owe for it like it was a normal transaction. Am I mistaken?

[Anonymous No.28886978]

>>28886774
What the hell are you talking about you retard? The event is taxable when you no longer hold the asset. Why are you trying to talk about shit you clearly have no idea about?
>Buy BTC
>no tax
>Swap BTC for ETH
>Pay taxes on any profit you made from the initial price of BTC. If it's a loss or neutral, you pay no taxes but still report the event
>If you swap back to BTC later and make a profit, you can deduct your losses from earlier so you're only paying taxes on the actual profit

[Anonymous No.28886989]

>>28886654
KYC

[Anonymous No.28887105]

>>28886951
You're so fucking wrong it hurts. Capital gains is taxed on realized gains. REALIZED. Hence the term "taxable event." How would you write off a loss if you never sold? You haven't lost anything yet.

[Anonymous No.28887135]

>>28880686
>>28880764
Its only on your gains. So if you just don't lose all your money you'll be fine. If you do a bunch of swinging, and then lose your money, you can deduct a maximum of $3000 from your taxes as a capital loss. Otherwise you're screwed. Just make money and don't worry about it.

[Anonymous No.28887177]

>>28886978
Trying to understand the fucking system, it feels like every single person I talk to has a different understanding of it, including lawyers and the IRS themselves. I could easily be wrong

[Anonymous No.28887225]

>>28881603
Proof that niggers are all faggots.

[Anonymous No.28887239]

>>28886665
>>28886978
That's how I originally thought it worked. Thanks for clarifying. Guess I got brainfucked from this thread. nothing surprises me anymore.

[Anonymous No.28887429]

>>28887177
I think it's just you.

>>28887135
You seem slightly confused even when you are technically correct. You can use infinite losses to offset paying any capital gains taxes, including pushing your losses to future years. If you have net losses for a year, you can deduct up to 3k from your income taxes (and push any more for next year). They are two separate things and important to understand. So if you made 100k profits and 50k losses, you don't get to deduct the 3k from your income taxes, but you are only paying taxes on 50k of profits.

[Anonymous No.28887558]

>>28887429
Then what the fuck is this faggot worried about and why did every response tell him to get a lawyer and that he's fucked?

[Anonymous No.28887651]

>>28886978
wait so do you have to report when you buy or only when you sell/swap?
I haven't reported anything yet

[Anonymous No.28887804]

>>28887558
Because he didn't pay taxes from the previous year and then gambled away the money he was supposed to use to pay his taxes. He can set up a payment plan with the IRS (while getting raped by having to pay interest) and continue to deduct his losses from his taxes over the years to chip away at it. They might also take a deal of some kind, I'm not too sure. But he was fucked because he just never paid his taxes.

[Anonymous No.28887919]

>>28887558
>>28887558

[Anonymous No.28887997]

>>28887651
Now the IRS asks if you've bought any at all, but technically you only have to report any taxable events (selling of an asset, regardless of profit or loss). That's the real bitch of this-- it takes forever to sit down and figure out every transaction if you've made a ton. You're reporting when you pay your taxes. Which, by the way, if your gains cause your taxes to go up by more than 1k of your estimated payment for the year, you need to make quarterly payments to the IRS or face a penalty. It's not a huge deal, but it's worth knowing.

[Anonymous No.28888098]

>>28887919
That's exactly what I said here >>28887804 Everything I've said in this thread goes with what happened to that Anon. Since you know that you have to pay taxes, you won't get into Anon's situation.

[Anonymous No.28888225]

>>28887804
I understand I'm a brainlet. But isn't that what I said where he got huge gains, swapped it for other crypto, then it all tanked and he owes a shit ton? You're saying when he did that initial swap he should have set aside money for taxes, right, regardless of how his gains or losses would be? I don't understand the distinction, the whole point is that if you trade crypto to crypto and your crypto tanks hard you eat shit and owe taxes. Again I know I'm retarded

[Anonymous No.28888255]

>>28880686
It's astonishing how none of you know how to use excel.
You can export your transactions from most exchanges into csv, slap a few formulas in and you've got your taxable amount (ofc you'll have to include any deductions relevant to your country) but this shit shouldn't take longer than a day or 2 to go through on your own.

[Anonymous No.28888398]

>>28888225

If you make a fuckload off crypto

Set aside money for taxes

The IRS will not stop until it gets "its fair share"

[Anonymous No.28888433]

>>28883095
Thats not how it works. You include losses in tax.

[Anonymous No.28888569]

>>28886654
Crypto's pipedream died years ago when everyone saw it as a way to get rich quick drawing govs attention.

