labor theory of value

[Anonymous No.13665675]

true or not?

[Anonymous No.13665689]

>>13665675
True but not the whole story. Think if it as the biggest gear in the economic model of thousands of gears, many tiny ones

[Anonymous No.13665691]

>dig a ditch
>fill it back in
>pay me

Stop being a retarded communist.

[Anonymous No.13665702]

>>13665691
Seems like 2 seconds of thinking can debunk every commie idea

[Anonymous No.13665716]

>>13665691
But that's also the capitalist theory of value.

[Anonymous No.13665734]

>>13665716
>Keynesian
>capitalist

Nigger, please.

[Anonymous No.13665736]

>>13665702
You must not do a lot of thinking.

[Anonymous No.13665740]

[Anonymous No.13665764]

>>13665740
Ever notice how all flaming retards post using internet explorer? It's like they're too stupid and technologically illiterate to figure out how to use a proper web browser.

[Anonymous No.13665767]

>>13665740
>Went from being equal in poverty to unequal in wealth

Cringe, Capitalism sucks

[Anonymous No.13665782]

>>13665675
People diving for Perls does not make them valuable, people dive for Perls because they are valuable. Labor theory of value is incoherent and a literal joke among economists

[Anonymous No.13665795]

>>13665734
>it's not REAL capitalism
>REAL capitalism has never been tried before!!!
How do you not see the irony in your posts?

[Anonymous No.13665803]

>>13665716
I own thing, you want use thing pay me or give me a cut. Really simple.

[Anonymous No.13665812]

>>13665782
>perls
And the mental retardation strikes again...

[Anonymous No.13665830]

>>13665812
he's probably a programmer

[Anonymous No.13665831]

>>13665736
Jep, you do not need to think alot to debunk communism :^)

[Anonymous No.13665843]

>>13665767
>it is more desirable for everyone to be poor than it is for people to have varying levels of wealth acquired from adding value

Yeah its much better to have poverty for the population and unbounded wealth for the communist party members.

>>13665795
>government spending and money printing adds to GDP
>central banking (central planner) dictating rates and money supply
>capitalism

Literal plank of communism, faggot. This shit is not hard to understand ffs.

[Anonymous No.13665854]

>>13665767
>would rather live in poverty than have the opportunity for wealth
Gay and cringepilled

[Anonymous No.13665898]

>>13665854
>>13665843
It was a joke you faggots

[Anonymous No.13665914]

>>13665795
are you retarded
the 'its not real communism' meme doesn't mean that literally everything is indeed communism, even anti-communist theory.
keynesianism is literally anti-market theory in every single one of its deviations from the orthodox economic theory which came before it.

[Anonymous No.13665916]

>>13665691
Based

[Anonymous No.13665964]

>>13665843
>>13665914
why do you guys call Keynes a communist? He rejected the LTV and he was for tax cuts during recessions and depressions

[Anonymous No.13665982]

>>13665964
>why do you guys call Keynes a communist?
I already explained it in my post. He's all for central planning.

[Anonymous No.13665985]

>>13665898
We don't take kindly to jokes around these parts (they probably mistook you for the other purple id tee bee h'aitch)

[Anonymous No.13666009]

>>13665982
no, he's for a central bank to stabilize the economy. most modern economists disagree with the gold standard and think there should be a central bank.

[Anonymous No.13666043]

>>13665964
I didn't call him a communist though did i retard

[Anonymous No.13666049]

>>13665795
we have real capitalism, but its warped and corrupted by a failed monetary system

people need to learn the difference between monetary systems and economic systems

i for one support the economic system, but am strongly against the current monetary system, which needs to change.

[Anonymous No.13666080]

>>13666043
you said he was anti-market

[Anonymous No.13666099]

>>13666080
i said that in all of his deviations from previously held orthodox economic theory he was anti-market

[Anonymous No.13666136]

>>13666009
>central bank to stabilize the economy
>create boom bust cycles via money printing and restriction
>literally gave us the great depression and recession

Central planners need to fuck off and stay fuck off.

[Anonymous No.13666185]

>>13666009
>centralisation of all currency apparatus in order to plan the economy such that it remains stable is not centralised planning

[Anonymous No.13666188]

>>13666136
>only the central bank created the depression
>not overproduction, WWII, Smoot-hawley tariffs, and overspeculation

[Anonymous No.13666212]

>>13666188
Central banking created the conditions that allowed overproduction and over speculation. Nice self portrait, dumbfuck.

[Anonymous No.13666237]

>>13666188
>implying that the bullet caused JFKs death and not the wound

[Anonymous No.13666251]

>>13666212
are you aware of the unemployment levels and amount of crashes in the 19th century without a central bank?

[Anonymous No.13666263]

>>13665675

No, it's the debt, marx didn't foresaw the birth of the federal reserve, the labor theory of value only makes sense in a world with gold as currency

[Anonymous No.13666297]

>>13666263
The existence of fiat currency rips the LTV to shreds

[Anonymous No.13666346]

>>13665691
This

[Anonymous No.13666348]

>>13666251
I never said things can't fail (unironically a function of capitalism). There is a difference between demand drying up and dictating rates.

I find it hard to believe people unironically defend fractional reserve banking on /biz/ of all fucking places. What coins do you hold?

