/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>9747579
The same companies control just as much of their hash too, they are just butthurt because if they fork away to a new PoW then BCH will overtake BTC almost immediately.

>>9747579

Same miners for both chains

>>9747693
>>9747711
Yes but is that a good thing?

>>9747745

Bcashers would tell you nonono it's the same the networks have same strengths.

Do your own research

>>9747798
Honestly thinking of going all in monero

>>9747579
Jeez are you biztards still talking about bcash? It's a shitcoin promoted by shit-tier scammers and con artists. All of which is completely provable. When are you going to grow up and face facts instead of hoping you'll make it with this shit?

>>9747879
Ive already cashed out 4x my inital investment so im playing with house money but i have 60k in crypto right now and want to position myself to get great returns. I genuinely felt that bch would give me the most return in light of all tje news but im not so sure anymore

>>9747579
>im starting to see the merit in btcs arguments against having one company control all the hash.
Extrapolate.

>>9747798
No one is going to say it is the same network.
Why would the miners blow up their off ramp?

>>9747579
>he didn't buy at 1:10
>he didn't buy at 1:9
>he didn't buy at 1:8
>he didn't buy at 1:7
you are here
>he didn't buy at 1:6
>he didn't buy at 1:5
>he didn't buy at 1:4
>he didn't buy at 1:3
>he didn't buy at 1:1

>>9747958
Well im not technically literate but doesnt bitmain have 40-50% hashrate on btc? And honestly i dont really care about all this i just want to 50x my 60k tbqh.

>>9747994
Dude i have 50 bch

>>9747923
Dude I'm just holding plain Bitcoin and didn't even blink an eye when it went from 19k to 7k

I'm here for the long term hold and you know what.. I am not fucking selling. see you in year 2020 bcashies. Let's see the effect of halving on your pathetic economy.

>>9747994

>>9747994
> A coin built on the idea that some other coin is gonna get destroyed

Parity reached.. in your wet dreams maybe.

>>9748022
same here. just hold, its the real bitcoin.

>>9747579
why not invest in the version of bitcoin that can interact with smart contracts and erc20 tokens?
https://github.com/0xbitcoin/white-paper

>>9747579
All the miner arguments against bch are just fud or retarded people attempting to discuss. Don't worry about centralized mining, There is going to be competition in making the best asic miner, It just happens that one genius chink made it before everyone else, therefore a lot of salty retards. POW is the free economic and game theory behind Bitcoin that actually makes it what it is; Bitcoin. Blockstream is trying to implement BTC with the economy we already have today. BCH stick to Satoshi's original plan to make a new economy.

Also when BCH flip BTC, all the hashpower is with BCH. Why so worried?

>>9748012
No.

>>9748074
Why not kill yourself?

>>9748022

>>9748075


You see what this guy is telling you? Don't worry about centralized mining it's perfectly fine.

>>9748103

Competition inevitably leads to businesses outpacing one another.

>>9748103
>btc is centralized but has just werked anyways for the last 9 years just cause lol

>>9747579
Bitcoin community is bashing it's head against a wall, meanwhile Monero is doing God's work. XMR is becoming what Bitcoin was supposed to be. Pic unrelated

>>9748155
We'll see monero in a decade when quantum computing makes all that fancy anonymity tech obsolete.

>>9748155
thats the xrp whore!

>>9748175
If quantum computing breaks encryption then we have bigger problems than fucking cryptocurrency

>>9748150
Fucking socialist. Bitcoin and crypto work because of fucking competition.

>>9748212
we don't have a problems, only people who have secrets do.
Bitcoin is gonna sail the high seas of eternal bull market.

>>9748103
Its a valid concern
>>9748075
I def think bch has more potential to moon short term just want to see both sides

>>9748236
>WHAT DO YOU NEED RIGHTS FOR, YOU UP TO SOMETHING?

>>9748246
Wait for the D.A
BTC difficulty going up 16%

BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH BCRASH

>>9749097
I am BTC supporter. I am against BCH but when I see this... Pathetic and so desperate. Are you scared or something? Come on.

>>9748093
because i will have so much money from my 0xbtc investment that i will be able to do whatever i want with my life.

I wouldn't hold a significant portion of your wealth in crypto right now unless you have enough trading experience to limit your exposure to risk via futures. The BTC vs BCH dumpster fire is dragging down all of crypto and there's no end in sight. It's still a nice market for traders but not hodlers.

Go all in

>decentralization technology
>single point of control
Good way to get fucked.

bitcoin cash. the most shilled shitcoin on /biz/. Can't scale, its 0 conf model doesn't work and relies on trusted, centralized services. It is only shilled by the chinese to undermine bitcoin.