[Anonymous No.28888583]

>>28885265
Then write it off as a loss on your taxes.

[Anonymous No.28888607]

>>28888225
>buys crypto year 1
The hazy part is he never clearly states when he swaps or sells it. He makes it sound like he sells it in year 1. If he doesn't, then he technically owed no taxes on it in year 1, assuming he bought and held it. But it sounds like he knows that he owes taxes, so I am going to assume he was swinging or sold there.
>makes a shitload of profit and sells it
>owes taxes but is too retarded to realize it
>reinvests the money year 2, including the money that he was supposed to pay in taxes, and loses it

[Anonymous No.28888704]

>>28886774
In the US, this is correct.

[Anonymous No.28888833]

>>28887997
Everyone forgets about the quarterly IRS payments, fucks a lot op people.

[Anonymous No.28888963]

>>28888704
I mean, technically he would owe taxes on the profits, but then he would get the losses from the other coins, assuming he actually sold them the same year. It would balance out. Capital gains = total profits - total losses realized for the year. It isn't difficult.

[Anonymous No.28889013]

>>28880686
bro...

i don't give a fuck what anybody says.

get your fucking stack up, and dont worry about taxes.

[Anonymous No.28889096]

>>28880686

Yeah no shit

Also

CLF

[Anonymous No.28889189]

>>28885699
>>28885560
fyi he was trading on coinbase or bitrex or some shit and they reported his ass

[Anonymous No.28889199]

>(((Land of the free)))
ahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahhaahhahahhahaahahhahhhhhhaaahaahhahaahhhhahh

[Anonymous No.28889388]

>>28882142
Where should I move?
I was thinking Switzerland.

[Anonymous No.28889390]

>>28880686
I just gave up, I don't trade anymore and the niggers at HMRC are missing out because I would have been able to cash out way more. Shot themselves in the foot.

[Anonymous No.28889458]

>>28880686
>Buy $10,000 worth of AAA
>AAA crabs, decide to swap
>swap all AAA for BBB, gain = 0
>swap BBB for CCC, gain = 0
>repeat until you swap for ZZZ
>25 swaps of $10,000 with 0 net gain
>owe 20% or whatever on $10,000 x 25 = $50,000
>owe $50,000 tax on $10,000 principal because "muh swaps"

This cannot be correct. I dont understand how they can deign to enforce this stupid law when you cant even buy most ERC-20 tokens with USD, only ETH. Can i pay my tax in ETH?

[Anonymous No.28889515]

>>28888607
>>28888963
I see. He fucked up because he realized the gains one year and then the next taxable year lost it all. If his entire story happened within the span of one year it would be gains vs losses. If he did go from 5k to 850k to 150k purely gambling shitcoins in the span of 1 year, would he owe capital gains on just 145k at the end of the year? I wish to never plague this board with my brainlet understanding of how all this shit works

[Anonymous No.28889522]

>>28881775
Almost everyone I think. Most people just refuse to check the crypto tax rules for their country. Me included.
I'll just keep that pain for some other day

[Anonymous No.28889551]

>>28880686
It's taxable only for the net value, same as if you sold and then bought more assets with the cash, at the same time.

[Anonymous No.28889651]

>>28889515
Correct.

>>28889458
Wrong. Just admit to yourself that you don't know fucking anything and you should feel embarrassed.

[Anonymous No.28889837]

>>28889551
I figured they're not ACTUALLY going to rape us.
im a little worried, but I figure theyre just taxing the net gain per trade right?

so if it's 100 > 200 thats 10%? so $10? 9000 > 10000 = $100 tax?

like that?

[Anonymous No.28889957]

>>28889651
which is why i wrote
>this cannot be correct

[Anonymous No.28890035]

>>28889837
Basically, yeah. Whatever the value of the crypto you're buying minus the cost you paid for the crypto you are converting is the profit. I think you can even include transaction fees (possibly in aggregate as a business expense rather than on a per-transaction basis) if you want to be a true jew but I'm not a tax accountant or lawyer.

[Anonymous No.28890073]

>>28889458
you’re correct, that’s not right. you made no profit and so would owe no cap gains. buy $1k worth of eth. swap that eth immediately after into shitcoin, assume no price difference, no gain or loss incurred. shitcoin value goes up to $2k, you swap back to eth. you made $1k in gains and owe 10% on that. you immediately swap your newfound $2k eth to USDC or fiat. no gains or losses incurred.
i apparently had 140+ transactions last year (mostly for holding purposes, wasn’t swinging) and only owe like $160 in cap gains on them

obviously i’m not an accountant and i may end up bankrupting myself next year, but this is how i understand the system

[Anonymous No.28890109]

>>28885947
over 20k i believe. undder that i believe they ignore unless pressed by irs

[Anonymous No.28890192]

>>28890035
that's roughly what i thought. yeah im not too bothered by taxes. we're still about a year away before having to worry about it anyway.

i'm gonna make my gains during this time.

