/biz/ - Business & Finance

THE ABSOLUTE STATE HAHAH

>>8529470
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLtkx-xKaKQ
lol, even though vid is only 1:30 long, I couldn't bear to watch it all. I had to purposely skip through parts of it so as not to feel the pain and awkwardness

im glad i got out

Not that bad desu

Aren't coloured coins just an ERC20 clone?

Why the fuck would you want that

crack team of autists

>>8529470
the only worthwhile presentation was by Emin Gün Sirer. can we please make him the benevolent dictator of bitcoin cash? he was super fucking rational about everything even the need for layer 2

the problem is programmers not seeing the forest from the trees is going to lead us to endless forks and sophistry about shit that is relatively trivial to what bitcoin is. If adoption can't be obtained on the offer of the most superior form of currency ever created that makes central banks financial repression infeasible, stuttering presentations on OP codes do nothing

>>8529470
THey dont even care to pump this shit

I've never bought this ayy lmao niggercoin but it's always on Coinbase for some reason with a couple of other useless Bitcoin clones.

>>8529470

>>8529470
bcash is dead

>>8530063

yuup what did you smoke?

you probably should go out for a while and think about your meme lines twice, how useless they are

>>8529470
As I already said in the comments, so you took all the content out and left all the filler in, in an attempt at mockery and so as not to face what they were actually saying. What a level of discourse! What a retort on fundamentals! Your crowd reminds me of primary school bullies. With this kind of leadership and followers, Bitcoin Core is fucked.

>>8530063

When it comes to having self-dignity and not being a total asshole liar the btc crowd is, bch wins by a long margin.

>>8530218
you can count on self-dignity with bcash scam

>>8529470

>>8530100
>>8530194
>>8530291
>>8530052
>>8530031
>>8529995
>>8529630
>>8529470
>>8530295


>when pajeets accept payment to fud the one invention that could grow their economy enough that everyone could afford a toilet

>>8530317
pump your sheet pajeet, you can do this

>>8530317
Stop imposing your western toilet culture on us.

>>8529760

they are marked bitcoin's not erc20 code... cmon keep up anon

weak fud

>>8529470
Oh you silly goose BCASH is ANTI-FRAGILE

>>8530063
Your lines literally draw a pyramid.

HHAHAHA
BCASH BCASH BCASH BCASHBCASH BCASHBCASH BCASHBCASH BCASHBCASH BCASHBCASH BCASHBCASH BCASHBCASH BCASHBCASH BCASHBCASH BCASH
HURRRR

>>8529681
delettttt

>>8531021

This pic always confuses the bots/pajeets who post BCH FUD spam

>>8529470
Why is a black man so concerned about colored coins?

remember- always do the opposite of what /biz/ does.
this thread is a bcash buy signal

>>8531993

thats not how it works...
such threads also existed early January - BCASH is now down -70%

>>8531635

nigger*

>OWNS BITCOIN.COM
>TRICKS PEOPLE INTO BUYING BCASH
>HALF OF MARKET CAP

>>8530218
>Members constantly FUD, lie, insult, use conspiracy theories and be the laughing stock of entire crypto community.
>Bitcoin community had it enough and fights back
>'It must Be a paid blockstream shill!'
You reap what you sow, cashcucks.

>nigger moderates your conference
Tells you everything you need to know

have some, cheers

I'm fucking dying
>muh coloured coins
>muh extension blocks
hahaahahahhahahaha

>>8530291
stop posting that picture, Roger is really great guy and he is a true libertarian, what did you ever do with your life?

>>8533033
fuck them, they don't know shit, I met Roger once, dude is a total Chad

Hahaha the desperation is too much, Segwit has already lost

Like EVERY fuckin time. /biz FUDs something before it explodes.

>mfw the war is already won

SATOSHI VISIOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON

This is pretty funny, two days already worth of presentations and the best you can come up with is 1 minute and 30 seconds worth of strung together random out of context punctuating words and various bits and pieces to make your point, no arguments, no actual content, just "lol look at these people in my montage where I go out of my way to make them look bad and can't really come up with much".
Meanwhile, if one were to take the same approach to a fucking blockstream presentation or something from that fucking autist Maxwell or god fucking forbid Luke-jr, you'd have both enough arguments as well as enough self congratulatory autistic cringe to spawn a blackhole which would then be summarily negated by the abject void of self awareness implicit in the scenario.
I can't believe how sad and desperate coretards are getting.

>>8533111
Full boat checked

We are coming and we are coming in waves!