LN is already working and is gaining adoption. You can run an LN node right now and pay 1 sat fees without having to trust any centralized "payment processing service" like bcash shills say you need for 0 confs. BTC has no shill army though so DYOR and make sure you're reading from legit sources and not brainless tech journalists or literal shills / paid advertising.

>>9750628
You gotta pay fees on Lightning Network? But it's off chain?! What a FUCKING JOKE

>>9750628
LN can't scale. Every sending node needs to maintain a routing table of every balance on every channel and it needs to be updated for every single transaction as it will update every single routing table for every trx.

>>9750671
1 sat you fucking retard, as in 1 satoshi total.
not 1 sat per byte, as in 300 sats, 1 sat.

>>9748155
Tiffany Hayden is the biggest mistake Airbitz / Edge Secure made. I liked them until she joined and poisoned their outfit.

>>9747745
OP whether or not it's a good thing is irrelevant, it's just reality. You changing over to BTC doesn't change what >>9747711 said.

It's possible that Bitmain controls 50% of all bitcoins in existence on both forks. If they just mined for a year before releasing the ASICs on the market that's the reality we're stuck with.

At least I'm assuming that's what you meant with "having one company control all the hash". There's really no other way to read it because on paper both forks have equal amounts of mining pools and there's no way to know how much one company is mining on any of them.
https://cash.coin.dance/blocks/today

btw I saw this clip with the Stripe founders https://youtu.be/Fo4GDDz0P9w

I wonder why they don't go with Bitcoin Cash, they are clearly describing why they dropped Bitcoin here but are ignoring that the version they want already exists. It's not like it's some random altcoin with no support either since so many oldschool bitcoin dudes like it.

>>9750628

0conf relies on miners competing and merchants wanting to be paid... thats it...

Also Lightning doesnt work... cut the BS. There is a reason very few merchants want to touch it. Anyone who doubts me, try actually using it. It is hihly experimental and nobody really knows if it even can be made to work reliably.

>>9751694

Devs admit Lightning is a piece of shit which can't maintain more than 100k users

>>9751702

For lightning to scale to a billion users we would need 500+ mb blocks just to open and close channels too...

The routing on lightning is a shit show as well.

Basically lightning takes satoshis brilliant design and adds an unnecessary piece of poop onto it for no reason. 2ND layers are fine but NOT at the expense of the main network. Bitcoin is CASH not a settlement layer.

Very, very few uses Lightning Network. Just 23.8 BTC in 8947 channels is not a good time to claim that "it works". Especially when it doesn't seem to succeed half the time...

https://p2sh.info/dashboard/db/lightning-network?orgId=1

Not even SegWit is getting much momentum. Only ~35% usage and that's after the Bitcoin Core made it so that you are forced to use SegWit in the latest version released at the start of Mars (went up from 15% at that time).

https://p2sh.info/dashboard/db/segwit-usage

>>9751702
This is how actual devs speak. They identify problems. If you guys ever get any devs maybe you will experience that.

>>9751847
more people use LN than bcash
deal with it bag holder

>>9747579
BCH really is the real bitcoin, the memes are real.
>its true, all of it

>>9751864
They didn't identify that LN wasn't ready for mainstream adoption and they didn't identify that a block size increase was needed in December (despite people warning about it since 2015).

Oh yeah, they did realize it but was refused code commit so they had to fork the project.

>>9751913
Now that's just silly.

>>9751976
ch3ck your meme tx highway sites
LN has more use than bcash

>>9752103
Link me to some places that accept LN. I bet you've not even used it yourself, all you're doing is trying to protect your investment.

>>9752149
nice goal posts
fact is btc has 10x more use than bcash
LN has more use
even doge has more use

its a doa scam fork with the dregs of crypto behind it to rip off newbies

>>9751913

I can buy from any online store with BCH through cryptonize.it

how many places accept BTC?

>>9751976
Actually there has already been proposed a solution for the problem you described which doesnt involve increasing block sizes. If you knew what you were talking about you would be able to name it....

>>9752158
You're not very good at this.

>>9752158
>fact is btc has 10x more use than bcash

That's a bad thing. we don't want people spending their digital gold

>>9752224
educate me. you better not be talking about segwit.

>>9752178
I pay my rent and all my bills with btc
keep trying

>>9752239
Educate yourself.

>>9752268
You're not very good at this either...

>>9752262
Yeah so?

>>9752278
Very good at what?
Youre here posting your opinions like they mean anything, I point out that you dont know basic facts, you then demand I spoonfeed you. Stop being so fucking lazy and stop shitting up the board.

>>9747579

>>9752308
I don't demand shit, don't post claims without backing them up and don't act like a brat when you get asked to spread knowledge.

>>9752360
Don't post your asinine opinions on public forums if you don't know the basics of the topic.