[Anonymous No.28890251]

>>28890073
Only capital gains for assets that you hold for more than a year, otherwise income tax rate. Though since Crypto isn't classified as a security that means you can wash (sell and immediately buy back) anything at day 364 to lock in losses at income rate, which is better than stock day trading, which only counts as a new holding if you've been out for more than 30 days.

[Anonymous No.28890333]

Just buy HYVE, dont cry like a little baby. If you buy HYVE you will easily get your money back. You can buy it on Uniswap, do your own research and thank me later

[Anonymous No.28890401]

>>28886654
everything that isnt xmr is a surveilance coin. NOT PRIVATE, COMPLETELY TRANSPARENT. if you onramp fiat in a kyc exchange and link you bank account, you are now labeled. if your gains while trading on a CEX exceed 20k, it will be auto report to IRS. so, DONT TRADE ON CEX. WITHDRAW ASAP TO PRIVATE WALLET. us leg is murmuring about kyc for personal wallets. if that happens we are all fucked and crypto will become our chains, not our salvation.

[Anonymous No.28890437]

>>28880764
>>28880686
Play dumb and just pay when you cash out.

[Anonymous No.28890449]

>>28890251
yeah sorry, should’ve specified that better. that’s why i said 10% on that hypothetical gain, was going by the income tax rate

[Anonymous No.28890484]

>>28889651
Thats not nearly as bad as I thought. I should gamble my shitcoins more, I was worried every event would fuck me consecutively, but really the only fucking is trying to keep track of it all. My understanding was based off of other retards here.
So literally it's just (for one fiscal year) gains - losses * capital gains tax rate. Pretending I've made 15k so far this year in gains, if I lose it all playing hot potato with shitcoins I'd owe no tax?

[Anonymous No.28890547]

>>28880764
>>28880686
You are supposed to be buying and holding for years anyway anon.
Taxes will get lower eventually anyway.

[Anonymous No.28890691]

>>28890401
what if I do the trades on Binance, where I did not do the KYC, then transfer my gains to coinbase to cash out?

[Anonymous No.28890739]

>>28890484
Your gains rate depends on your tax bracket (you can find it all online), but yeah. Exactly.

[Anonymous No.28890813]

>>28890691
If you come back with significantly more than you left with I've heard nightmare stories about Coinbase. Otherwise obviously, this is the case where they can't really do too much without a full blown audit I imagine

[Anonymous No.28890830]

>>28880686

Yeah, this applies in Canada.

[Anonymous No.28890856]

>>28890401
>everything that isnt xmr is a surveilance coin. NOT PRIVATE, COMPLETELY TRANSPARENT
You morons are hilarious.
Every single 1 and every single 0 runs through globohomo owned and operated tubes.
They know you have XMR.
They know how much XMR you have.
They know what you do with your XMR.
They know who you sent your XMR to.
Good luck retard.
I don't want anything bad to happen to you, but...

[Anonymous No.28890868]

>>28886583
Incorrect duderino, you can only write off ao much loss each year, like $10k losses.

[Anonymous No.28890895]

>>28890401
How can they even do KYC for personal wallets? Do you submit proof that you own the wallet or something? If you just have to give up your identity to buy coins it won't show that you own the wallet to which they've been sent, only that you bought them... Could have bought them for someone else.

[Anonymous No.28890914]

Just keep track of it and have your ACCOUNTANT deal with that bullshit. The only way you can get fucked is IF you had a lot of gains in one crypto and then converted it to another (lets say you buy AVAX and it goes up 100% then you convert it to LINK for example). Otherwise, if you are converting your money to USDT then to whatever you want to buy it is not a big deal and the capital gains will be nothing. But don't fuck around the CRA (or in your case the IRA) because they will skull fuck you if you mess around and that is why you have an accountant that deals with their bullshit and not you.
>t. Leaf

[Anonymous No.28890954]

>>28889651
But if you swing from crypto to crypto, you still don't have fiat to pay taxes. So, if the redditor just held his $850k shitcoins, he wouldn't have to pay taxes on it...right? He only had to pay because he made a transaction FROM his 850K gain. Correct?

[Anonymous No.28890999]

>>28881735
I'm sorry mate I don't know such country, do you mean the land occupied by the zionist entity?