>>8533033
>>8533052
you realize there id's on biz right?,the state of cashcucks

>>8533262
I actually posted this ironically as a cash supporter. They're fucking pathetic.

>>8529470
UHMMM

terabyte blocks
millions of tx/sec
global on-chain scaling at 10x visa scale
turing-complete smart contracts
graphene
weak blocks
bobtail
counterparty cash

fuck I'm not even scratching the surface. and did you see Roger's inspiring talk, holy shit. we're all gonna make it BCH bros

>>8533321

Yep, another terabyte every 10 minutes? This bandwidth issue is going to be I mean like nothing, like literally nothing, that's the easiest problem to solve.

Because look a 1 KM fiber link can do 255 TBPS. Bandwidth problem = SOLVED. Scalability BTFO.

Apparently with this new DATASIGVERIFY they are going to have oracle support native on bitcoin cash. Stinky linkies destroyed?

>>8533402
>1tb every 10 minutes
that isn't even a remotely big deal today. A decade ago i was at 1mpbs now I'm at 100 in a shithole in the middle of nowhere. Another decade with even faster speeds + sharding? Absolutely nothing.

>>8533461

Agreed. 1 TB blocks is literally nothing. Because moore's law right? By 2020 we'll probably have like 500 gallizon TBPS internet for free. That's why scalability is never an issue for any distributed computing system. Because computer speed just increases parabolically forever and its never a problem, like literally.

>>8533321
how does bcash support smart contracts

>>8533545
Doesn't even need to be remotely parabolic to keep up at this rate. Glad your entire philosophy is based around a red herring created by a bunch of kikes.

>>8533600
op codes being added back to Bitcoin (BCH) that were removed by core neckbeards

ethereum was never supposed to be its own blockchain, it was going to be built on top of Bitcoin via opcodes but blockstream told vitalk to go fuck off because they considered it spam

>>8533604

Yes don't get me started on the JEWS right?

>>8533632

Yes because protocol layers on top of bitcoin like omni, counterparty, rootstock don't exist, they are myths made up by the jews to mind control core cucks.

>>8531547
>altcoin literally created with the premise to allow pajeets that can't afford 30cent transactions to transact in exchange of centralizing the network
>pajeets are FUDding it

>>8533321
>terabyte blocks
centralized shitcoin
>turing-complete smart contracts
exploitfest clusterfuck. also proves once again craig s wright isn't satoshi since satoshi designed bitcoin non turing complete in purpose
>rest
memes

>>8533659
>counterparty
speaking of counterparty... lol

http://counterparty.cash/

>>8533632
blockstream was around back in 2009 and 2010 telling satoshi what to do? sorry, newfag here

>>8533690

So both BTC and BCH support smart contracts secondary layers. Its almost as if BCH is a fork of BTC and they are pretty much the same, except for one variable changed and marketed as a new feature for cucks to buy into...

>>8530063
lmao

These threads always make me chuckle. Corecucks saltiness is just hilarious. Even funnier when you get a bunch of the retards together. I guess I should feel bad about laughing at the mentally handicapped, but for whatever reason I don't in this case.

if you want to make of fun of niggers well lightning lead developers are a women and black guy so good luck with that

>>8533659
Do you understand anything?

>>8533731
One feature that makes you flip your shit and cry like a bitch nonstop for 8 months straight.

>>8533767

Ikr? Core cucks are mentally handicapped.

We all know this>>8533795
is the truth.

Fucking Bilderbergs got core cucks brainwashed

>Muh 1TB blocks
>Muh Fake Satoshi
>Muh Ex-felon convention
BEE-CASH

>>8533820
Nobody thinks your brainwashed we all just think you're completely retarded because you have 0 arguments.

>>8530218
bch is filled with dignified conmen
btc has an army of conniving rats
either way you lose

>>8533767
tell us more, sifu. please.

>>8533830
>bring up jews and bilderberg conspiracies
>expect rational arguments in response

>>8533837
Accept the real, fungible cryptocurrency that is scalable and ASIC-resistant.

>>8530184
Have to agree with you.
This video is reddit tier slander
Not even slightly funny. Still wouldn't touch bch with a 10 foot pole

>>8533861
>reality
>conspiracy
So you think that didn't happen? We're done here, these arguments are a waste of time.

>>8533867
Best be trolling, you haven't heard of new cryptonight ASICs?

>i identify as bitcoin!!!

>>8533867
Also it doesn't scale with it's current solutions

>>8533880
Didn't they change the pow almost immediately after that shit came out?