[Anonymous No.13666404]

>>13666348
I'm not defending fractional reserve banking. I don't like usury.
>What coins do you hold?
I'm a stock market boomer

[Anonymous No.13666416]

>>13666009
>centralized planning is not centralized planning
ever considered sudoku, brainlet?

[Anonymous No.13666423]

>>13666404
>I'm not defending fractional reserve banking. I don't like usury.
What exactly do you think central banking is?

[Anonymous No.13666425]

>>13665675
You can’t objectively measure value. You can say something has value only relative to what someone thinks it’s worth.

[Anonymous No.13666464]

>>13666416
Yes because the government decides what you sell, how much you make, where you work, and your salary

>>13666423
>A central bank, reserve bank, or monetary authority is the institution that manages the currency, money supply, and interest rates of a state or formal monetary union

[Anonymous No.13666508]

>>13666464
>there are intermediate points of central planning between anarcho-capitalism and inconceivable absolute totalitarianism

sorry if this is too much of a red pill for you to handlr

[Anonymous No.13666530]

>>13666464
Yes and everything that operates within the system operates via fractional reserve while the central bank has a complete monopoly on money supply and rates. Sounds familiar...

>5. Centralization of credit in the hands of the state, by means of a national bank with state capital and an exclusive monopoly.

[Anonymous No.13666641]

>>13666508
The way you put it makes it sound like totalitarian central planning. A central bank is just controlling the quantity of money and interest rates ffs

>>13666530
How do they have a monopoly on currency? There is no law stopping any crypto currency and there is no law stating that you MUST use the US dollar as a medium for exchange. Milton Friedman even criticized one of Hayek's books complaining about a non existent monopoly on currency.

[Anonymous No.13666751]

>>13666641
>How do they have a monopoly on currency?
I guess I didn't really think that through. I'm going to go print off my own dollars, what's the worst that could happen?!

>no law stating that you MUST use the US dollar as a medium for exchange
Well try and pay your federal taxes with anything else. Or if your a country try and sell oil in something besides USD.

[Anonymous No.13666829]

>>13666751
>I guess I didn't really think that through. I'm going to go print off my own dollars, what's the worst that could happen?!
There's only 2 alternatives.
(1) Return to the gold standard
(2) Have private companies print their own private currencies
>Well try and pay your federal taxes with anything else
Just like a business can refuse to accept one currency
>Or if your a country try and sell oil in something besides USD.
Because the USD is the most stable. The USD has to compete with over 100 different currencies globally.

[Anonymous No.13666944]

>>13666829
>There's only 2 alternatives.
>(1) Return to the gold standard
>(2) Have private companies print their own private currencies
Or move to crypto. Having companies print their own is pretty much the same as all these shittokens that get shitout everyday. Bitcoin (not segwit) is hard money and works 1000x better than gold or fiat. You could still have a fiat system within Bitcoin, but that's another discussion.

>Just like a business
>gun to your head
Nothing like business

>Because the USD is the most stable
That is not why countries are beholden to the Petrodollar, dude...

[Anonymous No.13667021]

>>13665691
>sit in office and browse 4chan for 8 hours
>pay me

[Anonymous No.13667047]

>>13665675
it is true in some situations and can be used to make the economy more efficient in some contexts. it is not absolutely true or false.

[Anonymous No.13667096]

>do _____

>not until you give me _____

Yes it's true

[Anonymous No.13667134]

>>13666829
>Because the USD is the most stable. The USD has to compete with over 100 different currencies globally.
Holy shit dude no. If you dont know about the petrodollar you need to educate yourself, it's the backing behind the entirety of modern world politics. Gadaffi was Africa's Jesus, he got them their own wifi sattelite and brought electricity to the commoners of Libya and let women have jobs and shit. We killed him for trying to sell oil for gold instead of for USD. His entire country, hell his entire REGION has not recovered.

[Anonymous No.13667173]

>>13667134
>that doesn't count as competition

[Anonymous No.13667187]

>>13667096
That's not at all how it works. You're describing a demand for a particular product or service which will be compensated with money. LTV states that labor has value regardless of what it produces.

[Anonymous No.13667197]

>>13667173
...what? USD does not "compete" against other currencies. You use USD or you are murdered. Other currencies can be superior and it doesn't matter.

[Anonymous No.13667228]

>>13667197
how is that not competition?

[Anonymous No.13667307]

>>13665716
No? The capitalist theory of value is based on utility
An iPhone is better than a Walkman, even if a Walkman has twice the labour put into it because of the utility provided by an iPhone.
How can a good deal exist if not for value being from utility?

[Anonymous No.13667450]

>>13666009
>Oh it doesn't count he just wanted to centralize the economy to stabilize it
Honestly this reminds me of when people said that it doesn't count when boogie 2988 eats a container of Mayo for a video. Like because he's eating it as a video his body will ignore the calories.

[Anonymous No.13667496]

>>13667187
You're not paying the worker for the product. You're paying for his labor. Therefore labor has value

[Anonymous No.13668570]

>>13665675
sort of

[Anonymous No.13668670]

>>13665675
Labor can have zero or negative value. Try digging holes and filling them in your backyard. What did you gain? You lost energy for nothing.

[Anonymous No.13668698]

>>13665675
In the end value is subjective. If you value something then it is so. People value things differently, what is valuable to you might not be for others.

[Anonymous No.13668700]

>>13665675

>convert labor value to price
>communism.exe stopped and it must get shut down