[Anonymous No.28891095]

>>28890856
Imagine not understanding how mimblewimble and xmr actually work. Bet you are going to get vanccinated to

[Anonymous No.28891099]

>>28880686
Why do fuck you talk about taxes in an international forum?
Its different in all countries, let alone states as far as I know

[Anonymous No.28891143]

>>28890691
i think coinbase and banks will require proof of trades to show where it came from. cashing out large amounts is bound to bring headaches and account freezes, gov eyes etc. i honestly have no idea how to cash out, as i personaly am not planning to.

[Anonymous No.28891190]

>>28890868
Your capital gains for the year is literally your profits - losses. There is no cap on the losses there. It's only if you are totally in the red that we talk about deducting your losses.

>>28890914
Biggest help you can get is someone (or software) that can look for the biggest breaks by sorting shit with stuff like last in first out.

[Anonymous No.28891231]

>>28890868
i think its 3k max reportable losses every year.

[Anonymous No.28891236]

>>28880686
Koinly nigger, it syncs all of the transactions from your wallets and exchanges for you. Use it free now and pay $50 at the end of the year to get your tax form.

[Anonymous No.28891330]

>hes scared of the fianazamt
lol theyre amateurs compared to the IRS

[Anonymous No.28891339]

>>28890954
Wrong. This board will try to get you to get some bitcoin debit card or some shit as a way to avoid taxes, but you're just evading taxes. When you give up an asset for any other asset, you are "cashing out," regardless of if fiat is involved. This isn't just for crypto. If you were flipping/trading old baseball cards, it's the same. Otherwise everyone would just barter as a loophole to avoid taxes.

[Anonymous No.28891357]

>>28891095
No reason to.
It goes through their tubes.
I been around awhile.
Back when I was new I thought the way you think.
You are typing on fucking 4ch about having it.
I'm sure they don't know what you are doing.
I'm sure their lives don't just revolve around fucking people over.
Just take your legal profits and do something less risky to fight the machine.

[Anonymous No.28891457]

>>28881775
Canada is also on the list

[Anonymous No.28891458]

>>28880686
cointracking website

[Anonymous No.28891469]

>>28888433
This

[Anonymous No.28891563]

>>28880686

Trade on a foreign exchange, never do kyc. Put all of your coins in a hardware wallet once you are done trading for the day.

[Anonymous No.28891580]

>>28891190
>Biggest help you can get is someone (or software) that can look for the biggest breaks by sorting shit with stuff like last in first out.
Exactly, you get it. Paying someone a few hundred bucks to deal with your bullshit (all of your personal accounting, not just crypto) makes dealing with your finances far easier and they will save you far more money than what they will charge you.

[Anonymous No.28891591]

>>28891339
But if you hold, and don't swap it, is the growth still taxed?

[Anonymous No.28891687]

Hahahaha
In my country I pay taxes only if I hold grains >51k€ for more than a week
Never gonna happen :)

[Anonymous No.28891695]

>>28891591
not yet

[Anonymous No.28891697]

>>28891591
No. Currently (I say this because the niggers that just took over are "thinking" about changing this, which will tank the fucking market) you only are taxed on realized gains. If you hold an asset for over a year, you even pay reduced taxes on it. It's just difficult to do so in crypto unless you just bought a bunch of BTC.

[Anonymous No.28891713]

>>28880686
Unless you're making a lot of money day trading literally who cares? You're only taxed on profit and I doubt you're pulling a 6 figure income doing this so chill.

[Anonymous No.28891761]

>>28891591
Yes it is but only when you cash out or convert it to something else.

[Anonymous No.28892076]

>>28880686
>just found out crypto-to-crypto is a taxable event in my country what the fuck do i do i swing like a retard
Since you're posting on biz I will assume you have a net loss for the year. Just report it, it will reduce your overall income and save you money on your taxes.

[Anonymous No.28892182]

>>28883095
how do the people allow so high taxes? in some countries theres literally no incentive to doing anything if you didnt inherit shitloads of money but there is infinite incentive to take it easy and do nothing

[Anonymous No.28892197]

>>28880686
By swing people mean sell and buy in right? Trading one crypto for another isn't taxable right?

[Anonymous No.28892264]

>>28892197
Read the damn thread.

[Anonymous No.28892309]

>>28890739
I think my biggest confusion stems from the difference between
Buy shit coin with fiat > shitcoin #1 grows > trade shitcoin #1 for shitcoin #2
Buy shit coin with fiat > shit coin grows > trade shitcoin for fiat

This may seem obvious, and it looks obvious, but in the first example, since shitcoins count as "assets", if shitcoin #2 plummets it's a loss and you deduct it. Fiat is always 1:1 so if you cash to fiat there's no possible deduction/gain as it's the baseline with which assets are determined to gain/loss, correct? last question from me, just wanting to make sure I understand before I play with crypto more.