>>8533880
>>8533893
The network upgrade this month will render the Antminer X3 useless. Also, Monero has a dynamic blocksize meaning the more users use the network, the cheaper fees become.

>>8533688
>"most ETH bagholders will not swallow until they can't deny anymore which will be pretty soon"
>eth did a 140x since this post was made
>still at 50x today
man could you imagine being that guy
you're anon and nobody else knows it's you, but each time you go to a btc vs eth topic you see that cap and witness your past stupidity displayed for the world to see

>>8533877
hey dumbfuck, how did blockstream cripple btc with high fees? high transactions led to miners prioritize transactions that paid higher fees. moreover, these huge companies invest tons of money all over the place, there is no overarching jew bitcoin conspiracy. you are a complete mong.

>>8533964
>how did blockstream cripple btc with high fees?
by not scaling the blocksize
>high transactions led to miners prioritize transactions that paid higher fees
Yep which led to a clogged mempool filled with unconfirmed transactions
>these huge companies invest tons of money all over the place, there is no overarching jew bitcoin conspiracy.
Sounds like your contradicting yourself in the same sentence
>you are a complete mong.
nobody with less than 130 iq is allowed to talk to me anymore

>>8533918
>>8533927
Thanks guys, didn't know that. What is the new algorithm?
Any guarantee that would be more ASIC resistant?
Kinda seems weird having to fork everytime.

the Bcore strategy is wrong and the BTC early adopters have the foresight to see it AND have the kahunas, coin, greed, and knowledge to counteract it.

>>8533986
hahaha i'm screencapping this. are you wearing a fedora as you post this from your moms old sweaty leather armchair in your studio apartment you can barely afford?

>>8533986
>Blockstream is centralizing BTC by keeping block size 1mb
>Hey let's make the block 1TB instead so only the few could afford running full nodes.
Cashiers are cool

>>8534001
Monero has a network upgrade every 6 months since 2016, I believe. The CryptoNight algorithm will continue to be used, albeit slightly modified with each upgrade. Bitmain is unable to develop and ship out new ASICs to consumers in less than 6 months, making it unfeasible for them to develop CryptoNight ASICs.

>>8534037
You understand the blocksize limit and the blocksize are two separate things right? No you don't please don't reply to me you simple man.
>>8534017
Because I'm tired of talking with idiots who either have no argument or shit arguments? Go ahead, post it on reddit too.

>>8534129
BCH plans to have full nodes only on industrial computers, do you argue about that?

>>8534087
Mkay I still think that eventually something permanent should be developed, crypto isn't supposed to be like a normal company where you keep changing things

>>8534218
You have to make an argument for an everyday users need to run a full node. There currently aren't any that I've seen. They would be industrial now but by the time we would get to 1tb if we ever do the financial requirements will have lowered.

>>8534037

No option is free from issue...
However i'd sooner pick a hardware growing pain that can be eased with moore's law over time than the LN which would naturally encourage central hubs and rented side channels.

>>8534001
>Kinda seems weird having to fork everytime.

They only had to do it once. Now the message is out and bitmain and others are deterred from wasting more time/resources developing new ASICs.

Also just watched the video. RIP cashies, the gig is up it was nice while it lasted.

>>8534409
Where does the line get drawn? Is it just asic and bitmain? Is nvidia and AMD ok? If another company besides bitmain does something similar is that ok? Seems like they're trying the fight the inevitable.

>>8534409
Bitmain is ecstatic, this means that they can develop ASIC hardware in secret, attain a majority monopoly on a massively skewed playing field on the dime of the entire monetary base, and then the idiot central planners that manage the network will maintain their ability to keep executing this plan long beyond any other operator might come in and rain on their parade by competing with them. Mining "ASIC-resistant" marketed chains that are actually stupid enough to stick to their guns on the marketing lie as an ASIC manufacturer with the ability to design and deploy full runs on your own is now an industry where the network central planners will chestpound about how they're out to get you, whilst actually maintaining your monopoly edge on all other competitors who have to mine with suboptimal resources.
But the emotions of the "asic-resistant" crew are more important than facts or logic it seems, and so that's the equilibrium in which we operate.

>>8533667
Core is the altcoin. BCH is the real Bitcoin. Notice how the white paper doesn't mention segshit or ln side chains

>>8533052
Holy fuck, I can't stop laughing. Fuck off to leddit you fucking bcash pleb.