>>9752403
If you have anything positive to say about your investment you better say it for your own sake. I'm not the only one reading this and you're not helping Lightning Network or BTC by hiding valuable information. Everybody reading will just assume you were lying and you hurt your investment.

>>9752420
have you also noticed the absence of turboshill?
must have gotten fired eh?
i can't help but feel sorry for you being all alone
to be clear i've never thought you to be a shill, just a brainlet.
i think i'll call you turbobrainlet.

the problem with btc is that it just isn't a currency.

LN works without routing. It is just a hub and spoke network. But still entirely trust-less and secure. If routing works well that's just a cherry on top as it allows for an efficient distributed network.

Contrast that to bch, where private, centralized payment processing services like bitpay (roger vers has a multi-million investment in bitpay) and coinbase are expected to be used by vendors to provides some quasi-security to 0 conf transactions. This is even more centralized than a hypothetically broken LN's hub and spoke network and but isn't even secure or trust-less.

Not to mention the fact bch's entire design doesn't even work. Its supposed to be cash used in point of sales but it requires a 0 conf transaction to be propagated to entire network which can take up to a minute or more. Fundamentally flawed, unless you think its accessible to wait 1min+ when checking out at the grocery store, or waiting 10+min for confs when the network is congested.

AND thats on top of the fact just scaling blocks bigger and bigger doesn't scale. Eth has dynamically scaling blocks and it obviously doesn't infinity scale like cash shill claims. The the entire premise of bch is totally unfeasible. Shills will say infinity increase block size scales. Then why doesn't eth? BCH is a scam just like every shitcoin roger ver has shilled. He is literally spending millions this year alone to spam BCH ads and shills its getting ridiculous.

>>9752420
I dont care what everyone reading thinks. LN will succeed with or without you.

>>9752542
>But still entirely trust-less and secure
The only nodes liquid enough to support you will be banks. They will require you to give full Name and ID to transact. They can block transactions at will. This is not "trustless" or "secure"
>blah blah blah 0-conf sucks
A few challenges are up where vendors are willing to sell gift cards at 0-conf. If 0-conf were insecure then I assume some bad actor would have purchased them for nothing. Hasn't happened yet.

>>9752496
?

>>9752543
To be honest I would have been extremely surprised if you weren't talking out of your ass.

>>9752542
LN "works" without routing because there is no routing. Right now you download a snapshot of the whole network, calculate the routing yourself and send it on its way (praying that the network hasn't changed too much because then the transaction fails).

One year ago Bitcoin was exactly like Bitcoin Cash. And if Bitpay owns the majority of BCH they also own the majority of BCH..

>>9752603
Isnt it your bedtime yet? Dont you have school tomorrow?

waiting for btc to die here, before the end of this year it will be 2-3k with bch over 20k

>>9752603
one year ago btc cost $10 to get a tx through in under 12 hours
bcash is exactly like that? Lmao

>>9752603
you know who turboshill is bitch don't play dumb.

>>9752647
Nope.

>>9752651
I meant that it works the same.

>>9752657
If you think BCH is a threat to BTC I suggest investing in it.

>>9752601

Anyone can run an LN node and use w/e nodes they want. If a bank requires KYC you can move on to the next node out of the thousands of nodes available.

Its trust-less because transactions on LN are guaranteed to be valid. There is zero trust component like with 0-conf. LN transactions are 100% as secure as on-chain transactions. Do do not need to know or trust the LN nodes you use, regardless of how distributed they are.

>>9752601

Those vendors are requiring the use of bitpay and other centralized services. Might as well use paypal at that point. BCH + BitPay is not a cryptocurrency solution. I'd like to see them sell the cards straight on a BCH node with no centralized services keeping it secure. They won't of course because they know its insecure (mt. gox).

>>9752603

Yep, LN works right now. You can send bitcoin for 1 sat.

>>9752684
I got it for free turbobrainlet.
along with the 40something other shitcoin forks since

>>9752688
>Anyone can run an LN node and use w/e nodes they want. If a bank requires KYC you can move on to the next node out of the thousands of nodes available.

Routing is an unsolved problem jackass. Even the dev admit it

>>9752708

Routing is not "unsolved," maybe finding the perfect route is, but you can simply the network like the current internet routing works.

Buy you're missing the point. LN doesn't need perfect routing. LN without routing is still infinity better than trying to jury rig 0 conf transactions to be half-way secure by having a centralize service monitor translations, then trying to needlessly pack those centralized transactions into a block chain with like 1TB blocks or w/e ridiculous number they claim is viable now.

So even if LN routing doesn't work. BCH in contrast just doesn't work, at all. It doesn't scale in throughput, fees, or speed. Its a scam.