[Anonymous No.28892352]

>>28891695
>>28891697
>>28891761
Thanks Anons.

[Anonymous No.28892452]

>>28881775
Which relevant country don’t do this?

[Anonymous No.28892509]

>>28890999
The british gave it them, there was only vermin there before :)

[Anonymous No.28892643]

>>28892352
Cheers, Anon. I hope you make it.

>>28892309
Let's take each situation separately.
>Buy shit coin with fiat
> shitcoin #1 grows
Not taxed
> trade shitcoin #1 for shitcoin #2
You owe tax on the profit from when you first bought shitcoin #1 until the sale of shitcoin #1. You can only deduct losses from shitcount #2 after you sell it. That's why some Anon was saying it might be worth selling your failed tokens/coins near the end of the year, just to realize the losses so you can deduct them.

>Buy shit coin with fiat
>shit coin grows
Not taxed
>trade shitcoin for fiat
You owe tax on the profit from when you first bought shitcoin #1 until the sale of shitcoin #1

[Anonymous No.28892746]

BUY HIGH
SELL LOW
NEVER PAY TAXES
HAVE TAXES PAY YOUUUUUUUU

[Anonymous No.28892807]

IS CRYPTO TO CRYPTO TAXABLE IN THE UK
PLS PLSPSPLSPSLPSSPLSPSLPSLSPLSPSL NO,I REALLY FUCKING HOPE NOT

[Anonymous No.28892864]

>>28880686
In monaco it isn't. a fortune i live next to it. :)))

[Anonymous No.28892987]

>>28887804
and people still think that the government isnt against you

[Anonymous No.28893039]

>>28880686
>>28880764
Well I was going to explain the loopholes and stipulations, but if you're going to be antisemitic then you deserve to be taxed out the ass.

[Anonymous No.28893056]

>>28880686
Pay a bunch of guys to kidnap you and force you to convert everything to XMR and send to a wallet you prepared before. Then go to the police and report your crypto stolen.

[Anonymous No.28893161]

>>28886774
Yes but if you sold those shitcoins it would be a massive loss to offset any gain.

[Anonymous No.28893223]

>>28888398
just buy power and kill them all

[Anonymous No.28893237]

>>28892643
>You can only deduct losses from shitcount #2 after you sell it. That's why some Anon was saying it might be worth selling your failed tokens/coins near the end of the year, just to realize the losses so you can deduct them.

There it is, that clears up all my confusion. I'm surprised I didn't see more shitcoin dump in late december

[Anonymous No.28893311]

>>28892197
yes it is. tahts what the entire fking thread is about. go to irs website and read the fking crypto laws yourself instead of asking randoms on fking 4chins about ur finances.

[Anonymous No.28893333]

>>28893237
If you still own something, you haven't "realized" the gains (or losses) from it. Glad it clicked for you.

[Anonymous No.28893459]

>>28892807
>ID: tax
It is, and you just might be fucked
>>28893333
checked

[Anonymous No.28893594]

so what method of getting into crypto wont fuck someone over?

[Anonymous No.28893619]

So just how legit are crypto savings accounts like BlockFi (amongst others)? I don't have mammoth amounts of crypto and it seems like a good way to make some more given how good the interest rates are compared to traditional banks for FIAT. Of course there is added risk here since they aren't protected to the same extent, but does anyone have any experiences they can share with them?

Also any service providers anyone would recommend in particular? Tried to sign up to BlockFi to scope it out some more but unsure if it works for britbong customers as it hasn't seemed to work yet for me.

[Anonymous No.28893671]

>>28886143
Deductible loss is limited to $3000 per year

[Anonymous No.28894070]

Fuck your land of cucks.
Til last year we had 0% taxes here.
Now 15% when cashout

Third worls shithole and i wont even pay that.

[Anonymous No.28894165]

Just asking from curiosity: What happens if someone buys crypto and actually just uses it as a currency? Do you still have to pay taxes? Lol... So technically 100% of everyone who's ever bought crypto and used it to purchase something can get ass-raped by IRS et al? lol

[Anonymous No.28894177]

>>28890401
so why are people still using the cuck coins instead of the superior anonymous coins? its like they want to get fucked by the tax jew who does basically nothing for their citizens

[Anonymous No.28894237]

/biz/ do I need to pay taxes on my.....

Oh wait nevermind I found some Monero lying around after I lost my funds on the L2. I think a Tornado dryer ate it. Thanks anyway. I'll donate them to an orphanage in Vanuatu

[Anonymous No.28894312]

>>28880764
Yup sucks bro. Unironically use kikebase and trade dollar pairs or swap everything and lie.