>>8534667
>ACTCUHLEY BCORE IS THE ALT COIN
How snug are those glasses on top of your watermelon head. Brush off that Dorito dust and actually read the white paper.

>>8534559
yeah the asic resistance meme is a joke

>>8533942
>scam going up means it's not a scam

the higher it goes the worse the crash, fundamentals remain: turing completeness is retarded.

>>8534310
No it cant. Big blocks = centralization at layer 0. Luckily it will never happen, since the people that hold most bitcoins are anti big blocks and will kill anyone attempting to do so.

>>8534667
>x is y

>>8535182
Satoshi holds the most Bitcoins and he will dump them for BCH because Blockstream took a shit on his project. It's not that long that Satoshi gets his Tulip trust.. holding BTC is risky af

>>8534302
>>8534543
Everyday users don't really care. I'm talking about nerds like usbeing able to run the node, mine and be able to choose a pool atleast.
It doesn't get more centralized than having 1 company produce all the chips, mine itself as much it sees fit and then sell the miners when it wants.
And using industrial servers for running nodes is basically DPOS, just with better computers.
TL:DR Satoshi probably doesn't like LN nor BCH-s 1tb block

>>8535339
Satoshi is in BCH camp. It's time to stop pretending that Craig isn't Satoshi

so honest question, for all you cucks spending so much of your day shitting up every BCH thread... why? why are you so butthurt that you invest countless hours making stupid memes/videos/photoshops and shitposting lies in threads like this? what are you getting out of it? If you don't like Bitcoin Cash, don't use it. It's pretty simple. Instead you waste your time like you have nothing better to do. Either you are severly assblasted because you were conned into selling your BCH at $300, or you are paid to shit up this board

BEEEECASSSSSHHHHKONEEHHHHHHHHH

Carlos would have a field day with this trash

>>8535510
>Conned into selling bch at $300

Omg wow whoever sold their 3x coin has 0 brains, being that no other coins can 3x in several months ever again!!!

>>8533111
>THOSE DIGITS

>>8533667
>centralizing the network

How unbelievably dumb do you have to be to believe that? Just admit you don't have a clue how any of this works and you just came here from /r/bitcoin. You've literally drank so much kool-aid that you're cross-eyed and you have to keep swallowing it back down as it's coming back up your throat into your mouth. Some of it is dribbling down your shirt even. Watching Lightning Network die a slow painful death is so enjoyable. Keep the entertainment coming, please

>>8535510
They're pissed because the bought at $19K and are too stupid to understand what's going on and why it's losing value. All they know is what they read on twitter and reddit, so they honestly believe Roger Ver controls BCH and is doing thinkgs like DDOSing LN and spamming the BTC mempool. Their only argument is "bcash! bcash!" It's hilarious. Not since the flat earthers has the internet seen a more delusional and clueless group of misinformed idiots

What if, and I know this is a crazy idea, neither BTC nor BCH are the currency of the future and this debate is pointless?

hey guys :)

>>8536193
what a colossal faggot

>>8536193
How much BCash to fuck her?

>>8535233
>craig wright is satoshi
>muh tulip funds

kek. No, none of that is true. What is true is, TMSR holds millions of coins, more than the actual satoshi, ver and so on combined. All forks are fucked, forever.

>>8535480
Did Craig push out a smelly wet fart as payment for this post.

BEECASHIE

bcucks lol.

>>8536193
He fuck her?

>>8535662
Go to back to plebit, Roger.

>>8536193
I know her, she is veru
y nice. I hope he dont he will not take advantage of his position.

>>8533033
>>8533052
Hi Roger

Because no one is this stupid

>>8533033
>stop posting that picture
literally delet.png

>>8529470
how surprising the bcore cuck is a nigger

>>8535182
That graph is a fucking joke, I run a Bitcoin core and Bitcoin ABC full node on the same machine. The Bitcoin ABC process consumes less resouces than the Bitcoin Core node, and neither of them consume anything even remotely worrying at all, the biggest lie there is the 8mb = 32gb memory consumption stat, it's off by more than a hundred times.
There has never been, and there never will be, any kind of actual reasonable technical justification as to why the scaling of the chain was sabotaged by Blockstream, the real reason was extremely simple; because their business model fucking requires it.
It is so fucking sad that stupid cunts like you can't realise that even at this late stage of the game with overwhelming empirical evidence that it's the simple fucking truth.

>>8536336
Forget what I said, asian girls are fucking scary.

https://twitter.com/misachasu0209/status/944926822398967809

>>8536812
>The Bitcoin ABC process consumes less resouces than the Bitcoin Core node
Yeah, because nobody uses bcrash, they can't even fill 1MB blocks. If Bcrash was being used at scale, the blocks would be filled and so would your computer.