[Anonymous No.28894330]

>>28890895
they dont. it happens when you buy your initial coins from the exchange

[Anonymous No.28894383]

>>28894165
Each purchase would be a taxable event, technically. So yes, if they ever got audited by the IRS, they would owe the taxes for each purchase worth of crypto + interest on the unpaid taxes. This is all technically. Who knows what the IRS would actually do.

[Anonymous No.28894524]

>>28894330
Right, so it's useless as it doesn't prove that you own the wallet.

[Anonymous No.28894550]

>>28880764
the USA?

[Anonymous No.28894716]

>>28888433
In the given example he would have to sell/exchange the ETH to incur the loss, which as a bizraeli would be madness, we would just HODL out of the loss.

[Anonymous No.28894903]

>>28889096
wrong screenshot CLF tranny. wrong gender too.

[Anonymous No.28895204]

>>28881775
asSpain does it too, if you make a benefit on that transaction

[Anonymous No.28895336]

>>28892182
They tout their country as being cool and fashionable, that it's a privilege to live there because reasons
then when you get upset at the high taxes they say "then move somewhere else" and replace you with newfags who don't look up the tax rates until it's too late

[Anonymous No.28895393]

>>28894383
yes. this is the regulations, trying to kill crypto as real currency by classifying it as property, and making it taxable. but the question is what if everyone doesnt play ball? how is the irs going to force 100s of millions of people to pay on their crypto traeds? this is all ridiculous. seems like fear tactics to scare us into paying when they can not in any real way do anything about it.

[Anonymous No.28895402]

>>28880686
>LOL just pay half a mil in taxes plus interest for the rest of your life while we replace you.
I would be on the first plane out to a third world country.

[Anonymous No.28895489]

I owe $3.6M in taxes for last year to the IRS according to their audit because I turned $10k into $10M but I got rugpulled to $3k. They've started deducting from my paychecks...

[Anonymous No.28895622]

>>28895393
It's like everything else with taxes-- if enough people play by the rules, it's fine. I'm all for playing by the rules because I don't want the peepee to be regulated out of everything. Crypto is being treated as property because it makes the most sense considering current regulations and what it is. Honestly, the rules are pretty fair right now (totally different than how you feel about tax rates), but I don't think that will hold through Biden's admin.

[Anonymous No.28895695]

>>28895489
I'm sure you're wiping your tears with you 100$ bills.

[Anonymous No.28895948]

>>28895622
i think regulation will cause a grand shakening in the markets. i think privacy will become a luxury, and most will try to attain it and be unable to. biden admin will bring the regulation we are all fearing i believe. they are churning out tons of EO like every day, who can follow it all. crypto regs will slip in under our noses. idk who knows. xmr forever.

[Anonymous No.28895962]

This is unironically bullish for CMR

[Anonymous No.28896001]

>>28883095
this isn’t how it works you fucking retard, you write off the loss and it cancels out your gains. fucking dumb nigger

[Anonymous No.28896039]

>>28895962
XMR*

[Anonymous No.28896044]

>>28891687
What based as fuck country is that?

[Anonymous No.28896062]

Yes, and swaps count as sells to USD. if you don't report them, and somehow managed to get audited, you would have to pay back taxes plus penalties and interest.

[Anonymous No.28896065]

>>28895948
I still can't believe they are actually considering taxing unrealized gains in stocks. I really believe if they do that, it will just tank the stock market and we'll end up in a depression.

[Anonymous No.28896073]

>>28880686
Then staking or Y vaults type deals are taxable in and taxable out, as there is an intermediary "coin" (yCRV, LPtoken etc), which would make it a taxable event. This is amazingly fucked up, as when you withdraw you get the same type of coins you deposited.

[Anonymous No.28896264]

>>28896065
im pretty sure it also would count with crypto markets because in usa digicoin is property.

[Anonymous No.28896268]

>>28895962
>>28896039
How?

>Be you
>Buy BTC
>Exchange to XMR
>Get slapped with infinite tax because they can't follow your coins so they just make shit up

[Anonymous No.28896388]

>>28896065
i also think its intentional if they do this. they know whats going to happen.>>28896073
its intentional that they are trying to throttle this new tech economy.

[Anonymous No.28896491]

>>28896268
atm i personaly onramp fiat in uphold, but eth or usdt, send to hotbit in china, then swap for xmr. best i can do atm. i hope its better than buying direct from us exchanges.

[Anonymous No.28896521]

>>28893237
>>28893333
aka the good old
>you don't lose until you sell

also checked

[Anonymous No.28896744]

>>28880686
Just open an UBS or Credit Suisse account.

[Anonymous No.28896913]

>>28895622
nice cuck mindset. you can pay millions in taxes but you wont get anything with that money. the us will just waste it on the military so they can fight in other countries and the rest will go to the politicians

[Anonymous No.28896950]

>>28880686
psst... nobody needs to know about your crypto trades...

[Anonymous No.28896955]

If you are going to swing trade. Just use a USD pair to avoid the headache of doing taxes. Dont do crypto to crypto

[Anonymous No.28897136]

>>28896065
but would the big stockholders just accept that? i bet that the us president will get shot again if he actually does something that crazy

[Anonymous No.28897201]

>>28892197
discord and telegram are good places to ask noob questions -- message boards not so much, we expect you to lurk for the basics.

Posting is best reserved for statements/observations, intelligent questions, or shitposting.

[Anonymous No.28897229]

the trick is to be shit at trading so all your crypto-crypto trades result in capital gain losses

[Anonymous No.28897352]

>>28880686
Just use Koinly. I was also panicking. But once you upload all your exchange API and wallet addresses, it syncs everything. I had over a thousand transactions in 2020. It took me about 20 minutes to input all the API stuff into Koinly and add the addresses. It spits out a report of your choosing. I uploaded that directly into turbotax. So it cost me $99 and less than an hour of effort. As opposed to over a thousand trades/moves and I used Uniswap. It would have been a nightmare to do this by hand. Just pay the $99 or whatever and get Koinly.

[Anonymous No.28897383]

>>28886102
That's Slovenia. In Germany, you have to have the same crypto

[Anonymous No.28897490]

>>28886583
you can't deduct gas you can only adjust cost basis on fee's. the government still counts what you paid for gas as being a capital gain even though you basically have to spend it to swap

[Anonymous No.28897494]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCFiKid071I
Sing with me, /biz/:

O SAY CAN YOU SHART
IN THE LOCAL WALMART
WHAT SO PROUDLY EXPELLED
FROM ANUS' LAST LEAKING
WHOSE BROAD STREAKS AND BROWN STARS
THROUGH THE PERILOUS BLIGHT
O'ER AISLES WE WATCHED...
SHIT GALLANTLY STREAMING


AND MUTT'S NAPPY HAIR
NAEGROES EVERYWHERE
GAVE PROOF THAT OUR RACE
IS 56% DISGRACE
O' SAY DOES THAT SHITE SPANGLED
BUMMER YET CUUUUUUUT
FOR THE LAND OF SHAAAART
AND THE HOME OF THE MUUTTTT

[Anonymous No.28897516]

>>28896913
the chad thing to do is to stay out of prison and not get raped by jerome

[Anonymous No.28897573]

you only pay when you cash ut to fiat in ur bank account

[Anonymous No.28897774]

>>28897573
wrong

[Anonymous No.28897844]

>>28889189
What’s the limit for trading for Coinbase?

[Anonymous No.28897863]

>>28887919
KEK totally fucked. I swear the number of people involved in crypto who are fucking clueless about the taxes they owe for each and every taxable event is almost limitless. now that many exchanges require KYC and compliance with IRS reporting the number of retards who are going to get ass rammed will only continue to grow. I know a retard like this whose gotten multiple bank accounts closed because of shady crypto money xfers in and he thinks he can avoid the IRS getting him by constantly moving to different states kek

[Anonymous No.28897933]

My country doesn't acknowledge the existence of cryptocurrency BUT single court cases stating it is to be taxed as regular capital gains exist
How the fuck do I manage my shitcoin to shitcoin transactions now

Never cashing out was not a meme after all

[Anonymous No.28898000]

>>28897516
nah. chad would not get caught for tax evasion. cuck will happily pay millions in taxes even if he gets nothing in return for the paid money

[Anonymous No.28898105]

Evading tax on crypto is stupid easy as long as you arent a US Citizen and your initial investment and trades don't involve KYC

[Anonymous No.28898188]

>>28888433
you can only take 3K max in short term capital gains losses per year and that's if your losses exceed your gains for the year. you can't just subtract losses from every gain or taxable event you have thinking that reduces your taxes if you do good fucking luck when the IRS comes knocking

[Anonymous No.28898193]

>>28897844
20k USD or 100-200 transactions

[Anonymous No.28898218]

FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK. how to fuck are we supposed to cash out ?

[Anonymous No.28898233]

>>28898105
so, where do get crypto without KYC ?