>>8533436
>https://medium.com/@g.andrew.stone/bitcoin-scripting-applications-decision-based-spending-8e7b93d7bdb9

They had this idea floating since 2 august last year. corecucks destroyed bitcoins progress

>>8536853
The memory stats are just as inaccurate for Bitcoin core, and they were even in december when the chain was completely saturated. Also in the few blocks where BCH was saturated because dumb LARP'ing wannabe fucks like you tried to DDOS it Bitcoin ABC didn't give a fuck and the memory usage at the time still didn't exceed even 512mb.
Face it, you have no fucking idea what you're talking about, and if people are stupid enough to back core, it doesn't matter how many corecoins they have, because eventually it won't be able to compete with an actual honest provably fair system not so handicapped, that you fuckwits seem to have no clue you're just playing useful idiots for blockstream is icing on the cake.
You think you pull the strings, you're actually a retarded puppet.

>>8533688
>halting problem
gas directly addresses this

BCH is the biggest meme in crypto anyway. If you dig deeper you realize it's 95% overinflated because bitmain hoards hundreds of thousands of BCH coins. It's on life support from day one.

>>8537363
You think perhaps they're hoarding BCH instead of BTC now because that was what originally made them actually start a business in the space? Peer to peer electronic cash? And everyone who was around since the beginning and has the intelligence to see that vision was sabotaged has moved off as well, and the only people left are those too stupid to grasp the actual technical facts of the issue?

Bitcoin virgins are getting desperate.

>>8536937
>You think you pull the strings, you're actually a retarded puppet.
Said the /r/btc 2016 tier puppet.

>>8537447
2018
still accepted nowhere.

>>8537823
>bitcoin's success depends on how many niggers are buying kfc using bitcoin

>>8537796
This is the problem when you don't have the necessary mental faculties to establish truth from fiction and instead rely on arguments from authority and who can yell the loudest, everything looks the same to you and you just follow whoever seems the most confident, and you think everyone is a puppet.
You may learn, you may be incapable of learning, but it doesn't change the eventual inevitable outcome. Unusable money will always be strictly inferior to usable money, all else held equal.

>>8529470
That nog is hilarious. I can't believe that people don't regard them as equals.

>>8533815
RKD

>>8535182

>people that hold most bitcoin are anti-big block

>>8537420
Yes those are the retards, the rest are fucking loser shills bagholding segshit store of value non-"coins"

>>8533321
>terabyte blocks
lmao

i cant tell if cashies are baiting at this point or not

>>8538334
This comment will not age well

>>8534129
>You understand the blocksize limit and the blocksize are two separate things right?
What are you talking about

>>8538366
>muh moore's law
cashies are confirmed retarded

>>8538387
cashies are the weirdest thing in all of crypto

>>8536414
>TMSR
What's that

>>8536937
>>8536812
You forgot about storage. 500GB per year is too much, and it's essential that people can download the entire ledger.

>>8538402
Why not believe in both? BCash is the future though. LN and Segwit. Blockstream. Really? Haha. Dr. Craig Steven Wright bitches.

Every bcash thread is always very active and high in the reply count. i really cant ignore it any longer. shill me

http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=hawala

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawala#Post-9/11_money_laundering_crackdowns

Hawala was bitcoin before bitcoin.

Example for the Hawala banking system: Person A wants to transfer money to person B, using the services of the "hawaladars" X and M. 1. A hands the money (red) to his hawaladar X and also tells him the code word (blue). 2a. Then, A tells B the code word. 2b. Independent of this, X tells the code word to M. 3a. B tells the code word to M... 3b. ...which shows to M that B is a legitimate receiver of the money, so he hands over the money to B. Legend: blue = shared code word is being told, red = money is handed over.