[Anonymous No.28898236]

>>28897863
or maybe this shit should be upgraded to modern standards. why the fuck should i be doing the governments job? if they claim to already know what i owe them then send the fucking bill instead of requiring me to figure out what im supposed to pay

[Anonymous No.28898325]

>>28898233
Buy it with cash from someone or through an ATM

[Anonymous No.28898354]

>>28897774
nope. stop spreading disinfo

[Anonymous No.28898465]

>>28898354
try keeping a significant amount made from trades in a KYC exchange

[Anonymous No.28898552]

>>28898188
Isn't the 3k max only against income tax, but unlimited against capital gains?

[Anonymous No.28898765]

>>28898552
Yes.

[Anonymous No.28898802]

>>28898552
you can reduce your income correct. only long term capital gains have unlimited loss potential though not short term they limit you to that measly 3k although you can roll some of it into the next year

[Anonymous No.28899073]

Nothing will happen to you if you've on-ramped a little here and there in the past for gas money and then crypto launder combo it pro style. All the better if you made some losses along the way looking like you fucked around with no idea of what you are doing. Also there's no etherscan for layer 2.

If you are a poor NEET in the middle of nowhere with no online footprint and everyone thinks you're virtually dead then you're fine.

[Anonymous No.28899099]

>>28892452
Mine doesn't. I wouldn't really call us relevant though, which is a big plus in my view. Like our flag, HAHA.

[Anonymous No.28899117]

>>28898236
well yeah but that's how government works and since they are lazy and crooks they just force businesses to follow laws and report people to them. pretty sure the regulations, tax and red tape shit is only going to get worse from here on out. though imo 2020 taxes people may get away with some stuff because the IRS is fucking swamped having done the two stimulus payments and will shortly be doing a third.

[Anonymous No.28899120]

can't wait for fully compatible cross-chain Dexes and mixers.

[Anonymous No.28899141]

>>28898802
You're misunderstanding what he's saying. You explained it correctly >>28898188

He doesn't understand that your capital gains tax is your total profits - total losses.

[Anonymous No.28899243]

This shit is retarded.
>Buy 1 BTC for $32,000
>Goes up to $50,000
>Trade for $50,000 worth of shitcoins
>According to IRS that is $18,000 in capital gains
>Shit coins go down 90% to $5,000 worth
>You still owe taxes on that $18,000

[Anonymous No.28899426]

>>28899243
You're just retarded

[Anonymous No.28899462]

>>28898325
next one is about 320km away from me ...

[Anonymous No.28899509]

>>28880686
Welcome to the hold crew

[Anonymous No.28899588]

How is taxing crypto-to-crypto legal if it's an unrealized gains tax?

[Anonymous No.28899620]

>>28899243
just sell enough of the shit coin to reduce your gain to zero by incurring losses though if you are in the same year. i mean yeah it kind of sucks because most every would just hodl and hope for the best but you gotta do what you gotta do

[Anonymous No.28899711]

>>28899588
the politicians can always change laws

[Anonymous No.28899756]

>>28899588
Because it isn't unrealized, you dumbass. When you traded one coin for another, you're doing so with the value of the first coin. You're being taxed the final fair market value of the coin minus the initial far market value of the coin. What you're trading it into has no bearing on your tax for that event.

[Anonymous No.28899779]

>>28898325
Fees on ATMS are daylight robbery. Just disappear your coins and transition to using DEX exclusively. You should be able to make it with enough hodls

[Anonymous No.28899842]

>>28894716
Literally just exit and re-enter your position to not get fucked by the IRS

[Anonymous No.28900099]

>>28899588
it's not unrealized if you gain. so if you bought A coin at $1 and then swapped it when it was worth $2 for B coin you'd be gaining $1 on each coin you swapped.

[Anonymous No.28900142]

>>28886583
>implying I want a year of capital losses to be inflated away over multiple years
Yeah no thanks

[Anonymous No.28900297]

>>28894070
>Now 15% when cashout
kek
In Germoney you can pay around 42% taxes for your exchange or cash out.

[Anonymous No.28900483]

what about taking your crypto to another country and cashing out there?

[Anonymous No.28900512]

>>28900099
Checked. So essentially they are punishing you for not withdrawing to fiat. Fuck these kikes.

[Anonymous No.28900963]

>>28899756
Faggot. I never received any fiat to pay the taxes with unless they want a percentage of my shitcoin. I see the jew game that is being played here.

[Anonymous No.28900984]

>>28899756
pretty gay system. in a world that is not operated by greedy kikes they would only tax you when you cash out the profits

[Anonymous No.28902467]

>>28883095
Fucking retards you only pay taxes on net yearly gain. If you have huge losses you can deduct all of them against yr profits that year