>>8529470
thanks just sold 100k

(im dead serious)

i unironically just bought 100k thanks to this thread

>>8538470
It will be the world currency, anon. Bch advocates are in this for the long haul

lol bcash

>>8538612
>>8538594
>neither poster did anything in reality

btc merchant adoption is shrinking bch adoption is growing.
Btc's replace by fee makes 0 confirmation transactions 100% unsafe and means settlement cannot be said to happen within 10 minutes.
There is not a single reason to cap blocks at 1mb today (non mining nodes do nothing).
Segwit destroys the mining nash equilibrium incentivising the collusion of miners to change the UTXO without owners signatures. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VoFb3mcxluY You can only trust jihan and roger to not be doing this right now.
BTC is vulnerable to a chain death spiral BCH is not.
Why introduce segwit before a blocksize increase when lightning network requires 133mb as specified in the lightning network whitepaper?
Why introduce segwit at all when it is not necessary for second layer solutions?
Lightning network will not be decentralized because to make decentralised routing in a mesh network is NP hard.
Why would anyone want lightning network when it is not a decentralised ledger? the whole point of bitcoin is to scale on chain as that is what makes decentralised uncensorable money which can free all the people in the world from the financial repression of central banks.

>>8538671
stop

>>8538683

angry corecuck

Bcash has better looking women

>>8538442
no need to dl the whole chain unless you want to. from a talk last night at the conference, they are adding a feature where a new node can be up and running im seconds as it gets the entire coin distribution as part of each block header

>>8538819
you don't get it anon... if you don't download the whole chain you need to trust the consensus. sure you can just download the UTXO set, but you have to believe the network. the point of bitcoin is to be trustless in the sense that anyone can download the ledger and verify all transactions in the history then prune it themselves to keep the utxo set and operate on that. but you need a trustless setup and using SPV or block headers or other workarounds don't cut it. that's the whole point of bitcoin

Cashies would buy Craig Wright's toilet leftovers if they could. Amazing. Don't forget to take your medication when BCash goes the way of every other Roger Ver endorsed project.

>>8538877
like I said faggot, if you want to be a neckbeard nerd with his raspberry pi full node feel free to download the full chain. However there is no need for the rest of the (sane) world, SPV wallets are fine or just grab the next block header and go with a full node

>>8538898
if it grows by 500GB per year, then I can't download it and verify it brainlet

>>8538919
then go spend $50 on a 100 tb hard drive or buy a real internet connection, pajeet

>>8538946
or don't do dumb on chain "scaling" and scale properly off chain

>>8538993
yes because the poor negros in africa cant wait to spend $50 in tx fees to lock up bitcoin in a payment channel from their raspberry pi so they can finally buy fresh water on the (((lightning network))). oh shit their pi full node went offline because mugabe cut off their internet. RIP all their bitcoin locked up in channels

>>8539040
that's not how ln will work

>>8539056
keep lying kike

>>8538946

this. memory is like $0.10/gb and will only get cheaper. i bet oldfags that spent hundreds of dollars on a 100gb HDD are LMAOing at this argument

>>8539329
where do i buy 100tb HDD for $50 pls tell me. actually, tell me where i can buy a 100TB HDD for any price

>>8529777

link to Emin's presentation? can't find shit

>>8539407
watch an actual worthwhile presentation eg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIy1jMy22N8

>>8529777
who needs layer two when you have gb blocksize? bandwidth ain't no thang apparently

If you think you need to download the blockchain to "validate" your TXs, think about this: To download the blockchain in the first place, you need to download it from peers. You have to trust those peers are honest. You do that by sampling some number of peers and seeing that they all have the same version and assume the majority of peers are honest.

Okay, so trust lies with the majority. Why bother downloading the entire blockchain from these peers when you can sample the UTXOs from them instead? Same trust level, far less overhead for you.

>>8539540

Also, if you don't trust miners, why are you even using bitcoin?

>>8539578
Well technically you dont need to trust miners themselves, just trust that there is economic incentive to mine your TX, and if one miner refuses it opens that opportunity for another to gain. Trust in competition

>>8533461
literally retarded

>>8536414
>>8538410
TMSR = MP+friends right?

>>8539407
https://youtu.be/GQFsfOGKBWs?t=8680

please watch this presentation everyone

>>8538898
why don't you just use paypal or venmo you fucking retard

>>8533869
That vid is funny as fuck nigger. Not all of us here have the bad kind of autism .

>>8539540
>Same trust level, far less overhead for you.
Not at all anon. If you want to, for instance, double-spend and all nodes maliciously approve your transaction, then how are you gonna rewrite the entire history to hide this? You just made up bitcoins that do not exist. Are you going to rewrite the entire history from Genesis? I'm afraid it'll take you a couple of years to become the chain with the longest work, time in which you won't make any money from your mining.

With only the UTXO set, you can do this. Just lie about the UTXO set and make up anything you want. With rewriting the entire blockchain history which was meant specifically to be as immutable as possible, you cannot. It's not the same trust level at all

>>8539578
Miners don't control the network. Full nodes can validate blocks and you can download from full nodes and ignore the miners.

>>8538442
No, the chart is wrong on more than just the memory, storage is also wrong, there are 525,600 minutes in a year, or 52,560 blocks on average. Even at 32 mb blocks, that's only 1.642GB, letalone 8mb blocks. I haven't taken the time to bother with manually invalidating every single claim in that chart, but I'd wager on examination that they are all complete bullshit. The memory usage was just the one that stuck out as the most obviously complete and utter bullshit to the extent it's like saying "If you want a whole litre of water you're going to need to set yourself up with a few square kilometres of reservoir catchment in order to deal with the torrential downpour necessary for this tremendous amount".
It's actually really sad that idiotic propaganda victims can spew this nonsense with apparently no idea just how fucking wide of the mark it is when it comes to the reality of the situation. I'll say it again; there is absolutely zero justification for limiting the on chain transaction throughput to the present anaemic level, period, and for the details of the limits that do actually exist and the levels at which they kick in, we have concrete data already right here that is well established and thoroughly vetted;
https:// www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SJm2ep3X_M
The *only* fucking reason, at all, for the current bullshit, is because it is in the interests of blockstream that on chain transaction throughput is massively artificially limited. Their actual business plan actually depends on that, and the CEO has admitted it. Get the fuck over it, accept it, it's just sad that coretards still aren't getting it fucking months after the BTC chain was effectively killed.

>>8539956
anon... 52,560 * 8MB = 420,480MB = 420GB

>>8539988
stupid cunt we're gonna have 1tb blocks in like, 1 year, and its gonna work

>>8539988
Actually I was wrong, I'm angry at this repeated bullshit and thus my calculations were wrong, and that's not ok so fuck me.
This chart is still incorrect however, even on this issue, as it implies that a given block limit is equal to an actual constant block size, it's 420,480MB per year *only if* it's 8MB blocks constantly running at 100% capacity. And even then, according to benchmark storage prices https:// www.backblaze.com/blog/hard-drive-cost-per-gigabyte/ that is 10.50 USD for a year's worth of completely full 8MB blocks.
That is, barely a quarter of many ordinary transaction fees when the sabotaged chain was saturated in December 2017.
You're also incorrect about having to download the entire blockchain to validate all transactions. You could pick any block at random if you wanted to validate the entire blockchain and audit it from that state, keep going until you're satisfied nothing strange is going on, you do not personally need to store the entire blockchain yourself on disk to validate every single transaction to be able to audit the chain, that's the nature of a chain of blocks that refer back to previous digital signatures in prior blocks, if the hash hasn't changed then it hasn't been tampered with.
And last of all, non mining full nodes do jack shit, if you don't mine, you can't actually create blocks, all you can do is complain that nobody is conforming to your rules and discard blocks that otherwise would be valid except for the rules you've decided to require but miners have decided are idiotic. You have zero power to actually change the ledger or influence it in any way unless you mine yourself.

>>8529470
OH NO NO NO NO

>>8540231
it's three no's, not four, my dude

>>8529470
>open video
>satoshits vision
>close video

>>8540163
>it's 420,480MB per year *only if* it's 8MB blocks constantly running at 100% capacity.
Yes, they give you an upper bound i.e. worst case. You can't estimate accurately how much it'll be used so you try to protect yourself from the worst case.

>You could pick any block at random if you wanted to validate the entire blockchain and audit it from that state

Are you suggesting to download the entire blockchain in batches while keeping the UTXO set and validate the whole thing? If so, that works for yourself, but peers need to store it for you to download it, hence the size limitation.

>And last of all, non mining full nodes do jack shit
They validate transactions and often keep copies of the ledger. If I'm a new node, I may only download from full nodes. If miners all do invalid transactions, full nodes are free to ignore them and reject any bitcoins mined from the invalid chain if the miners ever try to spend their bitcoins interacting with a party that holds a valid chain.

>>8529470

that was painful to watch. cash supporters used to be the scientologists of crypto. now they're literally the schizophrenic bums shouting on a street corner with a cardboard sign.

>>8540163
missed this:
>And even then, according to benchmark storage prices https:// www.backblaze.com/blog/hard-drive-cost-per-gigabyte/ that is 10.50 USD for a year's worth of completely full 8MB blocks.
The problem is that you start hosting the ledger on multiple HDDs. There's no HDD of 50TB for example. You need to start sharding while also serving other nodes. The idea is that consumer hardware can keep the history and serve other peers. Maybe it's a conservative number (1MB) but it's what they decided on to be on the safe side. Bitcoin doesn't need to record all transactions in the world ON-CHAIN, and they made it clear by refusing to increase the block size

>>8533285
Implying what? I cant keep up with all the political shit in bitcoin

>>8529470
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qU6tGj5VdYw
Face it corekeks, the most charismatic and influential figures in Bitcoin are already on the Cash side. Your only public figure is a psychopathic cocker spaniel who got destroyed in a debate with Roger.
Laughing about their public appearance is literally the dumbest attack vector you could have chosen. Because they outclass corekeks and it's not even close.

>>8540786
>no background in economics
From the horse's mouth

>>8539866
>just use fiat

found luke-jr

>>8540826
>an economist can't build a cryptocurrency
Roger is not designing or building the project, he's merely pitching it.
Amaury Sechet, Craig Wright, Peter Rizun and Emin Gun Sirer are much more qualified to do research and programming work than any corekek who turns a blind eye to research showing how 8mb blocks don't have any impact ot centralization.
>a computer scientist who applies common sense
None to be found in core.

>>8533303
The conference in Miami involved a ton of non btc and scammy icos. 95% were there to scam people

Yottabyte blocks are satoshi's vision

>>8536930
Sorry sweetie. This doesn’t seem close to what Link does. Not a decentralised oracle network. A single incorrect / lying oracle would fuck your smart contract. Link solves this by allowing multiple oracle sources.

>great t-talk tom
lmao

For the record, anyone who has ANY critical thinking who has read this thread has now realised Bitcoin Cash is more valuable than Segshitcoin as the FUD is so fucking pathetic

>>8542089
>next stage delusion
>desperation and panic
it's time to let it go anon

>>8541394
A Total Turing complete script system could interact with multiple sources, a total Turing machine is going to wipe the floor. If you didn't sell all your BTC for Bitcoin when it was $200 and still haven't you are officially a brainlet

>>8531993

I agree

>>8540052
Not with an average block time of 10 minutes. Kill yourself retarded shill.

>>8534667
this obviously

>>8529470
nice arguments corecucks

>>8533314
>They're fucking pathetic.
Who?

>>8543886
Core supporters. I watched the videos then looked at the comments and they actually thought there was substance. They are grasping at straws at this point and it is just embarrassing.

So Bitcoin or Greg Coin doesn't have a white paper since it forked off to use segwit and lightning. Bitcoin is a peer to peer electronic CASH

>>8543886
Segshitbankerretardcunts

>>8540474
>They validate transactions
Show me where in the source code do non-mining nodes validate transactions.

>>8544111
checked

>>8540474
pretty logical approach to scaling.
If using bitcoin (e.g. a single transaction) costs more than making a transaction on a 10x blockchain and verifying the whole 10x blockchain, then it is time to scale. What does everyone think of this compromise?

what the hell is colored coins

I still have all my bcash shitcoins from the fork. Quite a few. I guess I'll sell the pumps. The impatient have already sold their worthless bcash a long time ago

>>8540474
>reject any bitcoins mined from the invalid chain

We've reached a point where people think nodes can do anything when they literally just copy the blockchain. It would be like saying I could validate wikipedia pages by downloading them all to a archive on my computer

>>8540585
Yes there is. They're called RAID arrays and they go as big as you want them to.
All transactions in the world vs 14kbps worth of transactions is such an enormous gap even threading them together in the same sentence like that just makes you sound ignorant. The other guy is flatly right, the only reason the artificial on chain throughput limit exists is to privilege the blockstream business model at the expense of the rest of the ecosystem, and it is killing BTC. The only remaining question is if other cryptos potentially including bitcoin cash can pull off a recovery, because nobody with the slightest amount of critical thinking ability will ever trust the BTC chain again after what coretards did to it.

>>8538993

how is off chain the "proper" way to scale. Please explain.

You do realize there are tradeoffs right? If a payment channel can fuck you over is it really uncensorable?

What about at the end of block rewards? if the LN channels are making most of the TX money doesn't this break the incentive model and lower security?

Isn't security the primary driving factor of BTC's value?

Lightning channels seem closer to ripple or even swift than a true trustless, uncensorable, decentralized currency system. Why couldn't blockstream increase the blocksize at least temporarily until an acceptable 2nd layer solution was perfected? Segwit wouldn't have been necessary and we would still have 0conf, low fees, and growing merchant adoption.

>>8539506

why do you link this irrelevant, basic, presentation

>>8530031
TFW Bitchcoin Crash